Heckuva job there, Bushie!

No shit.

I think we all deduced as much.

"Oil Industry Execs Suggested Invasion of Iraq"

Get TF outta here!

What a fucking revelation!!

What is this information, like... ten years old or something?

The fact that this sounds like news to anyone is the most depressing part of it all.

"The fact that this sounds like news to anyone is the most depressing part of it all."

#4 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2009-07-03 11:34 AM | Reply | Flag: sad but true

Cheney/Bush destroyed our country for the price of a barrel of oil...

OCU

In other breaking news, there's a lot of sand in Iraq.

from the article --

Despite the Bush administration's denials about oil as a motivation for war, the Bush administration's focus on Iraqi oil was firmly set.

"But, but, but it had nothing at all to do with oil. It was all about democracy for the Iraqi people and fighting the 'War on Terror.'"

-- delusional Bushlovers

The fact that this sounds like news to anyone is the most depressing part of it all.

#4 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2009-07-03 11:34 AM | Reply

Not only depressing, but scary, to think some are still so naive.

But to get down to hard facts -- and this is where I probably part ways with others who were against the war in Iraq -- if it came down to us not going into Iraq and that would mean the eventual chance of COMMUNIST China eventually getting control of Iraq's oil instead of the U.S.? Then I say do whatever it takes for us to get in there first.

I was dead set against this war in Iraq because I knew from the time of Powell's speech at the U.N. the excuses being used to invade Iraq were lies.

However, I'm not so naive and stupid -- nor that unpatriotic -- that I'd rather see Communist China get control over one of the world's biggest sources of oil instead of my own country. I think in a few years, with Communist China flexing their military muscle more every day, it would have come down to us fighting with China for control of Iraq's oil. Better we went in now.

Better us than them.

Gee whiz! Does us think Cheney talked about it at his secret energy meetings????

I think someone predicted several years ago that all of our accusations and suspicions would be, in the end, all proven true.
Can anyone still pretend we don't need a real 9-11 Commission???? Not the phony baloney investigation with witnesses refusing to testify under oath...like Bush/Cheney.

that I'd rather see Communist China get control over one of the world's biggest sources of oil instead of my own country.
......#9 | Posted by CalifChris

....a couple of points.....

....first.....China is more capitalist than we are.....

....two...you don't want them to secure Iraqi oil, but it's ok for them have leverage over our economy & currency through their trade surplus with us, and our reliance on selling them our bonds........

....the struggle between China & the U.S....if there ever was one.....has been won already by China, who won the contest without firing a shot......

......they outsmarted us.....and let us enslave ourselves to them......one Visa transaction at a time......

......and lastly.......

.....what moral right did we have to Iraq's oil ??.....

....killing a million of them, and thousands of us, so the obscene oil companies could profit.....

.....and again.......

....when the Chinese call their ruling elite 'Communist', it is nothing more than a meaningless word.....like Republican, or Democrat......

.....it means nothing more than a title for the oligarchy and their cronies......

.....sooner or later all political parties, no matter how well intentioned, get taken over by the power hungry, who corrupt whatever ideals existed....

Just to follow up on SKIZZIKS post, now China can bid just like American oil companies to develop Iraqi oil fields and they didn't have to pay for the idiotic war.

#14 | Posted by danni

.....outsmarted us again.....

Oil? No...you're pulling my leg, right?

And all this time I thought we invaded because we didn't like the way they treated their women folk.

first.....China is more capitalist than we are.....

....two...you don't want them to secure Iraqi oil, but it's ok for them have leverage over our economy & currency through their trade surplus with us, and our reliance on selling them our bonds........

....the struggle between China & the U.S....if there ever was one.....has been won already by China, who won the contest without firing a shot......

......they outsmarted us.....and let us enslave ourselves to them......one Visa transaction at a time......

#11 | Posted by skizziks at 2009-07-03 12:49 PM

Must admit you've made some really good counterpoints in response to my post, skizziks.

Especially your second point about how even if we did get first hold of Iraq's oil and beat out China, Bush more than gave them the advantage in other crucial areas -- especially when Bush let China clobber us over the head economically with his backass version of how "free trade" should be conducted.

I also forgot it was China from whom Bush borrowed those trillions $$$ in order to pay for his war in Iraq in the first place.

Wonder if Iraq oil will end up costing us more in the long run than we ever planned on paying -- in more ways than one.

In other breaking news, there's a lot of sand in Iraq.

And taxpayer dollars.

Wonder if Iraq oil will end up costing us more in the long run than we ever planned on paying -- in more ways than one.

#17 | Posted by CalifChris

Chris, for the millionth time, Iraq oil is not for us, it is for China.

I've been telling you guys for two years that this war was a war for oil and the oil was from china.

You didn't listen then but listen to this now;

This war was for the untapped oil fields for china (who will sell some to india too). China and India have 2/3 of the worlds population and both have strong growing markets.

American boys and girls died so we could process oil for china. The money to be made from oil is from getting the oil out of the ground and refining it. This is what only America and Britian have the ability to do on a scale that China needs.

China paid for the Iraq war and will pay for afganistan too.

Please pay attention. The reason all this is not over yet is because they need to build a pipeline and service route from the Middle East to China. It will go through Iran, Afganistan and Pakistan. Any of this sinking in?

from china = for China

Hate to break it to all of you, but if they expand oil drilling in Alaska, the vast majority of the additional oil will also go to China.

It is only a few days until Palin announces her new job lobbying for Petrochina.

"The money to be made from oil is from getting the oil out of the ground and refining it. This is what only America and Britian have the ability to do on a scale that China needs."

Not really America and Britain IMHO, the companies that do this now are really international with no allegiance to the US or Britain though the get politicians to always mention "American interests" as things we still need to protect in both Iraq and the overall ME. These "American interests" do their banking in tax havens, hire Indians to do the construction work, buy our politicians, and pay scientists to pretend global warming is a hoax because they don't want fossil fuels taxed more than alternative energy. No, Americans need to finally wake up and recognize that our country is being run by people who believe the New World Order already exists, it is a world governed by corporations. Freedom, liberty, justice are all concepts from an earlier era, today only profit matters.

Some probably did, but Chevron's CEO was vocal in critizing such a plan because the blowback makes regular commerce impossible.

Israel, AIPAC and the NeoCons wanted it and Iran has proven to be the biggest beneficiary. As the Catholic Church, Hitler, most Kings and the CIA have learned the hard way, torture, destruction and death often have the opposite effect intended, on the human spirit. Rather than breaking it, it is strengthened. Just ask the British, the IRA, the North Vietnamese and the Iraqis.

Everyone in the country could have had free gasoline for a decade for what Shrub squandered in his ill conceived war. But that really was the point wasn't it (directing windfall profits into the pockets of chronys)?

THE PREDATOR STATE

'Everyone in the country could have had free gasoline for a decade for what Shrub squandered in his ill conceived war.'

then there is always the Tesla CAR

. ..for those that can afford one...

I notice no one has come on this thread to deny the article's points. Telling.

It was so obvious from the start what the real motive was, but Bush and his gang pretended we couldn't see through it.

It's a shame we couldn't have had an honest debate: i.e., is oil worth going to war over? Be honest with yourself. Oil is not an insignificant resource. Those of us who scoff and say it's shameful to fight for oil are still driving cars, and bitching when the price of gas goes up, aren't we?

I'm not justifying the war, just hoping we can be honest.

"prepared by the James A. Baker Institute for Public Policy and the U.S. Council on Foreign Relations at the request of then-Vice President Dick Cheney...."

With a pedigree like that it's no wonder Bush's war hound threw a litter of losers.

most americans are just to stupid to understand. their president would never lie to them.

reichwing: it's not about oil, but about FREEEEEEEEEEEEEDOOOOOOOOOOOOOM
!!!!

Fucking imbeciles

Yikes!

The source of this article is Truthout that is known for twisting bits of erroneous gossip, data and rumor and spinning it into far left wing spew in order to build faulty basic premises to suit its own biased interests. They've been at it since 2001.

Oil had its slppery hand in the Iraq debacle, but...come on RETORT...use credible sources.

come on RETORT...use credible sources.

3853177z

yeah, like rothschild owned Reuters...

or BBC?

Can we take the conv a step further? Is there an even bigger lie/motive than oil? The well-versed strategy of false-flag terrorism brought us a pre-canned Patriot Act, Department of Homeland Security, oppressive military law, suspension of the Constitution, made the President an acting dictator, all at the whim of the President simply by declaring a national emergency (i.e. new threat of terrorism, health emergency, cyber-emergency, etc, etc), a fast-tracking to globalism, numerous peolicies that mandate of total dependency on government for every aspect of our lives and "to protect us" from future "attacks".

lets shut down the oil company's and invade the dutch and take over their wind mills.

Exonnerate Them!!!

So if the family or families of US Military Personnell who got killed or permanently disabled in Iraq go "Postal" on some Oil Company Executives,we can now justly see why and also why we should completely and legally "exonnerate" them!!!

from the blood drenched battlefields and flag bedecked grave yards happy 4th of july.

start the bubble machine

I think Iraq was a ploy. We haven't gotten any special oil prices because of Iraq, we just needed a foothold in the mideast. Notice which country is between Iraq and Afghanistan.

We haven't gotten any special oil prices because of Iraq

Gosh, you mean the American consumer expected some kind of windfall? Sorry, no matter how hard we waved our flags, or how many of our best and brightest died...we were never going to get cheaper gas.

But a few CEO's got some nice new mansions out of the deal.

However, I'm not so naive and stupid -- nor that unpatriotic -- that I'd rather see Communist China get control over one of the world's biggest sources of oil instead of my own country. I think in a few years, with Communist China flexing their military muscle more every day, it would have come down to us fighting with China for control of Iraq's oil. Better we went in now.

Amazing, but at least honest. So you support countries which invade others to get their resources with the excuse, that invade early is better than invade late. You call people who support such a viewpoint
patriotic, I call them (and you) criminal.

"Oil Execs Sought Invasion of Iraq"

Two of the biggest Oil execs, Bush & Cheney, sought it as well.

"I think Iraq was a ploy. We haven't gotten any special oil prices because of Iraq, we just needed a foothold in the mideast."

But oil companies have made the largest profits in the history of the world. This wasn't to benefit us. It was done to benefit the oil companies and it has. They are bidding now to develop oil fields in Iraq. They are getting some, not all, of what they wanted. They also wanted the oil fields privatized but did not achieve that goal.
Cheap energy may seem like a bargain to Americans but since America is also an energy producer it is not necessarily so. Also, high energy prices were beginning to slow the flow of imports from China because shipping costs were beginning to offset the cost benefits of cheap labor. So, it may actually be that energy prices will actually have to rise for us to end the recession because that will make oriental exports more expensive and domestic manufacturing more cost efficient.

No one in the oil business is interested in lower prices. Why do you think they have been reducing oil refinery capacity?

BushCo's interest was in controlling the direction and quantity of flow, not the price. They want prices to be free to go as high as possible. Everything else is a lie.

well I for one am glad that we went to iraq for the oil

I mean look at what it has done for the price of gas.....

whats that...its still high??

what????

but we went to war for oil so that means we have it spilling out all over the place....

and ONE MORE TIME

when your car is sitting in the drive way or its not your day of the week to get gas..
you wont give a rats ass WHERE IT came from or how we got it....

I don't have a problem fighting a war for oil. Until someone comes up with a way to get 40 miles per fetus, fight on.

The US military has been protecting US interests for over 220 years. What do you think WWI and WWII were about?

This is nothing new...

Must admit you've made some really good counterpoints in response to my post, skizziks.
Especially your second point about how even if we did get first hold of Iraq's oil and beat out China, Bush more than gave them the advantage in other crucial areas -- especially when Bush let China clobber us over the head economically with his backass version of how "free trade" should be conducted.
I also forgot it was China from whom Bush borrowed those trillions $$$ in order to pay for his war in Iraq in the first place.
Wonder if Iraq oil will end up costing us more in the long run than we ever planned on paying -- in more ways than one.
#17 | Posted by CalifChris at 2009-07-03 03:01 PM

Alcohol, biolosic, hydrogen and fully electric are all superior, cleaner, more efficient and sustainable technologies to crude oil burning. You are conditioned to only consider the technologies that are "available". Chevron owns the patent to electric car batteries used in vehicles such as the EV-1 and will not release it for consumer use. I believe that corporate abuse of innovation is from where your derision genuinely stems, not a love of the existing oil scheme.

Iran wants to go solar, Saudi Arabia is doing so now. China and other asshole nations such as the United States are dangerous in that they want to maintain the oil regime at the waste of human potential. How unexpected.

If energy prices significantly increased it would end the growth of China. For other economies in the world to prosper, China's growth needs to slow. Therefore, though painful, I think higher energy costs are the key to restoring western economies to prosperity. Why is the T. Bone Pickens plan now on the back burner??? Because energy prices fell. We should use taxation as a means to increase the cost of energy, increase revenue to the government, create the opportunity for new, profitable industries that are unviable with energy as cheap as it is today. We need to use tax laws to encourage investment into such industries which will create employment and real economic growth for the first time in this country in a decade.

.....they outsmarted us.....and let us enslave ourselves to them......one Visa transaction at a time......

#11 | Posted by skizziks

Excellent post and to the point.

Any Wal-Mart shoppers out there still pretending to "love America" while buying mass quantities of Chinese-made goods can stop feeling so patriotic.

MidtowncowBOY, you must want to kill yourself every time you fill up your tank. Move to Afghanistan and ride a donkey. You'll feel better. Good luck friend.

Sorry MidtowncowBOY, should have been directed to redlightrobot

If energy prices significantly increased it would end the growth of China. For other economies in the world to prosper, China's growth needs to slow. Therefore, though painful, I think higher energy costs are the key to restoring western economies to prosperity. Why is the T. Bone Pickens plan now on the back burner??? Because energy prices fell. We should use taxation as a means to increase the cost of energy, increase revenue to the government, create the opportunity for new, profitable industries that are unviable with energy as cheap as it is today. We need to use tax laws to encourage investment into such industries which will create employment and real economic growth for the first time in this country in a decade.
#46 | Posted by danni at 2009-07-05 06:12 PM

This is like evaluating the "bank bailout" as a means to further devalue the entire monetary mass, reaching offshore hording.

We're currently being screwed by industry withholding innovations that compete with oil, not just in accepting offshore loans and becoming a stabilized branch of China's economy. Oil is not sustainable for us unless it's nationalized and regulated. The reason for these international oil wars is to avoid the real technological advancement that is required for survival. We have to consider the reasons for these common infrastructure abuses has been to belay and retard progress. All of our current technology relies on this mystical convergence of grandfathered structure and backdoored programming. The rolling blackouts in California are replicable anywhere and could easily decimate any of the tech-based economy in weeks, generating exodus, job loss, outsourcing and thus ruining the economic futures of thousands of people each business sector removed.

Apparently we are the victims of selective industrial cannibalism.

I don't have a problem fighting a war for oil. Until someone comes up with a way to get 40 miles per fetus, fight on.

#43 | Posted by TheLastAmerican

translated...

"my kids are dying for your rights to post here"

Prosecute.

whats that...its still high??

what????

#42 | Posted by afkabl2

The price of a gallon of gas is probably right around where it should be. In fact, I'm rather amazed that the price of a gallon of gas is as low as it is, considering where the raw material starts and the intense refining and shipping process that finally gets the fuel into your tank. The only saving factor is the billions of gallons of fuel consumed each year that keeps the price as low as it is.

Keep in mind that simple formula of the larger the quantity, the lower the price. In a sense, fuel efficient vehicles tend to backfire on us. Not only does the vehicle demand less product for miles driven, reducing revenues for the gas companies, it also decreases state revenues from gas taxes, forcing the states to explore other avenues for keeping revenues up, such as the mileage tax.

Keep in mind that simple formula of the larger the quantity

Sadly comical, lets forget the major sources of the oil, the fact it is not endless, pollution etc.

Lets continue down the aisle of fossil fuels. We can pretend it is the easy and only answer. Yes lets throw out CAFE standards and alternatives. After all the only real concern is revenue and the next quarter...

I mean look at what it has done for the price of gas.....
whats that...its still high??
what????

LOL

What, surprised?

Consider who command the debacle.....

Wrong. Bush attacked Iraq based on archaic religious beliefs. If it was for the good old greenback, then there would of been some sense to the madness.

Crisis

Jesus Christ.... The article is from Truthout. Now, I'm not saying that oil wasn't on many minds before going into Iraq, but I am saying that Truthout is not an impartial source for this type of article. Let me see the NYT print it and then I'll say that all of you who are acting like this is some sort of victory or substantiation for you have reason to think so.

#57 | Posted by everlong

Ah, yes. The moving goalposts!

One day, the NYT is a libruuuuul rag and half the DR can't wait for it to go under.

Then, it becomes the paragon of truth and virtue for conservatives when an article from that wacky Truthout is posted!

Which is it? Can't you guys make up your minds?

Oh, I see.

"New evidence seems to lay bare that I was (and continue to be) a pawn for Big Oil in my support of the unnecessary destruction of a sovereign nation. Stand by...experiencing cognitive dissonance. Owwwwwch...OK. Got a response. DAMN TRUTHOUT! Let's all attack the messenger and ignore the message!"

LOL. Everlong wants confirmation from the very people who brought you this war. Truthout is biased - but everything that comes out of the Government/Media revolving door is to be believed. LOL.

So, any substantive critiques of the arguments proffered in the article, or just more deflection?

Hooray for capitalism at its finest!

But oil companies have made the largest profits in the history of the world. This wasn't to benefit us. It was done to benefit the oil companies and it has. They are bidding now to develop oil fields in Iraq. They are getting some, not all, of what they wanted. They also wanted the oil fields privatized but did not achieve that goal.
Cheap energy may seem like a bargain to Americans but since America is also an energy producer it is not necessarily so. Also, high energy prices were beginning to slow the flow of imports from China because shipping costs were beginning to offset the cost benefits of cheap labor. So, it may actually be that energy prices will actually have to rise for us to end the recession because that will make oriental exports more expensive and domestic manufacturing more cost efficient.

---------------

Or we could head off the decrease in the american standard of living by stopping the empires wars to cut costs, and shoring up business with a national health care system.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! Government is bad! Wars are good!!!