Then women will just go back to jumping off raised platforms onto their stomachs.

I see a potential market for "Kick Me" pregnancy shirts! Time to vote Republican!

Then women will just go back to jumping off raised platforms onto their stomachs.

#1 | Posted by Big_League_Chew at 2009-08-17 03:41 PM

It's what the baby jebus would want.

#1 | Posted by Big_League_Chew

I don't wish death to anyone but when it's his time to go, I hope this technic goes with him.

This abortion can be done up till 21 weeks of pregnancy.

At 20 weeks the "fetus" 6.5 inches long, is swollowing, sucking his/her thumb and more.

You call someone who wants to give that little human a chance, a bully but don't consider it anything wrong when a woman ends that life. a

Technique

"You call someone who wants to give that little human a chance, a bully"

Because they shoot doctors dead. You're right, I wouldn't call them a bully. I'd call them a criminal.

#7

First of all yes...if someone kills someone they are a criminal...a murderer. And I certainly do not applaud one who does something like that.

But you are refering to extremists. And how many doctors have died at the hands of a pro life extremist compared to the number of babies aborted who have a chance to survive outside the womb and what do you call women who end that possibility?

And before you start saying that a babie can't survive at 21 weeks, A friend of mine had a son who was born at 20 weeks and survived. After a very rough start he went on to be an A student, joined the service and lives a normal life

Babies... Not a babie.

The libs take a lickin' but they keep on killin'.

Do you have to get a license to abort a baby? I know you need a license to drive because unlicensed divers are an unknown and may prove dangerous, even lethal, to other drivers. We need to take precautions so as few people die on the roads as possible.

Does a judge sign a order of abortion or anything along those lines? Are the rights of the unborn child taken into consideration?

You have to get a license to go shoot a duck, I'd think you would have to get a license to go suck a child's brains into a Cuisinart.

Would they *really* prefer an old coathanger, or a womb-punch, to what we have now?

Actually, I like the idea of a car antenna...

Why do libtards hate unborn children so much?

Are you so stupid as to believe conservatives don't get abortions at the same rate as libruls? There was a survey of women having abortions as to their religious choice. The biggest group behind catholics was evangelicals.
Given the absolute failure of abstinence only education, they righties are ripe for unplanned pregnancies (right Bristol?). Liberals are just less hypocritical than, say, Libertarian candidate Bob Barr, when it comes to choice.

"Women identifying themselves as Protestants obtain 37.4% of all abortions in the U.S.; Catholic women account for 31.3%, Jewish women account for 1.3%, and women with no religious affiliation obtain 23.7% of all abortions. 18% of all abortions are performed on women who identify themselves as "Born-again/Evangelical"."

Are you so stupid as to believe conservatives don't get abortions at the same rate as libruls? There was a survey of women having abortions as to their religious choice. The biggest group behind catholics was evangelicals.

more Catholics voted for Obama than McCain. I wouldn't be so quick to label Catholics as "conservative".

don't misunderstand, I'm not making a partisian argument. I agree that many cons do have abortions.

So, let's see. Repubs don't want government telling anyone what to do regarding health care UNLESS it's in regard to a pregnant woman. Then, the government trumps personal decisions. Hypocrisy is running amok and it's the Republican's favorite activity.

abortions....

Living below in this old sinful world.... hardly a ....can afford....

WHERE COULD I GO BUT TO THE LORD.
(Elvis did a good one on this).

Where could I go....

Takitez talking about abortions just reminds me that us baby-killing infidels missed one...

.. You have to get a license to go shoot a duck, I'd think you would have to get a license to go suck a child's brains into a Cuisinart.
#11 | Posted by zulu at 2009-08-17 08:04 PM

Uh... Hmmm. Explains a LOT.

Do you have to get a license to abort a baby?

A medical license. These doctors are performing late-term abortions for medical reasons. Women are not seeking out such late procedures for elective ones. The situations are often catastrophic health situations where the mother, fetus or both are in dire shape.

How did you come across this piece of intelligence RCADE? Is there a data base of some sort that distinguishes what are "elective" procedures from those necessary to save the life of the mother? How accurate would it be? Are there any studies by interested or disinterested parties?

Would an underwriter authorize a life insurance policy on this man? He may be bold, but is he suicidal? He seems obsessed with his cause, performance of late term abortions regardless of the consequence to him. There are undoubtedly others similarly obsessed with preventing late term abortions regardless of the consequence to them.

Is there a betting pool for choosing the time of his demise (either natural or artificially induced), sort of like betting on the ice breaking up?

The reason doctors like Tiller and Carhart are so dedicated to their cause is that they see women every day who need them and have been turned away by other doctors.

He's no more obsessed than a doctor who goes to a warzone with Doctors without Borders to provide care for desperate people.

In Johnson's world there are no women who need late term abortions, and if there were, there would not be doctors to save their lives.

I have to questions for those who support late term abortions.

1. Why would women wait as long as 21 weeks before deciding to abort?

2. IF, it is for their own health reasons why not take the baby rather than aborting, giving him/her at least a slight chance of survivng and then give the baby up for adoption??

Babies have survived when born that premature.

Good grief...two...not to!!

Geesh

Is there a betting pool for choosing the time of his demise (either natural or artificially induced), sort of like betting on the ice breaking up?

#22 | Posted by Johnson at 2009-08-18 09:17 AM

You sound like the kind of Asshole that would stalk him.

Tell me. How is it that most anti-abortion loons are guys?

Why would women wait as long as 21 weeks before deciding to abort?

Some catastrophic birth defects and life-risking health conditions are not detected until late in pregnancies.

Also, because there are so few doctors who perform these procedures, by the time some women get to Carhart they are late in their pregnancies.

You're focusing on the minority of situations where a woman seeks a late-term abortion -- elective reasons -- and ignoring the much more common situations where catastrophic health situations have arisen.

If doctors like Carhart didn't practice, who would care for the women in these situations -- many of whom desperately wanted the child they are carrying?

A medical license. These doctors are performing late-term abortions for medical reasons.

#20 | Posted by rcade

Is that number over 10%? I doubt it.

You're wrong, Sniper. The numerous stories about these practices since Tiller's murder have shown that the large majority of women seeking out late-term abortions do so for serious medical reasons.

Is that number over 10%? I doubt it.

#29 | Posted by Sniper at 2009-08-18 10:31 AM

Like I said.

Rcade:

You and I have differing opinions on spirituality I am sure, so I won't touch on the birth defects issue as a reason for these abortions. But I will say, If the babies birth defects are that catastrophic, the baby wouldn't life past birth anyway so I fail to see the need for an abortion..

If the woman truly wanted this baby...she would feel loss whether she had a late term abortion or if the baby dies after giving birth.

I certainly don't mean to sound cruel and I have had a misscarriage so I understand the loss a woman feels when losing a child but I just don't see the reasoning for these types of abortions especially.

And...if the woman really wanted this baby but her own health was at risk, why not have her doctor take the baby giving it a chance of survival while the womans health improves? The pregnancy would be over...her health would improve AND she may still have her child!

2. IF, it is for their own health reasons why not take the baby rather than aborting, giving him/her at least a slight chance of survivng and then give the baby up for adoption??

#25 | Posted by Lisa at 2009-08-18 09:37 AM | Reply | Flag

People have decided that the baby has no medical insurance. UHC has been discarded by pro life people who don't care about human beings--only fetuses. The kid dies--thanks to your vote there was no money to save the baby.

People who are terminally stupid will remain so their entire lives. They are the same morons who believed Dr Ron Paul when he said that he has never seen a case in all his years of practice where a mother's life was endangered by pregnancy. They are the same people who believe that a child with hydrocephaly is somehow going to survive and live a normal life.

And before you start saying that a babie can't survive at 21 weeks, A friend of mine had a son who was born at 20 weeks and survived. After a very rough start he went on to be an A student, joined the service and lives a normal life

#8 | Posted by Lisa

Sigh

Bob...either you stop assigning a position to me you have no idea I hold or to try and win a point, or just stop responding to my posts.

It really makes you look foolish for assuming such a thing.

That seems the only response you have.

And BTW...I have had 4 children, one who had health issues after he was born and 1 misscarriage...and at no time was the care for those babies not covered by insurance.

But I will say, If the babies birth defects are that catastrophic, the baby wouldn't life past birth anyway so I fail to see the need for an abortion.

If a woman finds out the fetus is anencephalic -- has no brain and will die a horrible painful death shortly after birth -- her choices are to have an abortion or to carry the child to term and slowly watch it die because any effort to help it would be utterly futile.

There are many situations where an abortion is the most humane thing to do. It's cruel to deny women this option and to allow the few doctors who provide it to be harassed, threatened and driven out of practice.

Hey Misses??

What you believe has no importance in my life. You have proven yourself to me.

He was 20 weeks. His mother knows that, I know that...what you think is irrellivant.

Go poll your 25 friends who have had abortions for unselfish reasons...perhaps that will occupy your time instead of this obsession you have for me...as flattering as it is!!

Troll on!

#36

Rcade:

I respect that answer, although I don't neccessarily agree with it.

What you believe has no importance in my life

#37 | Posted by Lisa at 2009-08-18 11:07 AM

The same could be said about you, Lisa.

Come down off of your cross.

Just for the record RCADE...I do NOT support those who cause any harm in any way, shape or form...to the doctors who perform those procedures.

He was 20 weeks. His mother knows that, I know that...what you think is irrellivant.
Troll on!

#37 | Posted by Lisa

You just proved my point, thank you.

#39

Easy solution...don't read my posts Jerry!!

I normally ignore Misses, but while flipping past comments I noticed she failed to enclose my comment in quotations prior to commenting above it, making it appear that the entire first part of her post was something I had said.

I was initially going to comment on her deceitfulness. Then dcided it wasn't worth it. What she says isn't important.

I read your posts Lisa.

You come off as a little self-rightious.

Keep flailing Lisa. There are several spaces between my comment and the quote. I would certainly never try to attribute my opinion to you, but if it makes you feel better to try to avoid looking stupid, then hey, go for it. Whatever.

I was initially going to comment on her deceitfulness. Then dcided it wasn't worth it. What she says isn't important.

#42 | Posted by Lisa

Oh, yeah, you ignored it alright. just like you ignored the proof that you are WRONG. If the earlies known preemie to survive was at 21 weeks, 6 days--born in 2007, and your friend's son was born at 20 weeks and is old enough to have joined the "service," he must be at least 18, so that would put his birth at 1991 or earlier. There would have to be some proof to that, unless you are lying. Oh let me see, no, lisa would never lie, she is a Christian, that would be a sin.

It's more likely that he was born at 30 weeks. Still very early, but not early enough for Lisa to make her whiny uneducated point. you've been proven wrong. Put on your big girl panties and admit it, then tell the real truth. God hates liars.

And BTW...I have had 4 children, one who had health issues after he was born and 1 misscarriage...and at no time was the care for those babies not covered by insurance.

#35 | Posted by Lisa at 2009-08-18 11:03 AM | Reply | Flag:

What makes you think I was talking about YOUR children?

But since you don't have the courage to state your opinion on your own, I will ask.

Are you prolife?

Are you against Universal Health Care for all Americans?

#43

I'm sorry you feel that way Jerry.

Now....if I was a self righteous person I would have said something like...

Well Jerry, if you feel threatened by my goodness, morals and values, you should work on improving yourself instead of criticizing someone else.

See the difference! : )

I do not believe I am better than anyone Jerry. But that doesn't mean I don't have a right to refuse conversations with people who can not hold a conversation without insults and name calling. Those conversations are unproductive and frankly, those who call people stupid, swear at them etc...have no valid point to make or they would post one.

If that sounds self righteous to you, I apologize. But I stand by my convictions.

To LISA
SNIPER
UTASTAFF
and all other dumbass rightards with a cross to bear I would ask ONE THING PLEASE

READ

THE FRIGGING STORY BEFORE

you start RUNNING YOUR MOUTH.

Thank you and have a nice day!

To everyone:

Please make up your minds whether I am. Libtard or Rightard.

I can only X the label you all give me so many times on my "I'm A Proud Member Of The ____ party". T Shirt!!!!

And BTW I DID read the article.

No one said they can't survive at 21 weeks. The statistics show that they have a chance, albeit slight, but still a chance. The reason I am for choice, is mainly do to the fact that my views should not be forced onto another person. Women already have a tough time coming to terms with their choice, and who are we to force our will upon them? Very few people are 100% pro-life. The majority are pro-life with stipulations. They don't care about the child after it leaves the womb, but yet they want to decide what that woman should do. I say this, because if you look at the current debate going on with healthcare you would see that those opposed to the reform forget or just don't care about the millions that live without health insurance. Not to mention the thousands that die annually because of such. Most pro-lifers are pro-death penalty and pro-war, as well as, pro-abortion doctor assassinations. Some innocent people die unjustly, but yet they mark it up as a casualty of war or crime. Why are pro-lifers not flocking to adoption centers to give those children a chance they preach so passionately for? It is anti-choice, and pro-invasion of privacy that these people strive for. Plain and simple!

It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
--Abraham Lincoln

#51 | Posted by Such_Is_Life

I couldn't agree more.

Lisa, who seems to be having an otherwise bad hair spelling day, asks:

1. Why would women wait as long as 21 weeks before deciding to abort?
2. ... why not ... give the baby up for adoption?

Lisa does not understand that late term pregnancies are terminated because ultra-sound has detected a brain growing outside the fetal skull or that delivery will kill the woman. They are not terminated because she suddenly remembered the prom. The nursery is already furnished, painted pink or blue ... herm

Do you have to get a license to abort a baby?

A medical license. These doctors are performing late-term abortions for medical reasons. Women are not seeking out such late procedures for elective ones. The situations are often catastrophic health situations where the mother, fetus or both are in dire shape.

#20 | Posted by rcade

Medical reasons?????????

Reasons for abortions
In 2000, cases of rape or incest accounted for 1% of abortions.[26] Another study, in 1998, revealed that in 1987-1988 women reported the following reasons for choosing an abortion:[27]

25.5% Want to postpone childbearing
21.3% Cannot afford a baby
14.1% Has relationship problem or partner does not want pregnancy
12.2% Too young; parent(s) or other(s) object to pregnancy
10.8% Having a child will disrupt education or job
7.9% Want no (more) children
3.3% Risk to fetal health
2.8% Risk to maternal health
2.1% Other
According to a 1987 study that included specific data about late abortions (i.e. abortions "at 16 or more weeks' gestation"),[28] women reported that various reasons contributed to their having a late abortion:

71% Woman didn't recognize she was pregnant or misjudged gestation
48% Woman found it hard to make arrangements for abortion
33% Woman was afraid to tell her partner or parents
24% Woman took time to decide to have an abortion
8% Woman waited for her relationship to change
8% Someone pressured woman not to have abortion
6% Something changed after woman became pregnant
6% Woman didn't know timing is important
5% Woman didn't know she could get an abortion
2% A fetal problem was diagnosed late in pregnancy
11% Other

Found this on wiki.

If these numbers are anything like today, what percentage are medical reasons?

Has anyone stopped to think that the absence of statistical data for late term abortions is hard to come by because the families who undergo these proceedures are already hurting at losing a child and don't really feel like taking a bullshit survey?

do you really think that someone would subject themselves to a 3 day painful process that culminates with delivery, yes delivery, of a still born baby with out good reason? These babies were not cut out or sucked out or otherwise spirited out of the mother. The process involves actually giving birth to the dead child. Unless someone truly has no conscience, they would not go through a proceedure like this unless there was no other way. It is not anyone's place to judge them for that and their decision does not affect anyone but them and their family, so people should just STFU and worry about their own lives.

#55 | Posted by Petrous

22 year old statistics are not valid. The entire world has changed in that time.

Miss, what is the current percentages?

If you consider 20+ year old statistics and the reasons given and the percentage of non-medical reasons - has things really changed?

I suspect they haven't based on the public belief that Roe v Wade said abortion is a right and that any reason is valid. Neither is true.

Well Jerry, if you feel threatened by my goodness, morals and values, you should work on improving yourself instead of criticizing someone else.

#47 | Posted by Lisa at 2009-08-18 12:02 PM

Morals are overrated.

Ask any preacher or politician, Dem. or Rep.

you should work on improving yourself instead of criticizing someone else.

Sounds like a criticism to me!

Morals are overrated.

Ask any preacher or politician, Dem. or Rep.

my morals and the priorties of my life are not dictated to me by preachers or politicians.

it would be very foolish to allow yourself to be controlled like that.

22 year old statistics are not valid. The entire world has changed in that time.

okay......sure.

people will deflect with anything to shield their blind ideologies no matter what facts are presented to them.

it would be very foolish to allow yourself to be controlled like that.

#60 | Posted by eberly at 2009-08-18 02:57 PM |

unlike you, bible-boy, i live life on my own terms.

i live life on my own terms.

you believe morality is overrated and you needed a politician to convince you of that.

you follow the politician/preacher down the low road and you accuse me of being a "BIBLE-BOY"?

you must suck a lot of dick.

Lisa is full of self righteous shit.

Provide one instance of a 20th week abortion that was was done out of elective choice vs. medical necessity.

Just one. Gee today I think I'll abort my 5 month fetus cause I changed my mind...LOL

And...if the woman really wanted this baby but her own health was at risk, why not have her doctor take the baby giving it a chance of survival while the womans health improves? The pregnancy would be over...her health would improve AND she may still have her child!

#32 | Posted by Lisa

Whos gonna pay for the hospital to keep the fetus on artificial support, my taxes? You're such a Liberal!

Lets all strap babies to our legs and go march in protest - because we can...

You're such a Liberal!

actually she is. this confuses the shit out of liberals as she is also pro-life.

Lisa is learning that extreme left wing wackos don't want her around despite the fact she agrees with them on every single issue.....

.....except one.

Lisa is learning that extreme left wing wackos don't want her around despite the fact she agrees with them on every single issue.....

Liberals are much more binary than conservatives, I've noticed. To them, it's all or nothing -- their is no gray area. It seems one conservative ideal and you are a right wing wackjob.

The conservatives don't seem to have a problem with someone having a mixed bag of idealisms on different issues.

unlike you, bible-boy, i live life on my own terms.

#62 | Posted by jerrytarkanian at 2009-08-18 03:05 PM

i live life on my own terms.

you believe morality is overrated and you needed a politician to convince you of that.

you follow the politician/preacher down the low road and you accuse me of being a "BIBLE-BOY"?

you must suck a lot of dick.

#63 | Posted by eberly at 2009-08-18 03:08 PM |

Where did i say I follow anyone?

"Sucking dick"? Sounds like eberly has some repressed issues.

#55 | Posted by Petrous at 2009-08-18 01:11 PM | Reply | F

Reasons for abortions that are any of your business---zero.

How about you live your life and stay out of others life decisions?

How about you live your life and stay out of others life decisions?

Because sometimes "others' life decisions" results in human butchery.

Like in the case of abortion.

Like in the case of Dr Tiller.

Oh, but I forgot, he deserved to be gunned down in front of his family at church, right?

Isn't it more merciful to allow a fetus that has never breathed air or had a single expirence outside the womb to die a painless death rather than to force it to die in agony outside the womb to satisfy the self righteous beliefs of a few?

Here is something that people would liketo forget...in the not so distant past, god fearing christians would expose sick babies to the elements to die--giving them back to god. They would also do this if they already had too many children and could not feed another. This practice has been replaced by abortion. Should we go back to the old way?

Because sometimes "others' life decisions" results in human butchery.

Like in the case of abortion.

#72 | Posted by Jak_Se_Mao at 2009-08-18 03:58 PM | Reply | Flag

Says who? You? No government agrees--no science agrees--no church agrees. You don't care about life---if you did---you would be against the loss of life in Iraq and Afghanistan for NOTHING---real people dying for zip. But I would suggest you support those deaths wholeheartedly---and have no problem with more death to come. You are simply a control freak and a hypocrite that can't mind your own business and have delusions of granduer that you know better than all governments since the beginning of time.

#74 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob

In essence, you are justifying legalized butchery because butchery occurs elsewhere?

In essence, you are justifying legalized butchery because butchery occurs elsewhere?

#75 | Posted by JeffJ

No, it seems to me that he is saying that they are only outraged at some butchery, but that killing is killing and if you want to label abortion as murder, you must label killing in the name of war to be murder as well. But, the same people who are against abortion are usually really into war and that maybe, it is because they like to control things and hate things that they cannot.

#76 | Posted by missesmerelda

Any way you slice it, BBob's 'point' was a BS deflection.

#74 | Posted by Buffalo_Bob

In essence, you are justifying legalized butchery because butchery occurs elsewhere?

#75 | Posted by JeffJ at 2009-08-18 04:33 PM | Reply | Flag

I say that if you say you are prolife---you shouldn't restrict yourself to just fetal life---you should try to stop the killing of humans dying for NOTHING. It seems prolife people are fine with citizens dying---but only get their panties in a wad when it is a fetus. Prolife rails against the safest procedure in the late term abortion of a dead fetus over the health of the mother---forcing the dead fetus to be dismembered in the womb instead of the birth canal. Prolife is simply a lie---the truth is profetus--nothing more. Human life has been shown to mean little to prolife people.

I think we can generalize, Bob, that the so-called "pro-lifers" are not pro-anything.

The Friends Of The Fetus favor war on the helpless, executing the innocent, health care only for those who can pay. They live for a white resident in the White House. Sarah Palin, maybe. herm

Doctor LeRoy Carhart's defiant response to the senseless death of Doctor Tiller is a beautiful thing.

Hero Flag.

Be Well.

That doctor is what a real American would call a true hero.

He's risking his life to help others. He's an example for us all.

Late term baby murders: Disgusting purveyors of death.

"According to Dr. McHugh, Dr. Tiller performed late-term abortions for 'mostly social reasons.'"

And did he have any proof, or was he just talking out of his agenda-driven ass?

Dead babies. The dead babies are the proof.

That, and no women have died since the good doctor met his demise. Also note no uptick in the number of three headed mutant babies that are now allowed to come to full term.

He was supposed to be saving the lives of women and aborting babies with serious defects. Remember? Funny how none of those two things seemed to be true.

If it were just liberal-progressives having abortions and facing death panels then I would say "its ugly but thats the gene pool cleaning itself for ya" but historically "Family Planning types" target minorities and other groups that they would like fewer of for these "rights".... just kiddin... but late term abortion is violent, bloody, murder no matter how you try to excuse it. Pregnancy sometimes goes bad and to save the mother's life or heath the baby needs to be delivered earlier that it can tolerate but that doesn't mean it should be brutalized and murdered.

I notice that many of those supporting late-term abortion do so based on the assumption that the life of the mother is threatened.

I wonder if you folks are willing to confine the "health of the mother" to her physical health rather than the pretense that her "mental health" would be impaired by the carrying of the child to term? Most states allow the mother to sever maternal rights at birth.

It is quite an anomaly that when a third party's action that harms the foetus, that act is considered as affecting the life of a person, while the alternate fiction is maintained that for purposes of abortion there is no person, but the power is delegated by society to the mother to arbitrarily terminate the life in esse that she bears.

Many oppose abortion on the basis that a life is a life, and that termination should not delegated by society to any individual. The mother bearing that life has assumed obligations by being pregnant and the termination of life should not be in the hands of the mother. The idea that "it's my body" is indeed true. But there are limitations as to what we can do with our bodies. You cannot shoot someone, or rape someone, or engage in many other proscribed activities with "your" body. In the same way, the use of anyone's body including that of a pregnant woman is circumscribed.

The pro-death crowd has been reciting its mantra for so long that it has come to believe in the inviability of its claim that society has no say in the termination of human life. That is a right that society has compromised, but can reassert.

#27 | Posted by jerrytarkanian at 2009-08-18 10:01 AM

You sound like the kind of Asshole that would stalk him.

Tell me. How is it that most anti-abortion loons are guys?

I don't have statistics on the percentage of males opposed to killing fetuses as compared to the percentage of females opposed to killing fetuses.

Oh gosh, inviolability.

Hey Bozo's abortion is legal.

Hey Bozo's abortion is legal.

What about everyone else, or are only clowns covered?

I cannot believe, if I find it unbelievable, that a pro-lifer would want someone to die instead of having their leg amputated to survive a train wreck.

You know, the guy is stuck between two trains. To remove him from the wreckage and save his life, they must cut the leg off.

But, no. You have some pro-legger, arguing that the leg shouldn't be amputated. That's murder.

BS.

Prolifers understand the difference between saving the life of the guy (and mothers) over life-threatening situations.

Nobody in their right mind would want doctors to allow a patient to die instead of taking steps to save them- -even abortion.

The difference in such an argument is the choice.
I posted this above. If you look at the number of abortions performed with the following reasons - the majority - a great majority - had nothing to do with saving the life of the mother.

"According to a 1987 study that included specific data about late abortions (i.e. abortions "at 16 or more weeks' gestation"),[28] women reported that various reasons contributed to their having a late abortion:

71% Woman didn't recognize she was pregnant or misjudged gestation
48% Woman found it hard to make arrangements for abortion
33% Woman was afraid to tell her partner or parents
24% Woman took time to decide to have an abortion
8% Woman waited for her relationship to change
8% Someone pressured woman not to have abortion
6% Something changed after woman became pregnant
6% Woman didn't know timing is important
5% Woman didn't know she could get an abortion
2% A fetal problem was diagnosed late in pregnancy
11% Other "

Late term baby murders: Disgusting purveyors of death.

"Last year, the Harvard-educated McHugh relayed that some women stated that their reasons for wanting a late-term abortion included 'not being able to go to a rock concert.' According to Dr. McHugh, Dr. Tiller performed late-term abortions for 'mostly social reasons.'"

#82 | Posted by zulu

Let's see what Dr McHugh actually said in context, shall we?

DR. MC HUGH: Yes, well they Remember most important, Megan, to appreciate is that these records that I was shown were very inadequate psychiatric records. Okay? They were not thorough, detailed, pages-long understandings of the biographies, backgrounds, states of mind, and particular directions that these young women were suffering from. There was no clear work of in those records that would be construed as capable of giving you a full picture of the mental condition of these women. They highlighted certain kinds of things, which, out of context, were hard of course to appreciate, but were sometimes of a most trivial sort, from saying that, "I won't be able to go to concerts," or "I won't be able to take part in sports," to more serious ones, such as, "I don't want to give my child up for adoption." But at no time could you see and understand the future of these individuals and in what way they should be seen as full people, people capable of being helped in this situation. Rather, they were highlighted for certain kinds of, well, preoccupations and concerns. Some of them would be construed as trivial and others would be construed as serious. A trivial one would not being able to go to a rock concert. A more serious one would be to say, "I am going to be worried about the life of this child later on in life. But notice, I could pick out only bits and pieces of this. This is not a none of them represented a full psychiatric history.

Miss,

this does point out though that many are done for reasons other than medical circumstances.

You post puts it in context. yes. I appreciate you doing that.

not judging.....just interpreting the data.

However, I have seen posters here insist that late term abortions are done for ONLY extreme medical circustances.

that simply isn't true.

It points out that DrMcHugh's opinon was based on incomplete records that were altered for privacy. He also only comments on those that were marked for "mental health reasons." If you look at the above statististics, you will see that all of the late term abortions done in Kansas in 2008 were judged by qualified physicians to be because "The patient would suffer substantial and irreversible
impairment of a major bodily function if she were
forced to continue the pregnancy."

While this may not be immenently life threatening, it cannot be determined if they would have beome imminently life threatening if allowed to continue by looking at statistics. Without looking at specfiic medical records of 192 women whose pregnancies were determined viable, no one can make those determinations except the dr that performed them and since Dr Tiller likely did most of them, and he's dead, no one can make those judgements.

The statisitcs on these abortions are not available because they were private. This was not a public health clinic that amkes all of it's patients do some bullshit survey to justify funding. This was a private medical practice, performing legal proceedures, on women who asked for them, and for the most part came from out of state to do so.

It is my opinion and my observation, that in general, people do not pay large sums of money and travel from out of state to do ANYTHING lightly, let alone have controversial and painful medical procedures.

The statistics also show that partial birth abortions have not been performed in Kansas AT ALL since 1999. so it is not accurate to say that "late term abortion is violent, bloody, murder ." The proceedure involves giveing birth to a stillborn baby. They are not dismembered in the womb. This is not an easy proceedure that someone, again, would take lightly.

Nope, he goes on gallantly, and lucratively, murdering innocents.....my hero!

The only one left in the country, too...I understand.

What are the reichmeisters to do?

"Prevent substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function. 188"

Miss, this is from your link.

Here's more:

my understanding is the downs syndrome is the main culprit

If you look at the above statististics, you will see that all of the late term abortions done in Kansas in 2008 were judged by qualified physicians to be because "The patient would suffer substantial and irreversible
impairment of a major bodily function if she were
forced to continue the pregnancy."

of course they were. For a late term abortion to be legal, it has to be judged that way.

did he say this or not??.....

They highlighted certain kinds of things, which, out of context, were hard of course to appreciate, but were sometimes of a most trivial sort, from saying that, "I won't be able to go to concerts," or "I won't be able to take part in sports," to more serious ones, such as, "I don't want to give my child up for adoption."

my understanding is the downs syndrome is the main culprit

I would assume that happens a lot.

thank goodness, then wonderful caring people like Tiller are still around then...

#100 Yes, that statement was made. Taken out of context it implies that the reasons were trivial. however, he also stated he had incomplete records and he only looked at records for "mental health" cases. Keep in mind as well that Dr McHugh is a psychologist who is not affiliated with Dr tiller in anyway and was asked to review selected records by someone else. He is also very much prochoice and therefore his opinion, based on incomplete records and his assumptions about subjects he never personally evaluated, is very biased.

#98 You keep citing statistics for ALL abortions, when this article only concerns late term abortions performed at the Tiller clinic in Kansas. Those statistics are invalid for those cases.

Miss, find sites that support the reason for abortion is medical by the majority and I'll be really interested is reading it.

#98 | Posted by Petrous
Just needed to add that ALL late term abortions are performed for medical reasons as determined by a physician. It is the law, as I have stated above.

"Prevent substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function "

4 in state
188 out of state
192 total

These figures make no sensem Miss.
Is there some phenomenon in Kansas where the women there are healthier?

People who are really expecting substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function should move permanently to Kansas.

4 out of 192 are in-state. With that stat, I'd guess that the 188 are not all truthful, medical determinations.

The gov't should investigate it because those numbers are too heavily weighted.

How many second opinions overturned the first doctor? Want to bet it was none and that the second opinion was from a doctor within arm-length transactions with the original doctor.

Did you even read the article? Only 10 doctors in the US do this proceedure. That is why they come from out of state, dipshit. From the article:

"Past viability, no doctor will terminate a pregnancy without a compelling reason. But what is a compelling reason, and who decides? Some would count a serious fetal abnormality, mental or physical; others would not. What if the baby has a 50 percent chance of surviving outside the womb? A 30 percent chance? While most of us navigate these questions in theory, Carhart deals with them in practice. At Tiller's clinic, he saw a rape victim in the third trimester of pregnancy. Every time she felt the baby move, she said, it brought back the rape all over again. She'd made three suicide attempts. Carhart performed her abortion. "If a woman is going to kill herself, then I think you have to look at it for her health," he says. The day before Tiller's death, a woman came into Carhart's Nebraska clinic 28 weeks along. Carhart asked her what she would do if she had to carry the baby to term. "She didn't say she was going to kill herself," he says. "She said she would put it up [for adoption]." He turned her away."

Got it. It's now ritualized murder. You need to recite the statements from the rule book, and then the requirement is met. It does seem as if enforcement is frivolous and as if the enforcers do not take their charge seriously. Some of those abortionists should be taken to task.

Michael Jackson's doctor is reportedly facing a manslaughter charge, probably under California law.

as usual, Johnson, blather, blather, blather...is there a point here or an actual correlation to the article in question, or just your usual spout or eloquent bullshit?

Mess, Look at these statements you posted:

"Some would count a serious fetal abnormality, mental or physical; others would not."

"What if the baby has a 50 percent chance of surviving outside the womb? A 30 percent chance? "

"Carhart deals with them in practice. At Tiller's clinic, he saw a rape victim in the third trimester of pregnancy. Every time she felt the baby move, she said, it brought back the rape all over again. She'd made three suicide attempts. Carhart performed her abortion. "If a woman is going to kill herself, then I think you have to look at it for her health," he says."

The day before Tiller's death, a woman came into Carhart's Nebraska clinic 28 weeks along. Carhart asked her what she would do if she had to carry the baby to term. "She didn't say she was going to kill herself," he says. "She said she would put it up [for adoption]." He turned her away."

Now, look at the State's info:

"People who are really expecting substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function should move permanently to Kansas."

Please explain how any of the things you posted agree with this statement from Kansas.

According to your statements posted, the statement by Kansas consists of lies. People were not expecting substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function because of the pregnancy.

You justified the abortion because the patient was suicidal, not because the pregnancy would cause the death of the mother.

Justifying the death of one person because you'd kill yourself if their death didn't occur is ridiculous.