Palin showed that while she can barely make it through a semi-debate with lots of coaching to answer predictable questions she's adrift at sea when her noggin hasn't been crammed full of stock phrase-answers. That's part of her Achilles' heel. But, of course, she doesn't even know what an Achilles heel is. Palin is pathetic, and she illustrates just how deep into the barrel McCain had to reach to find a veep nominee to whom he could feel superior.

it is amazing how much like bush she is, although her accent is real.

the way she pronounced words

the way she used non sequitors

the way she avoided questions

the way she doesn't believe in accountability.

the way she is intellectually incurious

bush with a bush.

What I thought as I watched the beginning of last night's entertainment:

Palin: "May I call you Joe?"

If Palin wants to talk directly to the American people, she should start by saying something that makes sense instead of talking in spin and sound bytes. The conservative spin for W was that he was likeable and someone you'd want to have a beer with. The spin on Palin is that she is likeable and just like us, Joe sixpack in high heels and lipstick. She is also trying to sell the meme that she is a maverick. How many Joe sixpacks are mavericks? She is actually worse than W because she knows less but is equally arrogant. Most Joe sixpacks don't think they can be VP or president and don't want to be.

If Palin wants to talk directly to the American people, she should start by saying something that makes sense...
Sincerely,
Bosniaks

(and yes, I know what media matters has to say)

I predict Palin won't be doing anymore interviews with anyone but the most conservative outlets. She can't afford to. I have often accused W of being cheerleader in chief. All Palin needed last night was pompoms and a megaphone to complete the picture of her as potential cheerleader in chief. How many people want her answering the dreaded 3 AM phone call? How many people want McCain to consult her on any of the pressing issues of our times? I guess we'll find out on election day. I noticed in the CNN tracking poll during the debate, that Palin did better with men than with women. The reverse seemed to be true of Biden. My conclusion is that Palin had rahrahrah sex appeal for the men, but that Biden did more to appeal to the security moms, who think governing this country is a serious matter, not a popularity contest.

did anybody else get the feeling that joe was swooning every time he got near her? i thought he was going to fall down a couple of times.

did anybody else get the feeling that joe was swooning every time he got near her?
Posted by nanc

I certainly don't blame him.

Palin: Drill, baby, drill! Give me a d, give me an r, give me an i . . . .

FF for GalTuesday...

Actually, I thought she was veering ever so slightly into the "My Favorite Line from a Porn Film" department.

did anybody else get the feeling that joe was swooning every time he got near her?
Posted by nanc

I certainly don't blame him.

Maybe this explains why she appealed more to the men than the women in the CNN tracking during the event. The men were thinking with one head while the women were thinking with another.

What we need now is a press conference with Palin. She needs to be forced to answer follow-ups. She needs to be made accessible to the press and thereby the American people.

If Palin wants to talk directly to the American people, she should start by saying something that makes sense...
Sincerely,
Bosniaks

#5 | Posted by 101Chairborne

"Did anyone feel Joe was swooning every time he got near her....?"

As a matter of fact, no.

Actually, I thought she was veering ever so slightly into the "My Favorite Line from a Porn Film" department.

At least she didn't lick her lips, something I have seen her do in other clips. Don't get me wrong: she is affable. Unfortunately, she is also verging laughable. Tina Fey will be winking away come Saturday night. Remember the earlier skit when Tina as Palin turned her backside to the camera during the debate with Hillary? In light of some of the comments in this thread, I don't think Fey's parody was too far off the mark.

Palin may have been coached to be rude to the moderator, with the understanding this was red meat for the Base. Put another way, Republicans have given up on the Independents.

The men were thinking with one head while the women were thinking with another.
Posted by Gal_Tuesday

No doubt. Most women are insecure or threatened by a good looking woman.

"Most women are insecure of threatened by a good looking woman...."

In a moment someone will say men are the ones so threatened. Now I know you guys know Palin lost.

Now I know you guys know Palin lost.

#18 | Posted by Zed

Yeah, I've already decided to cover all the bases and vote for Cynthia McKinney. It's a racial/gender win-win.

No doubt. Most women are insecure or threatened by a good looking woman.

Yeah, that must be it. Most women are intimidated by Palin's looks rather than dismayed by her lack of knowledge and put off by her false bravado.

"I don't want some pretty face to tell me pretty lies." Billy Joel

"We cant keep looking to the paaaast'! By the way, it was Ronald Reagan who said that freedom is only one generation away from extinction. We do not pass it on to our children through the bloodstream,"

inSincerely
S Palin

Palin says...May I call you Joe?

She had to ask that so she could use the line: "Say it isn't so, Joe."

PS. We will make sure that wall street is strictly regulated while concurrently keeping government out of stuff.

I think she said can I give you a blow.

Most women are intimidated by Palin's looks rather than dismayed by her lack of knowledge and put off by her false bravado.
Posted by Gal_Tuesday

If you are an Obama supporter, then you've hit the nail on the head.

"Palin may have been coached to be rude to the moderator"

I'm sure she was as this behavior is Typical of today's "conservatives" im afraid; they seem to think manners and grace aren't values worth preserving!

Truth, thanks for the clarification on the term Biden used. I mistakenedly thought it was a malapropism, but you and Biden are correct. It was the appropriate word in the he used it.

Wisgod,

I was being sarcastic. Most women recognize this is presidential campaing, not a beauty contest.

Palin during the debate:

It is a crisis. It's a toxic mess, really, on Main Street that's affecting Wall Street. And now we have to be ever vigilant and also making sure that credit markets don't seize up. That's where the Main Streeters like me, that's where we would really feel the effects.

Another nonsensical Palin answer:

I'm not one to attribute every man -- activity of man to the changes in the climate. There is something to be said also for man's activities, but also for the cyclical temperature changes on our planet.

But there are real changes going on in our climate. And I don't want to argue about the causes. What I want to argue about is, how are we going to get there to positively affect the impacts?

We have got to clean up this planet. We have got to encourage other nations also to come along with us with the impacts of climate change, what we can do about that.

If cyclical temperature changes are responsible for global warming, how is anything we doing going to change that effect? If we don't know the causes of global warming, how are we going to know what to do to "positively affect the impacts"? How are we going to know what to encourage other nations to do?

Truth, thanks for the clarification on the term Biden used. I mistakenedly thought it was a malapropism, but you and Biden are correct. It was the appropriate word in the he used it.

#27 | Posted by townncountry

that is the problem of the intellectually incurious.

not meaning you btw, but those who make "gut" decisions without facts

Off topic....what time does the House vote on the Bail out Bill?

ohhhh gee troll, it must suck to be wrong.

#13 | Posted by truthhurts at 2008-10-03 09:12 AM | Reply

I've stung you so badly in the past that you've grown desperate. In your haste to attempt to "get me back" you completely ignore the fact that I know what a Bosniak is (because my post following my bosniak crack mentions Media Matters factual account).

Keep on trying buttercup. Maybe you and Uallsuck can combine forces to "get" me.

You fool.

not meaning you btw, but those who make "gut" decisions without facts

#30 | Posted by truthhurts at 2008-10-03 09:46 AM | Reply

Like you did while ignoring my follow up post?

Nice try Uallsuck, but as usual, I'm way ahead of you.

Another Palin non sequitur:

No, in fact, when we talk about the Bush administration, there's a time, too, when Americans are going to say, "Enough is enough with your ticket," on constantly looking backwards, and pointing fingers, and doing the blame game.

There have been huge blunders in the war. There have been huge blunders throughout this administration, as there are with every administration.

But for a ticket that wants to talk about change and looking into the future, there's just too much finger-pointing backwards to ever make us believe that that's where you're going.

Positive change is coming, though. Reform of government is coming. We'll learn from the past mistakes in this administration and other administrations.

According to Palin, looking at the past is bad. How the heck are McCain/Palin going to learn from the mistakes of the past if they refuse to look back and identify what the blunders were, who made them and why, etc?

Gal, why not just link to KOS, and be done with it?

"If cyclical temperature changes are responsible for global warming, how is anything we doing going to change that effect? If we don't know the causes of global warming, how are we going to know what to do to "positively affect the impacts"? How are we going to know what to encourage other nations to do?"

The answer to all your questions is the same:

Pray to baby Jesus for guidance.

She had to ask that so she could use the line: "Say it isn't so, Joe."

#22 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2008-10-03 09:30 AM | Reply

I disagree. I think she did it (and on purpose on a hot mike) to A) Sound down home and polite and B) So that Biden would be tricked in to calling her Sara (which many people prior to the "debate" said would be a mistake because it would make it look like he was being condescending (which I don't understand how that would be condescending, but there it is).

One of the most astounding things I learned from the debate:

Biden: Again, we spend in three weeks on combat missions in Iraq, more than we spent in the entire time we have been in Afghanistan. That will change in a Barack Obama administration.

Wisgod,

I don't read daily kos. My comments are my own. I'm just reading through the debate transcript and making observations.

One of the most astounding things I learned from the debate:

Biden: Again, we spend in three weeks on combat missions in Iraq, more than we spent in the entire time we have been in Afghanistan. That will change in a Barack Obama administration.

#38 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2008-10-03 10:01 AM | Reply

I couldn't believe that either. Especially with all of the money we initially spent buying off warlords and Northern Alliance guys via the CIA and SpecOps (not to mention we're paying the freight for other NATO countries...or so I assume).

Either way, a damning statement if true.

One of the most astounding things I learned from the debate:

Biden: Again, we spend in three weeks on combat missions in Iraq, more than we spent in the entire time we have been in Afghanistan.

That was also a bald-faced lie.

One Reagan reference deserves another:

Biden: Look, all you have to do is go down Union Street with me in Wilmington or go to Katie's Restaurant or walk into Home Depot with me where I spend a lot of time and you ask anybody in there whether or not the economic and foreign policy of this administration has made them better off in the last eight years. And then ask them whether there's a single major initiative that John McCain differs with the president on. On taxes, on Iraq, on Afghanistan, on the whole question of how to help education, on the dealing with health care.

Palin chided Biden for looking to the past once again then went on to quote Reagan as well:

Palin: But even more important is that world view that I share with John McCain. That world view that says that America is a nation of exceptionalism. And we are to be that shining city on a hill, as President Reagan so beautifully said, that we are a beacon of hope and that we are unapologetic here.

Either way, a damning statement if true.

#39 | Posted by 101Chairborne

Wanna bet the Afghan warlords didn't know that either?

Watch the bribery rates skyrocket.

ok so you say it doesnt make sense while concurrently saying it does make sense, gotcha!

intellectual incuriousity will get you in trouble.

And we are to be that shining city on a hill, as President Reagan so beautifully said, that we are a beacon of hope and that we are unapologetic here.

BTW Reagan was quoting someone else

FACT

Palin: And I appreciate, too, Sen. Biden, getting to meet you, finally, also, and getting to debate with you. And I would like more opportunity for this.

Really?

"That was also a bald-faced lie."

Posted by Pinche_Mao

The Cost of Iraq, Afghanistan, and Other Global War
on Terror Operations Since 9/11

ok so you say it doesnt make sense while concurrently saying it does make sense, gotcha!

intellectual incuriousity will get you in trouble.

#44 | Posted by truthhurts at 2008-10-03 10:10 AM | Reply

Nice try buttercup. You got slapped with reality again.

You'd think you clowns would be able to score a point or two on me eventually. Keep trying. Ask Uallsuck to help you, or did Rogers take that handle away from you?

Palin: Doggone it, people like me because I'm like them!

Palin's new political slogan: Politicians R Us!~ wink wink

If Palin wants to talk directly to the American people, she should start by saying something that makes sense...
Sincerely,
Bosniaks

#5 | Posted by 101Chairborne

clearly you were accusing biden of saying something that doesnt make sense

then you follow up with this

(and yes, I know what media matters has to say)

#6 | Posted by 101Chairborne

admitting that biden did make sense

so tell us troll what was your point?

He also lied about the restaurant he was in.

According to the Congressional Research Service, spending on the war in Afghanistan since 2001 has been $172 Billion. Spending in Iraq is, as the Democrats repeatedly mention, a little under $10 Billion a month.

In other words, Biden's number is off by, oh, something like 2000%. Perhaps Obama's Sub-Committee ought to have held some hearings on Afghanistan after all.

Another Reagan reference, sort of:

Palin: It was Ronald Reagan who said that freedom is always just one generation away from extinction. We don't pass it to our children in the bloodstream; we have to fight for it and protect it, and then hand it to them so that they shall do the same, or we're going to find ourselves spending our sunset years telling our children and our children's children about a time in America, back in the day, when men and women were free.

According to some pundits, Reagan was actually talking about Medicare:

Her final quote "...you and I are going to spend our sunset years telling our children, and our children's children, what it once was like in America when men were free." is actually taken from a speech by Ronald Reagan that was recorded on an album entitled Ronald Reagan Speaks Out Against Socialized Medicine according to an article written in 2004 by Larry DeWitt, a doctoral student with numerous publications to his name, entitled Operation Coffeecup: Ronald Reagan's Effort to Prevent the Enactment of Medicare. The loss of freedom to which Reagan referred was to the enactment of Medicare.

so tell us troll what was your point?

#50 | Posted by truthhurts at 2008-10-03 10:20 AM | Reply

Damn you are slow on the uptake as well as a perfect example of a punching bag.
My point dumbass, was to once again rile the tools like you that can't help but trip over themselves in an attempt to prove how far in their heads I am.

Don't worry, it's not the first time you've not gotten something, and it won't be the last. I'll pull your strings and you'll dance. That's how this game has worked and will continue to work for a long time.

ok, thanks, cause that REALLLLLLLY makes sense

BIDEN: Look, we have spent more money -- we spend more money in three weeks on combat in Iraq than we've spent on the entirety of the last seven years that we have been in Afghanistan building that country. Let me say it again. Three weeks in Iraq; seven years -- seven years, or six and a half years, in Afghanistan.

Senator Biden appears to be contrasting the spending on combat operations in Iraq with the spending on reconstruction and other diplomatic activities ("building that country"). Over seven years (not including FY 09), according to the Congressional Research Service, the United States has spent $11.8 billion on foreign aid and diplomatic operations in Afghanistan. The Pentagon in FY 08 has spent $145 billion in Iraq. This works out to about $8.4 billion per three week period.

ok, thanks, cause that REALLLLLLLY makes sense

#55 | Posted by truthhurts at 2008-10-03 10:35 AM | Reply

Apparently so. You seem to be the only chump that didn't get it.

I swear I heard Sara ask Joe for his autograph there at the end........

Just realized that Changegirl created this thread.
I thought she was done with the Retort when her mom lost the primary.

Wisgod,
#8...Golly Wisgod, you betcha I never would have guessed you would be swayed by a pretty face...WTF?... something you would like to get out into the open and share with the class?

If we are voting just based on looks, I've got three choices, and i'll bet each one of them is smarter than hockey-puck.

3) Charlize Theron
2) Jenny McCarthy
1) Robin Meade (that chick that's on cnn headline news in the mornings) she is yummylicisous.

Joe is not being turthful on the Iraq issue and the cost--

Actually, statistics from The Congressional Research Service (posted on the website of the Center for Arms Control and Nuclear Non-Proliferation) show that our biggest Iraq expenditure came in Fiscal Year 2008 and reached $158 billion or $3 billion per week. This means that Biden's "three weeks in Iraq" would cost $9 billion at most.

And what about our commitment to Afghanistan? Has it really been $9 billion over seven years, as Biden suggested? The truth is we've spent $177.5 total in Afghanistan (compared to $661.1 billion in Iraq). This means that Biden either over-stated the cost of our war in Iraq TWENTY TIMES, or else understated the cost of our war in Afghanistan by a factor of twenty. Either way, the jerk is wrong by a distance equal to the width of the State of Delaware, and he delivered an Alaska-sized blooper three times in one evening.

Murphy-
Wow. It's from johnmccain.com, so it must be true!

LOL

"Wow. It's from johnmccain.com, so it must be true!"

McCain has claimed that he has discussed many foreign policy issues with Palin. I think someone should call his bluff, ask him what issues they discussed and what her advice was.

Goshdarnit!, you're right! Heck, any hockey mom or joe six pack can see that!

(unless their intelligence is insulted, but that may not be possible in some cases...)

Go goggle it--it was from facts--

BIDEN: Look, we have spent more money -- we spend more money in three weeks on combat in Iraq than we've spent on the entirety of the last seven years that we have been in Afghanistan building that country. Let me say it again. Three weeks in Iraq; seven years -- seven years, or six and a half years, in Afghanistan.

Analysis:

Senator Biden appears to be contrasting the spending on combat operations in Iraq with the spending on reconstruction and other diplomatic activities ("building that country"). Over seven years (not including FY 09), according to the Congressional Research Service, the United States has spent $11.8 billion on foreign aid and diplomatic operations in Afghanistan. The Pentagon in FY 08 has spent $145 billion in Iraq. This works out to about $8.4 billion per three week period.

I think Palin claimed Biden's plan for Iraq was to divided the country into three separate countries, but that is not the case:

A Plan to Hold Iraq Together

By Joseph R. Biden Jr.

Four months ago, in an opinion piece with Les Gelb, president emeritus of the Council on Foreign Relations, I laid out a detailed plan to keep Iraq together, protect America's interests and bring our troops home.

. . .

First, the plan calls for maintaining a unified Iraq by decentralizing it and giving Kurds, Shiites and Sunnis their own regions. The central government would be left in charge of common interests, such as border security and the distribution of oil revenue.

Second, it would bind the Sunnis to the deal by guaranteeing them a proportionate share of oil revenue. Each group would have an incentive to maximize oil production, making oil the glue that binds the country together.

Gal--Biden did want to split up the country and most everyone said it was a terrible idea..

As for teh NPR analysis--they are trying to guess what he was adding up to make this statement--they changed his words to be "rebuilding" costs--etc

But that is Not what Biden said--he screwed up this stuff and trying to get away with it. It's not working..

Do the math--

-------

Joe is not being turthful on the Iraq issue and the cost--

Actually, statistics from The Congressional Research Service (posted on the website of the Center for Arms Control and Nuclear Non-Proliferation) show that our biggest Iraq expenditure came in Fiscal Year 2008 and reached $158 billion or $3 billion per week. This means that Biden's "three weeks in Iraq" would cost $9 billion at most.

And what about our commitment to Afghanistan? Has it really been $9 billion over seven years, as Biden suggested? The truth is we've spent $177.5 total in Afghanistan (compared to $661.1 billion in Iraq). This means that Biden either over-stated the cost of our war in Iraq TWENTY TIMES, or else understated the cost of our war in Afghanistan by a factor of twenty. Either way, the jerk is wrong by a distance equal to the width of the State of Delaware, and he delivered an Alaska-sized blooper three times in one evening.

michaelmedved.townhall.com

See post #64 for the link

Murphy-
If we've only spent $177.50 total in Afghanistan, maybe Biden understated his point.

"michaelmedved.townhall.com"

just curious... what percentage of Americans say "nucular"?

just curious... what percentage of Americans say "nucular"?

#76 | Posted by steamingpile

The 22% who still think Bush is doing a good job

Oops, I forgot to say that she looked straight at the camera and she winked, and some men felt their body parts twitching. That makes up for her being a simpleton that should not be allowed anywhere near the presidency of the most powerful country in the world. It is time for us to have an intelligent president.

some men felt their body parts twitching

With me, it was my uvula.

It's that little hangy down thing in your throat that gets out of the way right before you throw up.

A wink bothers you?? Would you prefer we all wave our hands and exalt our candidate like they are teaching the children to do in this video..?

This line was a ploy that Joe didn't fall for. The McCain camp thought Joe would respond with, "may I call you Sarah" however Biden was much more respectful an addressed her as Govenor as Palin should have addressed him as Senator. When meeting in public you always use formal protocol and use earned titles. This was just another gaf that Sarah failed at out of the box.

Joe said yes to the question that Sarah could call him Joe. It wasn't for the purpose of Joe calling her Sarah--nitwit. It was so she could say,

"Say it ain't so Joe"

She also referred to him and Obama as Senator.

Thank you for posting the video on YouTube. I thought it was beautiful. Singing about hope is beautiful. After the last eight years, hope is pretty much what we have left. If parents and kids in one school choose to sing about it, more power to them!

The real fascists in this country are the ones that are trying to vilify a song like this. What is happening to freedom of speech and freedom of expression in this country? Anamerican, it seems that you have found your inner Nazi. Good for you.