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Tuesday, April 18, 2017

I have recently purchased a condo in another part of the state. I have been with my company for over 20 years. I make good money and bonuses. The only contract I have is a non compete within 110 miles and that won't be an issue.

If I give a months notice and they let me go immediately (happens all the time for a variety of reasons) I lose out on a months pay & bonuses. I would like to give a months notice, it will take that long to explain what I do here.

Or I could give 2 weeks notice and if they say let's part ways today I only lose 2 weeks pay & bonuses, not a month's worth.

I also have 180 hours of comp time, fight for it or just chalk it up to being lost? Using that comp time now is impossible due to the time of year it is, business related.

Thoughts?

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If you are so sure they'll let you go immediately, why not wait a month and give a month's notice the day before you expect them to let you go?

I don't give good advice regarding employment, as I am young, unmarried and still have the habit of acting impulsively.

#1 | Posted by pumpkinhead at 2017-04-18 11:07 AM | Reply

I am not sure they would. And it would be nothing personal. It happens to prevent theft of client database, classified information, etc.

#2 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2017-04-18 11:12 AM | Reply

Game Theory time.

The best answer is to give zero notice. If you give notice and get walked, or give no notice and just quit, the end result is the exact same. Unless you absolutely need the reference from somebody in this company that would be adversely effected by an instant departure, there is no benefit to putting in notice. Write off the comp time.

#3 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2017-04-18 11:19 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

long story short. just quitting in a month = money. putting in notice = no money. absent other circumstances, it's an easy choice.

#4 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2017-04-18 11:20 AM | Reply

I don't know Gracie, that's a tough one. I signed a non compete that covers three states on the Gulf coast. I have 160 hours of comp time and I got that in writing - they must pay me when I leave, I'd fight for that if it's even up for grabs.

I'm not an old wise geezer, I'm 47 but I've learned a thing or two. The first thing I tell people about job changing is this: It's just business decision you have to make. Take everything else out of it and it makes it so much easier.

Sorry I couldn't help more.

#5 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2017-04-18 11:20 AM | Reply

Are you flexible enough you can prepare for both contingencies? IE give 30 day notice and be prepared to walk that day. Be surprised that they want you to stay the 30 days and then stay?
I take it the comp time is 'gentlepersons' agreement, not in the contract?

#6 | Posted by mattm at 2017-04-18 11:22 AM | Reply

Sounds like you are trying to game the system? I don't mean that negatively, you are going for the most I presume?

I suggest not burning bridges and go with what is "traditional" for your position. Someone with 20 years experience I think the tradition would be 4 weeks notice.

From their perspective there are pluses and minuses to letting you stay. They get productivity and training for your replacement OTOH they risk you stealing clients, info etc.

So try negotiating the exit with them, give them assurances you wont "steal" info, see if there is a way to assure them on that matter.

#7 | Posted by truthhurts at 2017-04-18 11:32 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"The best answer is to give zero notice. If you give notice and get walked, or give no notice and just quit, the end result is the exact same. Unless you absolutely need the reference from somebody in this company that would be adversely effected by an instant departure, there is no benefit to putting in notice. Write off the comp time."

Agreed. The "courtesy" of giving notice is --------. Companies (to put this bluntly) do not deserve notice anymore.

They reserve the right to terminate you immediately if you attempt to give notice.....and that throws the obligation to give notice out the window.

If the company feels keeping you around is a risk or a problem then they make a business decision to let you go immediately.

YOU have to make the same business decision.

Give up the comp time.....I know that sucks but its business. Perhaps use that as a bargaining tool at new employer??

#8 | Posted by eberly at 2017-04-18 11:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#6 Yes. I paid for the condo in cash. Other then HOA fees & utilities, I have enough in the bank to not work for a year. And yes, comp time here is not recorded as in they owe me, I just keep time records for myself.

My thinking is that after 20+ years I really don't need a recommendation, anything negative would look petty on their part.

#9 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2017-04-18 11:34 AM | Reply

Be very cautious about accepting advice from people who are not intimately familiar with your personal financial situation. General advice usually doesn't cut it when it comes to big financial decisions. Shell out a little bit for a financial advisor who you trust. (I mean seriously, can you see following the financial advice of people like AFKABL2, Boaz, Corky or me?)

#10 | Posted by moder8 at 2017-04-18 11:37 AM | Reply

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Maybe there's a third option. Have you thought about the possibility of continuing your employment from a new location? More and more people telework. If you tossed them a bone and said you'd take a small pay cut to offset the cost of the company paying for the telework connection, they might prefer to keep you in a limited capacity instead of losing you entirely. You could use the extra time to wean them off while searching for something else in your new area.

#11 | Posted by MUSTANG at 2017-04-18 11:37 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

I assumed you had another job lined up......if you do, then take my advice. If you don't....then that might change things.....perhaps attempt to do what Mustang suggested in #11 or what Truthurts said in #7.

IOW, be a little more gracious.

#12 | Posted by eberly at 2017-04-18 11:41 AM | Reply

Financial decisions are the small part of it really. It's the giving notice and how much is the larger issue. The last time I looked for a job was 22 years ago and I was working and recruited for this one. Two weeks notice was mandatory back in the day, it spoke of your character.

#13 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2017-04-18 11:41 AM | Reply

#11 That is exactly what I was thinking. Thank you for making sense of my thoughts.

#14 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2017-04-18 11:42 AM | Reply


Bottom line, in my view...

You know your company better than anyone here, and I'm sure you have a gut feel how they would handle your notice to leave.

Some other items that come to mind, how soon can someone new be hired? Would it be worth having to around to help train, if the newbie could be hired before your month is out? If so, then that could help you get the full month.

But the bottom line, is, you know your company better than anyone here...

#15 | Posted by LampLighter at 2017-04-18 01:24 PM | Reply

Obviously you don't want to burn bridges and want to transition out amicably. Having said that, you've got to look out for yourself first. I wouldn't take the risk of lost income and other lost perks by taking the high-road.

#16 | Posted by JeffJ at 2017-04-18 01:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

People worry about how many weeks to give employers and the ramifications of not giving any.

Employers don't give a ---- about employees when they "right size" them.

The answer is plain as day.

#17 | Posted by 726 at 2017-04-18 01:35 PM | Reply

"comp time here is not recorded as in they owe me, I just keep time records for myself."

Gracie, you are probably screwed on the comp time since that's the case.

I've only worked 3 different jobs. In college I worked 2 years at a screen printing company, then I worked 6 as an RN at a hospital and I have been in my current job for 18 years. I gave both the hospital and even the screen printing job the courtesy of a notice.

Only you know your current workplace environment better than anyone else. If you think they will cut you the day you give your notice, DON'T give them the courtesy of a notice. If you think they will honor your 30 day or 2 week notice, then give them that notice.

Loyalty goes both ways regardless of if it's your job or a business you frequent. If you don't believe they will be loyal to you, then you have no obligation to be loyal to them.

#18 | Posted by jamesgelliott at 2017-04-18 02:09 PM | Reply

I would say, unless you are retiring and will not be working again, be amicable.

I know in my field of IT, everyone knows everyone and you don't know who knows who.

You don't want your exit over-shadowing your character over 20+ years of faithful work...

#19 | Posted by boaz at 2017-04-18 02:42 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I only have a handful of years of professional experience, but I'd do everything to exit gracefully, but I value work networking and having any previous employer available as high quality reference.
Your old geographic location isn't too far from your new one.

#20 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2017-04-18 03:17 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

(I mean seriously, can you see following the financial advice of people like AFKABL2, Boaz, Corky or me?)

#10 | Posted by moder8 at 2017-04-18 11:37 AM | Reply | Flag:

HEEEEYYYY !!

ahahaaa......

#21 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2017-04-18 04:05 PM | Reply

do the right thing. right follows right.

when can you claim the comp time?

#22 | Posted by ichiro at 2017-04-18 04:28 PM | Reply

there is no benefit to putting in notice

----

Yes, there is. It's called respect.

#23 | Posted by Pirate at 2017-04-18 04:45 PM | Reply

But if you do like the job and if it's possible, do try to see if you can work remote. My company let me work from home when I moved from NC to Illinois.

#24 | Posted by Pirate at 2017-04-18 04:52 PM | Reply

Okay this is what I have decided, please comment add or suggest deleting some.

This company has been extremely generous and kind to me. I understand why some companies cut people loose as soon as they give intent to resign. It's business not personal.

I'm going to give one month's notice. I am going to ask for in addition one month's severance pay with regards to the comp time (they know I earned it but are not required to pay it). I'm going to offer to work remotely part time for up to 8 weeks from Jacksonville to handle media issues, answer and or resolve things that were pending when I left and help with my replacement to ease him/her into my position. And be available after that on a consultation bases, rate TBD be it remotely or having to appear in person.

I of course will put this in writing and provide to future employment prospects if needed.

Yea or Na?

#25 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2017-04-18 05:52 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Sounds like lots if state laws may or may not be violated if they don't pay you what you're owed. I've never known an employer to not pay out accrued comp time.

#26 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-04-18 05:57 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Jesus Christ, Gracie.

Quit your job and start collecting welfare.

Or don't.

Whatever.

#27 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-04-18 05:57 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Clown the nail salon does not take EPT cards. How the f--k will I get pedicures?

#28 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2017-04-18 06:04 PM | Reply

Hire Boaz.

He'll suck on your toes till they sparkle.

#29 | Posted by ClownShack at 2017-04-18 06:05 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

That sounds smart. I am friends with my boss and would never quit without notice (we are a relatively small company) and I would need him as an excellent character and professional reference if I ever did decide to quit (which wont be happening).

Handle your separation as amicably as possible and you will be rewarded.

#30 | Posted by HeliumRat at 2017-04-18 06:05 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#26 Snoofy: I have, when I worked for Titlewave, a company that handled government documents. The company was run by a fundamentalist preacher who once told me "all that stuff is fine for Sunday school, but it has no place in the real world." That in response to why I asked him why he treated people like dirt when he was supposed to be a man of God.

Be careful who you work for.

#31 | Posted by HeliumRat at 2017-04-18 06:11 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Why would they have to hire someone to replace you. Surely a fellow employee has been dying to step up to the plate. 2 weeks is plenty. And I'm sure you're going to get one helluva party.

#32 | Posted by bruceaz at 2017-04-18 06:46 PM | Reply

I someone gives us 2 weeks notice we usually just pay them the 2 weeks and let them be on their way.

#33 | Posted by REDIAL at 2017-04-18 07:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Give as little notice as possible if they will do this.

Just tell them you hate to do it, but you don't really have a choice. Don't tell them that they are the ones who took away your choice, it's none of their business.

#34 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2017-04-18 07:28 PM | Reply

"Be careful who you work for."

Work
???

#35 | Posted by snoofy at 2017-04-18 10:02 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Activity involving mental or physical effort done in order to achieve a purpose or result, comrade Snoofy.

#36 | Posted by HeliumRat at 2017-04-18 10:17 PM | Reply

Gravy,

Here's the way I've done it. (I am prepared to leave that day, if needed).

Me; 'uhm, Bob, I am leaving and going to work for our competitor. I would love to help you make this easier by working with you to train my replacement or whatever. I like you and don't want to hurt you, therefore, I can offer you up to 2 weeks of time, if that will be helpful to you.' If you put it that way, they will feel you are being trustworthy and will ask you to help with the transition. Usually a 2 week notice is required to activate separation policy, but it varies.

Sometimes, depending on the circumstances, the quitting person immediately becomes a security risk. Many companies will pay you the severance and make you leave immediately (sometimes without even packing your personal box).

On secure projects, you announce you are quitting and within 5 minutes you are on the other side of a locked door and your computer account is locked and they tell you ato stop be the desk tomorrow to pick you your personal box.

is it policy that they will pay you for the comp time if you don't use it? If not, use it before you quit.

why is missing one month's bonus so important? You are about to lose all the bonuses forever.

#37 | Posted by kudzu at 2017-04-19 08:12 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"You know, when I started here 20 years ago, I thought it would just be a temporary job. That's the way things seem to be these days. You find an opportunity, milk it for all you can for a year or three, then move on. But I just fell in love with the place. This company has been like a family to me. And I'm really proud of the work we've done here.

But it's time to be moving on, I'm very sorry to say. I hope to make a change soon, maybe 30 days or so. But this may be an inconvenience for you, to find others to do my work. So I'm very happy to stay on for a while longer to help them with the transition, so that it's as smooth as possible for everyone. There is also some comp time I've banked, but since nothing is really in writing there, I've no hard feelings about it.

I also wanted to say how much I've really enjoyed working for you. You've been a great example for me, and I've always felt that you were very fair, and honest. It was a pleasure to be part of your group here, and I deeply appreciate the opportunity you gave me to have a good career here."

#38 | Posted by WhiteDevil at 2017-04-19 11:49 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Gracie, a lot of this depends on what State you are in, some are more aggressive in enforcing comp claims by employees (CA) others are very pro-employer (PA). Same thing for non-competes. Same thing goes for whether your non-compete is enforceable.

You really should talk to an employment lawyer in your State as to what your rights are, there are plenty here in CA that take unpaid comp cases on a contingency so a consultation wouldn't cost you anything.

#39 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2017-04-19 12:47 PM | Reply

Both times that I've ever been walked after turning in notice, I still received my pay for the period of time in which I gave my notice for. If they don't pay you for that timeframe then it would technically be a non-voluntary termination and you should be eligible for severance if they offer it and unemployment.

#40 | Posted by johnny_hotsauce at 2017-04-19 02:34 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Is your going away party going to be at hooters?

#41 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2017-04-19 04:53 PM | Reply

anything negative would look petty on their part.

#9 | POSTED BY GRACIEAMAZED

Says the 20 year-plus employee worried about a couple of weeks of comp time.

That's funny.

Serve out your time, give your employer notice, work hard until the last hour of the last day. Go out with style. It's right, and it will pay off.

#42 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2017-04-19 05:17 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"I'm going to give one month's notice. I am going to ask for in addition one month's severance pay with regards to the comp time (they know I earned it but are not required to pay it). I'm going to offer to work remotely part time for up to 8 weeks from Jacksonville to handle media issues, answer and or resolve things that were pending when I left and help with my replacement to ease him/her into my position. And be available after that on a consultation bases, rate TBD be it remotely or having to appear in person. "

They will probably reject your generous offer. My opinion, considering you mention Jacksonville and you are thus in Florida, a right to work state where they can fire you with not even an explanation. What you need to do is whatever it takes to make sure your new employer isn't somehow affected by your former employer which causes your new employer to retract their offer. Other than that, after you make such a generous offer, walk away with your head held high. You were the better person. But make sure your new employer knows about the situation and how hard you are working to resolve all the issues. The thing you want to avoid is to end up unemployed with your former employer giving you a bad reference.

#43 | Posted by danni at 2017-04-20 04:25 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

One reason companies give severance to begin with is because it locks in the 'I won't sue you for any reason' clause that they make you sign.

when you accept the severance money, you agree with the separation clause.

#44 | Posted by kudzu at 2017-04-20 06:30 AM | Reply

I left a job back in the nineties, gave them about a months notice as I recall. I offered to train the person replacing me in a pretty technical position, the incoming person who was transferring from another department rejected my offer of training saying she could just figure it out. Heard through the grape fine not long after that she and my former assistant were both fired and walked off the premises because neither of them had the common sense to back up a catalog that took three people one year to create. They accidentally deleted the entire thing and didn't have a backup. When I was there we backed up religiously every Friday afternoon and then the tape (I now I'm dating myself) was taken off premises to insure that, no matter what, we retained that data. My point is just that some employers will tell you they don't need a month's notice, that nothing you do that is so hard that someone new can't just come in and do. Usually, they are so completely wrong. In my experience most employers who hire people in technical positions don't really even understand what we do.

#45 | Posted by danni at 2017-04-20 08:15 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

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