lol, touche!

lol, douche!

Obama/Hagel '08!

Unbeatable.

Danni,
That would be a very good ticket.

It would be an awesome ticket. Hagel exudes credibility, and not even the most preposterous and simple-minded of the righties like fwthom and kuma, etc., could challenge his credentials.

Are you guys serious?

You just prove that the dem strategy has been to go GOP Lite. He might as well run with Lieberman.

Philosophically I generally agree with most of the left on this site, but I think this is a huge miscalculation.

Also, I think this is proof positive of the dearth of electable democrats these days.

The two party system seems to be the only thing keeping the DNC going, and Obama confirms it if he chooses Hagel.

"You just prove that the dem strategy has been to go GOP Lite."

ER....did you hear about John McCain contacting the Kerry campaign and discussing a run for VP on a Kerry/McCain ticket??? It's called politics.

It's called politics.
Posted by danni

I disagree. It's called a two party monopoly, danni.

That's not democracy.

Mybe for Sec. Def., if he started suggesting it in the fall...

It's called a two party monopoly, danni.

That's not democracy.

Posted by Hagbard_Celine


That's true, but it is what it is. Our system is pathetic. Having a two-party system means "if you're not for us, your against us", and gave rise to the simple-minded cretins of the right who see everything as win/los, us/them, etc. That being the case, it makes sense to appeal to both sides, since victory will depend on the electoral college, which requires winning of some "purple" states.

I think Hagel could pursuade some people tilting toward McCain based on their perception of his "experience" (in spite of the disastrous RESULT of that experience) to vote for Obama, knowing that the expertise and experience would be assured by virtue of having Hagel on board.

gave rise to the simple-minded cretins of the right who see everything as win/los, us/them, etc.


You're a hack if you believe that such thinking is exclusive to the right.

gave rise to the simple-minded cretins of the right who see everything as win/los, us/them, etc.


You're a hack if you believe that such thinking is exclusive to the right.

Posted by JeffJ


Such thinking exists everywhere, but SURELY you have to concede that on this issue, with this current breed of repubs, they have raised it to a new level.

Danni,

Quit drinking your bong water. obama will not be the next prez.

I think more republicans are thinking like Hagel. I doubt that he'll be on the ticket with Obama.

but SURELY you have to concede that on this issue, with this current breed of repubs, they have raised it to a new level.


I don't know that I'd agree with raising it to a new level, but I would agree that the bloc that you refer to has made an art-form out of it.

Having a two-party system means "if you're not for us, your against us", and gave rise to the simple-minded cretins of the right who see everything as win/los, us/them, etc.


...Or the simple minded cretins like danni who say people should "just choose one".

I mean, the ideals that were used to establish this country just aren't important enough to buck the system and give someone else a chance to save our skins.

I don't know that I'd agree with raising it to a new level, but I would agree that the bloc that you refer to has made an art-form out of it.



OK. I don't see much difference there, but I don't disagree with you.

To me, a key difference between the parties is that the current repubs virtually owe their existence to this sort of politics - which can not be said of the dems. My complaint abou tht edems is that they DON'T use more aggressive tactics - at least in response. I am therefore with Obama's responses thus far to McCain's ridiculous arguments against talking to our adversaries.

"The two party system seems to be the only thing keeping the DNC going, and Obama confirms it if he chooses Hagel."

I don't think it says much at all about the Democratic Party, it says something about Chuck Hagel if he chooses to run with Obama. It says he agrees more with the Democratic Party than the Republican Party. I doubt he will quit his party but it is probably tempting because of the Republican's firm committment to this mistaken war.
If anything, I think his switch would show that our two party system actually does offer a clear choice of policy not just personalities.

OK. I don't see much difference there, but I don't disagree with you.

Po-tay-to po-tah-to


I thought 'art-form' sounded better, but the difference is nothing more than semantics.


To me, a key difference between the parties is that the current repubs virtually owe their existence to this sort of politics - which can not be said of the dems.


I think both parties wrap themselves up in this sort of politics - moreso than you may realize, but I do agree that the Republicans do so at least a little bit more than do the Dems.

Chuck Hagel - a Repub with ethics and morals. But why does he stay a Repub? herm

**** Chuck Hagel - a Repub with ethics and morals. But why does he stay a Repub? herm
Posted by herm *****

......he must believe in the values of the party....

......not the queer-mafia gang that has taken it over......

If you read the article, you would see that Hagel is "callin 'em like he sees 'em".

Hagel and McCain are good friends, and this is hardly a departure from his stated position over the past 4 years. Besides, as senior member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, it would be pretty odd if he didn't come out in favor of negotiations with foreign powers, since that is what they have oversight of.

Don't read too much into this, his praise of Obama is typical for him (he was once criticized by the RNC for praising his opponent too much in a Senate reelection campaign) and I wouldn't be surprised if 1) McCain knew of the tenor of these remarks before Hagel said them; and 2) if McCain is elected, Hagel is named SecState.

RofC you really think McCain would want such a vocal opponent of the war in his cabinet???
That doesn't make sense. However, I don't doubt that they are friends but then McCain is friends with Clinton and Kennedy too. He seems mature enough to seperate politics from freindships.

obama will not be the next prez.

You're predicting Barr or Nader?

Danni- Webb would be a great VP pick. They just have to figure out what to do with Hillary...

"They just have to figure out what to do with Hillary..."

Majority Leader of the Senate, it's a better job than VP, IMHO, and Reid isn't getting the job done.

NG what do you think of my other suggestion....Bob Graham of Florida. He could bring Florida in for Obama and he has strong national security experience. Former Governor and Senator, still popular here in Florida. I believe he also opposed the Iraq invasion though I will have to check that.

Webb would be a great VP pick. They just have to figure out what to do with Hillary...

Posted by northguy3

I think that's pretty correct. Webb's got a long and distinguished career.

You ever hear his comment to the president when Bush asked him how his son was (who was in Iraq at the time)? Priceless.

There is one soldier who knows you owe no allegiance to a commanding officer who gives you an illegal command.

What TF DO you do with HRC though?

You think she'd take Supreme Court Justice?

Obama prolly can't offer Secretary of State because they've conflicted on foreign policy issues for over a year now...

"Webb would be a great VP pick."

Webb isn't a progressive. He's barely a Democrat. Those who, perhaps naively, think that the Democratic Party can still be made into an agent of change should insist on a progressive VP nominee, like Edwards or Russ Feingold.

Graham is a moderate progressive and he could help in Florida which we know is a pivotal state.

Webb isn't a progressive. He's barely a Democrat. Those who, perhaps naively, think that the Democratic Party can still be made into an agent of change should insist on a progressive VP nominee

Posted by nullifidian

The changeocrats could never accept a progressive VP nominee.... They've spent the last 8 years blaming NADER.

If you base your progressive credentials on a comparison of where you stand in contrast to the GOP, then you can always feel like a progressive. But the GOP keeps going further and further to the right and dem's have been characteristically afraid of being seen as too left leaning....
and there you have it.

I think Webb would be a good pick for V-P for Obama. You could call call them Moe and Curly. Except Moe and Curly would at least know where their ass is located.

"Except Moe and Curly would at least know where their ass is located."

They'd have to look no further than your 2:25 post.

"Except Moe and Curly would at least know where their ass is located.

Posted by anolesman at 2008-05-21 02:25 PM"

Yup - they could just follow your nose.

"Obama/Hagel '08! Unbeatable."

Would you vote for Hagel if he was at the top of the ticket? If not then why would he make a good fall back plan should a situation arise were Obama would not be able to serve?

Would you vote for Hagel if he was at the top ofthe ticket?

In a heartbeat! Hagel from the Repubs and Biden from the Dems are two senators that, IMO, appeal to voters across party lines because they are not intimdated and are not afraid to part from their own party's concensus from time to time.

RofC you really think McCain would want such a vocal opponent of the war in his cabinet???
That doesn't make sense.

Posted by danni at 2008-05-21 01:03 PM

Hagel has been more an opponent on how the war has been handled then the war itself, and ultimately came around to admitting (along with Levin et al.) that the surge was having the desired effect.

However, if you are McCain and want to, at the very least, appear that you want to engage in more diplomacy, who better to tab for SecState then Hagel?

RofC fortunately I doubt McCain will ever have to choose a Sec. of State.

Chuck Hagel?

Golly!

To most people that's almost as important as the guy who does the OxyClean commercials!

**** Chuck Hagel?
Golly!
To most people that's almost as important as the guy who does the OxyClean commercials!
Posted by vernon *****

.......an honest Republican is disconcerting.....but with effort....you could get used to them......