Idaho May Punish Shepherds Who Stray

Monday, February 25, 2013

A bill making it a crime for a shepherd to walk off the job without properly notifying the boss was introduced in the Idaho Senate Monday. Sought by the Idaho Wool Growers Association with the support of Jefferson County sheepman and Sen. Jeff Siddoway (R-Terreton), the measure would also make it a crime to aid and abet the wayward shepherd. Both offenses would be misdemeanors. "We've had a real problem here of late," said Boyd, explaining that foreign workers who come as H-2A agriculture workers have been leaving for better jobs and leaving bands of sheep on the open range.

Posted by badgerwest at 07:31 PM | 45 COMMENTS | permalink | Comment on This Entry |

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badgerwest

Joined 2008/02/08
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The first Christmas would have been changed substantially by this law.

#1 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-02-25 02:23 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Slavery" is a bit of an overstatement. More like indentured servitude.

#2 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-25 02:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

More like indentured servitude.

#2 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-25

Let's ask the Libertarians if they are for or against this. My guess, they're opposed to it. Why? Because societal force is used and freedom diminished.

But if the indentured servitude were voluntary on the part of the individual, then you can start talking contract enforcement.

Enforcement that would require societal force and a diminuition of freedom.

#3 | Posted by Zed at 2013-02-25 02:34 PM | Reply | Flag:

Idaho. Paradise for rightwing Christians. No surprise.

#4 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-02-25 02:48 PM | Reply | Flag:

"a crime for a shepherd to walk off the job without properly notifying the boss"

you simply have to tell them so the sheep don't wander, right?

that equates to slavery?

#5 | Posted by eberly at 2013-02-25 02:50 PM | Reply | Flag:

"that equates to slavery?"

I think it's the idea that they are making a criminal issue out of what should rightly be a civil matter.

#6 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-25 03:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

No more "Wham, Bam, Thank You, Mam."

#7 | Posted by squinch at 2013-02-25 05:04 PM | Reply | Flag:

Think of the sheep as a large amount of cash left outside.

If it's not protected from predators and the elements the owner can be ruined.

#8 | Posted by Tor at 2013-02-25 07:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

If it's not protected from predators and the elements the owner can be ruined.

And widowed.

But again, why is this a criminal matter? Does Idaho really believe sheep are the equivalent of children? Or that businesses should be served by the jackbooted authorities?

#9 | Posted by northguy3 at 2013-02-25 07:55 PM | Reply | Flag:

from the article --

"We've had a real problem here of late," said Boyd, explaining that foreign workers who come as "H-2A" agriculture workers have been leaving for better jobs and leaving bands of sheep on the open range. Such workers sign three-year contracts, with travel and visa expenses Boyd estimated at $2,500 to $3,000. Idaho has a long history of employing shepherds from overseas, first from the Basque Country in Spain and France and more recently from South America.

"Then in the middle of the night, maybe three months later, they walk off and abandon the sheep, or, if in the lambing sheds they abandon their duties there," Boyd said. "They're enticed with a better job at a nursery or a landscaper."

Seems to me this is pretty cut and dried and hardly fits the criteria for slavery or indentured servitude. The sheepherders willingly signed a legal contract and then knowingly broke it. The employer is not only out the $2000 - $3000 travel and visa expenses he paid on the employee's behalf, but also possible loss of some of the sheep in the herd (flock? whatever) due to their being abandoned for a time.

If this conduct is tolerated with no penalty attached, then every employment contract is a joke.

#10 | Posted by CalifChris at 2013-02-25 07:57 PM | Reply | Flag:

Northguy if a guy working at 7-11 walks off the job when no one else is there and doesn't even lock the door he's considered liable for anything that's stolen.

#11 | Posted by Tor at 2013-02-25 08:05 PM | Reply | Flag:

While I don't know that it should fall under criminal statues, there certainly should be a civil court proceeding for leaving business assets unattended, as taking care of said assets was agreed upon when taking the job. Employees are held accountable for company assets all the time. I think you can take your employer to court for non-payment of services...

#12 | Posted by rearendhat at 2013-02-25 09:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

Northguy if a guy working at 7-11 walks off the job when no one else is there and doesn't even lock the door he's considered liable for anything that's stolen.
#11 | Posted by Tor at 2013-02-25 08:05 PM

Not criminally, unless he partook in the stealing.

If this conduct is tolerated with no penalty attached, then every employment contract is a joke.
#10 | Posted by CalifChris at 2013-02-25 07:57 PM

Really? So I guess that means we get to lock up every employer who makes their employees work off the clock or work through their lunch and coffee breaks?

#13 | Posted by censored at 2013-02-25 09:09 PM | Reply | Flag:

Or you could stop importing labor on H-2A and H-1B Visas. There has never been any compliance with their associated quotas, an argument used to pass these bills. Its the same way with enforcement of all immigration laws. ITS JUST NOT DONE. So this way we can build more prisons.

#14 | Posted by nutcase at 2013-02-25 09:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

Seems to me this is pretty cut and dried and hardly fits the criteria for slavery or indentured servitude. The sheepherders willingly signed a legal contract and then knowingly broke it

Then put a non-performance clause in the contract.

The taxpayers shouldn't be involved in contract dispute between two private parties. It's none of our business.

#15 | Posted by snoofy at 2013-02-25 09:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

If this conduct is tolerated with no penalty attached, then every employment contract is a joke.

Not the shepherd's fault if his employer writes a joke contract.

#16 | Posted by snoofy at 2013-02-25 09:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

"The taxpayers shouldn't be involved in contract dispute between two private parties. It's none of our business."

I think property rights and contracts disputes are one of the main reasons govt. and courts exist.

#17 | Posted by rearendhat at 2013-02-25 09:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

"you could stop importing labor on H-2A and H-1B Visas."

And start treating their employees better?

never! ;)

#18 | Posted by Tor at 2013-02-25 09:27 PM | Reply | Flag:

I think property rights and contracts disputes are one of the main reasons govt. and courts exist.
#17 | Posted by rearendhat at 2013-02-25 09:24 PM

I can see the new GOP rallying cry now: Bring back the debtor prisons!

#19 | Posted by censored at 2013-02-25 09:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

GOP rallying cry now: Bring back the debtor prisons!

#19 | Posted by censored

Several Repubs here have already advocated that already

#20 | Posted by PunchyPossum at 2013-02-25 09:54 PM | Reply | Flag:

It's all about money. 'nuff said.

#21 | Posted by coyote at 2013-02-25 10:01 PM | Reply | Flag:

Citizens need to reverse the pendulum so that corporations are held criminally accountable to citizens for unethical acts against society.

#22 | Posted by Robson at 2013-02-25 10:04 PM | Reply | Flag:

When Hollywood convinced Congress that the copying of a $10 movie DVD is a crime punishable by 5 years in prison and a $250k fine it opened the door to the criminalizing of what were civil actions against business. The genie is out of the lamp and now corporate interests regularly sic cops on citizens for very minor offenses. Citizens need to reverse the pendulum so that corporations are held criminally accountable to citizens for unethical acts against society.
#22 | Posted by Robson at 2013-02-25 10:04 PM

Good point, and well said!

#23 | Posted by censored at 2013-02-25 10:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Does Idaho really believe sheep are the equivalent of children?"

I bet PETA does.

#24 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-02-25 11:04 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Does Idaho really believe sheep are the equivalent of children?"

Glorious Idaho, the only state where sheep are smarter than the children. And the adults.

#25 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-02-25 11:24 PM | Reply | Flag:

Idaho has great natural beauty, too bad it was ruined by Christians.

#26 | Posted by nullifidian at 2013-02-25 11:30 PM | Reply | Flag:

Has anyone here actually reared sheep?

Well other than clownshack since we already know he'll rear livestock, children, pretty much anything that can't run fast enough.

;)

#27 | Posted by Tor at 2013-02-25 11:33 PM | Reply | Flag:

"The taxpayers shouldn't be involved in contract dispute between two private parties. It's none of our business."

I think property rights and contracts disputes are one of the main reasons govt. and courts exist.

Of course. But the contract itself should spell out enforcement provisions and non-compliance provisions. Because those are central elements to the agreement being made.

They most certainly shouldn't be over in some separate body of law a shepherd from Basque country is unlikely to be aware of when he signs the contract.

#28 | Posted by snoofy at 2013-02-25 11:37 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Slavery" is a bit of an overstatement. More like indentured servitude.

#2 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine

WTF are you smoking hag?

#29 | Posted by Sniper at 2013-02-26 11:44 AM | Reply | Flag:

Can't you read, Sniper? I know, stupid question. They're making walking off a job a criminal matter.

#30 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-26 11:51 AM | Reply | Flag:

then every employment contract is a joke.

According to the right, they already are.

#31 | Posted by northguy3 at 2013-02-26 11:55 AM | Reply | Flag:

Can't you read, Sniper? I know, stupid question. They're making walking off a job a criminal matter.

#30 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine

You can't read hag, the sheep are put at big risk for a long time before the problem is discovered.

If you hire someone to watch your childern while you take a vacation and they turn the kids out in the street as soon as you leave town, What's the problem?

#32 | Posted by Sniper at 2013-02-26 12:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

wolves and coyotes have to eat too....

#33 | Posted by badgerwest at 2013-02-26 12:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

"the sheep are put at big risk for a long time before the problem is discovered."

Big risk from what? But again, that would be a civil matter.

"If you hire someone to watch your childern..."

You've gone off the deep end if you're equating property rights with the rights of childern to have adult supervision.

#34 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-26 12:20 PM | Reply | Flag:

States' Rights.
Just put a Drone on it.
If Drones are Good Enough for Afghans, they are Good Enough for Sheep Herders

Sincerely

Current Governor of the state of Vagina, modern "conservative" Champion and "constitutional conservative" Bob McDonnell

#35 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2013-02-26 12:32 PM | Reply | Flag:

Really? So I guess that means we get to lock up every employer who makes their employees work off the clock or work through their lunch and coffee breaks?

#13 | Posted by censored

Yes, exactly. It is illegal. Most don't call the cops or report them because they want to keep their job.

Your job may be more important to you than your coffee break.

To the Sheep owner, the sheep are more important than the sheep herder. They want repercussions for lying and saying you will watch their sheep, but instead leave without telling anyone.

They could sue the sheep herder, but they really don't have any money, so instead want to lock them up, or at least have them arrested.

#36 | Posted by Marty at 2013-02-26 01:03 PM | Reply | Flag:

in addition to being heavily subsidized for producing something no one wants or needs anymore and getting free pasture on federal lands they want to be the only industry to get govt help to force people to work for them? sounds fair to the teapartiers here...

#37 | Posted by badgerwest at 2013-02-26 01:23 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Does Idaho really believe sheep are the equivalent of children?"
I bet PETA does.
#24 | Posted by Diablo at 2013-02-25 11:04 PM

What is the point of a sheep herder?

You also misunderstand the term "Christmas" wholly.

#38 | Posted by redlightrobot at 2013-02-26 02:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

To the Sheep owner, the sheep are more important than the sheep herder. They want repercussions for lying and saying you will watch their sheep, but instead leave without telling anyone.

Maybe they should do some background checks. Maybe they should pay their herders a competitive wage.

Or maybe, using small government Republican logic, they should expand government to deal with their problem.

#39 | Posted by snoofy at 2013-02-26 02:35 PM | Reply | Flag:

Is Idaho a right to work state also?

#40 | Posted by Prolix247 at 2013-02-26 06:08 PM | Reply | Flag:

You can't read hag, the sheep are put at big risk for a long time before the problem is discovered.

If you hire someone to watch your childern while you take a vacation and they turn the kids out in the street as soon as you leave town, What's the problem?

#32 | Posted by Sniper

Sniper likes to stay very close to his sheep and doesn't like to leave them for a second.

And apparently to Sniper sheep are just like children.

#41 | Posted by donnerboy at 2013-02-26 07:59 PM | Reply | Flag:

"Slavery" is a bit of an overstatement. More like indentured servitude.
#2 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine

Wow. Only because he's a Republican?

LOL!!!

It's a crime to leave a child unattentended who's been left in one's care.

Is that slavery too?

#42 | Posted by RonPaul at 2013-02-26 08:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

We've had a real problem here of late," said Boyd, explaining that foreign workers who come as H-2A agriculture workers have been leaving for better jobs

So instead of improving the job, they make it illegal to leave.

Ahhhh free market enterprise at werk.

#43 | Posted by 726 at 2013-02-27 03:53 PM | Reply | Flag:

"So instead of improving the job, they make it illegal to leave. Ahhhh free market enterprise at werk."

In simple dollars and cents I guess it costs less to buy a few politicians to pass legislation than it would be to improve the terms of the employment contract.

#44 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-27 04:17 PM | Reply | Flag:

And apparently to Sniper sheep are just like children. #41 | Posted by donnerboy

Check #42. He ain't the only loon who has slipped out of the asylum.

#45 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2013-02-27 04:19 PM | Reply | Flag: