Obama: The Surge has worked

What's wrong with a candidate changing position if its based off of evidence?

BTW what does it matter what you think it causing GCC as long as you agree its happening? The only thing Man can do to about GCC is to change how we behave... so whether you think its man made or natural, you still can only work to reduce our carbon emissions, find alternative sources of energy and such... its not like you can stop a volcano or stop plants from dying.

Sara and her flashcards!

I still have yet to discover why this lady should be anywhere near the WH.

"BTW what does it matter what you think it causing GCC as long as you agree its happening? "

i've been saying this for years!
who cares the reason

lets just fix it

"lets just fix it'

Posted by klifferd

Been too late for years.

well

we can try at least

"BTW what does it matter what you think it causing GCC as long as you agree its happening? "

Well, if one were to think that Corporations weren't a cause, then why would one want to regulate their emissions?

I think Churches cause GCC. Does it matter now what I think is causing it?

48 hours ago when she was NOT one who would attribute [climate change] to being man-made." It mattered. It mattered enough to the McCain camp to have her contridict her previous statements on the issue.

I understand how she would buckle under the pressure. Shes a minor player in the big leauges and I am sure she is learning a great deal on what to THINK now that it matters. Its pretty sad when the Inteviewer knows more about the World than the Republican VP Candidate.

That should trouble every American.

Palin's appearance last night rang some sort of little bell, way back in the back of my head. I puzzled and puzzled until I figured out what it was.

She was reminding me of a Stepford wife - put together by fantasizing males to do and say and look just the way she "should", according to a set of crazy fetishistic rules. Her glittering eyes spent the entire interview seeking feedback from Charlie Gibson, so that she might glean hints on how to parse her words in the way that might please him most. Not once did I sense any real knowledge, commitment, or moral center; all I saw was a desperate desire to be whatever it was the Dweat Big Mans wanted.

The Stepford Candidate. Verily, a notion for our times.

"The Stepford Candidate. Verily, a notion for our times."

Mary TW has something, but as I recall the plastic Stepford wives, they were designed to please their mates by squeaking orgasmically if the right buttons were pushed. This Stepford candidate is interested ONLY in pleasing her corporate johns. She would be programmed, even in the White House, to repeat any script the corporate board rooms write for her.

MARY indeed is on to something. Gibson came across as someoone that was immune to flirtation, and from what I could tell that unnerved Palin greatly.

I still have yet to discover why this lady should be anywhere near the WH

There's a lot of folks have that very sentiment about Obama... not to call him a lady...

"someoone(sic) that was immune"

Welcome to the Show, bimbo.

Damn, the VP debates would have been fun if Obama had chosen Hillary.

Say anything that will get you into power. s.o.p.

Been too late for years.

#4 | Posted by Zatoichi

Take your pick ZAT:

#
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Too bad she had to go along with this BS. Its the civil rights issue of our time. Except its wrong.

Yawn

1998's anomaly was due to an extremely unusual el nino event.

Excel spreadsheets are so useful.

Warmest 10 years on record:
1995
1990
2001
2004
2006
2003
2002
1998
2007
2005

Coolest ten years on record:
1891
1917
1887
1884
1904
1893
1907
1892
1903
1918

First paper examining how the atmosphere retains heat.

1827 Joseph Fourier, "Mmoire Sur Les Tempratures Du Globe Terrestre Et Des Espaces Plantaires." Mmoires de l'Acadmie Royale des Sciences 7: 569-604.

First paper describing what we now call the greenhouse effect.

1861 John Tyndall, "On the Absorption and Radiation of Heat by Gases and Vapours..." Philosophical Magazine ser. 4, 22: 169-94, 273-85.

First paper quantifying anthropogenic global warming:

1896 Svante Arrhenius, "On the Influence of Carbonic Acid in the Air Upon the Temperature of the Ground." Philosophical Magazine 41: 237-76.

We can move on the the 20th century scientific literature as soon as you comprehend those papers.

The only thing to comprehend is that you can fool alot of people with enough technical BS...

Before you all get into facts and figures keep in mind that reporting stations have moved many times, temps are now taken digitally, not mercury or alcohol, record keeping is unreliable at best. For data to have any accuracy at all everything has to be the same. So the 'facts' being reported are not more than estimates.

The only thing to comprehend is that you can fool alot of people with enough technical BS...

#20 | Posted by smashmouth at 2008-09-12 07:56 PM

translation: i got nuthin.

praise jebus.

Gee... how much carbon dioxide does the earth emit each year? A couple trillion tons... and man emits what... 1%? Boy, that's a case for manmade global warming

Where did you get your facts, SM?

"and man emits what... 1%?"

The number is closer to 5 percent, which adds up quite a bit over a few years.

Since about 1750 human activity has increased the concentration of carbon dioxide and of some other greenhouse gases.[16] Natural sources of carbon dioxide are more than 20 times greater than sources due to human activity,[17] but over periods longer than a few years natural sources are closely balanced by natural sinks such as weathering of continental rocks and photosynthesis of carbon compounds by plants and marine plankton. As a result of this balance, the atmospheric concentration of carbon dioxide remained between 260 and 280 parts per million for the 10,000 years between the end of the last glacial maximum and the start of the industrial era.[18]

Al Gore said ppm's are now around 350... an incrediable climb. Do you know what ppm tranlates into... .0035%. So even if man dumps 5% of all the Co's, tell me how that warms a planet when it only accounts for .0035% of the atmosphere. Why do you think the only university climate research departments are the only one's growing... they have a really good gig... pushing the hoax.

Tell me, SM, where did you get your education? You were wrong about the percentage--you're wrong about the ppm, which is about 387--now you're wrong about the effect on the atmosphere. Where did you get this info on only climate research is growing? Made it up, like everything else?

Small changes can easily amplify great effects. Furthermore, there are other greenhouse gases. Or are you waiting for Earth to turn into Venus before you believe in global warming?

BTW, CO2 makes up 0.0384% of the Earth's atmoshere, not .0035% as you claimed. You're off more than a magnitude of 10.

R&R,
I said around 350... and where is there one iota of scientific proof that a small increase in CO's representing a fraction of the atmosphere is causing... warming. I suppose some scientist created atmosphere in a fruit jar as proof.

RR, you are correct and I am wrong... it is .0384%. I guess that must explain now that the planet is warming but an insignificant change in the atmosphere. I am not to big to admit an error...

387 is closer to aroung "400" than 350, but you've been very wrong elsewhere, so I'll give you a near miss. As usual, you're wrong about lack of evidence. There is plenty of evidence. I suspect you're just trolling, but here is one article. I'll be happy to find plenty of other for you.

Smashmouth-
re: "Do you know what ppm tranlates into... .0035%."

You are off by more than a factor of ten. But maybe I'm just using elite math.

Someone needs to say this.

The SKY IS FALLING! The SKY IS FALLING!

RANDYRINGEN-
All the global warming hoo-ha is manufactured by elite so-called "scientists" in it for the grant money. If you want to know the truth, just check sites funded by oil companies, who don't get the big sci-grant $$$.

*sigh*

1800-1870
Level of carbon dioxide gas (CO2) in the atmosphere, as later measured in ancient ice, is about 290 ppm (parts per million). Mean global temperature (1850-1870) is about 13.6C.

2007
Level of CO2 in the atmosphere reaches 382 ppm. Mean global temperature (five-year average) is 14.5C, the warmest in hundreds, perhaps thousands of years.

Sure, Bet., it's all a grand conspiracy. I guess there are advantages to being paranoid--I can't think of any, but it certainly is popular.

Perhaps millions of years as measure by fossilized marine life... and this by climate scientists who get grants for what... finding evidence of CO's contribbuting to gloabal warming...

RandyR-
Of course, it's a conspiracy by euro-socialist elites to bring the US economy to its knees and finally succeed in their nefarious plot to bring about a Red new world order where they'll confiscate your guns and eat your babies...alive! (anyway, that's where all the grant money is)

So, why should I believe an anonymous poster instead of these scientists? Oh, yeah, all of Caltech has been bought out by the global warming conspiracy. What is wrong with their methodology? Does it not state that high C02 corresponds with high temps? Oh, and did you read the grant saying they had to find evidence of global warming, or did you make that up, too?

Perhaps millions of years as measure by fossilized marine life... and this by climate scientists who get grants for what... finding evidence of CO's contribbuting to gloabal warming...

#37 | Posted by smashmouth at 2008-09-12 09:18 PM | Reply | Flag:

Yep. That's how it works. Scientists scribble their conclusion onto napkins and pass them to the grant machine bosses who then decide to lavish them with cash to find evidence of the conclusion.

Bet. :)

They've already done a good enough job bringing our economy to its knees. Or is that Neo-con socialist-capitalist elite? It's hard keeping track of who's promoting which conspiracy nowadays.

And the funny part is after this "hoax" was created to save the planet, no one can do a damn thing about it. How many nations that signed on to Kyota met the target... is it maybe 2. Even the assumptions in the lovefest in Paris for the recent IPCC report says it will keep climbing without drastic intervention...

I hung out with the wrong scientists. They weren't lavish with cash, even though they believed in global warming. I've got to find other stooges for the military-industrial complex.

RandyR-
It does get confusing. All you need to know is that the folks who are currently wrecking the economy are the good guys (Republicans), and it's vitally important not to let the uppity elites interrupt the current trend.

And people wonder why tuition keeps going up.

Yeah, SM, it's all a grad hoax made especially to make you uncomfortable.

Actually, you're probably right about one thing. The climate will get worse unless there is drasting action to change lifestyles, which won't happen unless it's coupled with corresponding economic changes, like high prices. And even that might not be enough.

Smashmouth-
I do remember a study that came out a few years ago about how the whole rising sea level due to warming was hooey. The researchers used a rather commonsense model: ice in a glass of water. They noted, obviously, that when the ice melted the water level in the glass did not rise.

Smashmouth-
Oh, wait. That wasn't a study, or a scientific endeavor at all. It was Rush Limbaugh talking out his ass. Most of the water locked in ice is on land.

Hey, I get it... ice melts and water rises. The Vikings learned that the last time the artic melted and they developed colonies... maybe around the 1300's. You'd see it now except you're too busy looking for marine fossils. You guys know the old saying... what goes around comes around... like global warming

"at the last time the artic(sic) melted"

(Moron can't even spell Arctic)

That was hundreds of thousands of years ago, if not millions.

Happy extinction, idiot.
You deserve it.

See you later, SM and Bet. It's been good talking to you. I've got to spread my nefarious gospel of global warming to unsuspecting members of the oil industry. There are none so credulous as infidels.

Zatoich-
As a scientist, you are a part of the plot, doncha know. As far as I can tell, anyone who can actually pronounce the word "nuclear" correctly is suspect.

And I think I will create some carbons right after I finish my sixpack... but at least I will be warm...

"As a scientist, you are a part of the plot, doncha know."

I am so busted.

Still, seeing the first cosmic-ray pictures ever was really cool. Especially since I built the camera. (With a little help from a bunch of great kids.)

Thank you Michael Dell.

Al Gore invented the internet.... Maybe he caused climate change too!

"Al Gore invented the internet"

Another liar for stupidity.
Happy extinction, shit-for-brains; You deserve it.

NASA scientists are pro-global warming, but they're not getting foundation grants. The chief NASA climatologist James Hansen recently stated that we've reached the tipping point. Who's paying him to say that when the White House is trying desperately to muzzle him?

Palin may have made a climate change U-Turn but she hasn't made a womens choice to choose U-Turn.

With Charles Gibson:

Palin: I know many people differ with me on this issue and I hope we can come together and discuss it and focus on issues that will reduce abortions....however...(Realit
y) ...make no mistake about it, I am against abortion for any reason except if the Mothers life is in danger and I will work feverishly to reverse Roe V. Wade and criminalize abortion and have all of you murderous fucking bastards thrown in prison.

I think the previous comments show that this issue really hasn't been decided yet.

Still, in regard to the interview, I think people are misinterpreting what Governor Palin said. While she believes the jury is still out on the cause, she's willing to "allow" for the possibility of some type of human contribution to the problem--and go to work on that basis. After all, cleaning up the environment made sense even before we ever heard of global warming.

Too bad its so influenced by radicals with an agenda... its called Deep Ecology. In other words, a few lies, some distortion of fact... whatever it takes to change behavior for the good of the environment... no matter how much the rest of us suffer for it.

Ah, but Palin did NOT make a shift. What she said was that human activity has contributed not to climate change but to ISSUES. See? Now, this might seem like exception al parsing but that's what these people do. This fools most people, but the hard right is snickering because Karl Rove got over on us once again.

I think we should outlaw cattle... they contribute 5 billion tons of CO's every year. Then again, we would need to outlaw Obama because he contributes equally from his verbal "flatulence"

"Too bad its so influenced by radicals with an agenda... its called Deep Ecology. In other words, a few lies, some distortion of fact... whatever it takes to change behavior for the good of the environment... no matter how much the rest of us suffer for it."

TRANSLATION: Too bad its so influenced by radicals with an agenda... its called Conservatism. In other words, a few lies, some distortion of fact... whatever it takes to change behavior for the good of the election... no matter how much the rest of us suffer for it.

TRANSLATION: You missed the point about Deep Ecology. Conservatives are NOT spending 270 million on a satellite to capture millions of datapoints on atmospheric CO's when it is not a proven fact; Al Gore, not conservatives, promoted "the hockey stick" curve on temp increase which was proven to be in statistical error... Conservatives preach using all means possible to satisfy global energy demand without placing a huge burden on people.

Deep Ecology says punish everyone for the good of the planet... because "they" know better...

WAIT WAIT WAIT.

The Right's latest FEMBOT, Her Queeness Sarah Palin says that Global Warming is real, and Mankind MAY be contributing to it's effects.

Why are you republicans arguing against Global Warming here?????

So Sarah sayeth it. So it is TRUE-eth.

Go forth and spread the Koolaid.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

"So Sarah sayeth it. So it is TRUE-eth."

Raising the specter that the 2010 State of the Union address just might be delivered in tongues. Glossolalia. herm

"I believe that man's activities certainly can be contributing to the issue of global warming, climate change," Quote.

I guess it depends on your definition of "can." As for me, its bunk and so is all the carbon credits they want to propose... but so you don't distort, I agree on most other platform issues.

Regardless of man's impact on global warming, reducing air pollution is just a good idea. Most methods, however, come at a cost and finding a way to make people be willing to pay those costs is difficult. Some people will even complain about wind power because they consider the windmills to be an eyesore.

Continued research and transition to alternate energy sources helps both emissions and our dependence on oil.

The truly hard part will be getting newly developing countries like China to jump on the environmentally conscious bandwagon. Without their participation, all our efforts may be for naught.

**** Too bad she had to go along with this BS. Its the civil rights issue of our time. Except its wrong.
.... Posted by ELCIDCE90 ******

.......yeah.......hope they don't push her into accepting evolution teaching in the schools also........

"lets just fix it'

Posted by klifferd

Been too late for years.

#4 | Posted by Zatoichi

thats why i have stocked up on ammo and food for years.. when the shit hits the fan..

I guess it depends on your definition of "can." As for me, its bunk and so is all the carbon credits they want to propose..s.

#68 | Posted by smashmouth

That is because you are plain fucking stupid..its sad that you and your brethren also believe the earth are only 6000 yo..

Flip-flopping waffle whore.