Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Thursday, November 16, 2017

A woman accused Minnesota Democratic Sen. Al Franken on Thursday of groping her and kissing her without her consent in 2006 while she was on a USO Tour overseas. Leeann Tweeden is now a morning news anchor on TalkRadio 790 KABC in Los Angeles and posted her story in a lengthy post on the station's website. The alleged incidents happened before Franken was elected to the Senate in 2008 and was seated in 2009 following a recount. Tweeden described the harassment as being part of a script for a USO skit where Franken wrote where he's supposed to kiss her. She writes that Franken repeatedly insisted they rehearse the kissing scene despite her protests. When she relented, Franken, "put his hand on the back of my head, mashed his lips against mine and aggressively stuck his tongue in my mouth."

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Al Franken must resign!

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Dotard first.

#1 | Posted by 726 at 2017-11-16 10:50 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

This series of revelations regarding the sexual assaults and harassments by the rich, famous and powerful is getting juicier than a spatchcocked turkey. I tend to believe that that last accusations will be reserved for the most powerful or for the most heinous activities because the accusers fear the backlash. Someone melt some butter - I'll get the popcorn.

#2 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2017-11-16 11:05 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Franken needs to address this publicly and quickly.

#3 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 11:23 AM | Reply

I feel today much like I felt when the truth came out about Bill Clinton. We've been betrayed by a selfish man who was a powerful voice for progressive values and now it i revealed, apparently, that he has disgraced himself.

#4 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-16 11:25 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#3 He already apologized for the photo saying he was trying to be funny and that he is sorry for it.

#5 | Posted by 726 at 2017-11-16 11:29 AM | Reply

if more people bring forward accusations, this could be very bad for Franken. The people don't usually care about apologies once things look like a pattern.

#6 | Posted by klifferd at 2017-11-16 11:36 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 3

#4 Danni, you touch on something that has gone unspoken but which we all know to be true: at some level, we all expected to hear something like this from guys like Weinstein and so while we were appalled by the scope, none of us were really 'surprised'. We are also not surprised when we hear about evangelicals being perverts, Catholic priests being gay pedophiles, football players assaulting their girlfriends, or Muslim men raping child brides. It's when we hear about someone we believe to be "better than that" or who has been a champion of 'the good fight' that we are completely appalled. It's because at some deep level, we feel as if we personally - our trust - has been violated, not just the victim.

#7 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2017-11-16 11:38 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

OK McConnell, are you going to refuse to seat him?

#8 | Posted by HanoverFist at 2017-11-16 11:47 AM | Reply

Is Franken going to step down? Lets not worry about what he has to say. We haven't worried about what any of the other accused has had to say, why start now?

#9 | Posted by boaz at 2017-11-16 11:51 AM | Reply

We haven't worried about what any of the other accused has had to say, why start now?

#9 | Posted by boaz at

You've taken on the role of worrying for the rest of us.

As the man said above: Dotard first. He's the worst of the lot.

#10 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 11:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

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Franken needs to address this publicly and quickly.

#3 | Posted by SheepleSchism at

He can threaten to sue, then doesn't. He can hire some woman from Arkansas to say any accusers are liars, and take my boss's word for it.

How's that for a start?

#11 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 11:59 AM | Reply

This isn't going to work for Trumpism, this line of attack. The existence of bad behavior elsewhere doesn't give Donald and his alleged "movement" any excuses.

Impeach the bastard, and let him move in with Hope Hicks. It's what he wants to do anyway.

#12 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 12:02 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

What line of attack?

A woman claims to have been groped , the left, by huge abundance of victims coming forward are throwing stones in glass houses...

#13 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 12:06 PM | Reply

"Franken needs to address this publicly and quickly." - #3 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 11:23 AM

He already has:

Franken told Raw Story in a statement: "I certainly don't remember the rehearsal for the skit in the same way, but I send my sincerest apologies to Leeann. As to the photo, it was clearly intended to be funny but wasn't. I shouldn't have done it."
That source was posted over an hour before your question.

#14 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 12:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"A woman claims to have been groped..." - #13 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 12:06 PM

I wonder why there are shadows between Franken's hands and the flack jacket worn by Leeann Tweeden.

#15 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 12:23 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Was she old enough to vote?

I think in order for this to be a "what a bout so and so" you are going to need to match a 14 year old with a 14 year old

#16 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2017-11-16 12:28 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

"Franken needs to address this publicly and quickly." - #3 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 11:23 AM
He already has:
Franken told Raw Story in a statement: "I certainly don't remember the rehearsal for the skit in the same way, but I send my sincerest apologies to Leeann. As to the photo, it was clearly intended to be funny but wasn't. I shouldn't have done it."
That source was posted over an hour before your question.

#14 | Posted by Hans

wow, that response is a strange way to raise campaign funds? And where in the bible does it say you apologize for misbehavior?

#17 | Posted by truthhurts at 2017-11-16 12:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Al Franken talking about his accuser-- a "beautiful woman"-- on the Senate floor in 2010.
twitter.com

#18 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 12:30 PM | Reply

What line of attack?...the left, by huge abundance of victims coming forward are throwing stones in glass houses...

#13 | Posted by AndreaMackris

#19 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 12:31 PM | Reply

More Al Franken ....
twitter.com

#20 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 12:33 PM | Reply

"The Democratic senator swiftly issued an apology to Tweeden, although he claimed to remember the rehearsal differently.

"I certainly don't remember the rehearsal for the skit in the same way, but I send my sincerest apologies to Leeann," Franken said in a statement provided to the Guardian.

"As to the photo, it was clearly intended to be funny but wasn't. I shouldn't have done it."

www.theguardian.com

If it turns out Al has a history of this sort of stuff, I'd be disappointed. A single rehearsal with the cast involved and a stupid pic prank on the Playboy model, not so much.

#21 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 12:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Of course, I know this sort of thing happens to Mackris all the time.

#22 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 12:36 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

What ever happens to Franklen happens.

But that photo was clearly meant to be humorous.

Also, isn't he gay? I doubt he was viewing it as a sexual act.

The picture isn't funny.

It actually reminds me of pics you see from fraternities where guys are taking pictures with passed out frat mates.

#24 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-16 12:52 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

How's that for a start?
#11 | POSTED BY ZED

Grope-coddlers unite!

#25 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 12:53 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Well then. That settles it. Discussion over." - #23 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 12:52 PM

You were the one who stated that Franken "needs to address this publicly and quickly" in your #3.

In my #14 I pointed out he already had.

Don't blame me for your lack of competence, known and admitted liar.

#26 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 12:56 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

was this in a locker room?

you know, locker room hijinks and all that?

#27 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2017-11-16 01:00 PM | Reply

"'Rape culture' doesn't exist!"

"'Rape culture' does exist, but only Democrats are involved in it!"

-- the same people

#28 | Posted by MrSilenceDogood at 2017-11-16 01:03 PM | Reply

Also, isn't he gay? I doubt he was viewing it as a sexual act.

#24 | POSTED BY CLOWNSHACK AT 2017-11-16 12:52 PM | FLAG:

No. He used to crack anti-gay jokes when it was cool to do so.

#29 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2017-11-16 01:07 PM | Reply

"Also, isn't he gay?" - #24 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-16 12:52 PM

Franken has been married to Franni Bryson for 42 years, and they have 2 children together.

#30 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 01:12 PM | Reply

We haven't worried about what any of the other accused has had to say, why start now?
#9 | POSTED BY BOAZ

We know you didn't about what that one accused guy had to say; "You know I'm automatically attracted to beautiful -- I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star... you can do anything."

#31 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2017-11-16 01:19 PM | Reply

if more people bring forward accusations, this could be very bad for Franken. The people don't usually care about apologies once things look like a pattern.

#6 | POSTED BY KLIFFERD AT 2017-11-16 11:36 AM

A second female accuser is coming forward with accusation that Al Franken ‘stalked and harassed' her

Like I said in yesterday's thread about congress and in the Jesse Jackson thread, it is going to get downright ugly on Capitol Hill.

And yes, Trump should resign over his statements and the allegations against him, just like Bubba should have.

#36 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 02:08 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Wait, if he did it while she was sleeping, how would she know? I mean I saw the picture. And if they were friends, maybe in poor taste but not exactly huge.

The kiss on the other hand is not right at all. Are there corroborating witnesses?

#37 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 02:10 PM | Reply

#36

The so-called 2nd accuser is an employee of....

"The Media Equality Project is dedicated to fighting back against an unprecedented, well-funded campaign by the left to silence conservative opposition voices."

www.gofundme.com

I'm getting an unsupported protocol error at their url.

But consideration of her prejudice should be taken into account when the promised detail arrives... if it does.

#39 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 02:19 PM | Reply

Wait, if he did it while she was sleeping, how would she know? I mean I saw the picture. And if they were friends, maybe in poor taste but not exactly huge.
The kiss on the other hand is not right at all. Are there corroborating witnesses?

#37 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

I should add I don't see him grabbing her in the picture but only pretending to grab her over what appears to be a flak jacket.

#40 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 02:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 6

A woman claims to have been groped , the left, by huge abundance of victims coming forward are throwing stones in glass houses...

#13 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

Really? Is that what is happening? Or is that what you want to pretend is happening?

I'm guessing the later. Because the Left tends to sort of eat its own on these matters rather than promote them.

Now Franken's actions appear a bit more isolated, uncorroborated and far less serious than most.

But hey, you keep throwing those stones and begging for that tax cut.

#41 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 02:23 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

The so-called 2nd accuser is an employee of....

But consideration of her prejudice should be taken into account when the promised detail arrives... if it does.

#39 | POSTED BY CORKY AT 2017-11-16 02:19 PM

Here is the "promised detail":

"Melanie Morgan, who was a ABC Radio talk show host for KSFO in San Francisco at the time, appeared August 19, 2000 on ABC's late night show Politically Incorrect.

She was joined by Franken, William Baldwin, and then-Colorado Lt. Governor Joe Rogers on the panel.
Morgan and Franken had a dispute over the OMB's budget numbers.

"I was invited and unaware of who his guests were going to be that night. I've since learned that though few know this, Al Franken was actually a writer for the show," Morgan said.

"I made a statement about the budget numbers, Franken challenged me, I challenged him back. It was about spending priorities, actually just a mundane discussion. But he obsessed over it."

After the show, Morgan said Franken wouldn't leave her alone, insisting on continuing the argument.

"He approached me backstage, angrily called me out on those numbers and insisted he would prove he was right. He wouldn't leave me alone, he kept following me. As a woman, his presence and proximity to me felt very threatening and intimindating.

"I didn't realize his creepy behavior after the show meant it would continue in the days to come.

"He approached Carol, the show's producer and demanded my home phone number, which was a clear violation of network protocol. I had thought that was the end of the story and was shocked when he started calling my home, badgering me repeatedly.

"I became fearful and called Carol to complain and asked her to tell him to back off. But he made another call after that. I thought that he might end up stalking me at my home in Northern California, it was that bad.

"By the third phone call I was outraged and terrified, as he is really disturbed," Morgan recounted.

Morgan said Franken finally left her alone, but only after she pushed back and threatened to call the police.

To this day, she says she is haunted by it: "I never forgot that experience and it informed me of his lack of character and obsessive personality. I believe every word Leann wrote."

"I will happily testify before the Senate Ethics Committee, should a hearing be held regarding Franken's behavior," Morgan added.

Still gonna coddle Al, or do you need to wait until Ms. Morgan testifies under oath?

#42 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 02:27 PM | Reply

#42 |

ROFL!

A few phone calls about a public dispute on budget numbers?

Quick, someone tell Roy Moore he's an OK guy!

#43 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 02:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Still gonna coddle Al, or do you need to wait until Ms. Morgan testifies under oath?
#42 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER

You were right to put quotation marks around "promised detail". I am severely underwhelmed.

#44 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 02:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

- severely underwhelmed.

Yeah, the debate is about sexual harassment, and budget numbers just aren't all that sexy.

Seeing the "detail" only adds to the suspicion of prejudice... and trying to get her rwing website employer in the headlines.

#45 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 02:45 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2


Al Franken Agrees to Ethics Investigation Into Himself After Groping Allegation
www.thedailybeast.com

...[Sen] Franken added: "I am asking that an ethics investigation be undertaken, and I will gladly cooperate."...

#46 | Posted by LampLighter at 2017-11-16 02:53 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

The existence of bad behavior elsewhere doesn't give Donald and his alleged "movement" any excuses.

No, but maybe it will keep you honest and give the same vileness to Democrats as you do the Republicans who are accused.

But I see it hasn't, Hans is straining to see "shadows" under fingertips..

#47 | Posted by boaz at 2017-11-16 02:53 PM | Reply

"Hans is straining to see "shadows" under fingertips.." - #47 | Posted by pfc. boaz at 2017-11-16 02:53 PM

While you're straining to ignore them, pfc. boaz.

#48 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 02:55 PM | Reply

Here is Franken's full statement about this affair. Feel free to compare and contrast this to every single other person accused of unwarranted sexual acts and then see whether those seeking to establish hypocrisy can find any in Franken's words.

"The first thing I want to do is apologize: to Leeann, to everyone else who was part of that tour, to everyone who has worked for me, to everyone I represent, and to everyone who counts on me to be an ally and supporter and champion of women. There's more I want to say, but the first and most important thing – and if it's the only thing you care to hear, that's fine – is: I'm sorry.

"I respect women. I don't respect men who don't. And the fact that my own actions have given people a good reason to doubt that makes me feel ashamed.

"But I want to say something else, too. Over the last few months, all of us – including and especially men who respect women – have been forced to take a good, hard look at our own actions and think (perhaps, shamefully, for the first time) about how those actions have affected women.

"For instance, that picture. I don't know what was in my head when I took that picture, and it doesn't matter. There's no excuse. I look at it now and I feel disgusted with myself. It isn't funny. It's completely inappropriate. It's obvious how Leeann would feel violated by that picture. And, what's more, I can see how millions of other women would feel violated by it – women who have had similar experiences in their own lives, women who fear having those experiences, women who look up to me, women who have counted on me.

"Coming from the world of comedy, I've told and written a lot of jokes that I once thought were funny but later came to realize were just plain offensive. But the intentions behind my actions aren't the point at all. It's the impact these jokes had on others that matters. And I'm sorry it's taken me so long to come to terms with that.

"While I don't remember the rehearsal for the skit as Leeann does, I understand why we need to listen to and believe women's experiences.

"I am asking that an ethics investigation be undertaken, and I will gladly cooperate.

"And the truth is, what people think of me in light of this is far less important than what people think of women who continue to come forward to tell their stories. They deserve to be heard, and believed. And they deserve to know that I am their ally and supporter. I have let them down and am committed to making it up to them." www.msnbc.com

#49 | Posted by tonyroma at 2017-11-16 02:57 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 7

No, but maybe it will keep you honest and give the same vileness to Democrats as you do the Republicans who are accused.
But I see it hasn't, Hans is straining to see "shadows" under fingertips..

#47 | POSTED BY BOAZ

Oops. Franken already agreed to an ethics investigation.

While Moore and PeeTUS refuse everything.

Good job for reminding us of the differences between Democrats and Republicans.

#50 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 02:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 6

A few phone calls about a public dispute on budget numbers?

You don't seem to get it, harassment takes many forms. Demanding a co-panelists home phone number (as well as giving it) is a breach of their rights of privacy in California as is stalking.

But go ahead and give him a free pass, you seem to be very adept at that if there is a (D) next to their name. As more allegations against Franken come out, I will remind you ala Hans of these posts.

And yes, to head off the inevitable deflection, Trump should resign over the allegations against him as well.

#51 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 03:01 PM | Reply

#50

Moore and Trump are much creepier than Franken, who is still a creep.

#52 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 03:02 PM | Reply

No, but maybe it will keep you honest and give the same vileness to Democrats as you do the Republicans who are accused.

But I see it hasn't, Hans is straining to see "shadows" under fingertips..

#47 | Posted by boaz

Perhaps you don't know the difference between a hateful vile hypocrite like Roy and decent human being like Al?

Gotta love how the wing-dings bozomackrackadore jumped on this news like they found a GOTCHA!

But, the BIGLY difference here is that Al Franken immediately addressed the issue and even apologized for acting inappropriately. In addition, he welcomes an Ethics Committee probe if that is what Republicans wish to spend their time and energy on.

Think old Pedi-Roy will be ok with the Ethics Committee investigating him should he manage to con Alabamans into voting for him?

#53 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-16 03:03 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

You don't seem to get it, harassment takes many forms. Demanding a co-panelists home phone number (as well as giving it) is a breach of their rights of privacy in California as is stalking.

#51 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER

I'd LOVE to see your source on that one.

#54 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 03:10 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Moore's defenders are too dense to realize that by taking Franken to the Ethics Committee because of a forced kiss and a photo where he appears to be grabbing her breasts makes it a certainty that if elected, Moore will wind up in front of the same committee. And all of his accusers will go under oath in front of US Senators, telling their stories, and all Moore has produced in his defense so far is his faulty memory and scads of people who did not know him nor were physically around him when his suspect behavior actually occurred.

Welcome to the land of equivalency. Hope you enjoy your stay.

#55 | Posted by tonyroma at 2017-11-16 03:10 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

What Franken did in the photo is offensive whether he touched her breasts or not. But it's more offensive if he did, because that's sexual assault. I don't think the photo shows him touching her. There's a shadow below his hands that wouldn't be there if he was groping. It looks like he was hovering over them to make a joke. I don't say that to defend the joke -- it's offensive, sexist and gross -- but to analyze what he did or didn't do.

As for the kiss story, if he really slipped her the tongue in rehearsal as she says that's creepy and gross.

Franken is right to apologize and support a Congressional ethics investigation into his behavior. That doesn't erase what he did, but it's a lot better than the "deny deny deny" game that Roy Moore, Donald Trump and others play when they are caught.

Anyone who calls for Franken's resignation while supporting Trump is a massive hypocrite. So let's all wait and see if AndreaMackris calls for Trump to resign.

#58 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 03:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 10

Agreeing to the ethics investigation instantly makes him more credible. Have to give him that.

#59 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-16 03:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Now Franken's actions appear a bit more isolated, uncorroborated and far less serious than most.
#41 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

Uncorroborated? Then what's his apology for?

#60 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 03:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

= As more allegations against Franken come out, I will remind you ala Hans of these posts.

Psychic lawyers... as if. And threats to Hans people, lol.

Franken is showing what class looks like when confronting his own foibles. Something from which some right of center people could take a clue.

#61 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 03:43 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

"There's a shadow below his hands that wouldn't be there if he was groping." - #58 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 03:30 PM

Indeed. And very Newsworthy.

#62 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 03:45 PM | Reply

#60

You might be a libertarian if... you don't get Al's apology.

internetisinamerica.blogspot.com

#63 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 03:45 PM | Reply

Perhaps you don't know the difference between a hateful vile hypocrite like Roy and decent human being like Al...
#53 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

Decent human beings dont have to apologize for groping people as a joke.

#64 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 03:45 PM | Reply

"And threats to Hans people..." - #61 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 03:43 PM

A new Drudge Retort meme is born.

:-)

#65 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 03:46 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Decent human beings dont have to apologize..." - #64 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 03:45 PM

Decent human beings apologize when they've done wrong, regardless of the nature or severity of the offense.

But I suppose that's a foreign concept to you.

#66 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 03:49 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I'd LOVE to see your source on that one.

#54 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT AT 2017-11-16 03:10 PM

CODE OF CIVIL PROCEDURE - CCP
PART 2. OF CIVIL ACTIONS [307 - 1062.20] ( Part 2 enacted 1872. )
TITLE 7. OTHER PROVISIONAL REMEDIES IN CIVIL ACTIONS [501 - 574] ( Heading of Title 7 added by Stats. 1974, Ch. 1516. )

CHAPTER 3. Injunction [525 - 534] ( Chapter 3 enacted 1872. )

527.6.
(a) (1) A person who has suffered harassment as defined in subdivision (b) may seek a temporary restraining order and an order after hearing prohibiting harassment as provided in this section.

(b) For purposes of this section:

(1) "Course of conduct" is a pattern of conduct composed of a series of acts over a period of time, however short, evidencing a continuity of purpose, including following or stalking an individual, making harassing telephone calls to an individual, or sending harassing correspondence to an individual by any means, including, but not limited to, the use of public or private mails, interoffice mail, facsimile, or email. Constitutionally protected activity is not included within the meaning of "course of conduct."

...

(3) "Harassment" is unlawful violence, a credible threat of violence, or a knowing and willful course of conduct directed at a specific person that seriously alarms, annoys, or harasses the person, and that serves no legitimate purpose. The course of conduct must be that which would cause a reasonable person to suffer substantial emotional distress, and must actually cause substantial emotional distress to the petitioner.

Pretty much sums up what happened to Ms. Morgan, and Franken knew that she could get a restraining order against him for it, which is why he stopped.

Any other questions?

#67 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 03:49 PM | Reply

Franken is showing what class looks like when confronting his own foibles. Something from which some right of center people could take a clue.

You finally said something of substance that I agree with. Well done, I knew you could do it if you really applied yourself.

#68 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 03:54 PM | Reply

#67 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 03:49 PM

Was Sycophant asking for the source of the California law?

Or was Sycophant asking for the source that a co-panelist's home phone number was divulged in contradiction of California law?

#69 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 03:54 PM | Reply

#66 | POSTED BY HANS

My point is decent human beings dont grope other people without their consent, as a joke.

#70 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 03:55 PM | Reply

#67

Topic is still sexual harassment, no matter how much some lawyers want to broaden it to something else.

- which is why he stopped.

"Psychic Lawyers, Part Deux: The Phony Bill Frist Act" or "Assigning Motivation 101".

#71 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 03:55 PM | Reply

#66 | POSTED BY HANS
My point is decent human beings dont grope other people without their consent, as a joke.
#70 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN

so there is no redemption in life? Mighty nihilistic of you.

#72 | Posted by truthhurts at 2017-11-16 04:04 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"My point is decent human beings dont grope other people..." - #70 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 03:55 PM

"What Franken did in the photo is offensive whether he touched her breasts or not. But it's more offensive if he did, because that's sexual assault. I don't think the photo shows him touching her. There's a shadow below his hands that wouldn't be there if he was groping. It looks like he was hovering over them to make a joke. I don't say that to defend the joke -- it's offensive, sexist and gross -- but to analyze what he did or didn't do." - #58 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 03:30 PM
Perhaps you missed that astute observation from our host.

#73 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:06 PM | Reply

apparently the accuser has accepted his apology as well.

#74 | Posted by klifferd at 2017-11-16 04:08 PM | Reply

Decent human beings dont have to apologize.

This is not true. Part of being a decent human is to recognize when your actions, either intentional or otherwise, have hurt someone and to attempt to make amends.

People who never apologize are usually sleazebags like Trump, not people who are so good their actions never, ever, never require an apology.

#75 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 04:08 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 8

I didnt miss it. I think its bs.

#76 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 04:08 PM | Reply

- apparently the accuser has accepted his apology as well.

"Not good enough! Nyet! Nyet!" - usual rwing suspects

"Woman who accused Franken says she accepts his apology"

thehill.com

#77 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 04:19 PM | Reply

Part of being a decent human is to recognize when your actions, either intentional or otherwise, have hurt someone and to attempt to make amends.

Ok, then Moore should not run and Franken should resign.

Agreed?

#78 | Posted by boaz at 2017-11-16 04:30 PM | Reply

"Ok, then Moore should not run and Franken should resign." - #78 | Posted by pfc. boaz at 2017-11-16 04:30 PM

When did Moore recognize that his actions, either intentional or otherwise, hurt someone?

And when did Moore attempt to make amends?

Your equivalency screw is as loose as ever, pfc. boaz.

#79 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:33 PM | Reply

#78

As if feeling up several minor girls is the same as what Franken did. And no one has seen Moore apologize or any of the 14-16 year old girls accept.

Your equivalency is false.

#80 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 04:34 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

- apparently the accuser has accepted his apology as well.
"Not good enough! Nyet! Nyet!" - usual rwing suspects
"Woman who accused Franken says she accepts his apology"
thehill.com
#77 | POSTED BY CORKY

Well there goes this story.

#81 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 04:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

No one has any evidence on Moore.

If you have evidence, post a link and let's examine it.

Like we can examine the photo of Frankengroper.

#82 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 04:35 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Your equivalency screw is as loose as ever, pfc. boaz." - #79 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:33 PM
"Your equivalency is false." - #80 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 04:34 PM
LOL!

#83 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:36 PM | Reply

"No one has any evidence on Moore." - #82 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 04:35 PM

Testimony, especially that of victims, is considered evidence in a court of law.

As it is, we're in the court of public opinion.

#84 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:37 PM | Reply

Or was Sycophant asking for the source that a co-panelist's home phone number was divulged in contradiction of California law?

#69 | POSTED BY HANS AT 2017-11-16 03:54 PM

Most companies have HR policies prohibiting disclosure of non-public information, in California caselaw has expanded Cal. Civ. Code §1798.81.5 beyond "customer records" to cover employee personal information, including unlisted phone numbers, from disclosure:

CIVIL CODE - CIV
DIVISION 3. OBLIGATIONS [1427 - 3272.9] ( Heading of Division 3 amended by Stats. 1988, Ch. 160, Sec. 14. )
PART 4. OBLIGATIONS ARISING FROM PARTICULAR TRANSACTIONS [1738 - 3273] ( Part 4 enacted 1872. )
TITLE 1.81. CUSTOMER RECORDS [1798.80 - 1798.84] ( Title 1.81 added by Stats. 2000, Ch. 1039, Sec. 1. )
1798.81.5.
(a) (1) It is the intent of the Legislature to ensure that personal information about California residents is protected. To that end, the purpose of this section is to encourage businesses that own, license, or maintain personal information about Californians to provide reasonable security for that information.

(2) For the purpose of this section, the terms "own" and "license" include personal information that a business retains as part of the business' internal customer account or for the purpose of using that information in transactions with the person to whom the information relates. The term "maintain" includes personal information that a business maintains but does not own or license.

(b) A business that owns, licenses, or maintains personal information about a California resident shall implement and maintain reasonable security procedures and practices appropriate to the nature of the information, to protect the personal information from unauthorized access, destruction, use, modification, or disclosure."

#85 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 04:39 PM | Reply

Well there goes another talking point for Team Andrea. OOPSIE DAISY!!!!!!!!!!!

#87 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2017-11-16 04:40 PM | Reply

#85 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER

That's not a criminal law.

And giving it away does not constitute stalking.

#88 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 04:41 PM | Reply

"No one has any evidence on Moore." - #82 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 04:35 PM
Testimony, especially that of victims, is considered evidence in a court of law.
As it is, we're in the court of public opinion.

#84 | POSTED BY HANS

Especially the testimony of 40 odd people at this point.

#89 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 04:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Testimony, especially that of victims, is considered evidence in a court of law.
As it is, we're in the court of public opinion.

#84 | POSTED BY HANS

Right.

#90 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 04:42 PM | Reply

#85 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 04:39 PM

RoC, please take off your Barristers' wig for a moment.

My questions were:

Was Sycophant asking for the source of the California law?

Or was Sycophant asking for the source that a co-panelist's home phone number was divulged in contradiction of California law?

Yes, yes, divulging a person's home telephone number violates California law and civil code. You've made that abundantly clear now... twice.

But is that what Sycophant was seeking?

Or was he seeking the source that a co-panelist's home phone number was divulged?

#91 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:44 PM | Reply

#88

You asked for the authority for not disclosing a phone number and how making phonecalls can be harassment or stalking and I gave both to you...sorry you don't like the answer.

#92 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 04:44 PM | Reply

"Right." - #90 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 04:42 PM

Correct.

I'm right.

#93 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 04:45 PM | Reply

As evidenced by 88 he was asking for the former Hans, and he got it.

#94 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 04:46 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

No one has any evidence on Moore.

You think all those women are lying and all the people they told who have come forward are lying and all the people who said he was banned from Gadsden Mall are lying? That's a conspiracy of around 30 people so far.

He's a kiddie chaser and instead of calling for him to quit the race you're running cover for him.

#95 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 04:48 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

I have to say, Franken is handling this about as well as one could handle it. His apology was specific and it at least sounded sincere. He offered himself up to go in front of the ethics committee. My guess is that he doesn't have any other instances like this in his closet if he's willing to put himself before the committee. The forced kiss was creepy and gross and the groping (can't tell if he's making physical contact or not) but if that's the extent of this....I don't see this taking him down in any way, nor should it, if this is all there is.

#96 | Posted by JeffJ at 2017-11-16 04:52 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 11

He's a kiddie chaser and instead of calling for him to quit the race you're running cover for him.

That's what hyper-partisans on both sides of the aisle tend to do, it is disgusting no matter who the abuser is.

#97 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 04:52 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

You don't seem to get it, harassment takes many forms. Demanding a co-panelists home phone number (as well as giving it) is a breach of their rights of privacy in California as is stalking.
#51 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER

I'd LOVE to see your source on that one.
#54 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

#88
You asked for the authority for not disclosing a phone number and how making phonecalls can be harassment or stalking and I gave both to you...sorry you don't like the answer.
#92 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER

Yeah and you screwed that up.

CIVIL CODE - CIV
DIVISION 3. OBLIGATIONS [1427 - 3272.9] ( Heading of Division 3 amended by Stats. 1988, Ch. 160, Sec. 14. )
PART 4. OBLIGATIONS ARISING FROM PARTICULAR TRANSACTIONS [1738 - 3273] ( Part 4 enacted 1872. )
TITLE 1.81. CUSTOMER RECORDS [1798.80 - 1798.84] ( Title 1.81 added by Stats. 2000, Ch. 1039, Sec. 1. )
1798.81.5.

"(1) "Personal information" means either of the following:
(A) An individual's first name or first initial and his or her last name in combination with any one or more of the following data elements, when either the name or the data elements are not encrypted or redacted:
(i) Social security number.
(ii) Driver's license number or California identification card number.
(iii) Account number, credit or debit card number, in combination with any required security code, access code, or password that would permit access to an individual's financial account.
(iv) Medical information.
(v) Health insurance information."

#98 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 05:02 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I have to say, Franken is handling this about as well as one could handle it. His apology was specific and it at least sounded sincere. He offered himself up to go in front of the ethics committee. My guess is that he doesn't have any other instances like this in his closet if he's willing to put himself before the committee. The forced kiss was creepy and gross and the groping (can't tell if he's making physical contact or not) but if that's the extent of this....I don't see this taking him down in any way, nor should it, if this is all there is.

#96 | POSTED BY JEFFJ

I hate when we agree... But that's put very well.

#99 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 05:03 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I'm feeling somewhat sexually harassed by all this quoting of the red hot civil code.

#100 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 05:04 PM | Reply

I have to say, Franken is handling this about as well as one could handle it. His apology was specific and it at least sounded sincere. He offered himself up to go in front of the ethics committee. My guess is that he doesn't have any other instances like this in his closet if he's willing to put himself before the committee. The forced kiss was creepy and gross and the groping (can't tell if he's making physical contact or not) but if that's the extent of this....I don't see this taking him down in any way, nor should it, if this is all there is.
#96 | POSTED BY JEFFJ
I hate when we agree... But that's put very well.

#99 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

Byrd survived his KKK membership.

Kennedy survived killing that poor Mary Jo.

Franken just might make it with your help.

#101 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 05:10 PM | Reply

"No one has any evidence on Moore." - #82 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 04:35 PM
Testimony, especially that of victims, is considered evidence in a court of law.
As it is, we're in the court of public opinion.
#84 | POSTED BY HANS
Especially the testimony of 40 odd people at this point.

#89 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

Thousands of people "testified" that no one at the pompous ACA Celebration March called John Lewis the n-word. Did that work for you, Syco?

#102 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 05:15 PM | Reply

But that's put very well.

#99 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

Thank you.

#103 | Posted by JeffJ at 2017-11-16 05:17 PM | Reply

"President believes Alabama voters alone should decide Senate race winner

By Jenna Johnson November 16 at 4:54 PM

President Trump considers the allegations of sexual assault and misconduct against Republican Alabama Senate candidate Roy Moore "extremely troubling" but doesn't plan to rescind his endorsement of the former state judge...."

www.washingtonpost.com

Donald finds it "extremely troubling" that he didn't get to hit on those minor girls first.

And he still endorses Moore for the Senate. I guess grabbers gotta stick together... so to speak.

#104 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 05:21 PM | Reply

"President believes Alabama voters alone should decide Senate race winner"

Especially the Alabama voters that get their news from Russian Facebook accounts.

#105 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-16 05:31 PM | Reply

DR Conservatives are reaching with this one more than Franken is in the picture.

#106 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2017-11-16 05:33 PM | Reply

Especially the testimony of 40 odd people at this point.
#89 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT
Thousands of people "testified" that no one at the pompous ACA Celebration March called John Lewis the n-word. Did that work for you, Syco?
#102 | POSTED BY DIXVILLENOTCH

No. It didn't. They could only testify that they didn't hear anything.

And given what we've heard from the Alt-Right now, kind of hard to believe it didn't happen...

#107 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-16 05:38 PM | Reply

DR Conservatives are reaching with this one more than Franken is in the picture.

#106 | Posted by IndianaJones

Hmmm. Smell that, too?

Don't you just love the smell of Republican Desperation in the morning (and daytime, nighttime, Saturday, too!).

#108 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-16 05:53 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

There were tons of cameras around Lewis that day. A $100,000 reward was offered for anyone who had anything recorded.

So, thousands of witnesses and dozens of recordings are kind of hard for you to believe. Why is that? Cause of something you've heard "now." Silly.

#109 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 05:57 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Especially the Alabama voters that get their news from Russian Facebook accounts.

#105 | Posted by snoofy

and Faux News and Donald Trump (the guy who invented "fake news")

Oops. Sorry

You just said that.

#110 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-16 06:01 PM | Reply

"I certainly don't remember the rehearsal for the skit in the same way..."

Sch-wiiing!

#111 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 06:04 PM | Reply

But that's put very well.

#99 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

Thank you.

#103 | POSTED BY JEFFJ

Get a room.

#112 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 06:05 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Thousands of people "testified" that no one at the pompous ACA Celebration March called John Lewis the n-word." - #102 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 05:15 PM

When all you have are lies then lying's all you can do.

#113 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-16 06:11 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

That's how hearsay and denials work, Hans.

Bright boy!

#114 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 06:20 PM | Reply

At least we've learned that Franken is a skeevy tongue jammer who kept a trophy photo.

money says one or two Moore might exist.

#115 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 06:20 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Yeah and you screwed that up.

Nope, as I said, California caselaw on this issue has expanded the scope and reach of both Art. I Sec. I of the California Constitution and the general precepts of Cal. Civ. Code §1798.81.5 beyond "customer records" to cover employee personal information, including unlisted phone numbers, from disclosure in the employment context.

If you have any other questions I am sure your company's HR department can address them.

#116 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 06:32 PM | Reply

Is the National Organization for Women going to criticize the Frankengroper, or will they hide out like during the Clinton years?

#117 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 06:33 PM | Reply

Looks bad for Franken. But he's a Democrat, so he'll wind up being held accountable for it, not getting put to the top of the Democratic Party's list of presidential candidates.

#118 | Posted by chuffy at 2017-11-16 06:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

- But he's a Democrat,

which often triggers the apples-oranges defense.

#119 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 06:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Franken is a skeevy tongue jammer who kept a trophy photo.

#115 | POSTED BY SHEEPLESCHISM

If he would have kept the photo -- instead of giving it to her -- he would be skating right now.

#120 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 06:43 PM | Reply

#skeevytonguejammer will be trending soon.

Lot's of examples these days.

#121 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 06:44 PM | Reply

I think #skeevyhomophobe may be coming up as well, from the Harvard Crimson, April 16, 1976:

"My advice to Harvard students," Al Franken said soberly, "is to drop out."

...

Franken spent most of his time at Harvard getting from one day to the next, always careful to keep his head above academic water. He spurned the Loeb, the Lampoon and the Pudding to work by himself for Dunster House productions.

"The Loeb, well, that's theater," Franken said, frowning a bit. "I was just never into theater. I was interested in real show business. And the Lampoon--it wasn't just that I didn't like them, I thought the stuff they were doing was terrible."

He recalled writing a skit called "Seamen on Broadway" that was rejected from the Hasty Pudding show "by some preppie so they could take some other preppie's skit." Franken started to smile again, but his tone was serious, too serious. "It's not preppies, cause I'm a preppie myself. I just don't like homosexuals. If you ask me, they're all homosexuals in the Pudding. Hey, I was glad when that Pudding homosexual got killed in Philadelphia." The smile became so broad it pushed his eyes shut. He couldn't stand it any longer. "Put that in, put that in," Franken laughed, leaning over the desk. "I'd love to see that in The Crimson."

#122 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 07:07 PM | Reply

Sorry, link didn't make it:

Live From New York: It's Al Franken

#123 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-11-16 07:14 PM | Reply

Franken is a skeevy tongue jammer who kept a trophy photo.

He didn't keep a photo. She was given a bunch of photos from that USO Tour by the photographer after the tour and that one was included.

#124 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 07:29 PM | Reply

... from the Harvard Crimson, April 16, 1976 ...

Taking a joke he made to a reporter as a Saturday Night Live writer in 1976 as a literal statement against gays is pretty stupid.

#125 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 07:32 PM | Reply

pretty stupid.

#125 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 07:32 PM | Reply

Will be carved on the tombstone of the Republican Party.

#126 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 07:35 PM | Reply

Slate magazine:

There is no rational reason to doubt the truth of Tweeden's accusations, no legitimate defense of Franken's actions, and no ambiguity here at all: Franken should resign from the Senate immediately. Democrats should call for him to step down straightaway. This revelation is a test of the Democratic Party's consistency, honesty, and decency. If Democrats wish to preserve whatever moral standing they have today, they must exhort Franken to leave the Senate, with no hesitation or reservations.

www.slate.com

#127 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 07:38 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

"Democrats should call for him (Franken) to step down straightaway"

Why shouldn't Trump step down straightaway? He's a worse offender. A much worse offender.

#128 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 07:43 PM | Reply

In fact, if you ask Franken to step down in return for Trump stepping down first, I'll bet he does that.

#129 | Posted by Zed at 2017-11-16 07:44 PM | Reply

Why shouldn't Trump step down straightaway? He's a worse offender. A much worse offender.

#128 | POSTED BY ZED

Hasnt that been called for, by people now defending Franken?

#130 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 07:55 PM | Reply

And he still endorses Moore for the Senate. I guess grabbers gotta stick together... so to speak.
#104 | POSTED BY CORKY

Seems like they got a new member of the grabber club today.

#131 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 07:58 PM | Reply

Mark Levin said that Tweeden was sleeping when that photo was taken and that she didn't know Franken had done that until she saw the photos later. The he said that Franken claims his hands weren't actually touching Tweeden, but that "Tweeden says she remembers he was." Wtf, over? Sleeping or remembering? Sleeping or remembering? Can't really have it both ways, Marky.

#132 | Posted by mOntecOre at 2017-11-16 08:07 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Andrea has been harassing school kid for their lunch money to pay for her sailboat.

#133 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 08:14 PM | Reply

It would be nice if professional pundits gasbagging about this bothered to get the facts right.

#134 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-16 08:15 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#132

But it doesn't matter, as Franken said he was wrong regardless. Newsflash: What Franken did is not predation in the manner of Moore or Trump, and that fact cannot be ignored. Franken apologized and understands how she feels about what he did. Franken did not try to explain away her feelings by overplaying his. The same can't be said about Moore and Trump who both call their accusers liars, knowing that no physical evidence will can be produced to refute their assertions. Franken says, here I am, an unperfect person, yet fully cognizant of my need to always be better than I showed in this instance. Moore wraps himself in the bible and Trump used the nuts and ----- counter accusation as their defense.

There is no proportionality in these disparate, yet wrong acts committed by three different men. Franken immediately acted contrite and remorseful, he did not blame the victim nor claim excuses for what he did as it relates to the feelings of the victim about what occurred. The same cannot be said about the other two men who publicly trashed their accusers and defiantly attacked them as liars for political motives when most of them have no appreciable political reason for having invented the details of their interactions with these men with long trails of troubling behavior in their pasts.

#135 | Posted by tonyroma at 2017-11-16 08:26 PM | Reply

Decent human beings dont have to apologize for groping people as a joke.
#64 | POSTED BY TXLIBERTARIAN

If thats the case, there's a lot less decent people in the world than you or I may think.

#136 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2017-11-16 08:26 PM | Reply

A single rehearsal with the cast involved and a stupid pic prank on the Playboy model, not so much.
#21 | POSTED BY CORKY

What part of being a Playboy model makes sexual assualt acceptable. Nice bit of ---- shaming there Corky, very progressive of you...

#137 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 08:27 PM | Reply

Nice bit of ---- shaming there Corky, very progressive of you...

#137 | POSTED BY TXLIBERTARIAN

Aren't you just so cute suddenly getting all righteous and indignant and concerned about a woman's feelings. Are you suddenly just as concerned for Roy Moore's and Donald Trump's accusers? There are a lot more of them you know. They have feelings too.

#139 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-16 08:42 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Don't you just love the smell of Republican Desperation in the morning (and daytime, nighttime, Saturday, too!).
#108 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

It's best on Sunday's, the supposed "Lord's day."

#140 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2017-11-16 08:45 PM | Reply

There are a lot more of them you know. They have feelings too.

#139 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

Yeah, but there's no photo. People defending Moore are demanding factual proof of inpropriety. Evangelicals demanding PROOF! Let that sink in for a moment. Won't take 9 accusers' word on faith, but they'll sure as hell base their entirety of belief system on faith.

What's the difference? To put it in their words: "Timing."

All the while pretending this "political witch hunt" is happening in a vacuum.

#141 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2017-11-16 08:58 PM | Reply

#139 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

Suddenly? Have you seen me defend Trump or Moore in regards to their sexual assualt allegations? Have you seen me ---- shame any of their accusers?

#142 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 09:09 PM | Reply

#139 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

Now's a good time for Trump's accusers to band together. I'd like to see it happen.

All these rich powerful ------ need to face the music.

#143 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 09:35 PM | Reply

He deserves whatever is coming to him. Kudos for a quick apology, but a Senate motion to censure is in his future. Probably he should not seek re-election as well.

#144 | Posted by e1g1 at 2017-11-16 09:39 PM | Reply

Now's a good time for Trump's accusers to band together. I'd like to see it happen ~ sheeple.

Where did they go? Not useful or not telling truth.

#145 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 09:40 PM | Reply

Yeah. all 16 are liars, andrea...

Partisan twit.

#146 | Posted by Alexandrite at 2017-11-16 09:52 PM | Reply

Where is Ted Kennedy when you need him?

#147 | Posted by Federalist at 2017-11-16 09:57 PM | Reply

It would be nice if professional pundits gasbagging about this bothered to get the facts right.

#134 | Posted by rcade
Leave Benghazi out of this!

#148 | Posted by Federalist at 2017-11-16 09:58 PM | Reply

"Sen. Al Franken on Thursday of groping her and kissing her without her consent in 2006 while she was on a USO Tour overseas."

She consented to the kiss, though:

"He repeated that actors really need to rehearse everything and that we must practice the kiss. I said ‘OK' so he would stop badgering me."

#149 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-16 10:00 PM | Reply

#149 | Posted by snoofy
Well Weinstien would like to use that defense. They were all actors!

#150 | Posted by Federalist at 2017-11-16 10:04 PM | Reply

Weinstein isn't even an actor.

#151 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-16 10:08 PM | Reply

She was given a bunch of photos from that USO Tour by the photographer after the tour and that one was included.

#124 | POSTED BY RCADE

The photographer was Al's brother, Owen Franken. Ups the suckage.

#152 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-16 10:10 PM | Reply

#151 | Posted by snoofy
How do you determine that?
"We are all actors on the stage of life."

#153 | Posted by Federalist at 2017-11-16 10:10 PM | Reply

So he felt up a sleeping playboy bunny, at least he apologized after being called out on it. I'm sure he's truly sorry he got caught.

#154 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-16 10:24 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#154 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

What does being a Playboy model have to do with this? Corky welcomes you to his ---- shaming club.

#155 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-16 10:29 PM | Reply

What does being a Playboy model have to do with this?

Opens the possibility that Franken was just trying on Heffner's fingerprints.

#156 | Posted by REDIAL at 2017-11-16 10:48 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#154 you have to touch something to grope it.

Idiot.

#157 | Posted by jpw at 2017-11-16 11:21 PM | Reply

- Where did they go?

Hans and Zed keep track of the weird stuff.

#158 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-16 11:21 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

- Nice bit of ---- shaming there Corky, very progressive of you...

---- shaming? I wasn't talking about you or Mackris, lmao!

I mentioned her werk... you sound like you think all Playboy models are ----s.

What's up with that?

Rwingers are so f-ed up.

#159 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-16 11:31 PM | Reply

Jpw... nevermind. I like living rent free in your head.

#160 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-16 11:44 PM | Reply

I like living rent free in your head.

Like 100% of the dolts that say things like that, you are probably not.

#161 | Posted by REDIAL at 2017-11-16 11:56 PM | Reply

"What does being a Playboy model have to do with this?"

It must have felt good to type that.

Did you do it one-handed?

#162 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-16 11:59 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

TT‏ @TheTabbasco

Replying to @LeeannTweeden
Strange, I was Al Frankin's Escort officer...I don't remember any of this except there was a lot of good natured joking in a crowded room...I was with him the entire time on base...
7:59 AM - 16 Nov 2017

He had an escort on every base during waking hours...I even stayed with him in the bathroom...If I saw anything that was inappropriate, it was my job to report it...BTW I am an independent, who did Leeanne vote for???
8:29 AM - 16 Nov 2017

twitter.com

#163 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:00 AM | Reply

I'm sure he's truly sorry he got caught.

There's a difference between being caught doing something and posing for the camera.

You pose for the camera when you're trying to be funny.

You take your victim to an isolated cabin in the woods when you know what you're doing is creepy and wrong, and don't want to get caught.

#164 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 12:03 AM | Reply

The ethics committee will have at least 3 witnesses to interview: the escort officer, the guy sitting next to Leeanne (assuming he's not the escort officer) and the photographer (Al's brother?).

#165 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:09 AM | Reply

So, does anyone think this sounds like a woman who regrets her past decisions?

I hear that on college campuses especially, they have to remind people that "There are gradations between "glorious, consensual sex" and rape; the term "rape" should not be used to describe every unfortunate or regrettable sexual encounter" yaledailynews.com

#166 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-11-17 12:11 AM | Reply

"You pose for the camera when you're trying to be funny."

You can tell by the look on Al's face that's what he's going for. It was meant to be a joke, in very poor taste, but a joke nonetheless.

#167 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:12 AM | Reply

Now's a good time for Trump's accusers to band together. I'd like to see it happen ~ sheeple.

Where did they go? Not useful or not telling truth.
#145 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-16 09:40 PM

Donald Trump's Sexual Assault Accusers Demand Justice in the #MeToo Era: 'We Were Forgotten'

people.com

6 Women or Donald Trump -- Whom Would You Believe?

That's how many women have now accused the president of harassment, assault, and other inappropriate behavior.

www.thenation.com

#168 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:26 AM | Reply

6 Women or Donald Trump -- Whom Would You Believe?

should be

16 Women or Donald Trump -- Whom Would You Believe?

#169 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:27 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

16 Women or Donald Trump -- Whom Would You Believe?

You're asking this of people who can't figure out if child molestation is a problem because it's not condemned by the Bible.

"I could rape somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."

~ Donnie Drumpsterfire

#170 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 12:46 AM | Reply

You can tell by the look on Al's face that's what he's going for. It was meant to be a joke, in very poor taste, but a joke nonetheless.

Completely agree.

I was just responding to the allegation that he's been "caught".

#171 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 12:48 AM | Reply

#171 I know, and I was just building on what you said.

#172 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:50 AM | Reply

👍🏽😎

#173 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 12:51 AM | Reply

#145 When Has Trump Been Accused of Rape or Attempted Rape? Allegations Include a Child, His Wife and a Business Associate

www.newsweek.com

#174 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 12:52 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#171 I know, and I was just building on what you said.
#172 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY

Ms. Tweeden, didnt find it funny.

#175 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-17 01:05 AM | Reply

I mentioned her werk...
#159 | POSTED BY CORKY

Hmmm...but didnt think to mention any of her other work...

#176 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-17 01:07 AM | Reply

Not useful or not telling truth.
#145 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

Perfect description for you.

Except I'd modify it to, "Not useful and Not telling the truth."

You're a one trick pony Macky, thank your parents everyday for your trust fund.

#177 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 01:08 AM | Reply

Ms. Tweeden, didnt find it funny.
#175 | POSTED BY TXLIBERTARIAN

No one is claiming she does.

Matter of fact, I've yet to read one person who thinks it is.

What the claim is, is the photo was taken on purpose in a failed attempt at humor.

In the moment Al and photog probably thought they were being hilarious.

Looking back it's obvious it wasn't.

#178 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 01:11 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

You can tell by the look on Al's face that's what he's going for. It was meant to be a joke, in very poor taste, but a joke nonetheless.
#167 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY

Ill remember this the next time, someone tells a racist, homophobic, bigoted etc joke. We'll see if this excuse hold water then. Sure they will be "in very poor taste, but a joke nonetheless."

#179 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-17 01:16 AM | Reply

It was meant to be a joke, in very poor taste, but a joke nonetheless.
#167 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY

Joke? LOL since when has Joking about sexual harassment been OK with the SJW's?

You have to be kidding me, using the "joke" excuse ....

Gal you have sunk to new lows.......

#180 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-17 01:20 AM | Reply

Perfect description for you.

LOL tells me you got nothing .... keep swinging Clown ...

What the claim is, is the photo was taken on purpose in a failed attempt at humor.

Humor at the expense of a woman's feelings? Wonderful world you live in.....

Gotta love it when Progressive hypocrisy rears its ugly head so easily.

#181 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-17 01:23 AM | Reply

#180

Andrea, you deserve an award for your performance as "clueless moron #2."

If you look at that picture. The placement of Al's hands. The moronic look on his face. Directly looking at the camera. And not be able to tell he's attempting to be funny. You're a moron.

Or lying because your a partisan hack.

Take your pick.

#182 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 01:28 AM | Reply

No one is claiming she does.
Matter of fact, I've yet to read one person who thinks it is.
#178 | POSTED BY CLOWNSHACK

Ok...I'll amend my statement, Ms. Tweeden didnt find it to be a joke. Now your "I've yet to read one person who thinks it is" wont work. Your one of those people...

#183 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-17 01:28 AM | Reply

Perfect description for you.

Pretty much out of ideas hey Clown ..

What the claim is, is the photo was taken on purpose in a failed attempt at humor.

Yep I suppose its true ...

Humor at the expense of a woman's feelings? Wonderful world you live in.....

Gotta love it when Progressive hypocrisy rears its ugly head so easily.

#184 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-17 01:28 AM | Reply

Andrea, you deserve an award for your performance as "clueless moron #2."
~ clownshack

Let me know when you get some new material, Corky beats you hands down for creativity....

Until then goodbye ...

#185 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-17 01:31 AM | Reply

Humor at the expense of a woman's feelings? Wonderful world you live in.....

I get that you're going for Super SJW.

But the world hasn't been so overly concerned with sexual harassment as we've recently become.

Ever watch a movie from the 80s? Every shot is glorified sexual harassment.

Placing your hands over a woman's breasts for a laugh isn't funny.

But it's nothing like bragging about grabbing ----.

Like your boy Donnie did.

#186 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 01:34 AM | Reply

Until then goodbye ...

If you don't think you can make it through the night make sure to contact your local suicide hotline.

#187 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 01:36 AM | Reply

Gotta love it when Progressive hypocrisy rears its ugly head so easily.
#184 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

To be fair the hypocrisy on this subject runs rampant on all sides.

#188 | Posted by TXLIBERTARIAN at 2017-11-17 01:46 AM | Reply

I'll amend my statement,

Oh goody.

Ms. Tweeden didnt find it to be a joke.

And Al is going to to be seen by an ethics committee for his actions.

As I said up thread. What ever happens to Al, happens.

Now your "I've yet to read one person who thinks it is" wont work.

Well yea. Because you amended your statement. Duh.

So I'll have to amend my statement.

I have yet to read anyone claim Ms. Tweeden is lying. She clearly doesn't find it to be a joke.

What I've read are people attempting to discern Senator Franklen's motives.

Did he have sexual intent?

I don't believe he did. In my opinion. It doesn't seem he did. It seems like he was trying to be funny. Which. To reiterate. I don't believe it's funny.

He doesn't either. His statement is linked above. (#14)

People do really dumb things in attempt to be funny. I've witnessed people do the dumbest things trying to be funny.

So then the question becomes. Does what he did warrant his dismal?

That's up to the ethics committee to decide.

And if he's to resign. He should.

Your one of those people...

Logical people?

#189 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-11-17 02:03 AM | Reply

Funny ------- pic

PC sez act indignant.

Hard I am laughing.

#190 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-11-17 02:40 AM | Reply

#160 VISITOR

HHAAAHA! wtf?!

Fuxkin stupid

#191 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2017-11-17 03:41 AM | Reply

Did any of you self-righteous "off with his head(ers)" take the time to read what the actual victim had to say about Franken's contrition and apology?

Later in the day, Jake Tapper talked to Leeann Tweeden for over a half hour. You can watch the whole thing, but I want to emphasize the fact that she accepted his apology. Then take a look at what she said when asked whether she wanted Franken to resign and if she wanted him to be punished (from 16:25 to 18:15)

First of all, she said that her intention was not for Franken to resign. When asked whether or not he should be punished, she said this:

"I just wanted him to apologize for that and say he was sorry ... I think that is where change is going to be driven from, not from the victims coming out and talking about it. I think it's going to come from the people who may be do the abusing and don't even realize they're doing the abusing because it's so a part of the culture ... When you think you can do it with impunity and get away with it, that's what's wrong with the culture. So if we can have the people doing the abusing change, that's when the change is going to occur."

No one on the planet wants to be defined by our worst moments, and there is no one who hasn't done or said something that would be extremely embarrassing were it to be made public. We shouldn't just be judging the acts themselves without giving proportional consideration to the perpetrator's response to the acts.

Therein lies all the difference in the world between Clinton, Trump, Moore, and Franken. Only one of them has admitted what they did was wrong and apologized to their victim(s). And that is the one so many want to skewer simply for the political affiliation behind his name and to take pressure off the other two from our other political party who continue to call their victims liars and other vile derisive names.

#192 | Posted by tonyroma at 2017-11-17 05:08 AM | Reply

And let me say a couple of more things as it regards LeeAnn Tweeden. I know that I'm not the only one here who saw the various "defenses" wandering around the internet which implied that Ms. Tweeden has frequented Fox News shows and may been a pawn in the game of deflection from Moore's problems. Or that the photographer of the damning photo has alleged that she was feigning sleep and was in on the joke, and I'm sure there might be more where those came from. But none of these counter accusations has entered this thread in defense of Franken that I have noticed, and my bringing them up now is not to defend him, but to say I find their assertions without any merit whatsoever based upon Sen. Franken's own contrition and apology.

He quickly figured out that it simply doesn't matter what he believed about the incidents in question, it only matters from the perspective of the one who was hurt by his actions. If only the other men who've had victims of their predation step forward and recount their stories would have the same inkling of human empathy and compassion, then maybe we could actually move forward as a society and stop taking our respective corners on these issues until we first figure out which political team the perpetrators belong to and dutifully take our respective sides.

Wrong is wrong and victims should not be victimized yet again without direct compelling evidence that they aren't being truthful far beyond just the word of the accused when so many are telling stories that show a repeated pattern of predatory behavior and selfish disregard of the people involved. The stronger the accused attack their accusers, the more likely the accused used the same irrational thought process in doing what they were accused of doing in the first place.

#193 | Posted by tonyroma at 2017-11-17 05:24 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Is this the point where nude pictures of LeeAnn start being posted to cement the contention that this was no big deal and she was asking to be treated like a piece of meat?

#194 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-17 07:45 AM | Reply

Franken did what Moore and Trump will never do, apologize for tasteless jokes and unwanted sexual advances under the guise of USO theater. Ms. Tweeden has accepted his apology with regrets that it came so late. The lesson here is a hard ---- has no conscience. Its difficult to even get any work done if you can't get releaved.

#195 | Posted by bayviking at 2017-11-17 08:06 AM | Reply

Is this the point where nude pictures of LeeAnn start being posted to cement the contention that this was no big deal and she was asking to be treated like a piece of meat?

#194 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

No. We're Democrats, not Republicans.

#196 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 09:08 AM | Reply

Gal you have sunk to new lows.......
#180 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-17 01:20 AM | Reply

...said the #Trumpvoter.
DOn't even write here, you have no moral authority in any way, shape, or form.

#197 | Posted by e1g1 at 2017-11-17 09:36 AM | Reply

Yes, it was meant to be a joke. Leeann views herself and bills herself as a sex object for money, so she shouldn't be surprised if a comedienne views her that way and bills her that way as part of a joke:

www.google.com

Had he really groped her, not merely put his hands above her Kevlar vest clad breasts, that would be a different matter entirely. Franken's joke was in very bad taste. He pretended forgot the rule many of Leeann's photos are meant to convey: look but don't touch. Or just touch yourself.

#198 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 09:46 AM | Reply

Andrea, you deserve an award for your performance as "clueless moron #2."
If you look at that picture. The placement of Al's hands. The moronic look on his face. Directly looking at the camera. And not be able to tell he's attempting to be funny. You're a moron.
Or lying because your a partisan hack.
Take your pick.

#182 | POSTED BY CLOWNSHACK AT 2017-11-17 01:28 AM | FLAG:

Problem is Franken always has a moronic look on his face and has a reputation for being an ----- to anyone who is below him.

#199 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 09:57 AM | Reply

Problem is Franken always has a moronic look on his face and has a reputation for being an ----- to anyone who is below him.

Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 09:57 AM | Reply

Show us your face so we can compare.

#200 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2017-11-17 10:01 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Problem is Franken always has a moronic look on his face and has a reputation for being an ----- to anyone who is below him."

Make s**t up much? Liar! He has earned the respect of his constituents in MN by not going on every national TV show, he focuses on his constituents' concerns.

#201 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 10:13 AM | Reply

I've been so busy I haven't had time to follow any of this much.

As far as I'm concerned....Franken can take his licks from the ethics committee and if the voters in Minnesota want him back then fine....or they can get rid of him. case closed.

#202 | Posted by eberly at 2017-11-17 10:16 AM | Reply

So many things are being conflated that it's ridiculous and threatens to undermine the serious cases of sexual harassment and assault. The idea that all of Moore's "accusers" should be lumped together is false. The girls who were of the legal age of consent (16 in Alabama) and who Moore asked out and kissed aren't "accusers" in the same way the 14 year old he undressed and fondled or the 16 year old he attempted to rape. What the latter accusers claim is against the law; what the former "accusers" claim isn't. You and I may think it was inappropriate for a 30 something man to "date" teenagers, but in the eyes of the law, he did nothing wrong in those instances.

#203 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 10:23 AM | Reply

There are degrees of sexual impropriety. The allegations against Weinstein would peg the meter at the high end. Clearly he needs to go to prison. Sexual harassment at work (crude jokes, come-ons, etc.) is at the lower end. Franken would be toward the mid-range -- especially his taking liberties with the kiss -- and in my opinion sufficient that he should resign from the Senate. What Moore is accused of would be in the middle for the most part, although the allegations involving the 14-year-old appear criminal in nature and move him into the upper range of the scale.

And Trump? Quite serious, in my view. By his own admission he grabbed women's -------- without their consent, and numerous women have accused him of groping and more: en.wikipedia.org

#204 | Posted by cbob at 2017-11-17 10:26 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Franken would be toward the mid-range -- especially his taking liberties with the kiss -- and in my opinion sufficient that he should resign from the Senate."

"What Moore is accused of would be in the middle for the most part, although the allegations involving the 14-year-old appear criminal in nature and move him into the upper range of the scale."

Ridiculous. One man preyed on children repeatedly, the other did things which were wrong and crude but not repetitions nor with children. Never mind that Franken was on a comedy tour, trying to be funny, cuz that's what you do on a comedy tour. Things sometimes go over the top in comedy, Moore was not on a comedy tour and it is never funny when it involves children.

#205 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 10:29 AM | Reply

"As far as I'm concerned....Franken can take his licks from the ethics committee and if the voters in Minnesota want him back then fine....or they can get rid of him. case closed."

Agreed.

#206 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 10:30 AM | Reply

"Franken would be toward the mid-range -- especially his taking liberties with the kiss -- and in my opinion sufficient that he should resign from the Senate. "

He said he didn't remember the kiss the way she did, so although he apologized to her, he didn't stipulate her version of the story was the one he recalled. We basically have a he said/she said on that one. At least right now.

#207 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 10:31 AM | Reply

I'll say also, if Franken's opponent for his reelection wants to use this issue against him they better be squeaky clean. If the GOP is smart they'll run a woman.

#208 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 10:32 AM | Reply

"Problem is Franken always has a moronic look on his face and has a reputation for being an ----- to anyone who is below him."
Make s**t up much? Liar! He has earned the respect of his constituents in MN by not going on every national TV show, he focuses on his constituents' concerns.

#201 | POSTED BY DANNI

Minnesota loves the guy. And he has a reputation for being a pretty darn nice guy.

#209 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 10:34 AM | Reply

Ridiculous. One man preyed on children repeatedly, the other did things which were wrong and crude but not repetitions nor with children. Never mind that Franken was on a comedy tour, trying to be funny, cuz that's what you do on a comedy tour. Things sometimes go over the top in comedy, Moore was not on a comedy tour and it is never funny when it involves children.
#205 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2017-11-17 10:29 AM | FLAG:

And if this Rand Paul you would give him a pass? Riiiight.

#210 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 10:39 AM | Reply

"And if this Rand Paul you would give him a pass?"

Simple question, amid all the deflections:

Do you see a difference between what Franken did and what Moore did?

#211 | Posted by Danforth at 2017-11-17 10:41 AM | Reply

Ridiculous. One man preyed on children repeatedly, the other did things which were wrong and crude but not repetitions nor with children. Never mind that Franken was on a comedy tour, trying to be funny, cuz that's what you do on a comedy tour. Things sometimes go over the top in comedy, Moore was not on a comedy tour and it is never funny when it involves children.
#205 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2017-11-17 10:29 AM | FLAG:

"Ridiculous" seems a little harsh. :)

I agree Franken has some mitigating factors in his favor -- his swift apology, his role as a comedian -- whereas Moore does not. But taking the woman at her word (in other words, not counting Franken's response), you have a man forcing a French kiss on her without her consent. That's serious business, as I see it.

#212 | Posted by cbob at 2017-11-17 10:45 AM | Reply

And if this Rand Paul you would give him a pass? Riiiight.

#210 | POSTED BY FISHPAW

And if this were Donald Trump, you'd make him President, right? Oh wait, you did.

Also, didn't we all agree what Franken did was wrong and agree there should be an ethics investigation?

Get back on your meds, troll.

#213 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 10:46 AM | Reply

Simple question, amid all the deflections:
Do you see a difference between what Franken did and what Moore did?

#211 | POSTED BY DANFORTH AT 2017-11-17 10:41 AM | REPLY |

Part 2: Do you see the difference between what Franken is doing now and what Moore is doing now?

#214 | Posted by hatter5183 at 2017-11-17 10:46 AM | Reply

"And if this Rand Paul you would give him a pass? Riiiight."

If Paul had been a comedienne on comedy tour, I think people would.

#215 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 10:46 AM | Reply

I do, as I have said all along I think Moore is a creep and I don't doubt that he is a perv. My issue with the left is they automatically give Dems a pass on what Franken did but if it was a Repub they would be screaming for his resignation. They are already saying that Franken's accuser had it coming. Can you see the hypocrisy?

#216 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 10:47 AM | Reply

comedienne = comedian (!)

#217 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 10:47 AM | Reply

#215 There is no way that would happen and you know it.

#218 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 10:48 AM | Reply

"But taking the woman at her word (in other words, not counting Franken's response), you have a man forcing a French kiss on her without her consent. That's serious business, as I see it."

For which Franken took responsibility, apologized and had his apology accepted by the woman in question. Moore? Not so much.

#219 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 10:49 AM | Reply

"But taking the woman at her word (in other words, not counting Franken's response), you have a man forcing a French kiss on her without her consent. That's serious business, as I see it."

I've been saying this for weeks--the new rule shouldn't be: We must take every woman's word for it. That's as stupid as the old rule: All women who come forward are liars. Don't the guys get to tell their side of the story? They should.

#220 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 10:51 AM | Reply

#219 Again not comparing this to Moore, already said and have said all along he is a creep, but if Franken was a Repub, even if he apologized you would be calling for his head and anyone who has read your posts over the years can't doubt me.

#221 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 10:53 AM | Reply

"There is no way that would happen and you know it."

I hope some people, on both sides of the aisle, would use the same standard.

#222 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 10:53 AM | Reply

"My issue with the left is they automatically give Dems a pass on what Franken did but if it was a Repub they would be screaming for his resignation."

No one here gave Franken a "pass." Now explain your support for Senator Diaper Vitter, Newt (affair while prosecuting Bill Clinton) Gingrich, President H.B. Bush grabbing asses, etc. Your statement flies in the face of your own willingness to accept misbehavior by Republicans repeatedly while pretending shock whenever a Democrat does something wrong. Makes you the poster boy for "hypocrite."

#223 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 10:53 AM | Reply

Hey, speaking of politicians getting caught with their pants down, here's a new one:

An anti-gay state legislator in Ohio, a strong supporter of the one man-one woman traditional family, has just resigned after being spied getting it on with a man at the office.
www.msn.com

#224 | Posted by cbob at 2017-11-17 10:53 AM | Reply

"My issue with the left is they automatically give Dems a pass on what Franken did but if it was a Repub they would be screaming for his resignation."

Your "issues" obviously go deeper than that.

Franken apologized and is willing to to cooperate with an ethics probe and we are willing to accept the outcome.

Roy Moore?

Not so much. Are you really not capable of seeing the difference?

#225 | Posted by donnerboy at 2017-11-17 10:54 AM | Reply

#223 Don't be shy about the hypocrite label Danni, Clinton is your idol and we don't need to go over what he did.

#226 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 10:55 AM | Reply

#225 see #221

#227 | Posted by fishpaw at 2017-11-17 10:56 AM | Reply

No one here gave Franken a "pass." - Danni

Perhaps you didn't read the whole thread, many of your counterparts were contending it was just a "joke" .... nothing to see ...

Now explain your support for Senator Diaper Vitter, Newt (affair while prosecuting Bill Clinton) Gingrich, President H.B. Bush grabbing asses, etc.

I don't support them, nor the actions, if they victims went public at the time I would have called them out.

I do though consider coming forward during a political campaign suspect, for D or R.

#228 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2017-11-17 10:58 AM | Reply

#219 Again not comparing this to Moore, already said and have said all along he is a creep, but if Franken was a Repub, even if he apologized you would be calling for his head and anyone who has read your posts over the years can't doubt me.

#221 | POSTED BY FISHPAW

You say that...and yet its never ever happened.

And never would. Republicans don't apologize for this kind of stuff or agree they should have an ethics investigation.

You like to say a lot of things that have never happened.

And lets be honest, if Franken was a Republican, he'd be 15 accusers away from you guys making him president.

#229 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 10:59 AM | Reply

IMHO Franken, Moore and the rest should be prosecuted for any crimes uncovered whether they admit, apologize, or anything else.

Nobody gets a pass.

That being said, as in any case when it comes time to sentence the judge will look at many things including the attitude of the offender.

A person denying and minimizing will get and deserves a longer sentence than someone who admits, apologizes and offers recompense

#230 | Posted by hatter5183 at 2017-11-17 11:05 AM | Reply

"And lets be honest, if Franken was a Republican, he'd be 15 accusers away from you guys making him president." Like Bill?

#231 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-17 11:05 AM | Reply

#224 Also a good reminder for me that not all of the accusers who come forward are women. Sometimes it's he said/he said.

#232 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 11:09 AM | Reply

"And lets be honest, if Franken was a Republican, he'd be 15 accusers away from you guys making him president." Like Bill?

#231 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

You mean two accusers with stories that didn't come out until his second term, no corroboration, and even prosecutors didn't think there was credibility?

Want to try again?

#233 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 11:10 AM | Reply

For what it is worth, I want Franken out of the senate. I don't want explanations, analogies or comparisons about relative levels of bad behavior. Laying your hands on a much younger teenager in a sexual manner morally disqualifies a person from political higher office. IMO.

#234 | Posted by moder8 at 2017-11-17 11:23 AM | Reply

""And lets be honest, if Franken was a Republican, he'd be 15 accusers away from you guys making him president." Like Bill?"

Clinton had a consensual sexual relationship with an adult. Are you pretending that is the same thing as a Disrtict Attorney having a relationship with 14 year old? Franken did rude things too, but also with an adult and also within the context of a comedy tour, is that comparable to Moore's desire to molest teenagers?

#235 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 11:24 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Sycophant you're becoming confused from having spin and pivot so much in the last couple of days.

#236 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-17 11:27 AM | Reply

"Laying your hands on a much younger teenager in a sexual manner morally disqualifies a person from political higher office. IMO."

Franken isn't even being accused of touching a teenager.

#237 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 11:27 AM | Reply

Danni you are ignoring the binder full of women that accused Bill of harassment.

#238 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-17 11:29 AM | Reply

Laying your hands on a much younger teenager in a sexual manner morally disqualifies a person from political higher office.

Alas, if one in not required to release tax returns it's highly unlikely it will be ever be required to release molesting history.

#239 | Posted by REDIAL at 2017-11-17 11:38 AM | Reply

Sycophant you're becoming confused from having spin and pivot so much in the last couple of days.

#236 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

No, I think you are getting concussions from the hardcore deflections you keep throwing up.

Franken: 1 woman. A kiss and fake ---- grab. Apologized. Agreed to ethics committee. Dems come down hard on him.

Clinton: 2 women. No corroboration. Not credible according to prosecutors. Second term. Was impeached.

Trump: Admits on tape that he just grabs women. Multiple accusers. During campaign. Becomes president.

Moore: Underage girls. Band from a mall. Still in the race.

#240 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 11:43 AM | Reply

banned rather

#241 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 11:47 AM | Reply

I love how the standard of evidence and willingness to overlook accusations is dependent on the party of the accused.

#242 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-17 11:52 AM | Reply

#240 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

You forgot Trump: Underage girls also.

#243 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2017-11-17 11:57 AM | Reply

I love how the standard of evidence and willingness to overlook accusations is dependent on the party of the accused.
#242 | POSTED BY VISITOR

If you have an (R) next to your name, you can get away with anything.

#244 | Posted by IndianaJones at 2017-11-17 11:57 AM | Reply

I love how the standard of evidence and willingness to overlook accusations is dependent on the party of the accused.

#242 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

Really? Are you sure? Because we'd all love to see the make believe world that came from.

#245 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 12:00 PM | Reply

Ok let's rehearse a kiss does not equal Ok stick your tongue in my mouth. Apparently some people need to be told that based on their posts.

#246 | Posted by Sully at 2017-11-17 12:01 PM | Reply

I love how the standard of evidence and willingness to overlook accusations is dependent on the party of the accused.
#242 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

I think you have to force yourself to believe these things or you can't get away with your political beliefs.

It's actually a bit pathetic.

#247 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 12:02 PM | Reply

"But it doesn't matter, as Franken said he was wrong regardless.
#135 | POSTED BY TONYROMA"

I hear what you are saying, but it does matter. It doesn't make it right, by any stretch, but it matters just like the age of Moore's accusers matters, consensuality matters (did I make up a new word?), and how demented HW was when he grabbed all those assses matters. Though neither is OK, acting like he's grabbing her funbags for a picture is different that grabbing her funbags. It just is.

#248 | Posted by mOntecOre at 2017-11-17 12:15 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Danni you are ignoring the binder full of women that accused Bill of harassment."

No, I'm not ignoring anything but you are ignoring Trump's bragging about assaulting women and his behavior at the Miss Universe contest in Moscow. Or, inyour mind, is it ok for a middle aged man to walk in unannounced into the dressing rooms when young women are naked or in other stages of getting dressed? And then later brag about it on air with Howard Stern? The last man on Earth who should criticize Al Franken would be Donald Trump, it's simply ridiculous. What do you have to say about that Visitor?

#249 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 12:21 PM | Reply

248

agreed. while both being wrong...one is way worse than the other and any attempt to equalize them is just partisan hackery.

#250 | Posted by eberly at 2017-11-17 12:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Really? Are you sure? Because we'd all love to see the make believe world that came from.
#245 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

It's not make believe that many have rushed to defend Franken, or at the very least, minimize his behavior.
Hopefully, this new awareness of sexual assault will out everyone abusing their power over others.

There should be a non-partisan effort to root these people out of every crack and crevice of society.

#251 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-17 12:40 PM | Reply

Really? Are you sure? Because we'd all love to see the make believe world that came from.
#245 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT
It's not make believe that many have rushed to defend Franken, or at the very least, minimize his behavior.
#251 | POSTED BY SHEEPLESCHISM

Who? The Dem Senate already came down hard and demanded an ethics investigation. Franken himself immediately apologized and said an ethics investigation is necessary.

It moved so fast the media couldn't even keep up.

So do tell us who this big group that rushed defend Franken are?

#252 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 12:47 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Gal you have sunk to new lows.......

#180 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

Says Miss Sex Adviser who has told us here all about her exploits pulling women's hair because it turns them on.

#253 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-17 01:02 PM | Reply

I love how the standard of evidence and willingness to overlook accusations is dependent on the party of the accused.

#242 | POSTED BY VISITOR_ AT 2017-11-17 11:52 AM | REPLY

More dependent on the political party of the observer.

Most of the liberal leaning DR posters say both Franken and Moore are bad although there are differences based on what they did, who they did it to, and how they are responding to the accusations

Most of the right leaning DR posters are crucifying Franken while giving Trump and Moore a pass

#254 | Posted by hatter5183 at 2017-11-17 01:08 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

So do tell us who this big group that rushed defend Franken are?
#252 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT

Maybe you missed Han's fake moon landing evidence.

#255 | Posted by SheepleSchism at 2017-11-17 01:09 PM | Reply

So do tell us who this big group that rushed defend Franken are?
#252 | POSTED BY SYCOPHANT
Maybe you missed Han's fake moon landing evidence.
#255 | POSTED BY SHEEPLESCHISM

You mean where he literally stated a FACT that Franken wasn't touching her but otherwise doesn't defend Franken's behavior in the slightest and agrees its wrong?

No. Unlike you, I know how to read apparently.

#256 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 01:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"There should be a non-partisan effort to root these people out of every crack and crevice of society."

I think we should teach them that this type of behavior is unacceptable. We should all be honest about it though, our society has winked and nodded about things like this forever, I don't condone the behavior of many men but I also don't pretend that they weren't raised in a world where guys were allowed to get away with this bad behavior by society.

#257 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 01:42 PM | Reply

What do you have to say about that Visitor? I say that by applying a low standard such as "more likely than not" Trump, Clinton, Moore and Franken are skeevy and aren't worthy of office. Only now that Clinton is no longer seeking office do his offences seem to offend. Trump's offences were known prior to his election and he was elected anyway. Moore's offenses are being made now so the voters have a chance to weigh in. I don't know if Franken's offenses were known before his election, but pictures are hard to ignore.

#258 | Posted by visitor_ at 2017-11-17 01:43 PM | Reply

What do you have to say about that Visitor? I say that by applying a low standard such as "more likely than not" Trump, Clinton, Moore and Franken are skeevy and aren't worthy of office. Only now that Clinton is no longer seeking office do his offences seem to offend. Trump's offences were known prior to his election and he was elected anyway. Moore's offenses are being made now so the voters have a chance to weigh in. I don't know if Franken's offenses were known before his election, but pictures are hard to ignore.

#258 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

Funny. You don't seem to ever post on threads calling out Trump...

#259 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 01:56 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

I think we should teach them that this type of behavior is unacceptable.

#257 | POSTED BY DANNI

Here's the issue: Franken knows what he did was wrong. Trump and Moore know that what their accusers did was wrong.

#260 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 01:57 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#254 | POSTED BY HATTER5183

Yup. Exactly.

#261 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2017-11-17 02:02 PM | Reply

" I don't know if Franken's offenses were known before his election, but pictures are hard to ignore."

And the rest of us can see through your false equivalency, Franken was wrong and he admitted it and apologized and then his victim accepted his apology. His victim was not a teenager. Moore hasn't acknowledged his behavior, hasn't apologized and his victims were teenagers.

#262 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-17 02:17 PM | Reply

" I don't know if Franken's offenses were known before his election, but pictures are hard to ignore."
And the rest of us can see through your false equivalency, Franken was wrong and he admitted it and apologized and then his victim accepted his apology. His victim was not a teenager. Moore hasn't acknowledged his behavior, hasn't apologized and his victims were teenagers.

#262 | POSTED BY DANNI

Yes but Moore is a Republican so its okay. Duh.

#263 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 02:45 PM | Reply

I hear what you are saying, but it does matter. It doesn't make it right, by any stretch, but it matters just like the age of Moore's accusers matters, consensuality matters (did I make up a new word?), and how demented HW was when he grabbed all those assses matters. Though neither is OK, acting like he's grabbing her funbags for a picture is different that grabbing her funbags. It just is.

Yes.

#264 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 02:52 PM | Reply

In Minnesota, Franken feels heat -- but no broad call to quit

www.msn.com -- -but-no-broad-call-to-quit/ar-BBF4sEr?ocid=spartandhp

#265 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 04:35 PM | Reply

After Al Franken and Roy Moore, We Are Dangerously Close to Botching the #MeToo Moment

Just as society begins to open its eyes, two prominent cases threaten to severely complicate matters.

Right now, the court of public opinion is faced with the awkward task of assigning degrees of severity to sexual misconduct, because, while they all cause harm, they don't all cause the same amount of harm and thus don't merit the same punishment.

www.thedailybeast.com

#266 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 04:50 PM | Reply

"...the court of public opinion is faced with the awkward task of assigning degrees of severity to sexual misconduct, because, while they all cause harm, they don't all cause the same amount of harm and thus don't merit the same punishment." - #266 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 04:50 PM

We've actually seen a dilemma like this before manifested in zero tolerance in the so-called War on Drugs.

A joint for personal consumption and a kilo of coke for distribution were looked at the same. With the same punishment: "lock 'em up and throw away the key."

#267 | Posted by Hans at 2017-11-17 04:56 PM | Reply

This article was pubished 11/13/17, and here we are:

Breitbart's Coming Exploitation of the Believe Women Movement

Unfolding against the backdrop of the post-Weinstein revolution, the Moore scandal exposes the conservative propaganda machine in the ugliest and most discrediting possible fashion. But these cultural changes are all but destined to collide with one another in the opposite direction, in a way that exploits both the beneficence of the "believe women" campaign, and the even-handedness of the mainstream media. It is a collision we as a political culture are not equipped to handle, the consequences of which are almost too awful to contemplate.

Imagine it's September or October 2020, and out of nowhere multiple women accuse the Democratic presidential nominee of sexual abuse, but instead of surfacing in a meticulously sourced story in a news outlet with a healthy tradition of careful reporting, it runs in a blind item on Breitbart.com. Or imagine such a story about a current Democratic candidate or leader landed in such an outlet tomorrow.

crooked.com

#268 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 05:13 PM | Reply

#268 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY

Here's the problem: defamation suit.

Ask Gawker.

#269 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 05:26 PM | Reply

In an October surprise, there wouldn't be enough time for someone to file a defamation suit and have it heard in court before the election. After the election, the women could always change their stories, which would not have been told under oath in the first place.

#270 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2017-11-17 05:30 PM | Reply

Here's the problem: defamation suit.

Ask Gawker.

Bigger problem: prior restraint.

Ask Bollea.

#272 | Posted by et_al at 2017-11-17 06:29 PM | Reply

Problem is Franken always has a moronic look on his face and has a reputation for being an ----- to anyone who is below him.

This is BS. Franken has a good reputation among staff and other people who deal with him regularly.

#273 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-17 07:10 PM | Reply

Funny ------- pic PC sez act indignant.

Pretending to grab ----- and making a "honk honk" gesture stops being funny after you're 12. Franken was an idiot to make that joke even when he wasn't in politics.

#274 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-17 07:13 PM | Reply

What part of being a Playboy model makes sexual assualt acceptable.

Nothing, but Playboy is full of risque humor that could be portrayed as offensive later on -- especially if it became dragged into politics.

The kissing skit that Franken and Tweeden performed sounds like an attempt at mildly risque humor to amuse troops.

#275 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-17 07:16 PM | Reply

Pretending to grab ----- and making a "honk honk" gesture stops being funny after you're 12. Franken was an idiot to make that joke even when he wasn't in politics.

#274 | Posted by rcade

Yes but foolish idiocy and aggressive sexual perversion are not the same thing.

REpubs are desperate to distract from the fact that they are now officially supporting a child molester and they are trying to act as if this is even in the same ballpark.

#276 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2017-11-17 07:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

By now I hope you guys have realize the real issue this poses for Republicans.With Franken apologizing immediately and agreeing to an ethics investigation, there's really nothing more to report. So it's basically out of the news. The distraction is over. Already.

#277 | Posted by Sycophant at 2017-11-17 10:12 PM | Reply

"After Al Franken and Roy Moore, We Are Dangerously Close to Botching the #MeToo Moment"

Uhhh...Franken is a comedian by trade. Someone who makes money by doing things that people may interpret as being humorous. Maybe Franken was trying to find a way to nail Tweeden, but there's nothing that really suggests to me that Franken is a creeper.

Roy Moore is banned from malls. Regardless of politics, think just how creepy that is. There's really no comparison between the two.

I've spent the last several days with family visiting from Idaho, making jokes about how my 2 year old niece is safe from creepos...because we don't live in Alabama...and we don't hang around with judges.

#278 | Posted by madbomber at 2017-11-17 11:45 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

#278

NW

#279 | Posted by Corky at 2017-11-18 12:05 AM | Reply

"After Al Franken and Roy Moore, We Are Dangerously Close to Botching the #MeToo Moment"
-----
Uhhh...Franken is a comedian by trade. Someone who makes money by doing things that people may interpret as being humorous. Maybe Franken was trying to find a way to nail Tweeden, but there's nothing that really suggests to me that Franken is a creeper.
Roy Moore is banned from malls. Regardless of politics, think just how creepy that is. There's really no comparison between the two.
I've spent the last several days with family visiting from Idaho, making jokes about how my 2 year old niece is safe from creepos...because we don't live in Alabama...and we don't hang around with judges.

#278 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER AT 2017-11-17 11:45 PM |

I'm giving this a NW. I reproduced it because it bears repeating.

#280 | Posted by JeffJ at 2017-11-18 12:58 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Here's the problem: defamation suit.
Ask Gawker."

Gawker was worth millions, these women appear to be just average people. Roy Moore isn't going to sue anyone, he knows it but the threat is what he pretends is a defense of his character. It will only fool those who want to be fooled.

#281 | Posted by danni at 2017-11-18 09:33 AM | Reply

Maybe Franken was trying to find a way to nail Tweeden ...

I don't think he was. Franken has spoken and written often about his USO Tour participation. He loves the organization and the incident seems more like an attempt at comedy that went awry than anything else.

(It's still offensive, before anyone claims I'm making excuses for it.)

#282 | Posted by rcade at 2017-11-18 01:07 PM | Reply

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