people hurt by this

OTHER ruggedly handsome workers in 'right to work' states on fixed incomes such as myslef.
HOW you say?
this money has to come from somewhere?

just another example of how rush may be on to something
obama and dems are PURPOSELY fucking the economy to get us all on board the GOVT EXPRESS to the third world.

Unfuckingbelievable!

This bill becomes increasingly unconstitutional and more and more corrupt with each passing day.

Union contracts are exempt from the tax for an additional 5 years???

We've seen corruption tied to this bill in a manner that vastly exceeds that of ANYTHING we saw from the Bush administration.

Oh, and what evil did medical device manufacturers commit to be targeted as a loser in this bill?

Every single person in the Democratic party at a federal level is complicit in this. Of the senate's 60 Democratic members, not one had even a modicum of a sense of fairness, decency and integrity to filibuster? Not one???

Every single Democrat and every single citizen who supports this attrocity is pure, unmitigated scum.

You can all go fuck yourselves.

"Every single Democrat and every single citizen who supports this attrocity is pure, unmitigated scum."

Now tell us how your really feel Jeff.

okay danni

those words may be a little harsh but the intent is and SHOULD Be even harsher.

and where is this coming from

rhom the ballet dancing chicago gangsta and his bro barry.
how can ANYONE even in MASS who isnt a union member and has this type of coverage that will be taxed FOURTY per cent...how can they possibily vote democrat on tuesday...

oh yeah
this will hurt them much more deeply than they could ever think.

and right before MASS election..I thought dems were the smartest politicians in the universe.

"Oh, and what evil did medical device manufacturers commit to be targeted as a loser in this bill?"

Just Harry's way of saying "fuck the disabled"...

Aren't many of the users of such devices on Medicare? So how do the gov't taxing itself make any sense?

Oh, and what evil did medical device manufacturers commit to be targeted as a loser in this bill?

earn a profit.

By trying to be bipartisan, then trying to have a public option, then trying for less and less and less....instead of just passing Medicare Part E....they have created a probable political disaster.
Had they just passed Medicare Part E there would have been screaming but then America would have realized the benefits, the cost savings, that it would make Medicare solvent....it would have been a political bonanza.

I was indicating that during my time in that industry, 80% of our DME and prosthetic/orthotic business was T18 and T19... Isn't it redundant for healthcare bill to be financed by taxing the state and federal governments? Or, if their rates go up, taxing the poor, aged and disabled.

And all that to then give breaks to the unions? I guess O'bama was worried about them going on a strike around Nov. 2012?

Isn't there this little passage in the constitution about levying taxes equitably amoung the states? How is discrimination between right to work and no-rights to work equitable?

??????

Every single Democrat and every single citizen who supports this attrocity is pure, unmitigated scum.
You can all go fuck yourselves.
Posted by JeffJ at 2010-01-15 03:18 PM

Sounds just like your average Rwandan radio program circa 1994.

Part E, lovely panacea there... Too bads its only hypothetical.

Don't worry though, the disaster this creates may pave the way for your single payor orgasms.

Every single Democrat and every single citizen who supports this attrocity is pure, unmitigated scum.

You can all go fuck yourselves.

#2 | Posted by JeffJ

Jeff is doing his MiniMao routine. In fact he's going to have a snarl tattooed to his face to complete his Pinochet impersonation.

ah dont jump on danni too much.
you can tell by her words that she isnt crazy about this shit either.

AND HAG
so how many rwandan radio programs in 1994 did you listen to...

#12 | Posted by nullifidian

Am I to assume you support these shenanigans?

how many insurance plans provided to union workers are considered "high end" anyway?

how many insurance plans provided to union workers are considered "high end" anyway?

If I am not mistaken, all auto-industry union contracts contain 'high end' insurance plans.

Almost ALL union jobs have high-end plans, if not, the union lobby wouldn't have opposed the tax in the first place.

This is a great reason for Toyota and Nissan to step up their marketing. Toyota has been looking for a way to take market share from Ford and GM in Pickup trucks. They should start an anti-union marketing campaign in Texas. It might work.

The cap is now approx $24k on the "cadillac" plans, I would imagine that the UAW plans are self funded and not fully insured, allowing the contributing companies to skim off some of the premium back into the till.

These plans are also excempt from state insurance regulations per ERISA and, therefore, can deny things that fully insured plans would pay for.

Dealing with DME and prosthetics, we often found that union self funded insurance were some of the most expensive yet shittiest plans.

I love the fact that the Dems closed off their debates to the cameras. Now, everything's going to come out at once, everyone is going to hate the final product, and blame the fact that nobody was allowed to weigh in on the thing for the reason.

The Dems' public relations antennae are seriously FUBAR these days. It's beautiful to watch.

I do find it hard to believe they aren't doing some consumer testing (private polling) of their talking points - at least with big labor.

I think this 'union mess' is funny. It shows that Obama/Biden campaign was all LIES. Transparency at its best. Behind closed doors, no cameras and helping us (to your property) to help you (incur way more debt). HAHAHAHAHA

Problem being this 'healthcare reform' bill, if passed, WILL harm all Americans and help to push the "budget" over the cliff. And then welcome to third world America.

Had they just passed Medicare Part E there would have been screaming but then America would have realized the benefits, the cost savings, that it would make Medicare solvent....it would have been a political bonanza.
#8 | POSTED BY DANNI AT 2010-01-15 03:40 PM | REPLY | FLAG: Failed grade school Arithmetic 101

Duh. Medicare is beyond any chance of being made solvent. Default is inevitable. It's only a question of how and when.

Almost ALL union jobs have high-end plans, if not, the union lobby wouldn't have opposed the tax in the first place.
#16 | POSTED BY JEFF

Major union layoffs to come in both the private and public sector. Fuck em.

I will be going to Whole Foods today for the first time this morning. I will no longer be shopping at Shoprite, Pathmark, or A&P because they are all unionized. Any American that has to subsidize the health care of unions should not buy the products they manufacture, shop at the stores they work at. Don't be friendly to them.Don't hire contractors that are union members. Bring down the unions until they pay their share. They are free loaders

I have friends who are in Unions that claim they don't pay into Social Security, or Medicare.

So this is not a shocker.

That said some health care economists are saying that the Cadillac plans play a role in driving up medical inflation, so taxing them will encourage people to opt out of those plans, and seek ones where you pay more out of pocket.

So excluding Unions defeats the purpose.

Let me get this straight:

This Health Care bill is a great but Unions are being excluded from part of the bill.

Yea Right, I think we were just sold the Brooklyn Bridge.

how many people is obama going to have to pay off in order for this unwanted healthcare bill to fly?

This is simply a function of government arbitrarily picking winners and losers and in the instance of the Democrats, they reward failure and punish success in a typical class-warfare manner.

I know a lot of liberals despise Ayn Rand, but what was satirized in Atlas Shrugged is looking awfully familiar at the moment. Let me be clear, this doesn't just apply to this health care bill, it is part and parcel of every aspect of Obama's economic meddling.

This is an easy fix. We can start our own union.

The HC bill is supposed to be so great--why all the corrupt deals behind closed doors?

We are living Atlas right now Jeff...

mur, I thought we were headded there when I first read the book back in the 60s.

I have always said, the difference in the two parties was the speed in which we were going there.

So why is it that the reason this monstrosity is needed is medical bills that are given to people who are either not covered or are under covered cause billions and billions of Americans to file for bankruptcy after they lose everything.

BUT...we want to TAX insurance plans that pay for high end medical expenses so more people will be hurt economically or consider being under insured so that they may have to pay out of pocket medical expenses and face bankruptcy.

It seems democrat logic - spread the misery, increase the cost, increase the risk. Have I missed anything?

I have always said, the difference in the two parties was the speed in which we were going there.

#31 | Posted by Sniper at 2010-01-16 05:51 PM | Reply | Flag:

+1 Sniper

I'm not even going to post on this subject since I might say words I haven't said in years and which I refuse to say on the DR.

Why is it that in order to get any one to support this mess they have to be given an exemption?

Can't be that great now can it?

What happened to equal protection under the law?

I find this parsing and giving certain groups such as government workers and Congress, who already have the best benefits, an exclusion from the taxes that we in the private sector will pay as outrageous.

This whole health bill is written for special interests, and to give Democrats a feather in their cap, but is not for all Americans.

It should have been simple. One payer, one basic plan that cover most situations, subsidized by beneficiaries and taxes from the greedy elite such as Wall Street. There could be options that could be purchased that would provide enhancements to the basic plan. Every user (medicare and otherwise) should be required to pay a $50 co payment as a deterrent to frivolous office visits.

How's that "hopie/changie thing working out for ya??

The Dems' slither behind closed doors and pander to the union thugs while the honest, hardworking taxpayers get mocked, abused and taken advantage of.

I pray that our friends in the great state of Mass start the wave of real change this Tuesday and give the first "shot across the bow."

For this Congress and this administration, it is apparent that some citizens are more equal than others, depending on whether they support the Democrat Party or have a "D" after their name.

Just a thought: Didn't our forefathers flee Europe to escape this Noblesse Oblige and such horrors as Debtors prisons for those who can't pay for healthcare as we see in this Health plan coming out of Congress? Didn't they flee having the elite control the masses, one class over another?

How any of this can be Constitutional is beyond me.

How any of this can be Constitutional is beyond me.

#39 | Posted by Kissntell

It isn't, neo-marxist only believe in their own rules and don't care about the constitution.

This plan is so great ... that everyone is negotiating their way OUT of it !! How funny, the plan is good enough for US, but not good enough for Democrat special interests like the Unions and Federal Employees ...

Beck is sounding more and more correct ... this isn't about Health Care, its about power, money and control ...

Since I have seen this twice...the Unions aren't negotiating their way out of the plan. They still get the benefit...THEY JUDT DON'T HAVE TO PAY THE TAXES that everyone else does. Must be nice to get something for nothing while someone else pays the tab. Thy name is democrat.

"its about power, money and control ..."

What other motivation does government have, if not to self justify it's own existance while securing the prosperity of the political elite.

They are the new royalty (i.e. Kennedy) and we are but mere serfs meant to feed the holy cow of Congress.

Lets hope the House amps up the resistance to this shit.

I think this is the first time in history the minority gets what they want while the majority is firmly against this stinky fish of a bill. You can hope all you want to but the only change coming is what's left in your paycheck after Obama finishes raping your wallet.

Lonnie

Barack Obama, 2008 campaign ad:

"Apparently, Senator McCain doesn't think it's enough that your health premiums have doubled. He thinks you should have to pay taxes on them, too."

Baucus is also weighing a tax based on the value of health care benefits that exceed a yet-to-be determined cap. A tax on benefits that exceed the cap by a mere $3,000 could amount to $750 in taxes annually for a worker who earns as little as $34,000, say experts.

But those union members serving under collective bargaining agreements would not be subjected to the tax, according to proposals under discussion.

* * * *

I thought Big O said that nobody earning less than $250,000 would be subject to a tax increase?

I love it. We elected these dumbasses, now the bill is in the mail. Most Americans will be paying, alot. The ones that voted for Obama, but who didn't send him a campaign check, will be hurt the most. And that's justice.

"Every single Democrat and every single citizen who supports this attrocity is pure, unmitigated scum."
Now tell us how your really feel Jeff.

#3 | POSTED BY DANNI

that is his "win the hearts and minds campaign"
screed.

Quit complaining and just bend over .. unless you're a Democrat Special interest.

This plan is good enough for ALL the people .. except members of Congress passing the bill, their staff, THEIR families all Federal Workers, Teachers, SEIU Members, Teamsters, Auto-Workers Unions, Machinists Unions .. all other Unions and people around politics putting this in place.

This is a corrupt agreement, by corrupt people and a corrupt administration.

We are all equal.

Some are more equal then others.

Obama the great black hope!

It's so good for the country that an overwhelming majority of those who support it either think they won't be affected by it personally or want a bribe or an exemption from it to support it.

Hope and Change...LOL!

We are living Atlas Shruged and we are 3/4 the way through.

Forcing the people to buy something is unconstitutional, period!

It's kind of like paying for protection from a local thug

Remember when Obama said this?

Forcing the people to buy something is unconstitutional, period!

It's kind of like paying for protection from a local thug

#53 | Posted by bph320

And guess what, 19 states are already lining up to challenge that issue if it's in the bill--Aaaaah, state rights are on the way back.

Remember when Obama said this?

volokh.com

But oh by the way, we will call it Cadillac and righteously tax the fuck out of it.

#54 | Posted by boojiboy

Oh, the web of lies that men weave.