Sounds to me like they were following their constitution and obeying their Supreme Court's ruling. Why does Obama have a problem with this?

why didn't this happen in 2000 with Bush?

Did Honduran teabaggers protest before the revolution?

There were other means that this could have been solved through the system. Sounds like there have not been any military coups lately in Central America so the Hondos figured they needed one for old times sake.

That being said I worked with some Hondo troops in Iraq. I was sad to see them go. We worked well with them.

Chavez and Castro condemned the takeover, so I guess the military did the right thing down there.

And Ol' Hugo next door has fired up his "Look At Me!" calliope again, this time about helping the ousted President regain his position by offering to send his troops across the border to quell the coup. (cue Louis Armstrong's "What A Wonderful World")

Popcorn, anyone?

"There were other means that this could have been solved through the system."

What system would that be? Chicago style thugary and lawlessness?

The problem was that Zelaya was not operating within the system.

He was trying to initiate a vote to change the constitution (for his ends). according to thier constitution, can only be done by congress. He broke in and stole ballots that were confiscated with the intent of distributing them.

"Did Honduran teabaggers protest before the revolution?"

Another socialist bites the dust.

I'm not exactly sympathetic for the man, but when the military deposes a sitting president, it's certainly news.

At least honduras has no nukes...

And our soccer team beat them anyway... no cause for concern.

"It wasn't a revolution, it was an arrest.
online.wsj.com"

According to the Wall Street Journal, which never saw a rightwing coup they didn't approve of.

Ousted for extra-constitutional activities?

Don't think it can't happen here - if the career politicians are not stopped...

...a military coup is in America's future.

Swore to protect and uphold the The Constitution of the United States, the military will have no choice in the matter.

Did Honduran teabaggers protest before the revolution?

#3 | Posted by Ron_Karate

I don't know. Was there one sitting on your face?

It wasn't a revolution, it was an arrest.

Saddam said the same damn thing when he took over. Not surprising the rightwingnuts here are celebrating a military coup. They were predicting (praying for?)one in January.

The Supreme Court ruled his referendum unconstitutional, and it instructed the military not to carry out the logistics of the vote as it normally would do.

Sounds like an activist Court to me! Judges get to order the military around? Can't wait for Justice Sotomayer to order the Air Force to start carpet bombing rightwing domestic terrorists.

chavez threatens military action....Obama deeply concerned....

NK....

Iran....

sure is different from the sidelines hey, barry?

oh, the israeli palestinian issue....

good luck

Sounds like an activist Court to me! Judges get to order the military around? Can't wait for Justice Sotomayer to order the Air Force to start carpet bombing rightwing domestic terrorists.

what about leftwing domestic terrorits?

elf, earth, whatever the fuck they are called.

oh and code pink

" Honduran patriots "

Yeah and the contras were the equivalent of the founding fathers. Moron.

I guess those phony "patriots" wanted to make sure the people couldn't vote for him...again.

obama says coup not legal....so he supports what this man did...no shock there.

so why are we sending a delegation there to restore anything....why are we meddling in another country's political affairs?

obama says coup not legal....so he supports what this man did...no shock there.

so why are we sending a delegation there to restore anything....why are we meddling in another country's political affairs?

#21 | Posted by scooter28054

No, he supports a legal, constitutional method to deal with the issue rather than military troops dragging the man away.

#22 | Posted by SanAntonioRogue

My understanding is that his "victory" was attained by means that violated their constitution - their supreme court stated as such and the military upheld their constitution and court decision.

I recognize that the waters can be murky on issues such as this, however I feel that my understanding is correct.

While Professor Ibrahim credits what he calls the "Obama Effect" for producing the latest outbreak of reform in the Middle East, history will see something quite different: the Bush Effect. Democracy, elections, and freedom in Iraq could not fail to have an impact on the minds of Muslim moderates, especially in Iran. How does a woman or a young person in Iran manage to put up with a medieval tyranny when across the border in Iraq individuals are starting to flourish under the banner of self-determination and liberty?

Barack Obama's rather suspicious early response to the exciting and poignant cry for freedom in Iran should have finally ripped the blinders off of Obama's swooning supporters in the human rights establishment. Truth be told, never does Mr. Obama look as awkward as he does when he's forced to mouth support for "democracy" and "freedom" either at home or abroad. It's not in the nature of a socialist in other words to feel comfortable speaking about these things. Obama, like all socialists, is at his best lecturing, controlling and organizing.

Very few on the left and in the Muslim world will admit that the American liberation of Iraq was the catalyst for a beneficent domino effect in Lebanon and Iran. But they should be reminded that this was George Bush's vision from the beginning. In other words, it was Bush, despite fierce criticism, who believed in a stable Middle East built upon democratic principles. The same belief has animated the thousands of U.S. troops who have helped to implement this vision in Iraq.

I think deep down Barack Obama understands the Bush Effect. And he's having trouble now because he can't stand it.

My understanding is that his "victory" was attained by means that violated their constitution - their supreme court stated as such and the military upheld their constitution and court decision.

I recognize that the waters can be murky on issues such as this, however I feel that my understanding is correct.

#23 | Posted by JeffJ

I'm not that familiar with their constitution, but surely there must be a method to deal with something like this through their legislative/judicial system.

You're not really advocating that the proper way to deal with this guy was for the military to intervene and drag him away in the dead of night, are you?

I hope that the President of Honduras is restored to his office and the proper legal process is followed in the prosecution of the coup sponsors and executers. Excuses that I have read so far are so minor that no public danger or emergency existed which required the suspension of democratic rule, this was simply a right wing power grab, just like the good old days of Latin America.

Wrong solution to a problem that could have been solved differently.

Where is the so-called "leftist" Obama denouncing the illegal overthrow of his fellow leftist? The rightwing screams at Obama for not denouncing the Iranian elections. I guess coups are ok, but fraudulent elections not ok.

Where is the so-called "leftist" Obama denouncing the illegal overthrow of his fellow leftist?

right here....siding with Chavez, and Castro, pretty quickly I might add...

I agree with JeffJ., the man was breaking the law and should be removed by however means possible.

The leader either follows the law or arrested, by whom doesn't matter.

The election should be reheld but without his name.

"President Barack Obama says the weekend ouster of Honduran leader Manuel Zelaya was a "not legal" coup and that he remains the country's president. "

Good for him. When is he going to call in the ambassador for a little chat? When is he going to withdraw our ambassador? Call for sanctions? My guess is he will just wimp his way through this with token statements.

"I agree with JeffJ., the man was breaking the law and should be removed by however means possible."

WTF moneywar? Any means possible? Since when did you become a rightwing apologist?

Some of you have been hanging out with Bendor too much.

Sorry Nulli,

and I wouldn't call this a coup. Removing an illegal representative is not a coup, it is enforcing the law.

The man had armed guards around the mansion protecting him, removing him by the military to enforce their laws is the correct thing to do.

Now, the question will be seen if they hold another election and vote in another president.

"Good for him."

Then you agree Obama's a leftist, never want to hear that crap about him being a centrist again ;-)

"When is he going to withdraw our ambassador?"

I believe they did, along with the other 8 lefty nations...

"My guess is he will just wimp his way through this with token statements."

Like everything else, he is a man of words...

"Excuses that I have read so far are so minor that no public danger or emergency existed which required the suspension of democratic rule, this was simply a right wing power grab, just like the good old days of Latin America."

The constitution was upheld, the military acted (as asked by the Hondurian supreme court) as I would expect ours to act when a branch of government stops using the rule of law, to the demise of the republic.

"no public danger or emergency existed "

The public danger is that they might have had an illegal vote. The president was not acting within his authority, for his own benefit, to the point of creating a mob of thugs to steal ballots which were previously confiscated. He was deemed an enemy of the state.

"He was deemed an enemy of the state."

Hahahahaha. Yeah that's something new in the history of rightwing coups in Latin America. LOL.

"My guess is he will just wimp his way through this with token statements"

My guess is that you voted for him, and have little right to bitch about his use of empty rhetoric.

"My guess is that you voted for him, and have little right to bitch about his use of empty rhetoric."

Well I don't have to guess whether you're a moron or not, and I'll bitch all I want, though I will never achieve Lawyer Joe levels of bitchiness.

BTW, are you denouncing this rightwing coup or apologizing for it?

I haven't taken a position on the issue yet because I haven't had time to read enough about it. I do, however, know enough to say that if it took you this long to realize that Obama would wimp his way through international issues with empty rhetoric, you're in for a rough four years.

I do, however, know enough to say that if it took you this long to realize that Obama would wimp his way through international issues with empty rhetoric, you're in for a rough four years.

#39 | Posted by JOE

What do you suggest as the alternative? That we send military force to every dust up in every country in the world?

A coup engineered by army colonels surely trained at the Fort Benning School of the Americas and surely in the Pentagon's back pockets. The oustee, a legitimately elected leader friendly with another Latin American president who does not place American corporations first. Anyone smell a Kissingeresque rat? How many banana republics have "our sons of bitches" grabbed like that in the last half century? herm

"I do, however, know enough to say that if it took you this long to realize that Obama would wimp his way through international issues with empty rhetoric, you're in for a rough four years."

Hey dumbshit, a few of us were calling Obama a wimpy centrist a year before the election. So blow it our your ass, Joe.

"Hey dumbshit, a few of us were calling Obama a wimpy centrist a year before the election. So blow it our your ass, Joe."

And yet, you voted for him. Right?

"What do you suggest as the alternative?"

Ask Null Set. He's the one who's bitching about Obama's response. I'm just laughing at his "buyer's remorse."

"And yet, you voted for him. Right?

Well I didn't for whathisname and the half-baked Alaskan or whatever retarded losertarian you voted for. I'm a pragmatist, not a loonytarian.

" I'm just laughing at his "buyer's remorse."

I told you dumbshit, there's no buyer's remorse. He's governing exactly as I predicted, as a centrist.

Ok, Null Set. You voted for a guy you knew you'd be unhappy with. Whatever works for you. That's America.

On topic, if I had to say one thing or another on this, based on the NPR story I heard early this morning, I would have to side against the coup and in favor of the old president. My understanding is that he had introduced a bill to allow himself to run for another term and was forced out by the army before the bill had a chance to pass. Doesn't seem right to me, though his intentions seemed rather "putin"-esque.

Why the hell does people who are supposed to be intelligent keep saying this was a coup. He is guilty of the same thing that chavez the asshole tried to do in venezuela. He tried to setup his own election and get a referendum to remain in office more than four years. The dumb ass hillary clinton must be on chavez's payroll to take his side against the supreme court in Honduras. The Army did the right thing, Just as the United States Army would have to do if obama did the same thing zelaya is trying to do.

"You voted for a guy you knew you'd be unhappy with. "

I didn't vote for anybody. I voted against the right, knowing full well Obama was no progressive. I'm not some ideological purist like loonytarians who can't even win a single congressional seat.

" My understanding is that he had introduced a bill to allow himself to run for another term"

You are correct, Joe. He could run for another term, and the democratic process would've have seen him either reelected or rejected. The rightwing thugs obviously feared the results.

Chavez the asshole and dumb ass Hillary. Badeye lives up to his(?) name for sure. herm

Well, like I said Null, that was the impression I gathered from an NPR story. My guess is that there's more to it than that, but perhaps there isn't.

Shucks, El Presidente defied the Honduran Congress and the Supreme Court, and removed the head of the army, who was obeying lawful orders, and our wannabe tinhorn leftist dictator, Obama, speaks out in support of the Honduran, who wanted to overthrow constitutional limitations that prevented his re-election.

The U.S. is silent in the case of the Iranian totalitarian theocratic ayatollahs ordering the shooting of people in the streets,. If it's an anti-American group in power, Obama supports a policy of non-interference. Well, the scumbag we have as President is consistent.

Obama is a monster. Crazy as a loon and with a self-serving leftist agenda that seeks to take from the provident and productive worldwide based on the false premise that somehow wealth will materialize because our madman President wants it so. King Canute knew better.

"He is guilty of the same thing that chavez the asshole tried to do in venezuela. He tried to setup his own election and get a referendum to remain in office more than four years."

Obviously, you did not read the article. Yes he did propose a referendum but it was not ever considered binding or other than just an unofficial political demonstration of solidarity. He was expressing his own freedom of speech in a very non-threatening, legal way. The aristocratic wealthy of Honduras and other Lating American nations, will not give up the access to wealth and power they have enjoyed at the expense of the peasantry easily. I sure as hell hope, that this time around, America doesn't side with the Fascistic, murdering, torturing, Contras or their ilk. I sure as hell hope that BArack Obama does not become weak in his committment to a new direction in American foreign policy. WE cannot afford to continue on the one we've been on for far too long.

Why aren't I surprised that Johnson, the rightwing tool, thinks a coup overthrowing a democratically elected leftist is a good thing? As a human being could he be any uglier?

These Right Wings Assholes on Fox thinks that this COUP is just fine an the President should Honor the overthrow. Is there a War that these Fucks don't want us to get involved with??? You Conservative Fucks are really SICK!!!!

Is there a War that these Fucks don't want us to get involved with??? You Conservative Fucks are really SICK!!!!

So are racists like you, celery.

I think this is the part where you make a weak attempt to insult me with your usual, "I fucked your wife/mother/sister" remark

"I fucked your wife/mother/sister"

I didn't know you were Southern!

I didn't know you were Southern!

Southwestern, actually. I'm from Texas

They do that "Family Tree easier to track if it is a straight line" thing out there too?

They do that "Family Tree easier to track if it is a straight line" thing out there too?

I have g'g'g'grandparents who were second cousins (as probably we all do). Other than that, my family tree bifurcates quite well, thank you.

He's governing exactly as I predicted, as a centrist.

#46 | Posted by nullifidian

HAHAHAHA--a centrist!--Null with a FF

The Supreme Court said it was unconstitutional what he was trying to do.

He ignored them and fired the general of the military.

The SC ordered he be arrested.

HIllary--Is it a coup?

Obama--Is it a coup?

Hillary--I asked if it was a coup.

Obama--Let's check wiki.

What is absolutely unfreakinbelievable it that Obama takes 11 days to really talk about Iran and be critical of the gov't after they were killing people in the streets who were protesting.

But only takes 3 hours to weigh in on Honduras.

What is wrong with this picture?

Nothing. Honduras is in our hemisphere and Iran is not.

Nothing. Honduras is in our hemisphere and Iran is not.

News doesn't take that much longer to travel!

It isn't about news traveling, but about what is in our "circle of influence" and what is not. Honduras is closer to America and could be argued is within our "circle of influence"

I must go to sleep. I didn't realize how late it was. Continue this tomorrow.

Obama is siding with Chavez???
I want my vote back.

Good night, Kanrei. Sweet dreams.

#56 | Posted by moder8 at 2009-06-29 09:56 PM

Why aren't I surprised that Johnson, the rightwing tool, thinks a coup overthrowing a democratically elected leftist is a good thing? As a human being could he be any uglier?

Now do you support Chavez' soulmate because as an abject obsequious sycophant you unquestioningly and unthinkingly support every action taken by Obama, or is it because as a thinking leftist, you support outcomes that favor installation of leftist wannabe dictators in office? Is it personal idolatry of Obama, moder8, or is it an ideological matter with you?

I suppose that it may be your human side as defending indigent thugs on a daily basis you develop an empathy and thus a sense of affinity with them, and so you are among those arrayed against those elsewhere who are provident and opposed to installation of a left wing "dictator for life."

Come on moder8, why do you support someone who intiated procedures seeking to install himself as "Presidente for life," sort of like his stalwart champion Chavez of Venzuela? Ah, you don't see the former El Presidente as a narcissist who wanted to engineer things so that he could personally retain power? What do you think that his motivations were, counselor?

Maybe it will happen to your big eared communist in the white house.

Ousted by a coup???

Yeah, right! The man tries to overturn his country's constitution to become another Hugo Chavez, and the law, via the military, arrests and removes the bastard for his illegality.

Of course Chavez, the Castro sisters, and Lord Zero all protest (which ought to tell you what kind of leftist Lord Zero is), and call it a coup?

More libtard bastardization of the English language!

The man may have broken the laws of his country, but his country ousted him in a coup nonetheless, appearing not to trust democratic forms to do the job. Sorry, that's what happened.

This is about as legal as overthrowing a leader in a Central American country can get. Not surprising that the Libs are agaisnt this. Smart liberals are more prevelant in the academic world where as smart conservatives are more prevelent in the REAL WORLD. If the Honduran congress would of tooken the slow beuracratic route of trying to oust their dictator wannabe from power he very well might of found a way to stay in power. In revolutions there is never fine line between what is Black & White. Even the American one.

The man may have broken the laws of his country, but his country ousted him in a coup nonetheless, appearing not to trust democratic forms to do the job. Sorry, that's what happened.

#74 | Posted by Zed

I'm sure Hamas would agree with you on this. But in the real world we have safeguards against leftists who would become dictators. If you want to call it a coup when a leftist is removed, go rigt ahead. Dick!

why didn't this happen in 2000 with Bush?

#2 | Posted by AuntieSocial

It's happening now with Obama and the out-of-control Dems in Congress!

Hopefully our Supreme court and military will do the same thing when the time comes in 8 years..

"Hopefully our Supreme court and military will do the same thing when the time comes in 8 years.."

Why would you think Obama's successor will need to be removed by the military and the courts?

#79 | Posted by Danforth

It's not his successor that I'm worried about. Just like that other leftist, Chavez, I can see in 8 years Barry and all the Obamabots, telling us how we just can't survive without him.

"It's not his successor that I'm worried about. Just like that other leftist, Chavez, I can see in 8 years Barry and all the Obamabots, telling us how we just can't survive without him."

Oh my God. This sort of talk may be the funniest shit I've seen here in a long time. So to you who are claiming this line, how did you react when lefties worried about Bush doing just such a thing--declaring martial law, whatever? Scoffed, didn't you? Ye gods. Do you know what it would take for such a thing to happen in this country?

This is almost as rich as those of you who wish for Obama to be proven not a native. Or as those of you who wish for the military to stage a coup against him. Do you people really want our country to experience a constitutional crisis the likes of which we've never seen (or not since the Civil War)? Yeah, that would help our economy and our international stature... Be real good for realpolitik.

The real question is: Since they removed the president of Honduras for screwing with the constitution and trying to make himself a dictator - WHY IS OBAMA SUPPORTING HIM?

Scoff if you want...but Congress Moran has put in a bill to eliminate term limits for the president, Obama has stated repeatedly on how the constitution (which he swore to defend) restricts him (That IS its purpose!)

So, unless Obama is trying to make the case that a president should not be removed (no matter how many laws he breaks) why is he supporting a potential dictator over the will of the people of his country?

"The man may have broken the laws of his country, but his country ousted him in a coup nonetheless,..."

He was ordered arrested and removed by the Honduran Attorney General in accordance with the Honduran constitution, all entirely legal. The reason Chavez printed the ballots was because the Honduran government refused to have ballots printed for an illegal referendum. Once they were sent to Honduras by Chavez, the military wouldn't distribute them so Zelaya had a mob take them from the military compound and start distributing them. The Honduran Supreme Court declared it illegal and ordered him arrested and escorted out of the country. It was hardly a "coup," it was done according to their constitution. Maybe someone could explain it to Obama and the Obamaniacs.

NOt surprising that the righties here want to pretend that this coup was actually legal, they dream of doing the exact same thing right here and they think of it as a precedent.
It's complete bull shit and only the listeners of right wing radio and TV believe it.

NOt surprising that the righties here want to pretend that this coup was actually legal, they dream of doing the exact same thing right here and they think of it as a precedent.
It's complete bull shit and only the listeners of right wing radio and TV believe it.

Sorry Danni, you're not correct.

I am not a rightie and this was NOT a coup but I do think what was done was correct.

Follow the constitution and its laws or change them according to the laws.

You're normally very common sense but for some reason here you're not making much sense in the stand you are taking......show me where the removal was not correct and leave the political rhetoric out.

Follow the constitution and its laws or change them according to the laws.

You're normally very common sense but for some reason here you're not making much sense in the stand you are taking......show me where the removal was not correct and leave the political rhetoric out.

#85 | Posted by moneywar

I don't think they DID follow the constitution. An article today says Zelaya was planning to come back into the country. The current "President" says if he does he'll be arrested and will face trial.

If he could be arrested and face trial, why didn't they do that in the first place instead of having the military drag him out of bed and spirit him out of the country.

This was a coup. Maybe the guy needs to be removed from office, but not that way.

I don't know of a single country in the world that supports the coup. The Organization of American States condemns the coup. The UN condemns the coup.

They're all wrong?

I don't think they DID follow the constitution. An article today says Zelaya was planning to come back into the country. The current "President" says if he does he'll be arrested and will face trial.

If he could be arrested and face trial, why didn't they do that in the first place instead of having the military drag him out of bed and spirit him out of the country.

Now wait.....the military dragged him out of bed and spirited him out of the country but yet now zelaya is planning to come back into the country...??????

"show me where the removal was not correct and leave the political rhetoric out."

I would think that the removal of the president, without a hearing, an impeachment for silly, pretend crimes of holding a non-binding referendum would pretty much indicate it was a coup.
The UN calls it a coup, most governments of the world call it a coup.
It's a coup and it will not succeed IMHO.
We'll see.

This is no coup, it is a act of a play that hasn't finished yet.

The UN calls it a coup, most governments of the world call it a coup.

So therefore itsa coup!

Kind of funny the government in power is having to coup itself.....and all this crying while the government has not changed.

I guess it was a major coup have obama change with bush.

"This is no coup, it is a act of a play that hasn't finished yet."

I'd agree with that, it will be a while before the dust settles.

"It was done according to their Constitution..."

The Honduran Constitution specifies a sitting president can be "escorted out of the country" with no more than a finding by the Supreme Court there?

I'm willing to be taught, but for now color me skeptical. If you can't find this dog-and-pony show in Honduran law then it's a coup.

I note the fascinating right-wingers above who applaud the subversion of law in the name of efficiency, or in getting the one political outcome they like.

There are opportunities for settlement in Honduras. Take advantage of them. You'll fit right in.

This is interesting---So the president of the country gets no chance to offer no evidence or arguments in open court---But that's OK?

Even more interesting---There was no civil authority available to roust this official? Not one measly police officer anywhere that could be armed with a warrant? The military had to do it?

Coup.

Coup or not a coup. Who cares!!!

The "coup" has support of the congress and the courts. Full support for impreachment if Honduran law permits. Obviously the Honduran President seeking to become a dictator who just previously stormed a building where ballots that Chavez sent him isn't going to abide by the law and could get people hurt and also there might be a real big chance the dictatorship would happen. The judges, congressmen, rich, & middleclass (AKA smart people) are thinking whats best for their country. The poor people who easily get bought off by dictators (AKA dumb people & left wing votes) aren't thinking ahead. Be realisitic LIBs impeachments in Central America doesn't happen. Dictators take over before that can take place.

Be realisitic LIBs impeachments in Central America doesn't happen. Dictators take over before that can take place.

#95 | Posted by quisp65

But that can only happen with the support of the military - and this guy didn't have that. So what, exactly, prevented him from being arrested by civil authorities and having the legal system run its course?

"But that can only happen with the support of the military - and this guy didn't have that. So what, exactly, prevented him from being arrested by civil authorities and having the legal system run its course?"

A few successful payoffs to the right generals or changes of command can change all this. Presidents have lots of power. Allegiances can change fast in Banana republics. Welcome to the real world!

Welcome to the real world!

#97 | Posted by quisp65

I suspect I've been out in the real world for a good bit longer than you have, but thanks for supporting your argument with vague "what ifs".

"I suspect I've been out in the real world for a good bit longer than you have, but thanks for supporting your argument with vague "what ifs"."

Well apparently most of the judges, congressman, rich & middleclass who live in Honduras disagree. The guy only had 6 more months of presidency. Maybe they knew something you didn't.

"Maybe they knew something you didn't..."

The Hondurans were following their culture, not their constitution. Yes, this is how it's done down there. All the "realists" are cheering; all fans of democracy are shedding a tear.