Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Wednesday, November 29, 2017

Michelle Goldberg, New York Times: One uncanny aspect of the investigations into [Donald] Trump's Russia connections is that instead of too little evidence there's too much. It's impossible to keep it straight without the kind of chaotic wall charts that Carrie Mathison of Homeland assembled during her manic episodes. Incidents that would be major scandals in a normal administration -- like the mere fact of Trump's connection to [Felix] Sater -- become minor subplots in this one. That's why Collusion is so essential, and why I wish everyone who is skeptical that Russia has leverage over Trump would read it. This country -- at least the parts not wholly under the sway of right-wing propaganda -- needs to come to terms with substantial evidence that the president is in thrall to a foreign power.

Advertisement

Advertisement

More

Alternate links: Google News | Twitter

[Luke] Harding's book is invaluable in collating the overwhelming evidence of a web of relationships between the Kremlin, Trump and members of Trump's circle. He suggests, convincingly, that Russia may have been cultivating Trump since the 1980s. At that time, Harding writes, the K.G.B. was working to draw "prominent figures in the West" -- as the K.G.B. described them -- into collaboration. According to Harding, a form for evaluating targets asked, "Are pride, arrogance, egoism, ambition or vanity among subject's natural characteristics?"

Comments

Admin's note: Participants in this discussion must follow the site's moderation policy. Profanity will be filtered. Abusive conduct is not allowed.

This fits perfectly with what we know about soviet active measures and Trump.

#1 | Posted by Tor at 2017-11-29 02:27 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Oh, what a tangled web we weave,
when first we practice to deceive...

#2 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 02:47 PM | Reply

DUH.

Anyone who doesn't know this by now is living in a bubble of right wing disinformation.

Let's do a quick recap.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Trump picked a russian operative to run his campaign.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Trump removed opposition to russia's ukraine invasion from the republican platform - the only part of the platform he showed any interest in.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Several of trump's circle have been caught lying about or "forgetting" meetings with russia.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Trump picked putin's favorite general as national security advisor.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Trump picked Putin's favorite oil exec as secretary of state, who immediately began crippling the agency, which just happens to be the agency which does the most to contain putin's ambitions.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Congress passed sanctions against russia, but trump is refusing to enact them.

BECAUSE RUSSIA OWNS TRUMP, Trump beleives the KGB agent's denials about influencing the election, instead of his own intelligence agencies conclusions that russia did influence the election

I'm sure I'm forgetting a lot, this is just off the top of my head. But i would LOVE to hear an explanation of all these facts that doesnt involve RUSSIA OWNING TRUMP.

#3 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-29 02:52 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"One uncanny aspect of the investigations into [Donald] Trump's Russia connections is that instead of too little evidence there's too much. It's impossible to keep it straight"

Death by Nothing Burger.

#4 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-29 03:00 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Trump's income tax returns contain information so explosive that the IRS is housing them in a special vault. I suspect proof of his ties to Russia are in those returns. One of the Trump sons bragged about all the money they could borrow from Russian oligarchs.

#5 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-29 03:01 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

"As one of those American liberals, I don't think this is quite right. Trump, the gaudy huckster who treats closing a sale as the height of human endeavor, is a quintessentially American figure. His campaign of racial and religious grievance drew on the darkest currents of American history. At most, Putin appears to have recognized an opportunity that American political dysfunction created.

It's a sign of how deep that dysfunction goes that the substantial evidence that the president is not a patriot hasn't caused more of a political earthquake. America, stunned and divided, appears incapable of metabolizing all we're learning about the man in the White House.

Yes, we have investigations, but the business of government plods on; right now the Senate is working on the Roy Moore of tax bills, a piece of legislation that magnifies right-wing pathologies into a cartoonish grotesque.

It wasn't Putin who fashioned a Republican Party willing to tolerate something close to treason if it's the price of corporate tax cuts. Even if all the Republicans in Congress read Harding's book, they probably wouldn't act. But at least they'd know what they're abetting."

.
Putin saw an easy bet on what he could gain in the way of loosened sanctions and an incompetent American leadership in the world and at home, and then did his best to help make it happen... and it did by a statistical fluke in the Electoral College.

But as the author notes, it's, "a Republican Party willing to tolerate something close to treason if it's the price of corporate tax cuts." who should receive the majority of both blame and punishment for their complicity, and that may well happen in the election booth... if they can be stopped from putting their thumb on the scales of who votes and what news is believed to be factual rather than fake.

#6 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-29 03:08 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

Rightwingers DO NOT CARE. Trump has an (R) after his name and that is the ONLY thing that matters to them.

#7 | Posted by moder8 at 2017-11-29 03:12 PM | Reply

much ado about nothing. see you at the next election.

TRUMP 2020.

#8 | Posted by AuntieSocial at 2017-11-29 03:12 PM | Reply

#8

Anti-lucid.

#9 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-29 03:21 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

Republican donors do not threated to stop donating to Republicans for colluding with Russians but they do to get Republicans to ram through big tax cuts for the 1% and the corporations. Conclusion: big Republican donors are not patriots they now consider themselves oligarchs.

#10 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-29 03:28 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

Advertisement

Advertisement

There is one Huge hole in this entire story and theory, that for it to be true Russia had to be responsible for Trump getting elected. That is where you sore losers can't connect the dots. Sorry.

#11 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-29 03:36 PM | Reply

There is one Huge hole in this entire story and theory, that for it to be true Russia had to be responsible for Trump getting elected. That is where you sore losers can't connect the dots. Sorry.

#11 | POSTED BY FISHPAW

Stupid post as usual.

First, they helped. That's enough.

Second, they didn't have to help. Even if he got elected without their help, they have him so under their thumb that he is practically owned.

No hole except in your head.

#12 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-29 03:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Trump's income tax returns contain information so explosive that the IRS is housing them in a special vault. I suspect proof of his ties to Russia are in those returns. One of the Trump sons bragged about all the money they could borrow from Russian oligarchs.

#5 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2017-11-29 03:01 PM | FLAG:

LOL. Is the proof on schedule m under money laundering? Will cross check uncover or cover it?

#13 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-29 03:39 PM | Reply

"Rightwingers DO NOT CARE. Trump has an (R) after his name and that is the ONLY thing that matters to them."

To their way of thinking, the worst Repbublican is better than the best Democrat. For that matter, Russians are better than Democrats. Think of how many times Trump said that Putin was a better leader than Obama. For many Repubilicans, Russians aren't the enemy; Democrats are.

#14 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-29 03:44 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

#12 Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US? Have you seen our economic numbers lately, especially today? You should check them out and have someone explain them to you.

#15 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-29 03:44 PM | Reply

"LOL. Is the proof on schedule m under money laundering? Will cross check uncover or cover it?"

Follow the money....that's the best way to get to the bottom of something like this.

#16 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-29 03:45 PM | Reply

"Republican donors do not threated to stop donating to Republicans for colluding with Russians but they do to get Republicans to ram through big tax cuts for the 1% and the corporations. Conclusion: big Republican donors are not patriots they now consider themselves oligarchs."

The Mercers and Kochs would like our country to be like Russia: run by an oligarch for oligarchs. The people of the country only matter to the extend they can be ripped off and used to fight wars.

#17 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-29 03:46 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Rightwingers DO NOT CARE. Trump has an (R) after his name and that is the ONLY thing that matters to them."
To their way of thinking, the worst Repbublican is better than the best Democrat. For that matter, Russians are better than Democrats. Think of how many times Trump said that Putin was a better leader than Obama. For many Repubilicans, Russians aren't the enemy; Democrats are.
#14 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY AT 2017-11-29 03:44 PM | FLAG:

And I'm sure you think the flip side, the worst Democrat is better than the best Republican, blah, blah. blah.

#18 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-29 03:50 PM | Reply

Follow the money....that's the best way to get to the bottom of something like this.

#16 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2017-11-29 03:45 PM | FLAG:

They have been trying, for about 2 years now.

#19 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-29 03:51 PM | Reply

"Russia had to be responsible for Trump getting elected."

Imagine for a second that Trump did not get elected. (my happy place)

Would the things he and his cronies did to coordinate with Russia be acceptable to you?

Do you think the FBI would have dropped the investigations just because he lost?

Do you think we should be doing anything about Russia's proven attempts to hack our elections regardless of who won?

#20 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 03:52 PM | Reply

They have been trying, for about 2 years now.

#19 | Posted by fishpaw

And look what they are finding.

#21 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 03:54 PM | Reply

They have been trying, for about 2 years now.

#19 | Posted by fishpaw

You think they haven't made any progress?

In case you hadn't noticed, repubs have gone from saying its a ridiculous conspiracy theory to saying there's nothing illegal about it.

#22 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-29 03:56 PM | Reply

#12 Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US? Have you seen our economic numbers lately, especially today? You should check them out and have someone explain them to you.

#15 | Posted by fishpaw

Are you saying because trump hasn't found a way to destroy the economy yet, that proves he's not working for putin?

Trump supporters whine about being called stupid, but they just keep proving it.

He IS working to weaken the US. If you got your news from real sources, you'd know that already.

#23 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-29 03:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

FishP is one of those rwingers who loves to be Tinkled Down on... even when it never really happens.

#24 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-29 03:59 PM | Reply

#12 Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US?

#15 | Posted by fishpaw at

That's exactly what he appears to be doing. EXACTLY. Extract head from nethermost extremities, and after you're done explain why he won't enforce the sanctions against Russia Congress passed?

#25 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-29 04:00 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US?"

Yeah I do, I think he would try his best to become the most divisive President in history. Guess what? He's succeeding.

#26 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-29 04:01 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US?"

Trump hasn't implemented the sanctions that would really hurt Putin and his oligarch friends. Tillerson even got rid of the sanctions office in the State Dept. Dismantling the State Depart hurts the US.

#27 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-29 04:05 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Wait... this is considered news? This has been well known for over a year.

#28 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2017-11-29 04:06 PM | Reply

#12 Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US? Have you seen our economic numbers lately, especially today? You should check them out and have someone explain them to you.

#15 | POSTED BY FISHPAW

No. That would be idiotic and look too terrible.

Don't you think if Trump weren't owned by Russia, he wouldn't have so many Russian connections in his campaign and cabinet?

#29 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-29 04:09 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US?"

Not at all.

Trump would do whatever he can to help Russia -- but he's limited in his range of actions because he has to maintain plausible deniability that he is not a Russian asset.

It's high time to investigate which other GOP party members are Russian assets.

#30 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-29 04:12 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"Don't you think that if Trump was owned by Russia that he would do anything he could to strengthen Russia and weaken the US?"
Not at all.
Trump would do whatever he can to help Russia -- but he's limited in his range of actions because he has to maintain plausible deniability that he is not a Russian asset.
It's high time to investigate which other GOP party members are Russian assets.

#30 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

That's what I said. It would look terrible.

#31 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-29 04:24 PM | Reply

It's high time to investigate which other GOP party members are Russian assets.

#30 | Posted by snoofy

Like a House Un-American Activities Committee?

No thank you.

The FBI is supposed to already be aware of who is contacting anyone in Russia and anyone with a clearance is supposed to be explaining that to the FBI.

People need to be prosecuted when they lie or mislead on their security forms.

#32 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 04:27 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

I would love for the investigation to uncover something actionable but it apparently has not happened yet.

I really don't care about the rest of this -------. Get him out of office or shut up about it already. Enough teasing.

#33 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-29 04:34 PM | Reply

The FBI is supposed to already be aware of who is contacting anyone in Russia and anyone with a clearance is supposed to be explaining that to the FBI.

#32 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

No, they aren't. They don't monitor these things unless tipped off to something suspicious.

#34 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-29 04:40 PM | Reply

"Republican donors are not patriots they now consider themselves oligarchs."
#17 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday

And you know what? They're right.

#35 | Posted by SomebodyElse at 2017-11-29 04:46 PM | Reply

"The FBI is supposed to already be aware of who is contacting anyone in Russia and anyone with a clearance is supposed to be explaining that to the FBI."

Sounds like the FBI needs to be investigated too then. For not doing what they're supposed to be doing.

#36 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-29 04:48 PM | Reply

"This country -- at least the parts not wholly under the sway of right-wing propaganda -- needs to come to terms with substantial evidence that the president is in thrall to a foreign power."

Actually it's Republicans who need to come to grips with this. The rest of us, including a decent swath of the "Never Trump" right-wingers (but by no means all, Sully and JeffJ) have figured it out.

#37 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-29 04:59 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Get him out of office or shut up about it already. Enough teasing.

#33 | Posted by Sully

Yeah just end the investigation before it's over because baby has a short attention span.

#38 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-29 05:07 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

No, they aren't. They don't monitor these things unless tipped off to something suspicious.

#34 | Posted by Sycophant

I beg to differ. I used to work in signals intelligence. Below is only a glimpse into what is being monitored. (And I should have mentioned the NSA which does most of the recording and monitoring of all calls and traffic to Russia.)

Through routine data collection programs authorized under Section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, the government gathers information from the internet backbone, which carries web browsing histories and a rapidly increasing amount of telephone traffic.

The government discards information that is plainly domestic and searches through the rest using only specific selectors -- a phone number or email address, for instance. But Americans' information that is incidentally collected and determined to contain some foreign intelligence value is fair game for review.

Cohn said such data on Americans could include communications that are to, from or about foreign targets the FISA court has already approved for surveillance. For example, if two Trump campaign officials were talking via email about a Moscow official under surveillance, that conversation might get flagged as relevant.

www.politico.com

#39 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 05:14 PM | Reply

RE #39

It appears that when Trump found out about the foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act that is when he went ballistic and accused Obama with "wire tapping" him because I imagine he suddenly realized how vulnerable he and his campaign associates were.

#40 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 05:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

No, they aren't. They don't monitor these things unless tipped off to something suspicious.
#34 | Posted by Sycophant

I beg to differ. I used to work in signals intelligence. Below is only a glimpse into what is being monitored. (And I should have mentioned the NSA which does most of the recording and monitoring of all calls and traffic to Russia.)
Through routine data collection programs authorized under Section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, the government gathers information from the internet backbone, which carries web browsing histories and a rapidly increasing amount of telephone traffic.

The government discards information that is plainly domestic and searches through the rest using only specific selectors -- a phone number or email address, for instance. But Americans' information that is incidentally collected and determined to contain some foreign intelligence value is fair game for review.

Cohn said such data on Americans could include communications that are to, from or about foreign targets the FISA court has already approved for surveillance. For example, if two Trump campaign officials were talking via email about a Moscow official under surveillance, that conversation might get flagged as relevant.
www.politico.com

#39 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

Isn't that what I just said?

#41 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-29 05:34 PM | Reply

Russia owns Trump?

This site gets dumber by the day.

#42 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-29 05:48 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

This site gets dumber by the day.

Posted by Ray at 2017-11-29 05:48 PM | Reply

Yeah they let you in after all.

#43 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2017-11-29 05:51 PM | Reply | Funny: 3

Israel owns Trump. Not Russia.

#44 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-29 05:51 PM | Reply

Isn't that what I just said?

#41 | Posted by Sycophant

Not exactly.

You said "They don't monitor these things unless tipped off to something suspicious."

They monitor all of it. They have programs that search through everything for key words and phrases or names, etc. The software automatically pulls all that forward for review.

No one "tips them off"... unless you were referring to the software a "tipping them off'. But, the software is always "tipping them off" if you think about it.

#45 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-29 05:57 PM | Reply

Russia owns Trump?

This site gets dumber by the day.

#42 | Posted by Ray

Great retort Simple Ray! With an argument like that, we're all totally convinced that trump isn't working for putin at all.

#46 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-29 06:11 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

With an argument like that, we're all totally convinced that trump isn't working for putin at all.
#46 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

The burden of proof is not on me. After a year of -------- rumors and innuendo, you libs still have nothing on Trump except your own fantasies.

#47 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-29 08:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#47

Well except admissions of collusion by members of his campaign team and family. A cabinet full of people with Russian connections. Campaign staff that has been criminally charged and some convicted. Proof that Russia meddled in the election. Proof that Russia hacked the DNC. And a president who fired the head of the FBI for investigating it.

Besides that, we have nothing. But Mueller might have some things.

#48 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-29 09:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#48 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

None of that would stand in a courtroom.

But Mueller might have some things

You can only wish.

#49 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-29 10:02 PM | Reply

RAY

Truth is we don't know what Mueller has. What we do know is that Trump, through arrogance, ineptitude or ignorance, has left a trail of suspicious activity that a blind man could follow ~ not the least of which is obstruction of justice insofar as the Russian investigation is concerned. Again, through arrogance, ineptitude or ignorance, Trump's own words belie any claims of his innocence.

There's also the fact (yes, FACT) that trusted members of Trump's closest advisers are under enormous pressure to cooperate with Mueller's investigation to lessen any charges against themselves for their involvement. That implies that there's more than smoke here. It implies that there's going to be a bonfire of evidence at Mueller's disposal for future prosecutions on both state and federal levels.

It would take a great stretch of imagination to believe that Trump's inner circle was operating entirely on their own without any guidance or instruction from Trump himself. Mueller's investigation is more likely than not leading straight to Trump's doorstep.

Of course, as always, the proof won't be known until the investigation has run it's course. However, there's no doubt that Mueller's crack team of prosecutors will turn over every stone to dislodge all there is to be known and the chances are very good that Trump himself will suffer the consequences for whatever went down.

And yes, that is what we wish.

#50 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 01:17 AM | Reply

RAY

You might also want to take note of Trump's daily stream of chaff via Twitter that's getting more deranged as he attempts to avoid the political missiles that are headed his way. He's desperate to keep his equally deranged base intact by stirring the pot full of their hatred and fear.

Considering the fragile nature of his own narcissism no one would be surprised if Trump dissolved into a complete meltdown.

#51 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 01:52 AM | Reply

I don't know what the point of #38 was.

Flaunting a lack of reading comprehension?

I said nothing about ending the investigation.

I'm was referring to the practice of feeding us a constant stream of non actionable tidbits that only suggest that something more nefarious happened. It's pointless. Let us know when you have something you can move on. This other crap just becomes white noise after a while. It is a waste of time.

#52 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 10:06 AM | Reply

"Let us know when you have something you can move on."

Trump admitted obstruction of justice, and Junior's emails proved attempted collusion.

The President tried to get the head of the FBI to call off an investigation of Flynn, for obvious self-serving reasons.

And EVERYONE on Team Trump has lied about Russian, every time, repeatedly, until the truth was too obvious to ignore.

What, exactly, are you waiting for?

#53 | Posted by Danforth at 2017-11-30 10:12 AM | Reply

#53 if what you are saying is all proven then what you should be asking why charges have not been filed.

That is what I'm waiting for. There have been too many boy who cried wolf moments with Trump and Russia over the last year. When they have something they say they can move on, I'll be interested. Until then I'm not willing to get all worked up about this stuff. There have been a lot of grandiose claims that so far have resulted in zilch.

#54 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 11:01 AM | Reply

"you should be asking why charges have not been filed."

Too rich.

You should be asking why Team Trump is expecting you to eat lies for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

"There have been a lot of grandiose claims that so far have resulted in zilch."

So you don't believe Trump admitting obstruction of justice is obstruction of justice? And you don't believe Junior's emails proving he was attempting to collude proves he was attempting to collude?

Is English your native language?

#55 | Posted by Danforth at 2017-11-30 11:18 AM | Reply

Danforth - I know you want to get all lathered up as if I'm defending Trump but I'm not. They could frame him and I would say good job. So if he is guilty of something by all means prosecute him.

What I believe is that if these claims, including yours, were not being exaggerated, something would be done.

Why would you get upset at me when according to you, they have him dead to rights and nothing has come of it yet? I'm saying if they can prove guilt then prosecute. Do you disagree with that?

#56 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 12:01 PM | Reply

#56 Of course he and the other Trump hating freaks won't be satisfied even if they continue to not find proof. The Hillary loss is just too much for these snowflakes to get over. Its actually becoming amusing to see the desperation.

#57 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-30 12:49 PM | Reply

The burden of proof is not on me. After a year of -------- rumors and innuendo, you libs still have nothing on Trump except your own fantasies.

#47 | Posted by Ray

In post #3 I listed the proof. You've yet to explain away or refute any of it.

#58 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 01:19 PM | Reply

What I believe is that if these claims, including yours, were not being exaggerated, something would be done.

#56 | Posted by Sully

Why do you believe that? Repubs have said a child molester is better than a democrat. What makes you think they would stand up to a russian puppet if that puppet was providing tax cuts for the rich?

#59 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 01:20 PM | Reply

#56 Of course he and the other Trump hating freaks won't be satisfied even if they continue to not find proof. The Hillary loss is just too much for these snowflakes to get over. Its actually becoming amusing to see the desperation.

#57 | Posted by fishpaw

There's already proof stupid. Don Junior's emails show he was trying to collude with the russians. Change the channel.

#60 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 01:21 PM | Reply

Why are all these DR righties; that still peddled Benghazi lies in 2016, suddenly demanding that evidence is required?

I have no doubt the evidence is there and will be released (especially if the investigations are even 1/4 what they were for Benghazi), but I just cannot understand why they choose to be so obviously hypocritical.

#61 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2017-11-30 02:50 PM | Reply

SULLY

You don't seem to know how a prosecutors office works in cases like this. Be patient. Once all the little fish have spilled their guts in exchange for a plea deals, the big fish will be last on the hook. That's the purpose of the whole investigation.

This is a paper trail investigation ... not a public opinion drama.

#62 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 03:07 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#59 - I'm asking why the people who are investigating himvand leaking all this info haven't acted if they really have him caught.

I don't know what you are babbling about.

#63 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 03:16 PM | Reply

#62 - I can be patient. I said I don't want to hear about until/unless they are ready to do something about it.

Do you think all this leaking of info is a normal part of the process?

#64 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 03:19 PM | Reply

#59 - I'm asking why the people who are investigating himvand leaking all this info haven't acted if they really have him caught.

#63 | Posted by Sully

Christ do you not know how the legal system works?

All your posts indicate that because prosecutors haven't told YOU everything that they know, there must not be anything to know.

Could you be more self important and childish?

#65 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 03:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Do you think all this leaking of info is a normal part of the process?

#64 | Posted by Sully

Is there a "normal process" for investigating whether or not the president is working for our enemies?

This is unprecedented.

#66 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 03:33 PM | Reply

SULLY

There are no unintended leaks coming out of the prosecutors office. However, the people who have already talked to Mueller are under no such obligation. They're the ones who are talking. I wouldn't put too much value on self-serving leaks. No one person knows full scope of the investigation.

Of course the media is grasping at every straw that blows their way. Most of it is second guessing and speculation by former prosecutors who know the general order of how things work.

Mueller and his team are the only ones who really know where this thing is going and they're not talking. We won't know until it goes to trial. It's better for them if they don't telegraph their case ahead of time.

I hope the trials are televised. As Nixon once said, the people have a right to know if their president is a crook.

There may not even be a trial if Trump resigns or is impeached. It's also possible that his cohorts will take a pre-determined plea and escape the embarrassment of a public lynching.

Pardons are also in the offing. Trump might take that route for his family members. Regardless, if Trump goes down he'll take them all with him and we'll be rid of this scourge on democracy.

#67 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 03:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I have some sympathy for Paul Ryan. He has a tiger by the tail and can't let go for fear it turns around and bites him.

#68 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 04:03 PM | Reply

"I have some sympathy for Paul Ryan. He has a tiger by the tail and can't let go for fear it turns around and bites him."

Not me. I have no sympathy for him. He is about to enact his high school dream of taking a huge step toward ending programs like SS, Medicare and Medicaid. The very programs, if I'm not mistaken, that helped him and his family during those same high school years. I hope the tiger that is Trump eats him for lunch, licks his lips and burps afterwards. Ryan deserves no better fate.

#69 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-30 04:07 PM | Reply

GAL

I wasn't talking about that kind of sympathy. Ryan made his choices and I hope he pays the price. As far as I'm concerned he's a cowardly scumbag.

#70 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 04:12 PM | Reply

Not me. I have no sympathy for him. He is about to enact his high school dream of taking a huge step toward ending programs like SS, Medicare and Medicaid. The very programs, if I'm not mistaken, that helped him and his family during those same high school years. I hope the tiger that is Trump eats him for lunch, licks his lips and burps afterwards. Ryan deserves no better fate.

Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-30 04:07 PM | Reply

Yeppers and people like JeffJ that praised his plan are too dimwitted to see it. Sad really

#71 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2017-11-30 04:12 PM | Reply

#65 - again nothing to say that addresses my point.

"Sure I know more than you but can't even demonstrate that I understand what you are saying.... "

Just give it up Speaks. You obviously are unable to comprehend an opinion that hasn't been assigned to you.

You don't and can't understand my point because you Areca drone who aspires to be nothing more. Go nip at another ankle, Twit.

#72 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 04:13 PM | Reply

#67 - if it's not just leaks but also rampant speculation then that is another reason to ignore all the noise until some action is taken.

I hope you are right in what you said. But there still exists the very real possibility that little comes of this.

Despite what certain cretins who think they are legal experts because they watch Law and Order seem to believe, all this noise from the media doesn't amount to squat.

#73 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-30 04:21 PM | Reply

SULLY

Even if the intended targets escape a formal trial, something will come of it. The most important "something" of all will be that America has regurgitated these scumbags and can begin the process of righting the ship of state.

That IS the ultimate goal, isn't it?

Yeah, I know. We all want to watch the fur fly at the Trial of the Century. But this isn't about retribution or vengeance. It's about saving a country from a horrible fate if left in the hands of a madman.

#74 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-11-30 04:58 PM | Reply

#65 - again nothing to say that addresses my point.

"Sure I know more than you but can't even demonstrate that I understand what you are saying.... "

Just give it up Speaks. You obviously are unable to comprehend an opinion that hasn't been assigned to you.

You don't and can't understand my point because you Areca drone who aspires to be nothing more. Go nip at another ankle, Twit.

#72 | Posted by Sully

You HAVE no point, other than you somehow think the public is entitled to all the information about an ongoing investigation, for some inexplicable reason.

#75 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 05:40 PM | Reply

But there still exists the very real possibility that little comes of this.

#73 | Posted by Sully

You're right about that. But that's only because the republican party has no ethics, morals, or patriotism.

They've already started saying "colluding with putin isn't illegal" just in case that's what is revealed.

#76 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 05:42 PM | Reply

Truth is we don't know what Mueller has.
#50 | POSTED BY TWINPAC

No we don't. In politics, what matters is if Trump is on board with the agenda. In my estimation he is. So he won't be touched. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong.

Considering the fragile nature of his own narcissism no one would be surprised if Trump dissolved into a complete meltdown.
#51 | POSTED BY TWINPAC

If he can't take the heat, that's his problem. Pence has the potential to be more of a hardliner.

#77 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-30 07:43 PM | Reply

In post #3 I listed the proof. You've yet to explain away or refute any of it.
#58 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

If Mueller has real proof, he'll use it. That's the test. I say he has no real proof, which means no physical evidence. Let's see what happens.

#78 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-30 07:50 PM | Reply

If Mueller has real proof, he'll use it. That's the test. I say he has no real proof, which means no physical evidence. Let's see what happens.

#78 | Posted by Ray

That excuse expired in February when Trump Jr's emails were released and trump said on tv he fired comey in an attempt to obstruct justice.

#79 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 08:22 PM | Reply

Whatever.

#80 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-30 08:28 PM | Reply

Whatever.

#80 | Posted by Ray

Simple Ray strikes again with another winning retort, showing how informed he is on the issues and how well thought out his positions are.

#81 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 08:53 PM | Reply

#81 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

I stated my position. What you call proof in your world, is -------- in my world.
There is nothing more to argue about.

#82 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-30 09:00 PM | Reply

I stated my position. What you call proof in your world, is -------- in my world.
There is nothing more to argue about.

#82 | Posted by Ray

Yeah. What you call -------- is evidence straight out of the perp's mouth.

Cause you aint too bright.

#83 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-30 09:19 PM | Reply

Your intelligence shines like the sun.

#84 | Posted by Ray at 2017-11-30 09:44 PM | Reply

RAY

It's hard to refute evidence (on tape). Mueller seems to be particularly interested in the firing of Comey and if that amounts to Obstruction of Justice ~ a charge that brought down Richard Nixon.

Then, of course, there's Kushner and Junior's sojourns into the world of Russian espionage. All of which is perfectly documented. And then there's Michael Flynn & Son squealing like a stuck pig. Plus there's not a doubt in my mind that Trump's tax returns are being scrutinized for illicite activity.

Even with the little we know doesn't look good for Donald Trump. How Mueller sums it up to prosecutable charges is yet to be known plus ... will it be enough to force a resignation? Or impeachment if the Dems take control of the House?

As you said, "we'll see."


#85 | Posted by Twinpac at 2017-12-01 01:40 AM | Reply

If Mueller has real proof, he'll use it. That's the test. I say he has no real proof, which means no physical evidence. Let's see what happens.
#78 | Posted by Ray

He has proof and he is using it.

Merry Christmas Ray. I was good so I got my gift. Too bad you were so naughty this year!

www.drudge.com

#86 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-12-01 10:57 AM | Reply

Your intelligence shines like the sun.

#84 | Posted by Ray

A lit match shines like the sun compared to you.

#87 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-12-01 11:57 AM | Reply

He has proof and he is using it.

Lying to the FBI. Even Martha Stewart couldn't escape that one.
It's not evidence of collusion with the Russians.

#88 | Posted by Ray at 2017-12-01 01:16 PM | Reply

A lit match shines like the sun compared to you.
#87 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

Whatever gives you a woody.

#89 | Posted by Ray at 2017-12-01 01:17 PM | Reply

- It's not evidence of collusion with the Russians.

Duh....

www.theatlantic.com

#90 | Posted by Corky at 2017-12-01 01:20 PM | Reply

Whatever gives you a woody.

#89 | Posted by Ray

Come on Simple Ray you can do better than that. This is a political debate site. If your simple brain can't compose and defend a viewpoint, what are you doing here?

#91 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-12-01 01:42 PM | Reply

#91 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

You are always right.

#90 | POSTED BY CORKY

The charge of lying implies they have no hard evidence.

#92 | Posted by Ray at 2017-12-01 03:13 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

The charge of lying implies they have no hard evidence.

#92 | Posted by Ray

No hard evidence of what?

We have hard evidence of trump jr attempting to collude with russians.

We have hard evidence of trump attempting to obstruct justice.

We have hard evidence of flynn lying.

What do you think we are lacking hard evidence of?

#93 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-12-01 03:15 PM | Reply

"The charge of lying implies they have no hard evidence."

Well we clearly know they have hard evidence of several other things, including lying on his signed documents.

Wouldn't the fact Flynn wasn't charged with crimes we know he committed tell you something?

And since when do prosecutors shoot down when they reduce charges???

#94 | Posted by Danforth at 2017-12-01 03:27 PM | Reply

The charge of lying implies they have no hard evidence.

#92 | POSTED BY RAY

The charge implies they are offering the chance for him to plead to lesser charges in exchange for cooperation. Welcome to how law works.

#95 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-12-01 03:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Welcome to how law works.

#95 | Posted by Sycophant

Welcome to trying to explain basic concepts to a moron who doesn't allow any real information into his head.

#96 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-12-01 03:44 PM | Reply

"Welcome to trying to explain basic concepts to a moron who doesn't allow any real information into his head."

You have to forgive Ray. He's a cancer survivor.

Not in the real sense, mind you. But if you re-define cancer to include pre-cancerous cells we all have in our bodies...

...he's a cancer survivor.

#97 | Posted by Danforth at 2017-12-01 03:51 PM | Reply

JeffJ defined me as a father because my girlfriend got an abortion.

Ray is who you'll grow up to be if you don't wise up, JeffJ.

#98 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-12-01 03:55 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

- to include pre-cancerous cells we all have in our bodies...

Odd topic.... several recent studies have shown that people who have or are susceptible to lung cancer might want to be careful about supplements that diminish free radicals that kill healthy cells... because free radicals also kill pre-cancerous cells.

I returned a bottled of concentrated dark cherry after reading those.

#99 | Posted by Corky at 2017-12-01 04:26 PM | Reply

off topic, lol

#100 | Posted by Corky at 2017-12-01 04:34 PM | Reply

Comments are closed for this entry.

Home | Breaking News | Comments | User Blogs | Stats | Back Page | RSS Feed | RSS Spec | DMCA Compliance | Privacy | Copyright 2018 World Readable

Drudge Retort