Remember Obama's pledge. No one earning under 250K per year will see any increase in tax of any type.

Time to MoveOn and hope for change.

Just 1% tax of the top 1% "earners" will pay for 50% of the entire nations health care needs.

The rich merely want use to hope for their spare change.

Red, do you have any facts to back up your claim.

1% tax of the top 1% of income is not 8% of the nations GDP

No I don't have any facts.

In 2007, the top 1 percent of tax returns paid 40.4 percent of all federal individual income taxes

Thay paid 451 billion dollars. If you increase there income tax by 1%, that would cause a 3% overall increase in payments, asming a 33% marginal tax rate, that equals about 13 billion dollars.

Not ayywhere close to 50% of the cost of health care. currently at 16% of our GDP.

all info from 'bulls and bears' this morning on fox business

CBO says...baucas plan WILL cut benefits

also says that humana claims ARE 'accurate'..these are the claims that the obamatons are destroying the first amendment over by telling them they can no longer give thier customers info on reform.
(sure sounds a lot like the 1930's)

also from CBO...baucas bill will TAX businessess more who hire single low income workers who have children....why do dems hate single moms?????
because guess what people employers will refuse to hire?

one guest made sense.
he said most reform he has seen puts COVERAGE above cost savings and it shouls be the other way around
makes sense...DOESNT IT OR Not???????

Thay paid 451 billion dollars. If you increase there income tax by 1%, that would cause a 3% overall increase in payments, asming a 33% marginal tax rate, that equals about 13 billion dollars.

And that assumes that the top one percent won't take measures to evade taxes at the higher rates. All experience says that an increase will result in a net loss.

Liberals live in a dream world always scheming on ways to steal from the productive segment of society. Then these same tax consumers complain that the producers don't pay their fair share, whatever "fair" is supposed to mean.

Just 1% tax of the top 1% "earners" will pay for 50% of the entire nations health care needs.

The rich merely want use to hope for their spare change.

#2 | Posted by redlightrobot

Where did you hear that?

That is not true.

anyone who still believes that obamacare wont come with higher taxes for everyone and fees as well as reduced benefits and care.. needs to click thier heels and head on back to kansas with dorothy because they are dreaming

Our health insurance system sucks. It's not really insurance at all, because it's involved in every single health care expenditure you make. It's like buying auto insurance and having to buy your gas and car repairs through your insurer, complete with their markup, and be told sometimes that they won't pay for the repairs because you don't need them.

Health care providers quote one price to insurers, because they have them by the balls, and another price 10-20 times higher to the public.

It should be illegal to have two prices.

I want to buy health insurance to cover against catastrophe and to pay for all preventative and routine care completely out of pocket. And I want catastrophic health insurance is guaranteed for life with no pre-existing conditions.

this from the email this morning

And, to add even more insult to injury, it's now clear they have no intention of letting you read it.

You read that right. On an almost straight party-line vote, Democrats in the Senate Finance Committee squashed an amendment by Senator Jim Bunning that would have required Baucus' ObamaCare bill to be posted on the Internet - for all Americans to read - for 72 hours prior to the Committee voting on it.

Not only that. Bunning's amendment also called for requiring the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office's official tally of how much Baucus' ObamaCare 6.0 will cost the American people and what the real impact will be on health costs to be released before the it was voted on.

It's as plain as the nose on your face.

They're leaving the door wide-open to pass Baucus' ObamaCare 6.0 proposal in the dead of night... under the cover of darkness... without even telling you and other concerned Americans what it will cost and how it will affect your health care.

but rcade
dems dont WANT you to know what it costs or what you can get
last week on cspan I watched the senate committe when cornyn proposes a 'consumer reports' style system that people could find out info they needed to know

baucas raised such a stink that cornyn withdrew it

and it even HAD some democrat support..wyden from oregon.

here is another little tidbit

pay for insurance and if you dont pay the fine

you will GO TO JAIL>...

This pick-n-choose taxation lately is a crock of shit.

Ex:

Tax on sugary soda, but not cookies or candy.

Where do you draw the line???

Wouldn't the Fair Tax plan (sales v. income) alleviate all of this?

Why not?

It should be illegal to have two prices.

Yes, it should.

Poor Babbler spinning his little half remembered sound bytes desperately trying to stave off the increasing realisation that the American health Care system is sick and can't be left untreated.

Lefties are arguing legitimate policy changes neccessary to put Health Care back in the pink?

That's good to see.

Rtards continue to play the HealthScare game?

Sad is that.

Be Well.

the unions are pissed about this,so it's not going to happen,it affects a lot of there members.

spud....
I said earlier

if you are going to post...stop smoking whatever that is that you are smoking..

semtex

I believe you are correct in that comment.

and as rhom said the other night on charlie rose

they are going to stuff this down our throat regardless.......but IM sure he wasnt refering to anything the union bosses dont like

So, you are willing to pay MORE to take care of your own health care, so you get taxed?

Yeah, makes a lot of sense to me....to quote Bugs Bunny "What a maroon."

This thread reminds me of the Genii jokes. Liberals should think twice before they make their wishes. I can't think of anything government does without fucking it up. They can't even make money on the Post Office.

"They can't even make money on the Post Office"

Government isn't supposed to "make money" on the Post Office anymore than it's supposed to make a profit on public libraries. Those are public services, not for-profit enterprises, dumbshit.

^.^

Gotta luv the Steal & Bitch Liberalistas who tax the richest 1% of our citizens, then complain that they're not contributing enough to our society.

I for one don't see why high-end insurance is a problem. If you can pay for it, so much the better. And I don't understand why Liberalistas can't do simple math ... the top 1% of taxpayers in the country already pay over 40% of the nation's taxes, and this does not take into account that the nation's top businesses also pay most of the corporate taxes.

It seems to me that too many of the people who support the Obamacare plan are far too willing to throw capitalism overboard and embrace socialism or communism just to be sure that everyone is covered by health care. Don't worry that some people don't want or need it ... cover everyone, no matter what the cost to the country.

^.^

"Government isn't supposed to "make money" on the Post Office anymore than it's supposed to make a profit on public libraries. Those are public services, not for-profit enterprises, dumbshit."

That'd be why they keep raising the rates on stamps, right?

The point trying to be made, I think, is that government can't run the post office effeciently at all, yet we are supposed to trust them with running a healthcare system that controls 1/6th of the economy?

Yeah..

John B.

NeoCommie Ass Bags can't wait to tax the shit out of everything. At least they can't run on a centrist theme in the next election

Those are public services, not for-profit enterprises, dumbshit.

#20 | Posted by nullifidian

Dog brain poops again. It was in the 70s or 80s when the Post Office was privatized on the promise it would become profitable. So was Amtrack and every other government sponsored agency like Fannie Mae. Washington can't even balance its own budget, running deficits that are nothing short of criminal.

"The point trying to be made, I think, is that government can't run the post office effeciently at all,"

The post office is very efficient and very popular, for good reason. Of course, the only measure of "efficiency" among rtards is profitability. A public service can be efficient even it runs a loss, if it provides services that no else is willing to provide.

A public service can be efficient even it runs a loss, if it provides services that no else is willing to provide.
#25 | Posted by nullifidian

More dogshit. Postal inspectors shut down anyone who tries to compete. Federal Express and United Parcel would accept First Class mail without second thought if they could do it legally.

So even with a legal monopoly on First Class mail,the Post Office hasn't been able to do without subsidies.

" Post Office hasn't been able to do without subsidies."

Neither do public libraries, shithead. Public services are--by definition--subsidized.

Liberals live in a dream world always scheming on ways to steal from the productive segment of society.

I find humor in this condescention.

And who is the productive segment of society?

I guess the other 99% of the population do nothing.

First class mail? You have really be shitten me.

When we pay fed X to get it there over night it generally means 2 to 3 working days.

Pay for 3 day delivery and it will take generally a fricken week to 10 days.

And that is for PROFIT.

See if you could do over night to dorkville Kansas.....LOL ray you live in a dream world.

Ray,

That is you live in an ECONOMIC dream world...LOL

^.^

*agrees with Ray*

FedEx and other delivery services would LOVE to get into the mail business. The competition would serve to keep prices reasonable.

However, there are some larger parts of the picture that need to be considered.

First, the government would have to ensure a uniform standard of postage, otherwise USPS, FedEx, and others would charge varying rates for postage. Perhaps maintaining the use of US postage stamps would work in this matter.

The second, and perhaps bigger problem is the fact that people use email in much the same way that postage was used before. I play in a political/diplomacy game that before the days of the Internet, would have been done via postage, it would have taken days or weeks to get materials sent to the game moderator, and those games used to charge $5-10 a turn.

Nowdays, these sorts of games are carried on places like Yahoo Groups, all sorts of player interactions happen each day, turns are sent in over email, and it's all free.

That's one example of how the Internet has affected the postal service. How many companies have saved money by emailing letters rather than sending them through the mail?

I realize this is a thread about healthcare, but one of the main arguments against government-run healthcare is that the government can not do healthcare better or more effeciently than the private sector, and that is only ONE argument against government-run healthcare.

There are other arguments that are as persuasive, if not more.

Nothing that has gone private has provided better and more efficient service to the masses that government operated. NOTHING.

Private enterprise operates for profit, not service to the mass public.

Dorkville kansas would no longer get mail service.

Neither do public libraries, shithead. Public services are--by definition--subsidized.

#27 | Posted by nullifidian

How many time do I have to repeat myself? Libraries make no such pretense. The Post Office was privatized decades ago on the pretense it could get off of subsidies. This is not a service that can't be done in the private sector.

When we pay fed X to get it there over night it generally means 2 to 3 working days.

Pay for 3 day delivery and it will take generally a fricken week to 10 days.

You must have really shitty fedex service where you live. I'm surprised they get business in your part of the country at all if that's true. My experience with Fedex has always been that they deliver as promised 100% of the time.

You say "generally takes" indicating that these very late deliveries are the norm. Sorry, I have to call BS. But then again, weren't you the guy who said that jet fuel is water soluble and you can get knocked off your feet from 50 feet in front of a jet engine intake? LOL

You live in a strange world, runnysore

Nothing that has gone private has provided better and more efficient service to the masses that government operated. NOTHING

Bullshit. Private schools consistently produce better educated students than those from public schools.

Go dissolve some jet fuel in water or something.

#34 | Posted by Ray

You're full of shit, Ray. Just a few weeks ago you admitted that you had no problems with the postal service. Your ideological fantasies are the real problem.

The Post Office was privatized decades ago on the pretense it could get off of subsidies. This is not a service that can't be done in the private sector.

You are one obtuse idiot.

The United States Postal Service (USPS) is an independent agency of the United States government responsible for providing postal service in the United States. It is one of the few government agencies explicitly authorized by the United States Constitution. Within the United States, it is commonly referred to as the "Post Office", "Postal Service", or "U.S. Mail".

Though postal services have existed on American territory before the United States's establishment, the USPS's first incarnation was established by Benjamin Franklin in Philadelphia in 1775 by decree of the Second Continental Congress. The Post Office Department was created from this in 1792 as part of the United States Cabinet, its current form in 1970 under the Postal Reorganization Act.

Since its reorganization in to an independent organization, the USPS has become self-sufficient and has not received taxpayer-dollars since the early 1980s. The decline of mail volume due to increased usage of e-mail has forced the postal service to look to other sources of revenue while cutting costs to maintain this financial balance.

Do you see anywhere here that says PRIVATIZED?????????

I see independent agency of the UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT.....apparently to ray, independent means privatized.

And notice HAS NOT RECEIVED TAX PAYER DOLLARS SINCE 1980S.

Wow, ray do you even research the shit you post.

Bullshit. Private schools consistently produce better educated students than those from public schools.

Once again goatman doesn't know how to read and cognitively understand the post.

private schools???? To the entire nation?????

Stop your selective word choice games you moron.

That is you live in an ECONOMIC dream world...LOL
#31 | Posted by moneywar

I dream of gold bars jumping over a fence.

I find humor in this condescention.
And who is the productive segment of society?
I guess the other 99% of the population do nothing.

Government produces nothing. It gets its revenue by extorting what it needs from the sector that produces things consumers are willing to pay for. Over half of society gets some form of wages or benefits from government.

There is nothing funny about a self-destructive system of politics that rewards larceny.

Once again goatman doesn't know how to read and cognitively understand the post.

You said "NEVER". You were wrong. I rubbed you nose in it. Now go to the corner, lick your wounds, and stop deflecting and whining

You say "generally takes" indicating that these very late deliveries are the norm. Sorry, I have to call BS. But then again, weren't you the guy who said that jet fuel is water soluble and you can get knocked off your feet from 50 feet in front of a jet engine intake? LOL

The purpose of this post?????

Jet fuel obsorbs water.......but you playing of word games.........we all know.

And I am about to head for work, why don't you come along. Doing engine runs, let you stand in front of #2 engine at 50 ft why we do full power......we will see how you do.....you just don't know shit.

Goat you have yet to show me wrong...but keep playing your fucking moron word games....shall we call you tosser too.

"Government produces nothing. "

That's simpleton bullshit. How many trillions of dollars of commerce are directly attributable to the Interstate Highway System?

private schools???? To the entire nation?????

That's the way it was until late in the 19th century. I think it was Massachusetts that introduced the idea of tax funded public schools. Over time it crowded out private schools.

There is very good reason why every government in the world, communist and capitalist alike, operate their school system: young minds are the easiest to mold to serve the needs of government self interests. I think it is a major factor in the growth of government.

Doing engine runs, let you stand in front of #2 engine at 50 ft why we do full power......we will see how you do.....you just don't know shit.

I know you can't get knocked off your feet from 50 feet in front of an air intake. The force of the moving air drops off as a funtion of the inverse of the cube of the distance away. I asked you for a link to prove that once and you showed me simple minded diagram with an arc that was drawn around the intake that was 5 meters (if I remember correctly) in front of it.

Link or stink, runnysore.

While at work mix some jet fuel and water in a bottle, shake it, wait a few minutes, and tell me what happens. It doesn't dissolve as you once claimed.

Ray you're just moronic crap.

Private school systems left the poor and poverty masses out of the picture or privided little education in terms of commitment....no money in it.

Fucking come back to earth ray, you are way out in the stars....some one must of hit you in the head with a black book too many times.

" think it was Massachusetts that introduced the idea of tax funded public schools."

And the idea was to breed good little conformist wage slaves. Ironic that the right now hates the public school system.

You don't know shit goat, I do it for a living every fucking day...and I provided you with a link but you couldn't figure out what the safety circle margin was.

Just like tosser.

How many time do I have to repeat myself? Libraries make no such pretense. The Post Office was privatized decades ago on the pretense it could get off of subsidies. This is not a service that can't be done in the private sector.

Posted by Ray

the Federal Reserve being privately owned is proof of that ~ ask Data:>)

"Government produces nothing. "

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA

And to think someone posted that on the internet.
That has to be the funniest thing I've read since Grendel was using transistors to claim quantum mechanics was bogus.

why can we tax the FED?

hell, we can't even audit it ~ lol

Goat you have yet to show me wrong...

I don't have to show you wrong. You made the claim. You bear the burden of proof.

Outside a legal context, "burden of proof" means that someone suggesting a new theory or stating a claim must provide evidence to support it: it is not sufficient to say "you can't disprove this." Specifically, when anyone is making a bold claim, and especially a positive claim, it is not someone else's responsibility to disprove the claim, but is rather the responsibility of the person who is making the bold claim to prove it. In short, X is not proven simply because "not X" cannot be proven (see negative proof).

That's simpleton bullshit. How many trillions of dollars of commerce are directly attributable to the Interstate Highway System?
#44 | Posted by nullifidian

It was paid for by the private sector. Government infrastructure project are a mixed bag. The Interstate Highway system was a success while the New Orleans levees are a waste of money. I have no issue with public roads.

^.^

"And notice HAS NOT RECEIVED TAX PAYER DOLLARS SINCE 1980S."

That's why the cost of a stamp has gone up so much ... the postal service uses money from stamps (in part) to run its operations.

Let me put it this way, if government does things so good, and they're so effecient and benevolent, why stop at healthcare?

I want the government to provide a bureaucracy to provide for all my needs, and not just my needs, but everyone's needs ...and heck, once we're done there, we can even start looking into people's WANTS.

By the time that's done, Iran will have to nuke us to put us out of our collective misery.

and I provided you with a link but you couldn't figure out what the safety circle margin was.

Yes, I guess I'm pretty stupid. All that drawing had was a yellow arc at 5 meters with no explanatory words at all and I was supposed to deduce that it meant that you could get knocked off your feet at 50 feet?

LOL

I think you are more imaginitive than I am stupid.

I want to buy health insurance to cover against catastrophe and to pay for all preventative and routine care completely out of pocket. And I want catastrophic health insurance is guaranteed for life with no pre-existing conditions.

#9 | Posted by rcade at 2009-09-26 11:55 AM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e

And to think someone posted that on the internet.
That has to be the funniest thing I've read since Grendel was using transistors to claim quantum mechanics was bogus.
#51 | Posted by Zatoichi

Then tell me. What does government operate in the marketplace that makes a profit - for government? To say it another way. Name something government does that doesn't depend on taxes?

Time and time again when I argue on this site, I'm running into the likes of ignoramuses like Zat who think they understand economics.

"By the time that's done, Iran will have to nuke us to put us out of our collective misery"

I can hardly wait

Ray you're just moronic crap.
Private school systems left the poor and poverty masses out of the picture or privided little education in terms of commitment....no money in it.
Fucking come back to earth ray, you are way out in the stars....some one must of hit you in the head with a black book too many times.
#47 | Posted by moneywar

Like I said before, Moneywar is a classic case of what government education produces these days. Lacking critical thinking skills, he is all primed full of government mythology.

Parents have long placed a high value on the education of their children. Illiteracy declined as the wealth of this country grew. As an example, parents to this day make sacrifices to send their children to college.

#60 | Posted by Ray at 2009-09-26 05:36 PM | Reply | Flag: irony went right by

Go find out where the internet came from, Ray.

In the mean time I'm laughing my ass off.
Thanks for the entertainment, it's better than Faux News.

In the mean time I'm laughing my ass off.
Thanks for the entertainment, it's better than Faux News.

Posted by Zatoichi

"another lost soul for Lisa to save"

Go find out where the internet came from, Ray.
In the mean time I'm laughing my ass off.
Thanks for the entertainment, it's better than Faux News.
#61 | Posted by Zatoichi

Duh. The government inventors could not imagined what entrepreneurs would do with the idea. Without a market economy there would have been no Internet as we know it. I can almost hear your stupid laugh.

#63 | Posted by Ray at 2009-09-26 06:08 PM | Reply | Flag: hallucinating again

If it wasn't for ARPANET there would be no internet and you'd just be another nut mumbling bullshit on a street corner.

Somehow "the government produces nothing" doesn't quite measure up to Ray's backpedaling bullshit. How's that $2,000 an ounce gold doing, mr 'engineer?'

How's that $2,000 an ounce gold doing, mr 'engineer?'

Posted by Zatoichi

so $1000 an ounce is normal now?

The World Wide Web, another government creation.

Bani would do well to notice gold is trading where it was decades ago.

Bani would do well to notice gold is trading where it was decades ago.

Posted by Zatoichi

only for a moment as TEXAS folks tried to corner the market ~ or was that silver ~ my bad:>)

If it wasn't for ARPANET there would be no internet and you'd just be another nut mumbling bullshit on a street corner.
#64 | Posted by Zatoichi

If you imagine there would have been no Internet otherwise, you're delusional.

Somehow "the government produces nothing" doesn't quite measure up to Ray's backpedaling bullshit. How's that $2,000 an ounce gold doing, mr 'engineer?'
#65 | Posted by Zatoich

You're making a big deal because gold is not 2,000 yet? It's only up almost four times in eight years.

Our health insurance system sucks. It's not really insurance at all, because it's involved in every single health care expenditure you make. It's like buying auto insurance and having to buy your gas and car repairs through your insurer, complete with their markup, and be told sometimes that they won't pay for the repairs because you don't need them.
Health care providers quote one price to insurers, because they have them by the balls, and another price 10-20 times higher to the public.
It should be illegal to have two prices.
I want to buy health insurance to cover against catastrophe and to pay for all preventative and routine care completely out of pocket. And I want catastrophic health insurance is guaranteed for life with no pre-existing conditions.

#9 | POSTED BY RCADE

agreed.. I just paid 1800 bucks our of pocket for my family to pay up premiums through NOVEMBER. My wifes prescriptions were denied because of a policy number discrepancy which doesn't ever seem to get resolved even though I speak to the tools at medco 2 times a month to make sure they have been authorized from United Hate Care to allow Walgreens to submit for reduced out of pocket. f'ing amazing.

I say to all the people that don't want a public option.. FUCK YOU. I HOPE and wish that you HAVE to go through medical insurance hell at some point just to have the experience of DENIED for a 180/ prescription after giving 1800 out of pocket to allow it. It will get resolved but as usual they get the money float we get the turd.

^.^

The problem with the ARPANET analogy is that it was based at schools like MIT and such ... I don't think something like ARPANET would have stayed a secret.

Liberals live in a dream world always scheming on ways to steal from the productive segment of society. Then these same tax consumers complain that the producers don't pay their fair share, whatever "fair" is supposed to mean.

#6 | POSTED BY RAY

Yeah..its always the evil liberals.. You fucks have no soul. Its all about the coin every time except when killing people you can't see or know. Remember Ray your money is worth something because the other 99% of the non wealthy working indentured say/agree it is worth more than Charmin. If you continually fuck the 99% you may end up with NOTHING. That is 0 in US Dollars. You go to Europe your tax rate will double. You go to a third world dictatorship you may be robbed, killed or imprisoned at the whim of the leadership. You have it good here, quit bitching.

That is called Freedom....the result of making free decisions is an economic system called capitalism that rewards those who meet the needs of the consumers the best. But you guys are supporting having the Federal Government CHARGE ME for making a decision I think is best for MY FAMILY. So much for Freedom.
Unleashing the 1600 insurance providers and allowing them to compete in ALL states will result in massive competition which drives out costs. Having the federal government tell me what decision I have to make - that is communistic

#57 | POSTED BY FOSHAFFER

..and the thing is these retards believe they have "free-dumb" and that capitalism is the panacea for all thing.. Fucking idiots.

Pure capitalism gave us child labor, slavery and robber barons. Pure Capitalism gave us an economic depression every 10-15 years causing untold misery on the populace.

You haven't had pure freedom since the 1700's so get over it.

Communistic..what a load of horse-shit. I would bet 10 dollars to a bucket of beer you have never even been in a "communistic" country let alone understand the inner working of said government. Don't like it, move asshole.

#72 | Posted by Legio

No it's not always the evil liberals. It's the combination of liberalism and conservatism - war and welfare.

I've got news for you. The government you trust to grant your every wish is robbing you blind. I'm always amazed how it is done in full public while statists like you think you're ahead in this game of robbing Peter to pay Paul. This country is going bankrupt fast. It's only a matter of time when the other 99% end up with nothing.

You go to a third world dictatorship you may be robbed, killed or imprisoned at the whim of the leadership. You have it good here, quit bitching.

That's no reason to accept our criminal government because it's not as bad as other criminal governments. I won't stop bitching about the willful blindness of statists.

"You fucks have no soul. Its all about the coin every time except when killing people you can't see or know. "

That's why they are correctly called, "propertarians".

How's that $2,000 an ounce gold doing, mr 'engineer?'
Posted by Zatoichi
so $1000 an ounce is normal now?

#66 | POSTED BY BANI
uh yes moron..

Gold is essentially lower in real terms when you account for inflation than say money put into IBM in 1977 or KO or some other blue chip. The overall DOW is 8.5 times since 1972 versus GOLD which is 25X since 72.. Gold SHOULD be at 600 or below to be in reality.

You want a real hedge buy oil..

10k invested in Gold in 1972 would have grossed you 202,932 through Dec 2008.

10k invested in Dividend paying DJIA Stocks in 1972 through the same time period would gross you 501,440 dollars.

#76 | Posted by Legio

Every $1K I paid for DELL for my kids in '91 made a lot. My kids paid tuition in cash and can have a debt-free life if they chose to do so.

I intentionally didn't give 'em enough to be idle rich. Now that they're in their late 20's it appears I nailed it. My ex and I are pleased.

Another reason for gold's inflation besides Ray's silly economic notions is it's value in manufacturing.

#76 | Posted by Legio

You're comparing today's gold to the gold of the 1970s? That's nuts! The dollar is falling out of favor in the rest of the world. It's lost 98% of its purchasing power since the Federal Reserve started devaluing the dollar. You have a lot of catching up to do with the fundamentals.

Whatever it takes to cover everybody is good in my opinion.

Another reason for gold's inflation besides Ray's silly economic notions is it's value in manufacturing.
#77 | Posted by Zatoichi

Where did you get the idea that I ever said that? Gold is a monetary metal. Very little of it is used in manufacturing.

"Very little of it is used in manufacturing."

#80 | Posted by Ray at 2009-09-26 07:40 PM | Reply | Flag: HA HA HA

Kepp digging idiot.

I never understand what makes gold so valuable? What if it becomes unfashionable? It's a good conductor but silver is better and copper is much cheaper and also very conductive. I've asked Ray and he thinks it is out of the question for gold to lose all or most of its value but I have to disagree. Like anything else if people don't want it then it becomes valueless.

"You're comparing today's gold to the gold of the 1970s? "

Ah yes. You should've seen the Atlantic Ocean back then.

It's a good conductor but silver is better and copper is much cheaper and also very conductive.

Gold is a noble metal. This is what makes it a desired conductor on contact surfaces.

Ray must not have heard of gold in electronics. It's a great metal for conducting electricity. From Gold wires to gold contacts.

Larry

Oh and Gold in dental crowns. It's superb for that. Especially porcelin fused to gold crowns. Very sturdy and very durable.

Larry

Gold is a noble metal. This is what makes it a desired conductor on contact surfaces.

#84 | Posted by goatman

But does that give it its true value or is it due to being used in fashion? What if it became very unfashionable?

Jackass

Gold has qualities that make it an ideal monetary standard.
It is inert, meaning it won't rust and lose weight.
It is difficult to mine, meaning it can't be reproduced like paper money can.
It is soft and easily coined. Though that's not important today as it was in earlier times.

Governments hate the gold standard because it forces them to live within their means. Now they can borrow and spend at will.

EVERY time paper money was tried, it ended in disaster. Gold and silver are the ultimate store of value when people lose faith in paper money. It happens every time.

"Where did you get the idea that I ever said that?"

Said what? Are you drinking Sterno again?

Off to listen to my 40 year old records with no snaps, crackles or pops cretins.

Ray must not have heard of gold in electronics. It's a great metal for conducting electricity. From Gold wires to gold contacts.
#85 | Posted by LarryMohr

I think I'm being misunderstood here. Because of its price, very little gold is used for those applications when there are cheaper substitutes. Something like 99% of the gold ever mined is still available.

Silver, on the other hand, because of its cheap price and high utility is almost all consumed. It's the investment of the century.

#89 | Posted by Zatoichi

In other words, you lied.

Gold is a noble metal. This is what makes it a desired conductor on contact surfaces.

#84 | Posted by goatman

But does that give it its true value or is it due to being used in fashion? What if it became very unfashionable?

#87 | Posted by jackass at 2009-09-26 07:56 PM

Gold earrings, bracelets, necklaces and rings will never become unfashionable -- not to women.

One home shopping network (QVC) has for over a year now been trying to push a line of "stainless steel jewelry" and yuk. It's been a loser. They can keep hyping it all they want but stainless steel is ugly and it's a loser as far as most women are concerned when using it to fashion jewelry.

What woman wants to wear the same metal used to make her pots and pans.

What woman wants to wear the same metal used to make her pots and pans.

Posted by CalifChris at 2009-09-26 08:34 PM | Reply

Maybe ones that want to have spiritual intercourse with the same metals that helped Her make Her Hubby Happy. Just a thought Christine.

Larry

Gold earrings, bracelets, necklaces and rings will never become unfashionable -- not to women.

There. You heard it from the source.

I own no gold. (I gave my wedding band to my son). I own one diamond. It is embedded in the handle of a 4" Buck knife I got as a 10 year service award from Sprint. I own various silver pieces. I love haggling for silver in Mexico.

I just listened to my perfect original pressing of Abraxas and took a few seconds to capture this from my back porch:

Posted by Ray at 2009-09-26 08:09 PM | Reply

Ray is an entertaining piece of otherwise useless shit at least; Far more intelligent than Ann Coulter, yet hasn't figured out where the cash flow is.

I have some original Keith Jarret that's more interesting than you losers.

Bye.

i179.photobucket.com

Enjoy.

Posted by Zatoichi at 2009-09-26 09:26 PM |

Really pretty sky. Are those rain clouds I see?

#76 | Posted by Legio

Every $1K I paid for DELL for my kids in '91 made a lot. My kids paid tuition in cash and can have a debt-free life if they chose to do so.

I intentionally didn't give 'em enough to be idle rich. Now that they're in their late 20's it appears I nailed it. My ex and I are pleased.

Another reason for gold's inflation besides Ray's silly economic notions is it's value in manufacturing.

#77 | Posted by Zatoichi

I was actually being conservative on the average..If you had WALMART or some other barn burner in the early days before the lift off you made out like a bandit.. My father in law bought IBM and KO in the mid 70's after the crash and lets just say he never worried about money again..

Another reason for gold's inflation besides Ray's silly economic notions is it's value in manufacturing.

#77 | Posted by Zatoichi

you got that right.. used.. in gold immersion for PCB assembly and leads on connectors.

#76 | Posted by Legio

You're comparing today's gold to the gold of the 1970s? That's nuts! The dollar is falling out of favor in the rest of the world. It's lost 98% of its purchasing power since the Federal Reserve started devaluing the dollar. You have a lot of catching up to do with the fundamentals.

#78 | Posted by Ray

you are insane..You can easily track the value and calculate the real rate of return netting inflation. Side by Side..stocks yielded more..period. I can take my so called zero value dollar and buy baseless yen or worthless Euro's or vapid Pounds.

Where did you get the idea that I ever said that? Gold is a monetary metal. Very little of it is used in manufacturing.

#80 | Posted by Ray

you are fucking stupid..Let me give you a free tip.. Silver is actually used more than gold in manufacturing especially in the new ROHS standard to eliminate Lead in the manufacturing process. You can't use gold as a basis for currency as there are too many fucking people and not enough gold. Without the use in jewelry and manufacturing and industrial apps.. AU would be as useful as tin..

Gold is a noble metal. This is what makes it a desired conductor on contact surfaces.

#84 | Posted by goatman

..and the corrosion fighting properties, it does not corrode. put copper and silver in a salt/water environment..

Oh and Gold is used on lots of Your Firetrucks and those Hoity Toity Prickazoidal signage on certain Lawyer Offices too. Oh and it makes a great "Frosting for certain cakes.(Yes it's edible) I have lots of gold in My mouth Unfortunately. They will probably kick My teeth in when I die to extract the gold. Sighhhhhhhhhh oh well won't need teefies in Heaven(More probably hell but thats a topic for another time)

Larry

oh well won't need teefies in Heaven(More probably hell but thats a topic for another time)

#103 | Posted by LarryMohr

I've got connections Larry which one do you wanna go to when you croak? If it's Hell I've got a nice little corner lot available right across from Dante's Inferno Steak House, a free whorehouse staffed by female softball/volleyball players and Beelzebub's House Of Brews. In Heaven 2 fine condos are available over a 24 Hour Fitness and across the road from a George W Bush tofu stand/juice bar and GOP Headquarters.

I know it's gonna be a tough choice for ya buddy

It's in cinnamon schnapps too, Larry.

It's in cinnamon schnapps too, Larry.

Yep,I've puked gold

Yep,I've puked gold

We were drinking the shit out of it on a camping trip one weekend. I took a shit in the woods. The sun reflected off the turd giving it a gilded appearance.

Collect all the gold you want...I'm collecting ammo.

If it ever gets to "that point", then I can have your gold using my ammo....

---------

The government no longer follows its mandate, as stated in the Constitution. It has decided to expand beyond that mandate, and, as we were warned by many of the Founding Fathers, now continues to morph from answering to the people to controlling the people.

As one of my former employees once said "Failure is our pathway to success." So many government programs are failures to their mandates that you'd think we'd realize it is time to quit mandating unrealistic gov't programs.

you are fucking stupid..Let me give you a free tip.. Silver is actually used more than gold in manufacturing especially in the new ROHS standard to eliminate Lead in the manufacturing process. You can't use gold as a basis for currency as there are too many fucking people and not enough gold. Without the use in jewelry and manufacturing and industrial apps.. AU would be as useful as tin..

#101 | Posted by Legio

How do I talk to this complete idiot? Answer: I can't.

The Golden Rule is: whoever has the gold makes the rules. The US had the gold after WWII. Now it is left with an increasingly worthless dollar. Meanwhile, nations like China and Russia are dumping their dollars for gold as fast as they can.

There is always enough gold to serve as a universal monetary standard. The question is at what price does gold have to go to to satisfy demand. I don't know what that price is, but I know that current prices are a steal.

I love this line where Legio calls me stupid, then repeats what I said.

Very little of it is used in manufacturing.
#80 | Posted by Ray

you are fucking stupid..Let me give you a free tip.. Silver is actually used more than gold in manufacturing especially in the new ROHS standard to eliminate Lead in the manufacturing process.

See my post at #90, idiot.

I want to buy health insurance to cover against catastrophe and to pay for all preventative and routine care completely out of pocket. And I want catastrophic health insurance is guaranteed for life with no pre-existing conditions.

#9 | Posted by rcade at 2009-09-26 11:55 AM

So, what you're really saying is you want to not buy insurance until you need it. Kinda like buying home owners insurance after your house burns down.

Grow up!

Catastrophic health insurance already exists. I have it and already pay for everything else as I go. Of course I live in the real world where tangibles are bought and sold because they're needed for people to live, not bullshit on a blog.

If you can't find catastrophic health insurance you know who and where I am, email me and I'll help you procure it. You don't need to call on Uncle Sam, I'll hook you up out of the goodness of my heart. Maybe then you'll see that what you supposedly wish for already exists.

One other thing. What you've asked for was the reason for health savings accounts. Of course this was a bad idea because the republicans proprosed it.

Damn you get shallower by the day. But then I shouldn't be surprised that's what liberalism does to the brain.

The problem is Baccus's plan has an inflation index cola, so eventually all plans will be taxed. S Inbetween that penalties for no insurance...you can say goodbye to another Zero promise (of no taxes for the middle class).

In fact his plan will cause great tax pain for the middle class!

here is another little tidbit

pay for insurance and if you dont pay the fine

you will GO TO JAIL>...

So now we are back to DEBTORS PRISONS?!!&*%^@! I think our forefathers left Europe on disease filled ships for unknown shores to escape this sort of tyranny. What the hell are we thinking, giving these people in Washington and the unelected bureaucracies control over our health, our very lives??????

It is apparent that the Senate and House are run by total lunatics who have never read the Constitution or totally disregard it as relevant, nor can they understand that we want feedom and not their heavy heavy hand in every part of our lives. They don't bother to read any of the bills they vote to pass and impose on us. After all, What do they care?! They have no skin in the game because they won't have to live by the same laws they pass on us serfs.

Canada is moving towards free market health care and we are moving to long waits and rationed health care. Maybe our country has collectively gone insane as well.

I love this line where Legio calls me stupid, then repeats what I said.
Very little of it is used in manufacturing.
#80 | Posted by Ray

you are fucking stupid..Let me give you a free tip.. Silver is actually used more than gold in manufacturing especially in the new ROHS standard to eliminate Lead in the manufacturing process.
See my post at #90, idiot.

#110 | POSTED BY RAY

god you are stupid..

No its used because it is cheaper in certain applications. the applications that REQUIRE gold like gold immersion or contacts REQUIRE gold and can't use silver. You couldn't use gold as a solder unless you wanted to go broke. It is the engineering qualities that determine application.

In this application silver is safer to use than lead and has the same conductivity. Gold would not be used.

and to your previous post about gold can always be used as specie of the realm.. Answer why?

Flaws in a specie as a currency:

1- it is inherently a very expensive currency due to labor and mining and also because the metals have a value in industrial and other applications creating scarcity.

2-It is an artificial and arbitrary currency that doesn't measure wealth of a society but only its own intrinsic value and can be employed as a currency due to its natural scarcity

3- it has a circulation independent of the products of industry which a true currency should never have.

4- it can be monopolized and concentrated by people that can charge for the use of it. This would instigate interest on money for the mere use of it and the controllers then could withdraw availability, create artificial scarcity which could cause "hard times" and then charge higher rates of interest just for its use... artificially.

and many more reasons..

true currency should be based upon and represent directly the products of labor and to be a facilitator.

here is another little tidbit
pay for insurance and if you dont pay the fine
you will GO TO JAIL>...

#113 | POSTED BY KISSNTELL

you guys never stop with fabrications and out right lies..

Fuck gold it's worthless
Chronic, diamonds, blow, and crude
are real currency.

I even did it in haiku for you.

One other thing. What you've asked for was the reason for health savings accounts. Of course this was a bad idea because the republicans proprosed it.
Damn you get shallower by the day. But then I shouldn't be surprised that's what liberalism does to the brain.

#111 | POSTED BY WASHBOARD

I have had health savings accounts.. No Thank you..
Its takes too much to accumulate the cash and pay the premium and is unwieldy.It is a total pain in the ass.

As for catastrophic.. I had that too and due to several kidney stones last year cost me over 10K out of pocket+ premiums ( that was the deductible). Shit i should have flown to Amsterdam and had the procedure done for cash at a cost of 1/4 of my out of pocket including air fare. I have since researched medical vacations for future procedures performed by American trained doctors at a third of the cost.

You be surprised what lying constantly and listening to repuke douche bags will do to your brain.

You assholes are continually