Obama: Palestinians 'Deserve a State'

Thursday, March 21, 2013

In a joint news conference with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas, Obama said that continued Israeli settlement activity in the West Bank is an obstacle to peace, but should not prevent the Palestinians from returning to the negotiating table. He said a peace deal to establish an independent Palestinian state would be "very difficult" but is "still possible." "The Palestinian people deserve an end to occupation and the daily indignities that come with it," Obama said. He said the two discussed the issues of Israeli settlement activity, Palestinian prisoners and access to Muslim holy sites in Jerusalem

Posted by Corky at 01:42 PM | 109 COMMENTS | permalink | Comment on This Entry |

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Corky

Joined 2005/05/24
Visited 2013/05/23

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#1 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 10:39 AM | Reply | Flag:

Oamais killing in Jerualem, to an audience of mostly younger folks.

repeated standing ovations.

#2 | Posted by ichiro at 2013-03-21 10:54 AM | Reply | Flag:

Oamais? OBAMA!

#3 | Posted by ichiro at 2013-03-21 10:54 AM | Reply | Flag:

Oamais? OBAMA!

Posted by ichiro at 2013-03-21 10:54 AM

Oh, Obama! I thought some old forgotten Egyptian god came back.

#4 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-21 10:58 AM | Reply | Flag:

-mostly younger folks

Who appreciate his being against settlements and for a Palestinian state.

#5 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:00 AM | Reply | Flag:

First the limo gets the wrong fuel and now he speaks under a terrorist.....

Could Obama lead his administration out of a paper-bag? That is a rhetorical question....

It should be noted how the MSM above didn't show the terorist in their videos or images.....
www.weeklystandard.com

#6 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2013-03-21 11:07 AM | Reply | Flag:

The people currenty running Israel don't want a Palestinian state. They also don't want the Palestinians to be full citizens of Israel. They seem to want to annex the West Bank and then have some kind of apartheid system keeping down whatever Palestinians they can't scare away. Seems strange that they are so unaware that the rest of world is going to find that unacceptable. South Africa of the 80's seems like a weird status to aspire to......

We shouldn't be funding Israel even if they were a real democracy but the excuse that they are the only strong democracy in the region hardly holds water anymore. They don't qualify as a democracy until they make up their minds to either allow the Palestinians to have their own state or give the Palestinians full rights as Israelis. Anything else, including the status quo, disqualifies them from claiming to be a democracy.

Also, Americans who want to support Israel should do it privately. There is no reason why Americans should be taxed for this.

#7 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 11:09 AM | Reply | Flag:

The geostrategic importance of North Africa and the ME was demonstrated in WWII. Having friends there has been our policy since we had to take it away from the Germans.

-They don't qualify as a democracy until they make up their minds to either allow the Palestinians to have their own state or give the Palestinians full rights as Israelis.

Agreed.

#8 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:15 AM | Reply | Flag:

"Genetic analysis suggests that a majority of the Muslims of Palestine, inclusive of Arab citizens of Israel, are descendants of Christians, Jews and other earlier inhabitants of the southern Levant whose core may reach back to prehistoric times.

A study of high-resolution haplotypes demonstrated that a substantial portion of Y chromosomes of Israeli Jews (70%) and of Palestinian Muslim Arabs (82%) belonged to the same chromosome pool.[27]"

en.wikipedia.org

Family feud.

#9 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:17 AM | Reply | Flag:

Why would an anti-Semitic world care when it is Semites killing Semites?

#10 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-21 11:19 AM | Reply | Flag:

#7 True, we also should not support Palestine as it is a big supporter/harbor of Hamas.

#11 | Posted by HeuristicGratis at 2013-03-21 11:20 AM | Reply | Flag:

did not see it myself but traveler says that palestinian maps don't even have Israel on them

stop the rockets/bombs

acknowledge existence of Israel

and then let's talk...

#12 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2013-03-21 11:20 AM | Reply | Flag:

If we supported Palestine more and they settled with Israel, chances are they would not be inclined to support radicals.

#13 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:21 AM | Reply | Flag:

I hope Obama can depart from Israel without any snags---he better check to see if air-force I takes unleaded gas, diesel or is solar powered.

#14 | Posted by matsop at 2013-03-21 11:24 AM | Reply | Flag:

#13 Unfortunately we are supposed to have a consistent policy of not supporting nations that support radicals and terrorists.

I do see how you can look past this as we have helped provide ammunition to rebel groups that contained known members of radial and terrorist groups.

I cannot lightly excuse Palestine's support for Hamas. Get rid of Hamas, then we can take supporting Palestine seriously.

#15 | Posted by HeuristicGratis at 2013-03-21 11:25 AM | Reply | Flag:

If we supported Palestine more and they settled with Israel, chances are they would not be inclined to support radicals.

#13 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:21 AM | Reply |

Has not exited from Wonderland yet.

#16 | Posted by matsop at 2013-03-21 11:25 AM | Reply | Flag:

#15 Avoiding stagnant old preconditions to talks is what's needed, not more of the same.

Otherwise how are Palestinians supposed to look past Jewish settlements that are contrary to past agreements.

Both sides need to come to the table without preconditions and with the authority to make agreements.

#17 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:28 AM | Reply | Flag:

#16 Sorry, but I don't have your red slippers to click together, Dorothy.

#18 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:29 AM | Reply | Flag:

As you seem more a denizen of Oz than Wonderland.

#19 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:31 AM | Reply | Flag:

Meeting Abbas, Obama Says a 2-State Deal Is ‘Still Possible'

Hours after rockets from the Palestinian enclave of Gaza hit southern Israel, Mr. Obama met with President Mahmoud Abbas of the Palestinian Authority on the second day of Mr. Obama's Middle East trip, and challenged both sides to resume face-to-face talks, pledging the United States "would do our part."

Mr. Obama condemned the rocket attacks, which broke a three-month cease-fire, but he insisted that the Israelis should not use violence as an excuse to avoid negotiations, no more than the Palestinians should insist that Israel halt construction of Jewish settlements in the West Bank as a condition.

"If we're going to be successful, part of what we're going to have to do is get out of the formulas and habits that have blocked progress," Mr. Obama said in a news conference with Mr. Abbas. "Both sides are going to have to think anew."

www.nytimes.com

#20 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:37 AM | Reply | Flag:

#17 Sure both sides have to come to the table without preconditions, but do you really think Israel is going to make a deal with a group that wants to be an independent state while that group supports a terrorist organization that seeks Israels destruction?

It might be wise to utilize some comment sense here.

#21 | Posted by HeuristicGratis at 2013-03-21 11:48 AM | Reply | Flag:

Arafat a terrorist?? Get over it. We may as well keep calling Mandella a terrorist, or even going on about how Obama is a terrorist.

It's this kind of binary thinking that keeps us from getting anywhere.

#22 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2013-03-21 11:50 AM | Reply | Flag:

#21

It would be wise not to set preconditions.

#23 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 11:55 AM | Reply | Flag:

Obama appeals to Israelis: Give justice to the Palestinians

President Barack Obama on Thursday urged the Israeli people to put themselves in the shoes of Palestinians and recognize their "right to self-determination, their right to justice."

In a televised speech in Jerusalem, Obama said there should be "two states for two peoples."

Breaking off from his prepared speech, he said that he recently met with a group of young Palestinians.

"Talking to them, they weren't that different from my daughters, they weren't that different from your daughters or sons," he said.

"I honestly believe that if any Israeli parent sat down with these kids, they'd say, ‘I want these kids to succeed, I want them to prosper, I want them to have opportunities just like my kids do,'" he added to applause.

Obama warned that "the only way for Israel to endure and thrive as a Jewish and democratic state" was through the creation of an independent Palestine.

That state had to be "viable" with real borders, he said, criticizing the building of settlements in the West Bank.

President Barack responds to a heckler in the crowd during his speech Thursday to the Israeli people at the Jerusalem Convention Center .

He urged ordinary Israelis to put pressure on their leaders to achieve a future in which Jews, Christians and Muslims could live in peace.

"I also know that not everyone in this hall will agree with what I have to say about peace. I recognize that there are those who are not simply skeptical about peace, but question its underlying premise, have a different vision for Israel's future and that's a part of democracy and the discourse between our two countries," he said.

"Peace is necessary, I believe that. I believe that peace is the only path to true security. You have the opportunity to be the generation that permanently secures the Zionist dream, or you can face a growing challenge to its future," he added.

heckler video at link
worldnews.nbcnews.com

#24 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 12:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

#22 | POSTED BY BRUCEBANNER

Really...you're gonna compare Arafat to Mandella? Seriously?

#26 | Posted by justanoversight at 2013-03-21 12:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

Hey Danni, how do you feel about Bruce comparing Nelson Mandella to Yassir Arafat?

#28 | Posted by justanoversight at 2013-03-21 12:23 PM | Reply | Flag:

"The geostrategic importance of North Africa and the ME was demonstrated in WWII. Having friends there has been our policy since we had to take it away from the Germans."

We gain nothing by taxing Americans to support Israel. Saying they are a friend for the sake of claiming to have a friend in the region is not of geostrategic importance.

#29 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 12:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. Because of mostly cultural similarities Americans more closely identify with Israelis but I don't consider either side to really own the moral high ground.

#30 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 12:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

#17 Yeah, that .03 percent of the Budget bugs some people.

Of course, what we gain is military tactical advantage against oh, say, Iran. But who's counting the cost of that?

#31 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 12:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Saying they are a friend for the sake of claiming to have a friend in the region is not of geostrategic importance."

Geostrategic importance = excuse for imperialism.

#32 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-21 12:44 PM | Reply | Flag:

Geostrategic importance has been used as an excuse for imperialism.

It also exists in and of itself. Of course, it is simpler to understand when painted with as broad and prejudiced a brush as possible.

#33 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 12:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

"military tactical advantage" = imperialism

#34 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-21 12:52 PM | Reply | Flag:

Hey Danni, how do you feel about Bruce comparing Nelson Mandella to Yassir Arafat?

#28 | POSTED BY JUSTANOVERSIGHT AT 2013-03-21 12:23 PM | FLAG:

Why does Danni run your life?

I'm not going to repeat my post to you. Go back and read it again. The point was to stop calling everyone a terrorist. It's a conversation ender. Then you risk the chance of having the idiot train run off the rails discussing the differences and similarities of arafat and mandella.

#35 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2013-03-21 12:53 PM | Reply | Flag:

#30...I want to make sure I'm clear about your position: Arafat and Mandella are moral equivalents?

#36 | Posted by justanoversight at 2013-03-21 12:53 PM | Reply | Flag:

"military tactical advantage" = imperialism

I just wish you had told us sooner that we could disband the Armed Forces now that the world is at peace.

Hooray!

#37 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 12:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Of course, what we gain is military tactical advantage against oh, say, Iran. But who's counting the cost of that?"

Really? Does our relationship with Israel makes Iran LESS of a threat to us? Does any defender of our Israel support really want to go down that road?

Israel is right next to Iraq. Did their strategic ablities prevent us from screwing ourselves over in Iraq? Did Israel help at all?

When has Israel every demonstrated any value as an ally whatsoever?

I seem to remember sinking a US naval vessel and machine gunning the life rafts. I remember they've been caught spying on us more than once, good friends that they are. But I can't recall them ever being helpful. Just maybe we should question the "Israel is important for our STRATEGERY!" mantra once in a while.

#38 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 12:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

- Does our relationship with Israel makes Iran LESS of a threat to us?

It allows us tactical military advantage if we decide to strike Iran, so yes, it does make them think twice about being a threat.

I generally take the Palestine side of the debate, but that doesn't mean I have to pretend that Israel is not a strategic partner in the ME.

Unless of course Nulli has declared World Peace and I missed it.

#39 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 01:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

"strategic partner "

lol. The kind of partner who pulls you into the quicksand.

#40 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-21 01:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

Did you say Nelson Mandela?

"On ABC's ``This Week,'' Cheney defended his 1986 vote against a resolution that called for U.S. recognition of the African National Congress in South Africa, freedom for the organization's then-imprisoned leader Nelson Mandela and negotiations with the black majority.
``The ANC was then viewed as a terrorist organization,'' Cheney said Sunday. ``It was a step that we simply weren't prepared to take.''

www.ontheissues.org

#41 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 01:04 PM | Reply | Flag:

Really? Does our relationship with Israel makes Iran LESS of a threat to us? Does any defender of our Israel support really want to go down that road?
#38 | POSTED BY SULLY

I'm your huckleberry. Of course our relationship with Israel makes Iran less of a threat to America. The first target for Iran's new weapons will be Israel. They won't be nuking us before they nuke Israel. Not to mention the spy information derived from Israel.

#42 | Posted by paneocon at 2013-03-21 01:05 PM | Reply | Flag:

Only if you let yourself be pulled.

Right now we are telling them to stop with the settlements and preconditions and come to the table. Same for the Palestinians.

#43 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 01:06 PM | Reply | Flag:

"By 1987 Israel found itself alone among the developed nations in still maintaining strong, even strategic relations with apartheid South Africa."

en.wikipedia.org

#44 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 01:07 PM | Reply | Flag:

"but that doesn't mean I have to pretend that Israel is not a strategic partner in the ME."

You're not the only one who claims Israel is any important "ally". Most Americans do.

But the next time I see this claim substantiated in any way will be the first.

I'm also unsure why the issue of them being an ally had to be tied to financial support. That's another one that of the people who understand stategegorical importance of Israel much better than me can never explain.....

#45 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 01:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Of course our relationship with Israel makes Iran less of a threat to America"

Why would Iran be an enemy of the United States if we had no relationship with Israel? It is ridiculous to pretend that Iran would be a threat to the US if Israel were not our protected ally.

#46 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 01:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

Danni, Thank you. You answered my question.

#47 | Posted by justanoversight at 2013-03-21 01:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

It allows us [Pentagon] tactical military advantage if we[Obama administration] decide to strike Iran,

#48 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-21 01:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Of course our relationship with Israel makes Iran less of a threat to America. The first target for Iran's new weapons will be Israel. They won't be nuking us before they nuke Israel."

Israel would be their first target either way. The question is whether we'd be a target at all if we weren't Israel's lap dog.

"Not to mention the spy information derived from Israel."

Like what?

#49 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 01:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

-But the next time I see this claim substantiated in any way will be the first.

I agree the relationship is problematic and sometimes seems to us one-sided.... but the intel they share with us from all over the ME is a big factor, as is their military infrastructure and capability.

Again, as I said, unless World Peace has broken out there, in which case I will be the first to celebrate our disinvolvement with a government that treats the Palestinians as they do.

#50 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 01:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

It is ridiculous to pretend that Iran would be a threat to the US if Israel were not our protected ally.

#46 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2013-03-21 01:08 PM | REPLY | FLAG:Thinks that naive isn't in the dictionary

#51 | Posted by justanoversight at 2013-03-21 01:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

-decide to strike Iran

Hopefully that won't happen. But if it becomes necessary, we will be prepared.

But I like your idea. Let's just declare World Peace and go home.

#52 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 01:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

Israel would be their first target either way. The question is whether we'd be a target at all if we weren't Israel's lap dog.
#49 | POSTED BY SULLY

Oil, black gold, Texas tea the real reason we ere there.

Not to mention the spy information derived from Israel."
#49 | POSTED BY SULLY

Oh say how to rig a centrifuge to over speed and implode?

#53 | Posted by paneocon at 2013-03-21 01:21 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Let's just declare World Peace and go home."

Good idea. Shut down a hundred military bases every year for the next 4 years. Maybe Obama could actually earn his Nobel Peace Prize.

#54 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-21 01:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

#54

Declaring something and having it are two different things. Well, in the real world, anyway.

#55 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 01:26 PM | Reply | Flag:

"I agree the relationship is problematic and sometimes seems to us one-sided.... but the intel they share with us from all over the ME is a big factor"

Name a situation where we get involved in the ME and it goes well? At what time have we ever looked like we have good intelligence and insider knowledge in the ME?

I admit, when you look at their operations, Israel seems to have very good intelligence at times. But IF they are really sharing it with us, I fail to see how we've ever been effective in using it. So either they aren't sharing or we have proven too inept to use it.

"as is their military infrastructure and capability."

You will never see an IDF soldier fighting alongside an American soldier unless its a conflict that Israel started. That is beyond any doubt.

Look at all the conflicts we stick our noses to in the region. The IDF has never once helped. They've killed Americans once more than they've ever fought alongside them.

#56 | Posted by sully at 2013-03-21 01:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Thinks that naive isn't in the dictionary"

It's even ridiculous to pretend Iran is a threat to the United States even with our relationship with Israel. I don't believe Iran is even a real threat to Israel, MAD is a good deterrent. The real leaders of Iran are not suicidal. I think the antagonistic relationship they carry on with Israel really serves to keep them in power, they have a virtual sense of being at war all the time, were that no so, the Iranian people would be throwing the Ayatollahs out of power and becoming a modern democracy.

#57 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 01:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Oh say how to rig a centrifuge to over speed and implode?"

In a literal sense, we knew that already.

With regards to the incident you're talking about, they probably did that one and undoubtedly for their own reasons.

#58 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 01:31 PM | Reply | Flag:

Our government excels at collecting useless/selfish allies and Israel is its crowning achievements in this endeavor.

#59 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-21 01:33 PM | Reply | Flag:

#56 We are in the ME for the same reason Germany invaded N Africa and parts of Russia... the oil.

You know, "their sand, our oil". It appears to be an unfortunate fact of modern life for the time being.

#60 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 01:33 PM | Reply | Flag:

"You know, "their sand, our oil". It appears to be an unfortunate fact of modern life for the time being."

lol. Yeah, U.S. foreign policy is an "unfortunate fact of life." Can't be changed, it's eternal.

#61 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-21 01:40 PM | Reply | Flag:

Shut down a hundred military bases every year for the next 4 years. Maybe Obama could actually earn his Nobel Peace Prize.

#54 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN AT 2013-03-21 01:24 PM

That would save us so much freaking tax dollars, maybe we could get around to fixing up America again instead of policing the world.

#62 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 01:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

Let's just make Cook County IL the new Palestinian state.

#63 | Posted by bph320 at 2013-03-21 02:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

I agree and I don't support going back to the 1967 borders either. I say go back to the 1948 borders. Jerusalem must be an international city under UN control.

#64 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-21 02:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

Jerusalem must be an international city under UN control.
#64 | POSTED BY KANREI AT 2013-03-21 02:10 PM

Agreed.

#65 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 02:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

#61

Would run automobiles on ketchup.

"Ketchup! Ketchup!"

#66 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-21 02:39 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yes, Mr President, you are correct, and so do the American Indians.

#67 | Posted by nutcase at 2013-03-21 02:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

Since everything is already so mucked up in the region based upon changed boundaries, it should become one country of different ethnic groups....just like the USA.

That's the way the real world is run. Each ethnic group doesn't have a right to its own country especially when the ownership of the land was never established.

#68 | Posted by Robson at 2013-03-21 02:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

Israel has been following the same plan for more than sixty years: Take everyone's water by controlling the Jordan River; divide Palestine into two land strips; and one day at a time bulldoze Palestinian farms and homes rebuilding Israeli settlements in their place killing everything in their path until they reach the Mediterranean Sea.

#69 | Posted by nutcase at 2013-03-21 02:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

#42 | Posted by paneocon

I'd suggest that our relationship with Israel actually makes Iran more of a threat to the USA. Israel has had a history of false flags intended to draw the USA into confrontation with Israel's enemies. They tried it with the Brits and the USA with Egypt. They attempted to do it later in 1967 with the USS Liberty. Many believe that the only beneficiary of 9-11 was Israel. War by deception is their motto.

For the sake of the hypothetical if a USA war ship was bombed or if a suitcase nuke were used as an attack against the USA, who would be blamed vs who actually pulled it off vs who would benefit again.

The only spy info we ever received from Israel was about Iraq yellow cake and it was wrong, and other was stolen from us by Pollard and others. Sorry I'm no longer a fan of "our closest ally". They are the poster child for no entangling alliances. They owe us too much and have never sacrificed or paid us a dime.

#70 | Posted by Robson at 2013-03-21 03:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

Mr. Obama condemned the rocket attacks, which broke a three-month cease-fire

You mean Isreal didnt fire first as all muslims and liberals claim? So, some liberal on here, tell me why the Palestinians fired those rockets? And can you agree that firing rockets when you were not fired upon does not help.

Why would Iran be an enemy of the United States if we had no relationship with Israel?

Because we are infidels. You seem to think fundamentalist Islamic nations want peace with those who arent like them. You cant be that naive, can you? If that were the case, we would already have peace...

#71 | Posted by boaz at 2013-03-21 03:32 PM | Reply | Flag:

Because we are infidels.....we are also customers. Without infidels buying their oil who would they sell it to?

#72 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 04:00 PM | Reply | Flag:

Look at all the conflicts we stick our noses to in the region. The IDF has never once helped. They've killed Americans once more than they've ever fought alongside them.

#56 | Posted by sully

Why should they when WE have to. It would only exacerbate their problems.

End our addiction to oil and we won't have to stick our nose in the middle east (so much).

That's why having a sound energy policy is a National Security issue.

#73 | Posted by donnerboy at 2013-03-21 05:27 PM | Reply | Flag:

End our addiction to oil and we won't have to stick our nose in the middle east (so much).

That's why having a sound energy policy is a National Security issue.

#73 | Posted by donnerboy

As long as some of the most wealthy and powerful people in the US have more loyalty to israel than they do to the USA, we're going to keep fighting over there.

And don't forget the masses of bible thumpers who are willing to fight to keep that piece of sand out of muslim hands because it is somehow more magical than all the other places on earth.

#74 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2013-03-21 07:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

And don't forget the masses of bible thumpers who are willing to fight to keep that piece of sand out of muslim hands because it is somehow more magical than all the other places on earth.

So now you are mocking people's beliefs? Lets find out what YOU hold dear and lets mock that, or better yet, how about we turn it over to muslims and let them decide if you can visit or see something that you hold valuable. I guess you can hope they dont think whatever it is is blasphemous. That Budda thing in afghanistan turned out real well, didnt it? And there are more Christians than just in the United States who hold that area just as every bit as holy as the muslims do. Funny how the area controlled by the Jews is still accessible to muslims and the muslim areas. Do you really think that if we gave the entire region over to the muslims they would deem the area of Christion significance off limits and destroy it because they would deem it unIslamic?

I wouldnt trust the muslims in that part of the world with a ten foot pole..

#75 | Posted by boaz at 2013-03-21 08:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

I wouldnt trust the muslims in that part of the world with a ten foot pole..
#75 | POSTED BY BOAZ AT 2013-03-21 08:48 PM

Why are you lying Boaz, you wouldn't trust any muslim from any part of the world.

#76 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 09:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yes, Mr President, you are correct, and so do the American Indians.

#67 | POSTED BY NUTCASE AT 2013-03-21 02:55 PM

They've got casinos and Doritos.

They are fine.

#77 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 09:05 PM | Reply | Flag:

just think..this may have been all taken care of a while back if there was someone on the palestinian side other than arafat...

#78 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2013-03-21 09:07 PM | Reply | Flag:

#75 | Posted by boaz

I'm mocking the idiocy of killing over beliefs. I'm mocking people being willing to send others (who may not even share their beleifs) to go kill or die in a faraway place simply because their historical hero used to hang out there. It's highly mockable. But not very funny.

If the bible thumpers really feel they want to defend israel I'm sure israel would welcome it. Head on over and stand up for your magical land, but stop spending my tax dollars to go defend your mythology.

If I believed my supernatural buddy was only going to appear after we build a landing platform for him on the moon, would you be cool with funding that or is that something you think I should pay for myself?

#79 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2013-03-21 09:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm mocking the idiocy of killing over beliefs.

Funny, that's exactly what muslims are doing. If Israel stopped defending itself, muslims would destroy them. If Muslims stopped bombing Israel, there would be peace and everyone would enjoy the area.

That is FACT.

#80 | Posted by boaz at 2013-03-21 09:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

If Muslims stopped bombing Israel, Israel would wait for them to die off and build settlements on top of their corpses.

Both sides hate each other Boaz. You're acting like Israel keeps offering a olive branch and Palestine keeps spitting in their face.

#81 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 09:20 PM | Reply | Flag:

If Israel stopped defending itself, muslims would destroy them. If Muslims stopped bombing Israel, there would be peace and everyone would enjoy the area.

That is FACT.

#80 | Posted by boaz

Building new settlements on their land is what you call israel defending itself?

Like I said before, if you want to them fight over their land, go for it. Stop acting like people in THIS country should care about what THOSE countries do to each other in their neverending battle of "my mythology vs your mythology" Some of us are much more evolved than that.

#82 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2013-03-21 09:32 PM | Reply | Flag:

Stop acting like people in THIS country should care about what THOSE countries do to each other in their neverending battle of "my mythology vs your mythology"

But Speak, many people in this country want all the Jews to go to Jerusalem so that Jesus can come back and start the rapture.

But that can only happen when every living jew gathers in Jerusalem, after all, their blood is needed to awaken the might of Jesus.

Seems that the Muslims are killing them too early. And spoiling Jesus' fun.

Its just another day in the "my cult is better than your cult" debate.

#83 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 09:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

Because we are infidels.....we are also customers. Without infidels buying their oil who would they sell it to?

#72 | POSTED BY DANNI

Good point. And I sure hope they're investing in green energy. Cuz when we switch over to it, a great many oil-dependent Muslims countries will be affected.

What then, I wonder?

#84 | Posted by brilliantbart at 2013-03-21 09:41 PM | Reply | Flag:

Its just another day in the "my cult is better than your cult" debate.

#83 | Posted by ClownShack

Exactly. But they're making us get involved and fund the whole thing.
If it weren't for that I wouldn't have to care.

But somehow theyve gotten our government to spend billions supporting their superstitions.

#85 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2013-03-21 09:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

If not trillions.

#86 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2013-03-21 09:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

most likely trillions.

Sad really.

our economy is in the tank, our nation is in need of some maintenance, we have starving kids, unemployment, ignorance at record levels...

and we are sending trillions to other nations.

#87 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-21 09:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

#57 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-21 01:31 PM

Only a tiny fraction of the masses ever wants war. Most just want a normal healthy life, employed and are contented with the normal stuff and for family. Those that want war are the political elite and their pals who benefit financially or politically through the deaths and destruction of the masses, and by using media propaganda to rile up the sheep. We could quickly solve this foolishness if the political leaders who salivate and push for wars were required to choose their weapons and go manno a manno, instead of forcing others to die for them.

#88 | Posted by Robson at 2013-03-22 01:19 AM | Reply | Flag:

"Why should they when WE have to. It would only exacerbate their problems."

I don't care why they are a useless ally. I only care that they ARE a useless ally. You're telling me that they are just looking out for self interest. Why is it wrong for us to do the same?

"End our addiction to oil and we won't have to stick our nose in the middle east (so much).

That's why having a sound energy policy is a National Security issue."

I agree.

#89 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-22 09:14 AM | Reply | Flag:

"So now you are mocking people's beliefs?"

Yes. The extent that people's idiotic beliefs screw over the rest of us, they deserve to be mocked. Americans who support Israel unconditionally for religious reasons that have nothing to do with the best interests of this country deserve to be called out for it. If your stupid religion tells you to put Israel ahead of the USA, then go move there and by all means do your best to help them out. If you're going to stay here, be a loyal citizen and stop putting the concerns of foreigners over your those of your countrymen.

Your premise that people who advocate self destructive polcies are above critcism because their idiocy is religion-driven is absurd. Your religious freedom ends where it starts to affect me. So grow up and be a big boy and take responsibility for what you're condoning.

#90 | Posted by Sully at 2013-03-22 09:19 AM | Reply | Flag:

You're acting like Israel keeps offering a olive branch and Palestine keeps spitting in their face.

Um, when I show up to negotiate and you keep lobbing rockets over the fence, that sort of gets old...

#91 | Posted by boaz at 2013-03-22 09:49 AM | Reply | Flag:

"They won't be nuking us before they nuke Israel."

Thank god 911 happened in Israel. Oh wait.

#92 | Posted by Klifferd at 2013-03-22 09:53 AM | Reply | Flag:

"Um, when I show up to negotiate and you keep lobbing rockets over the fence, that sort of gets old..."

That might be true if Israel showed up to the negotiating table. But they don't.

#93 | Posted by klifferd at 2013-03-22 09:55 AM | Reply | Flag:

"End our addiction to oil and we won't have to stick our nose in the middle east (so much)."

That's why having a sound energy policy is a National Security issue."

I agree.

Jimmy Carter tried to do exactly that for the USA (i.e. move us out of the ME) while big oil and the Israeli interests made sure he was marginalized with only one term. The ongoing hostage situation and the rescue failure which some say was due to sabotage ensured Reagan would save the day and remove the solar power from Whitehouse roof, and keep us entrenched in the Middle East quicksand. For a good review of US Iranian relations en.wikipedia.org

#94 | Posted by Robson at 2013-03-22 11:24 AM | Reply | Flag:

IMHO, a lot of our Israel love stems from WW2 thoughts, and not the Holocaust although I am sure there is a certain guilt to this day over FDR's "we have filled our Jew quota" comment.

I think it is more about the war in Africa. We think we need a jumping off point in the region and are paying Israel for that right.

It is a different world today and we need to adjust ourselves accordingly.

If Israel still wants our money, then they must conform to meet our standards. If they choose not to, then so be it, but our funding ends too.

#95 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 11:27 AM | Reply | Flag:

"Um, when I show up to negotiate and you keep lobbing rockets over the fence, that sort of gets old..."

That might be true if Israel showed up to the negotiating table. But they don't.

#93 | Posted by klifferd

I wouldnt trust the muslims in that part of the world with a ten foot pole..

#75 | Posted by boaz

This is how I imagine Boaz negotiating with Muslims.

www.youtube.com

#96 | Posted by donnerboy at 2013-03-22 02:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

so do native americans -think they will get it

#97 | Posted by lastomykind at 2013-03-22 03:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

The nation of "Palestine" is a myth. In 1967 there were no Palestinians anywhere. The west bank were citizens of Jordan, the Gaza strip were citizens of Egypt. Both were conquered by Israel after the combined armies of three Arab countries tied to wadge a war of extermination on them and got their ass handed to them with a bow. Most of the residences of both and Israel proper had come from other countries to work for the Jews,(as Yasar Arafat came from Egypt) and had been in the area for less than a generation. Their is no rationality when Muslims have to deal with Jews, Mohammad made Jew hatred a central tenant of his dogma. It is a pillar of Islam. Islam has taught the extermination of the Jews is a necessity for the Muslims to receive their Mahdi,(Islamic Christ)from day one. Some of the last words out of Mohammad's mouth was to encourage his followers to kill the Jews. Muslims believe that any land that is conquered by the Muslims is Muslim forever. There will never be a real peace. For the Muslims to accept Israel is to admit defeat, can not happen, will not happen.

#98 | Posted by docnjo at 2013-03-22 05:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

Israel is more valuable to the human race. .

"Israel boasts the highest number of scientists, technicians, and engineers per capita in the world with 140 scientists, technicians, and engineers per 10,000 employees. In comparison, the same is 85 per 10,000 in the United States and 83 per 10,000 in Japan.[3][4][5]
Israeli scientists have contributed to the advancement of agriculture, computer sciences, electronics, genetics, medicine, optics, solar energy and various fields of engineering. Israel is home to major players in the high-tech industry and has one of the world's most technologically-literate populations.[6]"

Hard to counter that one.

And I'm going to my first Passover dinner with an Israeli family Monday. Likely a tad biased. Also the iron dome / bad ass yamakas for cities is pretty cool.

en.wikipedia.org

#99 | Posted by Yodar013 at 2013-03-22 07:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Israel is more valuable to the human race. . "

That's stupid and bigoted. Kind of eugenics-type thinking.

#100 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-22 07:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

That's inference-type thinking. Replace 'human race' with 'modern world'. Is that better?

#101 | Posted by Yodar013 at 2013-03-22 07:40 PM | Reply | Flag:

or replace it with 'our military strategy'. Applicable in each semantic.

#102 | Posted by Yodar013 at 2013-03-22 07:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

"or replace it with 'our military strategy'. "

You work for the Pentagon?

#103 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-22 07:45 PM | Reply | Flag:

Israel is more valuable to the human race.

Israel? or Israelis? And which Israelis? The Jewish ones or the Arab ones?

You moron. Your decision to put a group of humans on a pedestal because they belong to the same cult as you do it revolting.

#104 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-22 07:50 PM | Reply | Flag:

or replace it with 'our military strategy'.

What military strategy? The one where we leave the middle east in a state of chaos and turmoil while we drain its oil? Or the one where we want all the Jews to return to Israel so that Jesus can begin the rapture?

Do you even think before posting?

#105 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-22 07:52 PM | Reply | Flag:

Good idea. Shut down a hundred military bases every year for the next 4 years. Maybe Obama could actually earn his Nobel Peace Prize.

#54 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-0

yeah buddy...our head in the sand in the 30's sure made for a wonderful first half of the 40's..

#106 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2013-03-22 08:35 PM | Reply | Flag:

so do native americans -think they will get it

#97 | Posted by lastomykind

Aren't Native Americans a Sovereign Nation within our Nation? Don't they even have their own lands?

I think they are way better off than the Palestinians.

Even though it is not perfect I bet the Palestinians would love it if they had that kind of arrangement... don't you think?

#107 | Posted by donnerboy at 2013-03-22 08:37 PM | Reply | Flag:

Aren't Native Americans a Sovereign Nation within our Nation? Don't they even have their own lands?

I think they are way better off than the Palestinians.

Even though it is not perfect I bet the Palestinians would love it if they had that kind of arrangement... don't you think?

#107 | Posted by donnerboy

yet Clinton got Arafat EVERYTHING Arafat asked for, then Arafat still walked away after inserting 1 more demand... KILL ALL JEWS

#108 | Posted by roadrunner22 at 2013-03-22 08:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

Wo to those who divide Israel.

#109 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-23 04:52 AM | Reply | Flag:

Israel is a threat to the Palestinians and we are a threat to Iran. Those are the real facts based on actual events on the ground. It's only because Iran and the Palestinian people return fire that there is any argument to be made that they constitute a threat to anyone. They are attempting to defend themselves against larger, more powerful aggressors and failing miserably at it. For every dead Israeli, there are a thousand dead Palestiniams amd a hundred bulldozed Palestinian homes, farms, cement plants, power plants and hospitals. They are denied the right to trade with other countries by blockaide. Israel has even systematically harvested organs from Palestinians and sold them in the United States. Israel is a nuclear power, thanks to Nixon, and for that reason alone, untouchable, just like North Korea.

#110 | Posted by nutcase at 2013-03-23 10:07 AM | Reply | Flag:

103: no.
104: The productive ones. And it's not my cult. Read more carefully. It's not 'revolting', it's the truth.
105: The strategy is stability, when was the last major war in this world? who do we have to thank for that? Pay closer attention. Your third question is more inference-type thinking. The fourth: yes.

110: They are all touchable.

#111 | Posted by Yodar013 at 2013-03-23 12:55 PM | Reply | Flag: