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Thursday, April 25, 2019

People over the millennia have reported having deeply moving religious experiences either spontaneously or while under the influence of psychedelic substances such as psilocybin-containing mushrooms or the Amazonian brew ayahuasca, and a portion of those experiences have been encounters with what the person regards as "God" or "ultimate reality."

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This article is very cool. I posted it after the topic was broached tangentially on another thread. It's fortuitous that this article was published just today in that regard.

#1 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-24 10:45 AM | Reply

Denver is going to vote on decriminalizing magic mushrooms next month, and Oregon is attempting to do the same.

#2 | Posted by nullifidian at 2019-04-24 10:55 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#2 I'm all for it. I remember reading the conclusions of a highly successful British study on the effects of psilocybin on terminal patients in hospice care. The British equivalent of the Surgeon General called psilocybin "remarkably non-toxic to the human organ system." I've also read that psilocybin and ayahuasca (so DMT?) are suspected of having neurogenesis properties that show promise in treating dementia of various kinds. Factor in the positive spiritual effects and it just seems ludicrous that responsible people ought not be allowed to pursue cognitive & spiritual freedom to its fullest extent without fear of legal complications. I went to Mexico for my ayahuasca experience. I'm not sure I'd risk it in the States, although from time-to-time I hear about ceremonies taking place in the high desert. I think I'd be too paranoid that Johnny Law would show up and throw a bunch of peaceful hippies in the federal poke.
It slays me that Mexico has more respect for people's cognitive & spiritual freedom than the USA.

#3 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-24 11:08 AM | Reply

#2 BTW, wasn't there a guy pushing to get a magic mushroom initiative of the California ballot recently, as well?

#4 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-24 11:10 AM | Reply

It didn't make it, unfortunately. Oregon and Colorado will beat Cali to the punch, just like with cannabis.

#5 | Posted by nullifidian at 2019-04-24 11:13 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

-- I went to Mexico for my ayahuasca experience. I'm not sure I'd risk it in the States,

Brew up a batch of dmt and make pharmahuasca.

#6 | Posted by nullifidian at 2019-04-24 11:16 AM | Reply

#6 I was thoroughly incapacitated for about five hours and definitely was glad to be under the benevolent care of a skilled shaman. I can't imagine doing ayahuasca alone outside of the presence of a shaman.

#7 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-24 11:22 AM | Reply

I miss psychedelics.. havent tripped since '95 but remember my 100+trips being life changing
Thats when I realized what they mean by God is everywhere

Non sure I can trip now that I'm on dyalisis.. may never come down

#8 | Posted by 503jc69 at 2019-04-24 12:55 PM | Reply

Being abducted by aliens, on the other hand, is terrifying.

#9 | Posted by HeliumRat at 2019-04-24 06:37 PM | Reply

leftists hate everything about religion or "God" unless it's in the context of consuming illicit drugs. Stick it to the man, maaaaan!

#10 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-25 02:15 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

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journals.plos.org

"In this study, five groups of individuals participated in an online survey with detailed questions characterizing the subjective phenomena, interpretation, and persisting changes attributed to their single most memorable God encounter experience (n = 809 Non-Drug, 1184 psilocybin, 1251 lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD), 435 ayahuasca, and 606 N,N-dimethyltryptamine (DMT)). "

Discarded as the trash it is.

#11 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-25 02:17 AM | Reply

"Participants were recruited primarily via internet advertisements, email invitations, and online social networks. Two different participant groups were recruited corresponding to two versions of the questionnaire. The purpose of both was stated as: "In this survey, we want to characterize various experiences of encounters with something that someone might call: God (e.g., the God of your understanding), Higher Power, Ultimate Reality, or an Aspect or Emissary of God (e.g., an angel)." However, one group (the Psychedelic Group) completed the questionnaire based on an experience of encountering something that occurred after taking a classic hallucinogen (e.g., psilocybin, LSD, ayahuasca, DMT, etc.). The other group (the Non-Drug Group) completed the questionnaire based on an experience that occurred in absence of taking a psychoactive drug. Internet and email advertisements provided a webpage link to the appropriate version of the questionnaire. Participants were informed that study participation was anonymous, they could choose to stop answering questions at any time, and if they did not complete the questionnaire their specific responses would not be used. The Institutional Review Board of the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine approved all study procedures."

#12 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-25 02:20 AM | Reply

Problems with this "study":

- not performed under laboratory conditions; therefore:
- no experimental or control groups
- online survey recruitment, which entails:
- retrospection, which is known to be unreliable
- all the various participant profiles (e.g., compliant, defiant, apathetic, etc.) which could bias the "study" one way or another

In short, this isn't science; it's scientism. Shame on Johns Hopkins for putting their stamp of approval on this absolute turd.

#13 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-25 02:28 AM | Reply

this study could be improved in the following ways, just off the top of my head:

- at least 2 "meta" groups, atheists and religious (and even agnostics), cross-referenced by frequency of worship (or lack thereof) who are given:
- controlled doses of the aforementioned psychoactive drugs (DMT, LSD, psilocybin, etc.) under laboratory conditions, plus another group given placebos
- collection of physical measures such as (but not necessarily limited to) fMRI, which would be coupled with:
- subjective questionnaires afterward

Properly conducted, this study would be AT LEAST a 2 x # of drugs + control design. That would require a lot of participants recruited and put through the paraidgm to draw such grandiose conclusions as we see in the headline. But I guess pumping publications through the pipeline is more important, and so-called "science journalists" are all too eager to snap up the click-bait headlines.

No wonder there's a replication crisis in psychology. en.wikipedia.org

#14 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-25 03:02 AM | Reply

I've only done LSD a handful of of times, but you know what I learned? God hates me. I keep have to dodge lightning bolts. And sometimes I get hit. And really, really hurts.

#15 | Posted by HeliumRat at 2019-04-25 04:20 AM | Reply

#10 "leftists hate everything about religion or "God" unless it's in the context of consuming illicit drugs. Stick it to the man, maaaaan!" POSTED BY BERSERKONE

Berserkone,

Nulli and I rarely get accused of being Leftists on the DR.

#16 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-25 09:23 AM | Reply

#16

The good news is that you can purchase magic mushroom spores in all but three states and grow your own. No need to wait for legalization.

#17 | Posted by nullifidian at 2019-04-25 11:03 AM | Reply

"White Man goes into his church and talks about Jesus. The Indian goes into his tipi and talks with Jesus."

-Quanah Parker

Quanah Parker was the last Comanche chief to war against the US and also started the Native American Church that incorporates Christianity with tribal beliefs and the ceremonial use of peyote.

#18 | Posted by shane at 2019-04-25 11:17 AM | Reply

Also check out Dr Rick Strassman's work and research on DMT at the University of New Mexico back in the mid 90's. Absolutely fascinating.

DMT The Spirit Molecule

www.amazon.com

#19 | Posted by shane at 2019-04-25 11:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#14 | POSTED BY BERSERKONE

so why don't you tell us all about the God high...is that God blotter or God windowpane, maybe Jesus doubledome. do you really want to bring up "controls" and proof?
i know one thing, anecdotally granted, when doing acid..those with a strong religious upbringing don't fare as well. a ride they wish they could get off before they arrive at a place they've never been before..think for yourself land.
and black people, it was cultural and maybe not as prevalent as 1967 but blacks(some) did not appreciate LSD. they seemed to have a much stronger belief in the supernatural, i.e. ghosts. i've did some terrible things to black buddies while they were high

#20 | Posted by 1947steamer at 2019-04-25 01:17 PM | Reply

#17 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

'shrooms are easy to grow..but easier to kill. and it takes a very very controlled environment. but if you're close to a college the profits can be large

#21 | Posted by 1947steamer at 2019-04-25 01:20 PM | Reply

Spiritual awareness, drug related or not, is a bit of a lost art in this materialist world.

Which is pretty much the message of most original religions, not to be confused with what currently passes for religion in the mostly material world.

#22 | Posted by Corky at 2019-04-25 01:25 PM | Reply

#22 | POSTED BY CORKY

Spiritual awareness = Unicorn farts. How about "Accept and Face Reality Awareness".

#23 | Posted by 1947steamer at 2019-04-25 01:40 PM | Reply

#23

That's what the material world wants you to buh-lieve; that there is nothing else. But then, most of the universe is dark matter.

#24 | Posted by Corky at 2019-04-25 02:32 PM | Reply

#20. St. Jimi Hendrix was sure one brother who loved him some LSD.

#25 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-25 04:13 PM | Reply

How about "Accept and Face Reality Awareness".

#23 | POSTED BY 1947STEAMER

How about "You Must Realize". (Favorite saying of old tai chi teacher)

I had no idea what she was talking about.

Then one day, I suddenly Realized what she meant.


According to many Mushrooms are aliens trying to communicate with us from across the galaxy.

"The late ethnobotanist Terence McKenna suggested that mushrooms are responsible for human intelligence as we know it. His theory hypothesized that mushroom spores possess all of the necessary requirements to travel on space currents. Furthermore, they could have settled in the brain matter of primitive humanoids and, following the lines of modern day hallucinogenic mushrooms, directly contributed to our modern day intelligence and self awareness.

McKenna went on to theorize that mushrooms are the reason there is human life on earth."

#26 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-04-26 10:34 AM | Reply

--According to many Mushrooms are aliens trying to communicate with us from across the galaxy.

Yeah sure, space cadet. McKenna was a nutjob. I did enjoy some of his crazy lectures, for the entertainment value.

#27 | Posted by nullifidian at 2019-04-26 10:40 AM | Reply

26/27

His brother Dennis carries on the Good Work.

I read that McKenna essay about mushroom origin theory, or whatever it's called. I dug it.

I listened to both of their lectures on ayahuasca for years before I participated in the ceremony in Mexico. Anthony Peake and Graham Hancock's, as well. For all of the research and prep, it was a far different experience than I had anticipated.

#28 | Posted by Karabekian at 2019-04-26 10:57 AM | Reply

McKenna was a a true bard from the old school , a very eloquent, compelling speaker. His lectures were captivating.The more I listened to him the more I felt that he should've been a sci-fi/fantasy writer. That was probably his true calling. I think he had some very interesting insights on the big problems of modern society; but he really dropped the ball on that "Timewave Zero" theory.

#29 | Posted by shane at 2019-04-26 11:36 AM | Reply

McKenna was a nutjob. I did enjoy some of his crazy lectures, for the entertainment value.

#27 | Posted by nullifidian

Speaking of nutjobs.

Have you read the works of this guy called Nullifidian?

So entertaining! Like reading the Sunday Comics (does anyone even do that anymore?).


#30 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-04-26 12:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

For all of the research and prep, it was a far different experience than I had anticipated.

#28 | Posted by Karabekian

I would love to hear about it!

Unfortunately, this is probably not the right forum.

Pure DMT is better. A "cleaner" experience. (ayahuasca can have nasty side effects) But, you have to inject it as DMT is destroyed in the digestive tract.

For more good info on his subject read Graham Hancock,
Supernatural - Meetings with the Ancient Teachers of Mankind (2005)

grahamhancock.com

Also, DMT is a naturally produced substance and can be generated int he body by various means.

Mediation is one of them.

So, apparently, we are all illegal drug mules!

#31 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-04-26 12:46 PM | Reply

31 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY>
You can get a natural DMT release by locking yourself in a totally darkened room for several days.

I've wondered if this is what happened to Mohammed when he secluded himself into a dark cave for like a week and had his visions?

#32 | Posted by shane at 2019-04-26 01:36 PM | Reply

Check this out:

youtu.be

#33 | Posted by shane at 2019-04-26 01:48 PM | Reply

I've wondered if this is what happened to Mohammed when he secluded himself into a dark cave for like a week and had his visions?

#32 | Posted by shane

You have wondered correctly.

Many shamanic initiation ceremonies do the same thing.

Extreme Pain does it too (such as in the Native American Sun Dance).

#34 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-04-26 02:03 PM | Reply

Mine though not drug induced have been wonderful.

#35 | Posted by Tor at 2019-04-26 02:08 PM | Reply

LSD clears emotional issues. The next morning will be stark and bright. Extremely, extremely helpful.

#36 | Posted by redlightrobot at 2019-04-26 08:34 PM | Reply

"LSD clears emotional issues"

look at all these lifestyle advisors advocating for you to seek out and consume illicit materials. This thread is glowing.

#37 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-27 01:55 AM | Reply

for all you boomers out there, that means it's radioactive

#38 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-04-27 01:57 AM | Reply

"look at all these lifestyle advisors advocating for you to seek out and consume illicit materials."

DMT is a naturally occurring "material".

It is created for a reason.

Your consciousness was created for a reason.

Maybe you should learn how to manipulate and manage your own consciousness before Big Data does.

Oh wait. Too late.

You are already being manipulated. So you better get busy before you don't even have the option anymore.

Or take the Blue Pill Big Pharma will gladly give you and go back to sleep.

#39 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-04-27 11:50 AM | Reply

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