The last couple of hundred-million dollar payoffs were just accepted. The only way he could get his own party members to vote for this shitpile.

I see the right is still on its quest to win the hearts and minds of the heartless and mindless.

#2 | Posted by cookfish at 2010-03-21 11:25 AM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

*shaking head*

Is that the best you've got?

Just wait until they try to enforce this crap.

We ain't seen nothing yet.

Emergency overnight demoRat BJs. Good job.

If so, then the Dems will own it. Hallelujah.

Time for me to start finding new shelters for my income and investments that can't be touched.

Well, actually, put finger on button of existing plans. Sort of like the Doomsday Clock, but a fiscal version.

Just wait until they try to enforce this crap.

We ain't seen nothing yet.

#6 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:31 AM | Reply | Flag:"keep your government hands off my medicare"

"But united Republicans fight on, refusing to concede defeat, claiming ‘the American people don't want this to pass'"

If the majority of the American people did not want this to pass they wouldn't have voted for the presidential candidate who said that he was going to do it. They'd have voted for Granddad and Barbie instead.

#9 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2010-03-21 11:32 AM | Reply | Flag:

Dumbass, I've got a long way to go before medicare.

Do you always jump to conclusions in such fashion?

I'll give you the same opportunity I gave Andy the other day.

Show me how solvency can be brought to Medicare/Medicaid on 2.9 percent of income.

Just the math, dumbass. Just the math.

Millions of us are waiting.

Give it your best shot.

The #2 comment is totally uncalled for. Now the right has a new reason to become bigots and hate mongers. They will work hard to divide the nation even more as the country finally starts getting run by the people for the people. Way to go jackass.

This is perhaps the greatest single accomplishment in the last 30 years and the right is still talking about "niggers and faggots" being behind it all. Hey toilet mouth, we are not all N's and F's.

Dem Leader: 'We Have the Votes'

Good! Over the next 7 months the American public will find out the GOP have done an Iraq War 'terrorist hugger', 'WMD' snow job on America.

Just wait until they try to enforce this crap.

We ain't seen nothing yet.

#6 | Posted by porkbrains in milk gravy

There was similar wailing and gnashing of teeth over civil rights, social security, medicare, etc., etc....

No way the Democrats cut Medicare, as they've promised to. This will blow a hole in the budget so sky-high that any enforcement of this boondoggle will be the end of us. The tax increases will go in, the spending cuts will not, and Obama's already monstrous deficits will become lethal.

Oh well. We have only liberals to blame.

How's that Republican party working for ya now?

Those idiots have been bad mouthing this bill from the start, and they couldn't even stop it.

If Bush hadn't fucked up so bad, you boys might still be in power, but now the republican party is just flacid.

Meanwhile, the Democrats have passed a major heathcare reform bill.

Doesn't seem like you get anything from the republican party, maybe it's time to reconsider your poor choices.

Millions of us are waiting.

Give it your best shot.

#11 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:37 AM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

teabagger, nothing is free. This bill will cost the average american some green in his/her tax bill..

That being said, at least the average american won't be hijacked anymore by some "dumbass" on the 13th floor of a highrise building making decisions about their "pre-existing condition(s)

You're nothing more than a blowhard hallicheney teabagger.

There was similar wailing and gnashing of teeth over civil rights, social security, medicare, etc., etc....

#14 | Posted by Dave at 2010-03-21 11:41 AM | Reply | Flag:

It's hard to explain that to a pimple faced brat who gets their talking points from Flush Rimjob

Same playbook on HCR as Iraq; mischaracterizations, untruths, inflammatory rhetoric, and attempts to paint the opposition as un-American. 'Totalitarian' and 'Socialist' (read Communist) instead of 'terrorist appeasers' or 'defeatists' or other catch phrases to paint anyone in opposition as 'un-American'.

Glenn Beck even used the Soviet hammer and sickle while he spoke the word 'socialist' to infer Democrats are "Marxist" and 'Communist'.

I thought Joe McCarthy was thoroughly discredited. Nice try GOP... again.

"Oh well. We have only liberals to blame."

That's all you've ever had, bonehead.

My new budget....

Income taxes 26 percent
Property taxes 8 percent
Sales taxes 7.5 percent
State income taxes 5 percent
Operating licenses 4 percent
Social Security and medicare 15.35 percent

Fucking retards.

I quit.

You're nothing more than a blowhard hallicheney teabagger.

#17 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2010-03-21 11:42 AM | Reply | Flag:

We get it. You don't have a clue.

#21 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:46 AM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

Hey "retard" dont you know that sales tax is already over 9% in some states?

didn't think so.

didn't think so.

#23 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2010-03-21 11:49 AM | Reply | Flag:

That's why I choose not to live in those states.

We get it. You don't have a clue.

We get it. You don't have a clue.

#22 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:48 AM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

On the contrary, I do get it. You've no problem with out of control government spending until someone wants to overhaul healthcare.

Chopper, get a life and quit kneeling to the alter of right wing radio...

There was similar wailing and gnashing of teeth over civil rights, social security, medicare, etc., etc....

#14 | Posted by Dave at 2010-03-21 11:41 AM | Reply | Flag:

The exact same things that can't be funded today.

You people are amazing.

Beneath stupid, even.

There was similar wailing and gnashing of teeth over civil rights, social security, medicare, etc., etc....
#14 | POSTED BY DAVE

It took a while, but the latter two are insolvent. Expanding the Ponzi Scheme pool will buy a few more years.

None of you can do math?

Show me how solvency can be brought to Medicare/Medicaid on 2.9 percent of income.

Just the math, dumbass. Just the math.

Millions of us are waiting.

Give it your best shot.

#11 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:37 AM | Reply | Flag:

Apparenlty no Dem wants to be the 216th vote. Why not? If the bill is so wonderfull that the American people will like it once it passes, why don't they want to be THE deciding vote and campaign on that?

They don't believe their own talking points. There is nothing wrong with talking points, but it would be nice if people actually believed them, but Dems know this is a crap bill.

None of you can do math?

Show me how solvency can be brought to Medicare/Medicaid on 2.9 percent of income.

Just the math, dumbass. Just the math.

Millions of us are waiting.

Give it your best shot.

#11 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:37 AM | Reply | Flag:

#29 | Posted by porkchop at 2010-03-21 11:57 AM

We raise taxes on the wealthy, we don't cut em...

There, that was easy.

No wonder so many are in foreclosure.

Can't even function at 6th grade math level.

Come on, someone put up the math to make medicare and medicaid solvent.

Just the math dumbasses.

That's what millions of us have been waiting to see.

I have an idea, isn't Pelosi from a safe ubber Liberal district? Why doesn't she cast the last and deciding vote? Her district will love her. Why do they need 217 votes? Just have Pelosi do the honors.

"Were gonna have" Rep Hoyer on Meet The Press This AM.

Not we do have! Big difference!

Which one is lying Hoyer or Larson?

Which one has the motive to lie? Hoyer or Larson

Apparenlty no Dem wants to be the 216th vote. Why not? If the bill is so wonderfull that the American people will like it once it passes, why don't they want to be THE deciding vote and campaign on that?

They don't believe their own talking points. There is nothing wrong with talking points, but it would be nice if people actually believed them, but Dems know this is a crap bill.

#30 | Posted by mitch at 2010-03-21 11:58 AM

Hey! I heard the same thing on Fox News Sunday.

It'll be fun to watch the vote this afternoon, and see those idiots at Fox having conniption fits.

I don't plan on watching the vote. It's bad enought we're going to have to deal with the reality of the bill being enacted. No sense in torturing oneself by watching the vote. You're gointg to watch Fox News Roy? That's not a real news org, you know? At least that is what Obama said, and yet he gave them an interview.

The "passage" (read purchase) of this bill shows just really how low our politicians have come. The lies and half truths in the finance of it would be a joke if it were not so serious.

All of you young that are for it I hope when you get into your 60's and are denied medical care you are happy with you single payer and rationing. Mark my word, there will be single payer and rationing.

When you hear people say "I don't want to pay for somebody else's..." "problems" (welfare), "kids" (public schools), "medical" (health care), you hear the internalized programming. With blissful obliviousness these political automatons will allow their economy to wither, and dispatch their tax dollars to fund the gold-plated war-waste of the Pentagon system and the many outrageous corporate subsidies ("bonuses") that remain protected by the "tax cuts" that are so liberal to corporate wealth, so measly for the suckers, but do bump those "welfare cheats" off the dole most satisfactorily to both the duped and the malevolent.

The great con-job here is in training a large population into accepting that property has more rights than people. Since under democracy there is always the threat that popular consensus could place some restrictions on "property" (the "right" of money to do as it pleases), then property -- as it is understood today: wealth protected by the legalistic über-persona of corporate structure -- must destroy democracy. Democracy is communism.

and if the bill is so good, why are out politicians (including "Dear Leader") covered by it from the date it is signed. why are they exempt?

People demand fairness these days in the real world.

Some elements within the American right are going to have to accept the fact that the la-la land they all still live is not viable to even think about any more because, well, the times they are a-changin' in the real world.

In that unreal world that never existed outside of their woolly brains things never change. That world where white men rule benevolently because they know better, where women know their place, where paternalistic charity replaces social services, where non-Christians, minorities and homosexuals just keep their damn mouths shut, where if we want some dirty foreigner's oil anywhere in the world we just go in and get it.

I don't plan on watching the vote. It's bad enought we're going to have to deal with the reality of the bill being enacted. No sense in torturing oneself by watching the vote. You're gointg to watch Fox News Roy? That's not a real news org, you know? At least that is what Obama said, and yet he gave them an interview.

#36 | Posted by mitch at 2010-03-21 12:04 PM

Oh I love watching Fox. It's very entertaining.

Seeing Bill Krystal predict the Dems won't be able to pass the bill, then later in the show, predict the Repubs will get a majority in the fall, and vote to rescind, forgetting that Obama will be able to veto any efforts the repubs make.

Yes... Fox is very entertaining.

KEYSTONE COPS 2010:

Enforcing every Mexican, legal and illegal in Southern California, Texas and Arizona and every Cuban in Florida to pay their share or pay their penalty or go to jail.

Is that circus music in the background?

#40 | Posted by brock at 2010-03-21 12:06 PM | Reply | Flag: White men basher.

We raise taxes on the wealthy, we don't cut em...

There, that was easy.
#31 | POSTED BY ROY_BATTY

Easy to say. With the fed running close to a $2 trillion deficit, they could double the tax rate across the board, and it wouldn't be enough. How and when the fed defaults is only a matter of details.

Our founding fathers created a republic not a democracy. Some on the left are very honest about what they want to change America into. It's bad enough they already got away with direct popular election of the senate, but their dream is to completely destory the last elements of republican government by eliminating the electoral college, which they consider obsolete because they don't understand it.

We need to repeal the 17th Amendment and restore the republic. In the pledge of allegiance, don't we swear allegiance to a republic? We'll it would be nice to have one again.

The great con-job here is in training a large population into accepting that property has more rights than people.
#38 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

There you have it by our resident Marxist. Government owns everything for what they charge for rent (taxes).

I am just happy that, pass or fail, this nonsense ends today.

"There you have it by our resident Marxist. Government owns everything for what they charge for rent (taxes)."

A centralized form of feudalism.

There you have it by our resident Marxist. Government owns everything for what they charge for rent (taxes).

#46 | Posted by Ray at 2010-03-21 12:15 PM | Reply | Flag: Broken record, red baiting, non-sequitur

Kanrei, the fight doesn't end today. The right isn't like France who will just surrender and bend over.

Easy to say. With the fed running close to a $2 trillion deficit, they could double the tax rate across the board, and it wouldn't be enough. How and when the fed defaults is only a matter of details.

#44 | Posted by Ray at 2010-03-21 12:11 PM | Reply | Flag:

Math isn't important, Ray. Just sit back and let someone else do the heavy lifting. That's the ticket.

#46 | Posted by Ray at 2010-03-21 12:15 PM | Reply | Flag: Broken record, red baiting, non-sequitur

#49 | Posted by nullifidian

You forgot strawman. What is wrong with you today?

"he right isn't like France who will just surrender and bend over.

#50 | Posted by mitch "

Another "freedom fry" dipshit.

Kanrei, the fight doesn't end today.

It does here though. I should have been more specific. Now WE can start fighting about other things.

I am just happy that, pass or fail, this nonsense ends today.
#47 | POSTED BY KANREI

Bad news. This is just getting started. Next it has to pass the Senate, for which I read there are differences in language. Several states say they will take the matter to court. Then there are years of litigation and regulations to work out the finer details.

#49 | Posted by nullifidian at 2010-03-21 12:18 PM | Reply | Flag: Possess's seven of the seven deadly sins. Has lots of company in the democrat party, too.

Next it has to pass the Senate

Thought Nancy was skipping the Senate.

Then there are years of litigation and regulations to work out the finer details.

#55 | Posted by Ray at 2010-03-21 12:21 PM | Reply | Flag:

One can only hope. Gridlock can be a good thing.

When you finish you victory dance later today I just want to give you pro health care people something to think about.

This or some form of HC will pass as Dems have the majority of both houses and the presidency. It will create the "Medicare Advisory Panels" as well as a lot of other regulatory boards.

In 2010 Republicans will take back the house and maybe the Senate and in 2014 we will take back the presidency in 2014 and the Senate.

When you wake up from your drug induced stupor on the 1st of February 2014 and you look up at your new Republican appointed "Medicare Advisory Panels"/Death panel, you will see me smiling back at you.

Thought there will be 4 yr wait for startup ? or more...

"we will take back the presidency in 2014"

You cannot make this shit up.

#46 | Posted by Ray at 2010-03-21 12:15 PM | Reply | Flag: Broken record, red baiting, non-sequitur
#49 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

Name calling evades the issue of ownership. You're running away from it.

Something else that can help is going to the doctor for the most minor thing, a papercut, a hangnail. Just throw sand in the gears in any way you can.

The #2 comment is totally uncalled for. Now the right has a new reason to become bigots and hate mongers. They will work hard to divide the nation even more as the country finally starts getting run by the people for the people. Way to go jackass.

This is perhaps the greatest single accomplishment in the last 30 years and the right is still talking about "niggers and faggots" being behind it all. Hey toilet mouth, we are not all N's and F's.

#12 | Posted by RingMaster

Ringmaster, 2 comments:

1---post #2 was posted by cookfish not jackass---although it could have been because of the shock value of the post.

2---"greatest single accomplishment in the last 30 years"---just a little hubris, I would say---a lot of taxes and not necessarily for healthcare along with more spending (costs) and a shuffling of money between areas----will help big pharma and hospitals but when all is said and done playing around the edges with pre-existing and some increase in coverage. Of course, it will be trumpeted but those that look at it carefully and educate themselves about it will be the ones that'll understand it's a lot of smoke and mirrors and really just a big tax for general budget needs.

Dem Leader: 'We Have the Votes'

Can't wait to hear the snivleing by likely posters here when the repubs and hopefully the media expose how dems got those votes. Seeing as it isn't on the merits of the legislation. How does holding one's nose and voting yes compliment the bill?

The pubbies aren't just eating crow now, they are eating Jim crow. I love it. Hahahahahah!

There you have it by our resident Marxist.
...

#46 | Posted by Ray

"Name calling...

#62 | Posted by Ray "

This might help in doing the math.

The pubbies aren't just eating crow now, they are eating Jim crow. I love it. Hahahahahah!

#66 | Posted by RingMaster

What an idiotic comment. I am sure it will get like 7 funny flags by Liberals who don't understand what real humor is.

"The great con-job here is in training a large population into accepting that property has more rights than people."

Property should have more rights than people!

--Propertarian Ray

The pubbies aren't just eating crow now, they are eating Jim crow. I love it. Hahahahahah!
#66 | POSTED BY RINGMASTER

Health care bill or not, the federal government is rushing helter skelter towards insolvency. I'll keep the Crow warm for you.

Did Barack and Nancy seduce the 'niggers' or the 'faggots'?

#2 | POSTED BY COOKFISH

spoken like a true tea-bagging scumbag.

Property should have more rights than people!
--Propertarian Ray
#70 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

Duh. Property doesn't have rights!!!

Nulllfidian, I don't think it was Libertraisn in the SCOTUS that gave personhood to corporations. If you read Libertarian forum you would know that Libertarians don't think corporations should have personhood. But hey, only crackpot Libertarians care about the Constitution and silly little things like correctly interpreting the 14th Amendment.

Just wait until they try to enforce this crap.
We ain't seen nothing yet.
#6 | POSTED BY PORKCHOP

that right.. incite violence and see the tolerant open up on your ass.. you pansies will fold like a cheap suit.

Don't mistake tolerance for weakness or inability to reciprocate in kind.

Property does't have rights, humans have rights. Private property is the source of individual rights. Why would they put the 4th Amendment, for example, if they didn't acknowledged that people have rights in their private property?

"Private property is the source of individual rights. "

Bullshit. Property is just one of many rights that a society can choose to recognize and codify.

Well Mitch. It looks like we're in agreement with Nulli. Property should not have more rights than people.

Same playbook on HCR as Iraq; mischaracterizations, untruths, inflammatory rhetoric, and attempts to paint the opposition as un-American. 'Totalitarian' and 'Socialist' (read Communist) instead of 'terrorist appeasers' or 'defeatists' or other catch phrases to paint anyone in opposition as 'un-American'.

#19 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

AU, have you lost your mind and joined the conservative camp---congratulations, couldn't agree with you more---it was nasty the way the pro-health crew (Pelosi particularly) painted the townhallers and teapartiers and others that were in opposition to this bill. Once again, happy that you see "the light" Elwood (blues bro).

Oh well. We have only liberals to blame.

#15 | POSTED BY RIGHTISRIGHT

Your fucking side - "the kluckkkers" are the ones that have exploded the deficit, killed the gold standard, started 3 wars in the last 20 years, rescinded the Glass Steagall Act in 1999

Nullifidian, dovernments do not confer rights on people, governments merely protect the rights people are born with. Read the DECLARATION of Indepedence and the Preamble to the Bill of Rights, is says "declaratory clauses." The Bill of Righsts is a statmet of fact, it states the rights we unalienably have. You seem to think the Bill of Rights gives kus those rights and that it is merely a matter of amending them to do away with them. Not so.

Property does't have rights, humans have rights. Private property is the source of individual rights. Why would they put the 4th Amendment, for example, if they didn't acknowledged that people have rights in their private property?

#76 | POSTED BY MITCH

Rights are given by your fellow man, you own nothing, you are nothing if your fellow man doesn't recognize your right to existence. It's an agreement between fellow men.

No public option; no single payer----a pyrrhic victory for the left---a lot of bluster and pages and nibbling around the edges---no big winner except larger government.

Property is just one of many rights that a society can choose to recognize and codify.
#77 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

Would you prefer a government that violates our person and property as it wishes, or a government that protects our person and property. I know your answer is the former. BTW, drug laws presume your body is not your property. You shouldn't complain so much about them.

I see what Nulli did. He took the literal meaning of "property rights" as if property has rights. Nice try Groucho.

" If you read Libertarian forum you would know that Libertarians don't think corporations should have personhood"

I don't know if Ray is against it, but it doesn't really matter. Right-libertarians will always promote property rights over other human rights.

Legio, read the Declaration of Independence, the part that say, "unalienable rights." If others chose not to recognize your rights, you defend them.

Rights are given by your fellow man, you own nothing, you are nothing if your fellow man doesn't recognize your right to existence. It's an agreement between fellow men.

#81 | Posted by Legio
* * * *

Spoken like a true collectivist.

It's a shame we can't have a country where those kind of sentiments aren't allowed to be the law of the land. You know, like build a Communist or a Socialist country, just to see how well things work out.

Seig heil!

What kills me is the fact something could have been passed a year ago. If the ultimate goal is to make insurance more affordable, and remove the ability of insurance companies to exclude or cancel those with pre-existing conditions, why in the hell wasn't that the entire crux of the legislation?

You know, like build a Communist or a Socialist country, just to see how well things work out.

Well, if California is any indication ...

"BTW, drug laws presume your body is not your property"

Your body is not your property. That's stupid. You are your body. You can't own your body. There aren't two different entities involved. That's a transparent attempt by right-libertarians to turn everything into property and every question into a property rights issue.

Rights are given by your fellow man, you own nothing, you are nothing if your fellow man doesn't recognize your right to existence. It's an agreement between fellow men.
#81 | POSTED BY LEGIO

More precisely, rights may be taken by your fellow man. Then the rest is in agreement.

Rights are given by your fellow man, you own nothing, you are nothing if your fellow man doesn't recognize your right to existence. It's an agreement between fellow men.

#81 | Posted by Legio

Legio, got to disagree with you---no man gives me my rights---they may attempt to take my rights away or modify them in some way---"Braveheart" is a classic example of the inherent rights of man and how other men through various means of power both on the left and right (or other governmental systems) may attempt to usurp those inherent (some would say unalienable) rights.

I'm still waiting to see if the Fat Lady sings on this or not. And which tune she'll sing...

crispee_oc

This is just A HUGE TAX INCREASE diguised as a health care bill. They say they will collect 4 years of taxes and start providing services in 2014 with the money. Do you really think the money will go to a "locked box?" No. It will be used for other things and then taxes will have to be raised again in 2014 to comply with the law creating the exchanges and the like. What a giant scam.

"You can't own your body."

Really have no idea what slavery is do you? Slavery is me laboring for someone elses rights.

that right.. incite violence and see the tolerant open up on your ass.. you pansies will fold like a cheap suit.

Don't mistake tolerance for weakness or inability to reciprocate in kind.

#74 | Posted by Legio at 2010-03-21 12:36 PM | Reply | Flag:

Nice.

Your body is not your property.

#89 | Posted by nullifidian

Nully, I can agree with that statement---now try this on for size--my body doesn't belong to me but instead to God who created me---it's his temple and therefore, I have a responsibility to Him and my neighbor not just to look out for my own interest but also the interest of my neighbor.

-Can't wait to hear the snivleing by likely posters here when the repubs and hopefully the media expose how dems got those votes. Seeing as it isn't on the merits of the legislation

These Legislative Virgins are hilarious.

People who claim that this hasn't been the legislative process for over 200 years in this country are either liars or fools.

If you want to change that, fine, support a Bill that changes it, don't pretend that somehow the extant process should be changed before we pass a Bill you just don't like.

Keep whining, my friends.

btw, interesting to note that the CBO, created in 1974, has scored many major Bills for cost and savings since 1980, and they averaged predicting about half the savings those Bills actually produced.

Jesus was quite a Marxist wasn't he? And yet the left rejects religion. How odd.

matsop, what about atheists like me? The would argue that their mon and dad are their "creator" does that mean we are their slaves? I am not sure I follow you. "I brough you into this world, I can take you out!"

The Communists may have the votes today but they won't in November either way

#81 | Posted by Legio at 2010-03-21 12:46 PM | Reply | Flag: Tenant farmer that likes working only 6 weeks a year and believes that gig can continue even when funding (subsidies) is no longer available.

You'd do well to read up on the Roman empire and how they dealt with farmers.

There are more recent examples as well.

This is just A HUGE TAX INCREASE diguised as a health care bill. They say they will collect 4 years of taxes and start providing services in 2014 with the money. Do you really think the money will go to a "locked box?" No. It will be used for other things and then taxes will have to be raised again in 2014 to comply with the law creating the exchanges and the like. What a giant scam.

#93 | Posted by mitch

BINGO, Mitch gets it---have been posting for weeks that this is a HUGE TAX BILL MASQUERADING AS A HEALHCARE REFORM BILL. The poor supporters think this is the most significant legislation in 30 years (poor ringmaster, duped again). The money will go like social security into the general budget---they'll throw you some bones like pre-existing and some increase coverage insurance but most of this money will go for deficits and other bureaucracy building. And when the outyears come for the benefits the money won't be there---kicking the can down the road which Bush was condemned for.

"People who claim that this hasn't been the legislative process for over 200 years in this country are either liars or fools."

I guess I would go under the fool category. On the other hand, only a liar or a fool would argue politicians try and expose the negatives of any legislation for political gain.

#81 | Posted by Legio at 2010-03-21 12:46 PM | Reply | Flag:

What????????

Whod'a thunk.....

Oh, that's right, It was a conservative philosophy. Personal responsibility and all that silly bullshit.

Rights are given by your fellow man, you own nothing, you are nothing if your fellow man doesn't recognize your right to existence. It's an agreement between fellow men.

#81 | Posted by Legio
* * * *

Spoken like a true collectivist.
#86 | Posted by rightisright

Or spoken like a "classical liberal" such as Benjamin Franklin.

All property, indeed, except the savage's temporary cabin, his bow, his matchcoat and other little Acquisitions absolutely necessary for his Subsistence, seems to me to be the creature of public Convention. Hence, the public has the rights of regulating Descents, and all other Conveyances of Property, and even of limiting the quantity and uses of it. All the property that is necessary to a man is his natural Right, which none may justly deprive him of, but all Property superfluous to such Purposes is the property of the Public who, by their Laws have created it and who may, by other Laws dispose of it.
Benjamin Franklin

It turns out that, when someone is spending his own money alone for routine expenses, he is far more likely to ask the questions he would ask if purchasing any other good or service: "Is there a generic version of that drug?" "Didn't I take that same test just recently?" "Where can I get the colonoscopy at the best price?"

matsop, what about atheists like me? The would argue that their mon and dad are their "creator" does that mean we are their slaves? I am not sure I follow you. "I brough you into this world, I can take you out!"

#99 | Posted by mitch

Mitch, nice point. I know it's a tough thing to understand---I've been immersed in this for years and therefore if I tried to explain it in these posted "straitjackets" it would be all the more confusing---my parents are my physical parents---like you said, brought me into this world. My spiritual and lasting parent is God who "knitted me together" in my mother's womb---physically, my parents and any man "could take me out" but they in their weakness have no control over my soul---owned by my God---and that's why I laugh and chuckle at all the machinations of simple man---that's why I can smile at the outcome of this healthcare bill because no matter how much that simple man tries to control what happens around them God ultimately will decide directly or indirectly.

On a side note: For all the contempt and ridicule lobbed at Pelosi, the fact of the matter is that if she successfully shepherds this legislation into fruition she will go down in American history as one of the most effective Speakers ever. Pretty interesting considering how much the rightwing loathes her. Kind of like Reagan but in the opposite direction.

Your body is not your property. That's stupid. You are your body. You can't own your body. There aren't two different entities involved. That's a transparent attempt by right-libertarians to turn everything into property and every question into a property rights issue.
#89 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

Every question IS a property rights issue. Who decides?

You're only revealing your ignorance on the nature of property rights. By definition, property rights means having the right to use one's property in a manner that does not infringe upon the property rights of others.

You are your body.

Yes. That's why we own it. If we don't own our bodies, then others can force us to use our bodies to their ends. Slavery was one such issue.

Partial slavery exists when the state claims the right to restrict what you ingest, or when the state takes some of your persona property by force. The same logic applies if it was a thug.

This healthcare issue is a major violation of our property rights on all grounds.

Of note. The poorest nations in the world have no property rights. The state owns you. It's not a coincidence.

Evidence based, Dems hate it, as much as they hate common sense, a quality, obvious daily they possess little of.

Government mandated health care, from the people who say a woman has a right to do with her own body as she pleased, even to the point of killing the unborn.

Hypocrisy, Irony, or both?

You decide.

"On a side note: For all the contempt and ridicule lobbed at Pelosi, the fact of the matter is that if she successfully shepherds this legislation into fruition she will go down in American history as one of the most effective Speakers ever."

How? By convincing her party which has all three Houses to vote along party lines? You call that historic leadership?

" If you read Libertarian forum you would know that Libertarians don't think corporations should have personhood"
I don't know if Ray is against it, but it doesn't really matter. Right-libertarians will always promote property rights over other human rights.
#84 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIANK

How stupid! Property rights are synonymous with human rights.

Corporate personhood is a side show. America has the best government corporations can buy. Those same corporations are behind the scenes running the show. You fools are only kidding yourself when you think government gives a rats ass about your health.

Mitch Daniels has this in the right direction and doing pretty darn well.

----------

In Indiana's HSA, the state deposits $2,750 per year into an account controlled by the employee, out of which he pays all his health bills. Indiana covers the premium for the plan. The intent is that participants will become more cost-conscious and careful about overpayment or overutilization.

Unused funds in the account -- to date some $30 million or about $2,000 per employee and growing fast -- are the worker's permanent property. For the very small number of employees (about 6% last year) who use their entire account balance, the state shares further health costs up to an out-of-pocket maximum of $8,000, after which the employee is completely protected.

The HSA option has proven highly popular. This year, over 70% of our 30,000 Indiana state workers chose it, by far the highest in public-sector America. Due to the rejection of these plans by government unions, the average use of HSAs in the public sector across the country is just 2%.

What we, and independent health-care experts at Mercer Consulting, have found is that individually owned and directed health-care coverage has a startlingly positive effect on costs for both employees and the state. What follows is a summary of our experience:

State employees enrolled in the consumer-driven plan will save more than $8 million in 2010 compared to their coworkers in the old-fashioned preferred provider organization (PPO) alternative. In the second straight year in which we've been forced to skip salary increases, workers switching to the HSA are adding thousands of dollars to their take-home pay. (Even if an employee had health issues and incurred the maximum out-of-pocket expenses, he would still be hundreds of dollars ahead.) HSA customers seem highly satisfied; only 3% have opted to switch back to the PPO.

Jesus was quite a Marxist wasn't he? And yet the left rejects religion. How odd.

#98 | Posted by mitch

Another astute thought---I guess you could label him that because of his teachings and examples and the marxist philosophy---however, the marxist dealt with the material and their philosophy wasn't loving; Jesus dealt with the spiritual and the responsibility of doing things out of love and not force.

There are now 38 states who have filed or will file a lawsuit blocking the reforms if it in fact passes.

"How stupid! Property rights are synonymous with human rights."

#115 | Posted by Ray

That's the right-libertarian ideology in a nutshell. But just asserting it doesn't make it true, no matter how many times you shout it.

#116 | Posted by MURPHY at 2010-03-21 01:28 PM

Murphy sounds fine but it doesn't address people with pre-existing conditions.

For the republicans it is all about price controls and never about adding those with pre-existing conditions.

#116 | Posted by MURPHY

Murph, good post---this is one of the directions healthcare should go--would ultimately along with a well thought out plan hold costs down and render healthcare to all.

#114

This call for bipartisanship with people who decided before he was sworn in that opposing Obama, just saying NO to everything, was better than really trying to help the American people.

In 1935 and 1965 when similar Bills were finally passed on a bipartisan basis, Dems held the conservative South and expected to lose some conservative votes, but back then the GOP had not "purified" the Party of Liberal Republicans who helped pass the Bills.

There are no Liberal Republicans now, and few moderates, so the idea of bipartisanship on difficult issues is an exaggerated possibility at best.

Jesus was quite a Marxist wasn't he? And yet the left rejects religion. How odd.

#98 | Posted by mitch

The left wants to control their fellow man; Jesus was not about control.

That was from Porkchp's link with the wsj online post--##112 | Posted by porkchop

That's the right-libertarian ideology in a nutshell. But just asserting it doesn't make it true, no matter how many times you shout it.
#119 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

Yeah sure, you defend your Marxist claptrap.

Networks are reporting that Stupak will vote YES for the Bill.

Congrats to Nancy Pelosi who lent Obama the use of her cojones after the MA election, and didn't give up on health care

Corky, wasn't this supposed to be the most ethical congress in the history of the entire universe? Isn't that what Pelousy said?

You are your body.

Yes. That's why we own it. If we don't own our bodies, then others can force us to use our bodies to their ends. Slavery was one such issue."

No, Ray. If you really believe that people have property rights in their own body then you have no possible objection to being able to sell oneself into slavery.

Would you like some cheese, Mitch?

I'm still waiting to see if the Fat Lady sings on this or not. And which tune she'll sing...

#92 | Posted by daprof

The tax tune

#108

Thank you. I kind of understand now. I'll have to reflect on it some more.

lmao... these Fox "News" people are going to need an entire Budweiser truckload to cry into ....

#109

Moder8, do you think Polosi, if the bill passes, could now conceive of a presidential run? I am sure Hillary will not be thrilled about it.

Walgreens will stop taking new WA Medicaid patients:

"Government mandated health care, from the people who say a woman has a right to do with her own body as she pleased, even to the point of killing the unborn. "

If it is true that they are trying to get Stupak in exchange for an executive order banning federal funding of abortion it will be interesting to watch the political fall out. Fun stuff. Can you imagine Obama throwing pro-chice female dems under the bus like that?

Let's get the vote over with...I want my free health care!

So, if someone isn't "pro health care" what are they? Pro disease?

#116

HSAs are great. I think they should just promote HSAs, especially for young people who can save up a lot to then pay medical bills as they get older.

Walgreens will stop taking new WA Medicaid patients:

An enterprising American will recognize this and start a company to fill the void. A great country, this.

#117

In other words, people should help out because they want to not because they are a burned out bureaucrat trying to deal with a crazy govrnment system. I understand the difference now.

#119

This is how Liberals can make it illegal to, for example, get rid of animals that harm your crops because they are in some endangered speciales list. The right of the animal is more importan than the right of the human dediding in his property how to deal with a threat to his livelihood.

So yes, peroperty rights are related to human rights. Iberals have no problem violating human rights for whatever reason.

It isn't really the GOP that makes me vote Republican, it's the Democrats.

#120

Jackass, if costs are not dealth with then NO ONE WILL BE ABLE TO ACCES CARE in the future.

Mitch, your fingers are slurring.

The left will be unhappy since there isn't a single payer or public option and this "pig" passed. They'll be somewhat happy because there'll be higher taxes, more government spending and bureaucray (gov. jobs).

The right will be unhappy because this "pig" passed and will mean higher taxes, more government spending and bureaucracy (gov. jobs). They'll be happy that there wasn't a single payer system or public option.

I'll be disappointed in how all this was handled and once again represents how our gov. through obsfucation, deviance, and deception passes a bill which has very little to do with healthcare reform but with taxes to impact the general budget. Also, disappointed that a package wasn't developed that truely would hold costs down that would allow more people in the future to be covered at a reasonable rate. Am happy for the fringe benefits of pre-existing and more insurance coverage.

It isn't really the GOP that makes me vote Republican, it's the Democrats.

#142 | Posted by wurster at 2010-03-21 02:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

Exactly, it's the lesser of the bad. Too bad they both take us to the same place.

#132

We will all be crying when our country defaults because of reckless entitlement spending.

Corky will be happy it passed because a bill was passed and he doesn't care what's in it as long as it was passed through a democratic controlled government---goooooooooooo Cork.

The government doesn't care about you, or your children, or your rights, or your welfare or your safety.

It's interested in its own power. That's the only thing.

Keeping it and expanding it wherever possible.

Control of the House.

435 seats
255 Democrats
178 Republicans.

The Democrats need 217?

Out of 255?

Dems don't even have all their members supporting this.

So, while the fingers point at the Rep's NO votes, there are quite a few Dems voting NO.

The Bill isn't entire supported by Democrats.

"This is the mother of all mandates", Paul Ryan, Republican, WI.

In the not too distant future I want to be in on the crowd at one of Paul Ryan's town hall meetings when his constituents tell him how much they like the reforms he opposed.

SLBronkowitz, if people are going to like the reforms, then Dems should have had no trouble getting votes and Obama would not have had to postpone his vacation until June.

Mitch, much of what the opponents of the legislation, including Rep. Ryan try to pass off as reform reminds me of snake oil.

you have to buy the snake oil,
you have to sell the snake oil,
you have to drink the snake oil
after you drink it we will tell you whats in it.

SNAKEOIL!

No they won't.

Democrats are historically gutless.

In turn, Republicans always have to appear united, even if they're wrong.

Politics in D.C. is always the same.

Always.

It's like a broken record.

Republicans are always a great opposition party, but they suck at governing. Democrats always seem so overreach when in power and they are spineless when they are the opposition.

117

In other words, people should help out because they want to not because they are a burned out bureaucrat trying to deal with a crazy govrnment system. I understand the difference now.

#140 | Posted by mitch

Mitch, bureaucrats can never accomplish what an individual or private group can accomplish---to a bureaucrat, it's just a job; to a private person(s) who feels responsible to their neighbor it's a "calling".

Do you think the Democrat Representatives' constituents support their Representative's position to vote NO? Not all Dems are voting for this.

Its funny the Dems are blaming the pubs for this not already passing. Dems have a vast majority in the House and they can't get the votes. That is their fault. Many of the votes they do have is because of bribery.

Almost there. I can quit my night job and have Obama care!!!

This could wind up to be one of the biggest and darkest days in our Nation's history if this succeeds... YES, we do need health care reform and we need to find more regulation on insurance companies and several other things.. but, this bill, unfortunately, is not about the RIGHT way to go, it has lost it's total focus and really comes down to saving a large EGO in the WH...
It is like buying a 2010 automobile FOR A PREMIUM, knowing that it has rotting tires and an engine with over 300,000 miles on it...would take a fool to pay over for it...
This is not about being for or against insurance companies or trying to screw people out of health care.. the entire scenario stinks..
and, the argument of 'IT IS BETTER TO PASS SOMETHING INSTEAD OF NOTHING' is about as ignorant as it gets...
why do you think the real DETAILS of this bill have not been laid out in 'laymen terms' so everyone could understand it???? just to say that it has been posted and you could go read it is not enough for something of this major impact.. of course, they are hiding taxes and leaving out things to be paid for later..
It is incredible to see the lack of intelligence applied to this process and the continuing apathy in some ranks to speak out...
Yes, again, something needs to be done as health care is a problem.. but this is not the way..

What's your solution, Dr. Soul? Other than complaining.

medicare has never been cut a dime,never has and never will.

Yep. Prices in general never go down. Never has. Never will.

Now the Republicans are arguing AGAINST an Executive Order stating the Hyde Amendment banning federal funds MOST DEFINITELY, ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY stands in this bill (despite it being IN the bill and the Hyde Amendment covering that anyway).

Thought they were all for banning federal funds for abortion, but they're against a double, triple, assurance of that?

These crazy fucks can't make up their minds. Right wingers are insane. Period.

"Yep. Prices in general never go down. Never has. Never will."

That's only true of gold.

--Ray

This debate is terrific fun!! Like watching the British Parliament.

Raucous. Love it.

Wish a Dem would say somthing to the GOP like, "you're a little late to the party. You had 6 years 2001-2007 to do whatever you wanted. We invited you to participate from the very beginning and you'd already made up your minds to vote as a single block of "NO!". Sorry, Charlie."

'Raucous. Love it.'

I agree with you there. Its nice to see these slime balls have to work.

AU-
Back now. Doing some resumes while C-SPAN plays off my left shoulder. More entertaining than March Madness at times.

Definitely better than watching soccer.

Gotta love John *Orange Alert* Boner calling today "Armageddon".... the same guy that told America in 1994 that the Clinton Budget would "destroy America".

Of course, it revitalized America, and left a surplus.

dems about to STEAL FIFTY THREE BILLION from social security...

planned parenthood research arm reports that the senate bill will mean AN ADDITIONAL FOUR HUNDRED THOUSAND MORE abortions in america..

The WH just said they will issue an executive order saying that current law, the Hyde amendment, cannot be circumvented in the Bill.

Of course, it's not circumvented in the Bill, anyway. as many priests and nuns who supported it can tell you.

So Stupak says Yes.

and a SPECIAL LIBERAL HYPCORICY HISTORICAL MOMENT

to the wayback machine

govt cant tell a woman what to do with her body

and this PM dems about to have the govt tell EVERYONE what they can do with thier body because reports are that TWO THOUSAND TImes in this massive pile of shit are the words

"the secretary shall..."

and libs here just dont give a fuck

- STEAL FIFTY THREE BILLION from social security...

Make that MoVE that money from insurer pockets as subsidies, and fix the Donut Hole with it, then you would be correct, sir.

if you believe this PROVEN liar then you are either naive or a biased and partisan hack

this shows a bigger picture to this whole thing
dems have ADMITTED that they are set to create "RIGHT' and when man gives you a right, he can take it away,
I dont believe the liar for one nanosecond as he is proven to have lied AGAIN in this bill when he said over and over again

"NOT ONE DIME"
health care discussed in house committee yesterday PROVES beyound a shadow of a doubt that this was a fuckin lie

its theft...pure and simple..

SIR!!!! lol

its theft...pure and simple..

#179 | Posted by afkabl2

STFU, stupid. You lost, looooooser.

a biased and partisan hack

#178 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2010-03-21 04:11 PM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

pot, meet kettle

sure..those FACTS have to be covered up dont they..

and the difference is that I admit to being partisan and biased against anyone who lies and steals and commits this kind of fraud on the american people.

and make no mistake

WE WILL NOT FORGET COME NEXT NOVEMBER.

STFU, stupid. You lost, looooooser.

#181 | Posted by nullifidian

remember this sentiment next november and send it to yourself.

NO NO>..I want the joy of reminding you then...

WE WILL NOT FORGET COME NEXT NOVEMBER.

#183 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2010-03-21 04:19 PM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

just what in the hell do you mean by "we"?

are you now the executive spokesperson for Teabaggers?

use any porn reference you want...its as significant as the fleas on my dogs ass.
if I had a dog

I can't wait for Nov for Repubes to start telling parents that their children with pre existing conditions who are now able to get insurance have to give up that right.

And small businesses have to give back their tax breaks for health care.

Let me know how that werks fer ya.

AND ON FOX NEWS SUNDAY

FUTURE PRESIDENT>..I hope ..paul ryan showed results of sending to the cbo a number without the dem LIES and graft and fraud that they sent..
without SOCIAL SECURITY THEFT and medicare cuts that simply will not happen but are spent TWICE..

and the result was a DEFICIT ADDITION OF 660 BILLION dollars.

all we have to do is point out the LIES from the president about taxes and that will offset anything like you mention
but nice talking point there SIR....yeah right :)

#188 | Posted by Corky at 2010-03-21 04:23 PM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

November aint going to be the Armageddon the teabaggers think it will be…

I can't wait for Nov for Repubes to start telling parents that their children with pre existing conditions who are now able to get insurance have to give up that right.

With that kind of unbridled anticipation, I hope things work out for you.

not when dems lie thier face off as they continue to do today..

those liars calling themselves conservative dems for instance.
no conservative votes for trillions and trillions and trillions of dollars in debt and deficit and get away with it....and talk shit about bush all you want..as I have said repeatedly..the worst most abusive and insulting thing I could say about him is true
he spent like a democrat.
EVEN THOUGH tarp put the deficit that high with the BLEsSING OF most dems who know use that for thier lies and fraud

OBAMA LIE OF THE NIGHT

cspan....gop read FROM BILL WITH NO DEM DISSENT..

"NOT ONE DIME" was the oft used quote..

reading from the committee....using poverty index and formula it comes out now that a family making 66 thousand a year will see A MEDICARE TAX INCREASE..
again...unlike most other gop readings..there was NO DEM DISSENT when this was read...

so yet another OBAMA LIE EXPOSED..

This is so much more fun to watch now, knowing we have the votes to pass historic, long overdue laws for a modern nation.

STFU, stupid. You lost, looooooser.

#181 | Posted by nullifidian

You guys won why are you so hostile? Just relax.

well thats not fun..but posting here is...
'aint it??

just wait til the first wednesday in november....

mitch..

they mistake my caps and shit as hostility towards them when its actually directed at the perpetuators of this impending bankrupcy and tyranny...

I just like to hear them convulse and spew....:)

Stupak is an idiot. If Obama is really going to sign a executive order with the abortion language he likes you'd think the pro-choicers would be switching from yes to no. That is not happening.

'You guys won why are you so hostile? Just relax.'

Asking a liberal to relax is like asking a dog to shit gold.

195 | Posted by Corky at

DAMNIT SKIPPY

missed a sixteen hundred tri because of one horse out of position...

make sure and look at all of the deals and shit LEFT IN this massive pile of shit

and never forget that the DEMS used WATER IN CALIFORNIA as blackmail..

dispicable....

You guys won why are you so hostile?

Dull lives in a state that by all rights with its natural and human resources should be an economic powerhouse and a great place to live. Instead it is bankrupt, has three of the top 20 most miserable cities in the US to live in,tops in real estate foreclosures, has no jobs, and is very expensive to live in spite of these things. Worse yet, he keeps getting reminded that waving a high scoring SAT in the air and repeating "Texas sucks" doesn't negate these issues.

I'd be hostile, too. LOL

It seems the bill will pass.

So for all the protests, all the phone calls and all the pressure, the only thing the people got is that Obama cancelled his vacation until June. Well, just great.

What a waste of time. These people are deaf.

ALSO LAST NIGHT on committe hearings..
I wanted to puke...no not because she was so ugly.

one part a dem spoke and it made me sick

it was the DEM POSTER BOY FOR crime

alcee hasings LECTURING gop on anything..

this man who was IMPEACHED from the bench because of bribes and perjury lecturing anyone is outrageous.,.

its typical though that this dem is a congressman instead of being in prison getting buttfucked daily.

At 6 the Pistons play. In 20 minutes I think they start the pre game stuff. I'd rather watch them lose miserably tonight than to watch the news. At least the Piston's outcome is inconsequential in the grand scheme of things.

Well--good for Stupak.

Now this pos bill is going to pass.

The repubs are going to run on the Repeal issues and dems are out of power in November.

Obama will be out in 2012.

murph

that is incomplete...the whole message is

repeal and replace....because no matter how many LIES obama told or others....doing nothing or status quo bullshit is just that...

Murphy, Stupak is Stupid. He will be double-crossed.

I hope all or most repubs campaign on repeal and then do something about in power. Even if Obama vetos it in 2011, it will be a campaign issue.

The repubs have a lot prove. If they want my vote in maybe 2014.

The repubs have a lot prove. If they want my vote in maybe 2014.

ditto but I am sure you meant 2012....

RYAN IN 012

the man is more presidential right now than obama is...

AGAIN..people who believe obama on this are same ones who fell for the lie about families making under 200K will not get taxes raised,,,"ONE SINGLE DIME"

THE LAW OF THE LAND TRUMPS EXECUTIVES ORDER. STUPAK IS AN IDIOT.

A law approved by congress TRUMPS AN EXECUTIVE ORDER.

-The repubs are going to run on the Repeal issues and dems are out of power in November.

I can't wait for Nov for Repubes to start telling parents that their children with pre existing conditions who are now able to get insurance have to give up that right.

And small businesses have to give back their tax breaks for health care.

Let me know how that werks fer ya.

#188 | Posted by Corky at 2010-03-21 04:23 PM

November aint going to be the Armageddon the teabaggers think it will be…

#191 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2010-03-21 04:25 PM

The year 2036 AD. Today's Teabaggers protesting HCR:

he knows that mitch.
this is his way out....IF that happens pelosi will ALLOW him to vote against that future measure..
ONLY if it comes up prior to 11/10

why are you quoting peaches and herb...:)

A law approved by congress TRUMPS AN EXECUTIVE ORDER.

#211 | Posted by mitch

That's true--also another POTUS or even Obama himself can rescind an executive order.

And a vote for this bill is a vote for tax payer funded abortions until Obama signs the order.

He is so good at breaking promises--I hope no one is holding their breath on this one.

Click the link, BushLover

Rush Limbaugh warned us that Stupak is ultimately a Dem and he couldn't resist the huge power grab. This is just nice political cover.

Dem first, American distant second, thwat is what Dem politicians are.

Wait to see the lawsuits that will be filed this week.

And the suits to be filed by the States against this monstrosity.

And the states who are passing bills to ignore the feds bill with their own legislation--States rights.

Mainly over the insurance mandates.

This is such a bad gross bill designed to tax the crap out of everyone.

GTG

HERE IS your link...AU

#216 | Posted by MURPHY

Geesh, wingnuts. Federal law already bans federal funds for abortion. The Senate bill does it on top of THAT. Obama's is the THIRD layer of guarantees. They could burn the only copies of this Executive Order and bill and send the crushed ashes to Pluto never to be seen again.

The federal government would STILL ban federal dollars for abortion.

Is that such a tough concept to grasp?

Perhaps they'll have a funeral pyre for Rethug Obstructionism over at Faux "News" later..... they're already acting like someone died.

AU--then why would Stupak and his disciples not vote for the senate bill if your statement were true??

The senate bill allowed federally subsidized insurance policies to pay for abortions.

Does that help you to understand?

Mainly over the insurance mandates.

This is such a bad gross bill designed to tax the crap out of everyone.

#219 | Posted by MURPHY

MURPH ..

there will be 'legal experts' here shortly to tell you that they have no hope..
but lets look at one precedent...

Bailey v drizzell

supreme court said that govt CAN NOT use taxes as a penalty.,..

also supreme court has ruled that things such as the gun free school zone...when the left tried to make a case that parents having to pick up their children did not mean a violation of the commerce clause as well as the case concerning a violence against women act...libs tried to say that women staying inside and not out shopping violated the commerce clause ...I may be a little off on some of that info but the two subjects are correct and the ruling from the court WAS correct...
in other words there appears to be SOME precedence that the interstate commerce clause CAN be expanded beyound the parimeters...I hope that a lawyer can clear up this even if its contrary to my position.

but DOESNT THIS IMPRESS THE HELL OUT OF ALL OF YOU that I have actually researched some of this....:)

#221 | Posted by afkabl2

cute elephant! lol

AU...as I posted earlier...report I heard today and yes it was on fox but it was from the editor of the hill..so question thier integrity if you must..
but he said that a research arm of planned parenthood has stated that the senate bill as it would provide for an EXTRA 400,000 abortions in the USA.
and again....as so able as it was put...why all the ANGST from DEMS on the issue?????

maybe they KNOW the truth????

WELL that link certainly speaks volumnes about difference between you and me

I link pic of almost NEKKED ladies and you link heads exploding.....

David Dreier would make a great game show host!

I could just never understand why it is OK for him to be gay, but not for his colleague Barney Frank.

8 EST
DISCOVERY CHANNEL

"LIFE"..

dont miss it...looks great

maybe its because there hasnt been any whoring going on out of his house??

I dont know.
lets ask an expert on being gay

HEY....NULLIFAN

'fill us in' on this....

(im joking...settle down)

AND BESIDES>.
its bad enough that barney SOUNDS LIke a cartoon chraracter but he looks like him too...

NOT that theres anything wrong with that...

why all the ANGST from DEMS on the issue?????

Unlike today's GOP the Democrat Party welcomes various viewpoints, including a large contingent of 'pro-life' folks (before and after birth).

They wanted to ensure they had the votes to pass, and really wanted them onboard.

BTW, the Hyde Amendment has made federal funding of abortion illegal all along. Much hand wringing over nothing - surprisingly from the GOP today. Go figure.

your first line it total nonsense...because we all knew that stupec would fold like a cheap suit....

and again....planned parenthood research has said that you are wrong..

but hey....we can always sacrifice another million innocents or so to see if who is right.

Ryan in 2012?

No thanks he is the GOP's version of John Edwards with out the affairs. Nice rhetoric and looks good on television.

and you still cant forget..this bill would have been law MONTHS AGO..
because gop blocked no.
NOPE...this whole thing has been blocked by dems.
and the dem LEADERS have shown that they have no use for pro life dems.

I repeat: The Hyde Amendment has, does, and will make using federal funds for abortion illegal.

Period.

I believe that IM going to have to pull a AU here on you mister &*&^$^%$** WITZ
LINK PLEASE
I dont recall ryan being involved in anything of the sort.......could you please 'set me straight'

The R-turds in the House are like a special-needs basketball team down by 80 points with 30 seconds to go throwing fouls.

You lost, dumbshits. Have the dignity (ha, did I really say that?) to just shut the fuck up and enjoy the steamrolling.

I REpeAT

millions of innocent lives are at stake and why are dems so opposed to the language
OH I KNOW

thier base......

You lost, dumbshits. Have the dignity (ha, did I really say that?) to just shut the fuck up and enjoy the steamrolling.

#240 | Posted by axe at 2010-03-21 05:32 PM

TExas ELECTED board on textbooks..

thanks for endorsing my claim..

AND through with part I of 'atlas shrugged' and IM just now understanding what all the hulabalou is about.
the woman is a seer..a soothsayer...a genius in predicting actions of obama and his plantation...

taking a success and KILLING it to give to others who want it....

AU--then why would Stupak and his disciples not vote for the senate bill if your statement were true??

Grandstanding, I'd guess.

An 81 year old Representative, a former priest, read the Senate bill clause 12 times, consulted attorneys and several bishops. All concurred the Senate bill did NOT allow federal funds for abortion. Period.

I repeat: The Hyde Amendment has, does, and will make using federal funds for abortion illegal.

Period.

#238 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2010-03-21 05:32 PM

Which is why Obama has promised to issue an executive order? Who is more stupid? You or the Congressional dems that needed this order to vote yes?

millions of innocent lives are at stake and why are dems so opposed to the language
OH I KNOW

thier base......

#241 | Posted by afkabl2

Just answered for Murphy. Grandstanding I think.

BTW, I've been wanted to mention this for a long time. Please take this in stride:

You consistently misspell 'their'. E before I.

The old rule "I before E except after C" has a couple exceptions, 'their' being one. Cheers!

uh excuse me sir

but the group of bishops said just the opposite as this was discussed on several shows this morning.
it was the nuns..OF all people who said this...

and now boys and girls its off and away as the BOWEls OF BARBARA BUSH are closing

I mean the library but saying that always makes AU and corky a little quesy and I ALWAYS enjoy creating that.....

at the end of this day

God help us all.

we are going to need it.

ou or the Congressional dems that needed this order to vote yes?

Dammit! No one called me to ask.

But, I'd say Stupak wanted it and got a 3rd level of protection. Personally, I think it waa all political posturing on his part. That, or keeping his "C Street/The Family" cult friends happy.

DAMNIT CORKY YOU bastard..

turf paradise...

got the 7 in the wrong place and missed ANOTHER fuckin tri..this time for a hundred and a half.

its ALL your fault..

AND OUT

hasta la pasta

but the group of bishops said just the opposite as this was discussed on several shows this morning.
it was the nuns..OF all people who said this...

The nuns are for passage. 55,000 of 'em. Many hospital caregivers.

The priest/U.S. Representative consulted several. I'll take his word.

Several bishops, that is

hasta la pasta

#248 | Posted by afkabl2

Don't say it, just do it, dumbshit.

someone on the myriad of shows I have watched the past two days reported that the collection of bishops ..whatever they call it...came out against this bill for just the abortion issue.
of that I am certain..

one other thing Im certian of...

time to make like a tree and get the shit out of here...

( yes I know its a mixed metaphor or cliche or platitude or whatever....)

Don't say it, just do it, dumbshit.

#251 | Posted by nullifidian at 2010-0

I posted again just FOR you.
you sexy thing......

"hasta la pasta"

Ramen

Schmitt's talking now, and Bachmann's right behind her. Looks like the GOP is pulling out all the loons they can and putting them right up front and personal. What a great face of the GOP.

This whole "money is fungible" bullshit is so ridiculous. Where has the GOP been when contracts with tax payer money were awarded to defense contractors? Small business loans? Anyone that receives ANY federal money - such as their own health care providers, or any business? What about those that receive food stamps? Should they never be allowed insurance because, at one time, they took a Federal handout? Money is fungible, after all. What about everyone that's had help from FEMA?

This is the most disingenuous flawed line of logic I've seen used in a long time. It was silly with Stupak, and it's even sillier with the histrionics the GOP's putting on right now on camera.

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson

My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government.
Thomas Jefferson

Hahahaha

Bachmann's all upset with an EO. Of course she was fine with every one of Bush's.

Hypocritical idiot. Did I mention she's crazy?

I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson

#257 | Posted by matsop

Pretty obvious from these postings and this event and others; Americans are not happy campers.

This health-care bill is pharmaceutical grade snake oil. It is only about control and the IRS will have a heavy hand.

You liberals will not have a government to support your entitlements, as the financial impact and quality of care stemming from this bill will be devastatingly irreversible. It guarantees a bleak future for this country. Unemployment will skyrocket as small companies struggle to meet these regulations and pay these mandatory premiums.
We will have long waits to see a doctor just like every other country that has socialized health-care. The outcome will be identical. Very simple stuff to recognize.

Look at Medicaid, Social Security, the Postal Service. All poorly managed. Yet some how, lazy liberals blindly believe they are owed something and prefer a submissive existence sucking on the gov't teet.

Dem first, American distant second, thwat is what Dem politicians are.

#218 | Posted by mitch at 2010-03-21 04:58 PM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

yeah we alredy know how "republicans roll" they taught us that over the last 8 years

"Look at Medicaid, Social Security, the Postal Service."

I don't know why exactly but I suspect ACLUSUX has personal experience with at least two of those three things he listed.

The Repubs this

The Repubs that

Yet, it is the Dem votes that are lacking in number, isn't it?

If the vote was 100% Reps NO
and 100% Dems YES

Then, it would be a one sided excuse of partisan and stupidity.

But, there are Dems against it and not just a few.

255 Democrats

The Democrats need 217, but are trying to reach that magic number.

Are these hold-out Dems waiting for a bribe, their own convictions to stand firm, or a future re-election bid?

To hell with the allegations about Rep's. It is the Dems stopping the bill. If the bill passes, you will have Dems that voted against it.

Do they have good reason?

So, DR's who support this bill, are these Dems as evil as the Reps?

if I had a dog

#187 | Posted by afkabl2 at 2010-03-21 04:22 PM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

If you had a dog it'd likely run away.. or just step into traffic.

If Obamacare passes, it'll be time to check out USAJOBS again for a job.

There hasn't been much out there, but who knows.

Maybe Ray can say how long the company will be in business after hiring.

I've been thinking about the site's jobs and now my brother in law just lost his job. He said the site is loaded with jobs. Good ole Uncle. Maybe it is time to think about it.

"Yet, it is the Dem votes that are lacking in number, isn't it?"

Who is saying that??? NOt the Dem leaders, not STupak, he says they have well over the needed number. It's a done deal unless something awfully dramatic happens and I seriously doubt it will.
I think the Republicans are being advised to try and not do anything utterly stupid tonight and the Dems are probably being told to say as little as possible to avoid the possibility of alienating any part of their health care majority.

255 need 217.

That's still 38 Dems who still vote NO.

Are they Republicans in disguise?
What do they see?

255 need 217.

That's still 38 Dems who still vote NO.

Are they Republicans in disguise?
What do they see?

A majority of registered Republican constituents.

small business Pink Slips by the millions pending and big business rolling manufacturing OUT of USA IE: CAT
enjoy your tax hikes forever

I love all these Republicans coming up with health care reform ideas they could have gotten into this bill, if they had been willing to pledge to vote for health reform at any point in the last six months. 40 Republicans willing to vote "yes" could have gotten just about everything they wanted, given the political realities.

The core of this bill is the same health care plan as Mitt Romney in Massachusetts and the Heritage Foundation in the '90s. Republicans could be standing up and taking ownership of this reform alongside Democrats. Instead, they are joining the long line of Republicans who were on the wrong side of history, like the ones who opposed child labor laws 100 years ago.

Obama went to Capitol Hill on Day One of health care to meet with the Republican caucus.

If you recall, he found out at that time he would be getting 0 votes and 0 help crafting the bill.

The GOP had 6 solid years to do something. They didn't even manage to pass Tort Reform - the penultimate thing they'd always said would fix the health care system.

Talk talk talk talk.

BTW, if you missed it catch David Plouffe vs Karl Rove. Classic!

abcnews.com/thisweek for full video

The GOP had 6 solid years to do something. They didn't even manage to pass Tort Reform - the penultimate thing they'd always said would fix the health care system.

Yup. What was stopping them from tort reform during the eight years Bush was president?

"What was stopping them from tort reform during the eight years Bush was president?"

Trial lawyers.

"We call it riding the gravy train!"

"Which one's Pink?"

What was stopping them from tort reform during the eight years Bush was president?

Not a single thing but lack of desire. Passing CBO scored $2 Trillion deficit creating tax cuts, multi trillion dollar prescription drug programs that pay several times what the VA does, and a $2 Trillion dollar war in Iraq were much more important, don't ya know?

David Plouffe tore Karl Rove a new one on deficits.

ARCHITECT (Plouffe) vs architect (Rove)

David Plouffe tore Karl Rove a new one on deficits.

ARCHITECT (Plouffe) vs architect (Rove)

#275 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

Clarification: The CBO scored both Bush tax cuts and Medicare Part D as deficit creating.

The GOP held the vote open for 3 hours to wrestle, threaten, and cajole the final GOP vote for Medicare Part D.

That needs to be tweaked to allow reimportation and negotiated prices.

Trial lawyers.

Trial lawyers and their lobbying groups back Democrats, not Republicans. If Republicans wanted tort reform, they had the opportunity to pass it.

The first time I can recall hearing a figure for what tort reform would save was during the summit at Blair House a couple weeks ago.

Guess how much out of an annual multi trillion dollar health care system? $5 billion. That's it. That was their cure for fixing the health care system the past what, 20 years?

Obama had to squeeze that number from Tom Coburn, who offered it very reluctantly. No wonder LOL

Charlie Rangel...what a crook.

its off and away as the BOWEls OF BARBARA BUSH are closing

not a moment too soon...

Dow futures down only about 50 points---gold hasn't moved much.

Rcade, I totally agree the Republicans have had every chance to fix things while they controlled everything.

The Republicans control nothing. The Dems can pass this bill if they all voted for it.

But, they aren't ALL behind it.

Some of these Dems are looking at November. Is that the only reason these Dems are saying No?

If it was all split by party, I'd agree that this is just a partisan vote. But it is not.

There are Dems against it and I fail to see that it is solely for November.

I still think there may only be a few that have read it as thoroughly as they did the NIE. Which means they haven't a clue.

There are Dems against it and I fail to see that it is solely for November.

For some reason, it is difficult for Republicans to understand not voting the party line every time.

255 need 217.

That's still 38 Dems who still vote NO.

Are they Republicans in disguise?
What do they see?

#267 | Posted by Petrous

A majority of registered Republican constituents.

#268 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

I think that some of them are also principally opposed because this is NOT legislation for a single payer system, as should have been an original starting point for debate of HCR.

The first time I can recall hearing a figure for what tort reform would save was during the summit at Blair House a couple weeks ago.

Guess how much out of an annual multi trillion dollar health care system? $5 billion. That's it. That was their cure for fixing the health care system the past what, 20 years?

#280 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

Don't agree with their figure ----here's why---most of the protocols that have been developed for different symptom presentations have not necessarily been developed because it's "good medicine" but for protection from law suits. An example---let's say an individual (perpetual drunk) is brought into an E.R. (homeless, found on the street, unable to arouse) by the police---that person may be brought in 3-4 times a month---imagine this scenario being played out all over the U.S. in major metropolitan areas----because of lack of arousal and no good history of a possible fall/assault and possible head injury, guess what's in the diagnostic algorithm---that's right, an automatic C-scan of the skull---you know how expensive those are----so imagine how many of these cases are seen each year---and you can apply this to many other diagnoses. Cookbook medicine to avoid lawsuits.

For some reason, it is difficult for Republicans to understand not voting the party line every time.

#286 | Posted by silver_ironist

It brings up a question. How can a group that so rarely deviates from the black and white of their party's beliefs have any reasoned or reasonable debate about a subject? Is it any wonder that there is such a drought of original ideas and thought from the pubbies?

Could there be any Republicans that agree with those Democrats that are voting No?

Cookbook medicine to avoid lawsuits.

When did "Fuck him, he's just a drunk" get put in the Hippocratic Oath?

On the other hand, any doctor who can't differentially diagnose alcohol intoxication from a head injury without a CT needs a new career.

#288 | Posted by matsop

At the Blair House summit Obama told Coburn point blank he's willing to get with Coburn and look at how problems can be addressed. Obama is not anti-tort reform at all. He acknowledged the problems inherent with over testing because of fear and exorbitant malpractice insurance rates for specialties. Don't be surprised if you see that addressed in the coming months. He and Coburn had a meeting of the minds after Coburn went into detail about malpractice issues.

Damn, it takes a long time for 433 (couple dead or gone) representatives to talk. Makes ya think there's a videographer taping clips they can use for everyone's fall campaigns or something

After November, the democrats will no longer control the house and senate and Obama will be a lame duck...as opposed to a stupid fuck!

After November, the democrats will no longer control the house and senate and Obama will be a lame duck...as opposed to a stupid fuck!

#294 | Posted by Beachbuzz

With this shame going on in Washington today, I feel the same as I felt on 9/11 and when Bush Invaded Iraq.

I guess small business will not be such a vital part of the American economy anymore.

The country will be run by large corporations and unions.

Too bad. Innovation is going overseas...

Yup. What was stopping them from tort reform during the eight years Bush was president?

#273 | Posted by rcade at 2010-03-21 07:29 PM | Reply | Flag:

As I recall, democrats and lawyers.

There will be a price to pay in November. Someone needs to buy an ad in major papers and say here is the jobs lost this week thank to and list the name of the local polit who voted for the bill

Trial lawyers and their lobbying groups back Democrats, not Republicans. If Republicans wanted tort reform, they had the opportunity to pass it.

#279 | Posted by rcade at 2010-03-21 07:38 PM | Reply | Flag:

See, you already knew the answer to your own question. The exception being the last sentence.

Cookbook medicine to avoid lawsuits.

When did "Fuck him, he's just a drunk" get put in the Hippocratic Oath?

On the other hand, any doctor who can't differentially diagnose alcohol intoxication from a head injury without a CT needs a new career.

#291 | Posted by silver_ironist

2 points for silver:

1 Where in the said presentation was there anything about the "----him, he's just a drunk" thought process----You been drinking tonight?---awfully defensive

2 Obviously, inebriation is present---it doesn't matter o ye of little knowledge---there can still be a head injury present which better be picked up or you're going to be held liable and accountable.

With this shame going on in Washington today, I feel the same as I felt on 9/11
-Eddie

Looks like another dumbfuck has been dipping into the kool-aid early tonight.

As it's such a small part of the problem, tort reform can be addressed anytime, as a separate issue.

#288 | Posted by matsop

At the Blair House summit Obama told Coburn point blank he's willing to get with Coburn and look at how problems can be addressed. Obama is not anti-tort reform at all. He acknowledged the problems inherent with over testing because of fear and exorbitant malpractice insurance rates for specialties. Don't be surprised if you see that addressed in the coming months. He and Coburn had a meeting of the minds after Coburn went into detail about malpractice issues.

#292 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

I hope this is true and not just blowing smoke because this bill may put even more financial pressure on some docs and when you're squeezed from the revenue side (even more) and expense side (medical malpractice) you're going to see a mass exodus of those who financially are capable and able to work in the non-clinical side of medicine.

I think that some of them are also principally opposed because this is NOT legislation for a single payer system, as should have been an original starting point for debate of HCR.

#287 | Posted by Whatsleft

I kind of learned about obscure Reps over the last couple weeks on sites that listed yes, no, and undecided Democrats. A couple sites explained their districts ala 'McCain won 56-44%' and stuff like that. Almost all the holdouts are from districts McCain carried by a pretty good margin in 2008.

Alan Grayson (D) has a 3 page bill to immediately open up Medicare for anyone who wants to buy in. He has over 60 co-sponsors in only a week. We'll see what happens with that. Might be promising.

(Oh, boy. Michelle Bachmann's on deck. Bet she was an easy lay back in the day)

The country is run by large corporations.

#296 | Posted by Eddie

There eddie, I fixed that post so that it has a small amount of truth.

As it's such a small part of the problem, tort reform can be addressed anytime, as a separate issue.

#302 | Posted by Whatsleft

Not being in medicine it's not the "small part of the problem" that you think. Been in medicine for years and have watched the problem of "defensive medicine"----maybe it's a perception problem on the part of some docs but it's a real cost issue.

I thought the vote would be at 2 pm. Man, either I'm living in an Einstein E=MC2 world or it's 8:04 pm

#306 | Posted by matsop

Every reasonable estimate I've ever seen except for yours says that it's a small problem.

It is certainly pure speculation that doctors will pass any savings from tort reform on to the consumer.

Heard they are using the commerce clause to justify forcing people to buy insurance. The commerce clause has been stretched more than a hooker's twat. But even so, this is a stretch that has GOT to hurt.

Looks like another dumbfuck has been dipping into the kool-aid early tonight.

#301 | Posted by ZombieHunter

What koolaide?

I watched the debates!

I watched Republicans get up there and warn that taxes would be going way up to pay for this NEEDLESS bill.

I Hate Democrats!

They are responsible for the lack of opportunity in the United States and they are ADMITTING IT!!!

What fucking koolaide?

Why the fuck am I having to pay for 32 million Americans who WON'T buy their kids health care, yet they have to drive a new car?

What? Has everyone lost their fucking minds?

This is insane! The war was insane!!

That's it. That was their cure for fixing the health care system the past what, 20 years?

#280 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

Repubs passed HSA's and that ridiculous drug Part D program.

The country is run by large corporations.

#296 | Posted by Eddie

There eddie, I fixed that post so that it has a small amount of truth.

#305 | Posted by Whatsleft

Ignorance is why we are in this mess.

Most of the new jobs in this country are from small business.

Small business is going away, smart guy.

You do the math.

And the HC bill does not do a damn thing about COSTS!

And the HC bill does not do a damn thing about COSTS!

#313 | Posted by MURPHY

That's right. The costs will continue to rise.

WHERE'S THE REFORM?

Pence is kicking some butt...

While it won't happen, I would LOVE to see every person who voted for this booted out of office the next time they come up for election.

[well, prefer to see them in jail for theft, conversion, etc. But out on their butts is an acceptable 3rd place choice]

And the HC bill does not do a damn thing about COSTS!

#313 | Posted by MURPHY

And that my friends was one of the major reasons for "REFORM". Oh, how they lie to the folks back home----love how they label a bill to get buyin and then do the "rope a dope" to get what they're really going after---and in this case it's an increase in taxes for the general budget and not for healhcare.

The majority of the country said NO to the war

And the majority of the country are saying NO to THIS bill.

I am saying yes yes yes to this bill and Obama listened!!!

And the majority of the country are saying NO to THIS bill.

Half the opposition to the bill is from people who want it to do more.

#303 | Posted by matsop

They had a good 15-20 exchange about it at Blair House. Really, Obama gets it. Look for it to happen in the near future.

Obama and Obamacare is a BLESSING for America. Average Americans have not been this engaged in politics or the political process in 100 years. Conservatives have been energized by this power grab. The Progressives on the left have made a huge miscalculation here. They will start to feel the backlash this November and will continue to feel it for decades. It will be men like myself who restore this nation to greatness, young, informed, motivated, combat veterans!!!

God Bless America and Live Free or Die!!!

If the Republicans call it "this flawed health care bill" 200 times, God will end death and sickness forever!

Small business is going away, smart guy.

Ridiculous hyperbole tends to undermine rather than support ones arguments.

2 points for silver:

I thought you would attack one or the other but not both.

The doctor should practice medicine to the best of his or her ability in line with standards of treatment.

Ordering a CT in your theoretical instance would be appropriate if closed trauma was suspected independent of any liability concerns.

During the years I worked in EDs I saw way more stuff slide than I saw defensive practice, due to the workload.

And the majority of the country are saying NO to THIS bill.

Half the opposition to the bill is from people who want it to do more.

#320 | Posted by rcade

20% is not half.

More than half want a better solution to reform.

Small business will survive--they will drop their employees health care and they will pay the fine.

Because it's cheaper to pay the fine that the premiums--which are going up.

Now for owner/operators who don't pay the premiums--they get taxed by the IRS and then jailed if they don't pay that.

Pelosi agreed jail was a possibility.

You know, there IS bipartisan agreement on this Health Care Bill.

That agreement is that this bill is the WRONG way to go about it.

I am saying yes yes yes to this bill and Obama listened!!!

#319 | Posted by jackass

Obama is supposed to "listen" to the majority and do the will of the people.

That ain't happening.

If the Republicans call it "this flawed health care bill" 200 times, God will end death and sickness forever!

#323 | Posted by rcade

I think they already surpassed that number!

It will be men like myself who restore this nation to greatness, young, informed, motivated, combat veterans!!!

God Bless America and Live Free or Die!!!

#322 | Posted by JANO275

I have never in my 50 years seen so many young Conservatives!

Obey is in charge, he will not fools lightly.

I have never in my 50 years seen so many young Conservatives!

Odd. I read it as parody. The other option is delusional megalomania. Either way, glad you found a new friend.

Opps that should have read .."he will not tolerate fools lightly."

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
Thomas Jefferson

The time might be getting close.

"Opps that should have read .."he will not tolerate fools lightly.""

"Opps", indeed.

The time might be getting close.

Please, elucidate. What are your intentions?

Odd. I read it as parody. The other option is delusional megalomania. Either way, glad you found a new friend.

#333 | Posted by YAV

What?

The guy displays an observation that most Americans see and you think it means something else?

No, it means that the Progressives underestimated that mainstream Americans would be going their way.

They depise the Obama/Pelosi/Reid takeover of the healthcare Reform and they are letting them know.

However, the Obama/Pelosi/Reid team are so arrogant that they would rather cause the economy to stagnate while they push through their little pet project and then watch small business change their business plans to hire LESS employees.

BTW, less employees means more unemployment.

Are the Dems really that stupid? Do they really not get it? I simply won't believe that.

The time might be getting close.

#335 | Posted by 1libertarian

Are you going to cry?

Rep. Boehner sounds like a preacher at a revival.

Rep. Boehner sounds like a preacher at a revival.

He sounds as sincere, too. The hypocrisy is oozing out of his pores.

On the other hand, Boehner's managed to put forth a defining moment that will be used against Republicans over and over again for years.

I am saying yes yes yes to this bill and Obama listened!!!

#319 | Posted by jackass

Jackass, you're right; Obama has been listening to Jackasses.

The time might be getting close.

#335 | Posted by 1libertarian

Are you going to cry?

#339 | Posted by jackass

No, I think it's what Joe Biden was talking about that Obama would be tested...

Biden probably has enough brain cells left to realize that he was taking a job working for a radical.

Let's see. A black man getting back a whitey by pushing a radical Socialist Agenda...

Are you fucking kidding me?

The time might be getting close, jackass.

How old are you jackass? You're about 25 and haven't finished college yet. Not married.

You haven't the wisdom to understand.

How the hell did that air head ever become speaker of the house? A true valley girl.

On the other hand, Boehner's managed to put forth a defining moment that will be used against Republicans over and over again for years.

#342 | Posted by YAV

I can't see how. Republicans always have this knack for doing the will of their constituencies.

With that in mind, you were saying?

LOL!!!

Funny how they just don't get it!

Jackass, you're right; Obama has been listening to Jackasses.

#343 | Posted by matsop

Ouch!

I am truly not worthy.

More than half want a better solution to reform.

Those people should be angry at Republicans for choosing obstructionism over coming up with their own plan and peeling off moderate Democrats.

Obama and Obamacare is a BLESSING for America. Average Americans have not been this engaged in politics or the political process in 100 years. Conservatives have been energized by this power grab. The Progressives on the left have made a huge miscalculation here. They will start to feel the backlash this November and will continue to feel it for decades. It will be men like myself who restore this nation to greatness, young, informed, motivated, combat veterans!!!

God Bless America and Live Free or Die!!!

#322 | Posted by JANO275

Hilarious. Once the bill passes the corporate sponsors of the teabaggers will cut their losses and take their money elsewhere, and poof! there will go this new conservative 'movement'.
This is not the first time conservatives and the GOP have claimed that a bill would end America in some form. They said the same thing when democrats outlawed child labor, started social security, passed the civil rights act and passed medicare. I think I'll reluctantly take my chances with the bill. This bill is essentially what Romney set up in Massachusetts and what republicans were proposing when Clinton was in office in the 90's. There is nothing radical about this bill and that is it's primary flaw: it still leaves the private insurance parasite sucking on the blood of the American economy.
This bill and all the theater around it were about politics. It was about whether the GOP would be able to neuter the Obama administration and the mandate they were given by the majority of Americans in '08. They came close, in no small part due to Obama himself, who seemed obsessed with gaining the approval of the GOP, even at the expense of his own base. He realized just in time that you cannot bargain in good faith with modern conservatives.
Now that the Democrats have this victory, they can move on to other issues, no doubt against the special interests that have funded the teabaggers.
Say goodbye to your Bush tax cuts!

He sounds as sincere, too. The hypocrisy is oozing out of his pores.

#341 | Posted by YAV

How so?

Or are you just saying that because it sounded good.

And aWaaaaaaaaaaay we go!

#349 | Posted by DARTHCHENEY

I have never read so much fear from a post before. Is this how you a rationalizing what's happening?

There is a groundswell of Americans trying to understand politics and most people are motivated because they think they are losing something.

If you own or work for a small business, part of your property will be taken by the Federal Government.

And aWaaaaaaaaaaay we go!

#351 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

AU,

If the bill passes, the Dems are fucked.

if the bill doesn't pass the Dems are fucked!

Obama/Pelosi are hoping it passes because they are fucked either way.

Funny, they get what they want, and we get to pay for it.

I'm mad, why aren't you?

Pelosi is what happens when the cartoon version of Mrs Howell and a Skeksis have a baby in a burning meth lab...

Republicans you will know defeat tonight!!!

Too bad.

The Republican plan will lower Health Insurance Premiums.

200 - 177 for

#349 | Posted by DARTHCHENEY

I heard someone who walked through the Teabag crowd today describe them as basically a bunch of middle aged Dukes of Hazzard fans who look like they're dressed for a vacation at a low rent resort ...

with a disproportionate amount wearing mullets.

Americans you will know defeat tonight!!!

#355 | Posted by jackass

There, fixed it for you, Jackass.

You know I'm right too.

That's what gets you!!!

More than half want a better solution to reform.

Some people are upset because they think the reform goes to far; others are upset because they don't think it goes far enough. I fall into the latter cateogory. I don't think there should be a mandate without a robust public option. Oh well. The politicans are putting the bust back into robust. Better something than nothing? I hope so, but I'm not sure. Time will tell, I guess.

I heard someone who walked through the Teabag crowd today describe them as basically a bunch of middle aged Dukes of Hazzard fans who look like they're dressed for a vacation at a low rent resort ...

with a disproportionate amount wearing mullets.

#358 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

I heard someone who walked through the Teabag crowd today describe them as basically a bunch of middle aged Dukes of Hazzard fans who look like they're dressed for a vacation at a low rent resort ...

with a disproportionate amount wearing mullets.

#358 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

Why are the Dems getting so desparate that they are lying so much!??!

Why? Because they know they're wrong!

They know that what they are doing is wrong...

So sad..

BINGO!!!!

216. Done.

216. Done.

Better something than nothing? I hope so, but I'm not sure. Time will tell, I guess.

#360 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday

This "Something" is a trophy for your Pelosi and Obama, nothing more!

It's a really bad piece of legislation that should have been rewritten with bi-partisan support.

Oops.

So they passed 3590....

Non-partisan, as expected

I only have one thing to say

YAY

I have been waiting for this for 30 years.

There is a groundswell of Americans trying to understand politics and most people are motivated because they think they are losing something.

If you own or work for a small business, part of your property will be taken by the Federal Government.

#352 | Posted by Eddie

Groundswell? That's funny! The fact that there are more than a dozen (but not much more) teabaggers protesting in front of Congress these last few days is a testament to the effectiveness of the Fox News led conservative echo-chamber for hire.
Most of these poor souls don't even know what's in the bill! They are no doubt the same kind of suckers who send their life savings to shady preachers to get on the fast lane to heaven. No doubt they also expect republicans to protect them from predatory corporations!

If you own or work for a small business, part of your property will be taken by the Federal Government.

#352 | Posted by Eddie

Really? Why stop there? Why not say they they'll take your property and redistribute it to undeserving hippies and welfare queens? I mean if you're going to make things up why not go all they way to the root nerve of conservative support.

Where are the dancing bananas, Rogers?

EDDIE

Obama made a special trip to the Capitol over a year ago to meet with the GOP and ask their help and support. They gave him the finger and told him he'd get zero votes or support.

The GOP never came up with anything resembling a 'plan' until the Senate had already passed its bill in December. Kind of late to be jumping on the train.

Obama tried. Several times. The GOP thought they'd just run against his plan (or, lack of one they hoped). Backfire.

I see the dancing bananas!

So....this next hurdle has been jumped.

I just wish the bill had a bit more bite.

It's still lacking, but I guess it's a first step.

GAL

Alan Grayson has a 3 page plan to open Medicare for all.

60 co-sponsors in just a week. It isn't over yet.

HALLELJAH!!!!

It's a really bad piece of legislation that should have been rewritten with bi-partisan support.

Coulda, shoulda, woulda. The Republicans had ample time to work on the bill, but they chose to play the fear card and trump up lies like death panels instead of working together with Obama and the Dems.

On to the Supreme Court....

Alan Grayson has a 3 page plan to open Medicare for all.

60 co-sponsors in just a week. It isn't over yet.

I think Medicare for all is probably a bridge too far at the moment, but I'd like to see a viable public option for folks to buy into. As far as I'm concerned, that day can't come too soon.

"The following users are currently suspended from posting: ELCIDCE90, SpokaneJim, Jak_Se_Mao, reinsurelaw, Rob_The_A_Hole, Tosser, Washboard"

Too bad...I bet they have a lot to say tonight.

Gotta love the bananas.

"The following users are currently suspended from posting: ELCIDCE90, SpokaneJim, Jak_Se_Mao, reinsurelaw, Rob_The_A_Hole, Tosser, Washboard

Too bad...I bet they have a lot to say tonight."

Never mind timbici/bigpun/stenwilly/
themaniscoming...

The following users are currently suspended from posting: ELCIDCE90, SpokaneJim, Jak_Se_Mao, reinsurelaw, Rob_The_A_Hole, Tosser, Washboard"

Too bad...I bet they have a lot to say tonight.

tune into to fucksnooze and you can get their responses verbatim--with some idiotic racist cracks thrown in for good measure

Coulda, shoulda, woulda. The Republicans had ample time to work on the bill, but they chose to play the fear card and trump up lies like death panels instead of working together with Obama and the Dems.

A 1000 chances. David Frum, former special assistant to Dubya and resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute has a column about just that.

"A huge part of the blame for today's disaster attaches to conservatives and Republicans ourselves.

At the beginning of this process we made a strategic decision: unlike, say, Democrats in 2001 when President Bush proposed his first tax cut, we would make no deal with the administration. No negotiations, no compromise, nothing. We were going for all the marbles. This would be Obama's Waterloo – just as healthcare was Clinton's in 1994."

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
Thomas Jefferson

The time might be getting close.

Nice. I tell you what: Pick a some states like TX and AL and secede from the Union. No need for a revolution; we'll let you go without a fight.

I think Medicare for all is probably a bridge too far at the moment

- "Obama can't possibley win in Iowa"
- "Obama can't beat Hillary"
- "No one will vote for a black guy"
- "America won't vote for a black guy"
- "The health care bill will be DOA"
- "the health care bill won't pass"
etc.

60 co-sponsors in a week is huge for Grayson. This might give it even more momentum. Talk is Dems are pretty excited about it since it's already set up and something that could be online in a matter of weeks.

This bill is a huge start. We aren't finished.

Nice to see you :-)

It's a really bad piece of legislation that should have been rewritten with bi-partisan support.

Coulda, shoulda, woulda. The Republicans had ample time to work on the bill, but they chose to play the fear card and trump up lies like death panels instead of working together with Obama and the Dems.

#377 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday

GOD DAMN IT!!!!

No they didn't!!!!

We all know this!

This is a bill from the Obama/Pelosi/Reid Team.

They didn't allow it.

Didn't you watch the debates? They so-called "meeting of the minds" circus that Obama called with the Republicans?

The Republicans told him point blank: START OVER!

He didn't listen, to his detriment.

And, now for a minority, like yourself, to tell me that we had our chance? BULLSHIT!!!

The Dems will lose so many more seats because of today, come November and I am very happy about that.

I am just pissed off at the sheer lying and defiance going on.

"Gotta love the bananas."

Definitely.

p.s. Fuck off, rtard loooooosers.

Sorry Gal_Tuesday, but you are so far behind in the news...

Coulda, shoulda, woulda. The Republicans had ample time to work on the bill, but they chose to play the fear card and trump up lies like death panels instead of working together with Obama and the Dems.

Exactly.

Repubs were interested in playing politics, not getting anything done.

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
Thomas Jefferson

The time might be getting close.

Who made that idiotic comment?

i384 | Posted by YAV

Thanks for the quote, Yav. Pretty much says it all.

"Little did we know in those heady days before the Mayan Apocalypse that Rogers Cadenhead's dancing bananna heralded both the beginning of a new socialist empire and the end of Quetzalcoatl's long slumber. Among those of us who survived the awakening of the vengeful Mayan god, few counted themselves as lucky to have escaped the merciful needle of Overlord Obama's Death Panels."

#386 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

AU, are you just playing us or are you really that desparate?

I can't tell.

GOD DAMN IT!!!!

No they didn't!!!!

We all know this!

This is a bill from the Obama/Pelosi/Reid Team.

They didn't allow it.

Didn't you watch the debates? They so-called "meeting of the minds" circus that Obama called with the Republicans?

The Republicans told him point blank: START OVER!

He didn't listen, to his detriment.

And, now for a minority, like yourself, to tell me that we had our chance? BULLSHIT!!!

The Dems will lose so many more seats because of today, come November and I am very happy about that.

I am just pissed off at the sheer lying and defiance going on.

Whenever Eddie says something, for some reason all I hear is this-

"The Dems will lose so many more seats because of today, come November and I am very happy about that."

And of course had the bill NOT passed you'd now be shitting your pants about the Democrats inevitable complete takeover in November?

Right?

Who made that idiotic comment?

Eddie. The same moron who denies marinating all twenty of his functioning brain cells in Glenn Beck-flavored kool aid.

A pyrrhic victory?

#394 | Posted by jpw

Truth hurts, don't it...

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

This shit just writes itself...

"The Dems will lose so many more seats because of today..."

I doubt that Eddie but we will see in November.

A pyrrhic victory?

#397 | Posted by matsop

Indeed. Obama fell on his sword.

Truth hurts, don't it...

Probably why Eddie avoids it at all costs.

Great day for those who have no insurance. Also I can put my daughter back on my plan and save a bucket load of money.
Thanks Dems!

Gal, my pleasure. It is always a joy to see a post by you. You may want to read that link. There's another gem in there that really nails the tea partiers and Fox myrmidons.