TWO BASTARDS what do the Obama's have to do with this...

Sarandon and Robbins Split

THE BULL DURHAM CURSE!

Speaking of bastards, has Tripp started goofing on his mongoloid uncle yet?

Just as bad as Goldie Hawn and Kurt Russell living together 26 years and never marrying.

If two people claim love for each other, have had children together, yet can't even make the committment to marry after living together for more than two decades, then their relationship isn't really based on "love" after all -- but merely on a matter of convenience.

People can be committed to each other and love each other without getting married. I wouldn't be any less committed to Mrs. Drudge Retort if we were still shacking up.

Toucha toucha toucha touch me
I wanna be dirty
Chill me thrill me fulfill me
Creature of the night

What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?

#4 | Posted by CalifChris at 2009-12-23 04:28 PM

The average length of a marriage in the US is eleven years.

What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?

Fear of divorce

Posted by andyuhenet at 2009-12-23 04:23 PM

Merry Christmas, Andy. And I hope your girlfriend is pleased with the promise ring you're going to give her as a present. Since you're being deployed (in just a few months, right?) she probably wants to have the ring as a special bond between the two of you before you have to leave. It's quite nice, actually, to know someone will be waiting for you to come back, especially when you're far away away from home. Let's hope all goes well next year, the war ends soon, and all our military guys come back safe and sound.

One has to go through a divorce to realize there is nothing romantic about a state marriage. Marriage or no, the state always holds the natural father liable for child support.

"What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?"

Fear of divorce

Posted by goatman at 2009-12-23 04:45 PM

Why? Fear one of them might have to hand over a chunk of money if they divorce? There's always a pre-nup if money concerns are the reason for not marrying.

If one is so worried about the likelihood he'd go through a divorce if he got married, then it's probably due to him not being sure she even loves him in the first place. Or vice versa when it comes to him loving her.

From the quote on my userpage -

"If you wait to do everything until you're sure it's right, you'll probably never do much of anything." - Win Borden

I think if you first live with someone for a couple or years or so, then you haven't left yourself open for too many surprises should you both decide to marry.

If two people... can't even make the committment to marry after living together for more than two decades, then their relationship isn't really based on "love" after all -- but merely on a matter of convenience. -- #4 | Posted by CalifChris

23 years is a lot more than most marriages last.

And the pretension that a marriage license means the union is based on love is silly. Half the married couples I know weren't (and aren't) doing much more than playing socially-approved roles.

I'm confused, , , , I know this isn't a thread that a conservative started so they could attack the children of a coupla liberals, it simply can't be. I've read here, on many occasions, that children are off limits. Any minute now a gang of crazy fuckers will be along to tell us all so. . . .

I think if you first live with someone for a couple or years or so, then you haven't left yourself open for too many surprises... -- #12 | Posted by CalifChris

I'm thinking Elin Nordegren could have lived with a few less surprises.

If one is so worried about the likelihood he'd go through a divorce if he got married, then it's probably due to him not being sure she even loves him in the first place. Or vice versa when it comes to him loving her.

Not today, Chris. The legal system has made marriage a hazardous risk. As we were discussing sperm banks the other day, one cannot be sure that the courts will honor a prenuptial contract. I think some states don't recognize them.

They never got married because they never wanted to take each other for granted according to her.

I think if you first live with someone for a couple or years or so, then you haven't left yourself open for too many surprises should you both decide to marry.

It's still no guarantee. People can change in ways over the years where they can no longer live together. Legal marriage can give a women a sense of entitlement which wouldn't show up while cohabitating.

I'm thinking Elin Nordegren could have lived with a few less surprises.

#15 | Posted by Phoenix at 2009-12-23 05:27 PM

LOL

And the pretension that a marriage license means the union is based on love is silly. Half the married couples I know weren't (and aren't) doing much more than playing socially-approved roles.

#13 | Posted by Phoenix at 2009-12-23 05:19 PM | Reply

True in some cases, I guess. But don't you agree after awhile -- even many years -- a married couple will still be very much in love even though it's not the hot, passionate relationship as when a young couple first gets married. Love goes through different stages in a relationship.

After a few years, love in a marriage often reaches a certain "comfort level" where the intensity they each feel might not always show up so much on the outside, but inside each of them knows the other one will always be there for them, no matter what. That's something money can't buy.

"What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?"

civil justice in the usa is aweful.

thats why.

anybody thats been through a divorce knows this.

Thanks for the nice words, Chris! Me and the little lady are gonna go for a cruise if we can find some nice military discounts around March or April.

Any location suggestions?

People can change in ways over the years where they can no longer live together. Legal marriage can give a women a sense of entitlement which wouldn't show up while cohabitating.

#18 | Posted by Ray at 2009-12-23 05:33 PM

If I remember correctly, it hasn't been the best last couple of years for you, Ray. Ane you're right, people do change and not always for the better. Just as long as you know it doesn't necessarily mean it was due to a failure on your part. Sometimes there's nothing you can do about it no matter how hard you try. Although that doesn't make it hurt any less, does it.

Need to get some things taken care of before some stores close. Hope you have a Merry Christmas, Ray, and just give it time. The feelings you're going through will soothe over after awhile. It's just difficult right now, especially at this time of the year.

...

Any location suggestions?

#22 | Posted by andyuhenet at 2009-12-23 05:59 PM

You're asking the one who still can't figure out for sure where to move for location suggestions! LOL

Just kidding. A cruise sounds so nice. Have errands to run now though, so let me think about it for awhile and I'll get back to you on that one. Maybe some of the others on here can also help you out with some ideas where to take a cruise?

later, all

But don't you agree after awhile -- even many years -- a married couple will still be very much in love... -- #20 | Posted by CalifChris

Some yes, some no.

And I don't think the marriage license has anything to do with it. Two gay couples I know (together 12 and 17 years now) have much stronger relationships than most of the married straight couples I know.

Hope you have a Merry Christmas, Ray, and just give it time. The feelings you're going through will soothe over after awhile. It's just difficult right now, especially at this time of the year.

Same to you Chris.

I was divorced twenty years ago. I left her and moved in with someone else. As bad as the legal tribulations were, it was an improvement over living with my Ex.

pity. they were the perfect couple at which to aim my right wing loathing... it just won't be the same. we'll still have Streisand though, but she's not a two fer.

20 years ago is a long time, Ray. Sounds like you still miss her a little. Just my 2 cents. Hopefully you both are at least still are on speaking terms, although sometimes it's hard to be "just friends" with someone you used to love a lot.

Toucha toucha toucha touch me
I wanna be dirty
Chill me thrill me fulfill me
Creature of the night

Posted by goatman at 2009-12-23 04:38 PM

No chance, Chris! She was my worst nightmare. I still see her on holidays because of the kids. We're friendly now, but I'll never forget. To this day she tries to control our kids with zero success. My son-in-law has already had some fights with her. My daughter will not let my ex interfere in her marriage. My son lives in California and refuses to get a marriage contract with the girl he's living with. She's lucky that both kids stay loyal to her. They keep just enough distance so she knows her place.

What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?

#7 | Posted by Lisa at 2009-12-23 04:43 PM |

Common sense.

"What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?

#7 | Posted by Lisa at 2009-12-23 04:43 PM | "

Common sense.

#31 | Posted by jerrytarkanian at 2009-12-23 07:14 PM | Reply | Flag: Been married 8 times

To those who asked why two people who've lived together for so long wouldn't get married, then let me ask this:

Seeing as they're both quite successful and have no need of things like shared insurance, etc, what actual purpose would getting married serve other than to make people who feel marriage is important stop asking them why they aren't married?

Darko, what's up brother? How goes the Gallic struggle?

It's hard to say. Adam West keep stalking me, but the giant flying manta-rays seem to have taken a night off.

How about you?

Fant-bloody-astic!

OoooH! These pills are GREEN! Wonder what they do....

ANDY --

Thanks for the nice words, Chris! Me and the little lady are gonna go for a cruise if we can find some nice military discounts around March or April.

Any location suggestions?

Also, I'd advise finding out ahead of time about info re how long the ship stays in each port if they make stops along the way, and if you can you book ahead for a car rental in your name when you make a port stop so you're not just stuck at some tourist trap for hours if you'd rather be able to get out and drive around and see the sites -- those kind of things.

Below are a few of the military discount cruise websites which feature various length cruises (some 2-3 days, some 4 days and longer). Don't forget when you plan for your cruise, you need to allow for travel time to get to the port where your ship is docked.

It may not matter to you one way or the other, but my preference would be a 4-7 day cruise so at least I'd have some to relax and enjoy the trip. With a 2-3 day cruise it'd feel like you barely got to unpack before the ship makes a u-turn to go back home again. Guess it all depends on your work schedules, etc. as to how long a cruise you can take.

And if it only runs you a few extra bucks, you might consider getting a "suite" to sleep in as rooms run small even on board a cruise ship from what I've heard.

Here are a few military discount cruise websites you might find helpful

This site has a good map shown at the top of the page -- just click on the city closest to where you live and it'll tell you which cruises are available from there.

Where the hell is brother Rogers?

Is Roger Rabbit your beau, bunny foo foo ?

Same as you Goatie

...Seeing as they're both quite successful and have no need of things like shared insurance, etc, what actual purpose would getting married serve other than to make people who feel marriage is important stop asking them why they aren't married?

All kids are little bastards.

They owe it to their kids to do the right thing and marry.

The right thing?Says who

For starters, it might be nice if they at least considered making any little bastards they produced together legitimate.

The idea that kids born out of wedlock are somehow less legitamte than any other kids is bizarre, in reality.

Just because their parents have not signed a silly piece of paper does not mean they are any less living, nor are they any less ANYTHING.

As far as I'm concerned, marriage is an outdated and somewhat quaint tradition to be looked at with curiosity and, perhaps, some nostalgia. Anything else is pointless. The government should not endorse any variation of this.

That being said, if the government is bound and determined to endorse some form of this archaic institution, they need to endorse any variation that includes two consenting adults.

And ether is a lot of fun, but I have to give you this piece of advice: don't drink the stuff.

The right thing? Says who

#47 | Posted by bruceaz at 2009-12-24 01:08 AM

I know you likely won't answer me truthfully since your "says who" lets me know your out to make your own point.

But figuring your parents were probably married when you were born, as you were growing up were you glad they were? Would it have been a little awkward for you as a little kid if your last name that that of your father was not the same? Your little classmates and friends would never have asked you why?

How about your granddaughter? Would it bother you if her parents never married -- assuming that they are. If they're not, that's their choice. But for your granddaughter's sake, does it matter in the least to you if she's legitimate or not? (And of course we're not talking here about any feelings of love you have for her.)

My folks were married before they had me, but I would have loved them just as much whether they ever got married or not. Still, I'm just glad they iinstead chose to marry first rather than have me go through life as their illegitimate child. I'm just more old-fashioned than you in my way of thinking, I guess.

bruceaz -

btw -- under the laws of the U.S. all of a man's children -- whether legitimate or illegitimate -- are considered equal in the eye of the law when it comes to inheritances whether or not there was a will when a parent died. Years ago it wasn't that way, but now the law no longer punishes a child born out of wedlock and treats all children equally -- which is the way it should be.

Cali Chris,
I understand what your saying,but no such thing as an illegitimate kid.

I've never heard you mention if you've ever been married or have kids.That's why I say "Says who"
My business partner has done neither,yet he is an expert.Says he has amazing powers of observation.

My kids and their kids are pretty much right up there with Gimme a Scotches.

My granddaughter is living with me now for all sorts of fucked up reasons.

My parents were married,I listened to them scream at each other for 17 years before I left.

"btw -- under the laws of the U.S. all of a man's children -- whether legitimate or illegitimate -- are considered equal in the eye of the law"

CC...I may very well be wrong...but I believe you're talking about California rights, and not Federal rights. Estates are usually settled under states' rights.

#51 addendum.

But its all cool

Elcid is jealous these two kids know who their father is. Mom didn't track her johns very well, did he, Cidney?

but no such thing as an illegitimate kid.

More correct to say "illegitimate parents". It's not the little bastard's fault, he/she is a bastard.

But it is the parents' fault for being mega-bastards and not letting their kid be backed up by paperwork.

but now the law no longer punishes a child born out of wedlock and treats all children equally

Providing you can prove you are Da Kid.... DNA sample and all that....

Far simpler to be legitimate and not having to go to court.

I don't know about the US, but here, they will tie you up in knots for years before you can touch whatever inheritance you can prove is yours. That's what lawyers do and they are good at it... wasting your time.

Her kids were born in '89 and '92,they're pretty much grown,so I don't really see what's to argue about here

CC...I may very well be wrong...but I believe you're talking about California rights, and not Federal rights. Estates are usually settled under states' rights.

#52 | Posted by Danforth at 2009-12-24 02:11 AM

No, you're not incorrect at all. Estates and inheritances, etc. (all considered "Probate" law) are in accordance with the individual Probate laws set out for each individual state. Each state is different.

When I said earlier "under the laws of the U.S" I should have been clearer. By that I meant that in our country (the "U.S") all children are considered as legitimate in the eyes of the law -- meaning as "seen equally" in the individual Probate laws of every state throughout the U.S.

I should probably have made myself clearer but my mind wasn't even thinking "federal" law when I said that as I knew federal law doesn't apply at all when it comes to any Probate issues -- only individual state law.

In fact, earlier today I was reading a very interesting legal case I had printed out on a particular section of the Probate Code for the State of Illinois. Very interesting case to me for reasons of my own, but living in California the Probate Codes of any other state would be inapplicable to me unless I lived there. Just as you said, estate and inheritance law (Probate) are decided by the individual states.

I know you likely won't answer me truthfully

Well,how was my answer.

Sorry Chris,I don't mean to jump all over you,but most of what you said falls under the category of"Wouldn't it be nice if"

Have a good night,
bruce

Well, how was my answer.

#59 | Posted by bruceaz at 2009-12-24 03:00 AM

It gave me a justified come-uppance and put me in my place. *grin*

My parents were married, I listened to them scream at each other for 17 years before I left.

You made an excellent point in that "getting married" doesn't guarantee a happier household any more than if they decided never to marry but merely lived together.

Sounds like whether your folks merely lived together or "did the right thing and got married" (as I keep babbling on about lol) it wouldn't have changed a thing.

The sad part isn't so much about them, as they chose to make their life together what it was, the sad part is they made it unbearable enough for you that you wanted out by age 17.

My granddaughter is living with me now for all sorts of fucked up reasons.

No matter how fucked up the reasons as to why your granddaughter is now living with you, it doesn't change the fact of what a decent person you must be to let her.

I believe you said before your granddaughter has a physical ailment to deal with in her life? All the more respect you deserve coming your way for taking her in and caring for her. Caretaking is one of the most all consumming jobs one can take on, yet also the most thankless when it comes to how others view the job of caretaker. Most people have no idea how much one who does it full time gives of themselves -- not only physically but mentally too. The stress and worry can be overwhelming at times.

Let's hope many new advancements are made in stem cell research so your granddaughter has a long and bright future ahead of her. Stem cell research was politically put on hold for 8 wasted years under the Bush Administration. But thankfully that's over with and hopefully we'll make huge new strides in many cures.

Didn't mean to talk so much! But one last comment on something you said --

i understand what your saying, but no such thing as an illegitimate kid...

Poor choice of word on my part. Should have said a child who was "born out of wedlock" if anything. "Illegitimate" does sound kind of dehumanizing, doesn't it? Alright, I won't use that word again.

Have a good night,
bruce

#61 | Posted by bruceaz at 2009-12-24 03:13 AM | Reply

Sorry, Bruce. Didn't see your #61 until now.

I had just "surfaced" back on to the thread after writing my #62 to you. Took me awhile to write the words as I wanted to say them. Hopefully you'll get to read my post tomorrow.

Ah Chris,I just took an opportunity to spout off and a second to feel sorry for myself.

My folks are in their 70's now still married and are happy I guess.the stress of raising 6 fucking kids must of been tough for them.

They are making progress on my granddaughter's CF,Life span is up to 40 now,so it should be much higher when she gets there.

But with the problems associated with that,fellow kids will be making fun of her for that,not her last name.Last names are a joke anyway,people just call me bruce.

I took a lot of ribbing for the movie They call me Bruce and Bruce Almighty,but I lived.

thanks for responding Chris

"If two people claim love for each other, have had children together, yet can't even make the committment to marry after living together for more than two decades, then their relationship isn't really based on "love" after all -- but merely on a matter of convenience."

You're kidding, right? People have to be married to be committed? So is the inverse true? People who are married are committed? Yeah, that would explain the divorce rate in this country.

Sorry, Chris, but there's more than one way to show commitment in this world. For that matter, I think 23 years is a pretty good run (especially in Hollywood!).

OoooH! These pills are GREEN! Wonder what they do....

#35 | Posted by RevDarko

Green M&M's are the best!

Rumor has it Susan was having coffee with someone else.

23 years is a really long time--married or not--they had committment.

Thanks for the nice words, Chris! Me and the little lady are gonna go for a cruise if we can find some nice military discounts around March or April.

Any location suggestions?

#22 | Posted by andyuhenet
-----------------------
Andy

Go to ITT and see what they have available. They have some sweet deals on cruises. Well ITT is the Air Force term not sure which branch your in.

Lonnie

pity. they were the perfect couple at which to aim my right wing loathing... it just won't be the same. we'll still have Streisand though, but she's not a two fer.

#27 | Posted by somoco
-----------------------
Don't forget, we still have Hanoi Jane.

Lonnie

What do you think prevents two people who have spent years together from getting married?

They're both the same sex?

I know a couple that is everything-but-married. But they're not actually married. That way she gets single mom status, which helps out when you're poor.

Would it have been a little awkward for you as a little kid if your last name that that of your father was not the same? -- #42 | Posted by CalifChris

Chris, you need to get out of the house every once in a while.

First, the fact that parents are unmarried is completely unrelated to the kids' last names. (Both of Sarandon and Robbins' children use his last name, for example.)

Second, many women don't change their names any more when they marry, and so it's become pretty common for kids to have last names that are different from at least one of their parents'.

Mostly, I can't see how people's marital status can possibly be anyone's business but their own.

Stem cell research was politically put on hold for 8 wasted years under the Bush Administration. But thankfully that's over with and hopefully we'll make huge new strides in many cures.

Probably won't make that much difference---nobody knows yet.

Misinformation drives me crazy---Bush did not put stem cell research on hold---let's get our facts right.

"If two people claim love for each other, have had children together, yet can't even make the committment to marry after living together for more than two decades, then their relationship isn't really based on "love" after all"

Marriage is a commitment? That's quaint. What is this, 1950? Cell phone contracts are more of a commitment than marriage is anymore.

And perhaps Goldie and Kurt don't prescribe to the religious inspired notion that people need to get married to have a happy life together. Their nearly 3 decades together was a much longer run than most married couples stayed together during that same period.

See the outrage from a few rigid posters over two people choosing to be together choosing to stop being together. The best relationships are those where the parties elect to be together, rather than are committed by law to being together. Robbins and Sarandon are both great people and will continue to have MY respect. herm