Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs

A national surge of homeless schoolchildren -- driven by relentless unemployment and foreclosures -- can be ruinous to their learning, educators say. "We see 8-year-olds telling Mom not to worry, don't cry," said Bill Murdock of Eblen-Kimmel Charities in North Carolina. An estimated one million schoolchildren are currently homeless in the U.S.

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And the imagined connection you imply is what?

I know this won't go over well with a lot of Drudgies, but this really eats at me. We're coddling bankers and allowing children to be thrown out on the street. In the meantime, President Obama is poised to give a "try harder in school" speech. Can we just call it "Beaumont II"? Even if he forgets to suggest that children from poor families underperform because they eat cold Popeye's for breakfast?

And the imagined connection you imply is what? -- #1 | Posted by Diablo

I'm connecting homelessness with foreclosures and unemployment that resulted from reckless banking practices.

Do you really think that's such a stretch?


I know this won't go over well with a lot of Drudgies, but this really eats at me. We're coddling bankers and allowing children to be thrown out on the street. In the meantime, President Obama is poised to give a "try harder in school" speech. Can we just call it "Beaumont II"? Even if he forgets to suggest that children from poor families underperform because they eat cold Popeye's for breakfast?

Posted by Phoenix at 2009-09-07 01:05 AM | Reply

Huh?? Enlighten Me please.

"Beaumont II"? -- Posted by Phoenix

Huh?? Enlighten Me please. -- #4 | Posted by LarryMohr

A few days before the Texas primary, Obama chose to demonstrate his toughness on blacks by giving a speech in Beaumont, TX which included the following:

Y'all have Popeyes out in Beaumont? I know some of y'all you got that cold Popeyes out for breakfast. I know. That's why y'all laughing. ... You can't do that. Children have to have proper nutrition. That affects also how they study, how they learn in school." www.suntimes.com

THANKS A MILLION. I appreciate it Pheonix

Larry

"I'm connecting homelessness with foreclosures and unemployment that resulted from reckless banking practices.
"Do you really think that's such a stretch?"

Not at all, Phoenix. I just find it difficult to believe the Times posted these articles side by side just to piss you off.
As far as the two topics being connected....yep, you are right. They are. Sad to say.
Jesus said it best: "The poor will always be with you."

BTW, Phoenix, I apologize if you took my first post as an insult.

Jesus said it best: "The poor will always be with you."

So,fuck'em,this oil feels good on my feet,Judas

You know, bruce, I am so glad you posted that. I often have resisted pointing out to the "sell the Vatican artwork and give it to the poor" sophists that it was Judas the betrayer who first suggested it.
St. John made it clear Judas went to sell out Jesus right after he had been corrected about this sort of nonsense.

Diablo,
Interesting response,I figured you'd just go nuts.Now that I've been corrected I wish I could get a few pieces of silver for your ass,Lol.

"sell the Vatican artwork

Besides the people who could afford to buy it aren't much better

If you could get silver for my ass, bruce, you'd be the most powerful con on the cellblock.
My ass is more in the copper range at my age anyway...

My ass is more in the copper range at my age anyway...

I'll work on my alchemy and get back to you

I just find it difficult to believe the Times posted these articles side by side just to piss you off. -- #7 | Posted by Diablo

I wasn't being sarcastic when I referred to the juxtaposition as brilliant. I'm disgusted by the Obama administration, not by the Times.

I apologize if you took my first post as an insult. -- #8 | Posted by Diablo

Thanks, but no worries. That was pretty tame by DR standards!

bankers get bailouts.

fuck you.

sop.

"Honey, I lost my job today."
"Gee, me too. And they repossessed the car too."
"What should we do?"
"This calls for drastic action. Let's think about it after we've had our summer vacation".

Do you really think that's such a stretch?

#3 | Posted by Phoenix

Could be if you don't include that way too many people bought homes they couldn't afford. But...... I guess everyone needs a 'starter castle'. We can't be living in a 1,700 sf house when the neighbors have a 3,000 sf one. My god, we need a 3 car garage to put all our crap in when we have 2 cars. Them big houses just don't fit on a normal city lot, we need 5 acres so we can spend all of our spare time doing yard work.

How bout them apples pho?

...way too many people bought homes they couldn't afford. But...... I guess everyone needs a 'starter castle'...How bout them apples pho? -- #19 | Posted by Sniper

Several years ago, state attorneys general and others involved in consumer protection began to notice a marked increase in a range of predatory lending practices by mortgage lenders. Some were misrepresenting the terms of loans, making loans without regard to consumers' ability to repay, making loans with deceptive "teaser" rates that later ballooned astronomically, packing loans with undisclosed charges and fees, or even paying illegal kickbacks. These and other practices, we noticed, were having a devastating effect on home buyers. In addition, the widespread nature of these practices, if left unchecked, threatened our financial markets...
www.washingtonpost.com

The article continues with details of the Bush Administration's fight against state AG's who tried to curb predatory lending practices. Worth a read.

During the Reagan administration the sayings "greed is good" and "deficits don't matter" became popular and none of today's Obama critics noticed anything wrong with that. During the recent Bush administration a man who had already said that if he were elected president he would engage us in war to increase his own power actually made good on that promise and the same crowd said nothing. Then that same man, for the first time in American history, enacted big tax cuts during that war and paid for the war off-budget and that same crowd again was silent.
Now a new president is in office who is desperately trying to figure a way out of those war, out of that debt and that same crowd won't STFU for a second.
Seems to me there is a pattern here.
Seems to me that the same folks who called others traitors for opposing the unnecessary war are revealing their true character and sorry but the word patriot simply does not come to mind.
We used to laugh about the post...
why does ______ hate America so much???
But why do they??? REally, why do they???

Yep Phoenix and it happened to me. Closing went up by well over 1000 bucks 3 days before closing. At closing the loan docs were different by a fair margin including almost a full percent higher interest rate than initial docs. Additionally in order to make it fit at the higher rate the lender removed escrow meaning that suddenly I had the mortgage I agreed on except it would cost me a grand a more a year in taxes and insurance. I would have walked away on the spot but my landlord was kicking me out and I had already been in court 2x to stay there and one more month would have put me back in court, plus I would have been out the 500 I had already paid.

No it was all the borrowers fault because a 80k 1300 sq ft condo is just ridiculous on a 40k a year annual income. Yep I went way over my head I admit I was a young dad who really did not know anything so yes in a way I went in over my head, I just assumed that the people I was paying to look out for me would.

Ah well live and learn, don't trust bankers, lenders, realtors, lawyers (although I knew that).


"Now a new president is in office who is desperately trying to figure a way out of those war, out of that debt is right..."

"(D)esperately" is right...now we have more large consolidated banks than ever...

www.john-f-kennedy.net

We have a Democrat in the White House and Democrats control Congress and the Senate...

Why is this happening?

Now a new president is in office who is desperately trying to figure a way out of those war, out of that debt and that same crowd won't STFU for a second.

#21 | Posted by danni

He's desparate with the war, probably because he doesn't know what he's doing.

He's NOT desparately trying to get out of debt. Are you kidding?

Obama has absolutely no concern about creating new jobs. If he did, then he would not have done this stupid Stimlus and would not be fucking with Health Care the way he's doing.

Are you kidding me!!!!

The truth is that Obama and the Dems in Congress completely miscalculated and thought that the country was behind them on these programs. They are not.

Jobs are being lost still today when we should be recovering.

This is Obama's economy.

making loans without regard to consumers' ability to repay, making loans with deceptive "teaser" rates that later ballooned astronomically, packing loans with undisclosed charges and fees, or even paying illegal kickbacks.

#20 | Posted by Phoenix

So, I guess the person taking out the loan has no responsiblity for their actions. Are you insane?

My daughter took out one of thoes variable rate loans and as soon as I found out about that we had a serious chat and she changed it to a fixed rate loan. Difference is, her house was used and only cost $80k, not $500k like some loons did.

"This is Obama's economy."

In your talking point world yes, in reality no.
The economy was destroyed pre-Obama that is just a simple fact. No one could have brought about a recovery by now. The majority of Americans understand that why can't you???

Consider, too, that for some people the variable rate makes sense, if it's capped that is.

We bought our house on a 3/1 ARM (Adjustable Rate Mortgage). Because we had to (not buying beyond our means, however--it's 1100 square feet and needs work)--we couldn't get a fixed rate that gave us a mortgage we could afford. Two years later, we refinanced, and now we have a 7/1 ARM. The interest rate of both these loans was lower than the current fixed-rate mortgages being offered. Go figure. You just have to watch it and re-fi before the 1 part of the ARM kicks in. (That first number is the number of years for which it is fixed. The second is the rate at which it will go up, as in annually thereafter. And the rise was capped at 2%, but that adds up fast if you let it.)

My father, a Realtor and MBA, suggests that fixed rate makes sense mostly if you _know_ you're going to be in that house for the long term. But if you expect not to be, you're better off with ARM because the rates are lower. Well, he explained it better than I can.

All that said, yes, it's the fault of the person taking the loan, but there is such a thing as predatory lending practices and taking advantage of people who don't know enough.

I thought it was interesting that McCain was talking about changing bankruptcies and such, when the Republican party mantra is personal responsibility. I sorta think that if you live that mantra, you should say, "Screw 'em; they were stupid enough to buy it." Others have pointed out that there are property-value issues that affect whole neighborhoods if you take the screw-'em approach. I dunno.

My father, a Realtor and MBA, suggests that fixed rate makes sense mostly if you _know_ you're going to be in that house for the long term. But if you expect not to be, you're better off with ARM because the rates are lower. Well, he explained it better than I can.

#28 | Posted by pragmatist

That only works if you have a market for your house.

Every time you re-finance, you have to come up with a bunch of money to do it. I hope you saved enough to pay for that.

pra, I don't have enough money to clean up after all the STUPID people here in the US. My pocket book says screw them. If you feel different, help someone out with their house payment. Hay, pick someone you don't even know.

#31--Dude, I was pretty much agreeing with you. But granting that I'm somewhat conflicted. And also pointing out there's more to the argument. If you wanna get pissed at me, go read a different thread, where I really did disagree and might even have been rude to you.

#30--Did you read my note. Re-fi has nothing to do with selling. But yes, my plot depends on the idea that you will one day have a market for your house. Ye gods, in seven years--oh, wait, it's six years now--you don't think there will be a market for my home? (There's that Wayforward Machine again.) And if you need closing costs to re-fi, you have a terrible lender. We didn't pay a red cent for the re-fi. Again, as noted, my father explained it better than I can. We did the first deal because it was that or not buy. And we found a nice solution. Whether that's possible in every physical market (city to city, I mean) or in every economic market (2007 vs. now, say), I have no idea. But seven years is a long time in markets. I'm not worried. If we're so fucked that my lender won't allow re-fi at no or minimal cost, then we're probably in much deeper trouble across the nation than I want to think about. (And quite likely that will mean the middle class is truly gone, and people in my financial boat are well and truly fucked.)

And by the by, back to the education part, poor children often do underperform, and for lots of reasons. Look at the data, naysayers. It's not 'cause they're poor as such, nor because some are identified as "at risk" (hi, JonRyker). It has to do with myriad factors: nutrition, space to work, emphasis on education, being read to (vocabulary), culture of poverty... The list goes on and on. (And none of that is to say that X rich kid will do better than X poor kid in every situation. That would be a foolish extrapolation of available data.)

Sniper,

I just gave an example of them taking advantage of people a pretty personal one, and yes I feel stupid but at the same time I was left with no choice when my landlord sold the place I was renting and the new owner sent an eviction notice the same day she closed on the place. Which happened to be the day before my sister-in-law died so on the same day her sister died my wife got an eviction notice and we got full custody of a new child. Have to say that was one of the worst days of my life. So with a family of now 5 I had 10 days to find a new house. Yes I chose badly when I financed this place but since it was well within my means it has not been a crisis but it has cut into my money pretty significantly especialy when my income dropped 3 months after buying it and I got Dx with MS a year later.

Once again I don't blame anyone life just hands you a big pile of shit some times, but to lay it all on the buyers heads is false too. I was lied to and because of my housing situation I had limited options.

Oh and Prag if you want to clean up someones mess you don't know you can send me some money :) You too sniper for that matter. If not I think I have it under control.

During the Reagan administration the sayings "greed is good" and "deficits don't matter" became popular and none of today's Obama critics noticed anything wrong with that. -- #21 | Posted by danni

I did, Danni. I'm a left-wing critic of Obama, not a right-winger.

My daughter took out one of thoes variable rate loans and as soon as I found out about that we had a serious chat and she changed it to a fixed rate loan. -- #26 | Posted by Sniper

So you're saying your own daughter (who I presume is not a moron) was duped by a mortgage broker, and got out of a bad deal only because she had a good Dad who was watching out for her.

Not exactly a ringing defense of the mortgage/banking industry.

Phoenix, funny.

And Tao--What, first I give you book lists and now you want money! Da noive! : )~

LOL,

Prag I will never turn down money or book lists!

The two go really well together in fact ;)

As far as the real issue unless you are a mortage broker or real estate broker or someone close to the industry it is very difficult to figure out and if it is your first house all but impossible. I did a ton of research and still got caught, granted I was stressed and rushing things but still I'm not exactly a moron myself.

Dude, I was pretty much agreeing with you. But granting that I'm somewhat conflicted. And also pointing out there's more to the argument. If you wanna get pissed at me, go read a different thread, where I really did disagree and might even have been rude to you.

#32 | Posted by pragmatist

My post wasn't being pissed at you. You must have a thin skin.

So you're saying your own daughter (who I presume is not a moron)

#36 | Posted by Phoenix

Thats quite an assumption. At the time she thought she had money because she still had check blanks. My other daughter and I have to keep a close eye on her and her husband all the time.

Like tao said, sometimes life deals you some stuff but you have to deal with it.

"My post wasn't being pissed at you. You must have a thin skin."

Not at all. I just like drama. But you missed my point anyway (the first time). It's all good. I don't give a single shit really. : ) But I realize now I should have said "pissy with" not "pissed at." (That was playful, in case you don't see it. Drama and playing with words--that's me. Whee.)

True, Tao, true. I too would like some extra cash and some time to visit my local (independent) bookstore. Then of course, I need time to read the damned books. Maybe in February, after I get through the new course once and figure out more clearly how to do it and which books I'm using...

I love estimated numbers. Have you ever seen any recently which were underestimated? [with the exception of projected numbers to push through a new govt program]

i must be drunk. after reading this thread am i to be convinced the so-called gap between the have and the have-not is a ruse by both (cahoots means no correlation)?

is that bacon i smell?

"The poor will always be with you."

Of course.

Some people will always have more than others.

The idea that the everyone in the world will all live on the same annual salary is a pipedream.

The only real question that exists is "how much disparity can be tolerated before a full blown class war becomes imminent?"

To truly judge a civilisation one doesn't look into the lives of the elites but into the lives of the humblest folk and into the prisons.

By those standards nobody on earth deserve to call it "civilisation" just yet.

Here's a story about an estimated one million homeless school aged kids existing at a time when the disparity between rich and poor has never been higher in America.

American policies have impacted the governments of other nations on the earth for years through the auspices of the IMF and World Bank. Encouraging reductions in social programs and huge breaks for the corporatists. This has tended to leave a neo-fuedal state where a handful of extremely rich folks exploit a vast majority of poor folk with just enough midle class left in between to service the elites.

The "client state" mentality is now coming home to roost in the US.

Meanwhile the traditional virulant anti-commie propaganda has weakened to a point where many no longer reflexively shirk away from discussing class in America, the real four letter word in American politics.

Thast's a hopeful sign.

One million homeless school age kids kids in a country as rich as America is shameful and needs to be addressed.

Can we all just agree on that fer a start?

Be Well.

You know, bruce, I am so glad you posted that. I often have resisted pointing out to the "sell the Vatican artwork and give it to the poor" sophists that it was Judas the betrayer who first suggested it.
St. John made it clear Judas went to sell out Jesus right after he had been corrected about this sort of nonsense.

#10 | Posted by Diablo at 2009-09-07 01:56 AM | Reply | Flag:

An earlier copy of the scripture found a fgew years back said that Jesus ASKED Judas to betray him, and had to convince him to do so.

Guess you missed the memo.

Closing went up by well over 1000 bucks 3 days before closing. At closing the loan docs were different by a fair margin including almost a full percent higher interest rate than initial docs. Additionally in order to make it fit at the higher rate the lender removed escrow meaning that suddenly I had the mortgage I agreed on except it would cost me a grand a more a year in taxes and insurance. I would have walked away on the spot but my landlord was kicking me out and I had already been in court 2x to stay there and one more month would have put me back in court, plus I would have been out the 500 I had already paid.
#22 | Posted by TaoWarrior

--Sooo, you signed up for a bad long term commitment that cost you $1000 at that moment because you didn't want to lose the $500? WTF?
Plus you were such a deadbeat you made your land lord take you to court TWICE? to get from you what you had already agreed to pay?!?!

WHAT A DEADBEAT FUCKING ASSHOLE! Sorry, I have been a landlord, and there are many many people who still owe me many $100's each for being UnWise. Oh, I decided my child should have a good Christmas present, so I spent the rent money on a really cool race track set, that he now has to setup in an Alley since DAddy got us evicted for his stupid fucking decision! There I go again... sorry, lots of people think cuz you are their land lord, you should be their daddy.

No it was all the borrowers fault because a 80k 1300 sq ft condo is just ridiculous on a 40k a year annual income.
#22 | Posted by TaoWarrior
Calculator says you should be bringing home about $3000 per month and paying about $700, how is it you can't afford that?

You shoule be able to affort a mortgage that is 2X's your anual salary, unless you are eating out every day, and don't know how to cook a pot of beans to feed your family for a week on $10. MORON!

LEARN TO COOK PEOPLE!!! It doesn't cost that much to feed your family if you spend a little time and get a CLUE! There I go again, too much coffee this AM.

Be well, and don't make stupid long term decision to cover a short term gain.

mar, you are correct, you can buy a cheep roast and a few vegies, throw it in a crock pot before you go to work in the morning and presto, a cheep, good meal when you get home at night. Cheeper than happy meals for the family at the golden crotch. It ain't hard.

DS quotes the Bible for sure, thank you.

as to the rest of that post: simply put, self-evident, and, i surely hope so. yet, i can't help but recall the

recall the famous Churchill (and others), and i've repeated it here before: The darkest hour is the one before dawn.

we probably have quite a ways to go before then.


Plus you were such a deadbeat you made your land lord take you to court TWICE? to get from you what you had already agreed to pay?!?!

No fuck head do you have reading comprehension issues? She gave me 10 day notice when she bought the property I took her to court to not be evicted before the end of the month which I had paid the previous landlord for. I won then at the end of the month I paid her for 1 more month and she said she didn't want it she wanted me out. I took her to court to stay that extra month to close on a house, sorry how many families of 5 have you evicted for no reason? Oh and she kept the security deposit despite the house being in good shape considering we had lived there 9 years.

--Sooo, you signed up for a bad long term commitment that cost you $1000 at that moment because you didn't want to lose the $500? WTF?

No the 500 was the least of the issues see above for the rest of the rush.

Calculator says you should be bringing home about $3000 per month and paying about $700, how is it you can't afford that?


You shoule be able to affort a mortgage that is 2X's your anual salary, unless you are eating out every day, and don't know how to cook a pot of beans to feed your family for a week on $10. MORON!


LEARN TO COOK PEOPLE!!! It doesn't cost that much to feed your family if you spend a little time and get a CLUE! There I go again, too much coffee this AM.

You try feeding a family of 5 on 10 bucks a week sorry even beans and rice cost more than that. We do it on 150 a week and that includes gas, I don't know the last time we ate out. As far as the 3k a month like I already said my income dropped 3mo. after buying the place and I got MS a year after that, any guess how much it costs to have MS even with health insurance?

Keep on being sanctimonius it will work well till your world colapses on you. Trust me on this you sound a lot like me a couple years ago.

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