Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Tuesday, January 05, 2010

Dr. Shiv Chopra was a drug company insider, and also worked for what is now Health Canada -- the Canadian equivalent of the FDA. He is uniquely qualified to explain why no flu vaccine has ever worked, and that swine flu and avian flu are nothing more than hoaxes.

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Zombie and JPW would be wise to check into unemployment benefits.

lol I hope not ~ I love Zombie's comments in general

I've never had a flu vaccine. And I've only had the flu once in my life, about 20 years ago.

I will ask this question again because people are afraid to answer it. How many people do you know that has had the swine flu? I know none.

Does anyone on here know of one single regular-health person that has had swine flu this year?

Does anyone on here know of one single regular-health person that has had swine flu this year?

#3 | Posted by Lipzoidial

Nope.

Zombie and JPW would be wise to check into unemployment benefits.

AAAAHHHHAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA that shit is the typical crap expected from Quackola.com. It's too bad you're too big of a dipshit to see it.

I will ask this question again because people are afraid to answer it. How many people do you know that has had the swine flu? I know none.

People have answered that on several threads that I can vaguely remember. I know of at least two in the real world I know and one or two people here on the DR that had it (don't remember who exactly).

Just because you don't know anyone doesn't mean shit. You realize anecdotes don't count as evidence, right?

#3

My next door neighbor had it, the child of a co worker of hers had it as well.

How could I forget...one of my daughters teachers from high school had it and died from complications of it.

You realize anecdotes don't count as evidence, right?

#5 | Posted by jpw

You realize this is a blog site and not a court of law, right?

(snark off) Seriously, I only ask because I want to know why the whole country and every news cast and every gov't agency and every nuerotic nelly was so obsessed with making everyone afraid.

The news casts and neurotic nellys I can agree with.

However, what government organization was trying to make you afraid of H1N1?

shivchopra.com

As usual you break the most important rule, Bani.

Don't believe doctors who have their own "drX.com" sites. They're salesmen, nothing more.

"My only hope is that the big Lebowski kills me before the Germans can cut my dick off and vaccinate me against swine flu."
- The Anti Vaxxers

"The Men Who Stare at Goats" quote

Larry Hooper: [from trailer] Lieutenant Colonel Django used funds from the project's black budget to procure prostitutes...
"aka big Lebowski" Bill Django: That's a lie!
Larry Hooper: ...and to get drugs for himself and his men.
"aka big Lebowski" Bill Django: That... well, the hooker thing is definitely a lie.

thebovine.wordpress.com

Read this letter from the purported "expert" from Quackola.com.

He doesn't have a clue what he's talking about. His numbered points are appallingly wrong (especially coming from a microbiologist) or misrepresented.

Yet L_Rcocksucker et al lap it right up...

FF #10 as usual

Is swine flu really a devastating pandemic that may wipe out large numbers of people? Are you doing yourself disservice by not getting the vaccine? According to Dr. Chopra, no and no way.

He states:

"No flu vaccine has ever worked. Swine flu, we don't even know there is such a thing. It's a misnomer. Avian [bird] flu, these are all made-up things. The whole thing is a hoax. It has been for the last 10 years. First they started with the avian flu, and then swine flu."

For those of you who don't remember, the bird flu epidemic -- predicted to kill some 2 million Americans -- turned out to be a whole lot of hot air, and not much else. This is why I wrote the book The Great Bird Flu Hoax.

Dr. Chopra was really one of the earliest advocates to warn that the bird flu was a hoax, and he explains that nobody really knows to this day what all of the major influenza epidemics of the past really were -- including the 1918 flu epidemic.

"How come they never talked about this influenza in India? We never heard of it. I never heard of it. Remember, this swine flu at that time was originally called Spanish flu, and the Spanish called it French flu because the two countries were on the opposite sides of the war. And then eventually they settled on swine flu. Again, nobody knew if that was really swine flu because we didn't know how to isolate a virus at that time," Dr. Chopra says.

"There were no tissue cultures and the viruses didn't grow outside living cells. We know a lot of people died; exactly what they died of, it could be swine flu, the virus, or pneumonia. We didn't have any antibiotics at that time. So complications may have killed them. It's even possible as some people say it was: with influenza you get fairly high fever, with some flu you get higher fever.

The aspirin at the time was a thing to reduce your body temperature. People say too much aspirin -- there were no controls, we didn't know how aspirin really worked and what damage it did. Some people may have died from internal bleeding, by taking too much aspirin and trying to bring the temperature down," he continues.

I doubt that it matters that this came from Mercola. I've been pessimistic about the danger from the swine flu. It didn't seem to reach the velocity of other flu outbreaks and it seemed that older people had a resistance to it. I think for a flu to be real serious there can't be a group of people with an apparent resistance to it.

So far JPW has attacked the messengers Dr Mercola, Bani as well as myself. Then later he makes feeble attempt to attack the actual purveyor of the message by stating 'Don't believe doctors who have their own "drX.com" sites. They're salesmen, nothing more.'

Apparently the mighty JPW cannot argue the devastating points made. He has made no attempt to do so. Instead, he focuses on the "easier" arguments by Lipz and others. Very transparent tactics of one who is defeated.

News to JPW. You're even worse than a salesman. Your a blind apparatchik of the ultra-corrupt big pharma. There'd be more honor in just saying nothing rather than your continued game of sharades.

Apparently the mighty JPW cannot argue the devastating points made. He has made no attempt to do so. Instead, he focuses on the "easier" arguments by Lipz and others. Very transparent tactics of one who is defeated.

Or one who is still at work at goes for the low hanging fruit to amuse himself during the occasional few minutes at his desk.

Patience, L_Rcocksucker, patience. I'm getting to the good part (haven't finished listening to the interview yet, which is only making the joke funnier and me more of a skeptical of the Canadian healthcare system if this assclown was able to maintain his job for all those years).

Your a blind apparatchik of the ultra-corrupt big pharma. There'd be more honor in just saying nothing rather than your continued game of sharades.

You and apparatchik again. Did someone learn a new word? LOL

I say plenty, you're just too ignorant to understand why it's significant.

His numbered points are appallingly wrong (especially coming from a microbiologist) or misrepresented.

Some gems from "Dr." Chopra:

"no foreign protein can be absorbed into the blood stream unless it is digested in the alimentary canal into its basic amino acids"

"it is these amino acids which, being absorbed into the blood stream, are reconstituted into one's own proteins and it is these proteins which distinguishes every being of existence into self and non-self"

"auto-immune conditions like autism"

My god. Did this guy get his degree in a crackerjack box?

I think for a flu to be real serious there can't be a group of people with an apparent resistance to it.

Any flu is serious. It's a huge killer. Besides, any emerging virus that rockets around the world in a matter of weeks a good measure of attention and respect.

India apparently...see his reference above to the Artic Flu of 1918?

Any flu is serious. It's a huge killer. Besides, any emerging virus that rockets around the world in a matter of weeks a good measure of attention and respect.

#20 | Posted by ZombieHunter

especially x=filed styled man made ones as suggested by the saleperson:>)

Bani, how much cough syrup have you had tonight?

First, no one is manufacturing influenza. That's batshit insane. Second, India was absolutely devastated by the 1918 pandemic. Chopra is lying through his teeth because he has a book to sell. A mention of the death toll in India.

You need to educate yourself - attempt to understand how a pathogen interacts with individual host as well as host populations - before you start shilling for the internet quack du jour. Same goes for LR.

"You need to educate yourself - attempt to understand how a pathogen interacts with individual host as well as host populations - before you start shilling for the internet quack du jour. Same goes for LR."

so bright & yet so dumb in your blind spot...but I love you anyway

ps I don't do coughsyrup...not for 40 years perhaps ~ you 30 yet?

so bright & yet so dumb in your blind spot...but I love you anyway

You are a strange fellow, I will say that. You remind me of one of my old friends. Bright guy, but he went off the deep end.

I don't do coughsyrup...not for 40 years perhaps

That's a good thing. In high school I saw a "robo-tripper" laugh his ass off after getting slugged in the nuts... all the while he was babbling about the collective consciousness of humanity being contained on TV satellites. Some of the things I read from the anti-vaxxers remind me of that meandering, quasi-schizophrenic rant.

~ you 30 yet?

No.

What, Contrarian, no other keen insights to add?

Chopra is lying through his teeth because he has a book to sell.

Or he is stupid and disingenuous enough to think that since he hasn't heard about it it must not have happened and therefore he shouldn't bother looking in to it.

Either way, it's pretty bad. I don't understand how a microbiologist could honestly believe some of this stuff.

The insanity is on par with a mechanic telling you that you that you don't need to put oil in your car.

What, Contrarian, no other keen insights to add?

He needs to wait until the Illuminati satellite passes over the horizon, otherwise they would triangulate his position and vaporize him using some sort of freedom-hating orbital death ray.

Apparently the mighty JPW cannot argue the devastating points made. He has made no attempt to do so.

Here we go dipshit.

"No flu vaccine has ever worked. Swine flu, we don't even know there is such a thing. It's a misnomer. Avian [bird] flu, these are all made-up things. The whole thing is a hoax. It has been for the last 10 years. First they started with the avian flu, and then swine flu."

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
aje.oxfordjournals.org

There's two articles from the top of the google search I did.

They clearly show flu vaccines work quite well.

As for not knowing if there is such a thing as swine flu, this guy is talking out his ass. We have isolated influenza viruses from several species including pigs and birds. We can then check for the presence of viral genes from swine or avian viruses in viruses isolated from humans and we do in fact find them.

"How come they never talked about this influenza in India? We never heard of it. I never heard of it.

If he hasn't heard of it then he's incompetent as shit as zombie provided a link with what I'm guessing was minimal effort.

And then eventually they settled on swine flu. Again, nobody knew if that was really swine flu because we didn't know how to isolate a virus at that time," Dr. Chopra says.

They did?

But we know what it was now. There is no general consensus as to the exact origin of the 1918 flu but the reverse engineered virus appears to be predominantly avian in origin.

All this aside, WTF does it have to do with the current H1N1 being a "hoax?"

The aspirin at the time was a thing to reduce your body temperature. People say too much aspirin -- there were no controls, we didn't know how aspirin really worked and what damage it did. Some people may have died from internal bleeding, by taking too much aspirin and trying to bring the temperature down," he continues.

LOL damn these bastards are really reaching. They died from such a massive aspirin overdose they bled to death internally? And the doctors at the time were too stupid to figure it out? LOfuckin'L.

How Did Vaccines Come to be Trusted?

Nothing under this heading remotely addresses what it says.

"What I'm saying categorically is that vaccines have never been tested. Vaccines other than smallpox have never been tested for safety or efficacy, as they should have been."

This is a complete fucking lie.

www.clinicaltrials.gov

Search all the viruses you want. Let me know what ones don't come up.

Zombie under 30! good there is plenty of time yet to find out new champions to challenge in your wisdom of youth.

Start with this fellow & report back if you feel inclined, too:>)

Julie Gerberding Primed Big Pharma's Pump with Flu and HPV Vaccines

Robert Scott Bell
vactruth.com
01/04/2010

(vactruth.com) The most recent in a long list of government bureaucrats to leave the public dole and take up the high-paying cause of Big Pharma is none other than former head of the CDC Julie Gerberding. One year and one day from the date of departure from the Taxpayer payroll, Ms. Gerberding takes the reins as president of the vaccine division of the principle descendant of I.G. Farben: Merck Pharmaceuticals.

vactruth.com

The revolving door between the Department of Health and Human Services and the pharmaceutical industrial complex is legend and it swings both ways. Current head of the FDA, Margaret Hamburg, served on the board of directors for Henry Schein, Inc., manufacturer of mercury dental amalgams, in between her stints with the Clinton and now Obama administrations. Therefore it should surprise no one that the FDA, despite mercury's known neurotoxicity, in 2009 ruled that mercury amalgams are really not so bad.

While Hamburg's return to the federal bureaucratic oligarchy has already paid dividends to the industry she left, Gerberding's departure should raise conflict-of-interest concerns for anyone wanting a CDC free of undue influence from Merck and other vaccine manufacturers.

A long time proponent of drug and vaccine intervention, Dr. Gerberding earned the nickname "Chicken Little" during her tenure at CDC for claiming that each successive flu season might be the one that puts the 1918 Spanish Influenza to shame. Yet there has always been a strange cognitive dissonance in her message.

"LOL damn these bastards are really reaching. They died from such a massive aspirin overdose they bled to death internally? And the doctors at the time were too stupid to figure it out? LOfuckin'L."

Secrets to Youth and Even More Over-the-Counter Natural Cures with Shane Ellison

"The Senate voted nature out of existence with its scheme to force everyone into a medical cage filled with anything you want as long as it's drugs, vaccines, ionizing radiation and surgery."

robertscottbell.blogspot.com

Happy New Belated Year:>)

The final segment is the best fucking part.

"Who is the Directorate General of the WHO to say that "I'm raising it to pandemic level #6?" Based on what? At the same time, from the same sources, we're receiving information that we think sooner or later, the virus is going to mutate. We don't know when but it is going to. How did they know that? How do they come to that conclusion?

LOL Yeah who the fuck is the head of the WHO to announce WHO decisions!?!?! What a fucking bitch!

It was based on the criteria that defines a pandemic.

www.who.int

That took a single google search and maybe 30 seconds. I guess it isn't a good think I'm not as qualified as Dr. dipshit at Quackola.com.

As for how did they know it would mutate? Because that's what RNA viruses do! For a microbiologist he seems rather ignorant of basic characteristics of RNA viruses, characteristics that make them the pesky bastards they are.

For the next two paragraphs I don't really know what he's driving at. I think he's taking issue with the fact that genome sequencing showed H1N1 to be a chimera of human, avian and swine influenza viruses but he doesn't offer any information on why that could or should be wrong.

And some people are being given nasal vaccine, so that means a live virus. If you're putting a drop in the nose like you put the drop of polio in the mouth, then those are the portals of entry that obviously mean this is a live virus. If it's a live virus, then you actually maybe creating a pandemic with whatever you manufactured in the laboratory. If it's a live virus then that's what could happen," he states.

Actually, it's considered beneficial for individuals to pass attenuated vaccine strains as it increases the impact of the vaccination program. And no, you're not going to get a pandemic of whats in the vaccine since whats in the vaccine is already what's causing the pandemic but in a significantly weaker form.

For real comedy, listen to the final two segments of the interview when dr bullshit gives his rendition of how vaccines work (or don't work in his words) and laugh at the hilarious bullshit coming from a supposed microbiologist's mouth. I couldn't even listen to it all because although funny to me, the fact that people might actually believe him was incredibly nauseating.

Influenza vaccine efficacy in young, healthy adults.
Grotto I, Mandel Y, Green MS, Varsano N, Gdalevich M, Ashkenazi I, Shemer J.

Medical Corps, Israel Defense Force, Tel-Aviv, Israel

Findings concerning influenza vaccine efficacy in young, healthy adults are inconsistent. A high incidence of influenza in the winter of 1995 provided an opportunity to study the efficacy of influenza vaccine among young, healthy military personnel.

really good sourze, JPW!

For real comedy...

#33 | Posted by jpw

read your posts!

Robert Scott Bell? A fucking radioshow host? Seriously?

It's actually kind of sad. Some people will listen to anyone regardless of credentials so long as they agree with them.

And then you question my source? LOL

really good sourze, JPW!

Why, because they're honest? *gasp*

Paste the rest of it.

(BTW what you did above is called cherry picking and is regarded as bad form)

read your posts!

Yeah, I find facts funny too.

What I find even funnier is you rebutting my posts (as hilarious as they are) with radio show hosts and people who obviously have not even read an undergraduate level immunology textbook.

Anywho, it's bed time.

Happy belated New Year to you too.

Yeah, I find facts funny too.

What I find even funnier is you rebutting my posts (as hilarious as they are) with radio show hosts and people who obviously have not even read an undergraduate level immunology textbook.

#37 | Posted by jpw

yeah, they couldn't possibly know more than you...lol

Wednesday, December 23, 2009
HIV Defendant Prevails Over Pharmaceutical Propaganda

For an industry that routinely spends billions settling criminal complaints and pushing deadly drugs to children and minorities, disinformation is a vital component of their marketing plans. Without this propaganda and the complicit media, Americans would know that infectious diseases (including HIV) are statistically irrelevant in the US, Europe, Australia and South Africa.

We would also know that millions of Americans are injured or killed each year by untested drugs, preventable medical errors, adverse drug reactions by the pharmaceutical industry's ongoing criminal behavior and systemic incompetence.

If the Media regularly reported these facts, taxpayers would not waste billions of dollars on the CDC, NIH, research centers and universities that market unproven cures for mythical dangers like H1N1, HIV, HPV and CO2.

Despite the propaganda, Christine Maggiore like her daughter and millions of other Americans died from an adverse drug reaction:

Christine suffered fatal renal failure caused by antibiotics, antiviral, and calcium received during the 9 days prior to her death.
So it's no surprise that, despite his considerable qualifications, the PharmaSluts have attacked Dr. Al-Bayati as unqualified, although few (if any) of his accusers have ever qualified in a real court to render evidence-based opinions. Not only does Dr. Al-Bayati routinely qualify as an expert in criminal matters throughout the US, but he routinely exposes flaws in medical evidence that would otherwise be used to convict innocent people.

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

(BTW what you did above is called cherry picking and is regarded as bad form)

#36 | Posted by jpw

so is swearing

Israel military personel does not strike me as a good sourze ~ sorry

How many people do you know that has had the swine flu?

Three diagnosed with it from work back in November. They each spent a week out of work and came back. Since then, no one else.

However, what government organization was trying to make you afraid of H1N1?

www.bloomberg.com

www.msnbc.msn.com

What affect do you think it has on people when their government declares an emergency?

How many people do you know that has had the swine flu? I know none.

I had several relatives in Dallas with confirmed cases, and others who were likely swine flu cases but did not get tested to confirm it. Most people who have gotten the flu the past several months in the U.S. contracted H1N1. The flu spread so well that it crowded out the seasonal flu.

... I want to know why the whole country and every news cast and every gov't agency and every nuerotic nelly was so obsessed with making everyone afraid.

Flu pandemics are serious. They have the potential to sicken and kill millions, given the right mix of contagiousness and potency. People who weren't afraid of this one weren't paying enough attention.

#18,26 | Posted by jpw at 2010-01-05 10:21 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'm getting to the good part (haven't finished listening to the interview yet

What, Contrarian, no other keen insights to add?

Why would I comment further. I'm too busy cracking up at your feeble replies. You have continued to attack the messengers. I'm still waiting for "the good part" in the sharades game!

#30 jpw

"No flu vaccine has ever worked. Swine flu, we don't even know there is such a thing. It's a misnomer. Avian [bird] flu, these are all made-up things. The whole thing is a hoax....

There's two articles from the top of the google search I did.

What? Top Google search? For the most basic question you need to do a Google popularity search? That makes it science by consensus. Your as much of a genius as Al Gore who must modify the scientific results to get the desired conclusion.

#33 jpw
It was based on the criteria that defines a pandemic.

What a feeble response. You've got a short convenient memory. The very definition of a pandemic was changed in order to fraudulently make it a pandemic. That's what is meant when asked 'Under what criteria'. Are you going to ask for a Link like usual? It's MSM retard.

#36 | Posted by jpw at 2010-01-06 01:52 AM | Reply | Flag: Spoken By the Master Cherry Picker Himself!

(BTW what you did above is called cherry picking and is regarded as bad form)

LMAO. Spoken by the master of 'Popularity' google searching. One would have thought you'd have learned with your faux paus with your complete quack source, Insolence!

What? Top Google search? For the most basic question you need to do a Google popularity search? That makes it science by consensus. Your as much of a genius as Al Gore who must modify the scientific results to get the desired conclusion.

No, dipshit. As in it took a single google search to get two articles that show the efficacy of influenza vaccines. As in the information is available to anyone (ie google as opposed to PubMed) and there's no excuse for being ignorant.

And how did I modify the results? I didn't write the papers, I just posted them.

What a feeble response. You've got a short convenient memory. The very definition of a pandemic was changed in order to fraudulently make it a pandemic. That's what is meant when asked 'Under what criteria'. Are you going to ask for a Link like usual? It's MSM retard.

The depths of your retardedness are never ending.

I recall a single "article" making the claim above and it was posted by you from natural news or some shit site like that.

However, you of course take it as gospel and it MUST be true since you read it on the intertubes. What's that about modifying information to meet your conclusions?

LMAO. Spoken by the master of 'Popularity' google searching. One would have thought you'd have learned with your faux paus with your complete quack source, Insolence!

A disciple of natural news calling a peer-reviewed medical article a quack source. LOL damn that's rich.

And again, it has nothing to do with the "popularity," it's the ease of access to information that people claim doesn't exist.

BTW all of your posts were ad hominems, hypocrite.

What affect do you think it has on people when their government declares an emergency?

It should tell them that it's a serious situation that is deserving of vigilance and monitoring. It in no way means the government is intentionally fear mongering.

What would you have them do instead? Sugar coat it? Say "it'll be ok, here's a blanket to snuggle with"?

It was and remains a serious situation that requires people to act like adults. Some, however, prefer to use it to further their anti-government proclivities.

Bani,

Do you really want to open the HIV can of worms? Don't tell me you're an HIV denialist as well.

It was and remains a serious situation that requires people to act like adults. Some, however, prefer to use it to further their anti-government proclivities.

Bingo.

#49 jpw
I recall ....

LMAO. I guess that makes it true. Why not do a Google popularity search?

Morons.

LMAO. I guess that makes it true. Why not do a Google popularity search?

Damn you're dense.

Why don't you post the article to back your claim? That's usually how it works.

Making others do the leg work to support your claims is intellectually lazy.

I also notice you nitpick and never address anything specific about the science. Is that because you don't really care about the science or because you're ignorant as hell of the science?

I couldn't even listen to it all because although funny to me, the fact that people might actually believe him was incredibly nauseating.

Have you seen the scientology episode of south park? They tell the xenu story and have the subtitie "this is what scientologists actually believe".

I read that shit and had this hilarious mental image of a white-knuckled microbiologist cackling like a madman in some Medieval castle-turned-laboratory. Occasional flashes of lightning illuminate the side of his face as he mutters incoherently about thinning the herd for the glory of Lucifer. Working by the light of candles made from the fat of aborted fetuses, he carefully innoculates a culture of vero cells with the next designer scourge. A flask of doom goes in the incubator. His work done, the madman takes up a P1000 engraved with the likeness of Baphomet, stabs a hog-tied virgin in the eye socket, and then he skullfucks her.

"this is what the anti-vaxxers actually believe"

#49 |Posted by jpw FLAG: LMAO. JPW is innundated by so many L_R's out there. Sees L_R in his nightmares.

it was posted by you from natural news or some shit

What's that about modifying information to meet your conclusions?

And how did I modify the results? I didn't write the papers,

it has nothing to do with the "popularity," it's the ease of access to information

As in the information is available to anyone (ie google as opposed to PubMed) and there's no excuse for being ignorant.

However, you of course take it as gospel and it MUST be true since you read it on the intertubes. What's that about modifying information to meet your conclusions?

Nice try. LOL! Find where I posted that from 'NaturalNews or some shit'.

The difference is you tout yourself to be highly knowledgeable on the topic. It's hillarious you measure yourself by the same stick that you measure me (with your incompetence rhetoric) to justify your google searching for sources! This justifies your Insolence major faux paus? Nice one! There is NO excuse for you to have to resort to popularity Google search, in which you naturally will find the skewed, pre-ordained government-sponsored research findings you need to find. Every post further proves you're completely defeated and must continue the sharades. Have you called up your handlers to see if they still need you as a shill? Do you think you have convinced one person on DR who listened to the microbiologist assessment of your handlers' malfeasance?


It should tell them that it's a serious situation that is deserving of vigilance and monitoring. It in no way means the government is intentionally fear mongering.

Some, however, prefer to use it to further their anti-government proclivities.

You're expecting a population of people governed by what is going on with American Idol to remain upbeat and reasonable when the vast majority of the information they receive is telling them to be scared?

What would you have them do instead? Sugar coat it? Say "it'll be ok, here's a blanket to snuggle with"?

How about not having the American people go into a state of panic over the perceived threat of quarantines and forced vaccinations?

Would it be too much to ask that the response to a threat be proportional to the threat?

Instead, we declared war on germs. The media blew things out of proportion and government was but a wee voice in the wilderness.

As for the seriousness of the situation. How many people die, every year, from "regular" influenza? How many died from Swine Flue?

The facts are on my side when I point to the various occasions that the reaction to this virus or that virus has been blown out of proportion.

Zombie under 30! good there is plenty of time yet to find out new champions to challenge in your wisdom of youth.

The people I "challenge" are generally my friends and co-workers... and whatever disagreements we may have generally get sorted out with arguments based in reality (unless a woman is involved, but I generally have more sense than to get into that with friends). I come here for entertainment and a way of breaking up a workday.

The very definition of a pandemic was changed in order to fraudulently make it a pandemic.

You're full of shit. Pandemic means the same thing today as it did decades ago. Interacting with you is about as productive as trying to convince a stubborn toddler that brushing his teeth is, in fact, necessary to prevent cavities. A toddler doesn't know what a cavity is, and you don't know dick about anything remotely pertaining to biology. The only difference here is that I'm not your parent and I don't particularly give a fuck if you remain an idiot or not.

so many L_R's out there

LOL are idiots like you reproducing asexually, now?

When bombshells come out like this expert witness, it is also time to review stories that were earlier "dismissed" by rhetoric.

WHO 'Mr Flu' under investigation for gross conflict of interest

#58 | Posted by ZombieHunter at 2010-01-06 01:21 PM | Reply | Flag:

Pandemic means the same thing today as it did decades ago.

Attempting conv with a disingenuous shill is even worse!

Speaka Swedish? Be patient, only the intro is in Swedish. Scientist speaks.

Reuters

LMAO. JPW is innundated by so many L_R's out there. Sees L_R in his nightmares.

You give yourself WAY too much credit.

Nice try. LOL! Find where I posted that from 'NaturalNews or some shit'.

I'm not really interested in searching through your archived posts to find it. It may not have been you.

The point still stands, however, that I've only seen one claim that the definition of pandemic was changed and it was not from a MSM source.

The difference is you tout yourself to be highly knowledgeable on the topic. It's hillarious you measure yourself by the same stick that you measure me (with your incompetence rhetoric) to justify your google searching for sources!

When it comes to virology and biology in general, I am light years beyond you in knowledge and comprehension.

And you can continue to harp on my use of Google (and making up bullshit excuses on how it will only present "skewed" data) despite my explanation on my reasons for using it. I understand that you too need to feel like you're making a point.

Every post further proves you're completely defeated and must continue the sharades.

LOL the delusion runs deep in this one.

Do you think you have convinced one person on DR who listened to the microbiologist assessment of your handlers' malfeasance?

I have no idea.

I'm willing to bet they say your post #1 and moved on.

#61 | Posted by L_RContrarian

LOL you're actually right (ouch!) that the definition has changed.

However, it has changed in an opposite manner than you think. They've made the definition more stringent, not less as you claimed.

#62 jpw
I'm willing to bet they say your post #1 and moved on.

Ah, if only you were only so lucky, huh JPW?

#63 jpw
However, it has changed in an opposite manner than you think. They've made the definition more stringent, not less as you claimed.

LOL. Art of war? You listened to the scientist? More stringent. Do you have a bridge to sell us too?
DR is smart enough to see through the facade. Game over.

People who weren't afraid of this one weren't paying enough attention.

#44 | Posted by rcade

Absolutely...

Claim: U.S. Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld owns stock in the company that makes Tamiflu. Status: True.; Example: [Collected via e-mail, 2006]; ... Do you know that it was the Americans who alerted us to the efficacy of the human antiviral TAMIFLU as a preventative? Do you know that TAMIFLU barely alleviates...

www.snopes.com/politics/
medical/tamiflu.asp

www.snopes.com

far better than cough syrup...

Ionic/Colloidal Silver is the easiest & fastest way I know of to get rid of a sore throat!

www.braintuner.com

LOL are idiots like you reproducing asexually, now?

#59 | Posted by ZombieHunter

you should know:>)

You're expecting a population of people governed by what is going on with American Idol to remain upbeat and reasonable when the vast majority of the information they receive is telling them to be scared?

I don't expect people to remain upbeat, but I've yet to see anything telling me to be scared. Now, people may react to something they don't understand by being afraid, but that doesn't mean that that was the intention or rational behind the announcement.

I can understand why some people reacted that way, but I think it was the media and not any government agency that is responsible for that.

How about not having the American people go into a state of panic over the perceived threat of quarantines and forced vaccinations?

Who was talking about quarantines and forced vaccinations?

And yes, quarantine is a standard approach to disease control that should be utilized if necessary. How or why is that scary?

Would it be too much to ask that the response to a threat be proportional to the threat?

In my opinion it was (again, talking about govt agencies, not media). You had a new virus that was spreading rapidly throughout the globe and was hitting certain populations harder in a manner similar to pandemic influenzas of the past. Add to that the fact that it was not only doing that, but was becoming the dominant influenza strain in circulation and I think it was a threat that was dealt with appropriately.

Instead, we declared war on germs. The media blew things out of proportion and government was but a wee voice in the wilderness.

I agree. The media was hysterical with this topic to the population's detriment.

As for the seriousness of the situation. How many people die, every year, from "regular" influenza? How many died from Swine Flue?

First of all, the season isn't even at peak yet. Second, pandemic strains come in waves and we are currently in a lull.

And so what if it "only" kills the same amount of people as "normal" influenza. 36,000 people is no small number and there was no way to tell before hand if it would be worse.

The facts are on my side when I point to the various occasions that the reaction to this virus or that virus has been blown out of proportion.

Blown out of proportion by who? If you mean the media, I probably agree with you.

If you mean public health officials, I probably will disagree with you.

Scientists can't read tea leaves to tell how something will work out, so they have to act on the information at hand and assume a worse case scenario. Anything else would be inappropriate and unethical.

It was and remains a serious situation that requires people to act like adults. Some, however, prefer to use it to further their anti-government proclivities.

Bingo.

#52 | Posted by rcade

Bingo it was! Disinformation is the art of the pharms shill today! Here's more from the article posted above in #39 about the author of it!

Clark Baker
Hollywood, CA, United States
Writer, producer, US Marine, private eye, pilot, divemaster, retired LAPD officer and father of a US Marine and public school teacher, Clark studied humanity on the streets of Calcutta, Nairobi, Rio, San Salvador, and Los Angeles. To know more, read his updated bio.

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

LOL. Art of war? You listened to the scientist? More stringent. Do you have a bridge to sell us too?

Do you have anything in proper English to tell us?

What's funny is that claims on WND ect (through a Google search OH NO) are that they REMOVED conditions to make it EASIER to declare H1N1 a pandemic. However, those living in reality see from your link that they didn't make it easier for something to be declared a pandemic, they made it harder by adding conditions to the criteria.

DR is smart enough to see through the facade. Game over.

For you? Most definitely.

Clark Baker
Hollywood, CA, United States
Writer, producer, US Marine, private eye, pilot, divemaster, retired LAPD officer and father of a US Marine and public school teacher, Clark studied humanity on the streets of Calcutta, Nairobi, Rio, San Salvador, and Los Angeles. To know more, read his updated bio.

Good for him. Anything that makes him qualified to comment with any authority on HIV?

certainly more than you or Zombie & probably Rcade imho:>)

But then I haven't asked him yet about his opinion of a known product that clearly works better than the ads above the comment window as I type...on swiney flu, & so forth

{Ads by Google Swine Flu Vaccines H1N1 Symptom Influenza Vaccines Influenza a H1N1 )

MMS Protocol works.

Zat doesn't count

Ionic/Colloidal Silver is the easiest & fastest way I know of to get rid of a sore throat!

...and end up looking like one of the Na'vi.

certainly more than you or Zombie & probably Rcade imho

Which is of course based on a thorough reading and understanding of the HIV literature.

MMS Protocol works.

Along with bloodletting and poultices made from mandrake root and the hair of the rabid dog that bit you.

#60 good link ~ L!

WHO Mr Flu' under investigation
for gross conflict of interest

www.financialsense.com

LOL. Art of war? You listened to the scientist? More stringent. Do you have a bridge to sell us too?
DR is smart enough to see through the facade. Game over.

LR, you're giving the Time Cube guy a run for his money. Congratulations.

EARTH HAS 4 CORNER
SIMULTANEOUS 4-DAY
TIME CUBE
IN ONLY 24 HOUR ROTATION.
4 CORNER DAYS, CUBES 4 QUAD EARTH- No 1 Day God.
******************
FREE SPEECH in AMERICA is
"BULL SHIT",
EVIL EDUCATORS
block and suppress
www.timecube.com.
You are educated evil,
and might have to kill
the evil ONE teaching
educators before you
can learn that 4 corner
days actually exist -but
all Cube Truth denied.
Some days I wonder if LR and the timecube guy huff the same brand of toluene.

Along with bloodletting and poultices made from mandrake root and the hair of the rabid dog that bit you.

#76 | Posted by ZombieHunter

no, I didn't get bitten by the rabid dog in Fantastic Mr. Fox!

However your Pan's Labyrinth's allusion was touche'

en.wikipedia.org's_Labyrinth

Which is of course based on a thorough reading and understanding of the HIV literature.

#75 | Posted by jpw

FF

Ionic/Colloidal Silver is the easiest & fastest way I know of to get rid of a sore throat!

...and end up looking like one of the Na'vi.

#74 | Posted by ZombieHunter

primal ignorance still runs thru your blue veins, aye?:>)

Some days I wonder if LR and the timecube guy huff the same brand of toluene.

#78 | Posted by ZombieHunter

Toluene - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Source Toluene , also known as methylbenzene , or Toluol , is a clear water-insoluble liquid with the typical smell of paint thinners, reminiscent of the related compound benzene. It is an aromatic hydr...

ah, one of the old time corporate Ice Cream ingredience...

primal ignorance still runs thru your blue veins

In your dreams, perhaps.

dr. chopra?

if tosser were here he would tell you not to trust the indians.

hahha

dr. chopra?

if tosser were here he would tell you not to trust the indians.

hahha

In your dreams, perhaps.

#83 | Posted by ZombieHunter

good one! & true ~ are u another Mr.Bladerunner, too?:>)

Did Krishna have Blue veins?

How Bauers being Blue bloods? lol

if tosser were here he would tell you not to trust the indians

If you read any of "Dr." Chopra's forays into insanity, you'll find this guy would not be proving tosser wrong.

Bani: Donald Rumsfeld having ties to the maker of Tamiflu has nothing to do with the current government's handling of the swine flu pandemic. He was out of office when the pandemic began.

As for whether I know anything about this stuff, I've read enough to conclude that the pandemic was real and the flu vaccine was an extremely important measure to deal with it.

Bani,

Have you read the snopes link you posted?

I don't think it says what you think it says...

are u another Mr.Bladerunner

I have nothing against replicants.

Have you read the snopes link you posted?

He stopped reading at the point where it says "true". The devil's in the details, and the dimwitted despise details.

Did Krishna have Blue veins?

There are some that would say you could ask him yourself. There are others who would say that doing so would land you in hell for eternity. There are others that will say "all is maya" and try to convince you that it is not actually Krishna that you've been looking for this entire time. There are others that will just have to get back with you once they finish annihilating their egos. And there are others that would say, "rama lama ding dong" and try to get you to join their cult. Successfully sifting through bullshit is a skill that I think you would benefit by honing.

How Bauers being Blue bloods?

As in Jack?

Snopes nails the money aspect of Rummie's sordid past dealings & potential future creations of fake pandemics...but then Silver/Mercury amalgams & 911 seems to escape Snopes focus for some obtuse reason? Perhaps the absolutely damning testimony of Mineta's not Zionistic enough ~ like Moderate8 of late ~ for snopes seemly overly nwo bias inclusions at this time???:>)

www.snopes.com

Snopes nails the money aspect of Rummie's sordid past dealings

Sordid? Why is investing in a biotech company sordid?

& potential future creations of fake pandemics...

Yeah, I can understand where that leap of logic comes in...

certainly more than you or Zombie & probably Rcade imho

Just out of curiosity, on what basis do you base you ho?

As in Jack?

#93 | Posted by ZombieHunter

apparently as well. Bauers are fascinating. original name for a famous family before it was changed to red shield in as in German ~ herstory suggests

Huh? "Bauer" means "builder" in German.

Just out of curiosity, on what basis do you base you ho?

#96 | Posted by jpw

experiences. you ho?

Red shield? Oooh, rothschild. I see where you're going. You're certainly a fan of those conspiracy theories.

What's your take on "real" vampires and satanic ritual abuse?

Huh? "Bauer" means "builder" in German.

#98 | Posted by ZombieHunter

red shield means?

experiences

You mean anecdotal evidence?

you ho?

Gotta smack 'em sometimes. For their own good.

What's your take on "real" vampires and satanic ritual abuse?

#100 | Posted by ZombieHunter

"Eyes Wide Open" was Directors last movie, No?

"experiences"

You mean anecdotal evidence?

Z wantabe

no, experiences!

experiences. you ho?

Ho? no. I've always thought of myself as more of a slut.

red shield means?

It would be roter schild, but yeah, I imagine that's the etymology of the last name "rothschild".

experiences=nothing?

"Eyes Wide Open" was Directors last movie, No?

No idea what you're talking about. Are you thinking of "Eyes Wide Shut"? There was a lot of T+A in that.

Yeah, I can understand where that leap of logic comes in...

#95 | Posted by jpw

you mean common sense?

9/10/2001: Rumsfeld says $2.3 TRILLION Missing from Pentagon

www.youtube.com

What does that have to do with the current thread?

you mean common sense?

Huh? You've gotta be kidding me. Influenza is an virus that organizes its genome and interacts with multiple host species in a way that practically ensures regular re-emergence. How do you leap from the well-established facts regarding this virus to harebrained fantasies about a shadowy cabal of government bioterrorists?

No idea what you're talking about. Are you thinking of "Eyes Wide Shut"? There was a lot of T+A in that.

#108 | Posted by ZombieHunter

lol my bad...It was Kubrick's last film before his death.

en.wikipedia.org

It was Kubrick's last film before his death.

Your point?

How do you leap from the well-established facts regarding this virus to harebrained fantasies about a shadowy cabal of government bioterrorists?

#111 | Posted by ZombieHunter

no brainer for me since 5 or 6 when lethal silver/mercury was inserted into my jaw eons ago...

don't get me start on fluoride in water bs either

"started"

Your point?

#113 | Posted by ZombieHunter

2001 was a great & better movie, too, imho but didn't piss off the right people? who knows...I have not checked it out lately...should I?

no brainer for me since 5 or 6 when lethal silver/mercury was inserted into my jaw eons ago...

You're still here, aren't you? Is all of your craziness just an attempt to prove that you can get mercury poisoning from fillings?

I imagine the cause runs a little deeper than that...

What does that have to do with the current thread?

#110 | Posted by jpw

why do you care?

www.financialsense.com

2001 was a great & better movie, too, imho but didn't piss off the right people?

Lol do you honestly think Kubrick got offed by a cult that was offended by Eyes Wide Shut? Don't beat around the bush, just say so one way or another.

Is all of your craziness just an attempt to prove that you can get mercury poisoning from fillings?

I imagine the cause runs a little deeper than that...

#117 | Posted by ZombieHunter

seems to me you drank the crazy water from the Madmen's well & pushing pharm disinfo on public ~ not I imho:>)

What is a PharmaSlut?

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

Lol do you honestly think Kubrick got offed by a cult that was offended by Eyes Wide Shut? Don't beat around the bush, just say so one way or another.

#119 | Posted by ZombieHunter

don't know...do you?

fluoride in water bs

Yes, the fluoride conspiracies are utter bs.

Did you not know, Bani... your tea is poisoned with fluoride! And by that, I mean that the common tea plant does a remarkably goood job of absorbing fluoride from the soil and even when you brew a cup with pristine water, you can be getting a higher dose of fluoride than you would from tap water. The WHO recommends 0.5-1.0 mg/l of fluoride in drinking water, in the middle of the range of concentrations present in tea brewed from fluoride-free water.

don't know...do you?

Arguments from ignorance... priceless. All the class of a creationist.

Arguments from ignorance... priceless. All the class of a creationist.

#123 | Posted by ZombieHunter

nice weak try, but you've done better

"Yes, the fluoride conspiracies are utter bs."

typical pharm slut stuff!

which is why you don't know as much as you think you do really! Or you sold out, too?

I have a water pitcher that gets 65% of the added fluoride out & have use it for over a year with satisfactory results imho

pushing pharm disinfo

If you think it anything I have said is "disinformation," by all means prove it.

If you think Tamiflu is ineffective against the 2009 pandemic virus, get yourself some tamiflu, some MDCK cells (or if you're ambitious, a dog and a blender), and a sick kid... prove everybody wrong. If you think that the 2009 pandemic was triggered by an engineered virus, demonstrate how it is not possible for well-documented natural processes to produce this virus.

These aren't difficult concepts, bani. Say something specific and back it up, step by step, with credible evidence. You have to connect the dots, not throw a bunch of crap against a wall, see what sticks, and hope the next idiot to come by sees the same patterns in the stool as you do.

why you don't know as much as you think you do

Whereas you do, despite having absolutely no background in this subject matter? Yeah, right.

If that was how things worked, I would have my car serviced by an Amazonian witch doctor who has never seen an automobile before.

I have a water pitcher that gets 65% of the added fluoride out & have use it for over a year with satisfactory results imho

My guess is you just have a water pitcher.

Unless you have more information than what the salesmen gave you when he took your money.

Whereas you do, despite having absolutely no background in this subject matter? Yeah, right.

#127 | Posted by ZombieHunter

at this point, I'm sure millions of people would recognize your cheap shot Pharma slut antics for what they are by now! But then again, I may be mistaken:>)

WHO Mr Flu' under investigation
for gross conflict of interest
author of Full Spectrum Dominance: Totalitarian Democracy in the New World Order
by F. William Engdahl
December 8, 2009

The man with the nickname "Dr Flu", Professor Albert Osterhaus, of the Erasmus University in Rotterdam Holland has been named by Dutch media researchers as the person at the center of the worldwide Swine Flu H1N1 Influenza A 2009 pandemic hysteria. Not only is Osterhaus the connecting person in an international network that has been described as the Pharma Mafia, he is THE key advisor to WHO on influenza and is intimately positioned to personally profit from the billions of euros in vaccines allegedly aimed at H1N1.

www.financialsense.com

Unless you have more information than what the salesmen gave you when he took your money.

#128 | Posted by jpw

typical disinfo tactic 101:>)

Honestly, bani, if you don't know what you're talking about, why should anyone listen to you?

The same goes for the quacks whose arguments you regurgitate. They can't support any of the horseshit they post on their personal webpages... they just hope you'll take their word for it (and then they'll take your money).

There are two issues here - first, you are too ignorant to recognize these snake oil salesmen for the frauds that they are, and second, you subscribe to a worldview that counts your ignorance as a virtue.

There are two issues here - first, you are too ignorant to recognize these snake oil salesmen for the frauds that they are, and second, you subscribe to a worldview that counts your ignorance as a virtue.

#131 | Posted by ZombieHunter

there are no issues here you have addressed lately worthy of comment yet I Persist...because I do know that you know better but have made choices to sell out...why I don't really know yet?:>)

What is a PharmaSlut?

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

WHO Mr Flu' under investigation

I recall there being an entire thread on that little hit piece.

I also seem to recall it not being as damning as you'd like it to be.

typical disinfo tactic 101:>)

How so?

I asked how you knew it removed 65% of fluoride from your water and whether said information was from another source other than the one who sold you the pitcher.

I'm beginning to think disinfo in your world means stuff that doesn't square with your alternate reality (so it's actually a compliment!).

The federal government made $98 billion in improper payments in fiscal 2009. ... within the next week aimed at cracking down on government waste and fraud, .... Bell's Palsy, Binge Eating Disorder, Bipolar Disorder, Bird Flu ... Rubella, Salmonella, SARS, Scabies, Schistosomiasis (Bilharzia) ...
www.medicalnewstoday.com

first, you are too ignorant to recognize these snake oil salesmen for the frauds that they are, and second, you subscribe to a worldview that counts your ignorance as a virtue.

Hmmmmmmm chicken or egg?

You're obsessed with this "Mr. Flu" guy, whoever he is. That's one person. For the sake of argument, say he did failed to disclose competing financial interests. He is one man, and if he disseminated any "disinformation," it would rapidly be exposed. Science is a cumulative, self-correcting endeavour consisting of countless individuals around the world. Your pathetic attempt at character assassination does nothing to invalidate the basic science you routinely ignore.

What's next? Are you going to try and discredit the ideal gas law because you think the guy at the hardware store is selling you underpressurized propane tanks?

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

What exactly about that guy (besides the fact that he appears to be as crazy as you...) draws you and compels you continually post his blog's link?

BTW-are you an HIV denialist?

Hmmmmmmm chicken or egg?

#135 | Posted by jpw

I'm going to have soft boiled eggs in abit...do you mind?

the old turkey in the frig goes to the lab

are you an HIV denialist?

I've yet to encounter an HIV denialist with the balls to put his T-cell count where his mouth is. Ask them "If HIV doesn't cause AIDS, what's the harm injecting yourself with some?" and you'll witness a tour-de-force in awkward attempts at deflection.

Gee, we really know nothing about JPW & Z wantabe, but this guy nails their pharm shill like tactics...hmmm


Clark Baker
Hollywood, CA, United States
Writer, producer, US Marine, private eye, pilot, divemaster, retired LAPD officer and father of a US Marine and public school teacher, Clark studied humanity on the streets of Calcutta, Nairobi, Rio, San Salvador, and Los Angeles.

exlibhollywood.blogspot.com

"I've yet to encounter an HIV denialist with the balls to put his T-cell count where his mouth is."

Humble says MMS 1 & 2 kills it completely...

Writer, producer, US Marine, private eye, pilot, divemaster, retired LAPD officer and father of a US Marine and public school teacher, Clark studied humanity on the streets of Calcutta, Nairobi, Rio, San Salvador, and Los Angeles.

Strangely, nothing in there has the slightest thing to do with biology. I can see why you believe him unconditionally.

Humble says MMS 1 & 2 kills it completely...

Is he willing to find out?

Strangely, nothing in there has the slightest thing to do with biology. I can see why you believe him unconditionally.

#142 | Posted by ZombieHunter

Certainly over just about anything you two have posted here in the above blog the last few days

Humble says MMS 1 & 2 kills it completely...

Of course he does.

I say a lot of stuff, Bani. How come you don't believe any of it?

Strangely, nothing in there has the slightest thing to do with biology. I can see why you believe him unconditionally.

Biology? WE DON'T NEED NO STINKIN' BIOLOGY!

Is he willing to find out?

#143 | Posted by ZombieHunter

I don't know, but I'm going to cook some soft boiled eggs now:>)

Certainly over just about anything you two have posted here in the above blog the last few days

Why?

Certainly over just about anything you two have posted here in the above blog the last few days

What, specifically, makes him more credible? More knowledgable?

WE DON'T NEED NO STINKIN' BIOLOGY!

Apparently not. All you need is a page on blogspot.com, an agenda, and access to gullible idiots.

WHO Mr Flu' under investigation
for gross conflict of interest
Apparently not. All you need is a page on blogspot.com, an agenda, and access to gullible idiots.

#149 | Posted by ZombieHunter

and make up these type of truly ridiculous stories:>)lol

author of Full Spectrum Dominance: Totalitarian

Democracy in the New World Order
by F. William Engdahl
December 8, 2009

The man with the nickname "Dr Flu", Professor Albert Osterhaus, of the Erasmus University in Rotterdam Holland has been named by Dutch media researchers as the person at the center of the worldwide Swine Flu H1N1 Influenza A 2009 pandemic hysteria. Not only is Osterhaus the connecting person in an international network that has been described as the Pharma Mafia, he is THE key advisor to WHO on influenza and is intimately positioned to personally profit from the billions of euros in vaccines allegedly aimed at H1N1.

www.financialsense.com

Yes, you've established your ability to repeat yourself, bani, but you have all the understanding of a parrot.

Anyway, bani, why don't you tackle 147 and 148. I'm out for a bit.

Yes, you've established your ability to repeat yourself, bani, but you have all the understanding of a parrot.

#151 | Posted by ZombieHunter

lol & your vast abilities are geared to selling out the people of the world with pharm shill tactics, but why?

Anyway, bani, why don't you tackle 147 and 148. I'm out for a bit.

#152 | Posted by ZombieHunter

see above:>)

see above:>)

So you're sticking with "nothing" as your answer?

not at all...here my next blog for you two/three to feast on:>)

Jan 6
The FDA Encourages Big Pharma To Screw Us

blogs.healthfreedomalliance.or
g

Carl C. Pfeiffer, MD, PhD

"For every drug that benefits a patient, there is a natural substance that can achieve the same effect." Pfeiffer's Law

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