This may be slightyl off-topic, but what the hey.

Tom Hartman today went off on a rant about the differences between liberals and libertarians/republicans (lumping the 2 together was the first offense, but we can let it slide for sake of argument)

He began in earnest to discuss how the history of ME societies have failed, How America was founded as a "We" society, and how we can't turn away from our "We" society heritage(another contentious statement, as frivolous as the ones made my right wingers and this country being founded on biblical christian ideologies). He then went off to spout about how The English society that Dicken's wrote about was a "Libertarian" society, and how we would all be Bob Cratchett begging Mr. Scrooge for our health insurance so little timmy can get better.

Now, lets put aside the fact that Tom can be as big a leftist whack job as you can find on the radio, and is closer to being a Communist then a Socialist (or liberal)... And examine the "We" society.

Their is no other society that is so based around the "good of the collective" with such a rich history of "Putting society first" as China. If we're really going to have an open discussion (as Tom claims to want) on what kind of society we should have, lets include China in the "we" category.


Rant Off...

Oh .. and China sucks for putting these people in jail...

Yeah, great analogy GUSTOGUS... Communist China and national health care. By your logic Europe is no different than Communist China. Canada too.
Virtually all of the industrialized world for that matter.
And Tom Hartman a commie....welcome back Sen. McCarthy.

""Oh .. and China sucks for putting these people in jail...""

...and what about the captialist company that helped them do it????

That's the thing, corporate capitalists are working with Chinese communists....we have a new phenomenon...it's called tyranny.

It doesn't matter if tyranny comes from the left or the right it is still tyranny and corporations are not designed to make evaluations in regards to tyranny. They are designed to maximize profits, if a tyrannical communist regime helps them do it then they will work with such a regime.
This is a problem we will see more of.

First Danni, Perhaps I didn't make myself clear, I equated Communism and thus Communist China to the concept of the "We" society with the same logic Hartman equated Dicken's England to the "Me" society. Hartman made the Healthcare leap, not me.

Secondly, I'm not Mccarthy in that I don't neccessarily villify communism, I just think its a bad political system that doesn't reward individual accomplishment.

The reason I equate Hartman more to a communist then a liberal is that he speaks wistfully of society(we the people) controlling the means of production and distributing the wealth created...A strong communist ideology.

My whole point, was that if liberals are goign to latch onto this "We" society concept that Hartman is championing, remember that it is very heart of the chinese society....

Just so we can make fair comparisons :)

Sure, Yahoo sucks for doing it as well, but they just operate within the laws of the country they are working in. To go after them is simply to use them as a scapegoat because there is nothing we can do to China.

What a B.S. lawsuit. The sooner all the idiots realize that the internet is NOT truly anonymous the better. These imbecils knew what kind of country China is and what could happen if they were found out. They either shut their traps, risk imprisonment by opening their mouths or leave the country. They chose the risk and now they are paying the price. There is such a thing as personal responsibility.

How in the world can Yahoo be responsible for Chinese torture? Yahoo does business in China and are subject to that country's laws. Does any DUMB liberal thing that Yahoo or any company would risk ceasing business with one of the largest global markets in the world because of some morons who knowingly took a risk? If a Chinese company conducted business in the U.S., they would have to be subject to our laws as well. Duh!

you come to China, you must obey da Raw! we don't want your Fleedom!

Yahoo has money, so spreading some of it to the lawyers and the arrested may not be that bad ---- at least guy has some income when he gets out.

Yahoo! does not dispute turning over information in response to Chinese government demands, but argues there was little connection between that information and the arrest, prosecution and conviction of the prisoners.

A "Little connection"? ...Is still a connection.

In its court filings, the company said it "deeply sympathises" with the plaintiffs and their families and does not condone the suppression of their liberties. However, it also argues that the company has no control over Chinese laws or their enforcement

This suit has no chance of success.

More's the pity.

Yahoo are right that they have no control over the actions of Chinese government just as they are wrong to help the Chi-Com Big Brother movement suppress calls fer democratic reform in the country.

This suit is about awareness, sparking debate and embarrassing both Yahoo and the Chinese governemnt.

In that respect it should work out but then again it may just further endanger this Democracy luffin' Chinese couple further.

A blog-worthy story thinks Spud.

Be Well.

Why is the this such a big surprise? Even U.S. companies turn over information when a subpoena demands it. Of course it is going to happen in China as well.

Yahoo will NOT lose a cent in this lawsuit. The reality is that the Chinese citizens broke Chinese Law. End of story.

Let's put this another way libs. Suppose the feds were going after a child molestor who killed a child and legally subpeoned Yahoo here in the U.S. If Yahoo turned over the records and to the authorities and the killer was convicted and sentenced to life in prison, does anyone really thing that Yahoo would get successfull sued for turning over the records? No way! Guess what. This is the same situation in China. China had the authority to command Yahoo to release the records because they do business in China. They were NOT the criminals under Chinese law. The Chinese citizens convicted were.

Redwhiteblue,

I'm sure you must have enjoyed Chinese 'flied lice' (fried rice) at some point.

*** *** *USA KISSES CHINESE ASS* *** ***

.....they won the war without firing a shot...smarter than us, those people....

......all readers, please proceed to Wal-Mart and make your weekly donation to the support of the Communist People's Party of China......

......don't argue, just do it.......

UTASTAFF's post is a perfect illustration of how hypocritical our embargo of Cuba is. It also demonstrates how little value some righties place on human rights. Just because we now do business with Communist China (much to America's shame) it does not lessen the evil that exists in their dictatorship. I hope I remember this post UTASTAFF the next time I read one of yours justifying our invasion of Iraq based on an end to "tyranny" as Bush once said, or because we had to depose the evil Saddam. By your post you basicly admit that in your mind the law of any nation should be respected by our nation. That is a change for the worse in American policies where human rights used to have some weight. Yahoo should be ashamed and I hope they suffer a huge publicity disaster over it.