Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Friday, September 09, 2005

AP - ABC viewers will get "Lost" in translation as part of a plan to make all the network's primetime entertainment available in Spanish starting this season. [Yahoo News]

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rcade

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Admin's note: This weblog entry is an unmoderated discussion.

STAR TREK had Klingon, so I suppose this is no surprise. If the market will support it, why not?

I'm surprised that they weren't already doing this. I thought Spanish closed captioning was pretty much universal now.

Shows what I know.

Claro que si ! Es nessesito por la gente de la mayora silenciosa no quiere estan mayora silenciosa no mas.

DC:

I thought the same!

I don't understand why people who come to this country don't have to learn English!! My grandparents did when they came from Italy. It may have been broken English, but at least they could function.

This is one of my biggest pet peeves...when living in the US, learn to read, speak and understand English!! Instead, we cater to them, spending lots of money which enables them not to have to learn!

Es importante que la televisin refleje la audiencia.

so what is the big deal?hopefully it will help keep the spanish speaking people informed anh help them assimilate.but in the end they must! learn to speak english...for drivers license and citizenship.this is america!

si es importante que la gente aprenda ingles, pero muchas personas no aprendieron la lengua por que no es necesario. hay muchos trabajos en cocinas y otros lugares donde la primera lengua es espanol. Tambien, mira a los angeles, la mayoria de la gente son de sur america! cincuenta y cinco porcenta!

Cundo el tiempo viene cuando nosotros finalmente volvemos a rodar Amrica, la Compaa Americana de Brodcasting har los mil millones de pesos! Nuestras personas ya por costumbre lo vern. Brillante!

Gran para ABC!

Humberto

Brown relieved of Katrina Duties

www.boston.com

I don't understand why people who come to this country don't have to learn English!

Your grandparents didn't have to learn English; they chose to learn it to better themselves and participate more fully in American society.

There are so many Spanish speaking people in the U.S. today that it's no longer fair to presume that this is an English-speaking nation. Americans who learn both languages will be at a competitive advantage in the work force.

Oh no! The Spanish Speakers are coming! The Spanish Speakers are coming!

Who fucking cares? I though every channel had an Espanol translation...

There are so many Spanish speaking people in the U.S. today that it's no longer fair to presume that this is an English-speaking nation.

Posted by rcade at 2005-09-09 01:47 PM | Reply


??????????????? Presume? I never thought I'd see the day that it would be presumptous (sp) to say the USA is an English speaking nation.
Get your guns!

Your ancestors did not sneak into this country illegally like the majority of the hispanics did.

If you have no intentions of being a legal citizen of this country, why would you care?

Es probablemente ms de cincuenta por ciento en Los Angeles. En los condados circundantes, tiene que ser por lo menos sesenta por ciento.

Humberto

INWIS es una ramera racista. Quin habra pensado. Apuesto ella huele como un bizcocho urinario. LOL


Humberto

RCADE:

You're right. My grandparents chose to learn English. I also agree with the rest of your post. However, I get quite upset when it costs us money that ultimately gives them an excuse for not needing to learn English so they CAN participate in our society better.

Case in point...our school districts. With school budgets the way they are today, I find it absolutely ridiculous that our district for example, has to spend part of it's already small budget, on hiring two full time teachers to TRANSLATE for these children!! That's crazy!! Hire an extra English teacher and teach them ENGLISH!! It would save money and help them settle into our society much more productively.

I think we should officially change the name of los angeles to the angels. I shouldn't have to speak spanish when I'm talking about American cities.

INWI: I'm one of the few anglos in my neighborhood, or as one of us put it, with a consonant instead of a vowel at the end of our name. While many of the older folk around here speak English, they still "live" in their native tongue, Italian or Portugese. Even their kids converse with mom or grandma in their native tongue. Many of them watch (loudly) non-English cable stations.
If you had to move to saudi arabia or wherever, you'd still use and watch English whenever possible, even if you became fluent in arabic.
Only you'd have to whisper under that burqua or you'd get hit with a stick.

"Your ancestors did not sneak into this country illegally like the majority of the hispanics did."


It was manifest destiny that allowed us to take tejas, alta california, and the rest of the southwest from los mexicanos to begin with. If they would just create a rule like that in Mexico then it would be legal right?

NG:

I'm not saying they shouldn't speak their own language to each other. I'm talking about the money spent to cater to them instead of learning English so they can function in our society better.

If one of my children was lagging in a subject, let's say math, I would have to pay for a tutor out of my own pocket. Yet, we are spending over 60 grand a year from our school budget to hire translaters so these other children, who won't learn to speak English, can learn other subjects. Where is the sense in this??

Humberto:

I'm not sure what you've said, but I can probably put down money on the fact it wasn't complimentary and you are calling me a racist. You couldn't be farther from the truth!

INWIS-

Spanish is the language of the future here in America. You and your children should learn it or get left behind. You can't fight it.

Humberto

Oh and NG...I would NEVER wear a Burqua and if someone hit me with a stick, I'ld hit them back!!!

Miss Wiss,

I took 4 years of Spanish in High School. I have forgotten much of it, but what I was able to translate confirmed your suspicions regarding Humberto's post.

Typical intellectual midget. This character thinks he's clever (and somehow intellectually superior) because he is insulting you in a language that you are not familiar with.

Humberto:

Every one of my children has taken Spanish in high school. Even my five year old knows how to count to twenty and knows other Spanish words. That is not the point.

Humberto,

You can't fight it.


Sure we can. We can push for an 'official' language be named for the U.S. - English. That would be a good start.

Push for it Jeff. Start in California and see how far you get. And you call me a Typical intellectual midget? Are you bilingual?

Humberto

Jeff:

I've been insulted before!! I'm aware of what it looks like in most languages..lol!

What he doesn't know, is what I have done in Italian to teach him a lesson..lol! He will be cursed all the days of his life...lol! Right OZ baby?!! I have "FAMILY"..lol!!

INWI-

Not all Italians are mobsters. Don't degrade your self.

Le sue persone sono molto a orgoglioso di essere insolentito.

Humberto

Humberto:

Jeff is right!

Let me ask you something:

Are you saying that the majority of this country who doesn't know spanish, should take their time and spend their money to learn it, just to appease a minority, who may or may not be in this country legally, who do speak it??

"A friend, I don't see a 1253 post from you addressed to me. Please clarify."

JeffJ,

My 12:53 post was on
Times Mocks Governator.

A Friend

I agree with you whole heartedly.

Ladylv

Humberto....lol....I'm NOT!

If you think your little spanish posts are upsetting me, you're wrong. I couldn't care less of what you are saying.

What Humberto said the first time

it is a racist ramera. Quin habra thought. Good looking it smells like an urinary sponge cake

Larry

Are you saying that the majority of this country who doesn't know spanish, should take their time and spend their money to learn it, just to appease a minority, who may or may not be in this country legally, who do speak it??

That seems to be the mentality today. I don't understand why these people refuse (?) to learn the language of their adopted country. If they wanted to be here so much they should take the time to learn the language. Our continued catering to them only makes them not need to learn english.

Ladylv

Humberto,

Am I bilingual? No. As I've mentioned, I had 4 years of Spanish in High School, but have gotten away from it.

Yes, I called you an intellectual midget. I did so because you seemed to be getting your rocks off over your personal and somewhat veiled joke (using a foreign language to levy insults). I found the tactic to be extremely annoying and condescending, which is why I lashed out.

Anyways, you really do bring up an excellent point. As a 'melting pot' nation, we really do have a bit of a language problem. Personally, I would very much like to have an 'official' language (English) AND very stongly encourage multi-linguism in our school system.

I think it's clear that we do have a problem, and a growing one at that. What are your thoughts as to the most effective way(s) of dealing with this issue.

Won't be a minority for long. Quit looking at your world today. Look at population trends and you will see the future.

Humberto

A friend,

OK. I'll check it out right now and reply.

Are you saying that the majority of this country who doesn't know spanish, should take their time and spend their money to learn it, just to appease a minority, who may or may not be in this country legally, who do speak it??

Besides your children's education, how much is your life actually affected by the spanish language? I personally think it could be good for the intolerant bigots whose votes got us in the mess we are today to have to interact with another culture now and then. It could make people realise that not everybody is a redneck bible beater.

Humberto:

So you don't refute what I have asked, only telling me to adjust...is that right??

Bullshit! Not happening!

A Friend,

Done.

"Bullshit! Not happening!"

Ohhh, Adesso lei me parla, il bambino. Quest'amo!

Henry:

"Besides your children's education, how much is your life actually affected by the spanish language"

Besides my childrens education???? That's a big enough reason in itself!!

I am on my school district's budgetory commiittee and I can tell you first hand how this effects EVERY student in our district!!

How dare you insinuate that I am a bigot!! My children and I have friends who are spanish, black and asian.

You are jumping to a conclusion you have no knowledge of my life to make. You are also overlooking my reasoning for wanting and expecting these children to learn English.

No, INWI, I am not saying you're a bigot. I did not even mean to imply it, however I can see what you mean upon re-reading my post. I was referring to actual intolerant bigots who have had no cultural interaction except with other intolerant bigots.

So, pardon my ignorance on the subject, but what is the problem? School districts have to provide the funding to educate students who don't speack English? And this takes away from the funding for other aspects of a child's education? It would seem to me that we have no realistic choice but to hire Spanish speaking teachers for Spanish speaking kids. HIspanic kids need to have an education as well because they are a part of our society, legal or not.

Henry Parsons:

Another comment presented by the Blame America & Hate America First crowd.
You are a full fledged member of La Raza I bet.

Every country belonged to someone else first.
And haven't you heard Vicente Fox has advocated the illegal invasion of our country?


Henry:

Thank you for clarifying because I thought I was going to lose my mind thinking you thought I was a bigot!

"It would seem to me that we have no realistic choice but to hire Spanish speaking teachers for Spanish speaking kids."

A realistic choice would have been to hire one additional English teacher and/or require tutoring after school, etc., for these student to learn English, rather that hiring full time translators, which, only prolongs the problem these children will face later, which is trying to fit into an English speaking society.

Humberto

When your people take over this country and I refuse to learn Spanish, will your government cater to me and put things in English?

What if I whine and call you racists?

No dice, huh?

And that is about what I thought.

Rabble,

That was a classic 'turnaround'. I never thought of it that way.

Classic! Certainly the most thought-provoking post of the day IMO.

In English:
INWIS is a racist ramera. Quin habra thought. Good looking it smells like an urinary sponge cake.


Babel Fish Translation

In English: From Italian by Humberto
Its persons are a lot to proud of being made insolent


I don't think Humberto is as multi-lingual as he thinks. Anyone can type stuff into Babel Fish and get a textual translation. I have done it many times when I need to converse with some of my Hispanic Tennants.

Personally I love the Hispanic culture. But why is it that Mexico is SOOO fucked up? Corruption and timidity in my opinion. The politicos and police are all corupt and the citizens are iether afraid or are mafiosos.

There doesn't seem to be any brave, honest people in Mexico.

I have a question for you Homberto. Why is it that when hard working Mexicans come to America, their children usually end up as gang-bangers?

Here it is in spanish so you can understand: Por qu es ese cuando el mexicano de trabajo duro viene a Amrica, sus nios termina generalmente para arriba como cuadrilla-gang-bangers? .

MARTY-

I dunno, for fun and profit?

RABBLEROUSER-

Nah, we'd take you out back and shoot you after emptying your wallet. Ever been to Mexico?

Humberto

But Henry, when does it end? How many languages are spoken across the entire Earth? If some people from each location move to America, do we need to hire translators for each and every language in the world?

What I am concerned with is government interactions. The Government should not support interactions in anything but English. If your school district wants to hire Translators or English teachers, that is their decision, but the US Govt. should be speaking English in its courts and on its publications. If you want a Spanish or Portugese translation, then type it into Babel Fish on the INternet at home or a Library so you can understand.

Rabble, I have heard Fox said that. Unfortunatly we are too wrapped up in other things now to secure the southern border. As for hating America, the only thing I hate is the hate of other people. A little tolerance can go a long way. And as far as blaming America, I don't recall blaming anyone for anything.

INWI, if they really speak no English, ESL after school is not going to teach them math. It takes a long time to acheive a level of fluency where other subjects can be learned in a non-native language. Again, the only way I see that they can be kept on pace in their education is using translators until they reach a certain level of fluency. This will not change until the influx of spanish speakers stops. This influx will not stop until the southern border is closed. And closing the southern border is pretty low on the to do list of the people in power right now.

"If some people from each location move to America, do we need to hire translators for each and every language in the world?"

No, but when we have such a huge influx of people that all speak a common language it is a very different scenario. And seeing as how this is the case, I think we should stick to it. As I said before, until we end the enormous migration of spanish speakers into los estados unidos this will continue to be a problem. So I think securing our southern border should be our priority before we even begin this discussion. Then when we can control immigration we can discuss how to assimilate everyone into our culture. And your second paragraph makes sense to me.

Gotta run...

Personally I love the Hispanic culture. But why is it that Mexico is SOOO fucked up? Corruption and timidity in my opinion. The politicos and police are all corupt and the citizens are iether afraid or are mafiosos.

There doesn't seem to be any brave, honest people in Mexico.

Marty - You have proven yourself to be a might douchebag. It is apparent to me that you have never been to Mexico (other than perhaps crossing the border to buy your drugs). Maybe you should try to get out and see more of the world outside of your parents basement.

Y si no entiendes mi ingles, te puedes comer mucho fundio.

Almost forgot...

Pinche pendejo!

HENRY,

You brought up a fine point about tightening the borders. It seems that neither party cares about this issue.

Any suggestions?

P.S. Your previous post regarding Manifest Destiny seemed to be aimed at "blaming" us for how we acquired formerly Mexican lands.
If that was not your intention, I apologize for the remark.

Aprendar Engles? Por que! No es neccessita no mas!

Viva la idioma nacional! Por Vida!


Dontardo? whore pubic hair? Chinga!

If we keep accomodating them, they will keep coming - in greater numbers. English immersion is the only way to go. Speak english or sink to the bottom. Tolerance has gotten us into the mess we are in- it will take big dose of intolerance to get us out. We cannot tolerate immigrants turning this country in to the hell hole that they left.

Humberto, while you are confident that english only laws cannot pass, Californians have consistently voted AGAINST government assitance for illegal aliens - Prop 187, english for the childeren initiative, etc. I think a Federal english only law would be widely supported - that way we would not have to worry about the empty headed liberal vote in this once great state.

CA Conservative

I love it ABC returns what the treaty of Hidalgo took away. The righty tighty's wanted capitalism here it is. Mexicans know how to deal with capitalism.

Speak english or sink to the bottom.

ha ha ha ha ha ha BTDT... those days are gone. Preguntarse Univision.

MARTY:

From his previous posts, here is HUMBERTO'S real loyaty - the AZTLAN website. Scroll down on the left hand side and check out the picture disgracing our USMC when they raided the flag at Iwo Jima. Aztlan's website shows a group of Mexicans in somberos reenacting the SAME thing -- signifying their stupid wish to take over America's southwest with the MEXICAN flag flying. It made me SICK to see it and those mother-fu_kers dare to use a monumental moment of WWII with our UNITED STATES MARINES CORP and deface it. AZTLAN's website then DARES to compare the same taking of Iwo Jima as to their Mexicans taking over OUR country.

"The "AZTLAN movement" lovers, like Humberto, ARE TRAITORS TO THE UNITED STATES. The picture I speak of is on the left hand side. But the Aztlan traitors HATE whites, they HATE Americans, they identify closely with the Palestians because they feel the USA southwest belongs to them. They are too cowardly to change the corruption and crap in their OWN country so they want to turn our southwest into the same corrupt mess as Mexico.

By the way, I could care less about simulcasts in Spanish. Just don't mess with my ENGLISH channels or knock any of them off and replace them with Spanish. We already have that out here in Mexifornia. Plus, sometimes I watch and learn different words in Spanish which I like to do.)0

Here ya go, Marty. Check out the individual boxes and stories on ATLZAN.net and keep on reading. They HATE Whites, they HATE Americans of European background. They HATE ALOT. Check out Humberto's "best buddies" and all their beliefs (and my apologies to every U.S. MARINE who died in Iwo Jima for them daring to use the image of them putting up the flag being the same as the Mexicans taking over our country):

TRAITOROUS AZTLAN "HATE AMERICA" WEBSITE

And, NO, I do not dislike Mexican people. I dislike people like Humberto who has made clear he loves these Aztlan thugs who want to take over MY country for themselves and who are racist pigs. Strong language but until you have seen and heard this group in action - and I have - you have no idea how traitorous and dangerous these "Aztlan lovers" are.

Do you know what they call a person who speaks three languages?

Tri-lingual.

Do you know what they call a person who speaks two languages?

Bi-lingual.

Do you know what they call a person who speaks one language?

an American



Domo arigato gazaimas

Personally I love the Hispanic culture. But why is it that Mexico is SOOO fucked up? Corruption and timidity in my opinion. The politicos and police are all corupt and the citizens are iether afraid or are mafiosos.

That one's easy to answer:

laisse-faire economics.

ohio gazaimas back atcha

donde esta el benjo?

When these threads and posts on this website start going too bilingual, CalifChris is outta here for good. I'll find an AMERICAN English-speaking blog instead. Adios.

HUMBERTO:

I happen to agree with a couple of things Aztlan says -- such as America should not go to war with other other countries to take their resources (Iraq), nor go in and privatize everything for the benefit of the multinationals and to the detriment of the poor of those countries, or Aztlan's view that often it is American kids from lower economic regions and/or minorities who are called into this illegal war in Iraq by Bush.

BUT when Aztlan's lazy thugs calls for the taking over of MY USA, and Aztlan does, for the benefit of giving my country to a FOREIGN country like Mexico -- then you have drawn the lines in the sand. You have gotten on this website before promoting Aztlan and their ideology. I will FIGHT any way I can and no other country is going to take it over. I have family members I can trace directly back to the Revolutionary War who DIED to protect America and America is not going to have a huge chunk of it given to Mexico (although George W. Bush, his old man, and the other globalists would love it that way). Just setting you straight were my views are.

"were" should be "what" in the last sentence above.

VIVA AZTLAN!

Gracias Chris! Your postings are great education for us all!

Humberto

De nada, Humberto.

I believe that George Bush's policies will return America back to what it once was...a vast wasteland, covered in ice.

Humberto

My first post - I'm so excited!

Zatoichi - Bullseye with the language joke!

CA Conservative - "sink to the bottom"- Have you ever heard of the No Child Left Behind Act? True, although wretched in its application (a crappy, underfunded scheme that seeks to destroy public schooling), its ostensible purpose (that we as a nation should do everything that we can to maximize acheivement in our children) is dead on. (Just to be clear; I love the notion, hate the M.O.)

INWI - "I am on my school district's budgetory commiittee and I can tell you first hand how this effects EVERY student in our district!!" Henry Parsons is right, one English teacher to teach them English at the cost of everything else is not any where near sufficient for educating a child. I understand that you think that it is expensive to have the ESL teachers, but think about the overall cost for society in increasing the amount of undereducated (uneducated?) citizens churned out by schools? The research behind this suggests that every year a child falls behind in other subjects (it does take a while to master English), increases the risk of them dropping out before they graduate. Talk about a double whammy --> learning less + staying in school shorter. Your wallet may be in the right place, but what about your heart and mind.

It seems so funny to me that people who hate the idea of having to learn another language are so quick to criticize people to learn another one. It's like yelling at someone to be quiet, or hitting someone for hitting someone. Jokers...

HUMBERTO

Mexico once ruled.

Like Menudo once rocked.

Get over youselves.

Los Lobos is better than Menudo, except for hangovers. Los Lonely Boys rock.

Can't get over myself, I'm too suave. Damn good looking.

Humberto

GABELN:

Welcome with your first post.

I do not "hate" the idea of having to learn another language. I took Spanish 101 in college for a year. I didn't need it much because I lived in an America where English was the main language and we didn't have traitorous globalists as Presidents as we do now with Bush the idiot.

I listened to Spanish news throughout the entire beginning of the Iraq war with a Spanish dictionary in my hands. Why? So I could stop the tape and look up word I didn't know. Hardly someone "afraid" of learning a new language. Why bother even doing that? Because I would get better info truth-wise, as to what was really happening in the war -- not "sanitized" like Bush wanted.

I think everyone is enhanced knowing languages from different countries. What is wrong here is the Aztlan "ATTITUDE" - this was "OUR" country, and "WE" are going to take it back, and "WE" are going to all speak ONLY Spanish. That is the crap Aztlan hands out.

As for education, if the Mexicans here stayed IN SCHOOL and bothered to graduate from high school - which a good majority here in Los Angeles do NOT, they would be alot better prepared to get a better job, and get out of the poverty stranglehold, rather than follow the Aztlan garbage and think they are going to have all of us speaking Spanish and get what they want -- uneducated or not.

I think Spanish is a beautiful language and sprinkle some of my sentences with Spanish once in awhile because "it just fits" and I like saying it. It's the "Aztlan ATTITUDE" that offends. If Mexico is so fu-king great, why isn't everybody heading south? If they educated themselves, in Mexico, or even the illegal aliens here who can do it at TAXPAYERS EXPENSE, then the Mexican people can fix their own government instead of trying to come up here and say they are going to take over and make the southwest another corrupt piece of crap like the country they just left.

By the way, most of the Mexicans I know do TRY to learn English. It's the racist Aztlan-types that try to discourage the Mexican people from learning anything BUT Spanish. They, like the Mexican government, would LOVE to see their own people held down. No one is more racist than the lighter-skinned officials -- like Vincente Fox -- who oppress and hold down their own darker skinned people. Fox hates the indigenous Indian people of Mexico, thinks he and others "like him" are better, and he doesn't want to help them, he just wants to get them out of Mexico. He and those of his ilk are the biggest racists of all.

Gabelin:

While I do not have a thorough knowledge of "no child left behind", I am not aware of any part of it that addresses catering to the needs of people who will not learn the native language of the country they are in.

I am all for the concept of "no child left behind" - the concept, not the legislation. We have had this argument here in CA when the "english for the children" initiative was passed. According to the statistics released during that campaign, children learned english better and faster when they had no other choice in the classroom. Obviously, this would still require special accomodations, but at lease it achieves the goal of getting those students to assimilate by learning english.

If we continue to coddle them in their own language, there is much less incentive to learn english.

CA Conservative

"Your grandparents didn't have to learn English; they chose to learn it to better themselves and participate more fully in American society.

There are so many Spanish speaking people in the U.S. today that it's no longer fair to presume that this is an English-speaking nation. Americans who learn both languages will be at a competitive advantage in the work force."

Rcade, you're a complete tool if you believe that. Last I checked, our grandparents HAD to learn english and were BETTER off for it.

Now fast forward to today where you have a larger spanish speaking audience. First off, how much influence does the influx of millions of illegal aliens (most of whom are from spanish-speaking countries) to this country affect the population of spanish speakers? That being stipulated, if you are someone coming to this country, assume that you have the choice to learn only one of two languages and you cannot learn the other... what are the odds that someone who speaks only spanish will succeed when compared to someone who speaks only english?

That's why people need to learn english. Nobody is asking that they give up their identity, but rather to avoid having their identities forced upon us.

Gabeln:

You're first post...congratulations!

First of all, let me ask if you have been doing a lot of reading of these posts prior to posting. If you have, you wouldn't have asked if my heart and mind were in the right place.

Children, all children are very important to me. I have a large family and an enormous extended family, meaning my community.

Let me be clear:

I do not object to children who do not speak English from attending school. It is not my intention that they fall behind. My objection is in the fact, that because we have to pay for two full time translators for these children because the do not speak English, we have had to make other cuts in teaching staff which effects all the other students. One was a business and marketing teacher, the other was in the arts.

My suggestion may not have been clear. I am not saying we shouldn't have these translators ....my suggestions is that in addition to these translators, these children should be staying after school, for tutoring in learning the English language, therefore eliminating the need for translators down the road, which, will kick back money to the district to be used for ALL students.

If we continue to supply translators for them year after year, without them taking the interest in learning English, I fail to see how this helps them in the long run. What are they to do after completing high school? They haven't learn to speak the language that they will need to learn to further their education...or are we expected to continue footing the bill because of their reluctance to learn English...because we have made it convinient for them not to! How will they get a decent job, if unable to speak English? Do you see what I'm trying to say? It will not benefit them later, to continue to coddle them year after year. I think my concern for these children and their future shows my mind and heart are in the right place.

"If we continue to coddle them in their own language, there is much less incentive to learn english"

This is just more of that ethnocentric, arrogant attitude that causes people around the world to consider Americans a bunch of ignorant hicks. In literate countries it is common for people to know 2 or more languages, whether they need to or not.

Right, thats the reason there are language classes in our schools. Americans are arrogant. INWI for example.

Humberto

Visitor:

"In literate countries it is common for people to know 2 or more languages, whether they need to or not."

Then why do you expect these children NOT to have to learn English???? Or is it just Americans that need to learn two languages??? If so, I would have to call you a hypocrite!

Humberto:

Call it arrogance if you wish, I call it concern for them in the future!!

You people are cracking me up!! How involved are you in your city's school district to know of the problems that lie within????

We can push for an 'official' language be named for the U.S. - English. That would be a good start.

What does that gain us? Being a monolingual nation puts the U.S. at disadvantage.

For as long as the Western Hemisphere is viewed as "our" hemisphere, the U.S. has significant strategic and economic motivation to be closely allied to Latin and South America. We have as much to gain by becoming a multilingual people as immigrants have learning English.

I didn't learn Spanish as a child growing up in Texas, when language skills are most easily acquired. I wish that I had.

INWI

The reason our public schools lag behind the rest of the civilized world is because of narrow minded people like you! Wake up!

Humberto

I am sorry but when You come to this country You had best Learn and understand English. You except to benefit by Our Country Learn English. I would say Learn how to spell it too But even I can not say that without being a Hypocrite



Larry

Humberto:

LOL...I would love the people in my community to read what you have just written about me...they would laugh!!

It's begining to look like you are just anti-American. You want to force yourself on us and expect us to conform to your lifestyle and language...in our country, at our expense.

Why don't you answer the question I asked??? How involved are you in your community school district to judge anything or anybody???? I'll be waiting for your answer!!

LOL..Humberto,

While going back over all your posts on this thread, I noticed you have nothing of substance to contribute...only insults!

Wow...impressive!

Just a perspective north of the border.

Canada has been officially bilingual from the beginning. Never looked back. Never suffered for it. Some uninformed but for the larger part of the citizenry is a badge of pride to be both English and French speaking. Lots of people enroll their kids in French immersion schools and have them take all the lessons in a second language.

I once read that if you can speak English and French you're able to converse with a large majority of the planet. You can bet those Spanish folks that come have a burning desire to know English. That makes them far more competitive than someone with only one language to depend on.

We live in an international community. The 19th century is long behind us now.

Regards,
etc.

"Or is it just Americans that need to learn two languages??? If so, I would have to call you a hypocrite!"

No, Inwi, other people learn two or more languages in other countries and don't think twice about it. It's Americans that demand that the rest of the world learn English.

Perfect Storm:

I was just curious - in Canada what percentage of all the people are bilingual in both English and French? Do you know? And if one language is spoken more, is it English? I know on my trip to British Columbia driving around in an RV, I picked up some tv dinners and half of the directions were in French and the other half in English. It was new to me then and I got a kick out of that. Now everything here in America is pretty much English/Spanish but back in the mid-1980's seeing the bilingual instructions pretty much for the first time while in Canada was a new experience.

I think learning a secondary language in the schools in America - AFTER English being the primary language, should be mandatory. I had to take foreign languages all thru high school and college. Didn't do the greatest in French class, though.

If I could learn spanish everybody should be able to. In california you need it almost everywhere.

jackass

Jackass:

I have no problems with learning Spanish and would like to be able to speak a second language fluently. The resentment comes in when the Aztlan crowd says they can come here and don't have to, or ever want to, learn English. There's a difference. Exceptions should be made for the elderly and those who would find it harder to pick up a new language - and English is harder to learn. But for the young, and the not quite so young, when you come to the USA learn, or at least TRY to learn, the official language of this country - English.

Visitor:

I responded once to you regarding this, but don't know where it went so I'll answer again:

"It's Americans that demand that the rest of the world learn English."

You are painting with a broad brush here. Please show me where I have ever demanded the "world" to learn English!! What I have actually said was, If one chooses to live here, they need to learn English for their own benefit. Specifically school age children.

Again I will ask you, if it is no problem for you to see other countries learning more than one language, not thinking twice about it, why do you ride my ass when I expect children who live in this country, to learn English??? Seems to me that you are holding me to a different set of standards that you find acceptable elsewhere!!

Everyone here seems to be missing the point. The POINT is that English is the international language. You will find that the majority of people in the world have learned at school and can speak some English, all of the European countries plus Japan, China, Russia, even African countries, most people can speak a few if not many English words enough to converse with others. In fact when I was living in Hong Kong and the Gherkas and Hong Kong chinese had to speak to one another they would use English (which was incredible to watch to be honest). Why is it that every other nationality that comes to this (or any other country to be honest) learns to speak the native tongue, Italians, russians, Poles, Pakistanis, chinese, japanese, every single one of them learn the language so that they can be productive members of society. YET alot of the spanish speaking people simply refuse to learn the language. And in a purely practical sense it just clogs up life. How many productive working hours are lost per year because people have to listen to "to hear this message in Spanish press 2" okay so it takes two seconds, but multiply that two seconds by the millions of people who encounter it every single day... even in our local court system we are held up every day by a defendant in front of the judge who doesn't speak English, Judge sends for one of the Bailiffs who speaks spanish (providing he is on duty), other than that, it is a quick scramble round the courthouse to find a translator. It wastes an inordinate amount of time and tax payers dollars to accommodate these people who refuse to assimilate to the country they have chosen to call home, dammnit if they are going to break our laws then they should bloody well learn the language so they can defend themselves in court. I am English and I had to learn the language when I got here... I say tom ah to you say tom ay to

VISITOR 9:09 p.m.

Excellent post!

Hey guys,
CA Conservative: the No Child Left Behind Act (NCLB) does not say anything about a specific language. It, simply put, puts forth the assumption that all children have the ability to succeed and that we, as a society, are doing them a disservice if we do not recognize this and make that assupmtion true. And then it plays the blame game at who is culpable. If we ennact a policy that, even if it seems to have the best of intentions, results in the de facto failings and/or dropping out of American (yes, they are American) kids, we have failed.

Researchers in education have endlessly studied new techniques to teach children better. Nowadays, educator's adapt their methods to best teach for a given student. And then teach them in multiple ways for good measure. My teachers sat us in rows silently, talked endlessly, and used rote memorization to "teach" us. I learned very little in school, and I know there are more just like me. I know it seems as if I have rambled, but... my point is, teachers' teaching is aimed at getting the student to learn in the means that best suits the student. Learning about something (math, science, social studies) should be put in the most potent means. The means would most certainly not be in a language that has not been mastered.

If a school district's mission is to teach the district's children using the best means, wouldn't that be in a language that they understand?

INWI: I am very involved in my cities school district, as an employee and as a vocal participant in our PTG (parent teacher group). I also do quite a bit of volunteer work at the local Elementary School, as well as other places. I believe, however, that because everybody has a vested interest in this country having an educated populace (educated societies tend to generate more productivity and less violent crimes) that my take on this carries no more weight than anyone else. Besides we all pay property taxes. Anyway, I understand where you are coming from. I submit this; take a broader look at your problem. Your school does not get enough funding. Wouldn't it be nice to have both sets of teachers? Why not complain about the way this country funds education? There are soo many things wrong with our government's attitude towards public schools. I am not suggesting to throw money at this problem; the problem is the schools do not get enough money to carry out their goals. Where does it end?

BTW the "melting pot" analogy rightfully was killed years ago. Try "salad bowl".

BTW part II: This doesn't just happen with Spanish.

Thanks for listening to my rant...

Gabeln:

I am soooo well aware of the lack of funding for school districts and couldn't agree more!

Wouldn't it be nice to have both sets of teachers??? I still have to say that, although the need for translators is there now, if we just put more emphasis on the importance of teaching them English, it would benefit them in the long run!!

Yes INWI,

But we would lose so many in the short run. And it is not okay to lose one if we could have prevented it.

Gabeln:

How? If we give them the translators they need now, teaching them English along with it...how do we lose any???

INWI,

Sorry, I misunderstood you. I thought that you meant if we put more of an emphasis on teaching English in place of using translators, not at the same time.

My bad.

I need to think about this more and read up on this more. I'll be back...

Gabeln:

I would like to see both.... translators only temporary though because of teaching English in the process would eventually eliminate the need for them.

That's fine Gabeln...I'll check back later!

This is America, we speak English

If you want Spanish, let in one of those craphole Spanish countries like Mexico, Colombia, Peru etc etc etc.

This country must make a stand for our language.

How many on this post have ever received an incorrect order from Micky-D's because the person taking the order no-speaky-good-english. And then when you try to get the order corrected, you still have the no-speaky-good-english bullshit. Then you have to wait until the english speaking white dude come over and get things right.

I spoke zero english when I arrived in the US. I learned it so I could COMMUNICATE with others. I wanted to communicate with others. LEARN TO SPEAK ENGLISH PEDRO!

"I spoke zero english when I arrived in the US. I learned it so I could COMMUNICATE with others. I wanted to communicate with others."

Good for you and thanks for helping me make my point!

How can one expect to be functioning in a society that one can not speak the language of??

Rabble,

I have two ideas, both of which would require a change in mentality of a large portion of the american population. 1st, we could end the war on drugs as we know it now and divert the resources to securing the southern border. Although the main reason to do this would be to control immigration, it would also decrease the drug trade through that border. Sounds like a win-win scenario to me. This is what I would like to see done, but as you said, neither party seems to care. The other option is to decrease our imperialistic tendencies and re-allocate resources in Iraq as well as other foreign countries to the southern border. This has too many problems to ever realistically come to pass.

In regards to the manifest destiny comment, I was just trying to show that population/territory can and will ebb and flow over time. It was populated by Mexicans, we took it from them, and now they are taking it back without even using arms or force. Only the apathy of our gov't is allowing this.

This makes my blood boil.........

The economy of this country is controlled with the English language. If any immigrant is going to make it -- in this country of America -- they must learn to use the English language.

Now -- having said that -- not only is it important here in the United States of America to speak English -- BUT -- most European countries are fluent in English as well. In France -- of course -- they will only use English as a last resort. I love catching them in a spirited exchange with their counterparts -- not knowing that I'm fluent in French -- and then responding to their derogatory comments about me in flawless French. It's delicious.......

Anyone who wants to be an American and succeed -- must speak English. If you don't -- you are setting yourself up for a life of mediocre earning capability.

Visitor 9:09.........

Your post was one of finest I've ever read. I completely agree.

When my fishermen in Canada -- who are Portuguese -- would not learn English -- I had to learn Portuguese. It was a matter of good business so I could control my product, i.e. profitability.

Fortunately I pick up languages quickly -- but -- I was always concerned as to why they wouldn't participate in the Canadian economy completely. NOW -- the most wonderful aspect of this story is that their children spoke English and French (from school) and Portuguese at home. Even the little ones -- three and four -- would turn their language on a dime. They would be speaking with me in English or French and then turn to their grandmother and speak perfect Portuguese. It was delightful to watch......

Okay -- let me check my English grammar and spelling -- the Retort blog word police is on duty this morning.

"the Retort blog word police is on duty this morning."

Are on duty. Police are on duty. ;^O

But I loved hearing about the tri-lingual kids. That's the way that works.

Well Zat -- that concludes my day of fun at this blog. I think I need some ZZZZZZZs.

Since this is my "no drive" day to conserve gas. I'll catch up on some ZZZZZs and then work in my garden.

Thanks for your insights.......

Hope to engage in some meaningful (grammatically correct) repartee at some later date.

A majority of Hispanics came here illegally? Check your facts rabble.

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