Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Thursday, July 17, 2014

A Malaysian passenger airliner with 295 people on board crashed in Ukraine near the Russian border on Thursday, the Interfax news agency cited an aviation industry source as saying. The plane was brought down by a Buk ground-to-air missile, the agency reported. It was flying over a region of military action where Ukrainian government forces are battling pro-Russian separatists.

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Admin's note: Participants in this discussion must follow the site's moderation policy. Profanity will be filtered. Abusive conduct is not allowed.

FOX is reporting that the plane was possibly shot down. Then again, it's FOX.

#1 | Posted by ness_gadol at 2014-07-17 11:38 AM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Fox News is picking up a live Sky News feed on the incident:

video.foxnews.com

#2 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 11:40 AM | Reply | Flag:

Shot down at 32,000 feet allegedly. Thats no manpad or cannon. That's a vehicle launched SAM or air to air missile.

#3 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-17 11:42 AM | Reply | Flag:

It's confirmed that it was shot down? All I've seen so far seems to be speculation.

#4 | Posted by ness_gadol at 2014-07-17 11:44 AM | Reply | Flag:

Is this the Russian response to the new sanctions announced yesterday?

#5 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 11:44 AM | Reply | Flag:

Calm down. It's fox and sky news. Both sensationalist murdoch lie machines.

Wait for a real news organization to confirm if it was actually shot down.

#6 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 11:44 AM | Reply | Flag:

Bad link. Here's a better one to watch Sky News:

www.livestation.com

#7 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 11:46 AM | Reply | Flag:

Wow. This is big. I remember when the US accidentally shot down an Iranian civilian airplane. Huge deal. There will be repercussions. The world just got a little bit less stable.

#8 | Posted by moder8 at 2014-07-17 11:48 AM | Reply | Flag:

So Ness & SS: When the reports are confirmed, will you finally admit you are clueless idiots?

#9 | Posted by justanoversight at 2014-07-17 11:56 AM | Reply | Flag:

Anyone taking bets on how long it will take for CNN to have a full 3-D holographic simulation?

#10 | Posted by ness_gadol at 2014-07-17 11:57 AM | Reply | Flag:

It was probably shot down by Ukranian Nazis, our friends.

#11 | Posted by nullifidian at 2014-07-17 11:57 AM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

Madness takes its toll.

#12 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 11:57 AM | Reply | Flag:

Wow. This is big. I remember when the US accidentally shot down an Iranian civilian airplane. Huge deal. There will be repercussions. The world just got a little bit less stable.

#8 | POSTED BY MODER8 AT 2014-07-17 11:48 AM | FLAG:

Huge deal? Not really. An air passenger aircraft is shot down about every 3 years.

In fact, if Ukraine did this, and they have the capability, it would not even be their first time. They shot down a Siberian aircraft in the early 2000s.

#13 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-17 11:59 AM | Reply | Flag:

Malaysian airplanes do seem to be dropping like flies as of late...

#14 | Posted by moder8 at 2014-07-17 11:59 AM | Reply | Flag:

Probably a case of mistaken identity.

Next up: Both sides blame the other for doing it.

#15 | Posted by Sully at 2014-07-17 11:59 AM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 2

Why would a passenger airline fly over a civil war-torn region in which combatants are fighting with surface-to-air missiles?

#16 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 12:00 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 3

#1 | POSTED BY NESS_GADOL

Anton Gerashenko, an adviser to Ukraine's Interior Minister, said on his Facebook page the plane was flying at an altitude of 10,000 meters (33,000 feet) when it was hit by a missile fired from a Buk launcher. A similar launcher was seen by Associated Press journalists near the eastern Ukrainian town of Snizhne earlier Thursday.
bigstory.ap.org

Malaysian airplanes do seem to be dropping like flies as of late...
#14 | POSTED BY MODER8

How do we know they are different planes? ;)

#17 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 12:02 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

Why would a passenger airline fly over a civil war-torn region in which combatants are fighting with surface-to-air missiles?
#16 | POSTED BY RCADE

When I was leaving Milan (MXP) I saw a couple of Ukrainian Airliners and thought the same thing.

But perhaps what is going on over there isn't as intense as reported?

#18 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 12:06 PM | Reply | Flag:

Why would a passenger airline fly over a civil war-torn region in which combatants are fighting with surface-to-air missiles?

#16 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2014-07-17 12:00 PM | FLAG:

Part of it is money. Detouring a 777 is expensive. Flying over "hotspots" is not uncommon.

Practically, the SAMs and cannons the rebels have can not possibly reach an airliner's altitude. The only thing that can are the anti-US-bomber-designed soviet systems Ukraine still uses. You're supposed to check in with ATC, etc, etc, and it's pretty safe. However it only takes a few guys on the ground to get confused and start sending up missiles. Even our highly trained Navy, with the most sophisticated combat radar ever, thought a passenger plane was an attacking F-14 during peacetime.

#19 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-17 12:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

But perhaps what is going on over there isn't as intense as reported?

#18 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

Or perhaps it is and everyone was in denial.

#20 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 12:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

The plane was a Boeing 777.

#21 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 12:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

#11

Hillary's Fault.

#22 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 12:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

Or perhaps it is and everyone was in denial.
#20 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY

This doesn't make sense, "everyone", who is everyone?

Very odd....

Unbelievable: passenger posted just before takeoff: "if it dissapears, this is what it looks like". @zerohedge pic.twitter.com/ew0GWcZHKf -- Lloyd BlankFine (@Lloyds_Casino) July 17, 2014


#23 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 12:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

The plane was a Boeing 777.

Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 12:16 PM | Reply

It sure ain't lucky 7's

#24 | Posted by LarryMohr at 2014-07-17 12:22 PM | Reply | Flag:

Ukraine Government is saying it was a BUK missile from the "Rebels"
Putin is supplying in this case..

#25 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 12:26 PM | Reply | Flag:

Here's a direct link to alleged passenger Cor Pan's photo on Facebook:

www.facebook.com

#26 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 12:28 PM | Reply | Flag:

"John McCain warns of "incredible repercussions" if plane was indeed shot down."

Neocon warmongering from that senile old fossil. Hillary will probably advocate nuking Russia.

#27 | Posted by nullifidian at 2014-07-17 12:29 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Video of crash...... maybe...
www.youtube.com

#28 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 12:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

So Ness & SS: When the reports are confirmed, will you finally admit ...

#9 | Posted by justanoversight

Why should they give you any acknowledgement to the confirmation that you're an -----?

#29 | Posted by Whatsleft at 2014-07-17 12:30 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 3

Hillary will probably advocate nuking Russia.
#27 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

That was the point of the reset button..... :)

Her new slogan, "Is Russia Ready for Hillary?"

#30 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 12:31 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

so how can they tell it is a buk sam defense system that did it?

did they find the unscratched missile at the crash site next to a perpetrator's unscathed passport or something?

#31 | Posted by NerfHerder at 2014-07-17 12:33 PM | Reply | Flag:

im sure in this day and age someone somewhere has a video of the plane crashing, not one of it already crashed...

#32 | Posted by NerfHerder at 2014-07-17 12:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

295 confirmed dead by Ukrainian government.

in.reuters.com

#33 | Posted by ness_gadol at 2014-07-17 12:43 PM | Reply | Flag:

I wonder what Obama will do once he finds out by reading about it the newspaper after finishing his game of golf. I'd hate to be Putin when that happens. That's going to be one sternly worded memo.

#34 | Posted by visitor_ at 2014-07-17 12:50 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 2

Why would a passenger airline fly over a civil war-torn region in which combatants are fighting with surface-to-air missiles?

Simple - ICAO (a UN Agency) designates all flight routes - They do Identify various zones as Combat, War Zones and Conflict Areas.

"War Zones" are areas in which Open Conflict has been declared.

"Combat Zones" are areas in which no formal conflict has been declared but could occur.

"Combat Zones" can be degraded into "Conflict Areas" only if conflicting parties agree (by treaty) that operations against civilian (unmarked) aircraft will not occur. These areas are marked in Solid Yellow with Stripped Red Lines on Navigational charts.

Flying in a conflicted area does not guarantee the safety of the aircraft. ICAO recommends turning on all Navigational Lights, ACARS and monitoring of all Unicomm frequencies while operating in such areas. Check the local air control agency for proper IFF squawk codes being used in these areas.

#35 | Posted by Pegasus at 2014-07-17 12:52 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'll be damned if I ever fly Malaysian.

#36 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 12:54 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Wait for a real news organization to confirm if it was actually shot down.

Well,

I guess you wont be listening to MSNBC or ABC then, right?

#37 | Posted by boaz at 2014-07-17 12:56 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Obama's bubble of tranquility is deflating.

#38 | Posted by Bph320 at 2014-07-17 01:09 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Why would a passenger airline fly over a civil war-torn region in which combatants are fighting with surface-to-air missiles?

#16 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 12:00 PM | Reply | Flag:"

Why indeed?

Obama has alot to answer for on this.

#39 | Posted by Sully at 2014-07-17 01:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

Anderson and Wolf better pack their pajamas. They will be gone for awhile

#40 | Posted by bph320 at 2014-07-17 01:20 PM | Reply | Flag:

I agree with others. There was not yet any confirmation it was shot down or a bomb. Why speculate? Ah...I know the news media does it all the time, but when the public does it the media calls it conspiracy theory.

What are the odds that Malaysian Airlines has (2) 777 go down under mysterious circumstances within 6 months?

#41 | Posted by Robson at 2014-07-17 01:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

"What are the odds that Malaysian Airlines has (2) 777 go down under mysterious circumstances within 6 months?"

Just guessing, 100%.

#42 | Posted by visitor_ at 2014-07-17 01:46 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

In April, the US Federal Aviation Administration warned American airlines to avoid the airspace over the region because it poses the "potential for conflicting air traffic control instructions from Ukrainian and Russian authorities and ... the misidentification of civil aircraft."

#43 | Posted by PunchyPossum at 2014-07-17 01:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

With the possible exception of Islamists, I just don't see any of the factions involved intending to shoot down a commercial passenger aircraft.

Accuse them of sloppy targeting? Yep.

Intent? Highly unlikely. (unless Islamists)

And truth told, even with the most highly trained and best militaries, this sort of thing is inevitable in war. This is why wise people avoid war zones, even at 30000 feet.

#44 | Posted by USAF242 at 2014-07-17 01:51 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Wait for a real news organization to confirm if it was actually shot down.

#6 | Posted by SpeakSoftly

The Whitehouse will confirm a video brought it down on Sunday Morning.

#45 | Posted by wisgod at 2014-07-17 01:53 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 2

Wait for a real news organization to confirm if it was actually shot down.

#6 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 11:44 AM

From CBS:

Anton Gerashenko, an adviser to Ukraine's interior minister, said on his Facebook page the plane was flying at an altitude of 10,000 meters (33,000 feet). He also said it was hit by a missile fired from a Buk launcher, which can fire missiles up to an altitude of 22,000 meters (72,000 feet).

. . .

A launcher similar to the Buk missile system was seen by Associated Press journalists near the eastern Ukrainian town of Snizhne, which is held by pro-Russia rebels, earlier Thursday.

. . .

Pro-Russia rebels, meanwhile, claimed responsibility for strikes Wednesday on two Ukrainian Sukhoi-25 jets. The Ukrainian Defense Ministry said the second jet was hit by a portable surface-to-air missile, but added the pilot was unscathed and managed to land his plane safely.


CBS good enough for you?

#46 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2014-07-17 01:56 PM | Reply | Flag:

More fake news.

Let's spend another month wondering what happened to this Malaysian aircraft.

Only to realize the whole thing was a hoax.

#47 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 01:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

#23 Twitter photo.

That twitter photo (I can only assume was of the exterior or interior of plane by a passenger) and the page is no longer there. Probably typical how such information is removed from public access so the message can be massaged or controlled later, similar to video feeds related to 9-11 and the shoe bomber.

#48 | Posted by Robson at 2014-07-17 01:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm sure that Putin is trembling over the thought of getting a call from Obambi.

#49 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2014-07-17 01:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

Dick Cheney just creamed his Transformer-themed Depends. Word just coming out of Montana: witnesses report seeing an old wrinkly man flapping his arms and demanding a Skype with the Pentagon.

#50 | Posted by DeadSpin at 2014-07-17 01:59 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 3

Wait for a real news organization to confirm if it was actually shot down.
#6 | Posted by SpeakSoftly

The Whitehouse will confirm a video brought it down on Sunday Morning.
#45 | POSTED BY WISGOD AT 2014-07-17 01:53 PM | FLAG:

Is it that video of Mrs Wisgod doing a strip tease?

Cause that would have caused the pilots to become suicidal and crash the plane themselves.

#51 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 02:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

#50 | POSTED BY DEADSPIN AT 2014-07-17 01:59 PM | REPLY | FLAG:

As Obama gives a campaign speech.

Do you think he told Putin, "I'm mad. Really mad. And so is Michelle."

#52 | Posted by RobThomas at 2014-07-17 02:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

Obambi: Well, Vlad, this is going to strain our relationship...

Putin: Этот парень чертовски шутка...

#53 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2014-07-17 02:09 PM | Reply | Flag:

Dick Cheney just creamed his Transformer-themed Depends. Word just coming out of Montana: witnesses report seeing an old wrinkly man flapping his arms and demanding a Skype with the Pentagon.

#50 | POSTED BY DEADSPIN

FUNNY FLAG!

#54 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2014-07-17 02:09 PM | Reply | Flag:

That twitter photo (I can only assume was of the exterior or interior of plane by a passenger) and the page is no longer there. Probably typical how such information is removed from public access so the message can be massaged or controlled later ...

Or the user who posted that tweet deleted it.

The photo is still on social media all over the place. Search for "Cor Pan".

Here's the original on Facebook, which has been shared over 3,000 times:

www.facebook.com

#55 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 02:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

The photos of the wreckage posted on Twitter include some horrifying gore.

#56 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 02:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

#53 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER

FF

I don't think Russians use the pejorative "----" in the same manner we do here, but good attempt anyways!

#57 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2014-07-17 02:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

Malaysian's need crack security agents like our TSA...

It shouldn't be difficult to figure out if a missile brought the plane down. I'm betting one did, and I'm betting it was supplied by the Russians to the rebels. I'm also betting nothing will be done about it, because there isn't a thing that can be done about it.

#58 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 02:12 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 3

" The BUK missile system is thought to be the weapon that downed the Malaysian 777 over Ukraine. FOX News is selling the idea that this system had to be smuggled across the border into Ukraine from Russia but the fact is that prior to the overthrow of Ukraine's elected government by a US-backed junta, Ukraine imported the BUK from Russia and even developed an enhanced radar systems for it which they market to other users of the system. So it is a FACT that the Kiev junta has this weapon.

" At this point I am thinking Kiev shot the 777 down to try to pin on the Russians, then when the wreckage fell short of the border, on the independence fighters in Eastern Ukraine.One other note. Unlike a MANPAD, the BUK requires a full crew to operate, and cannot be launched by a single person. So if indeed the BUK destroyed the plane, it was a deliberate act, whether by intention or (like TWA 800) locking onto the wrong target." Michael Rivero owner of wrh

#59 | Posted by Bani at 2014-07-17 02:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

whether by intention or (like TWA 800) locking onto the wrong target." Michael Rivero owner of wrh

I knew it. TWA 800 was shot down. That recent documentary was very convincing. U.S. military will never admit it, though.

#60 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2014-07-17 02:21 PM | Reply | Flag:

Now I just read 23 Americans were aboard that plane.

#61 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 02:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

Obama says "it looks like a tragedy".

Ya think?

#62 | Posted by bph320 at 2014-07-17 02:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

It's a fake.

Malaysian airlines doesn't even exist.

#63 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 02:34 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 2

"Today, we are all Malaysians"

--John McCain

#64 | Posted by nullifidian at 2014-07-17 02:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

The Whitehouse will confirm a video brought it down on Sunday Morning.

That made me chuckle. Funny flag.

#65 | Posted by ness_gadol at 2014-07-17 02:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

"I once dodged surface to air missile fire"

Hillary Clinton

#66 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 02:53 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

I can't believe Obama really said "it looks like a tragedy".

#67 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 02:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

"My son could have been on that plane."

-- Barack Obama

#68 | Posted by RobThomas at 2014-07-17 02:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm also betting nothing will be done about it, because there isn't a thing that can be done about it.

#58 | Posted by 101Chairborne

Garsh. Gonna have to agree that WE will do nothing.

After all, this IS America.

The Land of Nothing Can be Done.

#69 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 02:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

Donner, Obama isn't even sure if it's a tragedy at this point. So, give him some time. Ok?

#70 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 03:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

"No one could've ever imagined something like this happening"

Condi

#71 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 03:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

So, give him some time. Ok?

#70 | Posted by Dalton

He has 2 minutes.

--John McCain

#72 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 03:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

I dodged Bill's sniper fire, and it hit Monica's blue dress.
-hillzilla

#73 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 03:17 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

This link suggests the flight was off course:

twitter.com

#75 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 03:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

Donner, Obama isn't even sure if it's a tragedy at this point. So, give him some time. Ok?

#70 | POSTED BY DALTON AT 2014-07-17 03:02 PM | FLAG:

How can Obama be sure? This isn't even real news.

You might as well ask Obama how he feels about the death of big foot.

#76 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 03:32 PM | Reply | Flag:

- a US-backed junta

Hilarious.

This was obviously a False --- operation designed by Gomer Pyle.

(i'm a turribel speler)

#77 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 03:32 PM | Reply | Flag:

This whole story is suspect. First and foremost, the only reason any of us have ever even heard of Malaysia is because of a plane they couldn't find. In fact, that plane may just as well have been named "Malaysia" because we can't find that on a map.
-Americans

#78 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 03:37 PM | Reply | Flag:

How can Obama be sure? This isn't even real news.

You might as well ask Obama how he feels about the death of big foot.

#76 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 03:32 PM | Reply | Flag:

You don't think a plane with 300 people on it crashing is a tragedy?

#79 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 03:41 PM | Reply | Flag:

You don't think a plane with 300 people on it crashing is a tragedy?
#79 | POSTED BY DALTON AT 2014-07-17 03:41 PM | FLAG:

"No, it's an opportunity"

~Idiots blaming Obama.

#80 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 03:47 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 4

Who is blaming Obama? Nobody.

I suppose his own spoken words aren't his fault, again?

#81 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 03:50 PM | Reply | Flag:

Not sure of the timing of the word "was".... but...

The eastern part of Ukraine was closed to commercial flights.
www.washingtonpost.com

#82 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 03:51 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

"No, it's an opportunity"
~Idiots blaming Obama.
#80 | POSTED BY CLOWNSHACK

I blame Obama for what he said..... "looks like it may be a terrible tragedy", kind of an odd thing to say..... perhaps he know more?

#83 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 03:53 PM | Reply | Flag:

I suppose his own spoken words aren't his fault, again?

#81 | Posted by 101Chairborne

You meant to say "the twisting of his own words"...didn't ya?

#84 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 03:53 PM | Reply | Flag:

#82

A Malaysian air crew making a flight mistake?

No one could have predicted that.

#85 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 03:54 PM | Reply | Flag:

Malaysian pilot told the passengers he was going to take them over to view the fireworks.

#86 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 03:57 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 2

------------- now spending their day nitpicking every comment of Obama regarding this terrible tragedy?

Who could have predicted that?

#87 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 03:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

A Malaysian air crew making a flight mistake?
No one could have predicted that.

#85 | POSTED BY CORKY

Mistake? What type of mistake?

While there is the planned route, flying internationally, I constantly see corrections from the aircrew on the realtime map. I doubt these are mistakes, but perhaps weather (turbulence) and traffic considerations.

Airlines and their crew want the great circle route as it saves money, via fuel and time.

#88 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 03:58 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

"------------- now spending their day nitpicking every comment of Obama regarding this terrible tragedy?" - DonnerBoy

It might be nit picky, but its still odd.

#89 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 03:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

I suppose his own spoken words aren't his fault, again?

#81 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 03:50 PM | Reply | Fla

To be fair I doubt they were Obama's words. I'm sure it's just what scrolled across the screen.

#90 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 04:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Malaysian" has "asian" in it. They are not world renowned for their driving prowess. Coincidence? I report, you decide.

#91 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 04:01 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 2

"No, it's an opportunity"

~Idiots blaming Obama.

#80 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 03:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

Well Rahm did say "never let a tragedy go to waist"

#92 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 04:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

#88

Um, mistakenly flying into, "The eastern part of Ukraine was closed to commercial flights."

Which might possibly be worse than confusing one's loofah with one's falafel, Andrea.

#93 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 04:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

------------- now spending their day nitpicking every comment of Obama regarding this terrible tragedy?

Who could have predicted that?

#87 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 03:58 PM | Reply | Flag

That's rich coming from the crowd that spent 8 years complaining about how Bush said nuclear.

#95 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 04:04 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 2

Um, mistakenly flying into, "The eastern part of Ukraine was closed to commercial flights."
Which might possibly be worse than confusing one's loofah with one's falafel, Andrea.
#93 | POSTED BY CORKY

The question I asked above if you care to read, is what time was it closed?? The article is about how the airspace is now void of traffic. Is it closed now, as in was closed today. Or has it been closed for sometime. As I stated above I had seen mulitple Ukraine Air planes in MXP, so all flights were not cancelled from that airspace, and as you see below, Transaero had been flying there up until today.

The FAA made it prohibited, but EuroZone had been flying over it for sometime.....
http://www.faa.gov/
air_traffic/publications/ifim/
us_restrictions/media/2014_04-
03_fdc_notam_4-
2816_ukraine.pdf

#BREAKING: Russian Airliner Transaero says will avoid Ukrainian airspace for all future flights after Malaysian jet crash: statement -- Reuters Top News (@Reuters) July 17, 2014

#96 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 04:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

Hilarious. Krystal Ball on MSNBC just took a call from someone claiming to be a Ukrainian colonel or something. She asked if he saw the plane get shot down and he said "yes I believe it came out of Howard Stern's ass". She then went on to ask a follow up question and he replied "man you are a ------- aren't you".

#97 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 04:20 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Were the passengers armed with missiles? That's the problem. If The passengers had been allowed concealed carry missiles they could have defended themselves.

#98 | Posted by moder8 at 2014-07-17 04:32 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

"Well Rahm did say "never let a tragedy go to waist""

Yeah but that was a know on Christie eating everything is sight.

#99 | Posted by salamandagator at 2014-07-17 04:35 PM | Reply | Flag:

Terrible tragedy? Not until Obama definitively states as much, cheerleader.

#94 | Posted by 101Chairborne

It's the Presidents job as leader to help define the national conversation in times of tragedies. Reagan called the Space Shuttle disaster a tragedy and the nation mourned with him. Obama calls it a tragedy and the fangs come out.

Nicely done haters.

#100 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 04:37 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 3

know=knock

#101 | Posted by salamandagator at 2014-07-17 04:40 PM | Reply | Flag:

Nicely done haters.

#100 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 04:37 PM | Reply | Flag

You are missing the point on purpose I hope Donner. Obama says "it looks like a tragedy". That obvious no matter why the plane went down.

#102 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-17 04:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

now spending their day nitpicking every comment of Obama regarding this terrible tragedy?
Who could have predicted that?

#87 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY AT 2014-07-17 03:58 PM | FLAG:

"You're doing a heck of a job Johnny Kerry" -- Obama

#103 | Posted by RobThomas at 2014-07-17 04:54 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

"The world is less violent than it has ever been."

-- B. Obama

#104 | Posted by RobThomas at 2014-07-17 04:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

You mean "if" the plane went down.

Where's the proof there actually was a plane?

#105 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 04:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

Did "RobThomas" used to be "Rob the 'A' Hole"?

#106 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 05:03 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 2

#100

why are you crying?

#107 | Posted by eberly at 2014-07-17 05:07 PM | Reply | Flag:

Because he is emotionally vested in St Barack.

Clown,
No way. Rob [...] was lol funny, always. Even when you disagreed with him.
The new rob is a retread for sure though.

#108 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2014-07-17 05:11 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

yeah its just us on the right hating ....puulease....

so heard a report just now....possible ? oh crud...how do you spell the group of people here..... checkna ?? spell that for me..

#109 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 05:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

No, it's an opportunity"

~Idiots blaming Obama.

#80 | Posted by ClownShack

stop making stuff up.....it's just the same treatment "W" got and continues to get......

and there are already tweets from hollywood limo libs making jokes....guess they blame the LIC too...

#110 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 05:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

OKAY JUST HEARD.,......and I"M not blaming obama so go away if you think that...

obama JUST banned a company or something that made these missles...and now one brings down an airliner.....anyone know anything about that?

and why would they use one after he banned the home office of those weapons...what would that prove....

butt missles ???

what's the deal ?

#111 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 05:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

If Obama can't incite Putin to invade the Ukraine maybe he can blame them for downing the airplane and start another war. Its our second most important industry, second only to bailing out criminal Bankers.

#112 | Posted by nutcase at 2014-07-17 05:22 PM | Reply | Flag:

You know, I get people being funny and cracking jokes but this is a tragedy. 295 people who had nothing to do with this Russian inspired conflict have paid the price for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Maybe I am getting old and serious but I just see no humor in it. I find it horrifying. I see no humor in mocking the President, Cheney, Hillary or anyone else over initial reactions. Except maybe McCain's - sadly I used to respect that man.

I personally am tired with war in general. People being manipulated into open warfare is a sad state of affairs for the world we live in. I get all the ethnic hatred that comes from living in neighboring tribes for millennia and the genocides that go with it, but it is like Racism or any other ism here and elsewhere. Just a sad state of affairs for otherwise intelligent people.

#113 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2014-07-17 05:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

That's rich coming from the crowd that spent 8 years complaining about how Bush said nuclear.

#95 | Posted by Dalton

Classic Bushism.

And actually we were laughing. Up until the enormity Iraq Error that is. Then the Bushims were not so funny any more. They were....tragic.

#114 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 05:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

#100

why are you crying?

#107 | Posted by eberly

300 people just died needlessly.

I think the real question is...

Why are you not?

#115 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 05:39 PM | Reply | Flag:

Obama says "it looks like a tragedy". That obvious no matter why the plane went down.

#102 | Posted by Dalton

Reagan said the Space Shuttle disaster was a tragedy. That was painfully obvious. I bet you rammed that dumb remark right up his butt.

#116 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 05:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

sr US official just ruled out missle came from the ukraine...

that it was meant for a plane FROM ukraine and hit this by mistake...

wow....

well needless to say,...the issue is 'fluid' to say the least.

#117 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 05:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

why are you fighting over other BS ?

geesh.....what a waste of time...

#118 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 05:43 PM | Reply | Flag:

no donner....why are you crying for Obama (especially since 300 people died)?

you are crying for Obama, cheerleader

#119 | Posted by eberly at 2014-07-17 05:44 PM | Reply | Flag:

Hillary's protege, Victoria "PNAC" Nuland sure did fail. Helluva of a job, Vicki.

#120 | Posted by nullifidian at 2014-07-17 05:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

I don't think Russians use the pejorative "----" in the same manner we do here, but good attempt anyways!

#57 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2014-07-17 02:11 PM

LOL, I was trying to be as literal as possible.

#121 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2014-07-17 05:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

while I wait for more real info....THIS is always good to look at when libs are whining about some of their people and obama are being treated...

and it's history that can't be changed like they usually do...

maybe later we'll know more...

fbcdn-sphotos-e-
a.akamaihd.net

#122 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 05:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

DBoy-

Just to clear things up for you, the word "tragedy" is not the issue, its the preface that makes the statement inane.

#123 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2014-07-17 05:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

Donner, nobody is blaming Obama for this. He's just being picked on because his statement sounded stupid. that's it.

put away the tissues, for once, and accept it.

you opined about "mission accomplished" and "hecka of a job brownie" 500,000 times.

Both stupid comments as well.

get over it. I know....Obama is black and you thin you can't pick on him for anything.

But we can.

#124 | Posted by eberly at 2014-07-17 05:56 PM | Reply | Flag:

#108 | POSTED BY 101CHAIRBORNE AT 2014-07-17 05:11 PM |

I liked Rob [...].

He the reason I started posting on the DR.

And after our first debate we gained a respect for one another.

He disappeared with out a trace. Like many of our lost DR brethren.

#125 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 06:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

Dear God, you people kill me, will fight over anything. Two infants were on that flight. Americans were on there. Human Beings were on there. Families are grieving. I hate almost everything Obama stands for. But I don't for one dang minute think he is not feeling the sorrow and loss of life like the rest of us. I would say the same this if George W or Bill Clinton was in office. Did not like them either but know in my heart, like Obama, this is a tragedy, pure and simple and do not applaud the crash or mock it.

#126 | Posted by gracieamazed at 2014-07-17 06:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

Nothing the USA has said about the Ukraine or Russia's role has a grain of truth to it. Obama's objective in that region is to reduce business ties between the EU and Russia. Obama has been trying to get Putin to invade by upping the price for Putin doing nothing. Obama can then scream about invasion and human rights violations and probably get the EU onboard his plans, but Putin won't bite. Claiming it was a Russian missile may be the most he can come up with. Its probably another lie.

#127 | Posted by nutcase at 2014-07-17 06:04 PM | Reply | Flag:

you are crying for Obama, cheerleader

#119 | Posted by eberly

says you....a hater.

#128 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 06:05 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Just to clear things up for you, the word "tragedy" is not the issue, its the preface that makes the statement inane.

#123 | Posted by Rightocenter

So glad you cleared that up for me. THAT makes all the difference.

#129 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 06:06 PM | Reply | Flag:

#127

Laughable conspiracy theories are a dime a dozen.

Laughable conspiracists are even cheaper.

#130 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 06:09 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

get over it. I know....Obama is black and you thin you can't pick on him for anything.

But we can.

#124 | Posted by eberly

Obama IS black and you haters DO "pick on him" for EVERYTHING.

Not because it is right or makes sense or because you should or because he deserves it but because you can.

Got it.

And believe me I AM over it. But, YOU nutjobs will still be obsessing over him 8 years from now.

#131 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 06:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

#120

lol, Hillary's free rent space.

Dark, dank, dingy... but cheap!

#132 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 06:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm pretty sure Obama said what he did because he knows this is a hoax.

How many Malaysian airplane stories can you seriously fall for in a year?

#133 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 06:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Donner, nobody is blaming Obama for this."

That's correct. It's Hillary's fault.

#134 | Posted by nullifidian at 2014-07-17 06:22 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

Some woman cut the mustard and it exploded the plane.

#135 | Posted by LarryMohr at 2014-07-17 06:22 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

I'm pretty sure Obama said what he did because he knows this is a hoax.

#133 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 06:13 PM

He probably was waiting for a news outlet other than the "sensationalist Murdoch lie machines" to report it...

#136 | Posted by Rightocenter at 2014-07-17 06:23 PM | Reply | Flag:

He probably was waiting for a news outlet other than the "sensationalist Murdoch lie machines" to report it...

#136 | Posted by Rightocenter

They got the story first this time. But what credibility do they have when they spend all day airing climate change deniers and screaming about bengazi?

I just can't wait to hear all about how this is obama's fault. I'm sure they're trying to figure out that spin as we speak.

#137 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 06:27 PM | Reply | Flag:

He probably was waiting for a news outlet other than the "sensationalist Murdoch lie machines" to report it...
#136 | POSTED BY RIGHTOCENTER AT 2014-07-17 06:23 PM | FLAG:

Doesn't matter. Once any "News" outlet reports something as news the sheep swallow it hook, line, and sinker.

Besides. People have their favorite sitcom/reality shows to watch and no one actually cares anyway.

#138 | Posted by ClownShack at 2014-07-17 06:28 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm sure they're trying to figure out that spin as we speak.

#137 | Posted by SpeakSoftly

They are going to froth over how Obama briefly described the tragedy as "looking" like a tragedy while he was in the middle of giving a speech about something completely different...by the looks of it.

#139 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 06:33 PM | Reply | Flag:

#131

You poor thing. You're crying your eyes out over it.

Btw, I'm not picking on Obama. I'm picking on you.

#140 | Posted by eberly at 2014-07-17 06:43 PM | Reply | Flag:

?Claiming it was a Russian missile may be the most he can come up with. Its probably another lie.?

I guess when you want your conspiracy theories to be true so badly it mush suck when reality won't cooperate.

This was obviously the work of Russian Seperatists who are probably Russians that thought they were just shooting down another Ukrainian cargo plane of troop transport. I bet when they figured out what they had actually shot down they knew this will very likely destroy all public support for them, not that they had very much to begin with. This will also seriously damage Putin because the world knows, or will shortly, that he gave them the weapons with which they committed this act of terrorism. I am sure the nation of Malaysia will bring it up at the UN and demand justice for their citizens. As will the Dutch and the other nations who had citizens about that plane.

#141 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 06:48 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

Wow, has donner lost it or what?

#142 | Posted by eberly at 2014-07-17 06:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Wow, has donner lost it or what?"

They have already started going after Obama for that perfectly appropriate comment. The right is like a pack of mad dogs when it comes to Obama.

#143 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 06:51 PM | Reply | Flag:

Wow, has donner lost it or what?

#142 | Posted by eberly

Lost it? Ha....that is pretty funny beverly. You guys go all batty over a simple statement of recognition by the President and when I point that out I am the one "losing it".

I am not the one grasping at straw(men) hater.

#144 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 06:56 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 3

Donner, Eberly isn't really a hater, as far as I know, just a troll trying to get under your skin.

#145 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 07:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

#145

Yep. Donner is beside himself.

#146 | Posted by eberly at 2014-07-17 07:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

Pro-Russian Rebel Commander: 'We Did Warn You -- Do Not Fly in Our Sky'

.

#147 | Posted by Dave at 2014-07-17 07:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

Just like Yanukovytch, most of these terrorists will be sneaking out of Ukraine in the next few days though, due to the bad PR they are bringing Putin, I'm not real sure they will be any safer there. If they are captured in Ukraine they WILL be tried as terrorists and punished as such. Deservedly so.

#148 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 07:35 PM | Reply | Flag:

Donner, Eberly isn't really a hater, as far as I know, just a troll trying to get under your skin.

#145 | Posted by danni

I do tend to feed the trolls way too much when I get bored.

#151 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 07:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

[...] I'm glad you're over the great Iraq adventure Rob, some of us don't forgive something like that so quickly. Check with me in about 50 years and I might be ready.

#152 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 07:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yep. Donner is beside himself.

#146 | Posted by eberly

I heart you too beverly...shall we spoon?

#153 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 07:44 PM | Reply | Flag:

"I do tend to feed the trolls way too much when I get bored."

I'm just as guilty.

#154 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 07:51 PM | Reply | Flag:

They have already started going after Obama for that perfectly appropriate comment. The right is like a pack of mad dogs when it comes to Obama.

#143 | Posted by danni at 2014-

when you're fighting the most dangerous president in our history and he had blind biased voters and media covering for him from using the IRS to silence critics AND make valerie jarrets threat come true after 2012,,,when the republic is falling to be replaced with a third world low class welfare state....well..if it takes a pack of mad dogs then so be it..

so this happens....

ISRAEL is ON THE GROUND in gaza and what does this clown do...

NEW YORK TO RAISE MORE MONEY FOR DEMOCRAT LIARS !!!! in an apartment on the upper west side for over THIRTY GRAND A PIECE....

#155 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 08:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

so there's your "man of the people".....

what a frigging joke HE is....

of course he DID have the time to FORCE SOME GUN CONTROL through his weak kneed sanctions on russia..

#156 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 08:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

of course he DID have the time to FORCE SOME GUN CONTROL through his weak kneed sanctions on russia..

#156 | Posted by afkabl2

The majority of americans think we need more gun control. It's only a very loud minority that thinks its an offense against god.

#157 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 08:25 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 2

speak...that has absolutely NOTHING to do with anything....first of all I don't believe you when you say majority..

.there are a MAJORITY OF PEOPLE who have voted DOWN gay marriage and yet some liberal yahoo judge said the majority didn't rule....so you may not have things both ways.

but Im talking about LEADERSHIP or in his case...the lack of it..

ISRAEL is on the ground in GAZA.......russians supporters MIGHT have shot the plane out of the sky.WITH TWENTY THREE AMERICANS POSSIBLY on board......and OUR PRESIDENT ???
upper west side of new york.....32,000 per person RAISING MONEY FOR THE DNC !!
and smoozing with that EVIL ONE PER CENT you people keep demonizing...well when it's for the gop anyway

#158 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 08:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

when I say don't believe you, I don't believe the polling that I'm sure you're referring to..

#159 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 08:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

"ISRAEL is on the ground in GAZA.......russians supporters MIGHT have shot the plane out of the sky."

And? Obama should do what?

#160 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 08:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

.russians supporters DID shoot the plane out of the sky."

#161 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 08:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

This is alleged audio of intercepted calls of Russian fighters talking about shooting down the plane and discovering it was a civilian airliner:

twitter.com

#162 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 09:07 PM | Reply | Flag:

"ISRAEL is on the ground in GAZA.......russians supporters MIGHT have shot the plane out of the sky."

And? Obama should do what?

#160 | Posted by danni at 2014-0

at least LOOK like he gives a damn....

you know good and well that he should be at his desk.....

close your eyes and imagine it was a republican president and you'd be outraged.....

#163 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 09:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

"you know good and well that he should be at his desk....."

What is he going to do at his desk?

#164 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 09:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

and he's fast approaching 400 fund raisers....an all time record...but again,...being a democrat radical left winger...those things just don't matter......

but last week...instead of going to border and AT LEAST talking to agents etc...he's in austin raiding money from those freaks*....liberal in texas is a freak....and YES I meant to say "RAIDING"....

and earlier...spent FORTY SECONDS talking about it...then gets the JOKES running nonstop...

and now this...the man simply doesn't care ....

#165 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 09:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

- What is he going to do at his desk?

Guess he could look under it and laugh for the cameras when he didn't find any WMD.

There is a Presidential precedent for that.

(always wanted to use those 2 werds together)

#166 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 09:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

you know good and well that he should be at his desk....."

What is he going to do at his desk?

#164 | Posted by danni a

being a LEADER>..I know you haven't seen one of those in about six years....when the korean liner went down REAGAN rushed to the white house from california and was in actual contact there with leaders of the world...but then he BOMBED libya afterwards too,..,which WORKED....but then that's history that left doesn't want to remember...

it's real simple and clear and plain for all to see...he's more worried about the DNC having money to run in 14 and 16 than world events...

and again,.NOT confirmed on what I"m watching...but 23 Americans dead? and he's kissing butt and getting his kissed....typical and not all surprised....

#167 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 09:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

There is a Presidential precedent for that.

(always wanted to use those 2 werds together)

#166 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-

not surprised your making light of it either.....too bad.

again before I go.....

one week he cant be a leader but raises money instead in austin...

next week instead of being a leader after people are DEAD ...he's raising money again..

do not EVER try and tell me he's not worried more about the democrat party than other events and issues...

#168 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 09:20 PM | Reply | Flag:

This is alleged audio of intercepted calls of Russian fighters talking about shooting down the plane and discovering it was a civilian airliner:
twitter.com

#162 | POSTED BY RCADE

That's a chilling video recording of the conversations, Rogers.

But I'm sure we'll find out it is All Hillary's Fault.

A False Flag op... Russian Clintonistas describing the carnage of the plane.... and saying at they end when they find out from TV it is a Malaysian plane... "they must be dropping spies!".

#169 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 09:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

Sorry Corky, but the best conspiracy theory will be...it was Mossad....the Jews!!! to take the attention away from their invasion of Gaza! Their invasion will be over before the attention shifts away from the plane they shot down, leaving the Russian seperatists to take the blame.

#170 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 09:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

"That's a chilling video recording of the conversations, Rogers."

That video clip has CIA written all over it.

#171 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 09:41 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

close your eyes and imagine it was a republican president and you'd be outraged.....

#163 | Posted by afkabl2

If it was a republican president I'd be terrified he'd use it as an excuse to start a trillion dollar war.

I'll happily take a president who goes about his business.

Funny how your whole objection is based around APPEARANCES. Maybe that's an effect of your biased eyes.

#172 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 09:43 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

one week he cant be a leader but raises money instead in austin...

next week instead of being a leader after people are DEAD ...he's raising money again..

do not EVER try and tell me he's not worried more about the democrat party than other events and issues...

#168 | Posted by afkabl2

Hillarious to hear someone from the party that constantly ties the president's hands to then complain that his hands are tied.

#173 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 09:45 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

my objection is also based on liberal double standard..

TO THIS DAY 'you people' talk noise about that 7 mins that bush stayed in the class so not to upset the little kids...and now it's OBAMA and it's okay if he's out raising money cause that might hurt the gop.....

when these people say they are transparent...,they're right in some regards.....ALL of you are so transparent, we can read you like a book...one of the books with LARGE PRINT AND LOTS OF PICTURES...

hasta laredo

#174 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 09:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

Hillarious to hear someone from the party that constantly ties the president's hands to then complain that his hands are tied.

#173 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 20

can't really discuss anything with someone with nothing but democrat talking points and lies....

over 200 bills have passed the house....last year 40 bills went from the people's house to the senate and not one vote.....so don't EVEN try those democrat lies with me...I know better.....

last year the democrat senate...before last week as they tried to circumcent the SC.....they had 11 votes...so don't EVEN..

LATE.....

hasta.....

#175 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-17 09:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

Leave it up to the teahadists, to take a tragic event and turn it into an opportunity to skewer their political enemies. Can't say I didn't expect it from the fascist wing of the Republican Party though!

#176 | Posted by aborted_monson at 2014-07-17 09:52 PM | Reply | Flag:

and he's fast approaching 400 fund raisers...

Welcome to the real world, where politicians raise money. There used to be a Republican president who held political fundraisers while in office too. His name was ALL OF THEM.

#177 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 10:01 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 2

TO THIS DAY 'you people' talk noise about that 7 mins that bush stayed in the class so not to upset the little kids...and now it's OBAMA and it's okay if he's out raising money cause that might hurt the gop.....

#174 | Posted by afkabl2

QUick question - can you tell the difference between a foreign attack on a foreign airliner and a domestic attack on domestic targets?

#178 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 10:06 PM | Reply | Flag:

"...can you tell the difference between a foreign attack on a foreign airliner and a domestic attack on domestic targets?"

I got this one:

Bill Clinton got a BJ and Ted Kennedy drove off a bridge.

#179 | Posted by REDIAL at 2014-07-17 10:14 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 3

can't really discuss anything with someone with nothing but democrat talking points and lies....

over 200 bills have passed the house....last year 40 bills went from the people's house to the senate and not one vote.....so don't EVEN try those democrat lies with me...I know better.....

last year the democrat senate...before last week as they tried to circumcent the SC.....they had 11 votes...so don't EVEN..

LATE.....

hasta.....

#175 | Posted by afkabl2

What does passing bills to defund obamacare and reduce wall street regulations have to do with not opposing everything obama tries to do?

The oppose everything he attempts, then complain when he doesn't do anything.

#180 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 10:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Welcome to the real world, where politicians raise money. There used to be a Republican president who held political fundraisers while in office too. His name was ALL OF THEM."

You still respond to that idiot?

#181 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 10:29 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

CAn I ask a question? Why do intelligent people debate with a complete idiot?

#182 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-17 10:35 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

= That video clip has CIA written all over it.

And in secret code, no less!

Get your decoder rings now!

(that tweet could as easily had Onion written all over it)

#183 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 10:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

Cor Pan, the passenger who took the photo of the plane, was in a band called Vast Countenance. Here's a video of them performing a song in English called "Dear Lord." Cor is the seated guitarist closest to the piano:

www.facebook.com

#184 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 10:43 PM | Reply | Flag:

The fact that only 4 people have plonked me exhibits that I'm not executing properly here.

#185 | Posted by Shawn at 2014-07-17 10:50 PM | Reply | Flag:

(that tweet could as easily had Onion written all over it)

#183 | Posted by Corky

This very slick video was created and posted today in a matter of hours.

"The call was intercepted by the Security Service of Ukraine."

And posted by a user "maidanorgua"

do the math corky

#186 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-17 10:54 PM | Reply | Flag:

Welcome to the real world, where politicians raise money. There used to be a Republican president who held political fundraisers while in office too. His name was ALL OF THEM.

#177 | POSTED BY RCADE

While that may be true, Obama has had 394 thus far in his Presidency, and Bush only had 318. Obama also has had more golf days than Bush had in his entire presidency.

I do recall Libbies being upset over Bush's holidays and golf days......

where is the outrage now?

#187 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 10:56 PM | Reply | Flag:

Hillarious to hear someone from the party that constantly ties the president's hands to then complain that his hands are tied.

#173 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

Not according to him..... so there's that...

#188 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2014-07-17 10:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

-do the math corky

I have. The Onion has better production values.

"A Malaysia Airlines (MAS) jet was shot down over eastern Ukraine, killing all 298 people on board, in an attack that the government in Kiev blamed on pro-Russian rebels. The separatists denied the accusation.

Ukraine's state security service said it intercepted phone conversations among militants discussing the missile strike, which knocked Flight 17 from the sky within 50 kilometers (31 miles) of the Russian border. U.S. officials said the weapon probably was a Russian-made model used widely in Eastern Europe."

www.bloomberg.com

Wow. Another False Flag op, lol!

#189 | Posted by Corky at 2014-07-17 10:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

While that may be true, Obama has had 394 thus far in his Presidency, and Bush only had 318. Obama also has had more golf days than Bush had in his entire presidency.

I do recall Libbies being upset over Bush's holidays and golf days......
After 2006, the GOP wanted NOTHING TO DO with George W. Bush! By 2008, they acted as if he didn't exist.

"At the same point in Bush's presidency, the 43rd president had spent 367 days at his ranch in Crawford, Texas, and his parent's compound at Kennebunkport, Maine, according to a count by CBS News reporter Mark Knoller. Obama, who doesn't own a vacation home, has spent a total of 92 days of his presidency on vacation, according to Knoller."

Tweets by Knoller himself back that up. On the eve of Obama's departure for Martha's Vineyard, Knoller tweeted that "since taking office, Pres Obama has taken 14 vacation trips spanning all or part of 92 days." Knoller also tweeted that "at the same point in office, Pres. GWBush had made 50 visits to this Texas Ranch totaling all or part of 323 days." www.politifact.com


Sometimes you're a hack Andrea and regurgitate the pablum that passes for factual information inside the conservative media bubble. No thoughtful person begrudges ANY president reasonable time away from the rigors of the Oval Office. Physical activity is good for anyone who has tremendous pressure in an obviously stressful job. The problem with Bush was the frequency and duration of his many vacations, far beyond the need for simple rejuvenation, during two wars that he started himself and the continual sacrifice of the troops and families of which he is our CIC. That excess set a poor example when compared to the sacrifices other wartime Presidents made to show solidarity with the troops fighting for this nation under their leadership. Huge difference.

#190 | Posted by tonyroma at 2014-07-17 11:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

Obama also has had more golf days than Bush had in his entire presidency.

If you're going to be a sad partisan dork about this kind of stuff, Bush 43 had more vacation days than any other president in history.

#191 | Posted by rcade at 2014-07-17 11:12 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

I do recall Libbies being upset over Bush's holidays and golf days......

where is the outrage now?

#187 | Posted by AndreaMackris

Bush set a record for vacation days. Funny how conservatives are upset at a guy who takes LESS of them.

#192 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-17 11:12 PM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

"Obama also has had more golf days than Bush had in his entire presidency."

Didn't President Bush give up public golf as his personal contribution to the war effort?

#193 | Posted by REDIAL at 2014-07-17 11:15 PM | Reply | Flag: | Funny: 1

afkunable,

Al Jazeera investigated the bombing of PanAm #103 and produced a two hour documentary. Their conclusion was that Iran did the deed, not Libya. It appears we framed the Libyans. The crime was in revenge for our deliberate shooting down of an Iranian #655 another passenger plane. Reagan pulled out of Saudi Arabia when terrorist blew up a marine barracks. Your hero was an idiot.

#194 | Posted by nutcase at 2014-07-17 11:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

flightaware.com

Reports from the separatists on the ground claim that 2 Ukranian fighters escorted MH17 into the Donetsk region, then turned around 3 minutes prior to its disappearance off radar. From above link we can see previous flight paths, MH17 has not flown over the region in the prior 21 days. We can make our own assumptions until we get an official report.

#195 | Posted by aescal at 2014-07-18 12:39 AM | Reply | Flag:

The truth - Ukraine has the Russian made Buk missile that shot it down. A month ago, separatist over ran a Ukraine missile base and now have the missiles. Last week, they shot down a Ukraine military transport. The Malaysian airline went out of standard air corridor to avoid a storm. The separatist did not have access to radar with airline transponder signatures, so thought it could be another military plane and shot it down. Ukraine has photo of Buk missile launcher using back road to Russia with 2 missing missiles. Russia will likely destroy it. The missile was probably fired by Ukrainian soldiers trained by Russia who had defected to the rebel side.

#196 | Posted by RayT at 2014-07-18 09:43 AM | Reply | Flag:

This will also seriously damage Putin because the world knows, or will shortly, that he gave them the weapons with which they committed this act of terrorism.

#141 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2014-07-17 06:48 PM | FLAG:

That particular point seems to be false. The separatists reported days ago that they captured an SA-11 ("BUK") system from Ukranian forces. They are a force built around military veterans, so the technical knowledge to use it is there. The model they pictured matches the known Ukranian models. Now they are scrubbing those announcements and pretending they never had it.

It seems the most plausible event is that they captured one and used it on what they thought was a transport. The radio intercepts seem to confirm this also.

#197 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-18 09:54 AM | Reply | Flag:

"It seems the most plausible event is that they captured one and used it on what they thought was a transport. The radio intercepts seem to confirm this also."

Quite possibly so but if so they probably used Russian supplied weapons to acquire the Buk and, by all accounts I've read, most of these guys aren't even Ukrainians, they are Russians, led by Russians, financed by Russians, transported by Russians and allowed to pass back and forth across the Russian border at will. Putin is involved in all of this up to his eyeballs.

#198 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-18 10:07 AM | Reply | Flag:

by all accounts I've read, most of these guys aren't even Ukrainians

Putin is involved in all of this up to his eyeballs.

#198 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2014-07-18 10:07 AM | FLAG:

Allegedly the SAM crew are Cossacks. They poured into the region early on and were seen all over Crimea.

and so what about Putin? We do the same things all over the world. This is geo-politics. We've got even more of the same coming with Hillary. If suppliers and enablers of armed conflict are ever actually held accountable, we are so screwed it's not funny.

#199 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-18 10:19 AM | Reply | Flag: | Newsworthy 1

The proof that Russians had a hand in this is the fact that you could put a SAM operating system out in the middle of a field but, it takes training to shoot down a plane. It takes training to operate the radar system. I wouldn't be surprise if there are Russian "advisors" in the area helping these guys. Putin is to blame for this and hopefully Europeans will wake up to this. I think Obama finally has realized Romney was right about Russia and will be less flexible now.

#200 | Posted by Dalton at 2014-07-18 10:49 AM | Reply | Flag:

Time to get together with Allies and put the smackdown on whichever party is responsible. Seems to be the separatists, equipped by mother Russia.

#201 | Posted by e1g1 at 2014-07-18 11:24 AM | Reply | Flag:

This was an accidental shootdown, carried out by an undisciplined force that only had one piece of equipment required to acquire target, track, and ultimately shoot down an aircraft. It would be similar to trying to shoot one person in a crowd at 400 yards using iron sights. There's no practical way you could ever make a positive ID on the individual.

And it's worth noting that, outside of islamist communities, there is little tolerance for the specific targeting of non-combatants. I suspect the guys who carried out this attack will face a much harsher form of justice than if it had been American forces that accidentally shot down a civilian aircraft.

#202 | Posted by madbomber at 2014-07-18 11:47 AM | Reply | Flag:

"This was an accidental shootdown, carried out by an undisciplined force that only had one piece of equipment required to acquire target, track, and ultimately shoot down an aircraft."

So, if had been a Ukrainian troop transport plane shot down, as they have done in the past that is legitimate? Realize these people are mostly not Ukrainians, represent no national government and are basically just terrorists who have entered Ukraine to destroy parts of that sovereign nation. They probably were surprised when they realized they had shot down a civillian airliner but they were guilty of terrorist murder regardless if they had actually shot down another Ukrainian transport plane. They need to be hunted down, arrested and tried for terrorism. These same terrorists have been killing civillians, holding hostages, etc.

#203 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-18 12:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

So, if had been a Ukrainian troop transport plane shot down, as they have done in the past that is legitimate?

#203 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2014-07-18 12:01 PM | FLAG:

Yes, welcome to a relatively new version of warfare. I wouldn't throw around the word terrorist quite so casually. Their's a Ukranian MP with private security illegally rounding up "dissidents" and threatening to execute police chiefs. There's also the indiscriminate bombardment of civilian areas. There are no innocent angels in this conflict.

#204 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-18 12:26 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'll double down on what I said yesterday in the first hour of this thing:

NONE of the major combatant groups involved are shooting for passenger planes. Which does not mean that passenger planes won't get hit if they are in the area. (Islamists would shoot for them, but the Ukrainian and Russian-Rebel forces are not Islamist).

They call it a 'war zone' for a reason.

#205 | Posted by USAF242 at 2014-07-18 01:21 PM | Reply | Flag:

"There are no innocent angels in this conflict."

The Seperatists aren't Ukrainians. What right do they have to illegally enter Ukraine and start killing Ukrainian soldiers? Why doesn't the Ukrainian military have the right to shoot back and defend themselves however they see fit to defend themselves and their country's sovereignity? This is another episode of "both sides are the same" though one is the legitimate, elected government of Ukraine and the other is made up of a collection of misfits from outside the country who have indiscriminately murdered Ukrainians both military and civillian.

#206 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-18 01:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

"NONE of the major combatant groups involved are shooting for passenger planes."

It would seem that one of them did, they might not have known what they were shooting at but they were trying to kill people, just not those people and they had not right to kill anyone. If a Mexican gang of thugs came up into the US and decided to take over a town would they then have some legitimacy in their fight against the American authorities who were sent to remove them? No different from what is occurring in Ukraine.

#207 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-18 01:51 PM | Reply | Flag:

What does passing bills to defund obamacare and reduce wall street regulations have to do with not opposing everything obama tries to do?

The oppose everything he attempts, then complain when he doesn't do anything.

#180 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at

I'm really sorry that you're ignorant of so many current events but that's not my fault. out of the well over 200 passed bills that were ignored by the senate, you can't just pick these out...you can, but it just shows again....you don't know what you're talking about.

#208 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 02:04 PM | Reply | Flag:

MANY of them directly related to pushing ahead the slow economy..the SLOWEST RECOVERY since the last democrat president CAUSED a long recovery

#209 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 02:05 PM | Reply | Flag:

HOWEVER...I KNOW I JOIN ALL of you here in being able to sleep last night knowing that almost ANYTHING could have happened in the world that's burning on FIRE as it always does with dems in charge...

slept good knowing that democrats were paying 30 grand to have the potus there instead of even ACTING like he even WANTS to LOOK presidential....

#210 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 02:07 PM | Reply | Flag:

THANK YOU mr president..........

benghazi...HEADS TO VEGAS

invasion on border..HEADS TO AUSTIN

planes shot out of sky with rockets killing at least one american..HEAD FOR NYC>..

coward !!!

michellemalkin.com

#211 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 02:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

Time to get together with Allies and put the smackdown on whichever party is responsible. Seems to be the separatists, equipped by mother Russia.

#201 | Posted by e1g1 at 20

what makes you think our "ALLIES" are going to get behind our COWARD and do something.....I agree..EUROPE HAS to get involved but I think we all know they wont.....the way we treat allies, I wouldn't if it were me.

#212 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 02:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

The Seperatists aren't Ukrainians.

though one is the legitimate, elected government of Ukraine and the other is made up of a collection of misfits

#206 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2014-07-18 01:49 PM | FLAG:

Many are. That MP I mentioned earlier, he just goes straight to their house in the middle of the night and abducts them. Saw your face in a video about the referendum? You get kidnapped. What kind of invader brings a wife, kids, and an entire house of stuff with them? Short answer, they don't, they're locals. They do not recognize the new government installed by revolution turned violent. These mini-revolutions flourished because of local support, they don't work without it.

"Why doesn't the Ukrainian military have the right to shoot back and defend themselves however they see fit to defend themselves and their country's sovereignity?"

#206 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2014-07-18 01:49 PM | FLAG:

What right do they have to strafe a civilian park with people going about their business with a high explosive rocket barrage from a Su-25 attack aircraft? Feel free to justify that to yourself however you please, but it's brutality against civilians. That usually doesn't work out positively in the long run.

#213 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-18 02:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm really sorry that you're ignorant of so many current events but that's not my fault. out of the well over 200 passed bills that were ignored by the senate, you can't just pick these out...you can, but it just shows again....you don't know what you're talking about.

#208 | Posted by afkabl2

Since when does passing 200 tea party bills prove that the congress isn't tying the presidents hands? The two have nothing to do with each other. I'm sorry you're ignorant of how government works.

#214 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-18 02:47 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Feel free to justify that to yourself however you please, but it's brutality against civilians. That usually doesn't work out positively in the long run."

I've tried to find a link to a story about your story, all I've found is discussion about it with two distinct stories. One is as you say, the other is that the craters were obviously made with hand grenades and that it is just an attempt to create propaganda against the Ukrainians. If you have a decent link I'd appreciate seeing it.

#215 | Posted by danni at 2014-07-18 02:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

SPEAK post 214.....calling those tea party bills only proved my assertion to be correct...you really don't have an idea about the contents of 240 bills passed by the house but that's okay...not many do since they've been shreaded by harry reid...I think I remember a senator saying they've had 11 votes in the senate this term....but yet 'you people' are limited by bias to even talk about that.....

I know how this govt is SUPPOSED to work and you support a LYING president who is trashing the very fabric of how that representative republic is supposed to work.......you STILL apparently don't know what is supossed to happen when the house ...DOES IT"S CONSTITUTIONAL duty and sends SPENDING and fiscal bills to the senate....and REID THROWS them away....and WHERE"S THE SENATE BUDGET for...oh gee....how about 2010 or even before....

you're premise, much less your incorrect conclusion was really weak....

bottom line...YOUR opinion of the bills has nothing to do with the bills being STOPPED by the DEMOCRAT senate...

#216 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 03:25 PM | Reply | Flag:

as to this issue....HERE"S A LOOK BACK...

a little picture and script that makes one wonder......We were told that these sorts of things would never happen again when the clown was elected.

AND REMEMBER This quiet moment between two SO CALLED leaders???

fbcdn-sphotos-g-
a.akamaihd.net

#217 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2014-07-18 03:28 PM | Reply | Flag:

I've tried to find a link to a story about your story, all I've found is discussion about it with two distinct stories. One is as you say, the other is that the craters were obviously made with hand grenades and that it is just an attempt to create propaganda against the Ukrainians. If you have a decent link I'd appreciate seeing it.

#215 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2014-07-18 02:48 PM | FLAG:

Go to Vice News and watch all of the dispatches. It's probably the only even-handed reporting out there.

#218 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2014-07-18 04:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

bottom line...YOUR opinion of the bills has nothing to do with the bills being STOPPED by the DEMOCRAT senate...

#216 | Posted by afkabl2

Bottom line - you think the congress passing bills means that they're NOT tying the presidents hands on anything he tries to do. Those are unrelated issues and proves you're a total waste of time.

#219 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2014-07-18 04:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

Can anyone explain why the shooting down of a Cuban Passenger Plane by a US CIA agent, an Iranian Passenger Plane by the US Air Force, a US Passenger Plane with a US Senator by North Korea, Flight 103 by Iran (Libya previously alleged to have done it) and a US spy ship by Israel was a lower key story?

I submit Obama is hell bent on breaking existing business contracts between the EU and Russia. The US insulting of the Russian Olympic planning, intervention by US NGOs to the tune of $5 billion to destabilize the Ukraine, collaboration with WWII a Ukrainian Nazi Group spreading death and destruction after overthrowing a corrupt but legitimately elected Government. Seems like we make it our business to mind everyone else's business because of MONEY. Not because our Government loves freedom and Democracy, but it always says that. Afghanistan is about running a pipeline from Turkmenistan at US taxpayer expense for the benefit of Exxon and Chevron. Ukraine is about cutting off Russian sales of petroleum products to Europe.

#220 | Posted by nutcase at 2014-07-18 08:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

the world that's burning on FIRE as it always does with dems in charge...

The Democrats are in charge of the entire world now? Nice. Wish we had known this sooner though.

You are one crazy mo' fo' you know that?

You knew that.

#221 | Posted by donnerboy at 2014-07-18 09:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

MSNBC aired an eye witness to the downing of the plane.

Youtube Video

#222 | Posted by mysterytoy at 2014-07-18 10:15 PM | Reply | Flag:

Didn't read thread but lemme guess. Conservatives on the DR are defending Putin and blaming Obama.

What a bunch of traitorous scum.

#223 | Posted by klifferd at 2014-07-19 09:46 AM | Reply | Flag:

It is being reported on CNN that Russia closed the route that the Malaysian airline was taking, 4 hours before it was shoot down. But the carriers did not pick up on the announcement. So that seems to indicate hat Russia knew an attempt at shooting down Ukraine aircraft in that area was coming.

#224 | Posted by RayT at 2014-07-19 05:25 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Why would a passenger airline fly over a civil war-torn region in which combatants are fighting with surface-to-air missiles?"

To get to the other side.

#225 | Posted by Diablo at 2014-07-19 09:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

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