Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Friday, November 16, 2018

Undocumented workers, by law, can't qualify for a Social Security number and therefore are ineligible for a retired worker benefit, as well as disability and survivor's insurance protection. Unless migrants are on a legal path to citizenship and earning lifetime work credits, they won't qualify for a benefit from either the Old-Age and Survivors Insurance Trust or the Disability Insurance Trust. However, this doesn't mean undocumented workers aren't contributing in some way to the Social Security program. According to AARP, approximately $12 billion in payroll tax revenue (from either the workers or their employers) was collected in 2010 from undocumented migrants. These workers have absolutely no chance of ever seeing a dime of this money back unless they become U.S. citizens and earn the needed 40 work credits for a retirement benefit.

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Helps.

~Sincerely,
Math

#1 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-16 07:39 PM | Reply

Helps, if they are working.

#2 | Posted by bat4255 at 2018-11-16 07:45 PM | Reply

I don't know if immigration helps Social Security or not. But, on balance immigration to the US has been a net benefit by far. Most who come here are people who have taken great personal risk to get to a place where they would be able to have a better life. And, in many cases, founded companies and employed a lot of people. And, immigrants have comprised many great scientists and engineers who have made huge contributions to our country.

People such as this are generally known as entrepreneurs.

#3 | Posted by woe_is_W at 2018-11-16 08:26 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

is this a rhetorical question?

#4 | Posted by AuntieSocial at 2018-11-16 10:21 PM | Reply

You left out the good part............. They drain the American bank with all their free stuff.

#5 | Posted by Sniper at 2018-11-17 10:42 AM | Reply

Expensive Aliens: How Much Do Illegal Immigrants Really Cost?

By DALIA FAHMY

May 21, 2010

Email

It's all about money.

That's what it seems to come down to in the most recent flare-up of the immigration debate. Policy makers and pundits who want tougher policies against illegal immigrants argue that they cost American taxpayers billions of dollars. Those on the other side of the debate counter that illegal immigrants create demand and jobs that promote economic growth.

So which one is it?

The Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR), a conservative advocacy group that favors tighter immigration laws, argues that the answer is clear: illegal aliens cost U.S. taxpayers more than $100 billion each year.

#6 | Posted by Sniper at 2018-11-17 10:44 AM | Reply

Headline says "immigrants", article is about "undocumented" workers. I sense a stereotype being implied here.

If a worker is truly "undocumented" then they're working under the table and not paying into SSI. If they're using someone else's SSN to work then nothing is stopping them from collecting benefits with that number. And if they're using valid ITINs then you can't really call then "undocumented" workers.

#7 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-17 10:50 AM | Reply

The implied motivation is not necessary here Sentinel.

#8 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2018-11-17 11:29 AM | Reply

--Headline says "immigrants", article is about "undocumented" workers. I sense a stereotype being implied here.

That's the con game increasingly used. The pro-illegal immigrant advocates try to ascribe to illegal, poorly educated, unskilled trespassers the virtues of legal, skilled, educated immigrants.

#9 | Posted by nullifidian at 2018-11-17 11:32 AM | Reply

" If they're using someone else's SSN to work then nothing is stopping them from collecting benefits with that number."

Can you taste the stupid when you post something that dumb?

#10 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-17 11:38 AM | Reply

"The pro-illegal immigrant advocates try to ascribe to illegal, poorly educated, unskilled trespassers the virtues of legal, skilled, educated immigrants."

Legal, skilled, educated immigrants are the ones depressing wages in Silicon Valley.
You hate them too, remember?

#11 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-17 12:18 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

You left out the good part............. They drain the American bank with all their free stuff.

#5 | Posted by Sniper

What happened to you years ago? Did you really say that? I can't even write it off as an attempt at humor since it's coming from you. I just felt a whole lot dumber reading that.

#12 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2018-11-17 12:29 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

If a worker is truly "undocumented" then they're working under the table and not paying into SSI. If they're using someone else's SSN to work then nothing is stopping them from collecting benefits with that number. And if they're using valid ITINs then you can't really call then "undocumented" workers.

#7 | Posted by sentinel

I'm sooooo tired of stupid posts. This has been documented for decades. Ok "undocumented" doesn't mean working under the table - it means their immigration status. A WHOLE LOT of "undocumented" immigrants (i.e. illegal from your perspective) work with stolen IDs. They use them to get the job and get paid unlike most thieves though. The meat industry would shut down without them. Slaughter houses, chicken processing plants, etc are full of undocumented worker working under stolen IDs. Manufacturing in the south west would suffer hugely too. We have mark our products specially for major corporations in the southwest because of their immigrant work forces who can't read basic information from labels - and I do mean BASIC. And when I say Major corporations I am talking about multi Billion dollar companies - in other words big R donors.

#13 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2018-11-17 12:37 PM | Reply

--Headline says "immigrants", article is about "undocumented" workers. I sense a stereotype being implied here.

That's the con game increasingly used. The pro-illegal immigrant advocates try to ascribe to illegal, poorly educated, unskilled trespassers the virtues of legal, skilled, educated immigrants.

#9 | Posted by nullifidian

Did someone switched your weed for a crack pipe? There's more to it that than simply "illegal" remember they release immigrants who cross illegally AND legally while they await adjudication of their claims and that makes them legal to be here but they don't generally get work permits. So they commit a crime of using a stolen ID to get employment and make money and otherwise contribute to society. That said we have a 4% unemployment rate... So get out of your parents basement and start contributing already.

#14 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2018-11-17 12:42 PM | Reply

"If they're using someone else's SSN to work then nothing is stopping them from collecting benefits with that number."

No one is really that stupid. Right? I read posts that exceed all of my preconceived ideas of stupidity, it can be far worse than I ever imagined. Sentinel never ceases to prove it. I'm not going to even explain why his post is so dumb, if you don't already know, you won't be able to absorb the information anyway.

#15 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-17 12:56 PM | Reply

" The pro-illegal immigrant advocates try to ascribe to illegal, poorly educated, unskilled trespassers the virtues of legal, skilled, educated immigrants."

While you eat the food they pick and live under the roof they fix. Your problem is that they are brown and the Republican Party has trained you to respond angrily to things that only a few years ago you were cheering for. Remember "they're only coming here to do jobs Americans won't do"??? Who was that....come on...you remember George W. Bush don't you!
How about "they're doing jobs Americans wouldn't do for $50.00 an hour." I'm sure you remember that one too, a fallen hero, John McCain.
Now Trump comes along and makes illegal immigrants our enemy? God damn, you are playable like a fiddle.

#16 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-17 01:01 PM | Reply

It certainly helps for all those working on a payroll deduction system. How many illegals work that way today? Meat packing plants probably.

But population growth lowers the quality of our lives and raises the cost of living, with parking lot freeways and million dollar houses... there doesn't seem to be any end to it, it just keeps getting worse and worse.

#17 | Posted by bayviking at 2018-11-17 01:12 PM | Reply

They drain the American bank with all their free stuff.

#5 | POSTED BY SNIPER

You and your inbred trailer park brethren are a far greater drain, snippy.

#18 | Posted by jpw at 2018-11-17 01:14 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

www.thoughtco.com

In case snippy was feeling lively enough to day to want to learn something.

#19 | Posted by jpw at 2018-11-17 01:29 PM | Reply

"But population growth lowers the quality of our lives and raises the cost of living, with parking lot freeways and million dollar houses... there doesn't seem to be any end to it, it just keeps getting worse and worse."

Such has been the case since the Middle Ages when a huge portion of the European population was wiped out by plague. Economically, it worked out well for the survivors. Is that your idea of a successful way to improve society?

#20 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-17 01:55 PM | Reply

#20, Hardly, neither plague nor coercion is good policy. The only moral way to control population growth is to substantially improve education, particularly for women. Doing so is a reliable path to lower birth rates. Some will still have large families, but most will not.

#21 | Posted by bayviking at 2018-11-17 04:18 PM | Reply

"No one is really that stupid. Right? I read posts that exceed all of my preconceived ideas of stupidity, it can be far worse than I ever imagined. Sentinel never ceases to prove it. I'm not going to even explain why his post is so dumb, if you don't already know, you won't be able to absorb the information anyway."

In other words, you've got nothing.

#22 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-17 09:07 PM | Reply

"They drain the American bank with all their free stuff."

Another proud flunkee from Addition and Subtraction class.

#23 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-17 09:11 PM | Reply

"In other words, you've got nothing."

Oh, FFS. In your scenario, where do the social security checks go?

#24 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-17 09:13 PM | Reply

www.washingtonpost.com

"For nearly four decades, Andres Avelino Anduaga, a 66-year-old man from Tijuana, assumed Riojos's identity -- complete with a fraudulent birth certificate, Social Security number, identification number and U.S. passport. The documents allowed Anduaga to collect hundreds of thousands of dollars in government benefits under Riojos's name, starting in 1989. For the next 27 years, Anduaga collected nearly $361,000 in Social Security, disability, health and food benefits, according to a criminal complaint."

"Investigators did not say how Anduaga found Riojos's identity. It also does not appear that the real Riojos was aware that Anduaga had been using his identity for 37 years."

#25 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-18 09:27 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

www.washingtontimes.com
"In 2013, the Social Security Administration's Office of the Chief Actuary estimated that more than 40 percent of all illegal aliens working in the U.S. were doing so using fake or stolen SSNs. Elsewhere, the office has put the figure as high as 75 percent."

www.washingtontimes.com
"Most illegal immigrants who pay taxes have stolen someone else's legal identity, and the IRS doesn't do a very good job of letting those American citizens and legal immigrants know they're being impersonated, the tax agency's inspector general said in a new report released Thursday."

#26 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-18 09:41 AM | Reply

www.washingtontimes.com
"In 2013, the Social Security Administration's Office of the Chief Actuary estimated that more than 40 percent of all illegal aliens working in the U.S. were doing so using fake or stolen SSNs. Elsewhere, the office has put the figure as high as 75 percent."

www.washingtontimes.com
"Most illegal immigrants who pay taxes have stolen someone else's legal identity, and the IRS doesn't do a very good job of letting those American citizens and legal immigrants know they're being impersonated, the tax agency's inspector general said in a new report released Thursday."

#27 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-18 09:41 AM | Reply

double post

#28 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-18 09:42 AM | Reply

"Authorities say Anduaga was deported in 1994 and 2000, both under the name Jose Reyes.

He faces up to 12 years in federal prison and a fine of up to almost $972,000. He will be sentenced May 29."

www.washingtonpost.com

And, never mind that the vast majority of immigrants who use the SS numbers of others, fraudulently, pay in to SS with no hope of ever receiving any benefit at all so Sentinel goes and finds one isolated criminal case and tries to use it as an argument to call all those immigrants fraudulently paying into SS not receiving anything in return crooks. It's a very stupid argument not supported by the facts and just more xenophobia from right wing tools.

We I Sentinel, I'd change my screen name. As it is, we all know that all he does is post crap to try and insult the vast majority of immigrants who come here out of desperation.

#29 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-18 10:12 AM | Reply

to try and insult the vast majority of [illegal] immigrants who come here out of desperation.

Fixed.

#30 | Posted by nullifidian at 2018-11-18 10:54 AM | Reply

It's pretty clear that Danni or someone close to her routinely employs illegal immigrants and turns a blind eye to identity theft. If someone could get away with this for four decades, then 'smaller' scale abuses of the broken system are certainly taking place regularly. I bet she probably thinks these people are entitled to tax refunds with tax credits too.

#31 | Posted by sentinel at 2018-11-18 11:54 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

My question is when these illegals become elderly and can't work are you liberals who want them here so badly now going to kick them out or are you going to give them benefits even though they really don't qualify for them?

#32 | Posted by byrdman at 2018-11-18 12:01 PM | Reply

"In 2013, the Social Security Administration's Office of the Chief Actuary estimated that more than 40 percent of all illegal aliens working in the U.S. were doing so using fake or stolen SSNs. Elsewhere, the office has put the figure as high as 75 percent."

Hard to believe any of the percentages cited above since no one really knows how many illegals are in the country.

#33 | Posted by MSgt at 2018-11-18 02:30 PM | Reply

In case snippy was feeling lively enough to day to want to learn something.

#19 | Posted by jpw

This number is a few years old. I am sure it is more now.

Expensive Aliens: How Much Do Illegal Immigrants Really Cost?

It's all about money.

That's what it seems to come down to in the most recent flare-up of the immigration debate. Policy makers and pundits who want tougher policies against illegal immigrants argue that they cost American taxpayers billions of dollars. Those on the other side of the debate counter that illegal immigrants create demand and jobs that promote economic growth.

So which one is it?

The Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR), a conservative advocacy group that favors tighter immigration laws, argues that the answer is clear: illegal aliens cost U.S. taxpayers more than $100 billion each year.

#34 | Posted by Sniper at 2018-11-18 04:52 PM | Reply

And, never mind that the vast majority of immigrants who use the SS numbers of others, fraudulently, pay in to SS with no hope of ever receiving any benefit at all

#29 | Posted by danni

I am sure you have proof of that.

#35 | Posted by Sniper at 2018-11-18 04:55 PM | Reply

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