Such a sad state of affairs. Sighhhhhh. I thought the United States were the GOOD GUYS.

Larry

I thought the United States were the GOOD GUYS.

That was about 30 years ago, now, just another power criminal country exploiting any nation we can get our claws on.

In fact we are trashing our own nation for that bit of profit and material gain from those other empire nation building process.

Go America!

The old adage is true. The weak Nations always bring down the Strong. Never fails. Hook up a Strong Battery next to a weak one. The Weak battery will zap the juice of the Strong battery rendering them both useless.

Larry

Hook up a Strong Battery next to a weak one. The Weak battery will zap the juice of the Strong battery rendering them both useless.
~Larry

I liken your analogy to morals and the rational of torture.

Many here write that torture works. That really isn't the point whether true or not, do we truly want to allow our moral fiber to degenerate to what we despise in other cultures.

Many here write that torture works. That really isn't the point whether true or not...

#4 | Posted by Zap at 2009-04-24 09:52 AM | Reply

Oddly enough, whether it worked or not always was the point, until Blair admitted it worked...

Now, as I predicted, the limpwrists would change their tune to "It's not whether or not it works, it's not moral".

That was about 30 years ago...

#2 | Posted by moneywar at 2009-04-24 01:37 AM | Reply |

We were the good guys in 1979?

So, we nuked civilians in the 40's. Waged war with Korea and China in the 50's. Killed our president in the 60's. Attacked and killed civilians in the 70's, and let Pol Pot run amok on even more.

But 1979 was the height of our White Hat wearing days...

Now, as I predicted, the limpwrists would change their tune to "It's not whether or not it works, it's not moral".

So torture is moral?

Anyone care to produce information confirming the often heard contention of torture freaks that such interrogation practices produced information that actually uncovered plots, thwarted attacks, or saved lives?

torture doesn't work
nor is it moral

poodle doesn't care either way
he's a stubborn lil pure bread

So torture is moral?

#7 | Posted by Zap at 2009-04-24 10:16 AM | Reply |

Who the fuck cares as long as it produces results? Good guys finish last, especially where wars and national security are concerned.

We were the good guys in 1979?

101,

Crasswar is talking about how much wage a fatass autoworker made in 1979 and how great is was for them.

torture doesn't work

#9 | Posted by klifferd at 2009-04-24 10:23 AM | Reply

Obama's hand picked Intel Chief disagrees with you. Let me see....Intel Chief or mongrel...Hmmmm.

Actually, Obama's intel guy says it's counterproductive.

Actually, Obama's intel guy says it's counterproductive.

#13 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2009-04-24 10:29 AM | Reply

Actually he said it produced "significant results", and then tailored a message after the fact to fit in with the Admin's stance on torture.
But why let facts get in the way? If torture produced "significant results" then clearly torture worked. It's not a difficult concept.

So, as I stated, Obama's hand picked Intel Chief disagrees with him.

"Intel Chief or mongrel...Hmmmm"

considering you think obama's pick suck

i'll go with mongrel

pure bread

Our government is dedicated to preserving and defending the Constitution of the United States

That is why it is constantly under a thick piece of glass and surrounded by guards.

Now, as I predicted, the limpwrists would change their tune to "It's not whether or not it works, it's not moral".
#5 | Posted by 101Chairborne

First, sorry our wrists are not as strong as yours...cough cough.

Second, No. And if you honestly believe that, you watch too much Fox News. The point was it is illegal...idiot... or why else would there have been such arguments over Geneva? Effectiveness was a side point. It was really only pushed by the right to justify this crap.

Three, we executed people after Nuremberg for this.

Four, besides Gevena, we signed an array of treaties saying we would never torture anyone...period.

Five, federal law prohibits the actions taken by the CIA.

Sixth, this doesn't even get into disappearing people...also illegal on every level.

Seven, there is a journalist in Iran and now two more in North Korea who have been arrested. Because of the US stand on torture, they may now be tortured and executed without an open trial. And we can't say a thing about it. In fact, if we take the Bush route, we are expected to praise Iran and North Korea for being harsh on terrorists and spies.

The right seems determined to turn us into to China. We need to cut benefits to the working man because we need to compete with China. When bush was in office all those who spoke against him and his tactics where traitors and should be locked up, Just like china does. We need to use the Use these torture tech. from China. We need to Government to enforce Morality, just like China. How can one group claim to support Freedom yet want to turn our Country into a communist state??? You are no better then the left you claim to hate so much.

1. Why bother? That was stupid.
2. WTF are you talking about?
3. What is the "this" you are refering to? Be more specific.
4. So what? We sign treaties all of the time we have no intention of keeping.
5. Obviously not.
6. Non-sequitur
7. Non-sequitur. Pretending as if our harsh interogation techniques will result in more of our citizens being tortured is pure stupidity (like your entire post).

I shit on the floor and wipe it on the walls.

Posted by 101Chairpoodle

I shit on the floor and wipe it on the walls.
Posted by 101Chairpoodle
#21 | Posted by RastaCyborg

You don't know a thing about him, do you?

It would be your bed and your walls.

Jeez.

do we truly want to allow our moral fiber to degenerate to what we despise in other cultures.

#4 | Posted by Zap at 2009-04-24 09:52 AM | Reply

THEY KILLED 3000 AMERICANS ON 9/11

THEY CUT OFF DANIEL PEARLS HEAD!

- The Right Apologists

Hey Poodle,
I'm going to Mighty Taco for lunch; is it safe to use the restroom there or have you been wiping your scat on the walls?

Who the fuck cares as long as it produces results?

#10 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2009-04-24 10:24 AM

Because it is illegal. (Torture is prohibited under 18 U.S.C. 2340).

Because it is illegal. (Torture is prohibited under 18 U.S.C. 2340).

#26 | Posted by 726 at 2009-04-24 01:33 PM | Reply

So is jaywalking. Who fucking cares as long as the ends justifies the means?
Besides, it's not as if we didn't use "illegal" methods of interogation prior to 2000.

Rastabore,
Mighty Taco? What, did you get paid today?

Sorry Chairborne, reality does not support your contention:

"The information gained from these techniques was valuable in some instances," he said in a statement yesterday, "but there is no way of knowing whether the same information could have been obtained through other means."

"The bottom line is these techniques have hurt our image around the world," Blair said in the statement. "The damage they have done to our interests far outweighed whatever benefit they gave us and they are not essential to our national security."

So is jaywalking.

#27 | Posted by 101Chairborne

Only a fool would compare torture to jaywalking.

Northguy,
Do you always come across so fucking stupid? How can you possibly think that your #28 has any relevance to anything I've typed?

You actually think a guy saying "There's no way of knowing whether..." actually means something? Honestly, you're fucking stupid.

The last line is known as damage control. That was his response AFTER the secret memo was released.

Do yourself a favor and stick to ripping off Stewart.

Only a fool would compare torture to jaywalking.

#29 | Posted by 726 at 2009-04-24 02:03 PM | Reply

And only a dumbass would close his eyes tight and try to convince himself that we didn't use harsh techniques prior to 2000.

Makes sense. Americans owe all their money to the Chinese. May as well borrow their torture techniques as well.

And only a dumbass would close his eyes tight and try to convince himself that we didn't use harsh techniques prior to 2000.

#31 | Posted by 101Chairborne at 2009-04-24 02:07 PM

Did I ever say that we didn't fool?

We didn't fool who?

101,why do you hate America and all it stands for? I'm pretty sure "Whatever it takes" and "Who cares as long as it benefits me" are not in the Constitution.

Are nukes in the Constitution?

No, and neither are Big Macs.

But there is US and International Law that says torture is illegal.

We break US and International Laws whenever we see fit. So what?

What are the consequences so far?

Ever considered the fact that the real forces behind torture have very little personal ever invested in the military; from family to themselves.. besides the fact of broken law, from 'dubya' down, most of these idiots have never really served or had a commitment to the military nor have anyone in it who might become a POW themselves.. not that decisions should be made on this basis, but it is hard to guage if you have never been a part of the machine..
and, for those who will jump on 'dubya' wagon of serving, he was at best classified a 'weekend warrior' who dodged every opportunity to really serve....a real coward..!!! he has shown many times a total disrespect for the troops in uniform. cannot identify with them..

From china?! Right on! Can I get a manual at walmart?

the techniques were "borrowed" from the Nazis:

http://i259.photobucket.com/
albums/hh289/ichisatori/
bush_noriega.jpg

oops:

1. Why bother? That was stupid.
2. WTF are you talking about?
3. What is the "this" you are refering to? Be more specific.
4. So what? We sign treaties all of the time we have no intention of keeping.
5. Obviously not.
6. Non-sequitur
7. Non-sequitur. Pretending as if our harsh interogation techniques will result in more of our citizens being tortured is pure stupidity (like your entire post).
#20 | Posted by 101Chairborne

I sometimes forget you're an idiot.
1) Obviously over your head.
2) Torture is illegal whether it works or not. that was the point from the beginning contrary to your idiotic post which I even quoted for your terrible memory.
3) torture...idiot...we are sitll talking about torture in response to your post about torture and an article about torture...
4) Signed treaties become law...as a rightie, I expected your knowledge of the Constitution to understand this.
5) ...its still illegal under Federal Law...Why do you think everyone is so scared of being prosecuted for it? ...once again...idiot...
6) ignore what you will...
7) it means we can't complain anymore... Like that standard? You set it. Good boy...idiot.

Look, 101, you could at least read a little about what you are talking about rather than listening to Beck and Rush all day. The federal laws and treaties are on the books and sprawled across websites so even people like you can find them. You break a law in this country, you pay for it. This USED to be the slogan of the Right...until they started breaking as many laws as they could. What the hell has happened to the conservative movement in this country? Family values, law and order, truth and justice, just out the window... Absolutely pathetic.

Please, for God's sake, is there anyone on the right who can talk about torture without sounding like a complete moron? 101's 8th grade education only goes so far.

Ok, I realize this is hard for 101 and other Righties to understand so I'll explain it as simply as possible.

Torture is currently illegal in the United States via federal law, treaties, and past war crimes tribunals (specifically post WWII where we executed people for torture including water boarding).

George Bush knew this. So he had Yoo and others write up legal memos saying their harsh interrogation techniques were not torture. Since they were not supposedly torture, they were not illegal.

But, the reason the intelligence operatives are worried is because despite calling a these techniques harsh interrogation rather than torture, the courts, including military courts, could find that they still constituted torture and the memos were written and relied on in bad faith. In fact, this is exactly what would happen if these people were prosecuted. The legal memos have already been debunked.

Then, if prosecuted, they would go to jail or be executed depending on the nature and degree of the crime.

101,why do you hate America and all it stands for?

101 started hating America in November 2006. The reality of the fail that was the GOP and the Bush Administration was a hard pill for him to swallow. He has to blame somebody, so its America's fault that it doesn't understand the brilliance of the right. He used to be amusing, now he's just pathetic. He's one of those righties praying Osama gets a nuke.

bottom line torture is illegal, no one can argue that. however waterboarding, which is the technique the current administration has just now made illegal was not considered torture under the previous administration; therefore waterboarding was not illegal. you cannot make something illegal then prosecute someone for doing it when it was legal. if it was illegal then congress could have stepped in back then and said wait you cant do that, its torture, but they didnt. dont go off of what the military says is illegal. they have their own set of laws that have no bearing whatsoever on the real world.

BULLSHIT Gunslinger. Just because the Previous administration said it was legal doesn't make it so. Only the Court of Law says if something is legal or not. Oh and the United States has always up until the previous administration deamed it ILLEGAL so Your spew is just that spew.

Larry