Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Monday, October 08, 2007

Marty Kaplan: "Q: When President Bush says, 'This government does not torture,' isn't that true only because he got Alberto Gonzales to write a secret memo redefining the meaning of torture? A: Yes. The Constitution grants the power to redefine words to the unitary executive."

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Huh?

Shouldn't she be in an institution somewhere, some place with padded walls?

I know this is a paradoy, but sadly not far from the truth.

I watched the press conference the other day where Perino on being asked about the White House's definition of torture told the baffled reporter, "that's classified'. When the reporter pressed as to whether Congress had been advised as to the definition she answerd 'no, it's classified'.

So, how are we supposed to know what it is when they won't tell anyone?

""So, how are we supposed to know what it is when they won't tell anyone?""

There is a method but, sorry, it's classified.
We could tell you, but then we'd have to kill you.

I can't see how anyone is surprised. The same shit from this administration, just on a different day.

Anyone deluded enough to think they have any good intentions in them should up the arsenic levels in their kool-aid and just get it over with.

Perhaps we should torture more and not less. What was this thread about again?


Perhaps we should torture more and not less. What was this thread about again?

Posted by 101Chairborne


Sweet. Great idea. Better yet, let's start torturing Americans at random. Just start yanking people off the street, render them to Syria, and start taking their skin off with a potato peeler. I'll bet we'd get some really actionable intelligence for a change.

None of that crap intelligence we get from being nice to people and trying to improve their lives. Anyone who knows anything about intelligence knows that the only good intelligence comes from torture.

Sweet. Great idea. Better yet, let's start torturing Americans at random.

I'm glad you asked!

But just in Blue States and of course any big city not in the South.......

Sweet. Great idea. Better yet, let's start torturing Americans at random. Just start yanking people off the street, render them to Syria, and start taking their skin off with a potato peeler. I'll bet we'd get some really actionable intelligence for a change.

None of that crap intelligence we get from being nice to people and trying to improve their lives. Anyone who knows anything about intelligence knows that the only good intelligence comes from torture.

Posted by ddenton at 2007-10-08 03:19 PM | Reply


Now you're talkin'! Damn, I had you all wrong, I thought you were some limp-wristed liberal bitch.
My apologies...

"Everyone in America is entitled to our opinion."


That about sums up the current administration.

Great new career goal. Torturer.

""Mommy, when I grow up I want to torture people.""
"Oh Son, I'm so proud of you. Why don't you go beat the dog and dream big dreams. If you see your sister, smack her hard."

Ah, Danni, you get the FF...

"If you see your sister, smack her hard."

I bet its a huge joke with every journalist in those press conferences. They get to see the full scope of this administrations deceptiveness and out right arogance. The loaded question at the end was hilarious, but true. Do people actually fall for this shit?

Danni,

That was some Funny Shit !

-Sarge

So, how are we supposed to know what it is when they won't tell anyone?

As I understand it AU, the appropriate Committees in Congress have been fully briefed on the program. You should complain to those Senators and Congresspersons who have been briefed as to why they refuse to reveal classified information to the public.

Given that most of the Lefties here believe that "belly Slapping" is torture, I can't see how any interrogation technique that we are using won't fall under the Left's definition of torture.

As has been proven throughout this site the past couple of weeks or so, the fix on the Left is in -- there is no good news they won't ignore or dismiss, there won't be any opportunity to show their own hypocrisy overlooked, there wont be any chance to mischaracterize and lie about the President that they will let pass by.

I'm really starting to begin to believe that many people here have a screw loose, or are at least suffering from the final stages of BDS (Bush Derangement Syndrome)
en.wikipedia.org

""Mommy, when I grow up I want to torture people.""
"Oh Son, I'm so proud of you. Why don't you go beat the dog and dream big dreams. If you see your sister, smack her hard."

video.google.com

let's start torturing Americans at random.

Finally! Are you thinking of running for office? I have a list we can start with.

You should complain to those Senators and Congresspersons who have been briefed as to why they refuse to reveal classified information to the public.

Because it is against the law.

Wow Bowa, people are right, you are an idiot.


let's start torturing Americans at random.

Finally! Are you thinking of running for office? I have a list we can start with.


Would it really be torturing by random, if we had a list?

Bowa,

"Belly-slapping" sounds innocuous enough, but do that a couple of dozen times, couple that with getting slapped in the head, thrown into a freezer, then get strapped to metal bunk bed frame with your arms tied back at an obtuse angle. If all of that were happening to you, I doubt you'd be downplaying it.

If all of that were happening to you, I doubt you'd be downplaying it.

Posted by ddenton at 2007-10-08 04:14 PM | Reply

C'mon the torturers would be "just blowing off steam".

We could pick names at random off the list, preserving the randomness of the torture.

Hey here's an idea....

let's randomly start with Fox News.

Bowa you are suffering, I know, and I'm sorry, from Simple Derangement.

And I hope you don't have to depend on the Emergency Room, as recommended by the President for those who need health care.

"Everyone in America is entitled to our opinion."


That's Freedom Baby! "1984" style Freedom.

Let's randomly start with someone who isn't white. Nobody would report it.

Because it is against the law.

That's right Manypaths, releasing classified info to the public is against the law -- which is why the president doesn't do it, nor members of Congress.

So why all the complaints from people here who are criticizing the Bush Administration for not breaking the law to reveal classified information?

It isn't against the law for the President to divulge classified information to memebers of Congress.

His decision NOT to is his choice.

He tells a select group of Congressmen, who aren't allowed to tell ANYONE, and claims that he is being open about it. Well, that is a crafty way to hide the truth.

Hell, people like you eat it up.

That was some Funny Shit !

-Sarge

Posted by Sarge at 2007-


yeah sure funny as hell...

about as funny as the report from the new republic about the young child who was protituted into bashing bush about the veto....

it seems that the father just spent 160,000 bucks on some property and the child attends an upscale PRIVATE SCHOOL>..

so its the parents who made the choice for thier child to not have health insurance, but yet the socialists in this country, also known as democrats, tell ust that we are heartless because we support the veto....

doesnt seem like out of the ordinary though for that side to be deceptive and just plain lie and things like that.....or should we say just CONVIENENTLY leave that info out.........


torture......I believe that most of you here would drop your sanctamonius whining if you or a family member would be saved by info gotten by any means necessary.......OOPS......you already have been..
no attacks since 9/11 !!!!!!!!!!!!!

and remember bowa.......all of the left think that patrick leahy is an honored member of congtress..

and just what info like this was it that he leaked to the press?

and of course there is always sandy burgler.....
who, by the way , was just enlisted by the clinton campaign......I guess they need some help stealing secured government documents since he can steal whatever he wants and get away with it by stating that he didnt know those papers were in his socks..
that has as much credibility as the 'wide stance' argument......

you already have been..
no attacks since 9/11 !!!!!!!!!!!!!


And how many before than?

So you get information from the New Republic huh? Explains a lot of your ignorance.

And are you really so scared that you think a family member is going to die due to terrorism?

It wouls suck to live with such fear. I pity you and your family.

you already have been..
no attacks since 9/11 !!!!!!!!!!!!!


See, you continue to think that the Neo-Cons protect you when it was they who allowed 3000 Americans to expire that day, yet for some reason, you feel safe under them.

That part is hard to make sense of.

He tells a select group of Congressmen, who aren't allowed to tell ANYONE, and claims that he is being open about it. Well, that is a crafty way to hide the truth.

What are you talking about Manypaths. Each bi-partisan comittee is privy to top secret information pertaining to their duties which is shared between the three branches of government. It is not a crafty way to hide the truth but a responsible way to preserve state secrets that if disclosed could be injurious to our government, while at the same time providing oversight which preserves the balance of powers between the branches of governemnt.

If anyone in the Congress who had been briefed about the enhanced interrogation techniques had a problem with them, there are ways to appeal to the judiciary to raise the red flag without disclosing classified information.

no dickhead....thats not where I get ALL my info.....and you can leave the personal bullshit to yourslef.......

I get my info from all sorts of places and not just the NY times like you and pelosi.........

how typical of a response was this....should be put on everyone's computer......cant refute or even acknowledge something but you have to slobber this kind of rhetoric........

and of course you finish it with the old charge that jews, disguised in the name, neocon, in this country caused 9/11 in the first place......
wow, and its me and my family that you pity.....

putz!

about as funny as the report from the new republic about the young child who was protituted into bashing bush about the veto....

it seems that the father just spent 160,000 bucks on some property and the child attends an upscale PRIVATE SCHOOL


Is that true BL2? The kid who did the Democratic response the other day to president Bush's speech is some rich kid in private school who will get to go on the dole if the democrats override the Veto?

Danni,

That was some Funny Shit !

-Sarge

Posted by Sarge at 2007-10-08 03:41 PM

Is that you Larry?

Given that most of the Lefties here believe that "belly Slapping" is torture, I can't see how any interrogation technique that we are using won't fall under the Left's definition of torture.

If it's clasified, how do we know that "belly slapping" is all they're doing.
Forgive me if I don't take their word for it.

Is that true BL2? The kid who did the Democratic response the other day to president Bush's speech is some rich kid in private school who will get to go on the dole if the democrats override the Veto?

no, he was just a rich kid who has parents that care about disadvantaged kids.

You wouldn't understand.

the father just spent 160,000 bucks on some property

Posted by bushlovertwo

wow!!!that's what, a double wide these days? It still comes out as 600 Billion for an idiotic war and a turn down of a program to provide medical expenses for poor children. If you want to keep being associated with these moronic, retarded failure-oriented neo-con bunglers then keep on spewing the same ol crap.

Let's hook up some of the pro 'it's not torture' crowd. Let's put a wet cloth bag over their head, cuff then behind their back, and hang them from a hook by their cuffs until only the tips of their toes reach the floor. Hanging by your cuffed hands behind your back - putting tremendious pressure on their rotator cuffs (yes some tear) and making it nearly impossible to breath

Then we'll see where they stand...and stand....and stand....and stand....and stand....

Only one of the "it's not torture' techniques we use.

If anyone in the Congress who had been briefed about the enhanced interrogation techniques had a problem with them, there are ways to appeal to the judiciary to raise the red flag without disclosing classified information.

Patently, demonstrably, completely FALSE! Please inform us whom a Congressional representative is supposed to contact in the judiciary Bowa.

The reason for secrecy laws go directly to the fact that NO ONE is even allowed to discuss the information outside of the closed committee room, and not even with their own staff members. If you remember correctly Senator Rockefeller hand wrote and personally delivered a letter stating his own misgiving of early surveillance efforts to Dick Cheney and never received a response.

Most importantly, the information leaking out on these newer torture memos were NOT disclosed to Congress, and a number of reps are on the record as not learning about them until reading it in the paper. The Bush White House doesn't not believe in separation of powers and they make no bones about their own inherent superiority to Congress on almost all matters of national security choosing to define their constitutional mandates as they read them themselves through the lens of their lapdog Justice Department.

and of course you finish it with the old charge that jews, disguised in the name, neocon, in this country caused 9/11 in the first place......

I did? Did you read that at the New Republic?

Who was in charge of protecting us on 9-11-2001?

That is rhetoric? Interesting, as I was alluding to facts. The fact that you tout this admin as one that has protected us when the FACT is, this admin is the one that was in charge when 3000 Americans were killed.

And I hope you don't have to depend on the Emergency Room, as recommended by the President for those who need health care.

Bush meant that if something happened that needed to be taken care of right away, a person can go to an emergency room and they will be treated. As far as I know, that is true. Emergency rooms do not turn people away.

I have private insurance. I'm also a veteran so I have VA benefits to fall back on if I become unemployed. I've also been to the emergency room of a city hospital in the past few years after getting into a car accident -- not a major injury -- after hearing all the horror stories about emergency rooms, I was pleasantly surprised -- I was seen by a nurse within 10 minutes, and had been given x-rays, seen by an MD, given a prescription for pain killers, and back out the door within 90 minutes.

I'm not saying that our healthcare system is perfect but socialized medicaine is not the way to go.

Let's hook up some of the pro 'it's not torture' crowd. Let's put a wet cloth bag over their head, cuff then behind their back, and hang them from a hook by their cuffs for hours while only the tips of their toes reach the floor. Hanging by your cuffed hands behind your back - putting tremendious pressure on their rotator cuffs (yes some tear) and making it nearly impossible to breath

Then we'll see where they stand...and stand....and stand....and stand....and stand....

Only one of the "it's not torture' techniques we use.

That's right Manypaths, releasing classified info to the public is against the law -- which is why the president doesn't do it, nor members of Congress.

So why all the complaints from people here who are criticizing the Bush Administration for not breaking the law to reveal classified information?



Posted by Bowa at 2007-10-08 05:19 PM

Unless it is the name of an undercover CIA agent, then releaseing classified information is encouraged and defended.

no, he was just a rich kid who has parents that care about disadvantaged kids.

No, he isn't a "rich kid" at all, and the wingnut right media are raking the poor kid and his family over the coals with their usual assortment of lies and smears!

Conservatives have more recently turned their targets on young Graeme Frost himself. A poster at the Free Republic propagated information alleging that Frost was actually a rich kid being pampered by the government. Among other bits of information, the post by the Freeper "icwhatudo" asserts that Graeme and his sister Gemma attend wealthy schools that cost "nearly $40,000 per year for tuition" and live in a well-off home.

The smear attack against Graeme has taken firm hold in the right-wing blogosphere. The National Review, Michelle Malkin, Wizbang, Powerline, and the Weekly Standard blog have all launched assaults on the Frost family. The story is slowly working its way into traditional media outlets as well.

Here are the facts that the right-wing distorted in order to attack young Graeme:

1) Graeme has a scholarship to a private school. The school costs $15K a year, but the family only pays $500 a year.

2) His sister Gemma attends another private school to help her with the brain injuries that occurred due to her accident. The school costs $23,000 a year, but the state pays the entire cost.

3) They bought their "lavish house" sixteen years ago for $55,000 at a time when the neighborhood was less than safe.

4) Last year, the Frost's made $45,000 combined. Over the past few years they have made no more than $50,000 combined.

5) The state of Maryland has found them eligible to participate in the CHIP program.

Desperate to defend Bush's decision to cut off millions of children from health care, the right wing has stooped to launching baseless and uninformed attacks against a 12 year old child and his family.

Right wing bloggers have been harassing the Frosts, calling their home numerous times to get information about their private lives. Compassionate conservatism indeed.


thinkprogress.org

On the heels of the Limbaugh smearing and the O'Reilly meltdown, again we see the rightwing attack machine go off relentlessly without any compunction to whom they target and smear with impunity.

These scum make me sick!

torture was used to gain intelligence that was used to justify the invasion of iraq.

therefore as a result of torture,

3815 americans and hundreds of thousands of iraqis have lost their lives.

I'm not saying that our healthcare system is perfect but socialized medicaine is not the way to go.

BOWA


Government run health care (Medicare for example) spends 2% in administrative fees. Private insurers? Up to 20%.

Government run health care costs far less per visit. Private? Sky's the limit in what doctors charge.

Government run health care allows you to go to the doctor of your choice, and needed tests are given. Private HMO's tell you who you can see, and some 25 year old 2000 miles away decides if you can get those tests or not. You'd better call the HMO while you're unconscience before they'll 'pre-approve' your ambulance ride. Otherwise you pay.

Government run health care is nonprofit. Private insurers are 'for profit'. They care about profits over your health.

You sure about that Bowa?

torture......I believe that most of you here would drop your sanctamonius whining if you or a family member would be saved by info gotten by any means necessary.......OOPS......you already have been..
no attacks since 9/11 !!!!!!!!!!!!!


torture was used to gain intelligence that was used to justify the invasion of iraq


torture lead to the deaths of 3815 americans.

You sure about that Bowa?

Yes.

TONYROMA

Doesn't that smear campaign take the cake?

Now they're 'Swiftboating' 12 year olds with equally untrue BS.

BOWA

OK Just checking. If you like being told by an HMO who you can and cannot see, and have some 25 year old 2000 miles away make decisions about your health care against the doctor's wishes cool with me.

Frist Family: Inventors of the "for profit' HMO racket. Their company bought up community hospitals that used to offer affordable stays and replaced them with gaudy hospitals that left you bankrupt if you weren't wealthy just trying to pay co-pays or procedures your HMO wouldn't allow from 2000 miles away.

Nice.

AU...

Its getting to the point that serious looks should be taken to suing the most eggregious for slander and libel. No one should have to put up with that type of shit, particularly children who owe their lives to a government program that helped save their lives and their family's financial health at the same time.

When is the right going to figure out that the US will remain non-competitive with the rest of the globe until we enact a comprehensive healthcare system that removes the burden from employers and spreads it across society for the betterment of us all?

A comprehensive healthcare system IS pro-business unless you're an overpaid provider or an equally overpaid insurer. Not to mention preventative care is far less expensive than catastrophic care, but thats where the HUGE profits are. They aren't in keeping people healthy in the first place!

OK one more time for the 'It's not torture' crowd....

Let's put a wet cloth bag over their head, cuff them behind their back, and hang them from a hook by their cuffs for hours while only the tips of their toes reach the floor. Hanging with cuffed hands putting tremendious pressure is on their rotator cuffs (yes many tear) they find it nearly impossible to breath. They're left like that for hours.

Then we'll see where they stand...and stand....and stand....and stand....and stand....

Only one of the "it's not torture' techniques we use.

When is the right going to figure out that the US will remain non-competitive with the rest of the globe until we enact a comprehensive healthcare system that removes the burden from employers and spreads it across society for the betterment of us all?

Sorry Tony but I have to laugh at this.

The burden is not properly on the employers. When is the country going to figure out that healthcare should be on the employers and to allow them to be competitive the policies of imports should be changed.

Let's see here about all this freetrade stuff. It is good and is not supposed to hamper those who are trading but if other nations are not using private enterprise to administer healthcare we should be getting them fined through the WTO and the world bank.

Why are we not doing this, because the employers want it this way.

The insurance companies, most doctors and pharmaceutical companies all want to keep medical care in the private sector so that they can make lots of money from it. They spend billions on propaganda and rented right wingers to convince the rest of us that it is good for us. So far it has worked but they overreached in allowing Bush to become their flagbearer with the power to stop it because he can be relied on always to say something hateful and stupid at the wrong time when vetoing anything that even veers slightly from their heavenly right wing ideal. And tough though it's been to endure the stupid SOB there's only 16 months left before we set out on the road to everybody having access to the medical care that is their birthright as Americans and the government making sure that they get it. Thing is, as you right wing SOB's understand so well, once it's here, it's here to stay.

Socialized medicine guys, it's coming, get used to it or emigrate to some right wing heaven where they don't have it. You'll be so much happier there and so will we be to have you there and not here with your incessant whining.

Let's see here about all this freetrade stuff. It is good and is not supposed to hamper those who are trading but if other nations are not using private enterprise to administer healthcare we should be getting them fined through the WTO and the world bank.

Why are we not doing this, because the employers want it this way.


We see the problem from different ends. The rest of the world has already proven that state-administered healthcare is far more cost-effective than our private system. Why in the world should they be penalized for our own ignorance?

Unless, of course, this was the point you were trying to make in the first place, hopefully. Its the medical/pharma industry along with insurers who fight changes tooth and nail. They know they're extracting exhorbinant profits at the expense of both our health and in keeping preventative care from taking root and lessening our reliance on catastrophic care.

Tony,

You are getting close to what I was referring.

The so called false bravado of the right and their constant push to stay privatised is hyperbole at best.

Some how they think that the governments running healthcare will fail and there is no need for the unfair trade practices to be weighed in the WTO and world banking communitees.

Medicare costs the least per patient of anything out there. Providers somehow manage to provide health care, people can go to the doctor of their choice, test can be administered without some twerp 2000 miles away approving it. With only 2% going to administrative costs more money goes to provide care and it's far less costly than private insurance by far.

Why are so many saying government health care is a bad thing? Wouldn't they rather get nonprofit, better care for less outlay, and have decisions made by their doctor instead of some HMO who only wants to profit?

I don't get it.

Today's health care system is torture

Lou_Dobbs/BL2,

Torture is wrong,Period ! Bush lying about not supporting torture is wrong, Danni's joke was Funny, much like "Anne The Man Coulter's" humor is to you.

-Sarge

Hi Sarge!!

Hey, how's 45 Cal doing? I haven't talked to her in a couple of days.

Hope she's doing better!

We see the problem from different ends. The rest of the world has already proven that state-administered healthcare is far more cost-effective than our private system. Why in the world should they be penalized for our own ignorance?

Serious question.....at what point do you think our health care system became "broken"? When did it start failing. I ask because I doubt you would have thought this way 20 years ago. At what point did we cross this line?

Whatever, Bowa, I'm just happy you can get treatment for the "Simple Derangement" and urge you to do so immediately.

Baby boomer retirees!

Serious question.....at what point do you think our health care system became "broken"? When did it start failing. I ask because I doubt you would have thought this way 20 years ago. At what point did we cross this line?

Posted by eberly


Thoughts for starters:

-When HMO's were born - taking decisions out of doctor's hands and creating for-profit insurers as opposed to those like Blue Cross/Blue Shield that used to be nonprofit.
-When companies like HCA (Frist Family) started buying up all the non-profit community hospitals in the U.S. that used to provide affordable stays and replaced them with gaudy for-profit hospitals.
-The fact that health care costs have been rising at 3X's the level of inflation for years
-When med school students started reaching for the brass ring and general practioners slowly declined. When I was a kid, an office visit was $5.
-When pharmacutical companies started putting their money into drugs for things I didn't even know existed - like 'Restless Leg Syndrome. Are there really enough people to justify a multimillion dollar advertising campaign? I doubt it. But, no doubt they're selling it LOL

-When costs for insuring employees became so exorbitant fewer Americans were covered, pushing up the cost further for everyone. Partly due to outsourcing of good paying jobs. WalMart won't insure you too well....

His sister Gemma attends another private school to help her with the brain injuries that occurred due to her accident. The school costs $23,000 a year, but the state pays the entire cost.

How much do you want to bet that whatever private health insurance the family had dropped their ass when their kid got a brain injury and needed a special $23,000 per year tuition school?

The state pays because they have a vested interest in transforming a liability into a productive tax paying citizen.
The for-profit insurace company could care less.

Effective interrogators in WWII played chess and ping pong with their captives, gaining their trust/respect and getting info.

How far we have fallen under this so called christian president.

How far we have fallen under this so called christian president.

He's like a lot of Christians. They make an effusive showing of their religion, but deep down they have no compassion, and become driven by what they think is right. At that point they're no different than any other deranged person.

Not a few of them have a history of alcohol or drug abuse, if not themselves then their family.

Aggie says, "He's like a lot of Christians. They make an effusive showing of their religion, but deep down they have no compassion, and become driven by what they think is right. At that point they're no different than any other deranged person."

You missed the part where they do everything against their show of principles and morals, didn't you? No? Would that be an outright lie, and make your assertions seems comical? Instead, you just skip to the 'point' that they aren't any different than humanists who DO NOT EVER act or believe in those principles and, or morals, with which to begin! Say, a gang of Leftist/Democratics!

Is that what you are saying? That Christians are the same hypocrites as are Leftist/Democratics who aren't Christians?

How about Democratics who ARE Christian -- are they hypocrites, too?

Are you sure you're not blind, as well as being this mentally defective?

Skip....jump

skip.....jump

skip .... skip.....jump


democrat/liberal shit


skip....jump


Tadowe

Alex says, "Effective interrogators in WWII played chess and ping pong with their captives, gaining their trust/respect and getting info."

Link, please.

"During the many interrogations, I never laid hands on anyone," said George Frenkel, 87, of Kensington, Va. "We extracted information in a battle of the wits. I'm proud to say I never compromised my humanity."

Afraid this was another generation.

www.startribune.com

Moneywar answers for Alex, "Afraid this was another generation."

Afraid? BS!

You don't even think! How could you be afraid of what you don't think of?

This is one person, making claims about himself in the place he was at -- and not about what interrogations may have happened outside his knowledge, or what tactics were used that he wasn't aware of being done!

And, so what were the horrible tortures at abu Ghraib ... I'm not up on all the sadistic violence perpetrated by the guards (like nazis according to you all)?

What were they? Describe the worst one ... please?

How about Democratics who ARE Christian -- are they hypocrites, too?

Yep. Hillary is know to have attended church and bible on a weekly basis. They was a story about how the all the political wives go to this meeting and supported her during the Monica affair.

Don't you think she's a hypocrite? What about Laura Bush. You think she's any different?

There's an oligarchy in Washington. They're all members of the SAME party. Why do you pretend any different?

Hypocrisy or Stupidity?

You can't argue with me you ornery mule.

Ozzark says, "You can't argue with me you ornery mule."

You didn't answer!!!

Loser!

Apparently skip and jump is unable to click and read the link.

The only one here to show ignorance. Shall we put you in the ranks of truth with BOWA too?

Listen, taddy boy, I think all Christians, etc., are delusional.

49-reasons.com

I just target the right wingers because they've managed to plumb new depths. The Dems come off as more compassionate when they are nearly as vicious.

They are all hypocrites.

Guess they didn't teach reading comprehension at Buffalo Chip High, huh?

Moneywar backs down, "The only one here to show ignorance. Shall we put you in the ranks of truth with BOWA too?"

You want ALL our soldiers held responsible for the acts of a few, and which acts and actions were investigated and made public by the Pentagon, itself. You WANT/DESIRE/INSIST on US soldiers being torturers and murderers so that you can PROFIT FROM IT!

You are the party of torture schadenfreude -- you are so delighted by this and wish it to be a common practice of the services!

Murtha, after 37 years of service, calls Marines murderers for political gain ... and now known to be a BIG FAT LIE!

What scum, what subversive little shits to want to turn our soldiers into hated icons for political gain ...!

What total verminous anti-patriots they just happen to be ... the traitors!



How about Democratics who ARE Christian -- are they hypocrites, too?

Yep.
Posted by OzarkAggie at 2007-10-09 02:40 AM | Reply | Flag:

Ozzark says, "You can't argue with me you ornery mule."

You didn't answer!!!

Loser!

Posted by tadowe at 2007-10-09 02:44 AM


What is it about Yep that you don't understand?

Fucking Juicer.

You want ALL our soldiers held responsible for the acts of a few

Apparently you have intellectual comprehension as well.

This has nothing to do with our soldiers, no matter how hard you SKIP AND JUMP the fact will remain, you clearly don't understand the issue.

For someone who mixes and twists words so how is it you lack the comprehension in seeing the foundation of this issue?

Willfull ignorance? Blind support?

Just continue playing with the words and never saying anything but doing a good job of skipping and jumping around.

Oz says, "Listen, taddy boy, I think all Christians, etc., are delusional."

Is that why you want to lose in Iraq? You want Islam to win and help get rid of Christians?

"I just target the right wingers because they've managed to plumb new depths. The Dems come off as more compassionate when they are nearly as vicious."

Oh, I guess you are one of the 'moderates', right? Only, your 'moderation' is all on the side of excusing Democratics, as you do right there.

"They are all hypocrites. Guess they didn't teach reading comprehension at Buffalo Chip High, huh?"

I'm a real 'ozark' and graduated Neosho HS. No buffalo, there.

However, they did teach me to recognize buffalo chippers like you, and your efforts to transfer your own faults onto others ...

So, I know that you are the hypocrite, and you are the bs artist ... the only Christians you dislike are those who voter their principle and moral beliefs!!!

The rest is cover and a facade to hide your radical anti-patriotism ...

You want ALL our soldiers held responsible for the acts of a few

I say Let the Sun Shine In - Say Hallelujah Brother -This Way to the Truth and the Light.


IOW stop the CYA and get to the problem - the Civilian Contractors.

Trouble is, they like to use these guys. Others do too. It's a traveling freak show, S&M Style. They'll crawl away and show up somewhere else. South America has been their hangout, and now they're unwelcome.

I suspect that's why Bush bought land in Paraguay. He'll be the first president in history I believe to retire to a foreign country with a private army. He may well need it.

skip and jump,

Murtha, after 37 years of service, calls Marines murderers for political gain ... and now known to be a BIG FAT LIE!

Now, it is you who talked about hypocrits, now who are you showing your face to.

Murtha said nothing of the sort, yet you hypocritically spout such nonsense in postulation of such a big fat lie.

Moneywar ... just FO!

I'm not the subject you freak!?! You just prove that you and your ilk are nothing more than attack yellow-dogs who haven't a clue about politics!

It is all GANGSTERISM to you! You join and loyally attack anyone who your gang bosses tell you to attack!

"Get anyone who doesn't lie and try and lose this war!!!"

AND YOU DO!

Like the unpatriotic curs that you are! You are so disgusting, it is hard to describe!

You party of traitors is going down ... watch ...

skip and jump




skip and jump


skip skip and jump



liberal shit


skip and jump







tadowe

Skip and jump,

You just prove that you and your ilk are nothing more than attack yellow-dogs who haven't a clue about politics!

Your first mistake is the assumption that I am concerned with politics regarding this subject.

I notice politics is the only thing in your concern regardless of the truth.

OzarkAggie

IOW stop the CYA and get to the problem - the Civilian Contractors.
...
Posted by OzarkAggie at 2007-10-09 03:12 AM


I was listening to talk radio the other morning and some military veteran called in and had a really unique suggestion re what to do with Blackwater and the other mercenaries.

He said -- if I can remember how this goes -- that all veterans are obligated up to 8 years after they leave the service to be called back into service if needed. He said that since a good majority of these mercenary types are often ex-military that Bush should call them back into active service and have them serve under U.S. military command again. That would also solve any recruitment problem. Of course the ones called back would have to meet fitness requirements.

That way they would be covered by the UCMJ laws -- and we taxpayers would save a lot of money too since we are now paying the mercenary lots of $$$$ which would be much less if they were put back into active military again.

I thought the guy had a fairly good idea.

Money says, "Your first mistake is the assumption that I am concerned with politics regarding this subject."

Another sophomoric tactic to avoid discussion.

"I notice politics is the only thing in your concern regardless of the truth."

The 'truth' is what it is, and it is being twisted and misdirected in use to blame everything, all of it on this administration.

That is not a 'truthful' portrayal of what the truth of the matter happens to be.

The truth is that this situation was created as a result of the Democratic congress wanting to reduce the military to a skeleton force, after Vietnam. Even though civilians were already doing about 30% of military post/base duties, here and overseas, the Democratic congress increased civilian presence in nearly 50% of all military specialties and positions; even police/MP functions.

The BLAME is on a Congress right on about 30 years old, and that same philosophy in Democratically controlled congresses, up until the present. The only effort to increase military strength and responsibility has been during Republican administrations.

That's the 'truth' that the military is well aware of, and as their pay increases and benefits have been routinely cut, while civilian UNION pay has increased 10 times their rate!

Democratics hate the military and try and discredit it at every opportunity; even if they are responsible for the state of PRIVITASATION we are in ...


radical anti-patriotism ...


Posted by tadowe


radical anti-patriotism? Does that actually mean something in your world, tadpole?

the family in question here may not be rich by some of your standards which is the point.....they made choices.....he chose to spend money on property and to send thier child to a private school........INSTEAD OF HEALTH INSURANCE like I think most people would have done.........
and then the dems and the parents "PROSTITUTE thier child in front of a camera attempting to shame people into the side of their issue....

and you can call this whatever you want, but I think its important to know that these people CHOSE NOT TO HAVE HEALTH CARE FOR THIER CHILD..........

and here is good question too......

what is the line of money made that means you deserve me and the REST OF YOU to pay for people's health insurance.....is there one......or one that the left will just come up with....

and as was said on sunday,,,,

the left wants to give health insurance to people making 60 top 80 thou a year, but they considee people rich who make little more than that........

"PROSTITUTE thier child in front of a camera attempting to shame people into the side of their issue...."

Abortion Foes Let Their Own Kids Get Arrested.

Hans

Ban abortion and screw them once they're born.

Spend a trillion tax dollars helping the Iraqis 'get freedom' (latest excuse) and deny 18 days worth of Iraq expenditures to insure 10,000,000 American kids for a year.

Twisted logic.

I find it funny that after Tonyroma's post about the frost family that the righties quit talking about them on this thread.

As for Tad, he's almost as big a pile of shit as Rush Limbaugh. Pulling crazy shit like this out of his ass:

"You want ALL our soldiers held responsible for the acts of a few, and which acts and actions were investigated and made public by the Pentagon, itself. You WANT/DESIRE/INSIST on US soldiers being torturers and murderers so that you can PROFIT FROM IT!"

No sane person is going to believe this, from anyone. It's obvious Tadpole will believe anything. I suppose he also thinks the earth is flat and Jesus rode a dinosaur. It would be par for the course.

The only thing I WANT/DESIRE/INSIST on is Tad getting a fucking clue. Or he can die of gonorrhea. That would be nice too.

Ok, maybe not DIE from gonorrhea. But instead become sterile so he can't make more of himself.

Ok, maybe not DIE from gonorrhea. But instead become sterile so he can't make more of himself.

Posted by ddenton

Personally-I'd INSIST he be sterilized anyway.
True stupidity is NOT that intense.
Willful ignorance can be.
Add in the hatred he feels toward anyone to the left of flush rimjob-and you have a rethuglickin' "terra'ist" in training........

Just think-in 1964 Barry Goldwater couldn't get elected because he was considered TOO Conservative.
Compared to tad-the-polesmoker and his ilk-he almost seems soooo far to the left-he's next to Joseph Stalin.

When GHWB was at Yale, he played baseball but was not very good. One day during the Yale baseball season, he excitedly visited his mother to proudly proclaim that he had hit his first home run. She reportedly looked back at him with patrician coolness, and asked, "Yes, George, but did
your team win the game?"

Like father like son? Or the son is worse???

(See an interesting window to the two Bush's:
www.freedomdomain.com)

Idiots' Row is on display. Whenever a country's interests are threatened, it responds rationally. It's a rational response to avert harm to your fellow countrymen and yourselves by taking indicated measures.

Despite the lies promulgated by the NY Times in its editorial, torture does work. That's why it's used. The Number 3 al-Qaeda operative cracked under simulated drowning and provided information that saved numerous lives.

The President and any administration would be derelict if it did not employ extraordinary means to promote the welfare and well-being of its citizens, protecting them from harm.

The Constitutional provisions, and there don't seem to be any barring "torture" (however defined) of enemies, are addressed in a contemporary milieu. The Constitution has been reinterpreted over the years to conform to the current political and world situation.

When Lincoln was President, he actually had a Congressman jailed for opposing Lincoln's views. Another opponent was bound up and dumped into Confederate hands.

During WWII, six (was it) German spies were landed on the American shore by a German submarine with the object of committing sabotage. They were apprehended, tried by a military court, and in short order - no extended appeals, executed. Oops! Two of those six spies were American citizens. That did not prevent summary disposition of the case.

Why is it that idiots today want to expose Americans needlessly to harm. Are they masochistic as to themselves, or hateful toward their fellow Americans? Whatever they are, if they cannot foresee the consequences of the actions they support, they're stupid. If they can foresee the consequences of the actions they support and continue to support curtailing American actions taken in an attempt to forestall harm to its citizens, then they are renegades, and should be subject to punishment for giving aid and comfort to enemies of the United States.






President George W. Bush will be ruled by history to be a great man, a visionary with an epic view of events. He has recognized the nature of Islam and the role of Islamic terror in its jihad commenced against the West.

Oil revenues have enabled primitive Islamics to infuse life into an ideology that is now seeking to confront civilized people, who have emerged from the darkness of theocratically imposed limits on rationality. The enlightened non-Islamic world is being assailed by a base primitive belief system founded by an illiterate opportunist, who plagiarized some existing monotheistic ideas, and made them the justifications and motivations for committing murder and mayhem, and embracing the goal of subjugating non-Islamics.

The Islamic texts, the Quran and the Hadith require conversion, or death or subjugation, of non-Muslims and their condemnation to life under dhimmi statu. The barbaric Islamic belief systems are to prevail in the umma, which would encompass the world.

You hear what they say, and you see what they do, but you refuse to even dignify them by accepting the reality of their beliefs and their own ideas of their mission.

Islam is a death cult dedicated to death and conquest. The Medina portion of the Quran is unequivocal and Islamic scholars of all schools declare that the Medina, the later suras of the Quran supersede those promulgated earlier in Mecca, when Muhammed was struggling to achieve supremacy. After he was in control, his true brutality manifested itself. All of his declarations were to support his whims, such as "marrying" a six year old child, putting out the eyes of enemies, and other activities that some leftists seem to excuse as they deny autonomy of thought to Islamics.

(cont.)

(cont.)

Yet in Saudi Arabis, and in Iran, Islamic law, sharia, prevails, as all matters are subordinate to religion. The umma is trans-national. By the way, in honor of "the perfect man, who lived the perfect life," Muhammed the Prophet, and in deference to his expressing the will of God and his perfection, Iranian adoption of Islamic law, sharia, provides that a child may marry at age nine in emulation of the ways of the Prophet. Muhammed, who was in his 40s at the time as I recall, delayed intercourse with Fatima until she was nine years of age (apparently not because of concern regarding having sexual relations with a baby, but because she suffered from a repulsive disfiguring skin disease that did not heal for three years).

Islam is on the march. It is quite open in its declarations as to its objectives. It is priming its "warriors," indoctrinating them with the status of Islamics and their duty, their obligation under Islam to wage war against the West. And they are doing it.

It is astonishing that those of you who declare themselves secularists, give Islamics a bye and instead focus on Christianity as repressive, suppressive, or whatever. It would seem that you would want to enlist Christians as allies in addressing the monstrosity that is Islam, its use of death and death threats and rioting to coerce expressions of contrary opinions, its repression of women, its refusal ot allow other religions or any thoughts that question it, to be expressed, etc.

Remember agnostics and atheists, and Hindus, and Buddhists, that dhimmi status, being permitted to live under Islamic law, is reserved to monotheists, Christians and Jews, while non-monotheists are to be put to the sword. You folks certainly are courageous protected as you are by the American military. How about taking your loud mouths to an Islamic environment and making your views known in a sharia governed country?

I wonder why these primitives use the internet, and cars instead of camels and horses for transportation. After all, if it was good enough for Muhammed then it should be good enough for them. What about medical treatments? What about ...?

"...torture does work."

Oops:

"if I take a Bunsen burner to the guy's genitals, he's going to tell you just about anything," which would be pointless. Rothrock, who is no squishy liberal, says that he doesn't know "any professional intelligence officers of my generation who would think this is a good idea."

-----

Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., knows about prisoner abuse. As a naval aviator, he was shot down over Vietnam and spent 51/2 years as a prisoner of war in the infamous Hanoi Hilton, where he was beaten and tortured. Now McCain is leading an effort to clarify the rules of humane interrogation and prisoner treatment for the U.S. military. The Bush administration should be embracing it instead of trying to kill it.

-----

Why Torture Doesn't Work By Brig. Gen. David R. Irvine
And if that's not enough:

"Why Torture Doesn't Work" Link Fest

So much for "...torture does work."

"President George W. Bush will be ruled by history to be a great man, a visionary with an epic view of events."

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

Hans

Geez Hans, since torture doesn't work, how come the number three man of al-Qaeda regurgitated so much information.

You are aware, aren't you, that information extracted by any means is vetted from other sources, and combined with other information to create a model of activity.

Well Hans, what about the fact that #3 spilled his guts with waterboarding? Doesn't that contradict these claims.

Also, why do you suppose that so much effort is extended to "interrogation" if the results are not worthwhile? Grow up and smell the roses.

Hmm. Another instance, the black American Major or Lt. Col., who put a gun to the head of a prisoner and threatened to blow it off, and elicited information concerning a planned ambush. The information enabled the ambushers to be dealt with. The American officer was threatened with a court martial for his actions, but the military dropped the matter after a public outcry.

But Hans, keep citing those who claim that cold drafty rooms, lack of sleep, waterboarding, and the like do not result in information being secured. It was and is. Just consider what you personally know of human nature, and you may reconsider what you have accepted.

Thank god that those in charge of our apparatus are not immobilized by accepting idiocy as Holy Writ.

"President George W. Bush will be ruled by history to be a great man, a visionary with an epic view of events."


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

Hans
Tell us more concerning this language that you're using Hans. Are you speaking in tongues? Is it some form of onomatopoia? I'm certain that what sounds somewhat like braying has some meaning to you. Or is it intended to be a bray? Naw, you don't want to appear to be a jackass. So, Hans, what is it?

"Well Hans, what about the fact that #3 spilled his guts..."

Which "#3"? Seems that there's a new "#3" each week.

"Doesn't that contradict these claims."

No. Let's see, who to believe?

1. Army Col. Stuart Herrington, a military intelligence specialist who conducted interrogations in Vietnam, Panama and Iraq during Desert Storm, and who was sent by the Pentagon in 2003 -- long before Abu Ghraib -- to assess interrogations in Iraq, 2. Senator John McCain, who spent 5 1/2 years as a prisoner of war in the infamous Hanoi Hilton, and 3. Brig. General David R. Irvine?

Or "Johnson"

I choose the former.

"Tell us more concerning this language that you're using Hans."

New to this whole Internet thing?

Hans

Not at all, Hans. I'm not new to it.

And of course you're free to believe models that are contradicted by available information instead accepting self-serving statments of people with undisclosed agendas. Indulge yourself.

And shucks, is a person as knowledgeable as you are dissembling? Are you being disingenuous, when you inquire as to "which number 3" was broken under waterboarding and disclosed helpful information?

Well, I'm glad to be of service and identify the critter for you. It was none other than Khalid Sheikh Mohammed captured in Pakistan on May 4, 2005 together with some other terrorists, and identified at the time as the al-Qaeda Number 3 in the hierarchy.

Anytime Hans.

Have a good day.

"And of course you're free to believe models that are contradicted by available information ..."

Runway... or just magazine?

And what information? Your "opinion"?

Again, I'll take the opinion of experienced (and real) individuals, like Col. Stuart Herrington, Senator McCain and Brig. General David R. Irvine, over a "Johnson" any day.

"...disclosed helpful information?"

What "helpful" information?

"identified at the time as the al-Qaeda Number 3 in the hierarchy."

1. Why are all al-Qaida captives "No. 3"? By Timothy Noah
No matter what the explanation, it's clear that the sweet spot in al-Qaida management is No. 1 and No. 2. After that, job security seems only slightly better than that enjoyed by suicide bombers. My advice: Go with Procter & Gamble instead.
2. " Pakistan captures 'Al Qaeda number 3'," roared last week's headlines.

3. I am not referring merely to the targeted killing of the Hamza Rabia number 3 Al Qaeda terror master.
I thought I would keep it neat and post three (3) responses to the whole number (3) three thing.

Hans

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