Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Monday, October 13, 2008

The Dow Jones index rose a nearly inconceivable 936 points on Monday as a push by world governments to pump money into the banking system sparked relief among investors and credit markets showed signs of loosening up.

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500... ok now give us back the other 4500...

What are the chances that it will stabilize now? I think it is too optimistic to believe it will recover any time soon.

500... ok now give us back the other 4500...

Please, I moved everything out three weeks ago and back in this morning. Hope last Friday was the bottom.

Only 1500 to go!

Stir, re "Hope last Friday was the bottom":

I'm going with "no".

At for a week or two, I'm betting. We'll see.

Please, I moved everything out three weeks ago and back in this morning. Hope last Friday was the bottom.

Truth, STIRSUMUP? Nice.

dow back over 11,000 by christmas unless obama gets elected.

Okay, we talk numbers. It's STILL in the 8,000s, and this morning's 600-point spurt is waning. Clinton left it at 11.7K. It WAS at 14,000. Bush and Cheney will buy Paraguay on MY retirement nest egg and live happily ever after. Without extradition ... herm

7500 by the end of this week

go Gold!

HERM

Did you know Bill Clinton is the last President to receive lifetime protection? All who follow (including W) get 10 years.

That kind of explains W's ranch in Paraguay.

go Gold!

I waited too late.:(

Please, I moved everything out three weeks ago and back in this morning..


I have been buying heavily for the last 3 weeks. Buy Low Sell High.

Hope it works.

First the policy makers pretend that they can be paid, then they denounce the pessimists as spreading panic, and then they say that students have been taught for four thousand years how the "magic of compound interest" keeps on doubling and redoubling debts faster than the economy can squeeze out an economic surplus to pay.

What has ended is the idea that "the magic of compound interest" can make economies rich without having to work and without industry. I hope we have seen the end of derivatives formulae seeking to make money by playing in a zero-sum game. A debt overload ends either in foreclosure or annulment to preserve the economy.

If Congress really wanted to restore confidence it could mark to market, not to model. Investors no longer believe America's Enron-style accounting, debt rating agencies or monoline risk insurers. They don't trust U.S. banks to be honest about their financial positions. They worry about the fraud charges brought by attorneys general in eleven states against predatory lenders such as Countrywide and Wachovia that Citibank, JPMorgan Chase and Bank of America were so eager to buy.

While Senators and Congressmen were debating $700 billion for the major Wall Street contributors to both parties (only for starters, Mr. Paulson explained), the Federal Reserve already had given even more, without public discussion and mention in the major media. Since Bear Stearns failed in March, the Federal Reserve has used the small print of its charter to go outside its commercial charter and give investment banks, brokerage houses and large corporations some $875 billion in "cash for trash" swaps. (see the Fed's H41 report.) The Fed has exchanged Treasury securities for junk mortgages and other securities that brokerage houses and investment banks did not have time to pawn off onto OPEC, Asian sovereign wealth funds or other investors.

The Fed Chairman is not elected democratically. He traditionally is designated by the Wall Street financial sector that the Fed is supposed to regulate, acting as its lobbyist for creditor interests the top 10 percent of the population against that of the indebted "bottom 90 percent." This "independence of the central bank" is trumpeted as a hallmark of democracy. But it is undemocratic, precisely by being isolated from public control.

The subprime mortgage problem could have been solved by writing down just $1 or $2 trillion of the face value and interest rates of predatory loans. Instead, the $10+ trillion in financial-sector damage in recent weeks reflects Wall Street's fraudulent packaging and sale of junk mortgages at unrealistically high prices, using junk mathematics to calculate junk derivatives and sell them to gullible investors who believe that the pretenses these mathematics, credit ratings and projected income have a basis in reality.
Today we can see the debt-fueled bubble of asset-price inflation that Alan Greenspan trumpeted as real wealth creation for what it really is credit creation to bid up real estate, stock market and packaged-debt prices. Tangible capital formation has been left out of account, as if postindustrial economies no longer need it.

Will voters see the asymmetry in Congress's failure to offer debt relief for homeowners as real estate prices plunge below the mortgages that are owed? Will its members be blamed for not rewriting the nation's bankruptcy laws to free families from debt peonage and free housing markets from the price declines that result from today's proliferation of foreclosure sales? Will there be no relief for Corporations having to cut back investment to service junk bonds and other debts with which Wall Street's corporate raiders and "shareholder activists" have loaded then down?

Evidently not.

Excerpted from Michael Hudson @ Counterpunch

Please, I moved everything out three weeks ago and back in this morning. Hope last Friday was the bottom.

#3 | Posted by STIRSUMUP
****************************

Yeah, sure you did.

this one's easy

it fell like crazy when they saw the poll of double digit for obama who will tax investors out the wazzo and when they saw the poll over the weekend tighten by 4 it made them feel a LITTLE bit better......


just think how low they will go IF barry gets his capital gains tax raised?????????

and THATS not my judgement alone.

article out today in one of the "OTHER" new york papers about the market response to the polls........

"this one's easy"

BLT's keyboard needs a breathalyzer interlock.

And then there are those who feel the economy/stock market would be in better hands if Sen. Obama is elected:

rawstory.com

nymag.com

Will Flop Ears accuse the DOW of being racist?

the mad money guy though

isnt he the one who not long ago told people that they should invest in wachovia??????

thought I saw that on tv the other day

9220.35

wonder whose fault it will be if we narrowly escape this depression?

all of this will be easy to predict

in fact its already started

obama has already begun to take credit or at least his people

can even read here how the left is taking credit for success in iraq even as they call for the defeat of our troops.

and IF he gets elected and it gets better he will take credit for it and if mccain is elected and it WILL get better they will just lie about it and change history..........(see any story about reagan)..........

they are so transparent.............

FWTHOM, I'd start looking for that lay-off notice from wal-mart.

It's up 749 at the moment.
Wont stay there.

We're still in the opening act.

The heavy metal is yet to come.

2009 will be a very bad year for employees.

At least 15,000,000 of them , any how.

More Bushonomics.

Burdened by debt and driving home from a night of gambling in West Virginia, Sergio Lopez launched a scheme that at the time must have seemed like a good idea.

He pulled his Volkswagen Jetta up to a random corner in Silver Spring, doused the interior with gasoline, set it on fire and walked away. He later made a claim to Nationwide Insurance. The car was missing, he said -- someone must have stolen it.

Add Lopez, who pleaded guilty in the case this year, to the band of Washington area residents who have torched their cars hoping for a quick insurance check. A Baltimore police officer did it. So did a Baltimore firefighter. A Prince William County resident burned a minivan for a friend.

Investigators estimate that hundreds of such crimes occurred in the Washington area in the past two years, although the exact number is unclear, and experts predict the number will increase because of the worsening economy. Many offenders have fallen behind on payments to car dealerships. This year, more people are behind on such loans than in nearly two decades.

"With what's just happened to the economy in the last week," said Donald Galbreath, a longtime fraud investigator for the insurance industry, "I see the trend will get worse."



www.washingtonpost.com

9416.20

And that is a "conservative" estimate.

Let me know when it's 14,000 again.

9414.53 +963.34 (11.40%) Oct 13 4:01pm ET

Entire stock market history.

chart.bigcharts.com

Back to 1972, anyway.

Bushonomics doesn't begin to describe this problem because it goes far beyond the current administration. It's the sum totality of the way that capitalism has been implemented in the West. The only effective means is to eradicate the so-called "ownership society" and move toward a nationalization and shared ownership of the means of production. A socialist implementation would reduce the gap between the rich and poor. It would also spread wealth among the populace, thereby promoting stabilization. Prosperity must be shared for the sake of continuity.

1970

A breather for McCain....

the funny thing is that many americans will think the problem is solved and move on with their lives.

th - this is no time for complacency - you're right. let this be a lesson to us all.

some wise economist type: please explain what happens to people when governments put $trillions into the economy. does that cause inflation? if so how?

Will Flop Ears accuse the DOW of being racist?

#20 | Posted by fwthom

You're a weak person.

"all of this will be easy to predict

in fact its already started

obama has already begun to take credit or at least his people

can even read here how the left is taking credit for success in iraq even as they call for the defeat of our troops.

and IF he gets elected and it gets better he will take credit for it and if mccain is elected and it WILL get better they will just lie about it and change history..........(see any story about reagan)..........

they are so transparent.............

#24 | Posted by bushlovertwo at 2008-10-13 03:53 PM"

Definitely SOMETHING is transparent.

So..., just to review what you seem to be saying:

1. IF the market gets better it's NOT because Sen. Obama did anything. Got it ;-)!

2. IF the market doesn't get better, it's because Sen. Obama did NOTHING (or did the wrong thing). Got it ;-)!

3. What succes has there been in Iraq and HOW are "the left" taking credit for it? THIS ought to be good ;-)!

4. For simplicity, let's NOT delve into President Reagan. That topic has been extensively hashed over by other threads and historians.

It's not apparent to me how you could back up your sweeping/blanket "they are so transparent" statement, but it definitely seems YOU are quite transparent!

KNOWSTOOMUCH,

Even Karl Marx would call you a wacko!

APOCALYPTO<

You're a liar, I can bench press 380 lbs.

dow up 968

You're a liar, I can bench press 380 lbs.

#40 | Posted by fwthom

With his penis!


KNOWSTOOMUCH,
Even Karl Marx would call you a wacko!

???

Even the mainstream news magazine Newsweek has officially declared the ownership society to be a complete failure. It details the history going back as far as 1862 to prove that American Economic Policy leads only to the rape of natural world's resources and the exploitation of the worker by the rich. Reagan and Bush in the United States and Thatcher in the UK started the downward spiral that will culminate in the bankrupcy of Western Civilization. Namely, overconsumption leads to the ultimate demise of capitalism. It simply can't end any other way.

KnowsTooMuch is fucking hilarious.

She spews textbook socialist rhetoric, as if to impress a boy at school or something.

Actually dow rises 930 points...to where it was last Wednesday.

All this talk of bushonomics is comical. Obamanomics will make jimmy carter look brilliant, and that's hard to do.....

This is a short rally, I'm afraid. Look for it to go back down again.
This roller coaster ride ain't over yet.


I heard one economist say --

Unless you must have all your money now for some reason -- jfor now the wisest thing to do is just cash in 20% of your stocks (or pull it out from your 401k) and keep it in ready cash. Leave the rest of your 401k and stocks alone and in the market and wait it out.

Remember, right now the losses in your stocks and 401k are only a loss on paper.

You haven't realized any real loss in your money until you cash out.

Take out from your 401k and stocks only enough cash for now to make it through and to have ready cash available, and then if you need more money later you can always pull out another 20% for more cash if necessary. Otherwise leave your 401k and stocks as is.

This global recession is expected to last thru the end of 2009.

DAVE

The Market is only part of the economic problems we face.

The mortgage meltdown, bank liquidity, rising unemployment, and falling wages are among the other pressing issues.

Why do you neglect to mention Carter didn't inherit a healthy economy? Unemployment was over 7%, and we had rising inflation. Seems like everyone is anxious to blame the next president for the problems this one's policies caused. Well, unless it's McCain I suppose?

Would you next like to claim Bush inherited record deficits, high unemployment and inflation as well? I hope not. History's too clear on that one.


WASHINGTON - After consulting with Barack Obama, Democratic leaders are likely to call Congress back to work after the election in hopes of passing legislation that would include extended jobless benefits, money for food stamps and possibly a tax rebate, officials said Saturday.
ADVERTISEMENT

The bill's total cost could reach $150 billion, these officials said,

bet you can remove the tax rebate part.

Whatever happens on the next president's watch will be their fault.

That has been the standard.

So, in other words Clinton gets the credit for the boom times?

I feel like the economy was drunk and started to get hungover, the government in a blind effort to stave off the hangover, started pouring beer down the economies throat. Now it's getting drunk again, having a good time, but we all know that the longer you stay drunk, the worse the headache is when you finally crash.

SEMTEX

Heard last night several states have only a few months of reserves left for unemployment benefits. They're going to need some help.

The bill's total cost could reach $150 billion, these officials said,


Posted by semtex111

Bush's fault.


This global recession is expected to last thru the end of 2009.

Yet another hilarious comment by me to impress that cute boy in Chemistry class...

How can you possibly know how long a recession is supposed to last? And any objective analysis of the current situation would clearly show that this is not a temporary problem. Rather, this is a permanent descent from "economic superpower" status to "Third World nation" status. The American lifestyle is unsustainable because too many resources are consumed -- 25% of the world's energy by 3% of the population. We're seeing the start of the return to a village economy where people will work and live in small communes. The only question is whether the future is based on popularist democracies and shared economic models that ensures all enjoy equal prosperity, or if the world reverts to some kind of 12th century feudal society where the wealthy exploit the manual labor of the poor.


"The bail-out by the Fed could not have possibly had any effect on this market." - Live or Don't

The American lifestyle is unsustainable because too many resources are consumed -- 25% of the world's energy by 3% of the population.

what if we committed to being self sustaining with regard to energy?

The stock market is no different than a casino crap table these days.

Just remember, a thousand points a day for the rest of the week will STILL only bring it all back to where it was when Bush sent it into the tank. It's like we're grateful when gasoline goes down from $4 a gallon to $3.50. But it OUGHT to be around two bucks. herm

Don't get me started on Jimmy, this retort is about the Dow and I only mentioned carter in reference to Obama. The WSJ had a good review of his lie,i.e. that he only wanted to increase taxes on 5% of the ntions top earners.

"The Tax Foundation estimates that under the Obama plan 63 million Americans, or 44% of all tax filers, would have no income tax liability and most of those would get a check from the IRS each year. The Heritage Foundation's Center for Data Analysis estimates that by 2011, under the Obama plan, an additional 10 million filers would pay zero taxes while cashing checks from the IRS.

Granted, those organizations skew conservative. But the op/ed works its way through the numbers convincingly. And those numbers are frightening. Consider it: nearly half of America would pay no income tax within just three years. I don't need to tell you that means 56% of us would be facing much higher tax bills. The only way that wouldn't be accurate is if government spending came down, and it's hard to envision that scenario no matter who is in office.

Those of us who live in the New York metro area already pay high Federal income taxes where a two-job "middle class" family (schoolteacher & firefighter) can earn $150,000 per year. This may seem "rich" by the standards of much of America, but remember that real estate costs are sky-high in this area (click to see an example of home prices) and we also face some of the highest state and property taxes in America. If you work in New York City as many in this area do you are also hit with New York taxes and the privilege of paying thousands of dollars per year in commuting and parking costs. Remember our main highways the New Jersey Turnpike and Garden State Parkway are toll roads, and so we don't even get the benefit of free transportation for our tax dollars. All this, and the Garden State is still facing a massive deficit. People in this area are maxed out, angry and are leaving.

All of this while an estimated 30% of Americans already pay no taxes. And if this op/ed holds true, that number will continue to rise. And Americans will have to work even harder to give more money to those who pay no taxes at all."

briansullivan.blogs.foxbusines
s.com

online.wsj.com

Someone on here told me yesterday the stock market would be closed today --
October 13 -- for Columbus Day. What happened?

"All of this while an estimated 30% of Americans already pay no taxes."

The author conveniently pretends income taxes are the only taxes we pay. When ALL taxes are figured, including sales taxes, gasoline taxes, utility taxes, excise taxes, property taxes, etc., the five quintiles each pay about 17%-21% of their income in taxes. But this author doesn't want higher INCOME taxes, so he ignores the rest.

Make the argument about payroll taxes, for example, and the numbers invert.

Typical smoke and mirrors from the gang who proclaimed "tax cuts increase revenue!", while only using the raw-dollar amounts.

Who can believe anything Bush and Bernanke or Paulson tell you.

Two months before Freddie and Fannie came crashing down Bush was on tv and said about our economy "everything is fine, no cause to worry" when at the very time he said it Bush KNEW he was lying. Bush knew back then that Fannie and Freddie were billions in debt and we would have to rush in to bail them out. Bush KNEW when he spoke those words he was flat out lying.

So we're now suppose to believe Bush when he says some new schemes he's now just cooked up are suppose to work for the economy? I think it's just to butter us up so he can ask for more billions of our tax money.

I don't believe one word out of that guy's mouth.

No chris it was barney frank who swore there was no problem with fannie and freddie. Do your homework, THAT is an acknowledged FACT

www.youtube.com

" The American lifestyle is unsustainable because too many resources are consumed -- 25% of the world's energy by 3% of the population. "

Not just energy, but all the resources necessary to an industrial economy: water, minerals, timber, etc.

www.mindfully.org

So if everybody lived like Americans it would require 833.33% of the world's energy.

Hell, by 2050 I bet that's 1,700%.

That's such garbage, it's no wonder that next to none of the dr left took biz classes in college....

That's like saying that Michael Phillips is an ugly American who consumes too much of the world's resources...and they aren't going to put up with it any longer. That's Obama's line. Sooo you dudes are advocating an 80% pull back in our consumption??? YOU FIRST!!!!!!!

"Bushonomics doesn't begin to describe this problem because it goes far beyond the current administration. It's the sum totality of the way that capitalism has been implemented in the West. "

That's correct. It goes beyond one particular piece of legislation, or even one administration, or one political party. It's a result of decades of free market fundamentalism--supported to varying degrees by both major political parties--exacerbating the natural boom and bust cycles of capitalism.

"So if everybody lived like Americans it would require 833.33% of the world's energy."

You're the math guy! Sounds right to me.

I know how you can achieve that goal, lower our average wage earners income to the level of the world's 3rd and 4th rate countries, and have everybody earn less then 16,000 a year!

Zach it's time to dump the Porshe and get a Prius, Obama has spoken!

Futures will point to a nice opening. Maybe 100-200 points, then selloff into the rally will begin around 10:30.

Hybrids are stupid.

Clearly there is unfinished business to the down side. Secular bear markets can take a VERY long time to unwind!

No chris it was barney frank who swore there was no problem with fannie and freddie. Do your homework, THAT is an acknowledged FACT


www.youtube.com

#64 | Posted by DavetheWave at 2008-10-13 05:53 PM

That was awhile ago when Barny Frank said that and I'm not excusing Frank by any means.

I'm talking about two months ago when Bush announced to Americans everything was okay with our economy when at that very time Bush KNEW Freddie and Fannie were about to go under yet still got up and said we Americans have no problem -- nothing to worry about. I'm not arguing who caused the mess, I'm just telling you Bush LIED when he already knew about it but still told us our economy was just fine.

I'm thinking a Tesla with a little nuclear reactor for power.

"I know how you can achieve that goal, lower our average wage earners income to the level of the world's 3rd and 4th rate countries, and have everybody earn less then 16,000 a year!

#72 | Posted by DavetheWave "

Whatever, Wave. Did you really think the U.S. was going to consume that level of the world's resources forever?

Surf's up, dummy!

Who's Zach?

The only meaningful question is: if the economy improves will dems go back to their standard smear tactics and attack Palin's daughter and Palin's Down syndrome baby? Dems are always trying to help the children.

"The only meaningful question is: if the economy improves will dems go back to their standard smear tactics and attack Palin's daughter and Palin's Down syndrome baby? Dems are always trying to help the children.

#81 | Posted by fwthom at 2008-10-13 06:16 PM"

Never thought I'd see the word "meaningful" in a message with your signature ;-)!

More seriously, how about a link showing the "standard smear tactics" that "attack Palin's daughter and Palin's Down syndrome baby"?

Take as much time as you want, altho' puhleeze quit posting this garbage until you do.

I meant Zat!

Anyhoo that's why are % of resource usage is so hign null, it's because of our standard of living. You aren't advocating lowering that are you?

AND Surf is not up in NJ, besides fishing is my game, Stripers, Tuna, and Stripers!

"That was awhile ago when Barny Frank said that and I'm not excusing Frank by any means." No that has been his and shulmers constant verbage for years, up until say Nov 2008. NOT "awhile" ago.....

Besides I don't blame subprime entirely for this crisis. A simple fact that proerties rose in excess of the rate of inflation starting in the late 90's sucked in most all banks into writing mortgages on property values that were unsustainable. The sad fact is that a 30% + correction has fucked them, along with marked to market accounting.....

"You aren't advocating lowering that are you?"

There's a choice?

It's going to get lowered unless we find that other 733%. And drilling for oil isn't the solution. Neither is coal. Dumping more crap in the air just makes things worse. Another non-solution is taking the population to 9.5B by 2050.

Everybody knows the market could be down 500 tomorrow, if the slightest bit of mad news goes public, right?

Well-- this was a good day indeed.


But Obama hates plumbers--so he can't take any credit.


www.youtube.com

' this was a good day indeed.'

Imbecile flag.

"But Obama hates plumbers--so he can't take any credit."

Yeah, but John McCain loves G. Gordon Liddy, one of the White House plumbers.

The American lifestyle is unsustainable because too many resources are consumed -- 25% of the world's energy by 3% of the population.

How high can the bull shit get? Renewable energy is factored in which should not be a product of this measure.

I get my electricity all day everyday and will continue forever if need be all the while never consuming more energy other than what it took to put the damns in place. The water will continue to fall over those damns giving us the necessary energy we need but you go ahead and believe crappy stats.

Even though the stock market is rising it's still falling at the exact same time so how is this Good news anyways?? Seems like a fraudulent euphoria before the great fall. Least that is the way I read it anyhow.

Larry

Wow, you mean all those crooks who are asking for a bailout are now investing their take back into the market, well, good on them.

"Wow, you mean all those crooks who are asking for a bailout are now investing their take back into the market, well, good on them."

Oh well done MW so everybody who gets money is a crook? Guess that covers the bases, everybody is a crook except you?

LIAR!!!!!

"So, in other words Clinton gets the credit for the boom times?"

#50 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

I'm sure that when you typed this out, you were gay with glee, posting your little "gotcha." I'm not denying that times were much better under Clinton than Bush.

But the standard has been set. Whatever happens in the next 4 years will be Obama's fault. Not what's happening now, mind you.


Okay, we talk numbers. It's STILL in the 8,000s, and this morning's 600-point spurt is waning. Clinton left it at 11.7K. It WAS at 14,000. Bush and Cheney will buy Paraguay on MY retirement nest egg and live happily ever after. Without extradition ... herm

#9 | Posted by herm at


herm............thanks for the laugh and it was a SYMPATHETIC laugh because anyone who is at risk of losing retirement stuff.........well its not that funny, but to blame it all on bush and cheney.
you just have to laugh

and of course with the market going up ALL TIME HIGH AFTER the bush adminstration has been working so hard in trying to solve it.............well I am sure that he will get all sorts of praise here on the ole retort........????????????????
?

yeah of course he will........

so lets get to a barry thread and read about HE was the one responsible for the market doing what it di


and this morning it started UP ALMOST 300 but took a downward turn to 100 and something as I left the house..........

"and of course with the market going up ALL TIME HIGH AFTER the bush adminstration has been working so hard in trying to solve it.."

Translation: All of the credit, none of the blame.

no thats not what I said or meant to say but if you talk about blame, you have to start with dems in power for two years and then all of a sudden the market goes in the tank and noone EVER blames them from the left


of course you can read the FEAR that the left has in every post here.

THIS GOOD news is devastating for most of you here
when it cratered into 8000 or so, just how much GREATER could that have gotten for the obama campaign
the only thing better than the market falling like that would have been for a 100 or so soldiers to be killed in iraq...........

its ths same old story.....worse it gets for america, the better is it for dems.......

and PLEASE>...........the iraq remark aside

someone PLEASE try and tell me that this economic meltdown hasnt been THE GREATEST THING FOR OBAMA

Sure it has been great for Obama. If he wins it will be simply because he is not Republican. Not because he has better ideas.

If the current president were Democrat, McCain would be winning.

"If the current president were Democrat, McCain would be winning. "

And if your aunt had balls....

and of course dan.........even if you dont want to admit it........its a repeat of the one term jimmy carter.......if we werent in such bad shape then, reagan would have had a harder time winning istead of the landslide and rememebr that was BEFORE the repubs only won by cheating...........LOL

"even if you dont want to admit it..."

I've already admitted it: this current group of so-called Republicans have given us the worst governance I've ever experienced. They have no one to blame but themselves.

same thing happened to bush 41........its the economy stupid......re,member that?

and irony then was that the economy was actually better than most at the end of that first term but noone would admit it in the media or DNC.....and so then blowjob billy got the DOT COM explosion instead of 41..........how would THAT have changed history??????????


and there were some meaningfull positive during the clinton years and EVEN THOUGH THE LEFT wants to ALWAYS FORGET...
for the most part there was A REPUBLICAN CONGRESS.........

but you see........it was moderate republicans who got their way all this time.......

CONSERVATIVE republicans would not have gotten us into this......

"CONSERVATIVE republicans would not have gotten us into this......"

Yeah, I've always thought it would be great to be a _conservative_. Because they _always_ are for what is right, _always_ do what is right. The ones who don't, well, they were never conservatives. I often wonder what is would be like to live in _totally_ conservative times. Probably like the 1950's, only more so, I guess. Too bad the world always changes.

Americans have come to accept the inevitability of Obama becoming President. So has Wall Street which is why the stock market has been tanking like crazy. Parents will be pimping out there kids for a loaf of bread when Obama becomes POTUS.

short lived rally.. gotta fill the gap from Monday's rally and then to test 7846 and 7500.. It blows through those say hello to 3800.


Ben Bernanke threw all the meat on the grill this past weekend.. It wont work and there is nothing else to do but let it correct.

Please, I moved everything out three weeks ago and back in this morning. Hope last Friday was the bottom.

#3 | Posted by STIRSUMUP

It wasn't the bottom....

Machine trading or dead cat bounce . . . stay tuned!

this one's easy

it fell like crazy when they saw the poll of double digit for obama who will tax investors out the wazzo and when they saw the poll over the weekend tighten by 4 it made them feel a LITTLE bit better......


just think how low they will go IF barry gets his capital gains tax raised?????????

#16 | Posted by bushlovertwo

When the market collapses, there are NO capital gains to tax. Relax. Twist up a fattie. Spark it up. Relax.

If you look at all the fumding thrown at the problem, from ultra cheap emergency loans on through the current proposals, you are looking at some $5.2 trillion so far, with the taxpayer on the hook for about $2.3 trillion. It will get much, much larger.
The hit taken by our national wealth is in the range of $9.5-$10.2 trillion. This is based almost exclusivly with the loss of real estate value, which has not yet affected the commercial/industrial valuations. It does not take into account the loss on savings and retirement/pension values, which are included in the overall wealth standards, as measured by the public-private sector.
The fall is far from over.
Many are about to find out how not so secure their jobs actually are.
Tens of millions.

"Americans have come to accept the inevitability of Obama becoming President. So has Wall Street which is why the stock market has been tanking like crazy. Parents will be pimping out there kids for a loaf of bread when Obama becomes POTUS.

#107 | Posted by utastaff at 2008-10-14 04:38 PM"

If you're worried about your financial future, you might want to re-think your current opinion, UTASTAFF:

www.nytimes.com

all you have to do is listen to barry's answer to the plumber just the other day to understand his policy and it certainly isnt like the policies that made this country great........

"all you have to do is listen to barry's answer to the plumber just the other day to understand his policy and it certainly isnt like the policies that made this country great........"

Whereas Bush's plans: Aces....right, BL2?

9015.58 -295.41 (-3.17%) Oct 15 12:53pm ET

Oooops. Premature Evaluation!

8874.76 -436.23 (-4.69%) Oct 15 2:50pm ET


8874.76 -436.23 (-4.69%) Oct 15 2:50pm ET

#118 | Posted by Zatoichi

In other words, Wall Street knows the bailouts are BS. They also fear the impending nooses coming from the future politburo.

8577.91 -733.08 (-7.87%) Oct 15 4:04pm ET

and we have a retest as indicated..lets see if it tests the 7800 level..keep your powder dry for the next major leg down.

8300.98 -276.93 (-3.23%) Oct 16 11:22am ET

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