Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Monday, October 13, 2008

In my career in advertising and publishing, I have reviewed the portfolios of a thousand professional writers, but only a handful of these writers would have been capable of having a written a book as stylish as Dreams. I have also written a book on intellectual fraud, Hoodwinked, and examined any number of bogus biographies. Obama's ascent seems to follow a century-old pattern.

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I don't agree with the guy's conclusion, but it certainly is an interesting article.

More from the article:

"I bought Bill Ayers' 2001 memoir, Fugitive Days, for reasons unrelated to this project. As I discovered, he writes surprisingly well and very much like "Obama." In fact, my first thought was that the two may have shared the same ghostwriter. Unlike Dreams, however, where the high style is intermittent, Fugitive Days is infused with the authorial voice in every sentence. What is more, when Ayers speaks, even off the cuff, he uses a cadence and vocabulary consistent with his memoir. One does not hear any of Dreams in Obama's casual speech."

Tracing Obama's literary ascent is complicated by what Politico.com calls a "scant paper trail." That trail begins at Occidental College whose literary magazine published two of Obama's poems -- "Pop" and "Underground" -- in 1981. Obama calls it some "very bad poetry," and he does not sell himself short. From "Underground":


Under water grottos, caverns


Filled with apes


That eat figs.


Stepping on the figs


That the apes


Eat, they crunch.


The apes howl, bare


Their fangs, dance . . .


It would be another decade before Obama had anything in print and this an edited, unsigned student case comment in the Harvard Law Review unearthed by Politico. Attorneys who reviewed the piece for Politico described it as "a fairly standard example of the genre."


Of note, Politico reporters Ben Smith and Jeffrey Resner observe that "the temperate legal language doesn't display the rhetorical heights that run through his memoir, published a few years later."

Grasping

at straws

making

buffoons

of

themselves

as

it slips

away

Joe,

After you posted that BS about McCain's health insurance tax plan last week, I thought you'd post something solid as a follow -up.

Nope

Just when you thought the right couldn't get any more petty and pathetic in their attempts to demonize Obama...

What a bunch of losers.

Clearly nobody's even bothering to read the article. Par for the course.

"After you posted that BS about McCain's health insurance tax plan last week, I thought you'd post something solid as a follow -up."

I followed up enough in that thread. The fact that workers will be paid more when their employers no longer pay for health-care, and thus workers will incur additional payroll taxes on their higher salaries, does not amount to McCain's plan resulting in a "taxation of healthcare benefits." If you are too stupid to see that, no follow-up is necessary.

JOE

Only a fool would think employers pass on savings to their employees as higher salary. Perhaps an iota of them, but 99% don't.

"Only a fool would think employers pass on savings to their employees as higher salary. Perhaps an iota of them, but 99% don't."

In that case, Obama needs to find a new argument to support the allegation that McCain's plan will result in "healthcare benefits being taxed."

But in case you didn't notice, there was already a thread about that. This thread is about something else that none of you want to address.

JOE

McCain's plan would tax employers health care benefits as wages. You know....literally.

"This thread is about something else that none of you want to address."

There's nothing to address.
No proof.
No verifiable conclusion.
No "there" there.

Clearly nobody's even bothering to read the article. Par for the course - JOE


I have, and I would venture that this is, even to my jaded eyes, a grotesquely tortured attempt to make allegations about Obama that are based on less than nothing. It ought to be mind-boggling that somebody would even make the effort to come up with trash like this. Sadly it is all too common in this sad era of character assassination by proxy.

"Clearly nobody's even bothering to read the article. Par for the course - JOE"

I could find a hundred articles in 2 minutes more worthy of my time than this goofy shit.


Cashill is a pseudo-intellectual right wing hack who writes pseudo-intellectual right wing books for pseudo-intellectual right wing publishers.

"based on less than nothing"

The article is based on a comparison of Dreams to other items written by Obama, followed by a comparison of Dreams to Ayers' own book. The author of the article has welcomed any other input you and the others may have with regard to his idea.

Joe, shame on you. You might as well have posted an article about a candidate banning books from a library, cutting special needs school funding, being a member of a State Independence Party, avocating the teaching of creationism in Public schools or sleeping with a spouses best friend.
Asshole.

Funny thing is, I simply said it's an interesting article. I expected the typical knee-jerk reaction to any statement about Obama that doesn't come from his own mouth, and there it is.

He doesn't have one shred of evidence to back up his points, just a conspiracy theory and so-called coincidences. All the world loves a good conspiracy theory, but this is below you Joe. If you tried to use this in court you would be mocked to no end.


Funny thing is, I simply said it's an interesting article. I expected the typical knee-jerk reaction to any statement about Obama that doesn't come from his own mouth, and there it is.

#19 | Posted by JOE

Yeah, finding an open-minded Obama supporter is like finding a NASCAR driver who's good at turning right.

W, are you saying one can't be open minded if they don't buy into this hit piece?

"If you tried to use this in court"

Thing is, this site isn't court, as has been demonstrated time and again by everyone else who posts here. If I'm going to be held to that standard then good luck having time to reprimand everyone else here for that.

"All the world loves a good conspiracy theory, but this is below you Joe."

Again - my very first post in the thread was that I don't buy his conclusion but that I find the article to be interesting. Explain how finding something interesting is below anyone.

Everyone else is doing, so why not you?

W and his band of thugs cured us of believing anything coming out of the mouth of a Republicans these days.

So you don't believe it is true just an interesting theory, or do you think it could be true?

"Everyone else is doing, so why not you?"

Wrong again, because I don't endorse or agree with the article. I simply think it's worth reading. If you disagree, then say why, rather than holding me to a standard that you hold nobody else to.


W, are you saying one can't be open minded if they don't buy into this hit piece?

#22 | Posted by taxman

When did Joe or anyone claim you had to buy into it? It's the immediate tone from Obama supporters that make me laugh. Mention Ayers, Rev. Wright, Father Flager, George Obama etc., and you're either demonizing him or you're a racist. I first heard this story on Friday, and it can't be discussed?

I find it typical that Obama supporters are more focused on "figuring out" whether I personally agree with the story than they are with discussing or refuting the theory offered in the article.


W and his band of thugs cured us of believing anything coming out of the mouth of a Republicans these days.

#26 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

Its going to take more than a band of thugs to change a coward and liar.

Wrong.

Mention Ayers, Rev WRight, Flager, or George Obama and we roll our eyes at the ludicrous claims Republicans continue to make.

I'd vote for my dog as long as he didn't have an "R" after his name. The 1994-Now Republicans cured me of ever trusting a word they say.

I voted for a few Republican presidential candidates. Most likely won't for the rest of my days after the lies and thuggery of what the GOP became, their members allowed, and their mouthpieces on the radio repeat as the truth day after fucking day.

Only an idiot would vote Republican until the GOP begins behaving like adults who value America and the Constitution.

because I don't endorse or agree

Thank you.

WISGOD

You're not even good at being an effective asshole

I'd vote for my dog as long as he didn't have an "R" after his name.
Posted by AMERICANUNITY

At least you've finally admitted to being nothing more than a blind follower. Its a good start.

What's to thank for? Providing you with a snippet of text that keeps you from wetting your pants over what someone else might think? How about discussing the article - or is that beneath you too? How does someone like Obama go from writing the garbage poem quoted above to something as eloquent as Dreams?

"Funny thing is, I simply said it's an interesting article."

Funny that Joe never manages to find "interesting" articles critical of the right.

It's the immediate tone from Obama supporters that make me laugh

I read the whole damn article, and then posted a response. How is that an immediate reaction?

At least you've finally admitted to being nothing more than a blind follower. Its a good start.

#35 | Posted by wisgod

Mark me as an 'anyone but liars, cheats, warmongers, and assholes' voter


How is that an immediate reaction?

#38 | Posted by taxman


If you tried to use this in court you would be mocked to no end.

#20 | Posted by taxman

or is that beneath you too

Why discuss something you obviously don't agree with or condone? I don't agree or condone it either so there is really nothing to discuss. If you don't agree with or condone it then you must feel it is baseless as well. If that is the case then we have no disagreement and there is no point in wasting each other's time.

"Funny that Joe never manages to find "interesting" articles critical of the right."

I don't need to take pointers from someone who posts articles about William Ayers being a "hero."

Funny that Joe never manages to find "interesting" articles critical of the right.

#37 | Posted by nullifidian at 2008-10-13 03:13 PM | Reply


Because if there is one thing missing on the retort it's balance. We need more articles critical of the right here...

"Why discuss something you obviously don't agree with or condone?"

Because it's worth examining - I simply said I don't agree with the conclusion. The questions raised in the article are certainly worth looking at given the stark difference between anything he'd written before and his bestselling book.

"I don't need to take pointers from someone who posts articles about William Ayers being a "hero.""

I didn't say that I agreed with the author's conclusion. I just found the article "interesting."

"We need more articles critical of the right here..."

I agree, Chair. Wink

I agree, Chair. Wink

#46 | Posted by nullifidian at 2008-10-13 03:23 PM | Reply


Did somebody get her a Red Rider BB Gun for Christmas or something?

Funny that Joe never manages to find "interesting" articles critical of the right.

#37 | Posted by nullifidian

In NeoConland only 'liberals' can be to blame for anything and everything - even if they have to reach back 3 decades to find a possible culprit.

I know because if my radio is still on an AM station from the night before some asshole is screaming the same thing he did in 1995. If I flip through the TV channels and pause on FOXNEWS some asshole is screaming the same thing he did in 1996.

"THEM!!!!"

The NeoCons got their shot and left one fucked up nation in their wake.

Well, I suppose that's it. When the Obama nuts come out full force and tell you something is unimportant, that simply makes it so. They take any and all allegations against Sarah Palin to be true and will post for days about them - but ask a question about Obama and be prepared to offer a notarized document written by God proclaiming it to be the truth.

Did somebody get her a Red Rider BB Gun for Christmas or something?

That was Frank2.5 funny.....

As I understand it, this guy's asserting Obama didn't right the book because it's too good.

Reminds me of the fellow who seriously asserted Italian food was too good tasting for Italians to have invented it.

"Didn't write...."

This allegation says much more about the allegers than the target. Anyone got any, er, tangible evidence of fraud out there? Anyone?

"tangible evidence"

We can start by comparing Dreams to everything else Obama has ever written. Is that tangible enough for you, or do you need Obama himself to come out and tell you he had a ghostwriter?

Here is another link with details.

I heard about this and thought no way--then after doing some research--I don't know if Ayers is the ghost writer--maybe the ghost helped write all of their books?

And it is odd that Obama won't provide a copy of the college thesis, nothing from the Harvard Review, no writings can be found.

But then again--

When your spiritual mentor is Rev Wright for 20 years.

Your first job is from Bill Ayers and friend for 20 years.

Your campaign finance manager is Tony Resko and friend for 17 years....

Anything is possible with this untruthful naked marxist. He has no character, hangs with the wrong kind of people, consistently bad judgment, and has to be the stupidest person on the planet with a Harvard degree.

Oops--here is the link

www.cashill.com

"We can start by comparing everything else Obama has written...."

The number of persons who have written one, really fine, work of prose and then did little or nothing else is legion.

The prose selections linked to that allegedly show similarity between Ayers' prose and that of Obama don't. You fellows do read now and again, do you not?

You've got the idiot in the link supplied stating Obama couldn't have finished the book in question in a year. It's a assertion he's just pulling out of his ass, one of several.

This is worse than grasping at straws. Obama should sue someone for libel.


You fellows do read now and again, do you not?


Why bother when you're all ankles up trying desperately to add dimension to ghost of innuendo and rumor?

MURPHY

Here's a couple items form the U.S. Prosecutor who prosecuted, among other Weathermen, Bill Ayers:


THE LETTER by William C. Ibershof:

As the lead federal prosecutor of the Weathermen in the 1970s (I was then chief of the criminal division in the Eastern District of Michigan and took over the Weathermen prosecution in 1972), I am amazed and outraged that Senator Barack Obama is being linked to William Ayers's terrorist activities 40 years ago when Mr. Obama was, as he has noted, just a child.

Although I dearly wanted to obtain convictions against all the Weathermen, including Bill Ayers, I am very pleased to learn that he has become a responsible citizen.

Because Senator Obama recently served on a board of a charitable organization with Mr. Ayers cannot possibly link the senator to acts perpetrated by Mr. Ayers so many years ago.

I do take issue with the statement in your news article that the Weathermen indictment was dismissed because of "prosecutorial misconduct." It was dismissed because of illegal activities, including wiretaps, break-ins and mail interceptions, initiated by John N. Mitchell, attorney general at that time, and W. Mark Felt, an F.B.I. assistant director.

William C. Ibershof

Mill Valley, Calif., Oct. 8, 2008

www.nytimes.com


Former Weatherman Prosecutor Decries William Ayers Link:

William C. Ibershof, who in 1973 tried to convict the former radical, is 'amazed and outraged' over John McCain's attempts to raise doubts about Barack Obama.

Obama met Ayers when the former radical hosted an event to introduce Obama at the start of his political career. The two have served together on boards, but are not close.

"It seemed manifestly unfair to tar him with this association," Ibershof said in a telephone interview this weekend from his home in Mill Valley. "Sen. Obama had known Ayers during a period he was named Citizen of the Year in Chicago, not when he was committing those terrorist acts."

So Ibershof wrote a letter to the New York Times, saying he was "amazed and outraged" that Obama was being linked to the former radical's terrorist activities, which occurred when "Mr. Obama, was, as he has noted, just a child."

Ibershof, a registered Democrat, has donated about $200 to Obama's presidential campaign, but the 73-year-old former prosecutor said nobody put him up to his protest.

"I came to this gradually but surely watching the campaign," Ibershof said. "It just didn't make any sense to me."

In the letter, Ibershof also defends his reputation, taking issue with the characterization that the case against Ayers was dismissed for "prosecutorial misconduct." The government dropped the case after the Nixon administration's "illegal activities, including wiretaps, break-ins and mail interceptions," were exposed, he said.

Ibershof was a young prosecutor in Detroit in 1972 when he took over the prosecution of the radical Weathermen. Ayers, the group's "education minister" who was then in hiding, and 14 other Weather Underground leaders had been accused of plotting at a 1969 meeting in Flint, Mich., to launch a terror campaign.

Ibershof said the bombings were thought to include a 1970 pipe bomb attack on a San Francisco police station, which killed an officer. The crime has never been solved.

But before the trial even began, some of the defense lawyers asserted their offices had been broken into and searched, Ibershof said.

He also discovered the government had illegally bugged some of the defendants. "I had a sizable room full of files with wiretaps that were not obtained by court order," he said.

The illegal tactics were ordered by Atty. Gen. John N. Mitchell and FBI assistant director W. Mark Felt, who was later unmasked as the Watergate scandal's "Deep Throat," Ibershof said. They were part of a plan, exposed during the Watergate hearings, to use "espionage techniques" to gather intelligence on domestic foes.

Even after the revelations, Ibershof believed that he could have prevailed. But after a federal judge ordered a sweeping hearing on the burglary and surveillance charges, the government decided in 1973 to drop the case in the interests of national security, he said.

McCain supporters have denounced Ayers as an "unrepentant terrorist." Ibershof said he believes people deserve a chance to redeem themselves, "a human reaction anyone would have."

After leaving the prosecutor's office, Ibershof moved to San Francisco in 1975 and opened a business litigation practice. He retired about 10 years ago. He said he was unaware of the blizzard of blog postings, pro and con, about his letter. But he has heard from some friends.

"They thought it was a good letter," he said.

www.latimes.com


AMERICANUNITY

LA Times
NY Times

What other Lefty Rags are you going to quote?

This is a Faith issue!

Obama BAD must be defeated. WTF is the matter with you? The 9th commandment is officially on hold until Evil is defeated.

Lets all get our ankles up to stop Obama!

"The number of persons who have written one, really fine, work of prose and then did little or nothing else is legion."

Posted by Zed

Asimov, on the other hand, stands alone.

He has no character, hangs with the wrong kind of people, consistently bad judgment, and has to be the stupidest person on the planet with a Harvard degree. - Murphy

Talking about Bush again?

Zat

If you ever read Science fiction, you may remember a book where the main character's name was shortened to "Purple". His full name translated from whatever language it was to "As a color, purple". This character was short, round, extremely bright, balding, with white hair sticking straight out the sides.

Of course it was a tribute to Asimov, although I didn't figure this out til the end. But I was thirty years younger so I get a pass.

Do you happen to know this one?

"Do you happen to know this one?"

Sorry, no.
And I'm not likely to, since I'm probably going to be doing experimental astroparticle physics as long as I can move.

AU--if there wasn't such an obvious pattern iwth Obama--if it was only the pastor--or only Ayers--or only Resko or only Khalidi...

But he has a really long rap sheet of crooked, hard, left-tards as friends.

And they are so nice--and that happened so long ago--and so what? Right?

Wrong! Ayers is still not remorseful.

And the poor mixed up Ibershof--who loves Obama and probably thinks Manson should be let out to see if he too can become a professor at the University of Chicago.

Obama is incredibly stupid.

Here why not listen to the links at the last SDS reunion by Bernardine and Ayers..

www.evertube.com

"Posted by MURPHY at 2008-10-13 07:47 PM | "

See you in November, Goofy!

Everyone needs a hobby.



Comforting the Home of terrorism

"Wrong! Ayers is still not remorseful."

Neither is this guy.

MURPHY

I'm beginning to suspect you're a 'spoff' blogger parodying a nutcase, gullible right wing shill.

:-)

MURPHY

I'm beginning to suspect you're a 'spoof' blogger parodying a nutcase, gullible right wing shill.

:-)

'spoff'(sic)

It's 'spoof."

And no, she's that stupid.


I'm beginning to suspect you're a 'spoof' blogger parodying a nutcase, gullible right wing shill.


You forgot uptight..



I'm beginning to suspect you're a 'spoof' blogger parodying a nutcase, gullible right wing shill.

as well sexualy repressed.

Has to be a Brit.


'spoff'(sic)
It's 'spoof."
And no, she's that stupid.

#75 | POSTED BY ZATOICHI


Sorry Zat Rule 2 applies

He fixed it before correction, no foul...

Did Ayers Write "Dreams Of My Father?"
Based on the "evidence" presented by Jack Cashill?
In a word, "No."

Belief that Ayers helped write "Dreams Of My Father?" is directly proportional to the amount of Kool Aide consumed previously.

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