Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Friday, December 12, 2008

Global oil consumption will drop this year for the first time since 1983, prompted by an economic downturn in the West and slower growth in China.

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Its good for oil revenue dependent countries to feel the pain --- Russia, Venezuela, Saudi Arabia, Nigeria (more scams might result), etc.

Hooray for recessions, can't wait for the Republican Depression of 2008! Hell we won't be burning hardly any fuel then.

Good thing Obama will be taxing carbon emissions, and shutting down every power plant in the country that isn't powered by the sun, or by corn products in Iowa.

It is refreshing, though, to see all the posters go away who said gas prices were manipulated by oil companies, and ignore posters--like me--who saw a precipitous drop in demand, and prices. Even liberals recognize supply and demand equations when it suits them.


Hooray for recessions, can't wait for the Republican Depression of 2008! Hell we won't be burning hardly any fuel then.

#2 | Posted by danni at 2008


okay Ill go for this on ONE CONDITION..
that you even mention the DEMOCRAT RECESSION that greeted bush in 2000


just so you apply the SAME ADJECTIVE TO BOTH....

I ask, in all seriousness, does anyone expect the prices to stay at current levels? I, being the cynic, do not expect this at all.

I guess that's why it is around $1.50 per gal now. Hay libs, remember supply and demand? Or can we blame Bush.

Even liberals recognize supply and demand equations when it suits them.

#3 | Posted by rightisright at 2008-12-12 11:23 AM | Reply | Flag: Flag: (Choose)
FunnyNewsworthyOffensiveAbusiv
e



ABSOTIVITIVLY............( hybred word, a combination of absolutely and positively)

and lets make sure that your post RIGHT HERE is in the archives so that when it goes back up after opec CHOKES OFF THE SUPPLY as they have promised would happen recently.........make sure that when those same liberals tell us that it is STILL bush and cheneys fault that you have it handy to bring up

and I JUST FILLED UP AND PAID $1.29 a gallon.......

but I STILL am going to go home and do everything as if it were 4.29 a gallon..........

we must not forget that the energy problem we all were so worried about months ago

HAS NOT BEEN SOLVED.........even with the ascencion of the GREAT MESSIAH and have entered into the exaulted CULT OF OBAMATOPIA.............

"I ask, in all seriousness, does anyone expect the prices to stay at current levels? I, being the cynic, do not expect this at all.


#5 | Posted by LetUsReason "

Maybe its all just a collaborative plot between the Auto makers and the oil companies to sell the SUVs and other gas guzzlers nobody wants anymore. Now that gas is low, maybe people didn't learn their lesson and they can move those vehicles, and then gas can go back up. :)

We should enact gasoline taxes to insure that demand remains low. I'm not alone in thinking this, conservative David Frum said it too.

What a drop in less than six months from $147 bbl to $40 bbl. Remember when those idiot asshole experts were predicting $200 bbl oil. Don't believe OPEC when they say they are cutting production. There will be a lot of cheating among members trying to keep their revenues up.

Oil futures expert Thom

P.S. Deflation is a good thing for peoples personnal economies.


"Drill Here, Drill Now" is what is lowering prices.

Sincerely

BLT (two months ago, before the WH was forced to admit the recession was a year running).

"We should enact gasoline taxes to insure that demand remains low"

And so people can keep railing against President Bush for the high cost of gas, right? :)

"hybred word"

Like the author.

Hans

"And so people can keep railing against President Bush for the high cost of gas, right? :)"

One result would be that the auto manufacturers would have a market for fuel efficient cars that they could depend on. As things are now people will begin buying larger vehicles again and five years from now we will be blaming them again for building what consumers want to buy. Europe and Japan taxed gas long ago and thus created a market for fuel efficient vehicles, we didn't and the rest is history.

"that you even mention the DEMOCRAT RECESSION that greeted bush in 2000"

I don't seem to remember the massive unemployment, such as we're experiencing today, happening in 2000.

I don't seem to remember individuals losing massive value in their individual retirement funds, such as we're experiencing today, happening in 2000.

I don't seem to remember having to bailout Wall Street to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars, such as we're having to do today, happening in 2000.

I don't seem to remember massive deficits and over ten trillion dollars in debt, such as we have today, present in 2000.

Nope. I don't seem to remember 2000 being at all like the economic mess that is the Republican/George W. Bush Recession/Depression, no matter how it is spun.

Hans

"don't seem to remember 2000 being at all like the economic mess that is the Republican/George W. Bush Recession/Depression, no matter how it is spun."

Not trying to start a fight, but its our party that's controlled Congress for the past two years. Bush is the President so of course he takes the most blame, like his father and Clinton and Reagan and carter all had to. But I'm pretty pissed off at the Democratic leadership in the House and Senate too.

Related:

Auto deaths down 10 percent in 2008

NHTSA: 31,110 auto fatalities so far this year

By JOAN LOWY, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) - Federal safety officials said auto fatalities dropped almost 10 percent in 2008 through October. If the trend holds up for the year's last two months, highway deaths could reach their lowest level in the 42 years that records have been kept.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration said Thursday there were 31,110 auto fatalities the first 10 months of 2008. That's a 9.8 percent decline over the same period in 2007, when there were 34,502 fatalities.

The traffic safety administration has been tracking auto fatalities since 1966, when there were more than 50,000 deaths on the highways. The number of deaths peaked in 1972 at 54,589, then generally declined over the next two decades. The total has hovered above 40,000 the past few years.

"For the second year in a row we are seeing historic lows in deaths on our nation's roads," Transportation Secretary Mary Peters said in a statement. "Every American can be more confident than ever they will arrive at their destination safe and sound."

NHTSA did not cite a cause for the dramatic decline in highway deaths, but it overlaps with several other trends.

The Federal Highway Administration, which counts the number of cars on the road, is reporting a significant decline in the number of miles Americans are driving every month beginning in late 2007 and continuing through the first three quarters of 2008.

High gas prices through most of the year accelerated a shift to more fuel efficient cars and to alternatives to driving. Subways, buses, commuter rail and light-rail systems are reporting record increases in ridership. Amtrak, the nation's intercity passenger railroad, said it carried more passengers and brought in more revenue in fiscal 2008 than in any other year in its 37-year history.

Acting NHTSA Administrator David Kelly said it's likely safety measures also played a role in the decline in fatalities: seatbelt use is at its highest level ever, greater numbers of SUVs and other lights trucks are equipped with technology that prevents rollovers, and the federal government has been working with state and local law enforcement agencies on anti-drunk driving campaigns.

"I'm thrilled about these numbers," Kelly said. "When you talk about reductions in traffic fatalities in one year you are usually talking about hundreds in a good year. The fact that deaths are down 3,000 so far this year is staggering."

Source:

www.wishtv.com

"Hay libs, remember supply and demand?"

The price of oil went up by better than 50%. Now it has dropped by better than 50%. Didn't realize that supply/demand had fluctuated that much.

Nope. I don't seem to remember 2000 being at all like the economic mess that is the Republican/George W. Bush Recession/Depression, no matter how it is spun.

Or even the George H Bush Recession of 1992...

They can't win wars, they can't run economies, but boy can the GOPpers create recessions and depressions.

"Europe and Japan taxed gas long ago and thus created a market for fuel efficient vehicles, we didn't and the rest is history."

One thing I can see holding that back is European nations and Japan are much smaller than the United States which is more condusive to mass transportation. If our system were better a gas tax getting the cost back up to $4/gallon wouldn't be so painful. I hope the trend away from large gas guzzlers continues, but until our mass transit system improves I think a gas tax would just be too painful.

"The price of oil went up by better than 50%. Now it has dropped by better than 50%. Didn't realize that supply/demand had fluctuated that much.

#19 | Posted by fyi "

Did anyone here watch the 20/20 a week or so ago (I think it was 20/20), where they interviewed one of the key Saudi Oil guys? They asked him why oil spiked this year, and his explanation was that there was a panic early in the year that Saudi Arabia reached its peak for oil production and it was all downhill from there. Turns out they have plenty of oil and now that everyone has realized that the cost has come down. Makes sense if that's what it really was.

"If our system were better a gas tax getting the cost back up to $4/gallon wouldn't be so painful."

Only problem is it will probably go back up anyway. Already the Saudis are cutting production to push prices back up so if we don't enact a tax to reduce demand we will miss the opportunity and end up with higher prices anyway.
As far as the Democrats controlling Congress...last night proved once again that they don't really control Congress as long as Republicans can filibuster.

Drill Here, Drill Now" is what is lowering prices.


Sincerely


BLT (two months ago, before the WH was forced to admit the recession was a year running).

#12 | Posted by Redneckville at 2008


HEY SKIPPY...if you can remember that far back in your drug abused mind...........you would also remember that just by bush saying that we were undoing the drill ban that the price WENT DOWN almost overnight...........

thanks for playing

And so people can keep railing against President Bush for the high cost of gas, right? :)

#13 | Posted by GreenDad at 2008-


BINGO BABY.............

and dont forget to toss cheney in there as well

"As far as the Democrats controlling Congress...last night proved once again that they don't really control Congress as long as Republicans can filibuster.

#23 | Posted by danni"

I don't buy that. We took over in 2006, and now we've expanded our majority. Just because the Republicans CAN filibuster doesn't mean all is lost. If they work with the moderate Republicans (there are some), and the ones who are up for hard re-election contests they could get bills passed. It may mean they have to compromise at places but it could be done. And if they try all that and the GOP still filibusters everything then you spend millions letting the public know it and you throw even more of them out of office. Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi are absolute disasters at their posts.

Why are both sides of the aisle so set in stone on what they want and refuse to debate and compromise?

hans..
I didnt say it was as bad as this is. my point of course is her labeling of this economic shit...
I am sure she has NEVER typed the phrase

DEMOCRAT recession in talking about THAT PERiod....


AND AGAIN>....NEVER ONE MENTION of the names

chris doddd
barney frank........( well except when hans yells out.....OH BARNEY>>>>DEEPER>>>>DEEPER>..) LOL.........IM joking....chill out..

and others like franklin rich.........whose name is appropriate, wouldnt you say??

They can't win wars, they can't run economies, but boy can the GOPpers create recessions and depressions.

#20 | Posted by northguy3 at


WOW>..........you are joining in on hans and dannis' partisan rants about economic CYCLES..

who woulda thunk i?????

Greendad, with the increase in the majority we may be more able to get things done but right now we don't really even have a majority in the Senate.

As far as the Democrats controlling Congress...last night proved once again that they don't really control Congress as long as Republicans can filibuster.

#23 | Posted by danni at 2008-12


thank God ...sweety....thank God............


OF COURSE I WILl have to think about what I heard this morning. the UAW wouldnt back off salary demands and none of the other GOVERNMENT WELFARE reciepients didnt.......is that fair??????

"WOW>..........you are joining in on hans and dannis' partisan rants about economic CYCLES.."

I guess it is just a coincidence that after each successive Republican administration TRILLIONS get added to the national debt, unemployment rises, recessions loom. That is not partisanship, that's history BLT.
It has been going on since Hoover brought us the Great Republican Depression of 1929.

Deflation is a good thing for peoples personnal economies.

#11 | Posted by fwthom

Not if you are deflated out of business.

"thank God ...sweety....thank God............"

I bet you really think God has something to do with it.
Clue: God is not a Republican.

"Deflation is a good thing for peoples personnal economies."

Oh yeah, it's great to pay a mortgage with dollars worth more than the one's you borrowed.
Get a clue FWTHOM.
Deflation = depression!

"Greendad, with the increase in the majority we may be more able to get things done but right now we don't really even have a majority in the Senate.

#29 | Posted by danni"

We have a majority, what we lack is the leadership and political talent to get things done. Sorry, I'm just kind of mad after they couldn't get that bill passed last night.

We still won't have 60 votes come January, and although there will be times when the moderate republicans vote to end a fillibuster there will also be times when we don't. What will we do then, say we can't get anything done with 58 (maybe 59) senate seats?

"We have a majority"

No, we don't. Obama resigned. WE had a one vote majority, we don't even have that right now.

"What will we do then, say we can't get anything done with 58 (maybe 59) senate seats?"

Nuclear Option????
Unless there is compromise from the Republicans it will be difficult to get anything done and they seem quite unwilling to compromise about anything. They are more interested in playing partisan politics than in helping the country. They always have been.

I don't think there will be much problem getting moderates like Snowe and Collins on board for a lot of legislation.

Congress should get on this right away by calling the major US oil companies to come before them and answer the question about manipulating prices. Clearly the oil companies are up to some kind of shenanigans, manipulating the price of oil to go down, just as they manipulated prices upwards last July.

This is a travesty!

"Unless there is compromise from the Republicans it will be difficult to get anything done and they seem quite unwilling to compromise about anything."

Compromise works both ways. We can't just always expect them to see our side of things, and sometimes they have good ideas too that we should be willing to listen to.

What would have been so wrong with bumping up wage cuts by 1 year so that the entire bill could pass last night? Wouldn't it have been better to get something rather than nothing?

In my opinion everyone that works for them, from chairman to janitor should be taking wage cuts. They're coming begging with their hats in their hands wanting American taxpayers to save them, but they aren't willing to sacarfice?

"Nuclear Option????"

Bad idea. Think the Republicans are glad they didn't take that option now? Majorities can be lost just as easily as they are gained.

"I don't think there will be much problem getting moderates like Snowe and Collins on board for a lot of legislation.

#38 | Posted by SanAntonioRogue "

Hagel too at times. But that's a fine line to walk. I'm sure they'll break a good amount of times, but unless they want to face stiff primary challenges they're going to have to keep the Republican caucus happy too.

GREENDAD

Hagel's calling it quits. However, I think we'll see a resurgence of pragmatism from several of the GOP Senators. Their popularity trajectory looks like the Black Diamond hill at Vail.

It has been going on since Hoover brought us the Great Republican Depression of 1929.

#31 | Posted by danni at 2008-


YES YES YES YES YES


I believe it was called the new deal......have we decided just what a failure that turned out to be...


and I know God is not a republican.......I was looking for a punch line here but I couldnt come up with one.

STILL Looking for that librarian from last night...

"20/20 program ... Makes sense if that's what it really was." - Greendad

Except that isn't supply/demand, it's what people _think could be_ supply/demand. As such it is much closer to speculation than anything.

"Congress should get on this right away by calling the major US oil companies to come before them and answer the question about manipulating prices."

#39 | Posted by TheOneBS

And what of the non-US oil companies? This is hardly a US-unique issue.

Click the link to Wiki to see a list of oil companies world-wide, and also a list of those countries that have the largest reserves.

en.wikipedia.org

"I believe it was called the new deal"

That was the solution to the depression. Thanks for mentioning it.

"I believe it was called the new deal......have we decided just what a failure that turned out to be..."

Most historians still believe it was probably the best solution applicable to the times. It still appears that only a war could have done better, and IIRC, that followed. At minimum it kick-started the recovery process and gave Americans hope.

"Hay libs, remember supply and demand?"

YEAH!

I especially remember that I could get gas anywhere I went in the country (i.e. ample supply)!

I also remember NOT hearing about any gas lines, closed refineries, closed stations and anything else that would have been truncated by limited "supply"!

It would seem sniper that you are eager to be taken for a ride --- any ride!

red, why do you think the cost went up? Why do you think the cost is comming down?

"I believe it was called the new deal......have we decided just what a failure that turned out to be..."

We?

You dittoheads get sillier by the day!

"Drill Here, Drill Now" is what is lowering prices.

Sincerely

BLT (two months ago, before the WH was forced to admit the recession was a year running).

#12 | Posted by Redneckville at 2008-12-12 11:34 AM


Bush and the evil oil companies are controlling the price of oil

Sincerely

Redneckshill whenever gas went up at the pump.

"so if we don't enact a tax to reduce demand we will miss the opportunity and end up with higher prices anyway."

#23 | Posted by danni

Please don't tell me you think is possible to alter the driving habits of enough Americans to have any significant impact on the US economy via taxation???

Damn dan. I guess then you could blame the democrats for the high gas prices and not Bush. I do have to give you credit for that thought.

Congress should get on this right away by calling the major US oil companies to come before them and answer the question about manipulating prices. Clearly the oil companies are up to some kind of shenanigans, manipulating the price of oil to go down, just as they manipulated prices upwards last July.


This is a travesty!

Oh clearly! Of course it is the oil companies because they would be the only ones who had anything to gain or lose with volatility in the market due to their shenanigans. OPEC, self-serving politicians, special interest groups, supply & demand, they couldn't have anything to do with it. This is getting tiresome.

It's great news but the State Wisconsin Goverment will be looking for a way to makeup the $0.38/gallon tax they are being shorted on.

"they can't run economies"
Uh Northguy you want want to learn the English language.


"Uh Northguy you want want to learn the English language." - Tim

What is a "want want"?

"Please don't tell me you think is possible to alter the driving habits of enough Americans to have any significant impact on the US economy via taxation???"

When gas hit $4.00 it had a measurable effect, Americans drove less. That is a fact.

Them there self-retorting retorts sure am an bitch.

They sure sure are.

What what he said.

"Get a clue FWTHOM.
Deflation = depression!

#34 | Posted by danni"

Hey danni FU

You know JACK SHIT about economics and you prove it daily. You swore to me that INFLATION was the problem this past summer, and I told you otherwise. You went on and on trying to prove what you are clearly refuting now!

Deflation is not depression, you stupid twit. Nor are we in depression. Where the f did you get your education...don't go back you got screwed!

"You swore to me that INFLATION was the problem this past summer, and I told you otherwise."

Gas at $4.00 per gallon was inflation, all prices were rising.
Now prices are falling it's called deflation.
Ask any economist, they will tell you DEFLATION is depression and is far more dangerous than inflation.
YOu twit, you insult me but you don't have a clue about anything.
Not in a depression???

The FED has already used 2 TRILLION to try and prop up more banks, our major industries are virtually bankrupt, unemployment is going through the roof.
Get a clue, somewhere.

This is a perfect example of voodoo world of economics we live in. Gas prices are not driven by supply and demand, but Gann angles.

Energy traders use history to forecast what comes next. "I actually use a protractor," says Randall Rothenberg, who trades natural gas. Rothenberg explains that he draws what are known as Gann angles, after the mathematician who designed them. From those angles come the charts that inform his trading strategy.

Rothenberg says prices sometimes move as if propelled by magic. Traders encounter what they call support or resistance levels, which function as ceilings or floors. The price of crude oil approaches that magic number, but then turns back.

Charting prices and trading on perceived patterns has a name technical analysis. It has scores of variations. People have written books about it and computer programs to help with the analysis.

Technical analysis has been compared to astrology and to reading the entrails of a goat. Traders say they've heard the naysaying, but they're sticking with their system. They say they don't know why it works, but it does.

"There is something to these numbers," says trader Anthony Grisanti, the president of GRZ Energy. "When a market gets to a number three or four times and reacts off that number, then it's a big number. So yeah, I don't think there is any analyst or anybody in the industry that would say just disregard the numbers."

Osler and her colleague analyzed data going back to the 1970s. She discovered that the pattern was indeed right about where the market was pointing or at least that it was right often enough for traders to make money using it.

Osler was intrigued with one configuration a series of three bumps aptly named the 'head and shoulders' pattern. Traders take it for an omen that prices will drop.

Profits to traders mindful of the "head and shoulders" effect would have averaged 10 percent to 20 percent a year, better than returns from the stock market. Osler says she still has no idea why this stuff works.

So by having these middlemen playing the market everyone gets to pay 15% more for gas than if they didn't exist.

excerpted from NPR

I want 4.00 dollar a gallon gasoline back!!!

I think the sustained high price did affect driving patterns to such a large degree that it is resulting in greatly reduced demand. It certainly looks that way on the roads around here. And nobody believes the price will stay low so they are not going to change back their consumption and then have to change again when the price inevitably goes up again. People are just slack-jawed with amazement at how cheap the gas price is now. Now if all other prices would go down it would be so beneficial. But the world is in a state of sticker shock from the high gas price and it will take a long time for that to wear off. Would be nice if natural gas would go down.

Europe and Japan taxed gas long ago and thus created a market for fuel efficient vehicles, we didn't and the rest is history.

Japan and Europe doesnt have as much land mass as we do. Especially Japan, they dont need the size of our vehicles like we do. For some people, small vehicles just wont do.

I believe it was called the new deal"


That was the solution to the depression. Thanks for mentioning it.

#46 | Posted by danni at


but now we can look back at the big picture and judge the new deal better....a collosal failure and money pit is one way I have read about describing it.
of course things like the works progress stuff seems to have worked pretty good didnt it??

"Ask any economist, they will tell you DEFLATION is depression......."

No it is not you are clueless. Where do you get off spouting shit all day long with NOTHING to back it up.

I CHALLENGE you to provide some credible links which back up what you say. There are plenty of fearmongers out there, let's "see" what economist you can find which claims we are in depression.

And yes YOU DID swear the dollar was tanking because of US inflation. I said NO real estate is deflating and all commodities are in a bubble. AND I said deflation is the problem, but you refused to listen. AS USUAL. 4 months later, once you were hit over the head with 24/7 news coverage, you woke up.

Again we are not in a depression, and you are very foolish.....

I don't seem to remember the massive unemployment, such as we're experiencing today, happening in 2000.

I don't seem to remember individuals losing massive value in their individual retirement funds, such as we're experiencing today, happening in 2000.

I don't seem to remember having to bailout Wall Street to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars, such as we're having to do today, happening in 2000.

I don't seem to remember massive deficits and over ten trillion dollars in debt, such as we have today, present in 2000.

Nope. I don't seem to remember 2000 being at all like the economic mess that is the Republican/George W. Bush Recession/Depression, no matter how it is spun.

#16 | Posted by Hans

Your memory is about as long as your dick. I remember my 401k going into the shitter then.

I remember my 401k going into the shitter then.

#70 | Posted by Sniper at 2008-12-13 04:52 PM


you were what, twelve back then?

"I remember my 401k going into the shitter then."

That must have been post-9/11.

Prior to that, the biggest drop in 2000 was to 9811, less than a 14% drop from the first of the year.

By comparison, this year to date, the DJIA is down 33.8%.

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