Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Monday, November 23, 2009

Paul Krugman: A funny thing happened on the way to a new New Deal. A year ago, the only thing we had to fear was fear itself; today, the reigning doctrine in Washington appears to be "Be afraid. Be very afraid." What happened? To be sure, "centrists" in the Senate have hobbled efforts to rescue the economy. But the evidence suggests that in addition to facing political opposition, President Obama and his inner circle have been intimidated by scare stories from Wall Street.

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Krugman vs NY Times

www.huffingtonpost.com

"And let's not forget that Wall Street which somehow failed to recognize the biggest housing bubble in history has a less than stellar record at predicting market behavior. "

Is this the same Paul Krugman who was an advisor to Enron? THAT Paul Krugman?

Huh? There has never been a greater fear monger in the history of the country then George W. Bush.

At any rate why do people insist on linking to papers that require a registered log on. Screw the NY times. It's about time the users told them how to run an internet news page anyway.

Huh? There has never been a greater fear monger in the history of the country then George Bush.

#3 | Posted by RingMaster

Ringmaster, good to hear from you again--thought you had gone into hibernation in warm Hawaii. Hey, give old George a break and speak to the article. The point I found interesting was his comment the president sounded "diffident and nervous about his economic policy." Once again, it tells me this poor guy is out of his element and doesn't know what the heck he is doing---he's getting all this info and unfortunately, due to his lack of qualifications, executive experience and knowledge of business/economics he is unable to assimilate it to make decisions that are proper in this situation--there is no leadership in Washington and I believe the polls are increasingly reflecting that.

Krugman has been pushing and continues to push for giant gov't spending.

Do about 4 Stimulus bills--and be damned the consequences.

Such the economist..

Such the economist..

#5 | Posted by MURPHY

All right, Murphy vs. Krugman. This ought to be good.

Murphy,
...
...
...
Sincerely,

Paul Krugman

Is this the same Paul Krugman who was an advisor to Enron? THAT Paul Krugman?

#2 | Posted by vernon at 2009-11-23 02:18 PM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

Yes, it's the Nobel prize winning Economist Paul Krugman, who normally charges $20,000 per hour to speak and was given a "$50,000 fee for a year's participation in the advisory board, which would entail attending and presenting at two meetings, each of which would extend over two days. The year [Krugman] was on the board only one meeting took place; the other was canceled because of weather."

www.pkarchive.org

And Mr. Summers was right the first time: in the face of the greatest economic catastrophe since the Great Depression, it's much riskier to do too little than it is to do too much. It's sad, and unfortunate, that the administration appears to have lost sight of that truth.

Some are capable of learning from their mistakes. These people don't learn. So they make the same mistakes, alway hoping for a better result. It's never their fault.

Honey, here's the credit card; I know we have a $100,000 credit card debt and our combined income is $60,000/year. Oh, yes, we have a $325,000 mortgage and the recent appraisal was $290,000. That's okay, just keep spending and we'll figure how to pay it off later.

Krugman is Professor of Economics and International Affairs at the Woodrow Wilson School of Public and International Affairs.

My favorite President Woodrow. The man who handed our commerce over to the bankers. Wilson, who gave us the income tax with which to pay off our banker friends, for their trouble.

Corky treats Krugman like he's Nostradamus or something. I think he's a socialist whore.

"This [Federal Reserve Act] establishes the most gigantic trust on earth. When the President
[Wilson} signs this bill, the invisible government of the monetary power will be legalized....
the worst legislative crime of the ages is perpetrated by this banking and currency bill."
-- Charles A. Lindbergh, Sr. , 1913

"Most Americans have no real understanding of the operation of the international money lenders. The accounts of the Federal
Reserve System have never been audited. It operates outside the control of Congress and manipulates the credit of the United
States" -- Sen. Barry Goldwater (Rep. AZ)

Hopefully, Ron Paul's bill will change that.

"Some people think the Federal Reserve Banks are the United States government's institutions.
They are not government institutions. They are private credit monopolies which prey upon the people
of the United States for the benefit of themselves and their foreign swindlers" -- Congressional
Record 12595-12603 -- Louis T. McFadden, Chairman of the Committee on Banking and Currency (12 years) June 10, 1932

Woodrow Wilson, 1916, said:

A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is privately concentrated. The growth of the Nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men... We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated, governments in the civilized worldno longer a government by free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and the duress of small groups of dominant men.

And there you have it, folks; by the time we get through this, our institutions will finally be put under a light which should have happened years ago--people can yell and scream about their partisan politics and who did what but it all started in 1913 with the formation of the federal reserve and it seems that by it's 100 year anniversary (2013) we hopefully will have the destruction of the fed and some new system that will no longer concentrate monetary policy in the hands of a few.

"Yes, it's the Nobel prize winning Economist Paul Krugman...."

Great comeback! The Nobel committee, which also gave the Messiah a Nobel, based on a nomination when he'd been in office only two weeks.

Oh yeah, and let's not forget Arafat, Algore, etc.

great creds there

But the concerns Mr. Obama expressed become comprehensible if you suppose that he's getting his views, directly or indirectly, from Wall Street.
Impossible.

How is it possible that two of the four Wall Street puppets that destroyed our economy, Geithner, Greenspan, Rubin, and Summers are still in charge eleven years later? Replacing Greenspan with Bernanke provided the same continuity as switching Geithner for Paulson. Where is the change? Oh, I almost forgot, there is no change when Wall Street is in charge. Demowussie-Rethuglican debate is about nothing, except creating the illusion of Democracy, while robbing the taxpayer. Their money and yours is on its way to Asia, where it will do Wall Street the most good.

That's okay, just keep spending and we'll figure how to pay it off later.

Just cut your income as much as you can and wait for Jesus to come rescue you.

The Republican Party

"Yes, it's the Nobel prize winning Economist Paul Krugman...."

Great comeback! The Nobel committee, which also gave the Messiah a Nobel, based on a nomination when he'd been in office only two weeks.

Oh yeah, and let's not forget Arafat, Algore, etc.

great creds there

#16 | Posted by vernon at 2009-11-23 11:14 PM | Reply | Flag:

I'll have to pick the choices of the Nobel committee over yours until you have a better track record. They seem to have done quite well overall. Hindsight being 20/20 of course, it is easy to let Arafat ruin the whole thing. Try reading the bios on Nobel.org . They are quite inspiring.

To discount Krugman is foolish. He often speaks truth and one can't expect him to always be right when predicting the future. I trust him more than the majority of people running our financial world. They apparently don't know their asses from a hole in the ground and got us where we are today.

Paul Krugman attempted to WARN the country of the impending doom of following runaway neocon economic policies at least a year before the bust. He was shouted down as a crackpot then, as now.

This is a good read, in which he details what FDR did right and did wrong in helping Americans weather the last depression, also caused by 8 years of those same kind of pro corporate policies of Herbert Hoover.

What Obama Must Do
www.rollingstone.com

Read specifically how the same kind of fearmongers (who also were those who created the problems) turned FDR against his own programs to save Americans at risk and more quickly rescue the economy back then.

My question is this. Considering whose policies CREATED the problem, why is anyone still listening to any neocon republicans about this or any other issue?

Corky treats Krugman like he's Nostradamus or something. I think he's a socialist whore.

#11 | Posted by wurster

Sorry, I'm not your mother. Ask Charles Manson.

"like he's Nostradamus or something. . ."

video.filestube.com

This is a good read, in which he details what FDR did right and did wrong in helping Americans weather the last depression, also caused by 8 years of those same kind of pro corporate policies of Herbert Hoover.

Roosevelt only dragged the depression on for another ten years. It is fiscally impossible to spend your way out of a problem caused by too much spending. The economy didn't start to recover until after he died.

-Roosevelt only dragged the depression on for another ten years

Of course he did....

"If you're like me, you sometimes find yourself speechless when confronted with abject insanity.

If you're like me, for instance, you were dumbfounded when "Forrest Gump" beat out "Pulp Fiction" for best picture; when HBO's "Sopranos" received more accolades than "The Wire"; and when George W. Bush insisted Iraqi airplanes were about to drop WMD on American cities.

So if you're like me, you probably understand why I was momentarily tongue-tied last week after running face-first into conservatives' newest (and most ridiculous) talking point: the one designed to stop Congress from passing an economic stimulus package.

During a Christmas Eve appearance on Fox News, I pointed out that most mainstream economists believe the government must boost the economy with deficit spending.

That's when conservative pundit Monica Crowley said we should instead limit such spending because President Franklin Roosevelt's "massive government intervention actually prolonged the Great Depression." Fox News anchor Gregg Jarrett eagerly concurred, saying "historians pretty much agree on that."

Of course, I had recently heard snippets of this silly argument; right-wing pundits are repeating it everywhere these days. But I had never heard it articulated in such preposterous terms, so my initial reaction was paralysis, the mouth-agape, deer-in-the-headlights kind. Only after collecting myself did I say that such assertions about the New Deal were absurd. But then I was laughed at, as if it was hilarious to say that the New Deal did anything but exacerbate the Depression.

Afterward, suffering pangs of self-doubt, I wondered whether I and most of the country were the crazy ones. Sure, the vast majority of Americans think the New Deal worked well. But are conservatives right? Did the New Deal's "massive government intervention prolong the Great Depression?"

Ummm ... no.

On deeper examination, I discovered that the right bases its New Deal revisionism on the short-lived recession in a year straddling 1937 and 1938. But that was four years into Roosevelt's term -- four years marked by spectacular economic growth. Additionally, the fleeting decline happened not because of the New Deal's spending programs, but because Roosevelt momentarily listened to conservatives and backed off them. As Nobel-winning economist Paul Krugman notes, in 1937-38, FDR "was persuaded to balance the budget" and "cut spending and the economy went back down again."

To be sure, you can credibly argue that the New Deal had its share of problems. But overall, the numbers prove it helped -- rather than hurt -- the macroeconomy. "Excepting 1937-1938, unemployment fell each year of Roosevelt's first two terms [while] the U.S. economy grew at average annual growth rates of 9 percent to 10 percent," writes University of California historian Eric Rauchway."

more

mobile.salon.com

To support Krugman's arguement with Krugman's arguement is kinda silly - doesn't anyone else agree with this guy that you could cite?

MATSOP - What Wilson said about government control is sad because he was agreeing with it and it was his progressive goal....

Paul Krugman - "didn't do any subprime lending, because they can't: the definition of a subprime loan is precisely a loan that doesn't meet the requirement, imposed by law, that Fannie and Freddie buy only mortgages issued to borrowers who made substantial down payments and carefully documented their income." (New York Times, July 18, 2008)

Over the period 1997-2007 Fannie and Freddi acquired a total of $2.2 trillion in subprime loans and private securities backed by subprime loans.

Krugman has "confirmational bias" syndrome, Krugman can't face the fact that government policies have greatly influenced the current state of the economy, why would you expect him to now think anything the government does is wrong.

PaulKrugman- "Still, what about the possibility of a squeeze, in which rising rates for whatever reason produce a vicious circle of collapsing balance sheets among the carry traders, higher rates, and so on? Well, we've seen enough of that sort of thing not to dismiss the possibility. But if it does happen, it's a financial system problem not a deficit problem."

The financial system will collapse, which is due to an economic policy which will lead to high unemployment, which leads to this gem....

PaulKrugman - "I just don't think the inner circle gets how much danger we're in from another vicious circle, one that's real, not hypothetical. The longer high unemployment drags on, the greater the odds that crazy people will win big in the midterm elections dooming us to economic policy failure on a truly grand scale."

Fascinating logic, high unemployment of a failed economic policy will doom us to a failed economic policy...

"And let's not forget that Wall Street which somehow failed to recognize the biggest housing bubble in history

#2 | Posted by vernon

Wall street is being driven by day trade. They give no thought to next year at all.

#27

Great Post.

Of course, as usual, the "nattering nabobs of negativity", who supported the FAILED neocon/repug policies that created the economic mess we are in have NO SOLUTIONS, NO DIFFERENT PLANS.....just more of the same policies that doomed our economy under the last 40 years of their policies....nixon thru aWol.....

But they KNOW for sure that Krugman is wrong and FDR made the depression worse and Obama will fail....

GOP=the party of NO, (no plan, no solutions, just no) eh?

GOP=the party of NO, (no plan, no solutions, just no) eh?

#29 | Posted by woke

I don't know what they are saying now but the answer is to reduce the goverment by at least 75%.

Wall street is being driven by day trade. They give no thought to next year at all.

#28 | Posted by Sniper at 2009-11-24 10:57 AM | Reply | Flag:

Any trade opened and closed within a 7 day period should be taxed at 75%.

the answer is to reduce the goverment by at least 75%.

#30 | POSTED BY SNIPER AT 2009-11-24 03:42 PM

That's the same neocon plan we've heard since reagan, who quadtrupled the national debt.....thru aWol, who doubled it to 10 trillion.......with 6 years of repug congress and scotus.

Same neocon mantra.....as always:

My goal is to cut government in half in twenty-five years, to get it down to the size where we can drown it in the bathtub.
Grover Norquist

Mission Accomplished, eh?

Deregulation of banks, utilities, corporations...don't worry, they'll do the right thing....eh? Tax breaks for the richest 150,000 Americans who avg $7.4 million a year.....don't worry the money will TRICKLE DOWN to those who actually WORK for a living....eh?

Hasn't that bs been debunked by FACTS and REALITY for you yet?

Let me ask you this: Why do you people HATE the US government and American working people so much?

Why do you people HATE the US government and American working people so much?

The "Why do people who disagree with me hate America so much" line is so fucking stupid.

It's not about disagreeing with me.

It's about disagreeing with the US constitution, rules of law and especially policies that are good for the WORKING people instead of the legacies who inherit the millions granddaddy made or the speculators who fk it up for everyone else, creating faux market bubbles etc.

But, if you cannot debate using facts, just denigrate the messenger, that always works....

or does it?

"This [Federal Reserve Act] establishes the most gigantic trust on earth. When the President
[Wilson} signs this bill, the invisible government of the monetary power will be legalized....
the worst legislative crime of the ages is perpetrated by this banking and currency bill."
-- Charles A. Lindbergh, Sr. , 1913

PS: I like Hitler a lot.

It's about disagreeing with the US constitution,

So those who disagree with the 2nd amendment (and there are a lot of lefties who do) also hate America?

You're a joke if you think anyone who disagrees with the Constitution hates America. And I stand by my statement: The "You hate America" line is dull, passe, and only used by ignorant people.

...if you cannot debate using facts...

And that's a fact. Deal with it

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