Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Thursday, November 08, 2018

Twelve people including a police officer were killed by a gunman at a crowded bar in Thousand Oaks, California, late Wednesday, officials said. Several hundred people were inside the venue, which was hosting a "college country night" for students, police said. Ventura County Sheriff Geoff Dean described the incident at the Borderline Bar and Grill as a "tragic, tragic situation."

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Sgt. Ron Healus died after being struck "multiple times by gunfire," Dean said. Healus was a 29-year police veteran who was looking to retire in the next year.

#1 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 06:18 AM | Reply

"But as I said just a few months ago and I said a few months before that, and I said each time we see one of these mass shootings, our thoughts and prayers are not enough. It's not enough.

"It does not capture the heartache and grief and anger that we should feel. And it does nothing to prevent this carnage from being inflicted some place else in America." - President Barack Obama, October 1, 2015

#2 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 06:19 AM | Reply

Must be fake news, our "militia" is "well-regulated" and would never do anything like this...

#3 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 07:31 AM | Reply

Too early to play Rush to Judgement?

- White Male
- Age 24
- Few friends; introverted
- Is now or recently quit taking antidepressants
- Progressive; history of activism
- Chose a country bar so he could kill more Republicans

#4 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2018-11-08 07:52 AM | Reply | Funny: 3

Another righty incel.

#5 | Posted by Reinheitsgebot at 2018-11-08 07:54 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

i don't know any of them or anyone that knows any of them. i have my own troubles. SO WHAT. what's the point of this thread?. pick out a random mass slaughter of civilians in the united states..let's say the kid that shot up the black church, how many since then? this is tiresome.

#6 | Posted by ABlock at 2018-11-08 07:55 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#4 | POSTED BY MUSTANG

That's effing ridiculous.

#7 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2018-11-08 07:57 AM | Reply

#4 | Posted by MUSTANG

Yep...sounds reasonable...

Friggin' half-wit.

#8 | Posted by Angrydad at 2018-11-08 08:04 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

My son's high school has extra police presence because a threat made on a bathroom wall was found Monday night. Threats have to be taken very seriously in this day and age.

All this talk about gun control or more security is only addressing the symptom and not the root cause of why so many people are losing it.

#9 | Posted by Pirate at 2018-11-08 08:10 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#9,

Pirate, it's hard to address root causes.

It's easier to take someone else's rights instead.

#10 | Posted by boaz at 2018-11-08 08:14 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

"- White Male
- Age 24
- Few friends; introverted
- Is now or recently quit taking antidepressants
- Progressive; history of activism
- Chose a country bar so he could kill more Republicans"

Mustang just makes s**t up. It's disgusting. Shameful!

#11 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 08:16 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

It's easier to take someone else's rights..............#10 | POSTED BY BOAZ

and even easier yet to take someone else's life

#12 | Posted by 1947steamer at 2018-11-08 08:17 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Mustang just makes s**t up. It's disgusting. Shameful!...................#11 | POSTED BY DANNI

But you must give him an A+ for consistency . a C- for originality

#13 | Posted by 1947steamer at 2018-11-08 08:20 AM | Reply

#11 of course I made it up, Hagatha, I'm playing Rush to Judgement.

#14 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2018-11-08 08:22 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

It's easier to take someone else's rights instead.

#10 | POSTED BY BOAZ AT 2018-11-08 08:14 AM | REPLY | FLAG:UH YEAH!!!

Until you and your pig-brain friends figure out a way to curb some of your more irresponsible gun club members none of you deserve that right. So yeah lets take it away.

#15 | Posted by RightisTrite at 2018-11-08 08:31 AM | Reply

#10 At the moment, your "right" to have a particular hobby is killing dozens every week.

#16 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 08:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

YAY YAY N R A! For making sure WMDs are available to all!

I mean you know how hard it'd be to get even with that many with a butter knife?

#17 | Posted by 88120rob at 2018-11-08 08:35 AM | Reply

The NRA is oh so powerful in California. They personally write the laws for the Democrat party there.

#18 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 08:37 AM | Reply

#10 At the moment, your "right" to have a particular hobby is killing dozens every week.

So is your right to drive a car.

#19 | Posted by boaz at 2018-11-08 08:45 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Until you and your pig-brain friends figure out a way to curb some of your more irresponsible gun club members none of you deserve that right. So yeah lets take it away.

#15 | POSTED BY RIGHTISTRITE

That's the fun part about this debate.

It presupposes that people will act like intelligent, responsible adults when there is no evidence that they have the ability or desire to do so.


#20 | Posted by kudzu at 2018-11-08 08:47 AM | Reply

A mass shooting one day after the election? Didn't see that coming.

#21 | Posted by Zed at 2018-11-08 08:47 AM | Reply

BTW, WTF is 1000 Oaks?

#22 | Posted by kudzu at 2018-11-08 08:47 AM | Reply

#23

Friendly advice: Preparation H, not Ben Gay.

#24 | Posted by Zed at 2018-11-08 08:56 AM | Reply

Has the orange diaper sniper offered his warmest condolences yet?

#25 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2018-11-08 08:57 AM | Reply

Under what common sense gun reform would Boaz lose his right to bear arms? Would Boaz not pass a background check? Does Boaz have a felony conviction? Is Boaz a domestic abuser? Is Boaz suffering from a psychotic disorder of some kind? Has Boaz endangered others by handling or discharging a firearm irresponsibly in the past? Or is Boaz a straw purchaser? Is Boaz dealing guns to others at gun shows without wanting to be encumbered by doing background checks?

#27 | Posted by leadbelly at 2018-11-08 09:01 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

A mass shooting one day after the election? Didn't see that coming.

#21 | POSTED BY ZED

The shooter was just celebrating his freedom in the most American way possible; Baseball, Apple pie & mass shootings.

#28 | Posted by johnny_hotsauce at 2018-11-08 09:03 AM | Reply

Your dead children don't trump my 2nd amendment rights.----all NRA members.

#30 | Posted by 88120rob at 2018-11-08 09:06 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#23...Friendly advice: Preparation H, not Ben Gay................#24 | POSTED BY ZED

Nah...K-Y and vitamin D

#31 | Posted by ABlock at 2018-11-08 09:07 AM | Reply

Your dead children don't trump my rights.----all planned parenthood supporters.

#32 | POSTED BY MOVEON_2020 AT 2018-11-08 09:10 AM | REPLY |

When has a planned parenthood supported killed any children?

Fetuses are fetuses, not children. There is a reason we have a different word for it. It is a different thing

#33 | Posted by hatter5183 at 2018-11-08 09:15 AM | Reply

It presupposes that people will act like intelligent, responsible adults when there is no evidence that they have the ability or desire to do so.

#20 | POSTED BY KUDZU AT 2018-11-08 08:47 AM | REPLY | MMMMHHHMMMMM

Basically what I did was apply Trumplethinskin style reasoning to that statement... you know.... ban all Muslims from entering the country until we can figure out what is going on... because... when we ban Muslims from entering all the terrorist attacks will stop!

... and yet terrorism continues.

Now Imma watch the righty tighties make the exception to Trumpian methodology just because.

What bothers me the most about the right is how afraid they are... and its killing them from within...especially the men. Its a weird Darwinian thing I guess.

#34 | Posted by RightisTrite at 2018-11-08 09:16 AM | Reply

"Your dead children don't trump my rights.----all planned parenthood supporters."

I want the government to make women's choices for them.
~MoveOn

#36 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:23 AM | Reply

From an NBC article:

"Authorities confirmed that the shooter had been killed and Dean said it was too early to determine whether there was any link to terrorism."

IOW, we aren't sure of his race yet. If he's white it's definitely NOT an act of terrorism.

#38 | Posted by MrSilenceDogood at 2018-11-08 09:32 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

And blacks are 3/5 of a white person....that is why we have a different word for them. You are on the wrong side of history.

#35 | POSTED BY MOVEON_2020

I wonder why slave owners didn't have a field full of fetuses working for them....

#39 | Posted by MrSilenceDogood at 2018-11-08 09:34 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"She can choose to get pregnant or choose not to get pregnant."

And what responsibility do you demand for the male?

"You simply cannot murder people"

You simply cannot alter the meanings of words at will. "Murder" and "people" have definitions, and not the ones you're using.

#40 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:35 AM | Reply

#4

"- White Male
- Age 24
- Few friends; introverted
- Is now or recently quit taking antidepressants
- Progressive; history of activism
- Chose a country bar so he could kill more Republicans "

- Leftist who is driven to violence by the Leftist fake news.

#41 | Posted by JordyPete at 2018-11-08 09:35 AM | Reply

"However, once she is pregnant, the rights of the unborn child need to be respected as well. You simply cannot murder people because we find them to be inconvenient for your lifestyle."

So, you do think you should get to make the choices for women. I can honestly sometimes in some situations understand objections to late term abortions but in the first two trimesters just mind your own business. No woman needs you to tell her what is right or what is wrong. I'm quite sure, if I examined your life, I could find things which could have been judged wrong by others unless, of course, you really are Jesus.

#42 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 09:35 AM | Reply

"You mistakenly believe that people for gun reform have common sense. They don't and they are lying when they claim they want reform and not all guns banned."

That is just a lie. Not even an intelligent one that some folks might believe. You're simple a stupid liar. There are posters who can lie fairly intelligently here, you're not one of them. Dumb ass!

#43 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 09:38 AM | Reply

"- Leftist who is driven to violence by the Leftist fake news."

So Jodypete posts fake news in an attempt to attack fake news. Remarkably stupid. Negative numbers on his IQ.

#45 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 09:39 AM | Reply

I believe abortion needs to be legal. Having said that, let's not paper over what it actually is - state-sanctioned murder.

#46 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 09:41 AM | Reply

with over 300 million guns in circulation they are never ever going away. This is not Europe or Australia. You guys should focus on socializing medicine. Your gun grab fantasy is DOA.

#49 | Posted by byrdman at 2018-11-08 09:44 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Danni, do you believe ladies should be allowed to smoke crack or shoot heroin while pregnant? Do you think the police should stop them? In all honesty, I can't see how you would be against this as it seems pretty minor to simply killing the baby, which you obviously support."

I honestly don't care what you think and neither should any woman who is pregnant. You don't get a voice in that conversation and demanding one just makes you look like an a*****e and I don't care, at all, what your motivation is. Is ------------ by a man killing potential babies a*****e?

#50 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 09:46 AM | Reply

#37 | POSTED BY MOVEON_2020

And what do you suggest happens to the unwanted child once born? We have people dumping newborns in garbage cans, delivering in bathroom stalls and leaving the baby, etc. Our foster care and adoption systems are a mess. The same republicans that want to force unprepared women to deliver a child they have no ability to provide for also want to cut social services making even more children grow up in poverty and go hungry. You either care about the child or you dont. It sure looks to me like it is only having control over the woman that republicans actually care about.

#51 | Posted by justagirl_idaho at 2018-11-08 09:48 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"Your gun grab fantasy is DOA."

I've heard about the gun grab fantasy supposedly held by Clinton, Obama, Kerry, Carter, you name the Democrat but it is a myth and it is absolute b*** S*** to pretend otherwise. Hey, next week the evil Democrats will be collecting all the Bibles and yes, that actually was said about John Kerry.

#52 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 09:48 AM | Reply

"The same republicans that want to force unprepared women to deliver a child they have no ability to provide for also want to cut social services "

Don't forget refusing to fund honest education, or provide easy access to birth control.

#53 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:50 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"You truly don't see how unhinged you leftists have become? "

You don't see how unhinged you have always been. Which "leftist" society failed? Sweden, GB, France???? Don't argue with people who have intelligence you just look like a dope. I dare say, you're new here and this site is out of your league.

#55 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 09:54 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

---- you republicans.

#58 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 09:58 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"USSR
Eastern Europe
China
Cuba
Vietnam
Laos
Cambodia (probably the closest thing to leftist ideals taken to their logical conclusion)
Cuba
Venezuela
Angola"

All dictatorships. That is hardly "leftist."

As for GB, Sweden and France, they are currently in the process of squandering all of their wealth accumulated while being governed as a free society.

Tell that to the people who have a higher living standard than we do here. You're don't know what you are even talking about. That is what happens when you hear talking points and think they are thoughts. Go back to Red State or whatever right wing hate site you came from.

#59 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 10:01 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I believe abortion needs to be legal. Having said that, let's not paper over what it actually is - state-sanctioned murder.
#46 | POSTED BY JEFFJ

It's ------ up that you both think it's murder (which it isn't) and should be legal. You're the only dumbass I've ever seen admit to being pro murder.

#60 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 10:01 AM | Reply

--was apparently not carrying a driver's license or any other form of ID

Voted Democrat on Tuesday.

#61 | Posted by nullifidian at 2018-11-08 10:02 AM | Reply

All this talk about gun control or more security is only addressing the symptom and not the root cause of why so many people are losing it.

In the meantime, let's make sure EVERYONE, no matter how crazy, has a gun. Nothing says "self-correcting" like arming people that are "losing it" for some unknown reason.

BTW - Empirical data doesn't bear out "losing it" as the cause. Arming crazy people with highly efficient weapons is the cause.

#62 | Posted by YAV at 2018-11-08 10:02 AM | Reply

HOLY FN COW!

beyond words

#63 | Posted by AuntieSocial at 2018-11-08 10:05 AM | Reply

---- you republicans.

#58 | POSTED BY INDIANAJONES

Is everything political for you?

It's ------ up that you both think it's murder (which it isn't) and should be legal. You're the only dumbass I've ever seen admit to being pro murder.

#60 | POSTED BY INDIANAJONES

It's a position I struggle with. I freely admit that.

#64 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 10:06 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#48 | POSTED BY MOVEON_2020

People like you hate the idea of abortions because you know you would have been aborted had your mother had the choice.

#65 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 10:09 AM | Reply

#64 this happened in my own town because republicans refuse to address gun violence in our society. Everyone should blame the GOP for this.

#66 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 10:11 AM | Reply

"It's a position I struggle with. I freely admit that."

Struggle with it all you want, it's still none of your business what a woman chooses to do with her body.

#67 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 10:15 AM | Reply

Struggle with it all you want, it's still none of your business what a woman chooses to do with her body.

#67 | POSTED BY DANNI

Which is why I think it needs to be legal, in spite of the fact that it's murder.

#64 this happened in my own town because republicans refuse to address gun violence in our society. Everyone should blame the GOP for this.

#66 | POSTED BY INDIANAJONES

It happens every weekend in Chicago, yet we never talk about that.

#69 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 10:20 AM | Reply

#68 - Classic projection.

#70 | Posted by YAV at 2018-11-08 10:20 AM | Reply

It happens every weekend in Chicago, yet we never talk about that.

Mass shootings don't happen every day in Chicago.
We do talk about Chicago's murder rate a lot. We've had threads on it.

So you've managed to pull a Trump and lie twice in on sentence. Congrats on becoming more and more like that which you pretend to despise.

#71 | Posted by YAV at 2018-11-08 10:22 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

every weekend - not every day - mea culpa.

#72 | Posted by YAV at 2018-11-08 10:23 AM | Reply

3 fn nuts in 2 weeks. the day after midterms too ... .. there will be some sort of legislation coming out of this cluster. this is just too much to bear.

#73 | Posted by AuntieSocial at 2018-11-08 10:23 AM | Reply

Boaz

#27 | POSTED BY LEADBELLY

See, this is why we can't have nice things.

We all know wherein lies boaz's corrupt ideas and emotions. Every political idea he has is just about the opposite of my own, I would still trust him with my wife, my children and with my wallet. That is not the same thing as trusting him to write good gun legislation.

#74 | Posted by kudzu at 2018-11-08 10:23 AM | Reply

#73 - Won't be coming from the Republicans. The Senate won't pass it. Live with it. This is the Age of Trump. MAGA!

#75 | Posted by YAV at 2018-11-08 10:24 AM | Reply

Suspected shooter Ian David Long is a former marine.

www.cnn.com

#76 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2018-11-08 10:24 AM | Reply

Mass shootings don't happen every day in Chicago.
We do talk about Chicago's murder rate a lot. We've had threads on it.
So you've managed to pull a Trump and lie twice in on sentence. Congrats on becoming more and more like that which you pretend to despise.

#71 | POSTED BY YAV

Last year Chicago saw 650 people murdered.

And no, it's rarely discussed on this site and when it is progressives and some liberals pooh-pooh it.

#77 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 10:25 AM | Reply

11 people killed with a handgun. I guess we'd better ban the AR-15 in response to this.

#78 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 10:26 AM | Reply

Shooter used a .45 cal handgun purchased legally.

#80 | Posted by Daniel at 2018-11-08 10:27 AM | Reply

wow. just wow.

#81 | Posted by AuntieSocial at 2018-11-08 10:30 AM | Reply

Extended magazine:

The sheriff said in a news conference that the gun was "legally purchased" and described it as a "Glock 21 .45 caliber. Designed to hold a magazine of 10 rounds and one in the chamber. He had an extended magazine on it."

heavy.com

#82 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2018-11-08 10:34 AM | Reply

I assume you are offering this advice based on taste.

#26 | Posted by moveon_2020 at 2018-11-08 09:00 AM |

No. But if you want to eat it rather than apply it I can't stop you.

#83 | Posted by Zed at 2018-11-08 10:35 AM | Reply

I wonder if any of them were armed?:

6 off-duty officers were in the bar last night

There were six off-duty officers from various agencies inside the Borderline Bar & Grill at the time of the shooting, Ventura County Sheriff Geoff Dean said.

www.cnn.com

#84 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2018-11-08 10:37 AM | Reply

I knew Sgt. Healus. He wasn't a friend or anything, but I had professional interactions with the man. I'm about to head into work. it will be pretty grim in the courthouse today.

#85 | Posted by moder8 at 2018-11-08 10:44 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

For you who are posting this crap about Planned Parenthood and that women are responsible for deciding if they get pregnant or not, please keep in mind that the forces in this country who want to deny women the right to choose, to them this includes not only outlawing abortion but also contraceptives. And many of those who use the issue of religious freedom in this argument also believe that it's the male who's responsible for making the decision as whether their partner becomes pregnant or not. After all, have you ever heard of anyone on the Right objecting to insurance policies covering vasectomies? As one noted feminist once observed, "If males could become pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament."

OCU

#86 | Posted by OCUser at 2018-11-08 10:45 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 6

Sorry, but the above item was posted in the WRONG thread.

OCU

#87 | Posted by OCUser at 2018-11-08 10:47 AM | Reply

#85 - Good luck, Moder8.

#88 | Posted by YAV at 2018-11-08 10:48 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Actually, upon review, this was where I wanted to post it. Sorry for the confusion, it's still early in SoCal ;-)

OCU

#89 | Posted by OCUser at 2018-11-08 10:49 AM | Reply

Government-created killing machine kills people. Big surprise.

Crazy war vets are one more gift from the disaster that was dubya.

Just like trump's cult members will keep killing people for decades after he's gone.

#90 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 10:52 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

i don't know any of them or anyone that knows any of them. i have my own troubles. SO WHAT. what's the point of this thread?

You came here expecting all the news to be about you? Who do you think you are -- Donald Trump?

#91 | Posted by rcade at 2018-11-08 10:53 AM | Reply | Funny: 5

"You could just ask Snoofy to shower before changing positions." - #26 | Posted by moveon_2020 at 2018-11-08 09:00 AM

Snoofy last posted yesterday evening @ 8:00pm.

You just joined the Retort 11 hours and 50 minutes later.

How do you know who Snoofy is?

Whose sock-puppet are you?

Are you someone currently in exile attempting to getting around it by creating a new account?

#92 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 10:58 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 7

Yes, about time those gun toting California rednecks finally fix their lax gun control laws so they can finally lower their murder rates. Hell, just look at the success of anti-gun legislation in Chicago and Baltimore...gun violence has almost been completely eradicated!

#79 | Posted by moveon_2020

Prove this statement wrong: Gun control laws have saved 10000000 lives.

You can't.

It's unknowable how many lives have been saved by gun control laws.

Yet every shooting brings out a bunch of mouthbreathing morons claiming that the shooting is proof that gun control doesn't work.

If YOUR kid was the one who DOESNT get shot because of a gun law, you'd be singing a different tune.

#93 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 10:59 AM | Reply

Whose sock-puppet are you?

#92 | Posted by Hans

My money is on sheeple.

He got suspended and he couldnt take it, so he's back as moveon2020. Except with this disguise he's no longer pretending to be a super progressive who was forced by liberals to be a passionate trump supporter, now he's just openly a passionate trump supporter.

#94 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 11:01 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

"My money is on sheeple." - #94 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 11:01 AM

Or, possibly, Avigdore, who was put on "vacation" yesterday.

#95 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 11:05 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"And no, it's rarely discussed on this site and when it is progressives and some liberals pooh-pooh it."

That's just a lie. Liberals comment that though there are gun control laws in Chicago they can be purchased legally in nearby states.
www.nbcchicago.com

#96 | Posted by danni at 2018-11-08 11:08 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

My son's high school has extra police presence because a threat made on a bathroom wall was found Monday night. Threats have to be taken very seriously in this day and age.
All this talk about gun control or more security is only addressing the symptom and not the root cause of why so many people are losing it.
#9 | Posted by Pirate

#9,
Pirate, it's hard to address root causes.
It's easier to take someone else's rights instead.
#10 | Posted by boaz

Lets be honest here. Root cause? Far too many "root causes" to eliminate them all.

Extremist with a gun?
Mentally ill with a gun?
Slighted with a gun?
Sociopath with a gun?
Person with Anger issues with a gun?
Both extremist and mentally ill with gun?
Slighted and mentally ill with gun?
and on and on and on...
Do you go so far as to say Society in General?

We see it time and again. No offense but your "rights" say a well regulated militia and not every moron who thinks they need an arsenal. (Again I am an admitted owner of a small arsenal of hunting rifles.) Understand it is proven fact that punishment does not stop or deter crime - even the death penalty. (In this particular case and most others the villain took their own life.)

As for addressing root causes - every time "Liberals" attempt to the Right and/or NRA are totally against it. (Liberals in quotes because I mean people with common sense - just using right wing language so you follow.) More and better gun checks. Integrating mental health screenings and registries. Limiting mass death factors - like magazine size, bump stocks, etc. Look back in 34 and then again in the 90s it was the right who helped put the limits in place. I am not clear on what happened after that. It seems it was the influence and brainwashing of the NRA that came into play. Frankly the NRA and it's militant agenda are the problem. The Democrats haven't even come for your guns when they could - the paranoia is unreal.

As for mental health - lets not forget it was the right who defunded and decentralized institutional mental health care. They were going to replace the large institutions with local ones but never ever funded this. Since then there has been far more issues. People talking about the homeless? The homelessness problem exploded at that point because many of them are mentally ill and refuse medication. I understand their rights to refuse medication but if they can not function then they need to be housed and monitored at the very least for their own good and the good of all.

So until you have a fix and GOP will actually fix something here's to thoughts and prayers it isn't you or our family next. (Hint: There won't be a fix from the GOP. It involves increasing spending (taxes), social "welfare" programs and/or gun control. You know everyone should 100% of capable of taking care of themselves after all.)

#97 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2018-11-08 11:10 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Most countries of Europe are capitalist with comparatively high taxes supporting a social welfare state.

#98 | Posted by visitor_ at 2018-11-08 11:10 AM | Reply

I believe abortion needs to be legal. Having said that, let's not paper over what it actually is - state-sanctioned murder.
#46 | POSTED BY JEFFJ

^
To sum up:
JeffJ believe murder needs to be legal.
Does this only apply to fetuses, or are you making a point about the Second Amendment and gun violence?

#99 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 11:11 AM | Reply

Ex-Marine. Drudge has a picture up.

He looks like Jim Carrey

#101 | Posted by HanoverFist at 2018-11-08 11:16 AM | Reply

Are you someone currently in exile attempting to getting around it by creating a new account?

#92 | POSTED BY HANS

Good 👁 detective Hans!

We have our 👁👁 on you mr moveon.org

#102 | Posted by donnerboy at 2018-11-08 11:16 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Or, possibly, Avigdore, who was put on "vacation" yesterday.

#95 | POSTED BY HANS

Rcade's comment was funny, but apparently he wasn't serious....

AVIGDORE

Victor

Seniority: 258

Party: Independent

Ideology: Conservative

Private E-mail
No Home Page

Joined 2013/08/03
Visited 2018/11/07

Status: user

#103 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 11:18 AM | Reply

#9,
Pirate, it's hard to address root causes.
It's easier to take someone else's rights instead.
#10 | Posted by boaz

Ackshually, addressing the root cause will required taking someone's rights away no matter what

#104 | Posted by truthhurts at 2018-11-08 11:18 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

It's unknowable how many lives have been saved by gun control laws.

#93 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY AT 2018-11-08 10:59 AM | FLAG: NONESENSE

Weak excuse under any circumstance but Australia serves as a examle. Similar culture that once had a similar problem... not so much any more. A couple decades ago a very unpopular political move it is now considered a model.

Of course there are also more atheists in Oz too...

#105 | Posted by RightisTrite at 2018-11-08 11:20 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

#10 At the moment, your "right" to have a particular hobby is killing dozens every week.
So is your right to drive a car.
#19 | Posted by boaz

Which requires a license, insurance, safety checks, training, minimal aptitude, etc etc etc

#106 | Posted by truthhurts at 2018-11-08 11:20 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Most countries of Europe are capitalist with comparatively high taxes supporting a social welfare state.

#98 | Posted by visitor_

And we're capitalist with comparatively high taxes supporting a corrupt and wasteful military industrial complex.

#107 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 11:20 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

I grew up in Thousand Oaks – 60's – 80's. The Gunsmoke set was still there early on, the Dallas Cowboys would train there in the summer and it wasn't too far from the beach. A great town. Last place I'd imagine something like this happening.

My nephew is a Venture County sheriff and was called to the scene last night. I've traded texted to make sure he's ok, and will call when things calm down.

This has got to stop. I like the idea of people having to be licensed and have it renewed like a driver's license. That way if a man buys a gun and then goes off the deep end years later, there's a chance of intervening. And getting a license would educate a lot of idiots out there how to handle a gun.

#108 | Posted by JimDuncan at 2018-11-08 11:21 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

"...but apparently he wasn't serious...." - #103 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 11:18 AM

He was serious... until this morning. :-)

#109 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 11:27 AM | Reply

Seems to me he is the one that is consistent in his positions. Murder is okay.

#100 | Posted by moveon_2020

Go away sheep. YOu got banned.

#110 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 11:32 AM | Reply

In a society whose only value is profit and subject to wealth concentration over time armed angry losers will act out in arbitrary violent ways over and over again, because there is no way to succeed in a highly competitive rigged system. Stock market volatility, vanishing pension funds, monopoly pricing practices, offshoring, unemployment, falling wages amidst rising rents and education costs, union busting, persistent attacks on social security and other safety nets, global warming, and nuclear annihilation all create a growing black cloud over human civilization.

#111 | Posted by bayviking at 2018-11-08 11:33 AM | Reply

I truly want to know if JeffJ is okay with these murders the same way he is okay with baby murder.

If not, why the double standard, JeffJ.

#112 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 11:35 AM | Reply

--Go away sheep. YOu got banned.

#110 | Posted by SpeakSoftly

Everytime a new poster shows up, you clowns claim it's a previous poster if, and only if, the poster is right of center. This is the bubble mentality: There's a finite set of opposition posters, only the left can increase its numbers.

#113 | Posted by nullifidian at 2018-11-08 11:37 AM | Reply

"This has got to stop."

It will not stop.

#114 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 11:37 AM | Reply

Most countries of Europe are capitalist with comparatively high taxes supporting a social welfare state.

#98 | Posted by visitor_

Yes they are Capitalist countries with Social welfare for all. Home to huge corporations and a massive economy when grouped together - comparable in population and economy to the US. The biggest difference is their governments mostly work for the people - though some are still struggling as new democracies to throw off the corruption of communism.

#115 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2018-11-08 11:38 AM | Reply

"Everytime a new poster shows up, you clowns claim it's a previous poster if, and only if, the poster is right of center."

Your new hero referenced me; s/he's clearly not a new poster, just a new account.

#116 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 11:38 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Your new hero referenced me; s/he's clearly not a new poster, just a new account.

#116 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

Correct. Like Hans, it caught my eye when the newbie referenced you.

#117 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 11:45 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

It happens every weekend in Chicago, yet we never talk about that.

#69 | POSTED BY JEFFJ

We don't talk about it but we can still blame the republicans that allow it.

#118 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 11:50 AM | Reply

I grew up in Thousand Oaks – 60's – 80's.
#108 | POSTED BY JIMDUNCAN

It used to hover around the top spot for safest cities in the US. Now it suffers the same American Carnage trump promised to bring everywhere...

#119 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 11:54 AM | Reply

The city of Chicago and the state of Illinois are run by Democrats, Dr Jones.

You are never going to get an outright gun ban as long as the 2nd Amendment is around.

The 2nd is not a Republican or Democrat issue.

Do you realize how many UAW workers are deer hunters?

The auto factories in Michigan shut down for the first week of deer hunting season.

Do you think Democrats who represent those constituents are going to get behind repealing the 2nd and then banning guns?

You need to understand political reality.

#120 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 11:58 AM | Reply

It probably is sheep. "Moveon2020" sounds like a progressive name, but the poster is clearly a faux-christian putin-lover.

#121 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 12:00 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Everytime a new poster shows up, you clowns claim it's a previous poster if, and only if, the poster is right of center."

Is that why your fellow righties insist on claiming I am a prior poster? Cry me a river and drown in it.

#122 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-11-08 12:01 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Everytime a new poster shows up, you clowns claim it's a previous poster if, and only if, the poster is right of center. This is the bubble mentality: There's a finite set of opposition posters, only the left can increase its numbers.

#113 | Posted by nullifidian

If a poster gets banned or embarrased, and then immediately a new poster appears with their same posting pattern and agenda, it's pretty obvious.

But nulli's not good at understanding the obvious. He supports a con man president.

#123 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 12:02 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

"The city of Chicago and the state of Illinois are run by Democrats, Dr Jones."

Woah! I didn't realize Chicago was immune to interstate travel. I had no clue it had a sovereign border uncross-able by republican gun sellers.

"Do you realize how many UAW workers are deer hunters?"

WTF do hunters have to do with murderers?

"Do you think Democrats who represent those constituents are going to get behind repealing the 2nd and then banning guns?"

No one but trump has proposed this you moron. Lay off the koolaid for once in your life.

Great arguments, Ben Shapiro.

#124 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 12:03 PM | Reply

It happens every weekend in Chicago, yet we never talk about that.

No it doesn't. If you equate gang violence with mass shootings of random kids at school or people at a bar you are mentally ill.

That said, left policy on gum control would address both mass shootings and gang violence, so your "argument" is a stupid one anyway.

#125 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 12:03 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Another mass shooting in Amerikkka. Just the price of freedom.

#126 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-11-08 12:03 PM | Reply

The 2nd is not a Republican or Democrat issue.

#120 | Posted by JeffJ

But background checks are.

Assault weapons bans are.

Preventing the mentally ill from getting guns is.

NRA puppets opposed all of these, and get more people killed.

#127 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 12:04 PM | Reply

If you equate gang violence with mass shootings of random kids at school or people at a bar you are mentally ill.
#125 | POSTED BY JOE

That's Jeffylube.

#128 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 12:07 PM | Reply

Another mass shooting in Amerikkka. Just the price of freedom.

#126 | Posted by DirkStruan

People who spell America that way just expose themselves as America haters. Not that there was any doubt about Comrade Dirkovich.

#129 | Posted by nullifidian at 2018-11-08 12:09 PM | Reply

#129 People who oppose gun control while thousands of Americans are slaughtered every year are more "anti-American" than anyone who triggers you by spelling a word wrong.

#130 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 12:11 PM | Reply

The 2nd is not a Republican or Democrat issue.

--------. It's a right-wing dog whistle. Which party wants concealed carry reciprocity across state lines?

#131 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:12 PM | Reply

"People who spell America that way just expose themselves as America haters."

While people like you who gripe about it reveal your "love" for the country's least lovable aspects... like kids getting mowed down because of your "right" to own a gun.

#132 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-11-08 12:13 PM | Reply

"Do you realize how many UAW workers are deer hunters?"

Do you realize deer were hunted for hundreds of thousands of years before guns were invented?

#133 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:17 PM | Reply

Too early to play Rush to Judgement?

- White Male
- Age 24
- Few friends; introverted
- Is now or recently quit taking antidepressants
- Progressive; history of activism
- Chose a country bar so he could kill more Republicans

#4 | POSTED BY Comrade Mustang

He was one of yours snowflake! Own it!

#134 | Posted by aborted_monson at 2018-11-08 12:20 PM | Reply

That said, left policy on gum control would address both mass shootings and gang violence, so your "argument" is a stupid one anyway.

#125 | POSTED BY JOE

No it wouldn't. And you know it.

"Do you think Democrats who represent those constituents are going to get behind repealing the 2nd and then banning guns?"
No one but trump has proposed this you moron.

If you weren't such a moron, you'd do a quick Google check before making such a stupid statement:

www.google.com

#135 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 12:21 PM | Reply

#129 People who oppose gun control while thousands of Americans are slaughtered every year are more "anti-American" than anyone who triggers you by spelling a word wrong.

#130 | POSTED BY JOE

The gun control you support takes law-abiding responsible gun owners and turns them into criminals.

#136 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 12:22 PM | Reply

No it wouldn't. And you know it.

???

Universal/stricter background checks, closing gun show loopholes, banning assault weapons and bump stocks, etc would have an impact on all kinds of shootings. What is your basis for denying this?

#137 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 12:24 PM | Reply

#136

That's what laws DO, genius. The law against murder turns murderers into criminals! Oh no! The sky is falling!

#138 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-11-08 12:25 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

The gun control you support takes law-abiding responsible gun owners and turns them into criminals.

Despite the laughable hyperbole of your statement, i'm actually 100% on board with making every gun owner a criminal until children stop being slaughtered at school with AR-15s. But i see you and I have different prioriies - you support gun hobbyists while i support kids not dying.

#139 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 12:26 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

"The gun control you support takes law-abiding responsible gun owners and turns them into criminals.
#136 | POSTED BY JEFFJ"

Do you feel the same way about bomb control?

Why the double standard?

#140 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:28 PM | Reply

The gun control you support takes law-abiding responsible gun owners and turns them into criminals.

Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 12:22 PM | Reply

Nonsense. Reagan was for gun control hell even the NRA was for gun control until they were hijacked by Right Winged zealots. Sad what happened to a once respectable political party.

#141 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2018-11-08 12:33 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

My thoughts and prayers are with the people of (insert city, school, church, concert venue, event here) for this horrific act of evil and to the families of those impacted by this tragedy. #seeyounexttime

#142 | Posted by lee_the_agent at 2018-11-08 12:38 PM | Reply

Nonsense. Reagan was for gun control hell even the NRA was for gun control until they were hijacked by Right Winged zealots. Sad what happened to a once respectable political party.

#141 | POSTED BY LAURAMOHR AT 2018-11-08 12:33 PM | REPLY

That leadership wasn't hijacked. It was defeated, because it supported gun control for purely racist reasons.

#143 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 12:42 PM | Reply

The NRA is a Russian funded agitprop organization that exists to divide and weaken America from within.

The gun control "debate" becomes a lot easier to understand when you realize the true agenda of the pro-gun side.

#144 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:42 PM | Reply

"That leadership wasn't hijacked. It was defeated."

Actually, the leadership was purchased.
By Russians.

Thanks, Capitalism!

#145 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:44 PM | Reply

"It was defeated, because it supported gun control for purely racist reasons." - #143 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 12:42 PM

The Revolt at Cincinnati had nothing to do with "gun control for purely racist reasons."

#146 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 12:49 PM | Reply

Yes, it did. It happened because scary black people with rifles went into the California state house, which caused that era NRA leadership to support gun control. No racism, no revolt.

#147 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 12:50 PM | Reply

People who spell America that way just expose themselves as America haters.
#129 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

I take great pride in publicly hating confederate amerikkka.

#148 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 12:53 PM | Reply

Speaking of California, the state decided this guy wasn't a threat and let him keep his pistol.

#149 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 12:54 PM | Reply

BTW, WTF is 1000 Oaks?
#22 | POSTED BY KUDZU AT 2018-11-08 08:47 AM

Many locations carry the samesake of their original appearance.

#150 | Posted by redlightrobot at 2018-11-08 12:54 PM | Reply

Heller overturned a gun control law that existed for purely racist reasons.

DC cops would pile gun charges on ---------ers caught with illegal weapons.

DC's gun law existed for that purpose.

But, some things are worse than racism.

Mass murder for example.

#151 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:55 PM | Reply

"Speaking of California, the state decided this guy wasn't a threat and let him keep his pistol.
#149 | POSTED BY SITZKRIEG"

^
Didn't they get that right?

Or are you actually saying this guy's guns should have been taken away???

LOL!!!

#152 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 12:56 PM | Reply

Speaking of California, the state decided this guy wasn't a threat and let him keep his pistol.

#149 | Posted by sitzkrieg

Was he a threat? He didn't become a threat until it he did.

We don't use the Minority Report.... yet.

#153 | Posted by donnerboy at 2018-11-08 01:03 PM | Reply

Reports are the shooter was a Republican and that Trump is going to give him a medal of honor for his actions.

#154 | Posted by Tor at 2018-11-08 01:04 PM | Reply

I wonder why he popped the smoke.
Chaos? Concealment? Because he had it?

Anyone know if there was surveillance video?

Was he getting $$ from the VA for PTSD or are we assuming he had it?

#155 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2018-11-08 01:04 PM | Reply

#152 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2018-11-08 12:56 PM | FLAG:

I'm saying the best gun control the state can offer doesn't work. Don't lack.

#156 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 01:06 PM | Reply

"Yes, it did." - #147 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-08 12:50 PM

Nope.

How NRA's true believers converted a marksmanship group into a mighty gun lobby

[snip] "Before Cincinnati, you had a bunch of people who wanted to turn the NRA into a sports publishing organization and get rid of guns," recalls one of the rebels, John D. Aquilino, speaking by phone from the border city of Brownsville, Tex.

#157 | Posted by Hans at 2018-11-08 01:07 PM | Reply

I'm saying the best gun control the state can offer doesn't work. Don't lack.

#156 | Posted by sitzkrieg

Really? Can you PROVE it doesn't work? Can you prove NO lives have been saved by gun control?

Or does your definition of "working" mean that it works 100%?

#158 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 01:09 PM | Reply

I'm saying the best gun control the state can offer doesn't work. Don't lack.

#156 | Posted by sitzkrieg

The premise that gun control must work 100% of the time to be considered to "work" is so logically flawed that anyone who makes that argument looks like a total moron.

If yo brush your teeth and still get a cavity, does that mean brushing your teeth didn't work, so you might as well quit doing it?

#159 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2018-11-08 01:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Redlightrobot - Part of the Conejo (rabbit) Valley. They were everywhere before they paved over all the hills. Fibonacci would have loved the place.

Remember the airport scene in It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World? That was just down the road.

#160 | Posted by JimDuncan at 2018-11-08 01:14 PM | Reply

I'm saying the best gun control the state can offer doesn't work. Don't lack.

#156 | Posted by sitzkrieg

The "best gun control" the state can pass.

We can offer better. Doesn't mean it will pass.

Yet.

#161 | Posted by donnerboy at 2018-11-08 01:14 PM | Reply

"I'm saying the best gun control the state can offer doesn't work."

Well surely yurely you're smarter than California libs.

So tell us, what would work?

#162 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 01:21 PM | Reply

162 comments? What the hell? Don't you people realize it is too early to talk about this?

#163 | Posted by mOntecOre at 2018-11-08 01:36 PM | Reply | Funny: 4

Sitzkrieg, I find you to be one of the better posters here. I'd be interested in your thoughts on how to prevent things like this. You may have spelled them out before, and I wasn't reading. This one hit close to home so I came here.

#164 | Posted by JimDuncan at 2018-11-08 01:39 PM | Reply

Authorities identified the shooter as Ian David Long, a 28-year-old Marine veteran. He used a Glock 21 – a brand of .45-caliber handgun – with an extended magazine, police said. His motive and death are under investigation.

www.usatoday.com

#165 | Posted by memyselfini at 2018-11-08 01:40 PM | Reply

"I'm saying the best gun control the state can offer doesn't work."

So long as states are hamstrung by the Second Amendment, do you really expect gun control to succeed in any state?

You can't genuinely think gun control can work while the Second Amendment stands.

Feel free to Putin's NRA flavored d--- at us some more though. You're really making a meal out of it.

#166 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 01:40 PM | Reply

"Sitzkrieg, I find you to be one of the better posters here. I'd be interested in your thoughts on how to prevent things like this."

Maybe your honey will catch more flies than my vinegar.

Good luck!

#167 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 01:44 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Maybe your honey will catch more flies than my vinegar.
Good luck!

#167 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

Honey can catch more flies but vinegar will kill actually them.

#168 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 01:48 PM | Reply

His comments on the military and world events are very well thought out. Since he obviously has an interest in guns, I'd like to hear his stance. I'm not a gun grab guy, but I also want to take meaningful steps to prevent situations like this. I hope there are steps. Jumping to the extremes on both sides only keeps us were we are.

#169 | Posted by JimDuncan at 2018-11-08 01:57 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

And blacks are 3/5 of a white person....that is why we have a different word for them. You are on the wrong side of history.

#35 | POSTED BY MOVEON_2020 AT 2018-11-08 09:20 AM | REPLY |

Sorry there is only one human race.

fetuses are not children. Black men and white men are both men. WTF are YOU talking about?

#170 | Posted by hatter5183 at 2018-11-08 02:03 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Jumping to the extremes on both sides only keeps us were we are."

Literally everyone who didn't vote for Hillary Clinton prefers where we are to any changes whatsoever when it comes to guns.

Stop pretending gun control isn't partisan.

#171 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 02:05 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Jumping to the extremes on both sides only keeps us were we are

Actually, jumping to one partiular extreme would take us very far from where we currently are. It's too bad our politicians are too bought to go there.

#172 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-08 02:17 PM | Reply

#171 - Well, that's going to help.

#173 | Posted by JimDuncan at 2018-11-08 02:18 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

We now are so far to the right that even when Democrats "jump" extreme left they are actually jumping back into the center.

#174 | Posted by donnerboy at 2018-11-08 02:28 PM | Reply

The city of Chicago and the state of Illinois are run by Democrats, Dr Jones.

no nurse betty. for the last 8 years the state had a republican gov, who is still gov.

jb priztker, a dem, was elected tuesday

#175 | Posted by cjk85 at 2018-11-08 02:36 PM | Reply

"The city of Chicago and the state of Illinois are run by Democrats, Dr Jones."

See my #124. Try to keep up. Chicago and Illinois do not have borders closed to republican gun sellers.

#176 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 02:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Redlightrobot - Part of the Conejo (rabbit) Valley. They were everywhere before they paved over all the hills. Fibonacci would have loved the place.
Remember the airport scene in It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World? That was just down the road.
#160 | POSTED BY JIMDUNCAN AT 2018-11-08 01:14 PM

I have an affinity for great oak, that's too bad. Traveling through the ironwood district of Portland and you see zero ironwood trees. Many places across the nation are undoubtedly nicknamed Stumptown too.

On topic:

So, this man was suffering PTSD, is perceived as a liberal?! gun enthusiast ex-military because he attack alleged conservatives? Wow, what an identity jumble. But that's more and more the fact - we're not just one kind of PSTD society.

The Las Vegas massacre was also after C&W people - they do claim to be the biggest patriots with anthems about tailgate parties and proudly sacrificing their family to the military. It's formula lost it's fizz long before Toby Keith became the standard. Maybe he just got sick of country music hypocrisy? Or, he's been misdiagnosed by several professionals, legally armed and allowed to observably fester by multiple people who knew him until he picks someplace with the least danger to himself?

The military doesn't address this, marijuana isn't even a therapy yet. As much as I despise the man, Obama kush could have saved lives. California can thank Dianne Feinstein for blocking marijuana for so long. Thank her instead of innocent kids at a dance party.

#177 | Posted by redlightrobot at 2018-11-08 02:52 PM | Reply

Chicago and Illinois do not have borders closed to republican gun sellers.

#176 | Posted by IndianaJones

A little factoid that Conservatives always conveniently forget.

#178 | Posted by donnerboy at 2018-11-08 03:00 PM | Reply

#134. No denying it, but it doesn't run counter to my Rush to Judgement predictions, at least not yet!

#179 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2018-11-08 03:09 PM | Reply

I am guessing that the vet got humiliated by people that go to that bar, grew to hate them and then took revenge.

That seems to be the pattern of most mass shootings. Social failure uses gun to attack those he has grown to hate.
I think it has more to do with a uniquely American desire to go out in a blaze of glory.
Guns enable it, and mental health is associated, but what drives these murder and often suicides seems to be a uniquely American frequent desire to avenge humiliation with guns.

#180 | Posted by bored at 2018-11-08 03:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

The shooter is a white Marine combat veteran.

That means this wasn't terrorism.

It's just a symptom of his PTSD.

#181 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 06:37 PM | Reply

Its time for our leaders to sit down and work together; cons, dems together to come up with a workable plan to actually reduce these hellish shootings.
Fact is that most NRA members hate the gotdam nuts that do these shootings and support gun restrictions.
Mental issues have to addressed. Doctors have to be compelled to report anyone that is messed up to the point that they could be dangerous.
Stop and search YES!
Being an honest lawful gun owner, I can say that I cannot buy a gun without going thru a background check.
If there are loopholes, they have be plugged.

#182 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2018-11-08 06:54 PM | Reply

"Fact is that most NRA members hate the gotdam nuts that do these shootings and support gun restrictions."

You hate Marines with PTSD?

I believe you.

You sure as ---- don't support getting them better health care.

#183 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 06:56 PM | Reply

"cons, dems together to come up with a workable plan to actually reduce these hellish shootings"

There is no plan -- other than arming more people -- that the GOP supports.

Stop pretending this isn't a partisan issue.

#184 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 06:58 PM | Reply

You hate Marines with PTSD?
I believe you.
You sure as ---- don't support getting them better health care.
#183 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

That's your take-away from my post?
FUBAR son FUBAR

#186 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2018-11-08 07:17 PM | Reply

"That's your take-away from my post?"

Am I wrong?

#187 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 07:19 PM | Reply

If you have to ask, I'll be happy that you won't be on the panel that should/will be convened to try to solve the shooting problem.

#188 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2018-11-08 07:33 PM | Reply

I see Avigdore is still pretending to be someone else.

He is failing trolling 101. Pretending to be someone else is akin to playing poker.
You alt-right goobers have some obvious "tells" that give you away everytime.

#189 | Posted by aborted_monson at 2018-11-08 07:34 PM | Reply

"If you have to ask, I'll be happy that you won't be on the panel that should/will be convened to try to solve the shooting problem."

If that panel has any Republicans on it, the only "solution" they'll offer is more people should be armed.

Your inability to acknowledge that simple fact puts you in the "Denial" stage of the Kübler-Ross model.

Even Goatman did better than that; he was constantly trying to bargain away gun rights for some other rights. One stage ahead of where your ignorant ass is at.

#190 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 07:59 PM | Reply

You have better solution? Not the usual crackpot ---- you puke up...something that both sides could work with?

#191 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2018-11-08 08:12 PM | Reply

Australia figured it out.

#192 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 08:13 PM | Reply

"something that both sides could work with?"

There is nothing other than more guns that the GOP will accept. Why the f*** is it so hard for you to acknowledge that fact?

#193 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 08:14 PM | Reply

Phester, your problem is there isn't an honest bone in your body.

And that includes Trump's bone.

#194 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 08:20 PM | Reply

Phester, your problem is there isn't an honest bone in your body.
And that includes Trump's bone.
#194 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

Aw bless your pointed little head. You feel better now?
Instead of lashing out with useless hate, come up with a sensible plan.

#197 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2018-11-08 08:56 PM | Reply

"come up with a sensible plan."

I already did.

The only plan you and the rest of the GOP can support is giving more people more guns.

There's nothing I can do about that.

#198 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 08:58 PM | Reply

"So, sorry dudes that married dudes, you didn't get "married" - because, as Danforth points out, that word already has a definition."

^
This is the same old stupid disingenuous argument that n----- isn't a racist term because if you consult a dictionary from years gone by it defines it as "an excessively lazy person."

#199 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:01 PM | Reply

"So, they were successful in disarming their people - not so successful in stopping mass shootings as shown in mass shooting that occurred there THIS YEAR."

One, vs 307.

And you think 307 is winning.

#200 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:03 PM | Reply

"He is the one saying that we can't change definitions of words."

You mean, like, a law defining marriage as "one man and one woman" isn't going to fly?

#202 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:10 PM | Reply

Speaking of changing definitions,

Who were you before you made your new account?

#203 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:11 PM | Reply

Its time for our leaders to sit down and work together; cons, dems together to come up with a workable plan to actually reduce these hellish shootings.
Fact is that most NRA members hate the gotdam nuts that do these shootings and support gun restrictions.
Mental issues have to addressed. Doctors have to be compelled to report anyone that is messed up to the point that they could be dangerous.
Stop and search YES!
Being an honest lawful gun owner, I can say that I cannot buy a gun without going thru a background check.
If there are loopholes, they have be plugged.

#182 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2018-11-08 06:54 PM | Reply | Flag:

You and I don't agree on much, but I'm sincere in saying thank you for this post. We need to find common ground. The video of this shooting had me close to tears tonight as I watched TV with my daughter, about the same age as most of the victims, feeling nothing but helplessness.

#204 | Posted by cbob at 2018-11-08 09:16 PM | Reply

"which seems to be what Danforth believes ought to be the case"

What other name(s) have you posted under on the Drudge Retort?

#207 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:36 PM | Reply

"as Danforth points out, that word already has a definition."

Definitions can be expanded, especially through the court, whereas the definition of "murder" and "person" have legal boundaries.

You're playing Humpty Dumpty.

#211 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:39 PM | Reply

#208

Enjoy your mass shooting a week, you damned savage. Dead kids are just the price of freedom, right?

#212 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-11-08 09:40 PM | Reply

"How many times have you posted idiotic arguments, were pantsed because of it, and then tried to blame the messenger?"

None I've been so ashamed of I've had to change my screen name.

What coward(s) were you before?

#213 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:40 PM | Reply

"what was already the common accepted definition of marriage -"

According to whom? And by the way: homophobic slur noted and flagged.

#214 | Posted by DirkStruan at 2018-11-08 09:41 PM | Reply

"Because a 1 in 27,000,000 event occurred somewhere in the US?"

What kind of math are you using?

#215 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:42 PM | Reply

"You are scared of your own shadow."

You are scared of your own username.

#216 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:42 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"because Danforth doesn't think we should redefine words like gender."

Do us all a favor and try not to put words in my mouth.

I believe in freedom, and Laura and her gender is up to Laura, period. It's up to the rest of us to respect and support her decision.

#217 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:46 PM | Reply

"You are scared of your own shadow."

You are scared of your own username.

#216 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2018-11-08 09:42 PM | REPLY

Pwned. Thread over.

#218 | Posted by Alexandrite at 2018-11-08 09:48 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"He is the one saying that we can't change definitions of words."

No, I was specifically saying "murder" has a legal definition, and abortion isn't it. Also "person" has a legal definition, and a fetus isn't it. We as a society changed the legal definition of marriage, and allowed Americans the freedom to legally change their gender.

Everything else is just your bull-headedness. You're either sloppy, stupid, or both.

I expect this incarnation to disappear soon, and the old persona to return...

...once the butt paste heals all the election wounds.

#219 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:51 PM | Reply

POSTED BY MOVEON_2020

Just got here. Who's the reincarnated dweeb?

#220 | Posted by REDIAL at 2018-11-08 09:54 PM | Reply

"Because a 1 in 27,000,000 event occurred somewhere in the US?"
What kind of math are you using?

^
I think this is 325 million people in America, divided by 12 that got killed.

#221 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:54 PM | Reply

"using the same exact logical inconsistency. "

Posts the guy who can't seem to come to grips with laws and legal definitions changing. Too rich.

#222 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:55 PM | Reply

What coward(s) were you before?

#213 | POSTED BY DANFORTH

I've been trying to zero in and I'm 75% certain Movon2020 is Rex.

#223 | Posted by JeffJ at 2018-11-08 09:56 PM | Reply

"I think this is 325 million people in America, divided by 12 that got killed."

WTF? No one is that dumb.

#224 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 09:56 PM | Reply

To me it's believable because the math checks out so well though...

#225 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 09:58 PM | Reply

WTF? No one is that dumb.

Vernon is still out somewhere with his calculator.

#226 | Posted by REDIAL at 2018-11-08 09:58 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Movon2020 is Rex."

Well no wonder this moron is so butt hurt.

I've embarrassed Wrecks seven ways from Sunday. Everything from his failed blog (------- With Zits), to his belief in The Kansas Miracle (he actually both blamed and exonerated Republicans), to his crowning achievement, drunk-blogging from the crapper one night, giving everyone on the DR a plop-by-plop description of all things Wrecks.

#227 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 10:01 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Vernon is still out somewhere with his calculator."

There is only a 61,413% chance of that.

#228 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 10:03 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

--"Movon2020 is Rex."

I believe it's Professor Plum, in the library, with an assault rifle.

#229 | Posted by nullifidian at 2018-11-08 10:08 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Helpless why? Because a 1 in 27,000,000 event occurred somewhere in the US? How are you able to drive a car, take a bath, or use a vending machine (2 deaths / year) without wetting your pants. Libs love to say that conservatives have all of this fear...ah, no. You are scared of your own shadow.

#208 | Posted by moveon_2020 at 2018-11-08 09:37 PM | Reply | Flag:

Kill yourself.

#230 | Posted by cbob at 2018-11-08 10:13 PM | Reply

Moveon is a bad bowel movement and needs flushed.

#231 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2018-11-08 10:14 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

I am of the belief some of this horrible tragedy could have been averted if they allowed easier access to concealed carry. The evil gunman could have been neutralized by an armed citizen before before he had a chance to kill all those people.

#232 | Posted by byrdman at 2018-11-08 10:19 PM | Reply

"As a result, for the first time in human history, the linkage between 'educated' and economic success has been severed."

Pretending anecdotal stories alter macro results?!?

I'd ask where you got that, but no one would like the smell.

#233 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-08 10:40 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

I am of the belief some of this horrible tragedy could have been averted if they allowed easier access to concealed carry. The evil gunman could have been neutralized by an armed citizen before before he had a chance to kill all those people.

Posted by byrdman at 2018-11-08 10:19 PM | Reply

You're a damned fool full stop. A concealed carry gun in a crowded bar. You watch too many movies.

#234 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2018-11-08 10:42 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

#229 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

{} is playing with his mental blocks again.

#235 | Posted by Corky at 2018-11-08 11:06 PM | Reply

#232 | POSTED BY BYRDMAN

That would result in a bunch of vigilantes killing one another in confusion.

#236 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2018-11-08 11:20 PM | Reply

The evil gunman could have been neutralized by an armed citizen before before he had a chance to kill all those people.

Wasn't there like 6 off duty cops there? Is it hard for them to carry?

#237 | Posted by REDIAL at 2018-11-08 11:33 PM | Reply

MOVEON and HEINRICH and SPORK are sock puppets of TOR.

HEINRICH and SPORK have been exposed so this is now the "new guy".

He even named himself "TOR" after the TOR-Network... you get the joke? He is laughing in your faces.

He creates accounts to:

#1 plonk people.... ever wonder how the plonks keep going up but people respond to you just like before?

#2 to make friends and influence people.

This is a public service announcement to serve the public even when the public doesn't deserve to be served.

You're welcome.

#238 | Posted by J_Tremain at 2018-11-08 11:44 PM | Reply

Carry on please....

#239 | Posted by J_Tremain at 2018-11-08 11:45 PM | Reply

"I am of the belief some of this horrible tragedy could have been averted if they allowed easier access to concealed carry."

See, its just like I said:
"There is nothing other than more guns that the GOP will accept."

The sooner you right-wingers recognize this about yourselves, the better.

#240 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-08 11:46 PM | Reply

This why I don't like GLOCK pistols. Nothing wrong with the guns ... except that they are fugly guns... and that they are striker fired (blasphemy!).... but that most GLOCK are carried by losers.

It's so easy to use, it has become the BIC lighter of firearms. Hence why it is favored by mentally unstable people.

#241 | Posted by J_Tremain at 2018-11-08 11:54 PM | Reply

Real men use a TOKAREV!!!

#242 | Posted by J_Tremain at 2018-11-08 11:55 PM | Reply

I am of the belief some of this horrible tragedy could have been averted if they allowed easier access to concealed carry. The evil gunman could have been neutralized by an armed citizen before before he had a chance to kill all those people.

Your fantasy about some civilian playing hero is disrupted by the fact that he was able to kill an armed, trained police officer and continue his rampage.

#243 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-09 07:08 AM | Reply

#238 | POSTED BY J_TREMAIN

Dear God, the irony.....

#244 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2018-11-09 07:20 AM | Reply

Your fantasy about some civilian playing hero is disrupted by the fact that he was able to kill an armed, trained police officer and continue his rampage.

#243 | POSTED BY JOE AT 2018-11-09 07:08 AM | REPLY

Having a concealed carry gives you a chance, it's not a guarantee. People need to stop pretending like it's supposed to be a guarantee of victory.

#245 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2018-11-09 07:57 AM | Reply

I think many people are overlooking the fact that a good portion of the concealed carry folks may have been detained and ball-gagged in the past. Then brutally assaulted from behind for several hours by some hillbilly and his gimp wanting to take revenge against city folk. Just imagine some unbathed pawn shop rapist and his good buddy doing a number on you or one of your friends. Had you been armed, all this could've been avoided. So, next time you're on your way out of the grocery store at night, don't forget all the devious and devilish crazies out there who want your sweet, sweet ---- in their basement spread eagle in some disgusting machine devoted to such purpose.

#246 | Posted by madscientist at 2018-11-09 08:14 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

... in some disgusting machine devoted to such purpose.

Jeff Bezos sells those machines on Amazon and discounts the price to Democrats.

#247 | Posted by rcade at 2018-11-09 08:19 AM | Reply | Funny: 3

Then brutally assaulted from behind for several hours by some hillbilly and his gimp wanting to take revenge against city folk. Just imagine some unbathed pawn shop rapist and his good buddy doing a number on you or one of your friends. Had you been armed, all this could've been avoided.

LOL.... you like the movie I like.. and this one is from a classic!

www.youtube.com

#248 | Posted by J_Tremain at 2018-11-09 08:48 AM | Reply

Bring out the gimp!

www.youtube.com

LOL!

#249 | Posted by J_Tremain at 2018-11-09 08:56 AM | Reply

Ha! Good stuff.

#250 | Posted by cbob at 2018-11-09 09:20 AM | Reply

#250... I was referring to MadScientist's #246...

#251 | Posted by cbob at 2018-11-09 09:22 AM | Reply

"Having a concealed carry gives you a chance, it's not a guarantee."

Having a Second Amendment gives you a chance of getting gunned down by a Marine in a bar, it's not a guarantee.

#252 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-09 10:25 AM | Reply

i don't know any of them or anyone that knows any of them. i have my own troubles. SO WHAT. what's the point of this thread?. pick out a random mass slaughter of civilians in the united states..let's say the kid that shot up the black church, how many since then? this is tiresome.
.........................................#6 | POSTED BY ABLOCK AT 2018-11-08 07:55 AM

Gee...basically what has now been revealed as the shooter's attitude toward the "gun debate" and related deaths. and already the NRA has chastised doctors who they perceive to be "anti-gun".

#253 | Posted by 1947steamer at 2018-11-09 10:31 AM | Reply

Having a concealed carry gives you a chance, it's not a guarantee.

In this case an armed, trained police officer was unable to stop the assailant without himself being killed. What makes you think some random civilian with a gun would do any better? What makes you ignore the fact that, with the smoke bomb the shooter threw, a civilian with a gun might have made things a lot worse?

#254 | Posted by JOE at 2018-11-09 10:39 AM | Reply

"What makes you ignore the fact that, with the smoke bomb the shooter threw, a civilian with a gun might have made things a lot worse?"

Rambo movies.

#255 | Posted by Danforth at 2018-11-09 10:40 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"In this case an armed, trained police officer was unable to stop the assailant without himself being killed."

That's precisely what the Founders intended when they wrote the Second Amendment

If it wasn't, surely our two major political parties would work together to curb unwanted gun violence.

But it isn't unwanted gun violence.

At least one party thinks any solution to gun violence (other than giving more people more guns) is far, far greater a threat to freedom and liberty than the gun violence itself.

They'll never trade their guns for anyone else's safety.

Guns are an article of faith for them.

It's not really so different than being an anti-vaxxer. Or a global warming denier.

#256 | Posted by snoofy at 2018-11-09 10:47 AM | Reply

Hey - at least this wasn't another domestic terrorist using an AR-15.

Sometimes there is a silver lining around every chalk outline.

So, nobody else believes this particular terrorism has anything to do with a loathing for the blind patriotism of country "music"?

He immediately shot the guards, then the people tending the register, then went after people on the floor. He either hated this particular establishment or whatever it represents..

#257 | Posted by redlightrobot at 2018-11-09 03:27 PM | Reply

Having a concealed carry gives you a chance, it's not a guarantee. People need to stop pretending like it's supposed to be a guarantee of victory.

#245 | POSTED BY SITZKRIEG AT 2018-11-09 07:57 AM | REPLY |

If he didn't have the gun i can GUARANTEE he wouldn't have shot anyone.

Prevention is much better than a shootout at the ok corral

#258 | Posted by hatter5183 at 2018-11-09 07:43 PM | Reply

How many times have you posted idiotic arguments, were pantsed because of it, and then tried to blame the messenger?

#209 | POSTED BY Comrade MOVEON_2020

How many times are you going to dance around the question.
What 4th reicher were you before you decided to hide behind your current "personality".

I'm saying either Goatman or Rex as you have the same mental deficiencies and posting styles of both.

#259 | Posted by aborted_monson at 2018-11-10 12:56 AM | Reply

ABORTED

"I'm saying either Goatman or Rex "

Neither.

Goatman wouldn't stoop to that level and REX's mother took away his computer until he finds a job.

#260 | Posted by Twinpac at 2018-11-10 02:14 AM | Reply

Comments are closed for this entry.

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