Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, December 08, 2018

No more dinners with female colleagues. Don't sit next to them on flights. Book hotel rooms on different floors. Avoid one-on-one meetings. In fact, as a wealth adviser put it, just hiring a woman these days is "an unknown risk." What if she took something he said the wrong way? Across Wall Street, men are adopting controversial strategies for the #MeToo era and, in the process, making life even harder for women.

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Interesting to read as I remember many mocking comments on Vice President Pence about this very subject. My how quickly things can change.

#1 | Posted by MSgt at 2018-12-03 01:42 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 6

"I remember many mocking comments on Vice President Pence about this very subject." - #1 | Posted by MSgt at 2018-12-03 01:42 PM | Reply | Flagged newsworthy by nullifidian

Rumor has it, when Mike Pence is having breakfast alone at the Waffle House, the first thing he does is ask the waitress to remove Mrs. Butterworth from the table.

Can't be too careful, if you know what I mean.

#2 | Posted by Hans at 2018-12-03 02:09 PM | Reply | Funny: 6

VP Pence was ahead of his time on being proactive against any type of reckless allegations. It is almost incredible that Trump would have the self-realization to select someone who was so unlike himself for his VP spot. Trump: reckless with his engagements with women; Pence: almost overly-cautious when it came to appearances.

#3 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2018-12-03 02:16 PM | Reply

Any man who would need these rules is a dumbass with poor self control who should be fired.

Being a professional means acting like a professional, not avoiding a business meal or one-on-one meeting with an opposite-sex colleague.

Pence should be mocked for refusing to eat a meal with a woman because he thinks he might whip his dick out between courses.

#4 | Posted by rcade at 2018-12-03 02:18 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 8

VP Pence was ahead of his time on being proactive against any type of reckless allegations.

Pence is a freak and you're praising him as a role model.

Are you afraid to share a lunch table with a female coworker? What do you think is going to happen, exactly? It's a public place. If you're afraid of being accused that you said something, are you going to refuse to talk to any females on the phone too?

#5 | Posted by rcade at 2018-12-03 02:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

The only men that actually worry about allegations of harassment against them at work, are probably the dumb asses that would harass women if left to their own devices.

#6 | Posted by schmanch at 2018-12-03 02:22 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Rcade,

It's about not putting oneself into a he said/she said situation.

I was hosting a party a couple of years ago and one of my friends said he had to leave to put his kids to bed. He asked one of our female friends to ride in the car with him when he drove the babysitter home. This was not because he questioned his self-control, but he just didn't want to take the risk.

#7 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-12-03 02:24 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

The only men that actually worry about allegations of harassment against them at work, are probably the dumb asses that would harass women if left to their own devices.

#6 | POSTED BY SCHMANCH

Right, because no woman would ever falsely accuse a man of inappropriate (or worse) behavior. Perhaps you should discuss this with the Duke Lacrosse team.

#8 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-12-03 02:25 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Are you afraid to share a lunch table with a female coworker? What do you think is going to happen, exactly? It's a public place. If you're afraid of being accused that you said something, are you going to refuse to talk to any females on the phone too?
#5 | Posted by rcade

It isn't so much as the appearance in public, but being one-on-one in the office while working late at night. The type of scenario where the woman claimed to be working with Brett Kavanaugh late at night and "he became angry/frustrated, and she became scared."

Then again, one-on-one lunches in public could be seen by others as fraternization if others weren't originally invited to the outing. Fraternization isn't always about sex, but favoritism and that goes for all mixes of gender identities.

#9 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2018-12-03 02:25 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

Jeff, your friend was obviously looking for a 3-way. He has a story he's not telling you.

#10 | Posted by JimDuncan at 2018-12-03 08:15 PM | Reply | Funny: 3

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"It is almost incredible that Trump would have the self-realization to select someone who was so unlike himself for his VP spot. Trump: reckless with his engagements with women; Pence: almost overly-cautious when it came to appearances."

You're right about him being the opposite, but you're wrong about the topic. Pence was chosen for one reason and one reason alone:

Pence was chosen to sew up the vag^H^H^H anti-abortion vote.

#11 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-12-03 08:39 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Businesses operate on game theory to mitigate potential problems. This practice will spread.

#12 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-12-04 06:53 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 3

Businesses operate on game theory to mitigate potential problems. This practice will spread.

#12 | POSTED BY SITZKRIEG

Yep.

#13 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-12-04 11:09 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Pence should be mocked for refusing to eat a meal with a woman because he thinks he might whip his dick out between courses.

#4 | POSTED BY RCADE

BS! I hate to defend anything that that -------- Pence does, but you are wrong about this. I hope you don't find out someday, as I did.

If you never take my advice about anything, listen to this. If you employ a woman and she acts suggestive, dresses provocatively or appears manipulative, tell your wife at the first hint. Then, when it does happen to you, you may not lose your wife in the process.

A confident woman, like a confident man, who is good at their job, will find ways to be magnanimous in their dealings. They know that men and women have sexual drives. Usually confident people are in happy relationships away from work, and everything is good.

An incompetent woman, like an incompetent man, will find whatever way they can to work around the fact that their bad rapport is based on their own incompetence.

#14 | Posted by kudzu at 2018-12-04 11:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

The woman who started this crap remind me of the Trump wingnuts. They live in an apparently consequence free environment created from their own incompetence.

#15 | Posted by kudzu at 2018-12-04 11:59 AM | Reply

Apparently Im the only person here who's had a work place romance.

#16 | Posted by Tor at 2018-12-04 01:21 PM | Reply

Perhaps you should discuss this with the Duke Lacrosse team.

#8 | POSTED BY JEFFJ

Perhaps the Duke LaCrosse Team should not have hired a stripper to come to a party full of under age boys and barely of age men who were intent upon bad behavior.

#17 | Posted by oldwhiskeysour at 2018-12-04 05:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

If you employ a woman and she acts suggestive, dresses provocatively or appears manipulative, tell your wife at the first hint. Then, when it does happen to you, you may not lose your wife in the process.

I agree men should tell their wives about situations like that, but some spouses can handle that information and some can't.

#18 | Posted by rcade at 2018-12-05 04:15 PM | Reply

"If you employ a woman and she acts suggestive, dresses provocatively or appears manipulative, tell your wife at the first hint."

This information doesn't really seem up-to-date.

When do you tell your Stormy and the other side pieces you have lined up and waiting in the wings?

#19 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-12-05 04:18 PM | Reply

It's about not putting oneself into a he said/she said situation.

It is impossible to work without sometimes being in private discussions with the opposite sex.

If I was a boss and a male employee refused to ever be alone or talk alone with a female, I'd fire him. It would be too much of a detriment to work and would disadvantage all female employees and female clients.

Pence has no rational reason not to be in a public place with a female work colleague. And if he can't be trusted to handle a closed door meeting with a woman, he is too much of a clown to be trusted with anything.

There is no magic rule that protects men from ever being unfairly accused of anything. Men can't play keep-away at work and expect to succeed.

#20 | Posted by rcade at 2018-12-05 04:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

It's risk avoidance, Rcade.

A lot of executives and managers are going to follow suit. Bet on it.

#21 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-12-05 07:00 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

In that case, it's gender based discrimination too. I think that's illegal.

#22 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-12-05 07:02 PM | Reply

The consequences for breaking the law is just another one of the risks to be gamed.

Thanks, Capitalism!

#23 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-12-05 07:12 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1


Looks like the unintended consequences of over-reaction to the #metoo movement.

#24 | Posted by LampLighter at 2018-12-08 03:07 PM | Reply

One of my commands was as a commander of a trainee unit, I was NEVER in a room with a female trainee alone. Period.
It's just too much of a scenario that vindictive women will use, especially if you are having to discipline them or correct them.

Get over it liberals, no one is afraid to be around women.

Men are just protecting themselves.

#25 | Posted by boaz at 2018-12-08 07:01 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

This was not because he questioned his self-control, but he just didn't want to take the risk.

#7 | Posted by JeffJ

Right. Some random babysitter was going to #metoo his ass.

Guilty minds always worry about the consequences.

#26 | Posted by jpw at 2018-12-08 07:30 PM | Reply

Some random babysitter was going to #metoo his ass.

It's happened before. In this politically correct environment, perception, even if wrong, is king.

#27 | Posted by boaz at 2018-12-08 07:44 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

maybe female employees should be provided with body cams.

#28 | Posted by Tor at 2018-12-08 08:03 PM | Reply

It's happened before.

Link?

#29 | Posted by jpw at 2018-12-08 08:04 PM | Reply

Pence should be mocked for refusing to eat a meal with a woman because he thinks he might whip his dick out between courses.

#4 | POSTED BY RCADE

POTW

[post of the week]

#30 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2018-12-08 08:21 PM | Reply

Pence should be mocked for refusing to eat a meal with a woman because he thinks he might whip his dick out between courses.

"----, if this is gonna be that kind of party
I'm gonna stick my dick in the mashed potatoes"

-- Beastie Boys
'B-Boys Makin' With the Freak Freak', Ill Communication

#31 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2018-12-08 08:37 PM | Reply

mah potatoes are too hot. I've heard a sun baked watermelon is just right.

#32 | Posted by bayviking at 2018-12-08 08:51 PM | Reply

Geeze....someone needs to tell those puds that the only people it applies to are those who hang out the weener on those occasions.... why are those guys such babies?

#33 | Posted by RightisTrite at 2018-12-09 10:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#33 | POSTED BY RIGHTISTRITE AT 2018-12-09 10:57 AM | FLAG: ... because all women are truthful??? Allegations alone in this day and age can destroy a man's career - even if unfounded.

#34 | Posted by MSgt at 2018-12-09 12:57 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Weak. Reminds me of the Muslim fundamentalists who can't tolerate women showing any skin. It's as if the temptation is too great for sex-crazed men.

Or maybe it's revenge against da bitches for speaking up about harassment in the first place.

#35 | Posted by cbob at 2018-12-09 05:40 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

This is good advice. Don't give somebody a chance to lie about it.

#36 | Posted by byrdman at 2018-12-09 05:44 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

someone asked for a link for the baby sitter scenario... seems close enough...

Fairfax teacher Sean Lanigan still suffering from false molestation allegations - The Washington Post
www.washingtonpost.com

#37 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2018-12-09 07:14 PM | Reply

Sex abuse is a massive epidemic in the US... so of COURSE let's all talk about the vanishingly rate incidences of false accusation! Makes perfect sense.

#rapeculture

#38 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-12-09 07:33 PM | Reply

^vanishingly small

#39 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-12-09 07:33 PM | Reply

"vanishingly rate incidences of false accusation!"

What are the rates post #MeToo?

What are the consequences of a false accusation?

#40 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-09 09:33 PM | Reply

What are the consequences of a false accusation?
#40 | POSTED BY BRUCEBANNER

What are the consequences of a true accusation dismissed?

#41 | Posted by WhoDaMan at 2018-12-10 12:39 AM | Reply

What are the consequences of a true accusation dismissed?

POSTED BY WHODAMAN AT 2018-12-10 12:39 AM | REPLY

Justice Kavanaugh.

#42 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2018-12-10 12:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

What are the rates post #MeToo?

What are the consequences of a false accusation?
#40 | POSTED BY BRUCEBANNER AT 2018-12-09 09:33 PM | REPLY

Still vanishingly small and the same as they've always been.

#43 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-12-10 01:45 AM | Reply

Victims speak up, and rape culture doubles down.

#44 | Posted by hamburglar at 2018-12-10 07:03 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Still vanishingly small and the same as they've always been.

#43 | POSTED BY DIRKSTRUAN AT 2018-12-10 01:45 AM | REPLY | FLAG:

You don't know that. Admit it.

#45 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 08:52 AM | Reply

What are the consequences of a true accusation dismissed?

#41 | POSTED BY WHODAMAN AT 2018-12-10 12:39 AM | REPLY | FLAG:

Your question is sarcastic and mine is not.

#46 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 08:53 AM | Reply

Sounds like an early episode of Handmaid's Tale.

#47 | Posted by Daniel at 2018-12-10 09:10 AM | Reply

Your question is sarcastic and mine is not.

#46 | POSTED BY BRUCEBANNER

No, it's not sarcastic. Assault survivors frequently do not report, or delay reporting because they become accused of false reporting if the perpetrator is "privileged", like entitled white frat boys or, e.g., football players (of whatever color). Boys/men who have or are close to power are immediately granted more credibility than their accuser unless there are witnesses.

#48 | Posted by WhoDaMan at 2018-12-10 11:07 AM | Reply

The "Masters of the Universe" are turds

#49 | Posted by hamburglar at 2018-12-10 11:11 AM | Reply

unless there are witnesses... and there rarely are.

#50 | Posted by WhoDaMan at 2018-12-10 11:20 AM | Reply

You don't know that.

#45 | POSTED BY BRUCEBANNER AT 2018-12-10 08:52 AM | FLAG:

Sure I do. It has always been the same old misogynists who think otherwise... the same people who come on this forum and post article after article on whether MeToo has "gone too far."

#51 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-12-10 11:24 AM | Reply

#51 my question is a fair one.

If you knew where your numbers came from and what the assumptions behind them are, then you would not shut down an honest question.

#52 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 11:29 AM | Reply

#MeToo started October 2017. Show me the studies that have come out since Dirk.

Obviously, you would have them handy because you've thought this through.

#53 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 11:31 AM | Reply

Nice attempt to shift the burden.

#54 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-12-10 11:57 AM | Reply

There is no magic rule that protects men from ever being unfairly accused of anything. Men can't play keep-away at work and expect to succeed.

#20 | POSTED BY RCADE

I had two new ways to deal with it, after it happened the first time (doesn't take me long to learn lessons), is that I never go in a meeting room alone with a female.

Or, I simply have a meeting in the common cubicle area. It is distractive and counter-productive, but so is going to HR to defend your honor against someone who needs to create a victimhood. What is different now is that that need is encouraged.

This is how these 'victims' remind me of Trumpers. Talent means nothing. Non-thinking loyalty to a corrupt idea means everything.

#55 | Posted by kudzu at 2018-12-10 11:59 AM | Reply

Yeah, men are just so oppressed.

#56 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-12-10 12:01 PM | Reply

Your son is more likely to be sexually assaulted than to face false allegations. Explaining the fear of #HimToo

For years, statistics have shown that the incidence of false reports of sexual assault is very low -- studies track it at about 2 to 10 percent of reported assaults, a number that is believed to be inflated due to nonstandardized police terminology used to categorize a report as "false" or "unfounded." And, though Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data show that 1 in 3 women and 1 in 6 men in the U.S. experience some form of sexual violence involving physical contact, data from the Department of Justice's National Crime Victimization Survey estimate that only one-third of sexual assaults are ever reported to police.

That leaves a vast swath of victims sitting silently with their pain -- and whittles the percentage of false reports down even further by comparison.

It also means that your son is more likely to be a rapist, or to be sexually victimized, than he is to be falsely accused of sexual assault.

Honestly, if your son victimized someone sexually, chances are he got away with it.www.chicagotribune.com

#57 | Posted by WhoDaMan at 2018-12-10 12:14 PM | Reply

No, it's not sarcastic. Assault survivors frequently do not report, or delay reporting because they become accused of false reporting if the perpetrator is "privileged", like entitled white frat boys or, e.g., football players (of whatever color). Boys/men who have or are close to power are immediately granted more credibility than their accuser unless there are witnesses.

#48 | POSTED BY WHODAMAN AT 2018-12-10 11:07 AM | FLAG:

I agree with you. My question was: Has #MeToo changed any of those variables? I would think it has and I am interested in seeing how much. Certainly Social Media justice is swift and extreme. That alone removes the idea that there is a barrier to reporting. Also, we see the most powerful men being taken down (women seem to get a pass for now), so that barrier is coming down too. Then we see this mass panic among men. That all has to mean something.

I'm getting rotten tomatoes thrown at me for wondering where the movement has moved us.

#58 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 12:25 PM | Reply

#57 | POSTED BY WHODAMAN AT 2018-12-10 12:14 PM | FLAG:

I've seen similar stories with higher reports from men.

Also, are men less likely than women to report?

#59 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 12:27 PM | Reply

#57 | POSTED BY WHODAMAN AT 2018-12-10 12:14 PM | FLAG:

For example: aasas.ca

And I have seen much higher numbers from more recent sources.

#60 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 12:43 PM | Reply

From what I am reading, power is the factor here.

When we take power away from one group and give it to another, then we see the powerful take advantage of the weaker.

#61 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-12-10 12:44 PM | Reply

Right. Some random babysitter was going to #metoo his ass.
Guilty minds always worry about the consequences.

#26 | POSTED BY JPW

This was several years ago - long before #MeToo.

#62 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-12-10 01:13 PM | Reply

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