Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs

Four Republicans from Congress have traveled to Honduras to meet interim President Roberto Micheletti, despite the U.S. declaration that the coup that ousted President Manuel Zelaya is illegitimate. "It was not a coup," said Rep. Doug Lamborn (R.-Colo.).

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The righties call Obama's election a coup and complain about it.
The right doesn't believe in democracy or America, only in the Republican Party. That's why they pray for al queda to nuke Chicago and for a military coup to remove Obama.

The righties call Obama's election a coup ...

???

This is a new one to me. Who ever called his election a 'coup'? I can't think of one rightie, much less all of them.

"The righties call Obama's election a coup and complain about it."

In Canada they're already showing signs of cabin fever. Must be that arctic ice getting thicker

This actually is an interesting story on several levels (none of which are evidently grasped by the person that posted it)

The supreme court of Honduras ordered the removal of Zelaya after he attempted to seek another term (forbidden by their constitution)..

Its a strange way of dealing with it to be sure..

The underlying story is Chavez.. and Zelaya's attempt to not only align with him but emulate him.. and exactly why the Obama administration has given not only tacit approval to Zelaya, but has expressed open hostility to the political and military figures in Honduras that have opposed him.

I think its just another example of the naivete of Obama, and it sounds again, exactly like what a Jimmy Carter would do. The end result is very likely to be another country in the region that's hostile to the United States, regardless of the final outcome.

We didn't have to express any support for the removal of Zelaya.. but neither are we gaining anything by wading into a situation where the outcome is anything but certain, and where there is no clear moral high ground to take.

Jimmy Carter = Obama.. and the nation isn't served well by either.

The underlying story is Chavez.. and Zelaya's attempt to not only align with him but emulate him.. and exactly why the Obama administration has given not only tacit approval to Zelaya, but has expressed open hostility to the political and military figures in Honduras that have opposed him.
nmg no

now wait, just last month obama was pals with chavez. zelaya's trying to emulate chavez. in your world shouldn't obama be "in love" with zelaya too?

you guys can't keep your shit together.

#5 | Posted by cjk85 at 2009-10-09 12:14 PM
***"you guys can't keep your shit together."

Uh, you should read the story...

Not that I agree with the Conservative take on the "underlying story", but that: "zelaya's trying to emulate chavez. in your world shouldn't obama be "in love" with zelaya too?" is exactly what they're saying...

maybe you should try and read the post above mine uranus.

The underlying story is that the people elected Zelaya because they wanted to end decades of domination by the wealthy aristocrats. He tried to raise the minimum wage and the shit hit the fan.
These Republican Congressmen are trying to conduct foreign policy which is not their role, if this situation were reversed the Republicans would be screaming bloody murder.

What do you expect when we have a Foreign Leadership vacuum in Washington?

"What do you expect when we have a Foreign Leadership vacuum in Washington?"

The only vacuum in Washington is inside some Republican heads.

#7 | Posted by cjk85 at 2009-10-09 12:32 PM
***"maybe you should try and read the post above mine uranus."

I did. And, I read the article. And, I read the Wiki pages on Zeleya, which contains the complete backstory...

They are saying exactly what you said they should be saying. Obama IS supporting Zeleya, so is the international community...

Repubs Meet Honduran Coup Leader

No doubt-looking for ways to accomplish it here.......

This issue isn't as simple as the Republicans would like it to be...

The fact is that Zeleya wasn't trying to extend his term in office. Zeleya was trying to establish a "National Constituent Assembly". This assembly would have allowed labor groups, farmers and civil organizations to have a say in a political system that is controlled by wealthy. And, the establishment of the "NCA" had strong support within these groups, as-well-as in the population in general...

Honduras media is controlled exclusively by the same wealthy entities as is the political system, so anti Zeleya propaganda was commonplace, and the political pressure to oppose his NCA poll, that would have given Hondurans the ability to rewrite there own constitution, was overwhelming amongst the ruling factions in Honduras...

What Zeleya was trying to accomplish wasn't "unconstitutional". The NCA was an initiative that could have undermined the control that the wealthy ruling class in Honduras has enjoyed for decades, so it was extremely unpopular within Honduran leadership...

And, since Zelaya's actions were not illegal. And, given the fact that the NCA wouldn't have even been established until after the election that would have constitutionally ended his presidency, thus making it impossible for him to "extend his presidential term", (as were the accusations that led to his expatriation), Zeleya's removal from office and subsequent expatriation were by definition, a coup. And, "the coup" itself was unconstitutional, because the Honduran Constitution prohibits the handing over or expatriation of Honduran citizens...

So, in the end, Obama is supporting the illegally ousted Honduran President, and this group of "rogue" Republican US Senators are undermining US relations in the region by supporting the illegal Honduran government (that gained control by force) through acknowledging them openly against the wishes of the acting US President...

But, it's not really that surprising, Republicans aligning themselves with wealthy illegitimate foreign regimes; business as usual...

Republicans assisting thugs overthrowing a legitimately elected President...what else is new.

"The underlying story is Chavez.. and Zelaya's attempt to not only align with him but emulate him.. and exactly why the Obama administration has given not only tacit approval to Zelaya, but has expressed open hostility to the political and military figures in Honduras that have opposed him."

No, it's called democracy. The military stepped in and stopped a leader from holding a democratic election to see if his people wanted him to serve another term. Think of FDR, same thing here in the states(only in reverse). Zelaya does align with chavez in the fact that he wants his people to choose their destiny, in a democratic election. Whether or not you agree with the idealogy, the fact that he is trying to hold democratic elections is the true Freedom being crushed in a tianamen square like act and yet it's obama that is somehow linked to teh commies?

LM


You have righty pols traveling to Honduras and China and bad mouthing the US and they call themselves patriots.

The Dixie chicks did the same thing, but have no input on national policy, and the right screamed they were un-American.

Which is it, retards?

The nerve of Hondurans thinking they could elect a president who would do what they want instead of what the wealthy elite want. Republicans who met with the coup leaders show how much respect they actually have for democracy. Their attitude is reflected in the Obama hatred which we have witnessed since the election. Like they say, "we want our country back", well in Honduras they actually took it back.
One question, will Zelaya be allowed to run in the elections the coup leaders claim will be held???

Zeleya wasn't trying to get his presidential term extended. He was trying to establish a National Constituents Assembly that would have allowed the Honduran people to amend and/or rewrite there constitution in part, or in whole.

This "Assembly" wouldn't have even been established until after his term ended, so it couldn't have had any effect on his term of office...

Brought to you by the "Coup Brings Peace" brigade of the "republican" party!


HAR HAR!

"It was not a coup," said Rep. Doug Lamborn (R.-Colo.).
Wasn't your place, dipshit.

Win the next presidential election and then your party can make that determination.

I kind of wish the administration would crack down on this bull shit, but how can that be accomplished without crossing the line between the executive and legislative branches?

Oh come on... you would have to be hyper-partisan to believe that Zelaya was a President for the people and that what he was doing was legitimate. When they searched his computer they found documentation certifying the referendum had passed! A referendum that was never held!

If you paid any attention to what has been happening in Honduras (I don't think reading a Wiki page counts) you would know that the public protests have been overwhelmingly in favor of the current administration (e.g. opposed to Zelaya). And you would know that full and open elections are going to be held on November 29th. Elections overseen by an independent election council that Zelaya refused to fund. I guess he was too busy funding his priorities including...

L. 4,411,500 Publicity without bidding
L. 4,915,617 Helicopter rental
L. 4,172,385 Airplane rental
L. 1,565,436 Jewelry
L. 780,000 Caretaker for Cafe, his horse
L. 400,000 Fuel for helicopter rental
L. 280,000 Stereo for his personal vehicle
L. 228,330 Oil paintings
L. 102,204 Supplies, etc., for Cafe, his horse
L. 97,974 Wine
L. 50,255 Cigars
L. 40,000 Sculptures
L. 20,515 Motorcycle repairs

L. = Lempira. $1 = ~19 Lempira.

In accordance with the Honduran constitution Zelaya ceased to be President once he started exploring modifying the constitution to extend the term of the Presidency. He is nothing more than a wannabe dictator for life.

The country's Congress and courts, alarmed by Zelaya's political shift into a close alliance with leftist Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez and Cuba, backed Zelaya's removal.

He was arrested on orders of the Supreme Court on charges of treason and abuse of power for ignoring court orders against holding a popular referendum on reforming the constitution.

Micheletti said Zelaya sought to remove a ban on re-election grounds for immediate removal from office under the Honduran constitution.

what part of that is so hard to understand?

Who ever called his election a 'coup'? I can't think of one rightie, much less all of them.

Rush and Sowell have both called it a coup. Also Briebart-Matt Drudge's main news source.

But there should be no surprise as to Republicans flocking to coup organizers. I was Republican saint Ronnie Reagan who committed treason by selling weapons to the mad ayatollahs in Iran who over threw the Shah. And gave gifts to Saddam, who overthrew the elected Iraqi government.

LIMBAUGH: Obama won this election by 10 million votes, but this is not what he had a mandate to do. This is -- I would describe what Obama is doing to this country is basically a coup. It is just -- it is just frightening.

Typical bed-wetting whiny rightwinger, there, too, also Goat.

#18 | POSTED BY CAPT_OF_URANUS


The Captain is right on the money.

Some hear the words "Supreme Court", "Constitution", etc., and assume that they have the same meaning in Honduras that they do state-side. However, there's much more to the situation than that.

The Honduran constitution under discussion now is basically the 1982 version that gives the military almost total control over the country's political and economic affairs. It was the dictate of General Plicarpo Paz Garcia who was President of Honduras from August 7, 1978 until January 27, 1982. The military had ruled Honduras almost continuously since 1963, and Paz was the last of the generals of the ruling junta to hold Honduras's Presidency. To this day, the senior leadership of the Honduran Army, The Supreme Council of the Armed Forces, basically chooses its own members from within (the Honduran congress receives a list of candidates from the leadership of the military and chooses the military leaderships new members from that list).

Honduran politics is almost impossible to understand from an American perspective. We hear the terms "constitution" and "representative democracy" and think of something quite different from what the Honduran system actually is - which is not democracy at all. At least not the way American's understand democracy.

In Honduras seven party bosses controlled by 10 or so wealthy families determine who the people may choose to vote for. This includes the country's president, the congress and all local officials. No one can participate without the patronage of the junta that rules from behind the scenes.

...

Under Honduras's constitution, for instance, indigenous groups and African descendants have no land rights. The land that they occupy and work for their meager livings belongs to the nation (military).

Any call for redress of grievance against the government must be brought through government employed attorneys. Citizens do not have the right to privately petition their government; all complaints must only be brought through the government operated apparatus - there is no other way.

Much has been made by the coup's supporters of the fact that the Honduran Supreme Court ordered the military to proceed with the coup and that the Honduran congress was acting under a legal decree from the court to elect and install the replacement president. Its choice, Roberto Micheletti, has been a Honduran political kingpin for more than thirty years (that's a catchy Spanish surname, "Micheletti").

To put this in context; the Honduran congress, which is hand-chosen by the Honduran military, selects the members of the Honduran Supreme Court. All power is vested in one continuum.


The history in Honduras' closet...

Meanwhile, tighties see a leftist with popular support, trying to do something for the most oppressed of his constituents, and piss their pants.

If, in an alternate universe, Zelaya were amenable to the agenda of Big Business and happened to be forced out of office in the wee hours of the morning by a military junta, these same people would be screaming from the rooftops about an antidemocatic coup.

How could a Honduran possibly want Republicans from the USA to come meddle in their affairs? Don't these people remember Nicaragua?

What's that you say? It's the super-rich who control everything fishing for Republican "aid?" Well that explains a lot.

Are they looking for tips on how to get the guy they dont like out of this country's office?

To arrest a president at gunpoint and expel him from the country amounts to a coup d'etat. There are reasons to believe that Zelaya violated the Constitution. In these cases, a democratic country would start a trial.

By the way, W's election was a coup d'etat.

In 2001, the OAS approved a democratic clause to isolate undemocratic governments originated by coups d'etat. That's why Obama and the rest of the democratically-elected governments os the continent support Zelaya's return to power.

By the way, W's election was a coup d'etat.

Get over it

I watched an interesting program on Peru. A Peruvian politician, angered by the Shining Path terrorist organization and looming civil war, studied how the Swiss managed to make a coherent country of national law and prosperous economy out of all their various duchies with 100's of different codes of law slightly over 100 years ago.

He was successful in getting over 400 bills passed in the Peruvian legislature. The one that led to the most economic success was titling all the land in the country to those who owned it - from the very rich in the cities to the very poor farmers. Credit started flowing and slums are turning into prospering neighborhoods and entrepreneurship skyrocketed and anyone with an idea for a business could get it started. A business license that used to take 280 days can now be gotten in one. Many other helpful changes were made.

Their sustained 4.5% annual growth rate is the highest in South America. Such a plan might work well in Honduras and other 3rd world Latin American countries.

Not only economic success in Peru, but an end to the Shining Path and sympathy for it. When Peruvians were given the opportunity to get title to their land they dropped support for the Shining Path.

the swiss,give me a break.they profited from the wars that ravaged europe and their secret banking laws to harvest what should have been paid to local governments in taxes?Peru maybe working out but bad comparison.Are they going to hang their previous Japanese leader who fought the Shining Path?extrajudicialistly.Who is now going to trial.

Bruce

Absolutely true. But, 100 years ago Switzerland didn't have a thriving economy because of the disparate nature of their laws and government. That was the aspect the Peruvian politician was studying and put into practice.

it's not really that surprising, Republicans aligning themselves with wealthy illegitimate foreign regimes; business as usual...

THIS.

These rtards is coup-coup.

Be Well.

The only vacuum in Washington is inside some Republican heads.

#10 | Posted by danni at 2009-10-09 12:49 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yes, of course, because having a "D" after your name automatically means your brain is chock-full of grey matter goodness!

What a tiresome hack.

I think it's interesting that every part of the world that was colonized by Spain has the same endemic problem: Mestizo.

Spain installed feudal governments with a ruling elite group of families (from Spain) and 99% peasantry. And in all of those places today you still see that system in place.

(Turn on any Latin America TV channel and you see the standard of beauty is white European -- even though those of Spanish descent are few. Because of America's long history with the Philippines, it's being half-American that confers status.)

20 generations deep, the Mestizo control everything -- banks, real estate, government, etc. -- and have no incentive to use their power to improve the lives of the citizens.

They've been raised to believe that they are superior, and so peasants deserve their misery.

Vernon,excellant post,

headline and ANYTIME THe word coup is used the story is finshed before it begins.

and its comletely logical that the party who is doing everything they can to ignore our constitution is all about these people ignoring theirs.

Imagine if George Bush had decided to run for a third term, and the Supreme Court said no. Then he chose to anyhow.

But it matters not. Zelaya is a libbie, and so it should be all-okay if he wants to rule for life.

And the poster above is right: Obama hasn't really had a peep to say about it. He probably doesn't know what to do to "triangulate" a position that simultaneously offends no one, and everyone.

"Spain installed feudal governments with a ruling elite group of families (from Spain) and 99% peasantry. And in all of those places today you still see that system in place."

I've noticed the same thing but generally I connected it to Catholicism. Notice, Ireland too was quite backwards and dominated by England as was Scotland too. It just always seemed to me that where Protestantism took hold the peasants were more likely to demand equality and higher wages.
I think Catholocism encourages peasants to be more accepting of authority figures.

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