Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Friday, November 20, 2009

If you have a frequent flyer arrangement with virtually any of the airlines (who doesn't), you have received notification of the new program. The new requirements may not seem like much of a change, but this is only because of the incrementalism of the approach used by the TSA.

The actual legal history of fighting the TSA is actually very interesting. The analysis describes actual laws being broken by the strengthening TSA requirements. This is July, 2008, before any Secure Flight procedures.

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Protecting air safety is essential, but professional screening at airports already provides for it. Giving the TSA as an official agency the additional authority to decide who gets to go where reaches beyond safety into overextended governmental power. This newly minted "Secure Flight" rule fundamentally imbalances long-standing citizens' rights both to travel and to be left alone. If your name appears among hundreds of thousands on "watchlists," you assert that the government should not require ID to fly, you don't want to reveal your date of birth for concern about identity theft, or you don't choose to declare your gender, you can stay home.

By combining the requirement for government photo IDs in order to fly with checking government watchlists including potentially every passenger, "Secure Flight" puts the federal government into the business of licensing travel. All travelers will need government OK in order to board a flight, or take a cruise. What the government can allow one day, it can forbid the next. All things considered, isn't this a higher-tech and later-day version of South African domestic passports or eastern European checkpoints? In fact, because of the high technological capacity of the U.S. version, aren't its implications for travel control of plane, train, bus and subway travel much more far reaching? It's incredible that something like this is happening relatively unrecognized in America.

While some people consider the requirement to show ID or reveal a birth date a small trade-off for security, what is at stake here is the right to travel. That fundamental freedom of movement appears in the Articles of Confederation in the right to freely enter and leave all the states of the then small union. It was so fundamentally a part of American citizenship that the privileges and immunities clauses of the Constitution included it without explicitly mentioning it again for the more perfect union. With a large and expansive nation now ranging from Hawaii and Alaska to Washington DC, that right to travel nationally, and petition the distant government, is even more fundamental. Yet some courts maintain that if you can walk, you don't need the right to fly. People have the right to walk around freely without carrying a national ID; why do they have to show one to travel? The Supreme Court has yet to rule on the scope of the right to travel but lower courts have tended to restrict it more narrowly than the Founding Fathers would approve.

Clearly, the air ID and "Secure Flight" rules mean you cannot travel any distance reachable only by air without official permission. Moreover, the system can easily be extended to Amtrak as a government railroad, which already requires government ID in order to purchase a ticket. It can further be extended to urban rapid-transit networks tied to travel cards, and private inter-city buses requiring IDs to buy tickets or board coaches. These are the bases for an internal passport system in the U.S.

There are a lot of practical issues here too. The assumption that any "no-fly" list includes all potential wrong doers is implausible, and first time criminals would by definition not appear until it's too late. Many people on these lists are there because their names are similar to those who are suspect for other reasons. There are perhaps a few hundred people whose past activities merit keeping them off the streets, let alone flights; the small group is better caught through search warrants and good police work before they come to the airport. To demand that 750 million annual passengers have to get government permissions to fly creates a needle in-a-haystack approach to locating a few potential wrongdoers

Secure Flight, Insecure Travel Rights

TSA Agent; 'So, I see you want to go to Pheonix, hmmmm'?

Passenger; 'Yes that's right'.

Tsa; 'May I ask why?'

Passenger; 'It's none of your damn business'.

Tsa; 'Sully, take this one down to the 'tank' until his attitude improves'.

Tas; 'NEXT'!!!

Tsa; 'So you want to go to Pheonix, hmmmm'?

Passenger; 'Yes I live there, I must hurry, my wife is expecting a baby any day now'.

Tsa; 'yes I see that. did you know that she is seeing another man, hmmmm? and she is going to leave you and take your bass boat, because this is his child'?

Passenger; 'huh?

Tsa; 'Yes if you hurry, you can catch them because he has a 4 pm tee-time'.......


Question for all apathetic DR'ers.

What did you do when you were notified by the airlines to hand them over more of your privacy data?

Anyone have to use the redress number yet?

I know. Ok, I'll bend over and take another rape job. Please oh please, mr tsa, I'm not [sic]alkiyda. Please let me on your airplane. I promise to be a good slave and stop demanding my constitutional rights. I understand you are just protecting me from mr boogeyman.

What did you do when you were notified by the airlines to hand them over more of your privacy data?

I haven't been notified of this. Is this a very recent thing?

goat: just a thought, instead of asking for a spoon-feeding, why don't you go find out for yourself?

"As long as a person can not think for himself, decide for himself, and act on his own decisions, he is a slave of those who make decisions for him."

Of course we all know the goat doesn't really wish to acknowledge the truth, even more of an indication of a slave.

goat: just a thought, instead of asking for a spoon-feeding, why don't you go find out for yourself?

Actually I have. That is why I asked the question. Until three months ago, I flew every two weeks for years. Now it is every three weeks for my crew change. I do not notice any difference in security at all except I have to take off my shoes now and issues with carrying liquids. I still have to show my driver's licence as I always have. Not anything more.

I haven't any idea about this handing over more of my privacy data you refer to. Please don't evade the question. I honestly have no idea what you are talking about and I have been a freqent flyer for years.

Either way, Goat, the story answers the question,
you cannot rightly feign ignorance and ask it to be explained to you having not even read it [even if you state that you haven't seen the changes].

Perhaps, you had already submitted your dob, and name matching your gov't issued ID as part of the earlier "voluntary" program. That doesn't change the fact that now everyone is being told to do this. If you had read the story, you would have known this and seen as well that it is announced that some will be affected either way, based on the new redress process.

All I know is that 10, 15, 20 years ago I had to show ID, my drivers' licence. Today I still show it and nothing more.

I can deal with it. If you want to make a big deal out it and call me a slave for continuing to do what I have done my entire flying life, go for it. I've got bigger battles in life to fight, so I'll forego the one that mandates I keep doing what I've been doing for decades. They've got my name, dob, and address. BFD Who doesn't?

Wow goat, what do we call this, the Florence Nightingale effect or what!

Who exactly do you think you can fool? Any moron knows the vast difference since 2001. Once you accept that as a slave, now you wish to whitewash the latest piece of incrementalism. But once a slave, you are now also the toad that won't jump out of slowly rising water temperature.

Any moron knows the vast difference since 2001.

I guess I'm not a moron. I don't know any difference, much less a 'vast' one as far as privacy is concerned. in 2000 I showed a driver's license to board a plane. Today I show a driver's license to board a plane.

Tell me, what do you have to do differently (privacy wise) when you board a plane that you didn't do in 2000? I truly am curious.

As a frequent flyer that you claim to be, why would I waste my time posting dozens of new regulations that have occured since 2001 that you obviously would know about?

Only two possibilities remain: a complete blathering brainless idiot who deserves to be a slave
or a complete fraud playing a game who enjoys their slavery.

I asked a simple question, l_r: As far as privacy goes, how is boading a plane any different today than it was in 2000? If you see no difference say so. Don't call names a be obtuse.

I am sincere when I ask you how boarding a plane has changed in the last 9 years privacy wise.

SInce L_R can't answer, maybe someone else can tell me if they feel their "privacy data" has been compromised

Only two possibilities remain: a complete blathering brainless idiot who deserves to be a slave
or a complete fraud playing a game who enjoys their slavery.

There is a third possibility: You are wrong in your post #3 when you said I was handing over more privacy data.

Clearly the answer is three unless you can tell me what privacy data I have handed over to 'them' except my name, address, DoB and DL # -- same as I did in the year 1980

Well?

Mr Goat,

You have moved the goalposts. From your own posting, you're initial fraudulent intent was that you had no knowledge that it was required to provide dob, gender, name matching govt-issued ID. I haven't been notified of this. Is this a very recent thing?

Then came the admission you have been a frequent flyer for years: I haven't any idea about this handing over more of my privacy data you refer to. Please don't evade the question. I honestly have no idea what you are talking about and I have been a freqent flyer for years.

Upon a reply that you have must have chosen to voluntarily submit this information prior to now, there was no denial.

Then the central issue became, 'even so, the basic privacy issue hasn't changed at all in 20 or 30 years. This is so laughable that isn't worth a reply. Apparently everyone else agrees, as nobody chose to enlighten you on the incrementalism of the vast change in authority of the TSA over just the last 8 years.

Finally, the move of the goalposts back again in your claim that a third option is I was wrong all along to state that you gave up additional privacy info.

How laughable in light of #7 reply Perhaps, you had already submitted your dob, and name matching your gov't issued ID as part of the earlier "voluntary" program. which you never denied.

You have moved the goalposts.

No moving goalposts. Rather than a dissertation, just answer the simple question I asked above:

How is checking in for a flight any different (privacy data wise) today than it was 10 or twenty years ago?

It is no different to me. They ask for my drivers' license just like 20 years ago. That's it

I await your reply

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