Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, March 09, 2013

Obama has made it clear to Netanyahu that his visit is not about photo-ops, but the business of Iran and a Palestinian state. The implication is that if Israel won't give him something he can work with, then he'll act on his own.

He continues to allow aid to flow to the Muslim Brotherhood led Egypt, including lethal military weaponry. John Kerry, the new U.S. Secretary of State, has announced more U.S. aid to the Syrian rebels who are made up of a mix of Hezbollah, Al Quds, Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups. And suddenly Vice President Joe Biden has warned Iran that "Barak Obama is not bluffing".

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Woe to them that divide the Land of Israel.
americaisraelprophecy.com

#1 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 09:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

Recent on the same trend...
U.N. Panel: Israel Must Remove Settlers (drudge.com 2/2/2013)

#2 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 09:22 PM | Reply | Flag:

Woe to them that divide the Land of Israel.
americaisraelprophecy.com

#1 | Posted by reitze

If there is no Palestinian Nation made Israel will die as a Jewish nation.

The rate of birth among the Palestinians is much higher then the Jews and the only way a greater Israel could maintain to be a Jewish nation would be to go a south Africa Aparti type of system.
A system not even America could back.
Israel must except this fact and allow a nation of Palestine to be formed.

#3 | Posted by PunchyPossum at 2013-03-09 09:44 PM | Reply | Flag:

Big difference in the name "Israel" as used now or when Joel was written, Reitze.
The use of Jewish or "Old Testament" prophecy to augment the Book of Revelations is almost always a dud.
Look at it this way: prophecies prove true only after events show they are true, like the destruction of the Temple or the remarkable Fatima predictions. They are not riddles to be puzzled out to anticipate events but more signs the ones who spoke prophecies were sent by God. And those people usually have messages of spiritual importance as the main message, not whatever event is foretold.
If someone puzzled over John the Baptist's prophecy of the coming kingdom, it would have been to little avail identifying the one he predicted, but it DID mark John as a giant of a man to be revered when it came true to Christians. His prophecy was God's imprimatur on John.

#4 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-09 10:23 PM | Reply | Flag:

#3 Or they could grow a pair and wipe out their enemies. We do already know how this will end. WO'bama.

#5 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 10:23 PM | Reply | Flag:

Genocide? This has taken a dark turn. Stop yourself now Reitze.

#6 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2013-03-09 10:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

Reitze, to be clear, are you advocating wiping out the Palestinians in #5?
That's really not anything I can even treat as hyperbole to make a point. Lighten up.

#7 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-09 10:35 PM | Reply | Flag:

Brucebanner is right, Reitze. Over the line by a few lengths.

#8 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-09 10:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

Bruce, identifying options isn't avocation of anything. Stop yourself? what having a conversation about war? Why? Do you advocate anything yourself? Is that position threatened by the existance of a dialog? Are you flagging every post as prejudice? Are you prejudice? So what is prejudice in this context?

There is a war situation going on and yea there's a connection between war and genocide. War includes genocide options, sometimes euphemistically called "peace keeping". It also includes breeding like rats to eventually outnumber the oppressors. Ever here the expression "all is fair in love and war"? Ever read "The Art Of War"... yes? well then offer something more then "stop yourself".

Diablo - #4 is confusing. What are you trying to say? Dividing Israel is good in your POV? #7 I'm not advocating but I do recognize that option exists and I'm sure I'm not the only one to have thought it - will it happen? I'd be surprised because like some of the content in #4 the prophetic stories don't seem to indicate that anywhere i recall. Rather that it just become a foul and disgusting place of every possible foul bird (maybe you can find whatever quote I'm remembering there).

#9 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 10:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

#8 sure Diablo, true to form - missinterpret my post to assert confusion.

Notice that #5 ends in "WO'bama" - as in I don't expect a genocide event there - rather I expect Obama will loose credibility with a large segment of his support - and I hope he doesn't get that far into genocide himself. Will he? IDK.

#10 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 10:51 PM | Reply | Flag:

Another option? I read somewhere recently that Obama wants to flood the USA with Islamic immigrants. Maybe he'll offer a "Boat Of Tears" (inuendo to "The Trail Of Tears" of the USA's natives).

#11 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 10:58 PM | Reply | Flag:

Okay, Reitze. But be careful to make sure 'wipe them out' is in the clear context of if there is a war. Both Bruce and I were concerned about the implied action of your post, okay?

#12 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-09 11:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

"What are you trying to say? Dividing Israel is good in your POV?"

I did not write that so why would you ask? I am not God and can not predict or decide such things. I do, however (and have always) advocate we should remove ourselves as a country from that entire region as much as possible. Both the Israelis and their enemies keep getting us in wars there and I am sick of it.
The point I made was prophecy is not a type of riddle to be solved, as the end time types constantly mutilate scripture doing.
Prophecy is almost always merely an indicator the prediction, if it comes true, means the OTHER content of what the prophet urged is true. To prophecy the fall of the Temple serves only to prove Jesus should be considered as visionary in His teachings as well. The incredible accuracy of the Fatima predictions, made by three simple children, proves their main message of the urgent need for humanity to repent and reform is true. Yet many Catholics still waste time trying to 'solve the riddle' rather than look at that vital message!

#13 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-09 11:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

The implications were yours not mine. And if i wasn't "ok" with that I wouldn't be here on DR because its 'normal' here.

#14 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 11:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

#13 Finally - your POV offered. Interesting. IDK what to add to your points - other than at least SOMEONE else thinks, even if he is named after the devil on DR.

#15 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 11:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

#9 | POSTED BY REITZE
"Dividing Israel is good in your POV?"

Dividing Israel is ultimately going to be necessary, regardless of Joel.
The state was created out of thin air, regardless of ancient residence, and it can be divided.
No easy task, of course, but it will be necessary, eventually, and sooner better than later.

#4 | POSTED BY DIABLO
#13 | POSTED BY DIABLO

Two very good posts, Diablo. Well said.

#16 | Posted by TheTom at 2013-03-09 11:26 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Both the Israelis and their enemies keep getting us in wars there and I am sick of it." --diablo #13

Somewhere in either "The Art Of War" or maybe Machiavelli text there's a warning about treaties and promising to defend nations that only use that status to bring you down. I'm also "sick of it" but its rare that others seem to see the picture. Their seem either to be so "pro-war" they think its gr8 to dominate the world or so "anti war" that we should retract all forces everywhere.

I think there's a balance and not diminishing our 'defender' role after WWII has made us week regardless of how many bases we have - we're over extended ($!)while at the same time the most strategic institution and cities are still the most troubled.

Only God can save us - if you believe in God. I happen to believe but don't have short-winded proof to persuade others - that took me reading well over 500 books.

#17 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 11:40 PM | Reply | Flag:

I am not saying anything about appeasement or treaties, Reitze. Our involvement there is like a camper who tries to sleep between two ant hives and blames only one for his bites.
Just get the hell out of the area and let these Manicheans go at one another's throat. We can not create peace among those who view it as a weakness.

#18 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-09 11:51 PM | Reply | Flag:

LOL Diablo just advocated genocide! (sorta)

#19 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-09 11:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

Anyone know how many times Israel has been conquered by Christians and Muslims?

I can't tell you the number but I know it's happened many times.

It's as though it doesn't cause the end of the world.

#20 | Posted by Tor at 2013-03-10 12:01 AM | Reply | Flag:

We can not prevent that, Reitze. I do not advocate it, but it will happen there. These maniacs will not compromise on either side.
But I'd much rather get the Euro-weenies who sit to the side to start thinking about their own back yard. I mean, they created the Mid-East mess in the first place. Why should we clean up after them?
If we said bye-bye, it would shake up those snobs and make them act like the adults.

#21 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-10 12:03 AM | Reply | Flag:

Like I said Diablo, at least someone is THINKING. It reminds me of Brooks' The Mythical Manmonth - No Silver Bullet.

#22 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-10 12:12 AM | Reply | Flag:

#3 Or they could grow a pair and wipe out their enemies.

Wow. This may be the first time I've seen something of this disgusting a magnitude posted on this site. [...]

#23 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-10 03:24 AM | Reply | Flag:

1. President Obama has given in to the Fordo uranium enrichment plant continuing to operate instead of shutting down, as demanded by Israel – even though its function is to turn out 20 percent pure (near-weapons grade) uranium;

2. He has even consented to the Iranians continuing to manufacture uranium to that level;

3. Washington has dropped its insistence on Iran sending out of the country its stocks of 3.5-5 percent enriched uranium.

#25 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 09:44 AM | Reply | Flag:

1. President Obama has given in to the Fordo uranium enrichment plant continuing to operate instead of shutting down, as demanded by Israel – even though its function is to turn out 20 percent pure (near-weapons grade) uranium;

2. He has even consented to the Iranians continuing to manufacture uranium to that level;

3. Washington has dropped its insistence on Iran sending out of the country its stocks of 3.5-5 percent enriched uranium.

#25 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 09:44 AM | Reply | Flag:

That's actually a good place to start in the negotiations with Iran. Offering up the alternative of them seceding full control of their energy needs to countries that regard them as a threat is really ludicrous.

#26 | Posted by daniel_3 at 2013-03-10 10:00 AM | Reply | Flag:

If Israel wants Obama to be stronger in his demands on Iran they should start by stopping the settlements. These whining Israelis want everything their way, it would be good to divide Israelis between reasonable and the unreasonable right wing. Obama should tell them either you stop the settlements or you are on your own, now financial aid, no military support. The crazies in Israel are no better than the crazies on the other side.

#27 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 10:13 AM | Reply | Flag:

[...] Israel laughs in our face as we give them money. I don't want one penny of my tax dollars going to them, I'm sick of their arrogance and expansionism which has been the real motivation for Neocon scum to invade Iraq and cause the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and thousands of Americans. Just how much are folks like you willing to sacrifice for a country that simply will not stop the land grabs?

#29 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 12:19 PM | Reply | Flag:

Bho PROMISED he would not tolerate a nuclear Iran. How many times did he say that danni?

Do his words mean anything?

#31 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 12:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

I don't think Israel laughs at us, Danni, but they sure take us for a ride. Israel, Jordan and the Saudis are the only countries we can deal with rationally over there, but only if we pay the lady for the massage. That is an unworkable arrangement for the long term.
Once the assassinations by the Mossad started in Iran, I had to question whether we are breaking our own laws against such things by our dealing with Israel, but no one inside the Beltway will go there.

#32 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-03-10 12:44 PM | Reply | Flag:

- President Barack Obama signed off on $85 billion in Sequestration cuts on March 1 and opened the door to cuts in Social Security benefits and Medicare benefits for Americans the next week.
But as the president whacks away at the U.S. military, Homeland Security and safety nets for Americans, he has been quite generous to foreign groups like the Muslim Brotherhood of Egypt, the Taliban-infested nation of Afghanistan and even Iran.
For example, the U.S. is donating $2.3 billion to Afghanistan this year and plans to gift that country at least $1 billion a year over the next decade, according to an unnamed official quoted by the Associated Press.

#33 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 12:50 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Bho PROMISED he would not tolerate a nuclear Iran. How many times did he say that danni? "

So you want an invasion, or just bombing? Personally, I'm not ready to go there and Iran does not have a bomb yet. If they get one what good will it do them other than to prevent anyone from ever invading them? Unless you think the leadership of Iran is truly suicidal there isn't really a huge reason to fear a nuclear Iran and saying that you fear proliferation from Iran is silly considering the nut job running N. Korea.

#34 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 12:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

Answer the question danni. [...]

"Bho PROMISED he would not tolerate a nuclear Iran. How many times did he say that?

#35 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 03:16 PM | Reply | Flag:

So you want an invasion, or just bombing?
#34 | Posted by danni

Excuse me? This is not what I want. He said it. Did he mean it? Do his words have meaning???

How many times do you think he said it???

In a forceful address to the group, the influential American Israel Public Affairs Committee, Mr. Obama declared that he would not tolerate a nuclear-armed Iran and would act -- with military force, if necessary -- to prevent that from happening. 3/2012

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton vowed Monday that the Obama administration will not accept a nuclear armed Iran and is working on sanctions that will bite to press it to come clean about its suspected atomic program. 3/2010

The Obama administration has repeatedly said that there is still time and space to solve the Iranian nuclear issue peacefully, although it has made it clear the United States will not allow Tehran to have a nuclear bomb.

Last month, the New York Times, quoting Obama administration officials, reported that the United States and Iran had agreed for the first time to have one-on-one talks over the latter's controversial nuclear program. The White House later quickly denied the report.11/2012

Obama made the speech at the U.N. General Assembly in New York and noted, "Make no mistake: a nuclear-armed Iran is not a challenge that can be contained. It would threaten the elimination of Israel, the security of Gulf nations, and the stability of the global economy. It risks triggering a nuclear-arms race in the region, and the unraveling of the non-proliferation treaty. That's why the United States will do what we must to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon09/2012

Bet you I can find two dozen more refrences OF HIS DIRECT WORDS

#37 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 03:26 PM | Reply | Flag:

Secret Gates memo warns that U.S. has no strategy for dealing with a nuclear Iran.

"Of course they didn't prepare alternatives. How could they possibly fathom that diplomacy might fail? The core plank of "smart power," such as it is, has always been the Obama charm offensive. Simply by being the anti-Bush and offering an open hand to Iran, he would convince Tehran to unclench its fist and open a dialogue. Bush was the problem (he always is!) and once the problem was removed, solutions would inevitably follow. So why bother developing a Plan B? The result: Iran's now enriching uranium to 20 percent purity and rolling out advanced centrifuges, which means nuclear "breakout" capacity, i.e. the ability to build a bomb quickly even if they haven't yet done so, won't be long in coming.

#40 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 03:33 PM | Reply | Flag:

You haven't answered my question Dave, do you want to invade, do you want us to bomb them? I know what the President said and I think he is trying his best to prevent Iran becoming a nuclear power but, happily in my view, he is not yet ready to start another war. Apparently, from your criticism of him, you think he should already have started one. I think it would be crazy to do that and I hope he doesn't.

#41 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 03:35 PM | Reply | Flag:

I believe in equal rights. O'Bomber has divided the US; he has a right to divide Israel.

#42 | Posted by matsop at 2013-03-10 03:39 PM | Reply | Flag:

but, happily in my view, he is not yet ready to start another war.

#41 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 03:35 PM | Reply

History has shown that appeasement is a very dangerous policy.

#43 | Posted by matsop at 2013-03-10 03:43 PM | Reply | Flag:

Israel is a failed nation being propped up by America. It's unsustainable.

It's a waste of our tax dollars and an excuse for Islamic nations to hate Americans.

We don't bend over for any other nation.

But religious fundamentals believe it will bring back Jesus. Much in the same way milk and cookies will bring Santa Claus.

#44 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-10 04:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Bho PROMISED he would not tolerate a nuclear Iran. How many times did he say that?
#36 | POSTED BY DAVETHEWAVE AT 2013-03-10 03:18 PM | FLAG:

Hey Dave. What right does America have to tell Iran it cannot be nuclear???

Please tell me why Pakistan, India, Israel... Have the right to be nuclear, but not Iran.

What nation has Iran directly attacked?

Why is it N Korea is threatening to nuke America but we don't care?

I'll wait for your answer.

#45 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-10 04:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

"History has shown that appeasement is a very dangerous policy."

Germany occupied other nations, has Iran occupied Israel while I wasn't looking. Appeasement of a sort, caused by MAD, in the end defeated the Soviet Union.

#47 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 05:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

So, Matsop, you are then in favor of bombing Iran, or of attacking and occupying? Are you ready for all of that? Dave doesn't seem to have a real opinion so I'll ask you.

#48 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 05:15 PM | Reply | Flag:

So you refuse to answer. That's funny. So you agree

OBAMA'S WORDS MEAN NOTHING. HE LIES REGULARLY AND IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT HE HAS TO SAY POLITICALLY. HE CAN'T PASS A BUDGET, BUT HE CAN PASS THE BUCK

No wonder he divides peoples

#49 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 05:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

Should we be bombing Iran? Yes or No?

Obviously, Obama doesn't think it is time to do that but what is your opinion other than just to ankle bite Obama? Sounds like politics over even a decision of war.

#50 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 05:37 PM | Reply | Flag:

What some people fail to recognize is that the president of Iran is a madman. His ultimate goal is to create the conditions for the return of the Mahdi, the prophesied redeemer of Islam. Which by the way, is perfectly described in the Christian Bible as the anti-Christ. To bring about the return of the Mahdi, will require the creation of complete and total chaos in the Middle East. Ahmadinejad believes he is the point man for bringing about this chaos that will cause the Mahdi (13th Imam) to come. You may not believe it and you may mock it but he believes it without any doubts.

There is no doubt in my mind that he will have nuclear weapons and he will attack Israel. It's just a matter of when and by all appearances, it looks like it may be sooner rather than later.

#51 | Posted by Daniel at 2013-03-10 05:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

Does anyone here know how many times Israel has been conquered by Christians and Muslims?

I can't tell you the number myself but I know it's happened many times.

It's as though it doesn't cause the end of the world.

#52 | Posted by Tor at 2013-03-10 06:56 PM | Reply | Flag:

"What some people fail to recognize is that the president of Iran is a madman. "

Perhaps a more important fact to recognize is the the President of Iran does not hold the power to attack anyone, the Ayatolla has that power. Iran has no more intention of attacking Israel than you have in committing suicide. If Iran ever did Israel would lose a city but the entire nation of Iran would be reduced to rubble.

#53 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 07:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

What are the drones for?

#54 | Posted by Federalist at 2013-03-10 07:10 PM | Reply | Flag:

"What some people fail to recognize is that the president of Iran is a madman. "

Well he is a monotheist.

#55 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-03-10 07:13 PM | Reply | Flag:

Wow. This may be the first time I've seen something of this disgusting a magnitude posted on this site. [...]
#23 | Posted by jpw at 2013-03-10 03:24 AM | Reply | Flag:

No opinion or even ideas offered in the thread. Disgusting posts advocating vaccines and drugs all the time... pffft.

Sounds like politics over even a decision of war.
#50 | Posted by danni at 2013-03-10 05:37 PM | Reply | Flag:
GOOD!

War is supposed to be declared by congress. Just bombing others is against the law. POTUSs doing that has been going on while our constitution and representation has been eroded for the last several decades. So yea, it should be political - represent the will of the people - so that WE OWN IT no matter what it is. The problem we have now is we're drone-striking people, even US Citizens all over the world without proper declaration by the representatives who are now representing their big money bribes (oh right campaign doners w/ no more limit$ means that's fine? NOPE.)

#56 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-10 07:19 PM | Reply | Flag:

#60 this retort is about Obama dividing Israel, which you are in full support of such. It has nothing to do with me. Nada, zip, zero. Only someone afraid to answer would deflect away to something completely irrelevant to the retort. What is wrong with you? Why can't you answer a question directly pertinent to topic. (As usual the Dr left tries to put words in my mouth, because they are speechless)

The president has spoken. Do his words mean anything?

#57 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2013-03-10 08:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

Dave, we're not up to #60. Was that sopposed to be #50? If so it fits, Danni loves Obama.

#58 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-10 09:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

This link has slanted anti-Islam content. Its relevant in THIS thread because of the history of Israel and the implications over dividing the nation. www.bible.ca... / What every non-Muslim needs to know about Islam!

#59 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-10 09:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

Run away. Be afraid. Be scared. The boogeyman will get you.

#60 | Posted by coyote at 2013-03-10 10:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

"grow a pair"

flag: argumentum ad machismo

grow a pair!

#61 | Posted by Zarathustra at 2013-03-11 12:04 AM | Reply | Flag:

onward, christian soldiers!

go forth and defend israel, so that jesus can come back and we can kick off the rapture in style.

really. please. go.

#62 | Posted by Zarathustra at 2013-03-11 12:13 AM | Reply | Flag:

"What makes a man? Is it the woman in his arms? Just because she has big titties?

Or is the way He fights everyday? No, it's probably the titties"

now you're a mayun!

#63 | Posted by Zarathustra at 2013-03-11 12:18 AM | Reply | Flag:

#61, 63 - LOL! ... man... FFs 4 u! ... man

#64 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-11 12:35 AM | Reply | Flag:

To bring about the return of the Mahdi, will require the creation of complete and total chaos in the Middle East.
#51 | POSTED BY DANIEL AT 2013-03-10 05:55 PM | REPLY |

So then America must also want the return of Mahdi since we have plunged the middle east into complete chaos.

Thanks for your abysmal, religion based, analysis.

#65 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-11 02:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

If you think the Middle East is in chaos now, you better hang on to your clown shoes because, you haven't seen anything yet. And as always, I'm patiently waiting for your expert analysis on this matter, seriously.

#66 | Posted by Daniel at 2013-03-11 02:41 PM | Reply | Flag:

"The implication is that if Israel won't give him something he can work with, then he'll act on his own." - FTA

Land for peace will never work, hasn't worked for at least a century.
www.amazon.com

#67 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2013-03-11 02:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

If you think the Middle East is in chaos now, you better hang on to your clown shoes because, you haven't seen anything yet. And as always, I'm patiently waiting for your expert analysis on this matter, seriously.
#66 | POSTED BY DANIEL AT 2013-03-11 02:41 PM | REPLY

Yea, I agree, America has some more plans for the middle east and wont leave the area until all the oil has been used up.

Iraq and Afghanistan are already in chaos, Syria and Iran are next.

Seems like your buddies read the same fictitious books you did and are trying their best to bring about the rapture.

Also, my analysis of the middle east is based on current facts. Not some fiction novel from two thousand years ago.

Have you read Dianetics yet? In two thousand years from now people (like you) will claim it's a holy book dictated to L Ron Hubbard by God. You see how ridiculous you are yet? probably not.

#68 | Posted by ClownShack at 2013-03-11 03:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

-L Ron Hubbard

The followers of Ray Wiley Hubbard would vigorously disagree.

www.youtube.com

#69 | Posted by Corky at 2013-03-11 03:09 PM | Reply | Flag:

You see how ridiculous you are yet? probably not.

I'm stubborn that way. But, I try to study the subject matter in an attempt to view issues from "their" perspective. A psycho completely justifies his crime in his own mind no matter how ridiculous we may view it.

#70 | Posted by Daniel at 2013-03-11 03:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

#70 self defense is not a crime even if the other person ends up dead.

#71 | Posted by reitze at 2013-03-11 07:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

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