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Thursday, March 21, 2013

Amazon founder Jeff Bezos announced Wednesday that his Bezos Expeditions team successfully recovered some of the remains of the F-1 engines that powered the Saturn V rocket, the workhorse of the Apollo lunar missions in the 1960s and 1970s. "We found so much. We've seen an underwater wonderland -- an incredible sculpture garden of twisted F-1 engines that tells the story of a fiery and violent end, one that serves testament to the Apollo program," Bezos wrote on his website Wednesday.

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jpw

 

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I know some will view this as a waste of money, as some view the Apollo missions themselves, but I see it as refreshing to see someone spending their personal fortune to give back to the American people. This is a fantastic contribution for an unparalleled portion of our nation's history.

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www.bezosexpeditions.com

#1 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-21 01:40 AM | Reply | Flag:

Super cool

#2 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2013-03-21 01:49 AM | Reply | Flag:

www.youtube.com

Great video sequence from a Discovery Channel series on manned space flight (highly recommended for those interested).

I particularly love the matter of fact One minute after liftoff, the Saturn V is already supersonic.

For a vehicle weighing 6.2 million pounds at liftoff that's not too bad.

#3 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-21 01:49 AM | Reply | Flag:

Now this is a billionaire who's hobby I admire.

#4 | Posted by Tor at 2013-03-21 02:45 PM | Reply | Flag:

The Right Stuff!

Thanks for sharing JPW.

#5 | Posted by donnerboy at 2013-03-21 02:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

Cool.

But was it worth the expense of finding the engines? Was it worth all of the natural resources it took to relocate the engines?

What's the noble, higher good here what warrants the carbon footprint required to achieve, finding those engines?

It's not like they found a new super-dooper-blooper-might-
cure-cancer-plant-species way down deep or anything.

An engine. Well, at least it ain't a gasoline one.

#6 | Posted by brilliantbart at 2013-03-21 02:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

These are rockets from our lunar missions bart.

They are a unique part of the planets history.

#7 | Posted by Tor at 2013-03-21 02:53 PM | Reply | Flag:

"An engine. Well, at least it ain't a gasoline one."

Fuel gulper though. Saturn V first stage averaged 5 inches per gallon.

#8 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-21 02:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yup. About 15,000 lbs of fuel per second for the five mainstays F1 engines.

#9 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-21 03:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

They are gonna look so cool on his coffee table.

#10 | Posted by justanoversight at 2013-03-21 08:42 PM | Reply | Flag:

Now maybe they can figure out how to build another rocket engine capable of taking us to the moon. Our technology in the 60's was far superior than today's tech. From what I've heard, we won't have the tech to go back to the moon for another ten-twenty years.

#11 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 12:52 AM | Reply | Flag:

"...we won't have the tech money to go back to the moon..."

#12 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 12:55 AM | Reply | Flag:

"Our technology in the 60's was far superior than today's tech."

I assume you posted this from a 60's era computer?

#13 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 12:58 AM | Reply | Flag:

I assume you posted this from a 60's era computer?

#13 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 12:58 AM | Reply | Flag

Gee, you think there is only one kind of tech? Probably. No, there are many types of tech. I was referring to our space tech. Did you think people went into space with magic flying computers? Probably.

#14 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 01:04 AM | Reply | Flag:

Actually, I don't think the Apollo computers were magic. But they did indeed fly. And you could fit the computing power of 20 Apollos into a iPhone. That's kind of magical, isn't it?

#15 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:09 AM | Reply | Flag:

"I was referring to our space tech."

You are aware they had computers in the Apollos, right?

#16 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:10 AM | Reply | Flag:

#15 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:09 AM | Reply | Flag

Computers don't fly. Rockets fly. Planes fly. Birds fly. Computers compute. Try sitting on your computer and see how quick you can get to 30,000 feet. Let me know how that works out.

In the meantime, I'm hoping these engines can upgrade our current space tech so we can go someplace other than the space station.

#17 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 01:13 AM | Reply | Flag:

What do you care? You don't believe we actually went to the moon, anyways.

#18 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:16 AM | Reply | Flag:

You are aware they had computers in the Apollos, right?

#16 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:10 AM | Reply | Flag:

You are aware that they found rocket engines in the ocean, not computers, right? Our computers aren't holding us from going back to the moon---it is the rocket engines that we lack.

#19 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 01:17 AM | Reply | Flag:

Yes by all means, lets let 50 year old engines magically "upgrade our space tech"

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

#20 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:17 AM | Reply | Flag:

What do you care? You don't believe we actually went to the moon, anyways.

#18 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:16 AM | Reply | Flag

You aren't bright enough to know what I think. You believe anything the government says without question. I question. You baaa.

#21 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 01:18 AM | Reply | Flag:

"You are aware that they found rocket engines in the ocean, not computers, right?"

If they had found computers, that would have meant the spacecraft crashed into the ocean. Not real S-M-R-T, are ya?

#22 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:18 AM | Reply | Flag:

"You aren't bright enough to know what I think."

Well, I'm smart enough to know you know nothing about escape velocity.

#23 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:19 AM | Reply | Flag:

going to the moon is a matter of money desire and little else.

#24 | Posted by Tor at 2013-03-22 01:21 AM | Reply | Flag:

Of course. We just sent an SUV to Mars, for chrissakes.

#25 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:23 AM | Reply | Flag:

Yes by all means, lets let 50 year old engines magically "upgrade our space tech"

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

#20 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 01:17 AM | Reply | Flag:

You should upgrade your history knowlwdge. There is no current rocket engione that compares with the Saturn V.

The largest and most powerful rocket to successfully lift off was the Saturn V, which flew men and equipment to the Moon as part of Project Apollo in the 1960s and 1970s. The rocket's first stage had a lot of lifting to do, so it boasted the largest and most powerful liquid-fueled rocket engines to ever fly: the Rocketdyne F-1. Producing 1,500,000 pounds of thrust at sea level and consuming one ton of refined kerosene (RP-1) and two tons of liquid oxygen per second, the Saturn was propelled skyward on five of these monstrous engines.

arstechnica.com

#26 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 01:24 AM | Reply | Flag:

A nice piece of history. Usually when someone recovers something from NASA it is still considered NASA property. I wonder where these will end up?

#27 | Posted by sames1 at 2013-03-22 11:02 AM | Reply | Flag:

"We found so much. We've seen an underwater wonderland -- an incredible sculpture garden of twisted F-1 engines that tells the story of a fiery and violent end, one that serves testament to the Apollo program,"

Maybe we should leave it all there then.

#28 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 11:04 AM | Reply | Flag:

"I wonder where these will end up?"

here...hopefully.

www.cosmo.org

#29 | Posted by eberly at 2013-03-22 11:05 AM | Reply | Flag:

In the meantime, I'm hoping these engines can upgrade our current space tech so we can go someplace other than the space station.

Not only are there the plans, designs ect still in existence, but there are multiple, intact F1s on display at various museums.

This is cool because of the preservation of our history, not any sort of technical matter.

Also, do you not think that the lessons learned in perfecting the F1 weren't used in the development of later engines?

There is no current rocket engione that compares with the Saturn V.

Engine? No.

Motor? Yes. Each of the solid rocket boosters (SRBs) used on the shuttle put out slightly less than 2X the thrust of what an F1 did. Plus, they're reusable multiple times.

#30 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-22 12:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

"What do you care? You don't believe we actually went to the moon, anyways."

I was thinking not only of Bob but of the larger conspiracy set. I bet Kubrick planted these engines in the ocean, probably after he died.

#31 | Posted by pragmatist at 2013-03-22 02:37 PM | Reply | Flag:

You've been peeking.

#32 | Posted by Harry_Powell at 2013-03-22 03:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

#30 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-22 12:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

I posted a link that says the F1 was the most powerful rocket engine ever made. How about some links from you that shows modern engines have more thrust?

#33 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 04:26 PM | Reply | Flag:

I was thinking not only of Bob but of the larger conspiracy set. I bet Kubrick planted these engines in the ocean, probably after he died.

#31 | Posted by pragmatist at 2013-03-22 02:37 PM | Reply | Flag

You think because they found these engines in the ocean that that is positive proof we went to the moon? I give the chance that we went to the moon as 95% positive that we went. This is based on the reflectors that were planted that can be used to tell the distance to the moon from the earth. Also recent photos of landing sites. The 5% that is doubtful is based on this video. Why would they fake their distance from earth---why was the video so good in the capsule but so bad when Armstrong actually stepped on the moon?

www.youtube.com

#34 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 04:45 PM | Reply | Flag:

I posted a link that says the F1 was the most powerful rocket engine ever made. How about some links from you that shows modern engines have more thrust?

It's the most powerful ever successfully flown.

Also, my point was that we have modern systems with greater levels of thrust than the F1, namely the SRBs.

Since you're too lazy to Google the different between rocket engine and rocket motor, here.

en.wikipedia.org

As for the shuttle solid boosters:

en.wikipedia.org

Each booster had a liftoff thrust of approximately 2,800,000 pounds-force (12 MN) at sea level, increasing shortly after liftoff to about 3,100,000 lbf (14 MN)

#35 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-22 04:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

Doesn't say how deep they were or at least i missed it. Could this site be a diving site? Sounds awesome and historic.

#36 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

#35 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-22 04:59 PM | Reply

I did google after your post and I see that you are correct. You should have posted your links when you spoke like I did. I doubt money is the reason we don't go back to the moon since as was mentioned above, we just put an SUV on Mars.

#37 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 05:02 PM | Reply | Flag:

It was the one thing Bush said I totally agreed with: we need a base on the moon if, for no other reason, the gravity difference makes launching spacecraft cheaper and easier. From there we can explore our solar system.

#38 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:05 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Doesn't say how deep they were or at least i missed it."

14,000 feet I read somewhere.

#39 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:09 PM | Reply | Flag:

14K? That's too deep to dive, isn't it? I always wanted to dive, but my sinus condition can't even handle the bottom of a swimming pool.

#40 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

Bezos' team used remotely operated vehicles to dive down 14,000 feet (almost three miles) to the dark depths of the ocean floor, where they recovered "major components" of two Saturn V F-1 rocket engines flown during the Apollo program (1963-'72).

From ABC news

#41 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yeah... 300 feet is about the normal limit.

#42 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

I am so jealous of anyone who gets to go diving.

#43 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

"I doubt money is the reason we don't go back to the moon since as was mentioned above, we just put an SUV on Mars."

The difference in cost between manned and unmanned spaceflight is astronomical.

#44 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

"I am so jealous of anyone who gets to go diving."

Me too. I used to but blew a lung.

#45 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

I think American attitude is why we don't go back. We have already been there. Americans don't think in steps, but outcomes and would get so upset if the government spent millions to go where we have already been.

#46 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

Me too. I used to but blew a lung.
#45 | POSTED BY REDIAL AT 2013-03-22 05:17 PM

My whole family dives but me. Every vacation as a kid was a diving one. Snorkeling SUCKS.

#47 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:19 PM | Reply | Flag:

I don't mind snorkelling. It usually means there's no snow close by. :-)

#48 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

Snorkeling is to diving as watching porn is to having sex.

#49 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:25 PM | Reply | Flag:

True, but porn still seems to be fairly popular.

#50 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-22 05:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

#46 | Posted by kanrei at 2013-03-22 05:18 PM | Reply | Flag

You think the moon has nothing more to offer? You think we know all there is to know about the moon? I think it would be great to actually examine the Cydonia region and see if those pyramids are just natural formations or if there was alien activity. I'd sure like a definitive answer on that "smokestack" if nothing else.

www.youtube.com

We know the moon is loaded with helium3 and that is could power cities far more efficiently than petroleum products. What's on Mars that we could use in the future? It seems the moon is a lot more sensible target simply because it is so close and could be used for future launches. The moon could also support a repository for genetic material such as seeds etc. if there were a permanent base that could protect against a world wide catastrophic event. The moon looks like a much more viable target than Mars.

#51 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-22 05:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

I doubt money is the reason we don't go back to the moon since as was mentioned above, we just put an SUV on Mars.

I don't think that's a valid comparison.

I don't know how much the rover weighs, but it doesn't require life support and all the weight that goes along with it.

It also doesn't have to come back and survive reentry ect ect.

#52 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-22 10:06 PM | Reply | Flag:

#52 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-22 10:06 PM | Reply | Flag

As has been shown, the modern engines have more thrust, so weight shouldn't be a problem since engines with lesser power did the job just fine 45 years ago..

As has been shown, the computers of today are far superior to those of the 60's. Those computers handled course and reentry just fine.

#53 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob at 2013-03-23 12:43 AM | Reply | Flag:

The entire Apollo program cost $25 Billion.

They'd spend that much just drawing the Gantt chart for a new Moon mission.

#54 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-23 01:22 AM | Reply | Flag:

The entire Apollo program cost $25 Billion.

or..

Odummer's 2nd Term expenses...

#55 | Posted by Greatamerican at 2013-03-23 02:12 AM | Reply | Flag:

How does President Obama live in so many people's heads at the same time?

Must be a time share.

#56 | Posted by REDIAL at 2013-03-23 09:20 AM | Reply | Flag:

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