Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Thursday, September 25, 2008

A group of conservative Republicans in the House have devised an alternative plan for dealing with the Wall Street crisis: a two-year suspension of the capital gains tax and the full privatization of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

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From Daily Kos:

Republican Study Committee "Alternative Plan": This Can't Possibly Be Real, Can It?
by Hunter
Wed Sep 24, 2008 at 09:49:57 AM PDT
Well, the House Republican Study Committee has released their own minimalist proposal for dealing with the financial crisis. And to be honest, it stumps me, because it seems like self-parody -- something we'd make up to insult them.

It's a bit baffling. The conservative Republican counterproposal to the bailout is, of course... to banish all capital gain taxes, so that rich people can save us by "selling their unwanted assets." Um... WTF?

Two-Year Suspension of the Capital Gains: Immediately suspend the capital gains rate from 15% for individuals and 35% for corporations. By encouraging corporations to sell unwnated assets, this provision would unleash funds and materials with which to create jobs and grow the economy. After the two-year suspension, capital gains rates would return to present levels but assets would be indexed permanently for any inflationary gains.

[more]

[continued]
Am I missing something? You don't pay capital gains on something you've lost money on, so capital gains tax doesn't apply to any of the "toxic" assets in question. And if we're asking investors and corporations to sell off more of their stable assets, that's simply going to further depress the market prices of those assets, which is the very last damn thing we need right now. Additionally, the corporations in dire straits don't need incentive to sell their profitable assets. If their choice is bankruptcy or not bankruptcy, the tax situation isn't going to be a prime motivator.

So aside from being the same ideologically blinkered trickle-down nonsense that they've been pushing on us for years, I don't follow this "proposal" at all. This is akin to walking into a doctor's office with five gunshot wounds, and having the doctor shoot you one last time so that the first five don't hurt as bad in comparison.
[more]

[continued]
By what possible measure could anyone honestly believe that the solution to this crisis is to eliminate the capital gains tax on corporations and the wealthy? The only thing I can come up with is that the purveyors of this nonsense are goddamn, no good, flim-flamming bullsh*tting soulless America-hating megacrooks who have absolutely no interest in anything except getting a narrow class of people out of paying their damn taxes -- and are willing to scream "Depression!" at everyone if they don't get it.

Whoever wrote this alternative "plan" shouldn't merely be fired -- they should be fired into the sun.

[more @ DailyKos]

After reading this unintentional parody of Republican economic "thought," I'm reminded of George Cartlin's bit on "servicing the customer."

You don't pay capital gains on something you've lost money on, so capital gains tax doesn't apply to any of the "toxic" assets in question. And if we're asking investors and corporations to sell off more of their stable assets, that's simply going to further depress the market prices of those assets, which is the very last damn thing we need right now.

No one will ever accuse this bunch of theives of being the sharpest tools in the shed.

It is SOP for GOP, more tax cuts for the wealthy.

The country is going down the shitter and more tax cuts!


GOP's Crisis Solution: More Tax Cuts for the Rich

Thank god, with the bail out money in pocket they need a little break..

Hey, let's just screw the rich with many taxes - it worked so well for the economy when Carter did it.

ps: Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it, over, and over, and over...

Hey, let's just screw the rich with many taxes - it worked so well for the economy when Carter did it. Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it, over, and over, and over...

#7 | Posted by MSgt

I've got an idea-let's just give all the wealthy people in the country every bit of money we can scrape up-max out ALL our credit cards, Lines of credit-get second mortgages on our homes.
The economy is hemorrhaging money because of tax cuts for the wealthy-and you want to continue it?
I find your post unbelievably stoopid, especially after the last 8 years of dumbass & co.

Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it, over, and over, and over...

Like the Great Depression?

Cindi says this is a good plan, especially when i have to pay 5 grand to look adorable for her. You know what the upkeep on 7 houses, a jet and 13 cars is? Seriously, tell me. I don't handle money. I just sign my three government checks and nap.

John McChicken.

NORTH BY NORTHWEST told a funny!


McCain campaign to press: We're outta here
One of John McCain's aideshas just told reporters in the traveling press that the campaign will be leaving Washington in the morning. Details to come tonight and, at the moment, destination unknown.

PUNKED!

"One of John McCain's aideshas just told reporters in the traveling press that the campaign will be leaving Washington in the morning. Details to come tonight and, at the moment, destination unknown."

Maybe someone flashed him the queen of diamonds and he's on his way to Manchuria.

"Details to come tonight and, at the moment, destination unknown."

The Thursday night Leno Show, just to piss of Bucktooth Dave?

I'm all for tax cuts.. but if you don't cut spending what is the point? Tax cuts don't stop the government from spending they only steal the money from the dollar with inflation.

His advance team is in Mississippi. And WisGod that's "gap tooth".

Hmmmmmm,

I wonder which would be better, this fantastic package or having a pine cone shoved up my ass

Let's increase corporate taxes on companies and businesses. That way when we drive more of them overseas we can blame Repubs for selling out America when evil businessmen outsource to other countries!

What's good for Michigan is good for all of America!

Go Liberals! Yay team!

IncreaseCorp Taxes??? Are you fuckin' havin' a stroke?
The bastards don't have to pay much of anything as it is.
All we want is for them to pay their fair share.

If they don't want to-Oh Well! They CAN abandon their assets here-take just the clothes they're wearin', and a couple of mill to tide them over-and that's IT.
I'll bet good money they don't go very far..

Tax cuts for the rich or tax increases for the poor, take your pick.


His advance team is in Mississippi. And WisGod that's "gap tooth".

#16 | Posted by Chill

Gap tooth if prohibition Chicago, Bucktooth in Milwaukee. :)

if=in. Fucking keyboard is dead to me.

more whoring.


Tax cuts for the rich or tax increases for the poor, take your pick.

#20 | Posted by KBM at 2008-09-25 07:12 PM

I pick the third option: tell you to go fuck yourself and the horse you rode in on and then get my financial information from someone who knows that they're talking about.
I still can't believe there are idiots out there that believe the reason that the economy is in the shitter is because we haven't eliminated taxes. And that cutting the income tax of the rich somehow creates jobs. If there's anything good to be said of the last eight years is that they have proved in practice that these ideas are laughably wrong.
At this point 'trickle down' ecomonics have about as much economic credibility as pyramid schemes and those scam emails from Nigeria.

I don't get it. Who do the republicans expect to pay the bills? Tax the poor? You can't get blood from a stone. Tax the middle class? Many middle class citizen are hanging on by their fingernails now. While I don't expect the wealthy to carry the entire load, they are the only group that has been increasing their assets over the last ~decade. This may be one of the stupidest things I have heard recently. I wish this story would get picked up by some of the MSM. The shit heads who proposed this should get voted out!

Name one country that taxed itself into prosperity.

I like rich people! They sign my paycheck!

How many poor people ever signed a paycheck?

That Bill Gates is a real bastard! If it weren't for him, I wouldn't be reading so much envy masquerading as concern for the poor on this Windows machine! That rich SOB has made it really bad for poor folk!

Go Libs! Yay Team!!!


What do you trolls care? Most of you do not have fucking jobs anyway, you dont pay fucking taves.

KATIE COURIC: And, Bob, I understand that John McCain actually floated an alternative plan. What can you tell us about that?

BOB ORR We're told at the White House Senator McCain offered an alternative plan that would include fewer regulations and more corporate tax breaks for businesses, kind of a private solution. But we're also told those ideas angered and surprised Democrats like banking chairman Chris Dodd who now says he thinks the White House summit was more of a political stunt for McCain.


McCain Solution: More Tax Cuts for Rich

Chris Dodd who now says he thinks the White House summit was more of a political stunt for McCain.

Took him that long to figure it out did it?

Well, better late than never, Doddmeister!

Almost can't believe wot Spud is reading here.

These Rethugs are trying to fuck rape the country w/o the benefit of lube.

Throw the bums out.

Get some new blood in there.

G08ama.

Be Well.

we wouldn't have to raise taxes if wall street hadn't just blown 700 billion. You can't have it both ways. No taxes no wall street bailout.

And McCain just scuttled the deal so everything he said about this being an emergency was a lie. He's not in a hurry anymore is he?

You don't pay capital gains on something you've lost money on, so capital gains tax doesn't apply to any of the "toxic" assets in question.

* * * *

Hmmm. You're a retard.

The suspension of the capital gains tax would be intended to make the investments more attractive to buyers: obviously, we have to take taxes into consideration when considering the return on our investment. This would make the assets more marketable.

"And McCain just scuttled the deal so everything he said about this being an emergency was a lie. He's not in a hurry anymore is he?"

Yep. McFuckup flew into Washington and politicized the deal. Way to go, moron.

Clearly by the posts I have read here, class envy is alive and well. The media and government loves when we fight amongst ourselves...it keeps us distracted while they are screwing us. So it only takes a spark to get that forest fire burning and they are at keeping us distracted.

It is time to change our complex 100 year old tax system and try something new.

www.fairtax.org

The beauty about a consumption tax is how it reaches so many people that do not currenlty pay taxes: drug dealers, prostitutes, illegal aliens, organized crime, tourist from other countries and even terrorist...all these people spend money in the US and do not pay income tax.

Also consider people spend more than they make so taxing income is much more limited than taxing overspenders.

If the government wants to increase revenue, all they have to do is promote spending without raising rates on the different classes.

Speaking of spending, government must be held accountable for every penny they spend. No amount of taxes will ever keep up with speding if there is no accountability.

Time for a new system!

What's good for Michigan is good for all of America!

"I like NAFTA."
Senor Juan McSamo.


.......they are just trying to grab the silverware on the way out the door..........

How does reducing taxes on capital gains work to fund this fiasco? How about coupling those that benefited from the sub-prime mess with those paying for it? Read the new Forbes on the huge number of billionaires that have been created in the last eight years and you will see that a large number owed their riches to "financing". It shouldn't be too hard to hit the winners--this disconnect is what has the country incensed.

Anyone who votes to perpetuate this criminal regime for four MORE years is surely and certifiably criminally insane. As in Einstein's classic definition of insanity: "Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results." herm

When will they fuckin learn!!!

I can't beleive it, were goin down the tubes and they propose more tax cuts for the rich?

Jesus H Christ!!!

On capital gains tax cuts, I'd say it's one or the other. You can have taxpayer money or a tax cut. Not both.

But tax cuts and deregulation are what got us into this mess. How does more of the same fix anything?

I say put taxes back where they were under Clinton when the Nasdac was at 5000. It worked then.


.........does money trickle down.?.......

........not sure........

.......but certainly shit rolls downhill......

In the dark of night over the weekend when most people were snoozing, the Treasury dramatically expanded its bailout plan to include buying student loans, car loans, credit card debt and any other "troubled" assets held by banks.

The changes, which were included in draft language that also opened the bailout program to foreign banks with extensive loan operations in the United States, potentially added tens of billions of dollars to the cost of the program.

Although it was a major addition to what was already the nation's largest-ever bailout, it did not become part of the debate between Democrats and the Treasury over details of the program. A Monday counterproposal by Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher J. Dodd included such consumer loans as well as mortgages, just as the Treasury's draft did Saturday night.

"The costs of the bailout will be significantly higher than originally considered or acknowledged," said Joshua Rosner, managing director of Graham Fisher & Co., who charged that the Treasury and Federal Reserve have not been "forthright" about the ultimate cost to the public. The plan gives Treasury the discretion to buy the non-mortgage loans and securities in consultation with the Fed.

Conservatives cited the move as a sign that the massive plan to take over bad mortgage debt already is opening the door to further government bailouts.

We've just been alerted that despite House Democrats relenting on extending bans on offshore drilling and oil shale in the continuing resolution (CR) appropriations bill, Democrat Senate Leader Harry Reid has decided to sneak an extension of the oil shale ban through as Congress fights over the financial bailout. Oil shale in America's West is estimated to hold be between 800 billion and 2 trillion barrels of oil that is more than three times the proven oil reserves in Saudi Arabia alone.

Here is the text of Reid's proposed new ban on oil shale, that he is trying to add as an amendment to the CR or move seperately as a "stimulus" package, or we should say an anti-stimulus package if this is included.

Sec 1602 continues ban on oil shale. The language follows:

SEC. 1602. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, including section 152 of division A of H.R. 2638 (110th Congress), the Consolidated Security, Disaster Assistance, and Continuing Appropriations Act, 2009, the terms and conditions contained in section 433 of division F of Public Law 110161 shall remain in effect for the 19 fiscal year ending September 30, 2009.

It would be an insult to all Americans if Senate Democrats worked to bailout Wall Street while damaging our future prosperity by banning development of vast energy reserves in oil shale.

Pejman Yousefzadeh, also writing at Redstate supports and expounds upon an alternative plan:

It does not have to be this way. There are ways to help the economy quickly and maintain our free market credentials in the process. To be sure, they involve TAX CUTSthose supposedly horrid things that we supposedly ought to be wary of, but which, in fact, actually work in stimulating the economy and helping companies big and small maintain healthy balance sheets. I would say, however, that tax cuts that work in stimulating the economy and help bring about healthy balance sheets are infinitely preferable to socializing the economy and landing vicious body blows on the philosophy of free markets.


You cannot save an economy that operates on debt, if the average citizen cannot afford the debt, and the people that offer the debt control your wages, for the purpose of causing you to engage in debt service to participate within your society.

In the end, greed never prevails.

It has ruined every great civilization.

Without fail.


Unbelievable.

The cure for unregulated mortgage slicing and dicing? Let the culprits break more laws and pay less taxes; meaning more taxes required from taxpayers to make up for lost revenue.

Is stupid contagious amongst the GOP?

John BONER is Benedict BONER.

Major "Earmark" in Democrat Bailout Agreement (URGENT must read -ACORN and more)
Blogs 4 McCain ^ | 25 September 2008 | Bill Smith

Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 7:04:56 AM by SE Mom

I received a copy of "Agreement in Principle" relative to the $700 billion "bailout" being proposed and supported by Senate Democrats. The one page agreement from the U.S. Senate Banking Committee details guidelines to be put in place relative to taxpayer protection, oversight and transparency, home ownership preservation and Funding Authority.

... In the "agreement in principle," there is the effect of a major "earmark" which commits money from future "profits" to be given to nonprofits organizations like ACORN, National Council of La Raza and potentially the National Urban League. This agreement clearly evidences that the Government expects to benefit in the future from the bailout when the values of property rises and mortgages or properties are then sold by the Federal government. The agreement

... In the proposed bailout agreement, Sen. Christopher Dodd, the Senate Banking Committee and other Democrats desire to pre-direct that future funds (profits) not be returned to the taxpayers via the treasury but that they be used to underwrite potential questionable (maybe even illegal activities) of certain nonprofits which have had a hand in promoting and expanding access to "no money down" loans for minorities, illegal voter registrations and extensive lobbying activities.

publicmarkup.org

Read it for yourself.

The last time the Dems promised to save us was just a few short months ago - $300 billion housing bill that added $500 million a year to ACORN.


If you have following any of my posts in the last 30 days, you will know that ACORN is a left wing activist group.


According to ACORN, Obama trained its Chicago members in leadership seminars; in turn, ACORN volunteers worked on his campaigns. Obama also sat on the boards of the Woods Fund and Joyce Foundation, both of which poured money into ACORN's coffers. ACORN head Maude Hurd gushes that Obama is the candidate who "best understands and can affect change on the issues ACORN cares about" like ensuring their massive pipeline to your hard-earned money.

Last July, ACORN settled the largest case of voter fraud in the history of Washington State. Seven ACORN workers had submitted nearly 2,000 bogus voter registration forms. According to case records, they flipped through phone books for names to use on the forms, including "Leon Spinks," "Frekkie Magoal" and "Fruto Boy Crispila." Three ACORN election hoaxers pleaded guilty in October. A King County prosecutor called ACORN's criminal sabotage "an act of vandalism upon the voter rolls."


"The suspension of the capital gains tax would be intended to make the investments more attractive to buyers: obviously, we have to take taxes into consideration when considering the return on our investment. This would make the assets more marketable."

What would yet another huge increase of spending while lowering taxes do to the dollar?

If you want to read the entire article from which Anamerican lifted most of his post, you can find it at article.nationalreview.com -- a NRO piece by looney rightbot du jour Michelle Malkin.

Daily Kos, the site that this post quotes extensively is "an American political blog, publishing news and opinion from a liberal or progressive point of view."

Rebut the earmark, Doc. If you can....

publicmarkup.org

I don't know, Sully. Ask Obama. He is promising that 95% of Americans will get a tax cut and has huge plans to spend money on social programs.

yeah

mccain is only going to give the rich tax cuts

the other 5%

oh yea and all those corps get them too
and they get bailed out
by mccains cabinet, aka the bailout boys

"Name one country that taxed itself into prosperity."

The United STates of America under Franklin D. Roosevelt.
Now, you name one country that became prosperous by reducing taxes on the wealthy.

"To be sure, they involve TAX CUTSthose supposedly horrid things that we supposedly ought to be wary of, but which, in fact, actually work in stimulating the economy and helping companies big and small maintain healthy balance sheets."

What a laughable and dishonest poster you are.
First you pretend tax cuts will "stimulate" the economy when we have 8 years of Bush to prove otherwise and then make shit up about where the money will flow from this bailout. Anyone who believes the idiotic, over the top, accusations you make in your posts is probably already a McBush voter anyway but it is annoying to read such dishonest bull shit early in the morning. Liar.

#51 | Posted by anamerican

Merely pointing out where you got the readable part of your post. You hadn't referenced it, or indicated you cut-and-pasted it. It would be a shame if anyone got the misimpression you'd actually strung all those words together into a more or less coherent---albeit ladled with rightist lather---whole. Michelle Malkin would've raised the bar far beyond your abitities to compete.

You're welcome. And, as usual, no charge.

The United STates of America under Franklin D. Roosevelt.

Specifically what did FDR do to accomplish this?

Conservative Republicans offer bailout alternative

www.reuters.com

It seems to me that McCain and House Republicans are trying to save us $700B, but instead of people getting behind this plan, everyone is btiching and complaining and calling McCain a spoiler.

This RSC/Insurance/Privatizing FMA & FMAC plan is something I could get behind.

Why should we buy junk from Wall Street? Let them buy insurance to insure that junk, who knows, they might figure out a way to eventually sell it in the futre, or they will be force to negotiate mortgage terms with many people.

I oppose the Kind Henry Paulson plan, I support this RSC plan, I am glad that capitalism is alive and well in some corners.

member
if they want to save 700b.

then then mccain doesn't have to suspend his campaign

just vote no
and the dems will vote no if there is no change to the plan that they want

and bam

debate goes on.

Danni, learn something new today.

www.heritage.org

Kliff, how many debates did Clinton say yesterday that Obama turned down?

Kliff, the Dems do not want to send this to the floor unless they are sure to get majorities in both parties. That is why the RSC throws a monkey-wrench into this Paulson Plan Scam.

"Danni, learn something new today."

When I want to learn something the Heritage Foundation is the last place I would ever look.
Can we say "propaganda"???

You ask for information and links. You get them and say it "is the last place I would look". Don't let that stop you from learning something.

Perhaps this will be more to your liking.

economics.about.com

"Specifically what did FDR do to accomplish this?"

Eberly, if you don't know American history then go read a history book, everyone else in the class knows exactly what FDR did. You do too you, your pretense of ignorance just makes you look dishonest.

Can we say "propaganda"???

Can we say "common sense"???

Heck even socialist European countries have lower corporate tax rates, why shouldn't the U.S. have a nice and reasonable 20% corporate tax rate, without loopholes, and that would be the end of it. The economy would function more efficienty without those distortion/loopholes and the country wiould be more competitive.

Here is the tagline for the RSC plan:

"Let Wall Street pay for it's own bailout."

As opposed to the Paulsom Scam:

"Let the taxpayers clean up Wall Street's mess."

Which do you chose?

It's simple for me.

"You ask for information and links."

No, I didn't ask for anything. I know my history and I have studied enough economics to know that the idea of "supply side" is a disproven bunch of bull shit put forth by those who benefit from tax cuts but that economies, our is not the first, generally end up in the toilet when that theory is followed. Hey, how much is that national debt these days???? Someone should slap you in the face for even suggesting tax cuts, Americans will be paying off the bills the supply siders ran up for decades.

"Heck even socialist European countries have lower corporate tax rates, why shouldn't the U.S. have a nice and reasonable 20% corporate tax rate, without loopholes????"

Yeah, why shouldn't the US have that, but you try to sell that to corporate America. Hilarious.

Do you have a problem with the Obama plan to give 95% of Americans tax cuts? But overtax the small business and corporations that employ the workers in this country?

OH, BTW, calling Heritage Foundation anything except propaganda makes you look foolish. Even righties know what it is though some are too dishonest to admit it.

Someone should really slap Danni "in the face" for supporting Obama. LOL

"Do you have a problem with the Obama plan to give 95% of Americans tax cuts? But overtax the small business and corporations that employ the workers in this country?"

No I have a problem with liars who misrepresent Obama's tax plan even after they have been corrected over and over and over.

Did you go to my other link, Danni. Perhaps you don't want to learn anything different than your own slanted view.

"Someone should really slap Danni "in the face" for supporting Obama. LOL"

Funny except that it is your team that led us into the mess we are currently in which is now requiring a 700 Billion dollar bailout. Yes, anyone who still mouths the idiotic rant of lower taxes on the wealthy needs to be slapped...very hard.

700 BILLION!!!

OMG!!!

You can't make this shit up.

Obama has promised there will be tax cuts for 95% of Americans, Danni.



700 BILLION!!!


OMG!!!


You can't make this shit up.

#75 | Posted by danni

And it appears one Parties idea is that it won't cost the tax payers a dime. Guess which Party.

"I don't know, Sully. Ask Obama."

WTF is that even supposed to mean? You're such an unthinking hack that you don't care what a policy will do to us so long as you can bray "The other side wants it too!".

Yeah, thanks for that pearl, Stupid. No wonder its so easy for these people to fuck us. Next time you feel the urge to vote, kill yourself instead.

"And it appears one Parties idea is that it won't cost the tax payers a dime. Guess which Party."

First off, that isn't true.

Secondly, if it were you could hardly give anyone credit for coming up with one idea that would not cost us money after spending eight years coming up with ideas that have been bankrupting us. Well, I guess you could but you'd have to be retarded.....

Apparently I hit a nerve.

Danni proclaims "first you pretend tax cuts will "stimulate" the economy when we have 8 years of Bush to prove otherwise " and "Someone should slap you in the face for even suggesting tax cuts".

I point out that Obama wants to cut taxes for 95% of all Americans and you both go ape shit because you know Danni stuck her foot in her mouth. LOL

First off, that isn't true.
Posted by Sully

Ok. That settles that. Back to Palin.

Eberly, if you don't know American history then go read a history book,

I know what he did.

I doubt you do.

your answer (quite predictable....which is why I asked.) proves you don't really know specifically what FDR did.

"Funny except that it is your team that led us into the mess we are currently in which is now requiring a 700 Billion dollar bailout."

Now, danni, tell it all. Even your one-time idol isn't buying that crap. Here's what he said yesterday:

"Clinton, however, said that Democrats weren't entirely blameless, stating that they should have highlighted problems with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and "tried more aggressively to regulate derivatives."

He also acknowledged that there was possible danger in his administration's policy of pressing Fannie Mae, the mortgage company, to lower its credit standards for lower- and middle-income families seeking homes."

AND...there's plenty of blame to go around, danni.

directorblue.blogspot.com

"I point out that Obama wants to cut taxes for 95% of all Americans and you both go ape shit because you know Danni stuck her foot in her mouth."

I could care less about Obama or Danni. You have the mentality of an eight year old. "The other guy is doing it too!" is not a rational defense of anyone. Do your country a favor and stop voting. Please. We literally can't afford to have morons like you involved in the process anymore.

Sully=the elitist "I'm smarter than you are" voter

Thanks, but no thanks. Someone has to use common sense to balance your kind, Sully.

"I point out that Obama wants to cut taxes for 95% of all Americans and you both go ape shit because you know Danni stuck her foot in her mouth. LOL"

But he wants to return the tax rates from Clinton for those earning over $250,000...which will begin the job of digging our way out of the Rethug mess.
You seem to want to play silly games attacking Obama without ever considering what your party has done to this country. You aren't even dealing with the issues of today, just playing silly partisan games. It ain't a football game. You can be as right wing as you like but the economic hardships that the present administration has brought are going to effect you just as much as me but at least I know who to blame. No matter how much you cheer for your team it won't fix the mess they have created.

and they get bailed out
by mccains cabinet, aka the bailout boys

Yo Killfred, its the DEMS pushing for bailout and REP are not not convinced.

Did you notice Omamma wasn't involved in the discussions or any of the negotiations yest. He wasn't asked to participate. He wasn't needed. If he is such an econominc expert why wasn't he involved. He has never been needed in the discussions because he is a neophyte. More proof he his an empty suit.

What is the difference between Ohbama and an empty suit?


"Name one country that taxed itself into prosperity."


The United STates of America under Franklin D. Roosevelt.
Now, you name one country that became prosperous by reducing taxes on the wealthy.


LOL...LOL. FDR did not bring prosperity through taxes you dimwit. Industry did...via a nasty war. It's a known fact...lower taxes and revenue goes up. But the trade off for control freak socialists (AKA, the DNC) is they have less control over industry. They'd rather see industry hit rock bottom (think of the American auto industry and the jobs bank program) than give up control of it via taxation.

You freaking socialists are pathetic!



"To be sure, they involve TAX CUTSthose supposedly horrid things that we supposedly ought to be wary of, but which, in fact, actually work in stimulating the economy and helping companies big and small maintain healthy balance sheets."


What a laughable and dishonest poster you are.
First you pretend tax cuts will "stimulate" the economy when we have 8 years of Bush to prove otherwise and then make shit up about where the money will flow from this bailout. Anyone who believes the idiotic, over the top, accusations you make in your posts is probably already a McBush voter anyway but it is annoying to read such dishonest bull shit early in the morning. Liar.


Uhhh, Bull Shit! Tax cuts didn't screw it up. Inordinate spending screwed it up. It was Bush acting like a typical tax and SPEND Democrat that screwed us over. Doofus!



"....but at least I know who to blame."

No, Danni...you obviously don't.

You tax the rich (which Obama says is over $250,000) and they stop spending money. What you consider a waste of money puts food on the table for the guy who sold him that waste. What you may think is a luxury item for the rich provides a living for the guy who makes that luxury item. What you may consider a pampering for a wife/mistress/spoiled brat is a car payment to a manicurist, hair stylist and cucumber facial specialist.

So, when you tax the rich to bring them down to your level, you'll find that your new level has dropped also. All you did was knock them down a rung and took yourself down two.

And many of the people that make $250,000 are also small business owners sometimes in limited liabilities or partnerships where there business income counts as PERSONAL income. Do you think these people are going to be able to stay in business and keep the same number of people employed?



And just how are 95% of Americans going to get a tax cut when 40% don't even pay any income tax? And many of that 40% get money from the government in the form of earned income credit that comes out of the tax coffers.

"Uhhh, Bull Shit! Tax cuts didn't screw it up. Inordinate spending screwed it up. It was Bush acting like a typical tax and SPEND Democrat that screwed us over. Doofus!"

TAx and spend Democrat??? But without the taxes!!!!

You are a joke, you know that right???

You seem to want to play silly games attacking Obama without ever considering what your party has done to this country.
A quick list of Dem leaders who benefited from the GSE's. When does the grand jury investigation into the actions of these people begin?

Former Clinton administration budget director Franklin Raines sat in the CEO chair. Under Raines' leadership, Fannie overstated earnings by a stunning $10.6 billion, all the while paying Raines and his senior management team massive bonuses.

It was under Raines' management that Fannie morphed from being a company in a sleepy business -- issuing debt to buy mortgages from lenders -- into a far more risky and exciting one: buying up mortgages and holding them, thus capturing the spread between its borrowing costs (which were lower than anyone's other than the federal government's) and the interest rate received. It was a great business, except that it had nothing to do with Fannie's charter. According to a May 2006 report from OFHEO, Raines became obsessed with keeping earnings per share as high as possible and motivated management to achieve that goal by setting up a bonus system that rewarded increasing earnings per share (EPS).

All told, Raines pulled in some $90 million between 1998 and 2003, the majority from bonuses. And when OFHEO began to ask uncomfortable questions, Raines actively lobbied Congress to cut its funding. In April, Raines agreed to disburse $24 million for his role in the accounting "errors."

As Fannie's CFO from 1990 to 2005, Tim Howard signed off on the financials that overstated the company's earnings by $10.6 billion from 1998 to 2004. His reward? A cool $14 million in salary and $16.8 million in bonuses during the period -- bonuses based on the earnings plan that Raines set up.


Gorlick took out $60 million. What could a justice dept lawyer do to be worth that much money? Keep her mouth shut about the Gorlick wall? The wall that allowed 9/11 to happen?

"And just how are 95% of Americans going to get a tax cut when 40% don't even pay any income tax?"

Actually it will be closer to 80% that actually get a tax cut. So sue Obama for exaggerating. It's still better than the lying McCain and his supporters like you do claiming that he is going to raise everyone's taxes, even after being corrected over and over and over, even after the corporate media has corrected you over and over and over.
Perhaps you are incapable of learning???

MIDTOWN I'm sure it was just an oversight that you forgot to mention McCain's campaign manager's lobbying firm who received millions in fees from Freddie Mac, even up until last month at $30 K per month.....I'm sure you just forgot.


"President Bush to make statement on financial bailout at 9:35 a.m. ET"

Hopefully, this is Bush telling House Repubes who are more concerned with keeping their jobs than putting country first and protecting American jobs, that allowing Wall Street to break even more laws and cost the taxpayers even more money by giving them a tax-free bail out is not the right thing to do.


MIDTOWN I'm sure it was just an oversight that you forgot to mention McCain's campaign manager's lobbying firm who received millions in fees from Freddie Mac, even up until last month at $30 K per month.....I'm sure you just forgot.

#95 | Posted by danni at 2008-09-26 09:37 AM


And I'm sure you're not just mindlessly repeating a talking point that has been shown to be flase...Oh wait, I'm not sure of that at all. In fact, I think you're a stooge that is doing exactly that.

posted by DANNI: MIDTOWN I'm sure it was just an oversight that you forgot to mention McCain's campaign manager's lobbying firm who received millions in fees from Freddie Mac, even up until last month at $30 K per month.....I'm sure you just forgot.

Ummmm, this was shown to be an outright lie. But I'm sure that won't matter to you, DNC Troll that you are! Repeat a lie enough times and you'll believe it. Unless you're a Democrat, then it doesn't matter...you'll believe it on the first hearing if it suits your agenda!

You know you are a joke...right?




"And I'm sure you're not just mindlessly repeating a talking point that has been shown to be flase"

Oh, Rick DAvis's lobbying firm didn't receive those payments....????

""What the statement doesn't dispute is the actual news in the story: the $15,000 monthly payments from Freddie Mac, which began while Davis was still running the firm. You can judge the news value of that for yourself.""

www.politico.com

Wonder if Obama will be debating himself tonight - "What I've said during the primary" vs "What I've said since then". That would be a great one.

THEONEBS you were saying?????

You guys are pathetic, you seem to forget that this thing called the internet was invented which makes it very easy to prove you are full of crap.

"Wonder if Obama will be debating himself tonight - "

Perhaps....unless Grampy gets a little courage...which is doubtful.....he can't handle the embarrassment of having his ass handed to him.

Who turned down the opportunity for many debates? Uh....uh......I..I...

What I've said during the primary" vs "What I've said since then". That would be a great one.


like being for deregulation before he was against deregulation?

He's a regulating deregulator.

"Someone has to use common sense to balance your kind, Sully."

You don't know what common sense is. Defending stupid policies by saying "the other guy is doing it too" is not common sense. Its just atrocious hackery.

We can't afford to carry the likes of you anymore.

orrrrrrrr, tax the life out of them until they have no money and it's equally distributed amongst their pet projects - voila! JOBS AND PRODUCT LOSS! woo-hoo!

a two-year suspension of the capital gains tax....


would be a great move!


a two-year suspension of the capital gains tax....

would be a great move!

Posted by kerrin57

Kerrin being willing to personally make-up for the tax shortfall himself, one supposes?

Perhaps....unless Grampy gets a little courage...which is doubtful.....he can't handle the embarrassment of having his ass handed to him.

#102 | Posted by danni at 2008-09-26 09:58 AM
**

Danni,

You don't play chess do you? This was a brilliant strategic move. No matter what Obama does he is in check. If the bail-out passes on McCain's terms he can say "now Wall street will be given loans that they will have to pay back (which is what McCain wants to do), but my opponent wanted to give $700B of your money to failed, corrupt businesses."

If the Dems pass their version of the bill, which they can because they have the majority, he can say "Obama and the dems just gave $700B of your money to failed corrupt businesses and they refused to listen to republicans that could fix this without putting you further into debt."

If Obama go's to the debate and McCain doesn't he looks like a fool because the debate can't happen unless both are there because it is illegal. According to the Federal Election Commission both have to be there or it is considered an illegal campaign contribution.

Then if the Great Messiah Apollo Obama whines about that he can say "well, if you would have agree to the 10 town-hall debates I wanted we wouldn't have this problem."

No matter what Obama look like the inexperienced Jr. Senator his is.

Check and Mate.

Oh, but if you need Obama, just call him.

The stupidist thing ever said by a candidate.

"If Obama go's to the debate and McCain doesn't he looks like a fool because the debate can't happen unless both are there"

McCain claimed he wouldn't debate unless a deal was struck, and now he's going to debate despite a deal not being struck.

So was McCain lying, employing poor judgement, or merely confused?

So was McCain lying, employing poor judgement, or merely confused?

#112 | Posted by Danforth at 2008-09-26 11:55 AM


None of the above Danforh, he is just making his final move. Read my post again. CHECKMATE

Once Obama makes Mcsame look bad tonight then we can all say checkmate.

Mutt I hope you get dumped right on out of this blog.

" he is just making his final move"

And his "final move" is...what...? Telling the American public he'd do one thing, and doing the exact opposite?

Quick! Start another war!

You guys are pathetic, you seem to forget that this thing called the internet was invented which makes it very easy to prove you are full of crap.

#101 | Posted by danni at 2008-09-26 09:57 AM | Reply


Dummi,
You seem to forget that your post is easy to access with the scroll of a mouse.
You seem to forget that you claimed the firm was getting $30,000 a month.

Then mysteriously it became $15k...

Are you that dense?

No matter what Obama look like the inexperienced Jr. Senator his is.

Check and Mate.

#110 | Posted by Mutt at 2008-09-26 11:50 AM

Interesting analogy.

Obama has netralized Mr. Magoo's queen (the Demon Huntress) AND HAS NOT RELENTED on the bailout or debate issue. McCain blinked and now looks like a fool.

Check.

Tonite it should be Mate!

""What the statement doesn't dispute is the actual news in the story: the $15,000 monthly payments from Freddie Mac, which began while Davis was still running the firm. You can judge the news value of that for yourself.""


www.politico.com


#99 | Posted by danni at 2008-09-26 09:55 AM
***
Just more liberal lies Danni. You really need to stop drinking the kool-aid, Obama and his partners at the NYT and NBC (New Barrak Channel) will lie, cheat and steal to win. Just like he was trained to do on the streets of south Chicago.

Now for the truth.

"In fact, the allegation is demonstrably false. As has been previously reported, Mr. Davis separated from his consulting firm, Davis Manafort, in 2006. As has been previously reported, Mr. Davis has seen no income from Davis Manafort since 2006. Zero. Mr. Davis has received no salary or compensation since 2006. Mr. Davis has received no profit or partner distributions from that firm on any basis -- weekly, bi-weekly, monthly, bi-monthly, quarterly, semi-annual or annual -- since 2006. Again, zero. Neither has Mr. Davis received any equity in the firm based on profits derived since his financial separation from Davis Manafort in 2006.

Further, and missing from the Times' reporting, Mr. Davis has never -- never -- been a lobbyist for either Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac. Mr. Davis has not served as a registered lobbyist since 2005.

McCain blinked and now looks like a fool.

Check.

Tonite it should be Mate!

#118 | Posted by donnerboy at 2008-09-26 01:32 PM

Sorry Donnerboy. If when McCain made his anouncement if ol' BHO had come out and said "good idea the country comes first, let put politics aside and fix this problem." and then went to Washington with McCain he would have completly neturalized the play. But NO, being the sef-centered basted he is he said the stupidist thing he could have said. " I'm staying here and prepairing for the debate if you need me just call."

What an idiot.

****** What an idiot.
..... Posted by Mutt ******

......Obama did the right thing......

......McCain just went to Washington for a photo-op......

.....he wouldn't know how to fix the problems even if he was well intentioned.....but his big idea was to give millionaires another tax cut.......

......this campaign is showing McCain to be a cheap, self-promoting charlatan......

......this campaign is showing McCain to be a cheap, self-promoting charlatan......

#121 | Posted by skizziks at 2008-09-26 02:48 PM
**

Funny, I can hear your little liberal butts puckering. This is going to be a landslide, Obama will be lucky to get 200 elctorial votes. Then you know I will have to do the dance!

When I want to learn something the Heritage Foundation is the last place I would ever look.
Can we say "propaganda"???

#62 | Posted by danni

no danni you will likely look to the enquirer or the red star, you are an ignorant blatherskite

When I want to learn something the Heritage Foundation is the last place I would ever look.
Can we say "propaganda"???

#62 | Posted by danni

no danni you will likely look to the enquirer or the red star, you are an ignorant blatherskite

***** tax cuts that work in stimulating the economy and help bring about healthy balance sheets are infinitely preferable to socializing the economy and landing vicious body blows on the philosophy of free markets.
...... Posted by anamerican *******

.........it's tax cuts and the underegulated free markets that got us into the shit-house.......

........and you propose more of the same ?.......

.......tax cuts as revenue generators, are in the same vein of economic mythology as creationism is to biological science.......its pablum for simpletons.......

***** This is going to be a landslide, Obama will be lucky to get 200 elctorial votes. Then you know I will have to do the dance!
........Posted by Mutt ******

......your ability to ignore the obvious is scintillating......

......don't get too depressed when President Obama is inaugerated.....it will be a great day for the country.......