Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Thursday, June 25, 2009

Dr. Kenneth H. Spady of Everson, Wash., can't retire at age 81. After more than two years of trying, and several close recruiting calls, there's still no one to take his place in this rural community 100 miles north of Seattle, where the nation's shortage of primary care doctors.

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Don't worry--Physician Assistants will do just fine.

Sincerely,

Obama

"Physicians Assistants will do just fine...."

A ham sandwich is a meal to a starving man.

I note the reason for the doctor shortage is the doctors themselves. Current system richly rewards lack of care provision. Reminds me of a time not so long ago when the Brits found a financial incentive to let the Irish starve.

And in some western state (Colorado?) some doctor is reluctantly gearing up to resume the practice of the martyred Dr. Tiller, risking his life so women with problem pregnancies won't die. herm

women with problem pregnancies won't die. - HARM

1% of all abortions occur because of rape or incest; 6% of abortions occur because of potential health problems regarding either the mother or child, and 93% of all abortions occur for social reasons (i.e. the child is unwanted or inconvenient).

7% - yeah, problem pregnancies right - the problem was the mother could not keep her legs crossed - what a tool you are HERM - tired of having to keep saying it. Where is that wayback machine so I can go speak with your mother about her "reproductive rights".

Cuba exports doctors because they educate their people for free and thus have an abundance of doctors. India takes jobs from America because it educates its people to do the high tech jobs while America raises tuition and make education less affordable. We need to invest in the human infrastructure of the country.

#6 | Posted by danni

India has an inconme tax rate of 23-33 %. And as we all know, Cuba is such a wonderful country to live in, but I am sure danni would love the U.S. to be just like cuba with her messiah playing the part of castro.

#6 and #7

Yes, shame on you, Danni, for bringing up other countries when trying to substantiate your arguments for a change! Shit, shame on you for advocating a change! This is America, where our problems all work themselves out, or are the fault of socialist/communists!

Why would someone want to go through everything that is required to be a doctor to merely be a government employee that gets their fees set by the government? Consider that once government gets involved, doctors will be TOLD what their services are worth. I suppose that those services would be worth very little given every person's newly found God given right to health care.

And in some western state (Colorado?)

#4 | Posted by herm

No, it was Kansas, where the world is young (only 6000 years old according to a recent school board).

#7 | Posted by chickenrancher at 2009-06-25 10:54 AM | Reply | Flag: Has nothing of substance to add to the conversation...EVER!

"Why would someone want to go through everything that is required to be a doctor to merely be a government employee that gets their fees set by the government?"

First, you should ask the doctors in most other moder nations what is their motivations and secondly why would you want to go through all that just to be told how much you get to charge by an insurance company.
YOu pretend they aren't already being told what to charge. They are.

New talking point please.

This has been caused by the Health care industry and the way they force doctors into "speciality rolls" it has nothing to do with choice because if you are a specialist they can Charge more and restrict the care they can provide you. It is another case of these companies putting profit ahead of peoples health and what is best for this country. To all those on the right if you dont want socialized Med. figure out a way for these companies to actualy put whats best for People head of a Dollar figure. That is all it will take. Figure out a way to change the culture of these companies. PS do the same thing for All companies. Example: people are pissed because companies slash Benefits even during good times so CEO's can attain a higher bonus. Then they lay off those employees or cut there pay and bonus. While CEO's are uneffected. Figure out a way to make those at the top to take responibility for there actions and have them take the first hit and all the rush towards socialism will stop. IE tax breaks for Companies that act with a once of moral fiber instead F the little people i cant take a 10 million dollar cut when i am making 20 i might have an Alan Stanford Moment and have to fly with the plebes. PS if you didnt read his Comments on Flying commerical the Guy is tryly one of the largest D bags ever.

Wow. ElCid is a religious nutjob AND a fire-breathing misogynist. I suppose that goes hand in hand.

Don't worry--Physician Assistants will do just fine.

Sincerely,

Obama

#1 | Posted by MURPHY at 2009-

AH dont worry
I am sure there are plenty of affirmative action doctors around.......

"Don't worry--Physician Assistants will do just fine."

Hmm, interesting!

One of The Biggest Religious Kooks on this site bemoans the loss of scientifically trained professionals!

Fucking Priceless!

Perhaps if people like murk and nanc didn't indoctrinate an entire generation with reenactments of the Rapture, (they have entire summer camps devoted to this Baptist derangement) perhaps we would have more people this country who went to bed dreaming and planning of a Future instead of thinking how to usher in their Naked Picnic in the Sky with Jesus!

New talking point please.

#11 | Posted by danni at 2009-

okay

rural communities like this have had the problem of attracting young doctors for some time now...
and this massive government takeover of medicine will do anything but help since there is a projected doctor shortage. possibly on its way

We don't need none of dem der doctors and their fancy-smancy book lernin round des parts! If de good lawd wants em to live, they live and if de good lawd don't, they don't. Simple. Damn librals making things harder than they havta be.

www.drudge.com

Retired until "axe" got suspended.

Don't worry--Physician Assistants will do just fine

Yeah they do for the most part. I see my Dr. once a year for my physical and the PA all the rest of the time.

Danni

Under the present system, the docthas the choice of what insurance to take. Further, since there are multiple insurance companies, the company cannot unilaterally fix the rates of doctor's compensation.

Nice attempt to justify a eutopian position.

#13 | Posted by LetUsPrey

More tolerance from the left for different opinions and someone stressing self restraint/control. Heavan forbid that a woman be blamed for getting pregnant - only men make women pregnant. How silly of me to think otherwise. Your a retard LUP. When did I mention religion again in my post? 93% of the woman who have abortions wanted to be pregnant. Why do I say that? 100% of the people posting today on the DR wanted to post - it was THEIR decision to log on and type - yes, just like sex there is more than one party involved - anyone could come onto the site and just read it without retorting just like 93% of those pregnant women had a choice before they opened their legs. They chose to get pregnant. 100% of the women practicing abstinence do not get pregnant. Disclaimer - the very small percentage that use some form of birth control that fails do not fall into the 93% above I believe.

We don't need none of dem der doctors and their fancy-smancy book lernin round des parts! If de good lawd wants em to live, they live and if de good lawd don't, they don't. Simple. Damn librals making things harder than they havta be.

#17 | Posted by kanrei at 2009

DAMN STRAIGHT PARTNER

I didnt knows you wus from round heres........

10 miles down as the crow flies

well sheet feller......

93% of the woman who have abortions wanted to be pregnant.

So 93% of women who have abortions don't want them... who's forcing them to the clinics at gunpoint? The ACLU?

If all of these people wanted to be pregnant, then why did they get abortions in the first place, dumbass?

They chose to get pregnant.

They chose to have sex.

100% of the women practicing abstinence do not get pregnant.

"Abstinance" is the least reliable method of contraception - it flies in the face of millions of years of evolution. We are hardwired to fuck.

Actualy if gov was setting the rates I think we would see less trouble finding doc's for rural places. If you are only gonna make 25 bucks a paitent would you rather do it in NY where you have to see a 100 paitents a day to get an apartment or bumfuck where 1 paitent a week will pay all your bills?

"Under the present system, the docthas the choice of what insurance to take. Further, since there are multiple insurance companies, the company cannot unilaterally fix the rates of doctor's compensation."

The same rule will apply to the public option so any choice the doctor has will just be increased. Also, insurance companies know what each other pay and make sure none pays very much more than another.

"and this massive government takeover of medicine will do anything but help since there is a projected doctor shortage. possibly on its way"

What connection is there between a government option being created and doctors choosing to practice in a rural community???

Maybe if the government provided some incentives for folks to go to school to be doctors, it would help. I never understood why we as a nation offer grants for college basketweaving, but not enough to encourage doctors, scientists and engineers.

Beacause as a nation we have an average intellegence of basketweavers.

"Medical miscalculation creates doctor shortage"

www.usatoday.com

"Actualy if gov was setting the rates I think we would see less trouble finding doc's for rural places. If you are only gonna make 25 bucks a paitent would you rather do it in NY where you have to see a 100 paitents a day to get an apartment or bumfuck where 1 paitent a week will pay all your bills?"

#26 | Posted by TaoWarrior

Have you ever been a physician practicing in a rural area? It's much more difficult than practicing in a large city where you have backup and alterernate coverage. Why do you think most physicians don't want to go to small towns? You are alone, everybody knows where you live and they come to your house in the middle of the night.

You want to have a set fee or salary? Most physicians won't go there for 3 X whatever you are going to pay.

What connection is there between a government option being created and doctors choosing to practice in a rural community???

As the son of a rural doctor who kept his practice open long after he should have retired (until he was felled by a stroke) the connection is there, but it is not what aflababble thinks it is.

The main problem rural doctors have, and the big reason for the shortage, is getting paid.

My fathers practice was in rural Alabama, in a county where the only industry was agriculture.

When I was young, before Medicaid, he routinely got paid in watermelons, beans and other produce. The people, mostly black sharecroppers, had no money.

Medicaid in Alabama was a problem to deal with, mostly due to their practice of retroactively disallowing drugs which were on the list when administered, thus sticking the doctor with the cost. However, it allowed my family to have a decent income and the patients to eat their own food and not use it to pay the doctor bill.

From my experience, I would have to say that a single payer health plan would increase incentives for doctors to open rural clinics. There are definite lifesytle advantages, especially if one likes being a big fish in a little pond.

Have you ever been a physician practicing in a rural area?

No.

Most physicians won't go there for 3 X whatever you are going to pay.

Probably not especialy with the cost of medical school added into the equation. The very reason we need to look at those costs as factors to the very real health care problems this nation faces.

"Probably not especialy with the cost of medical school added into the equation."

I don't know how it works for doctors but if a teacher is willing to teach in some inner city schools they can get student loans forgiven, why couldn't we do the same for doctors willing to practice in underserved rural communitites??

Yes, in Wingding World preventative treatment of a diabetic for life for 10K (paid for by every premium payer) doesn't Make Fiscal Sense like Having to Amputate, rehabilitate, and provide long term services to that same diabetic for 100K ---- after visiting the emergency room (paid for by Every Premium Payer)!

See, just like every person who blames the economic downturn on Obama is a person who didn't loose anything anyway, those who whine about Healthcare are people who Don't Pay Premiums Now!

It's as Absurd as a Creationist complaining about the demise of Science and Engineering in America and thinking someone will take them seriously!

Danni,

I believe there are programs like that in some states.

Other incentives for young doctors to go to rural areas are offered by towns and private individuals.

There are often clinics that are empty, where the old doctor retired or died. New doctors can get extremely advantageous situations if they agree to reopen the practice.

In many towns there is still some 'old money'. These individuals will often mentor a new doctor financially with loans, grants, land deals, etc.

Doctors are in high demand in rural areas. If a young doctor grew up in a small town and wants the advantages of raising his or her family there, they can establish themselves much more quickly than in a city.

A single payer health plan would, I believe, make the proposition more attractive by reducing the amount of pro bono work the doctor must provide.

"A single payer health plan would, I believe, make the proposition more attractive by reducing the amount of pro bono work the doctor must provide."

I suspect you are right about that.

What connection is there between a government option being created and doctors choosing to practice in a rural community???

#27 | Posted by danni at 2009-06-

because of the shortage of doctors nationwide that some say is going to happen.
if there are even less drs, then the pool they DO have would be even smaller...

and dont tell me that thier numbers wouldnt go down...and even if they stayed the same...millions more on health care rolls would make it seem like there were fewer docs...

and again...rural places is the last place almost ANY vocation wants to go to unless they are from there....

risking his life so women with problem pregnancies won't die. herm

#4 | Posted by herm

Almost any doctor will do that. Look closer, that isn't what tiller was doing.

The free market will determine whether you live or die, just like God wants it.

Muffy

.rural places is the last place almost ANY vocation wants to go

I don't believe that.

I worked in the Emergency Dept. of a hospital that had a Family Practice residency program.

Most of the residents were very idealistic and were fulfilling their dream of being doctors so they could help people. They knew that Family Medicine wasn't that lucrative, but they wanted to do primary care. Many of them planned on a rural practice.

Of course, quite a bit of the idealism wears off over the years of actual medical practice, but my point is that doctors are not all the same. Some want wealth and the city life in a specialty where they are more applied scientists than caregivers. Others don't see life that way and want to participate directly in people's lives in a more meaningful way.

Medical school admissions are biased against the first kind. If you are going to try to get into med school, you better have your idealism intact.

"I don't know how it works for doctors but if a teacher is willing to teach in some inner city schools they can get student loans forgiven, why couldn't we do the same for doctors willing to practice in underserved rural communitites??"

#34 | Posted by danni

Because teachers who teach in inner cities usually do not have to live in the inner city.

Doctors who practice in a rural area have to live there. They usually are the only doctor for miles. A decent hospital is miles away. It's almost impossible to take a vacation, you can get sued for not being there. People literally come to your house at all hours.

Most physicians won't do it for any amount of money, loan forgiveness etc.

I'm not sure what you do for a living but are you "on call" 24 hours a day and seven days a week?

The "System" needs to put money toward primary care not just in the training but on the back end in payment. You must understand that primary care physicians are paid the worst/least but yet are stuck with more of the burden particularly paperwork wise. My wife is a primary care doc and she is constantly swamped with insurnace paperwork. None of this stuff is paid for by the insurance companies.. its rolled into the fees charged for your office visits, etc. Primary care is wonderful on the patient care side of things. On the paperwork side, most PCPs will tell you their sick of spending hours if not days/weeks on the administration/paperwork side of things. On a side note.. my wife practices in an under served area and loves the population albeit she cannot take only medicaid patients because the pay is so poor. For too long the healthcare system has rewarded/paid more for "procedures" rather than prevention. Basically the system pays big $ for performing procedures but pays nothing extra if my wife catches a pre-cancerous lession before it costs the system big $s. To me its somewhat arse backwards. The fun is figuring out how to track this sort of thing.. its much easier to pay for a procedure than assign value to heading off a patient's future disease(s). One more note.. for those that think doctors go into the profession simply to make money. Most Med students graduate with 80-120K of loans in tow. Thats a hefty burdon to pay back when the general mindset is .. you shouldn't go into the profession to make money. I honesly don't know how any PCP could start a solo practice right out of school these days. Most docs are forced to join large groups as partners short of being personally wealthy up front.

Don't worry--Physician Assistants will do just fine.

Sincerely,

Obama

#1 | Posted by MURPHY

Actually mine does for me. I see one 99% of the time and I am very happy with the services.

If your pregnant, you might find it easier to find a doctor to perform an abortion than to find a doctor to deliver it.

One is expected to injure the baby.

My ex-sister in law is pregnant. There is only one hospital in her area that delivers babies. There used to be 5 hospitals that would just 10 years ago.

Physician assistant will do just fine.. for simple things. Trust them to catch other problems or prescribe drugs. I don't think so. Many physician assistants are employed by DOCs. Its a valid point.. but don't think for a second that these providers are equiv. in training or knowledge. There's a reason doctors have to carry malpractice and physician assistants have to be backed up by a doctor.

Being an OB doctor is a challenge just about anywhere you go. Particularly in states where no TORT reforms have taken place. OB doctors have to pay huge amounts of money for malpractice and as a result almost all of these physicians are affiliated with a hospital or are receiving some form of assistance to practice in a given area. Take my previous example of 80-120K debt coming out of Med school and tack on another 60-120K A YEAR in malpractice costs.. it should be no big surprise that OB services are so limited. Also keep in mind that in most situations .. a patient can sue up until their 18 years of age for a so called birth complication.

The Replacements...great fucking band

Why would someone want to go through everything that is required to be a doctor to merely be a government employee that gets their fees set by the government?

#9 | Posted by A_Citizen

Uhm... How about these professions that also require varying levels of training and credentials:

- Public school teachers

- Fire fighters

- Police officers

- Civil service worker?

- Military personnel

The above are certainly not in it for the money, 'cause it ain't that great.

This has been caused by the Health care industry and the way they force doctors into "speciality rolls" it has nothing to do with choice

#12 | Posted by fenderwa41

It has more to due with liability and high medical malpractice insurance rates.

India takes jobs from America because it educates its people to do the high tech jobs while America raises tuition and make education less affordable. We need to invest in the human infrastructure of the country.

#6 | Posted by danni

Look again sweet cheeks. The US has plenty of college grads. Problem is they graduate in all the easy stuff and don't take engineering and science.

We have college grads flipping burgers while we have to import math and science teachers for our high schools and engineers for our tech industries.

The town should make a deal with some doctors that they will fully pay off their student loans for a contractual obligation of 3 to 4 years.

But seriously, I have a hard time believing this story. This town is a short commute from Bellingham. Do you know how idyllic Bellingham is?

If it wasn't so monochromatic in those parts, I'd try to convince my wife to take that job.

"How do we rally Drudge to get the important stories on the front page instead of a ridiculous nonsense story like a monkee pees on a foreign president?"

Two ways as far as I can tell. Either rcade finds the story particularly important, or your thread gets a lot of posts (the threshold I seem to notice is near 40 or so).

Of course, if rcade finds your story objectionable for any reason, it will languish on the back page or mysteriously disappear altogether.

How do we rally Drudge to get the important stories on the front page

FF

- Public school teachers
- Fire fighters
- Police officers
- Civil service worker
- Military

The above are certainly not in it for the money, 'cause it ain't that great.

#48 | Posted by ZOT

No, but the retirement benifits are great at a real young age.

#51 | Posted by L_RContrarian

first, you must never whine about the front page stories.

second, you must never make suggestions.

third, never whine about the front page stories.

got it?

Apparently someone hasn't grasped the concept of toggling back and forth between the front and back page, or just perusing the "Comments" section for interesting discussions.

What the hell difference does it make whether it is front page or back?

What the hell difference does it make whether it is front page or back?
#57 | Posted by SanAntonioRogue

Well, in his defense, it was probably a year or more before I bothered to click on the back page link to actually find out what it was.

i like my stuff on the middle page.

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