Well he should.
We've been under the DLC thumb for too long. Get rid of them. Most are nuthin' but rethugs in Dem clothing anyway. They've been doing nothing but pulling the party to the right-listen-we ALREADY have a party on the right-we need a modern Left leaning party that can get the message out. Stop the squeemish BS and do the jobs you're paid to do.

Too late. Dean and the Dems could have had a chance until the illegal immigration 'guestworker' open border shamnesty was voted on by 99% of the Senate Democrats. Dean and the Dems should have listened to 75% of Americans from both parties who said they did not want it. Instead the Dems voted overwhelmingly for amnesty, open borders, loss of sovereignty, and an absurd guestworker program that would have shafted millions of American workers by flooding the country with millions of foreign (permanent) guestworkers. America is not going to forget what the Democrats did and especially regular, non-liberal Americans won't forget.

Should have listened, Dean, too late now. No one in their right mind would trust the Democrats to protect our borders or our country's sovereignty ever again -- not to mention social security which Hillary voted to give every illegal immigrant who worked with a stolen or fraudulent social security card. What American would ever trust a party like that?

Fact is the GOP has a well-organized, very well-financed political set-up with long ties to government and the military-industrial complex. They know what's going on in the couintry and they know where the money is.

Howard Dean realizes that the Democrats don't have enough money and enough oligarchs behind them to compete on teh same playing field as the GOP likes to compete on. What do you think?

Fact is the GOP has a well-organized, very well-financed political set-up with long ties to government and the military-industrial complex. They know what's going on in the country and they know where the money is.

Howard Dean realizes that the Democrats don't have enough money and enough oligarchs behind them to compete on teh same playing field as the GOP likes to compete on. What do you think?

Correction (edited):

Surprised no comments here yet ...Look at who funded the Bush-Cheney campaigns:
(

"""Dean and the Dems could have had a chance until the illegal immigration 'guestworker' open border shamnesty was voted on by 99% of the Senate Democrats."""

Yeah, instead those Dems should have voted to buy the necessary cattle cars and start loading up the evil Mexican hordes. Men, women and children, many of whom were born here just like our parents or grandparents should be rounded up and put on the trains, transported accross the border and then dumped in Mexico where they no longer have homes, jobs or any chance of a decent life. Compassion is a virtue America has decided it can no longer afford.

Chris, your hatred towards the illegal aliens is really getting to be disturbing. Your anger is really misplaced. You ought to realize that they are just poor people who want better lives. Perhaps you should direct your anger towards those who benefit by keeping them poor.

Danni, I agree with you and frankly I am stunned at some of the "liberal" posters on the RETORT...

What in hell do they think they are going to do with between 12 Million and 20 million human beings...

And they are all going off half cocked, without knowing the results...

Lets do what is realistic...CLOSE THE BORDERS...and come up with a plan to remedy the situtation without dire HUMAN and FINANCIAL consequences...

danni.....your disregard for laws of our country in the case of the democratic voter base called il-legal aliens is equally disturbing.

and dean pursuing a 50 state strategy......well god golly miss molly....it doesnt matter what state he is in....he is just as big of a liberal blowheard dickheaded loud mouthed LOSER!

Danni,

May I ask where you live? I have to leave soon so I may not be able to get back to you for a couple hours, but I will be back.

and what about the governors of california and texas trying to do something about the borders.....nice....
I am not sure how the cameras will really help but anything can help......I would rather have the guard at the border watching the camera and arresting anyone who crosses.........

Town,
Are you upset about political largess because you're ignorant? Every successful president had fund raising strategies that reward the most effective people.

Political appointments, for Republicans and Dems, have always been a political favor. Your outrage is either fake (because you know this) or you are incredibly stupid about reality. It's like being mad because the sun won't rise in the west.

we need a modern Left leaning party that can get the message out.

Posted by frankf55 at 2006-06-03 10:59 PM | Reply

They do get the word out. That's why you keep losing. Clinton only won because of Ross Perot siphoning away votes for Bush I.

I know you will never admit it Frank, but the MESSAGE is most of the problem.

"Clinton only won because of Ross Perot siphoning away votes for Bush I."


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA

Thanks for tha laugh, Vern.
I needed one.
Got your voodoo stick?

"Yeah, instead those Dems should have voted to buy the necessary cattle cars and start loading up the evil Mexican hordes. Men, women and children, many of whom were born here just like our parents or grandparents should be rounded up and put on the trains..."

The difference being my immigrant ancestors came through Ellis Island legally... not sneaking across the border in flagrant violation of the law. Yes, pack them up and send them back. If they want back in tell them to use the door, not the window.

Someone trys coming through my window in my house they get shot, not just hustled out the door.

Chris, your hatred towards the illegal aliens is really getting to be disturbing. Your anger is really misplaced. You ought to realize that they are just poor people who want better lives. Perhaps you should direct your anger towards those who benefit by keeping them poor.

Posted by danni


And who might that be?

America is not going to forget what the Democrats did and especially regular, non-liberal Americans won't forget.

Hispanic Americans aren't going to forget the way they're being demonized, Chris.

It should be possible to get illegal immigration in check without treating the largely Hispanic and Catholic group like terrorist invaders. Any problems we're having as a result of this immigration fall squarely on the shoulders of their employers. Without the jobs, they wouldn't risk their lives to come here.

California's a Democratic state today because of what Gov. Pete Wilson tried with Proposition 187. I think this is going to be the same thing on a national level.

How about making their country a better place to live and work, then maybe they wont want to leave, into the arms of America.

Dean's policy is a good long run approach. In developing a platform, there is always a possibility for either party to position themselves to get a seat or two in the future. You can just keep throwing money at competitive races if your opponents are working on a 50 state platform and centralizing a strategy against you. In my view the Democratic party needs to change itself to compete with a stronger Republican machine.

The fact that Republicans were able to continue their dominance despite the tremendous mistakes they made should be telling. The fact that Democrats were in effective in winning under those ideal conditions would appear to prove the Dean strategy is best.

In order to win certain races, there maybe the need to take certain positions that are traditional to Republicans.

It should be possible to get illegal immigration in check without treating the largely Hispanic and Catholic group like terrorist invaders.

Then maybe they should stop SNEAKING in like terrorist invaders and follow the legal channels. It just galls me that people come here illegally then demand the same rights that legal citizens have.

"Without the jobs, they wouldn't risk their lives to come here."

There have been laws on the books punishing employers for 20 years, they have just never been enforced. Had they been, we wouldn't have nearly the problem we do now.

All of the hysteria now is a backlash of the Bush Fear Factor, having scared the public near to death about terrorists in an effort to get their votes.

What is needed now is strict enforcement of current law for businesses and immigrants, and a program of patriation for families who have been here for decades.

Sorry to inform you that not all illegal criminals are here working. 30% in our prisons are ILLEGAL ALIENS.Hospitals going broke from being used as primary care clinic for a runny nose.Working under the table and sending millions home to whereever.Sure they want to be legal and cant wait to pay taxes!! Yeah right.How about cracking down on western union and greedy bankers who give a shit about nothing but the bottom line! Then you have clearly racist groups like "La rasse(rassa), wtf does that mean-The Race? What race?All other races are no good?

Chris, your hatred towards the illegal aliens is really getting to be disturbing. Your anger is really misplaced. You ought to realize that they are just poor people who want better lives. Perhaps you should direct your anger towards those who benefit by keeping them poor.

Posted by danni at 2006-06-04 08:06 AM | Reply

Nobody ever said a word about deporting people. That's just the open borders crowd who use it as a scare scam. Get real, Danni. This guestworker/shamnesty bill is not just about Mexican people who do low skill labor. it will give ANY American job away to ANY foreign worker from ANY foreign country who will under bid an American job -- including yours.

As for "they only want to come here for a better life" -- well, who the hell doesn't. ALL OF INDIA, CHINA, RUSSIA AND SOUTH AMERICA want to "come here for a better life." Give me a break. we are a nation of LAWS -- that is exactly what makes us different from the corruption piece of crap country of Mexico who treats its citizens like slaves and has exported 15% of its population because the country is so rotten and corrupt their elites keep the money instead of using it for job production.

As for social security, why the hell should OUR social security system be jeopardized by adding 60 million more low wage people who will take out much more than they ever contribute -- or even more so -- why give it to people who worked here on stolen i.d.? I have a number of Mexican friends, some born here, some legalized and a few I don't even ask. THEY DON'T WANT MORE ILLEGALS POURING IN. It hurts their chances at work because they are always underbid on the jobs.

get real. our hospitals are shutting down and overburdened, our schools are the pits, AMERICAN kids get a crap education out here because we have to spend so much time translating from Spanish.

You want every illegal alien to come here -- fine. put them in YOUR town. this has nothing to do with anti-Mexican. It happens to be the Mexicans because they are 75% of the illegals who are in my state. More and more people are pouring in from Central America. I'll send them all your way along with the illegals we are getting from overseas. If they were a bunch of Russians or Hungarians here illegally by the millions doing the same thing I would say the same thing.

THAT is why the Democrats will not win because they have this "Oh, please come in entire third world and we don't care if you drag us down to your third-world level and live 15 to a one-bedroom apt. with you cause we are too stupid to be a nation of laws and sovereignty so we'll just sink to your living level." I don't care if you call me racist because I know I am not. I am all for LEGAL immigration (a racist would not be) from ANY country -- but play by the rules. I'm not some blind fool to think this country would not sink to third world level if the Democrats got their way and brought into the USA millions and millions of people from third world countries -- only a fool could not see that.

Danni

Bush is totally corrupt and is even worse about enforcing employer sanctions than Clinton who at least obeyed some of the immigration laws until he became a globalist big time with NAFTA -- then all enforcement came to a halt. Neither party will go after the employers who are the ones that should carry 90% of the blame. So what are we suppose to do then? Just go along with the open borders globalists who would love nothing better than to destroy our sovereignty? Sorry, I don't roll over on my country that easily. WE ARE A SOVEREIGN NATION. Open borders is NOT a sovereign nation. I don't give a damn who pours in here illegally -- brown or white or whatever -- illegal is illegal. Unless your one of these "no one is illegal" types as the illegals kept displaying with their signs in the marches and then your hopeless because you no longer belong to a nation of laws and none who feel that way deserve this country.

Actualy Chris a Sovereign Nation has NOTHING to do with the Borders being Open or closed. As much as I emphathise with You. That is not a Condition on if a Country is Sovereign or not.

Larry

"Hispanic Americans aren't going to forget the way they're being demonized, Chris."

Most Hispanic Americans I know are madder than hell about the illegal immigration. I know many right now that want to go to the border to help the Minutemen.

KAREN

Most Hispanic Americans I know are madder than hell about the illegal immigration. I know many right now that want to go to the border to help the Minutemen.

A number of Hispanics are already staunch members of the Minutemen as are a few Blacks and more are joining. There is one thing these people -- Hipanics, Whites and Blacks all have in commom -- they are AMERICANS FIRST. That's the difference with the 'open borders, kumbaya crowd" on this blog. They would rather we lose our nation and what's the most pathetic joke on them of all is that they are playing right into the hands of the globalists like Bush, whom most dislike so much.

Bush the anti-American globalist wants nothing more than to have open borders and flood this nation with millions and millions of third-world, non-educated, low skilled workers who would never complain about their rights (no overtime, no breaks, no lunch hour, nada) -- it's a globalist's dream and these open borders, come one, come all fools are playing right into Bush's underlying agenda to destroy the middle class -- the backbone of this country.

Bush is not an American and neither is the kumbaya crowd/open borders crowd. This is not a race thing, not a party thing, it is an AMERICAN thing. If we lose this fight to protect our borders and give the globlists what they want, this country as we know it -- a sovereign nation -- will be lost forever.

Republicrates rule. No one else can get sufficient advertising funds. We must take back some of the broadcast bandwidth in order to have a Government "of, by, and for the people". Until that happens, people who reject politically popular assumptions and think clearly (Paul Craig Roberts & Noam Chomsky) will continue to be marginalized for the sake of profits for the superrich.

I am not a big Howard Dean fan, but I think his strategy is wise. It will over time help the Democratic Party get in better touch with the voter base and also build committed party workers needed to run campaigns and win.

Democrats need to take General Grant's advice to his generals as he began his campaign towards Richmond in 1864: stop worrying about what the other side is going to do and think about what you are going to do.

I hope the Pubs keep winning. I look forward to the end of civilization.