Does it make you nice? Well, only if you do it right. For Christians the second greatest commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. If you view other people with love, niceness, amongst other good things, comes naturally. You can still correct others, but with an attitude of love. Just like I don't let my kids do self-destructive behavior because I want what's best for them.

Christians get a bad name because so many see the faith as simple set of behavioral rules. As long as they go through the motions, they think they're covered. The "rules" are put there for our own good, but if I "...have not love, I am nothing." Without love, these people try to pummel others into submission with their Bibles and in the process push people even further away from God.

There are also the people who have sociological problems who feel the need to justify themselves to a disapproving society. They often times will take a Bible verse or 2 completely out of context and try to justify their actions with it. The pedophiles who start cults are a classic example.

Like all negative things, the belligerent Christians get all the press. However, what you don't see on the nightly news as much is all the good we do. Christians run thousands of homeless shelters and soup kitchens throughout the country. We also send people all over the world to hard hit areas and help the people out by building schools, wells, and the like.

Christianity is not easy. It is a maturing process should continue throughout one's entire lifetime and takes effort. People unwilling to put in the effort, but still take up the name, make us look like a bunch of hypocrites.

If being nice was for the religious only we would be fro, ankle high in ass holes to somewhere overhead. A person that believes in and follows the doctrine of Christianity they should be pleasant to deal with and as anyone can see, this just doesn't follow. Most religions of the world call for better behavior towards all persons. It would seem that preachers from all churches have an up hill battle.

Of course it does not, just look around you.

This is an article that closes one eye and squints out the other to make it appear accurate.

religion is the most destructive force ever created by man, period. economics is second. Now, they have merged to form religinomics. christ and commerce.

but i suppose there were a few 'nice' nazis (who justified their actions as their christian duty) as well as a few nice 'bankers'.

(Most Americans who describe themselves as atheists, for instance, nonetheless believe that their souls will survive the death of their bodies.)

Railing against religious hypocrites is a famously satisfying past time. Jesus did it with panache.

But zealous religious types really have nothing on atheists as far as hypocrisy goes, according to the above finding.

Does religion make you nice?

I'd have to say.... maybe? Sometimes?

But it can also make you self-righteous, hateful, obstinate... sometimes. Maybe.

I'd say it does no better than chance, or having no religion at all.

I know lots of beautifully nice people, religious and not.

And further, I'll say that if you are nice because God tells you to be, then that's not as genuine as being nice for niceness' sake.

But if you're not going to make my existence miserable, I won't go too far questioning your motives.

There are a lot of folks that aren't doing it right, apparently.

There are a lot of folks that aren't doing it right, apparently.

Denmark, Sweden - Nicer than the U.S. - Non religious.

The last page of the article.

Religion provides community, community promotes good behavior generally. The Scandinavians have community without the trappings of religion.

Organized religion pretty much makes Me gag.

The occasional MLT is nice, though.

My hsuband and I have attended several gay churches over the years.

Verdict: No different than a gay bar or
bath house. Same 'ol same 'ol. No biggie!

Be Well.

If you happen to be gay it's a little hard to believe religion makes you nicer these days.
More like the exact opposite.
Of course I realize that not all religions are homophobic so I apologize to those who belong to inclusive religions.
But the rest of them....not so much.

Religion does not "make" you anything, it only serves to reinforce who you already are.

If you are a nice person, religion will serve to make you nicer

If you are a hating person, religion will serve to justify all your hates

Religion is nothing more than the reflection of the religious.

At best organized religion is a fetish for a particular few years of history.

At worst it's just manipulation of the masses.

but i suppose there were a few 'nice' nazis (who justified their actions as their christian duty) as well as a few nice 'bankers'.
and the ignorant fools believed them when they claimed they were acting as Christians just like Lipzodial spreads the lie today.

What an ignorant tool is Lipzodial.

"Religion is all bunk."
-Edison

"Religion is an insult to human dignity."
-Weinberg

"Friends, I agree with you in Providence; but I believe in the Providence of the most men, the largest purse, and the longest cannon."
-Lincoln, 1854

"At least two thirds of our miseries spring from human stupidity, human malice and those great motivators and justifiers of malice and stupidity, idealism, dogmatism and proselytizing zeal on behalf of religious or political idols."
-Aldous Huxley

"Lighthouses are more helpful than churches."
-Ben Franklin

"Just in terms of allocation of time resources, religion is not very efficient. There's a lot more I could be doing on a Sunday morning."
-Bill Gates

"A deist is someone who has not lived long enough to become an atheist."
-Diderot

"I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reasons, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."
-Galileo

religion is the most destructive force ever created by man

----

I disagree. The heart of all human destructive force is selfishness. Tragically, that's a human flaw.

But but but....they killed Jesus!!!

"Tragically, that's a human flaw."

Tragedy or survival system???

Now the interesting thing to watch is the posts on this thread.

Will people be nice or not?

"I always like a dog so long as he isn't spelled backward."
-G.K. Chesterton

"The heresy of one age becomes the orthodoxy of the next."
-Helen Keller

"Puritanism: the haunting fear that someone, somewhere, may be happy."
-H. L. Mencken

"The scientist who yields anything to theology, however slight, is yielding to ignorance and false pretenses, and as certainly as if he granted that a horse-hair put into a bottle of water will turn into a snake."
-H. L. Mencken

"If the concept of God has any validity or any use, it can only be to make us larger, freer, and more loving. If God cannot do this, then it is time we got rid of Him."
-James Baldwin

"A myth is a religion in which no one any longer believes."
-James Feibleman

I don't think religion has as much to do with "being nice" as many people would like it to or assume it does. Having a good family and good people around you in your community will do more for your moral behavior than any religion ever could.

"There is a dream dreaming us."

- Joseph Campbell, quoting a Kalahari Bushman

"Thou shall keep thy religion to thyself"
George Carlin

"What a fool believes"
Doobie Brothers

"Dear G-d, please save me from your followers"
Every persecuted person

Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and tortuous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be more consistant that we call it the word of a demon than the word of God. It is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind; and, for my part, I sincerely detest it, as I detest everything that is cruel. [Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason]

Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch toward uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one-half the world fools and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.
-- Thomas Jefferson, Notes on the State of Virginia, 1781-82

religion may not...
however, if one adheres to the teachings of christ (as an example), it should make one more loving, willing to share, etc...
religion has little to do with god, of course, except in using the name to get people in the door.
and most in this country are cafeteria christians. picking what they want and leaving what they will not or cannot choose to accept behind. sin today, be forgiven tomorrow and all of that.
christ didn't support a war or lie... throw rocks and judge... though tis a common occurrence seemingly everywhere.
i do not, btw, sit on a pedestal... just posting my pov.

all the best.

"I'm a washed-up, wannabe-intellectual atheist, and it's my mission in life to make sure a bunch of anonymous posters on an obscure leftwing blog know it."

- Zatoichi

What kind of a GOD would be transformed from an angry bloodthirsty son-of-a-bitch, characterized by the old testament, into a loving spirit, characterized by the new testament, by making his alleged son suffer a cruel death?

What kind of a GOD would be placated and dish out punishment and rewards based on beliefs or behavior while he killing and condemning all Jews during a Rapture Event?

In my humble opinion, any such GOD went to the Darth Cheney school of ethics.

I knew my Dad's generation of cousins and brothers who were 1st generation Ukrainian Americans were kindhearted, brave and honest. After 2 generations of communism and atheism, the Ukrainians of today coming to the USA and Canada are a lot less nice than those who kept up with the Ukrainian traditions and religion. So perhaps religion does make you nice.

"religion is the most destructive force ever created by man, period."

No, man is the most destructive force ever created by man, period.

It is what man does in the name of religion that can be destructive.

What kind of a GOD...

#29 | Posted by nutcase

You make the assumption that God is actively and continually involved in the affairs of man.

When I read articles like this one, I don't come away with the idea that religion is good for you. What strikes me is that America, so busy, so hard-working, so materialistic, is a relatively unpleasant, isolating place to live and only those with an organized outlet are a bit happier.

If you're not religious and you live in the suburbs or in a rural area, what social options do you have? The local mall? If you have any spare time, it's spent in front of the tube or playing electronic games.

In countries like Sweden, people socialize. There are clubs, community centers, and a heck of a lot more time off.

Intolerant Christian/Moslem religious zealots are like the shamelessly partisan leftist extremists on the DR - they both have nothing to constructively add to the dialogue at hand.

Religion doesn't make you nice.
Atheism doesn't make you intelligent.

You are one or the other regardless of your belief or lack thereof.

If you're not religious and you live in the suburbs or in a rural area, what social options do you have? The local mall? If you have any spare time, it's spent in front of the tube or playing electronic games.
In countries like Sweden, people socialize. There are clubs, community centers, and a heck of a lot more time off.

#33 | Posted by BobSF_94117

That was the blowback of white flight. And the time formerly used to socialize is used commuting and decompressing from the stress of the commute.

Does Religion Make You Nice?

Oh, geeze, another excuse for all the DR atheists to do their circle jerk.

There's not a lot of non-atheists, but my friendships aren't based on religion. The problem is the proselytizers. On the internet, the atheists won't shut up, but in real life the religious won't.

Also, you know there's no reward for how shitty the world is after you die.

it's the tax exemption that makes organized religion pretend to be nice.

I'll answer it.

No. It does not. If you aren't nice to begin with, you never will be. Hell, I never was, and I was religious for a while there, before I woke up and realized we're all in this alone.

In countries like Sweden, people socialize. There are clubs, community centers, and a heck of a lot more time off.

#33 | Posted by BobSF_94117

Christians are generally evil greedy bastards

"evil greedy bastards"

"Christians are generally evil greedy bastards"

And you know this because you've gone out of your way to meet as many Christians and get to know them personally as you can, right?

~~~

"I'm a washed-up, wannabe-intellectual atheist, and it's my mission in life to make sure a bunch of anonymous posters on an obscure leftwing blog know it."

- Zatoichi

#28 | Posted by ChickenInOven at 2008-11-11 02:23 PM | Reply | Flag

Chicken-
I can appreciate sarcasm. You can see that in my response to Tron. But generally, if you want to defend the NICENESS of Christianity, doing it by posting a scathingly sarcastic response to Zat is probably NOT the best option.

The people I go to church with mostly seem very nice. The athiest libs on DR seem unhappy and nasty.

No!

Religion does not make you nice. The tenants of Christianity are very good guidelines for the foundation of a society, but it doesn't necessarily mean you're nice.

The basis for many forms of the larger religions are based on elevating oneself by attacking others preferences. Now, there are many, many people who are very religious and very nice, but the two are not mutually exclusive.

No.

Happy pills make you nice, however, then you tend to drive badly and other people still think you're an asshole.

It's a lose/lose.

Religion, if nothing else, provides a way of stating what side you're on. That old Good and Evil thing. Making a statement in support of Good is a way to begin fighting Evil.

I argue with FWTHOM a lot. But we're both Christians. That implies an obligation not to take the arguments too seriously, and to help one another when the chance arises.

That has to be a good thing.

ZED said it well.

Religion is evil, so those who support it support evil. Again, if religion made you nice then why are the prisons full of the religious and nearly empty of atheist. Simply put if your a good law abiding person you don't go to jail and if your not then you probably found god......

LM

Yep, religion makes people nice, as all those individuals who where molested by the leaders of those religions.

Yes, religion makes you nice, as those who have been extorted by all the mafia heads.

Yes, religion is nice, as all those in Iraq who are being killed because the christian right doesn't like the muslims having all that oil.

Terrorists are all religion all the time but they are so nice.

All religion does is teach those in their flock how to be nice while actually not betraying their wicked ways.

Those people who are actually really nice are nice not because of religion but because they are nice as an individual person.

Want to know religion nice, look at Eberly and his posts, that will show the true reflection.

All of the atheists I know are very nice, but all the evangelicals I see here are holier-than-thou hate mongerers.

See, this arguement can be played both ways. Neither is accurate.

When you witness a vocal person with opposing views, they tend to stand out. The more negative they appear, the more you remember them and their comments.

This "study" is BS. How do you guage a person's niceness? How do you guage how religious they are? I know quite a few people who are, by their own definition, very religious and are or have been adulterers. Their claimed righteous salvation does not make their actions nice. On the other hand, I know some atheists who are selfish and arrogant to a harmful degree.

A person's "niceness" is guaged by their actions; not historically by those who share the same views. To imply otherwise is to say that only religious people are ethical, or vice versa.

Does anybody here argue this point?

Does anybody here argue this point?

#56 | Posted by CricketCricket

chirp, chirp

Cricket, I think you summed up the flaw of this idea pretty well.

Overall I think this thread is another good example of people using data to reinforce their pre-conceptions about entire groups of people.

Some atheists come on here and scoff at this idea because they already think Christians are pretty darn mean, quite possibly without sufficient, quality evidence (I'm not talking statistics or headlines, here; I'm talking substantial, high-quality anecdotal evidence).

Some Christians (or other religious folk) come on here and this reinforces their belief that Christians are inherently nice, something they already thought anyway. Oh, and they also see some atheists acting smug and think that ALL atheists must be that way.

But I don't think most atheists are Richard Dawkins wannabes.

And I don't think most Christians are the Spanish Inquisition in disguise.

Although...nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!!

chirp, chirp

#57 | Posted by CalifChris

That pretty much sums up most of the responses I get. Thank you ;)

-----

Cricket, I think you summed up the flaw of this idea pretty well.
...
And I don't think most Christians are the Spanish Inquisition in disguise.

Although...nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!!

#58 | Posted by dylanfan

Hm! She is made of harder stuff! Cardinal Fang! Fetch...THE COMFY CHAIR!

Does Religion Make You Nice?

Oh, geeze, another excuse for all the DR atheists to do their circle jerk.

#37 | Posted by CalifChris

Are you offering a "hand" Chris?

Almost makes me wish I was an atheist.

Atheists (myself included) often go off quite vocally because we percieve ourselves (according to statistics, anyway) as vastly in the minority in the united states, and we are trying to make our voices be heard.

The religious vs. the atheists for who's nicer though? Anybody's call. Some who are atheists are that out of bitterness. They abandon a god who they feel abandonded them for some reason, some hurt they had in the past. These people tend to not be the nicest people anyway. Other atheists, myself included, simply look and see no need for god. The universe doesn't seem to need one. All the religions tell us they're the only one and the others are all lies, which makes it dreadfully difficult to figure out which one is supposedly telling the truth, and what if it's one nobody believes in anymore? Perhaps I should be following the god of my ancestors...Odin, now THAT was a god. There's a thought, for instance. Then, we go ahead and see all the harm caused in the name of religions over the years, and just think mankind would simply be better off without this bullshit that lets hucksters make off with the hard-earned money of the less educated, while politicians gain power on the lives lost who think they're going to something better, when all they have ahead of them is being wormfood, which is the real tragedy of religion. It makes life, the most precious thing we have on earth, the only one we ever get, an ok thing to lose. I love life too much to play catch with it with an imaginary friend.

Honestly, I wish there were a god, I wish he would bring justice and mercy and right all wrongs, but that's why it's called wishfull thinking.

Now, relgious people on the other hand, I have met plenty who are nice, but what turns me off are the hypocrits. If I meet a bitter atheist, I feel sorry for them, because I'm sure they were hurt somehow, but I'm much less sorry for hypocrits who spout off at the mouth about their own personal holiness, but can't walk the walk. I think on the whole, religions teach some good things, but often the people who use religion are much less than nice.

oh, and thanks, now i've got the inquisition song stuck in my head.

how come noone ever talks about hitler on ice?

there's a major difference between being "nice" and performing good deeds to buy your way into heaven or recruit the unsuspecting into your cult.

"Those who support it (religion) are evil...."

This is interesting. And that great mass who have no religion (not necessarily atheist), do you think they swim in a great ocean of natural innocence?

"Performing good deeds to buy yourself into heaven...."

As far as I know God doesn't allow that.

"Other atheists, myself included, simply look and see no need for God...."

Now that IS interesting. As far as I can tell, the NEED for God is the easy to demonstrate logically. I thank countless modern Existentialist writers for this insight.

Much easier than, say, provoking God into striking Zat dead because he's being an ass on a given day.

"Much easier than, say, provoking God into striking Zat dead because he's being an ass on a given day."

Posted by Zed

Your imaginary friend has three seconds to kiss my ass of STFU.

Times up!

of?
or!

Here's a final thought on "niceness"----Christ refused to allow him self to be called good. He said only God is good.

So religion, accepting that authority, might make you nicer but it will never make you nice. That condition is saved for another existence or, in the case of those who accept no possiblity of other existences, you guys have it never.

Zat, as far as I can tell, you talk to my imaginary friend almost as much as I do, you just have less to say.

"Honestly, I wish there were a god, I wish he would bring justice and mercy and right all wrongs, but that's why it's called wishfull thinking."

#61 | Posted by zeropointnrg

There is God. But God left the bringing of justice and the righting of wrongs to us. That's why it's called free will.

To expand slightly on the quote:

"Where there is no God, all is permitted."

The belief in God implies that there is the ultimate price to pay for bad behavior or a reward for good behavior, a final judgment. Religion is the attempt to define and propagate the rules of good behavior, and also pay homage the The One that gave you Life.

If there is no God, then who defines the base guidelines that define good behavior? Nobody can agree on one hard set of rules and the subsequent punishments or rewards for everybody.

Free will...

We can either hang together or we will certainly hang separately.

As a planet, as a species, we're certainly not getting the job done.

Shit, 3 posts and Lipozoidal already compares Christians to Nazis...

Maybe you can look at who is the nicest on drudge.

The most antichrist members on DR call the mosts names--Lipozoidal and Zatiochi.

Christians like nanc and myself maybe believe things you find repugnant but we don't act in arrogant name-calling ways.

Christians usually have the humility to admit that we can be real assholes at times.

I never could do that before I was a Christian.

Hate on...

If you happen to be gay it's a little hard to believe religion makes you nicer these days.#13 | Posted by danni at 2008-11-11 01:54 PM | Reply

...Unless of course someone wants to STOP homosexual behavior and thoughts, then Christianity is the only thing with the POWER to change someone so they will no longer be controlled by sin.

I know plenty of people that WANTED to change and did through Jesus.

To them, the liberating power of Christianity changed them, and the Christians who helped them were lifesavers, a NICE thing.

If you don't want to change, you don't have to. There may be consequences...

Would someone tell me how nice "non-cristians" are.

"...Unless of course someone wants to STOP homosexual behavior and thoughts, then Christianity is the only thing with the POWER to change someone so they will no longer be controlled by sin."

#74 | Posted by kirk

You make the assumption that some folk choose to be gay and that it is thus sin.

You are in error of course, but don't let that stop you.

The "liberating power of Christianity" may have coerced them into believng that they can be "normally" functioning hets (you tell somebody a lie long enough and often enough and though they may eventually believe that the lie is truth doesn't make it any less a lie), it is a mask, a cover. The original programming remains intact. Ever tried to remove Internet Explorer entirely from the OS?

The "liberating power of Islam" I understand is also quite effective in dealing with gay deviants, perhaps even more effective than the "liberating power of Christianity."

People who think being religious by itself makes you "moral" or "nice" don't really understand what morality or kindness really is. There is no correlation.

"Would someone tell me how nice "non-cristians" are."

Sure go to prison and you will tons of religous fanatics, but you will find extremely few atheist. If breaking the laws of society are a gauge then the answer is simple. Religious people are far less nice/law abiding than non religous. And b4 the idiot throws out there are way more religous people than non, look at percentage of religous in versus atheist. The percentages won't equate....religous will make up less of the US population as a percentage but more of the prison poulation as a percentage. Very simple, religion=law breakers. Atheist, not so much(but some still do).

LM

Sure go to prison and you will tons of religous fanatics, but you will find extremely few atheist.

go ahead.

great argument.

:-(

LM,
Do your stats include all the people who "find God" while in prison. With a lot of free time on their hands, many prisoners reflect on what's wrong with their lives and discover the rehabilitating love of Jesus. Most churches I've attended have had Jail Ministries. So how many of the prisoners were atheists when they committed their crime, but are now listed as believers in the demographics?

Frosty, I have been asked that question many times in other posts. I will try to find the link again, and I did only find one the first time I hunted it down. The statistics are for those who enter prison system not once there in prison what their affiliation becomes. I would counter the free time notion, with most are devious enough to know that if they act repentent and born again the chance for parole is far greater.

Eberly, yeah, the argument is lame. When talking about good and bad people why would one ever look into the crimes committed by both sides? I mean how could this ever be a measure of good/evil? Where should they go, to church, where people act fake for one hour then go home and talk smack on the rest of the congregation? The only reason I would go to a church is for the chicks, they are easier than the ones at the bars.

LM

"They are easier (women) than the ones in bars...."

We'll just put you down as not "nice". Just a word of advice, though---Make sure your targets are at least of age.

Sure go to prison and you will tons of religous fanatics, but you will find extremely few atheist.

#78 | Posted by Liberal_Mongrel

I guess you think it was good cristian ethics that got them there in the first place. You are talking about a bunch of non-believers who are looking for a get out of jail free card.

Tell me what non-christian society is so good.

The "liberating power of Islam" I understand is also quite effective in dealing with gay deviants, perhaps even more effective than the "liberating power of Christianity."

Agreed. Why don't we institute that here?

Zot,

I assume no such thing. Neither, did our founding Fathers who believed in an afterlife, but equated God with Nature (Deists).

I contend that the story of Christ's "perfect life", sacrifice and resurrection is an ethical tarpit. How does killing right a wrong? Why would such an act satisfy God? For this God will save imperfect men instead of condemning them to death? Either God is an asshole, or the storyline is false and/or grossly distorted.

I appreciate Christs teachings but cannot see any connection with the bulk of organized religions in this world. Non-profit Corporations posing as agents of the "Lord". If Christ were alive today he would condemn the vaste majority of them.

There are exceptions, one Church with no name and no need to file with the IRS, that believe in the bible, whose ministers take an oath of poverty, meet every Sunday in someone's home and are connected by self interpretation of Bible readings and a hymn book. Anti War Activists and Atheists

Among social animals like humans, altruistic behavior is advantageous. Mutual altruism improves the ability of individuals within the population to reproduce and care for their young; any genetic component of altruistic behavior is passed on to offspring. Humans also "inherit" a bunch of information in the form of cultural knowledge. In addition to our innate, genetically determined sense of morality, culture can give us a sense of right and wrong, and it does so primarily through religion. It is no surprise that the moral framework of every major religion (and many other extinct or small ones) is based around the same "golden rule". If you think about the golden rule, it is a simple, elegant statement of altruism. Though the followers of religions may not believe in evolution, the core of their moral system is an acknowledgment of it.

Sure go to prison and you will tons of religous fanatics, but you will find extremely few atheist.

There are no atheists in foxholes.

Soup kitchens.

Boarding for homeless families. Not individuals, families. Most city housing won't take a family.

Destitute - referred to a church.

There was a fire at a public school, they evacuated the children to a church. Not to businesses that were closer. Not to the gym. To the church.

Despite the constant complaint about religion, when the cities need help dealing with the poor, homeless, destitute, etc., the city refers these people to the churches

Seems most of the charitible agencies in the city are church-led. There are exceptions, obviously, but you will even hear it on the news about 'who' takes care of them and it ain't the city.

"Tell me what non-christian society is so good."

Then why is the crime rate at the vatican higer than in say China, or venezuela? I don't advocate communism, but since these are two countries that have higher non-believer pops....well hard to argue those facts.

Why does the us have the higest incarceration rate in the world? Again in the USA there are far more believers than non.

LM

"There are no atheists in foxholes."

I call bullshit.

The church feeds off the poor and desolate, they are usually so uneducated that it's much easier to barain wash them into one way of thinking. Not to mention what better way to recruit someone into your ideology than to force feed it to them when they are kids. Common sense don't you think.

And in a sick, twisted view, for some in the church who better to prey on the the cast outs, the unwanted, and the helpless. No one stands up for them if you can beat them down so bad, that is why th echurch has such a terrible time with every form of child abuse.

LM

"There are no atheists in foxholes."

That is bullshit, additionally the most prominent atheist recently(pat tillman) was murdered by a bumnch of god fearing troops, who then lied and covered it up, way to represent your religion so well.

LM

P.S, just how many commandments were broken by those military guys who murdered Pat Tillman.....damn near all of them huh.....

LM

Then why is the crime rate at the vatican higer than in say China, or venezuela? I don't advocate communism, but since these are two countries that have higher non-believer pops....well hard to argue those facts.

you are correct.....hard to argue those facts.

I agree with the fact that you are a communist.

Soup kitchens.

Boarding for homeless families. Not individuals, families. Most city housing won't take a family.

Destitute - referred to a church.

There was a fire at a public school, they evacuated the children to a church. Not to businesses that were closer. Not to the gym. To the church.

I'll bet anything that Liberal Rodent has received free health care at a religous sponsored hospital.

35% of my wife's time was spent giving free health care at "St. Francis rehab hospital."

greedy bitch.

Maybe some.

On the other side of the coin a lot of horrible things have been done in the name of God. Most justified by an archaic passage or flagrant misinterpretation at complete odds with the core principles of the religion.

Buddhists are probably the 'nicest' population in a religion as a whole. They haven't killed millions during a Crusade or Inquisition type actions as Christians and Muslims have.

People who compassionately practice the core principles of most major religions are generally nice people.

"I'll bet anything that Liberal Rodent has received free health care at a religous sponsored hospital.

35% of my wife's time was spent giving free health care at "St. Francis rehab hospital."

greedy bitch."

Eb, so only had to spend 35%of here time trying to get away from your dumbass?. You just lost your bet, I pay my own health insurance and go to very nice hospitals when needed(memorial hermann, where my sister is a nurse). Sorry but like the arguments you consistently loose, you jut lost that bet also. So maybe now you will STFU.....

It's funny though, the best deflection that you could come up with for religion having the highest crime rate is that I visited a church hospital.....nice refute.

"greedy bitch" what your wife was snatching all teh rehabs meds, damn that is a greedy bitch!!

LM

"There are no atheists in foxholes...."

Is a propostion hard to test, but likely true.

No one's saying a soldier can't be an atheist. What's being said is the the conscious knowledge of impending death makes the concept of God infintely more attractive.

Maybe Pat Tillman was an atheist in Afghanistan. Maybe he wouldn't have been had he been shelled all night by a Japanese battleship without a damned thing he could do to escape or hit back.

Afghanistan is rough work. Guadalcanal was rougher. Ever talk with a Marine that found God in the jungles of Burma, 1944?

Atheism has it's limitations, as almost anyone sufficently desperate gets to learn.

"Maybe Pat Tillman was an atheist in Afghanistan. Maybe he wouldn't have been had he been shelled all night by a Japanese battleship without a damned thing he could do to escape or hit back."

There is no maybe, he was an atheist, period. I see how your scenario is far worse than being stuck in a ravine all night taking fire from friends and enemies, and then while trying to SAVE your theist brethren in arms they murder you. Then take all your possesions and burn them. Then tell your family a lie about how you died, and then try to cover up the truth. HIs family is atheist and even more so after seeing what teh religious figures in the US military did to them. I highly recommend you read some of Ms Tillmans writings before you start talking bout her son.

As for have I ever talked to marine from Burma, no, but how about my marine uncle from vietnam, or my grandparents from both world wars....but wait there are no atheist in a foxhole.

LM

"He was an atheist, period..."

And you are mind reader, period. I'd like to learn that, mind reading. Is there a web page I can visit?

Hell no it doesn't! I know some Catholics that are total douche bags. One the flip side of that coin EVERY Unitarian I have EVER met have been SUPER JUDGEMENTAL about everyother NON-Unitarian.

"And you are mind reader, period. I'd like to learn that, mind reading. Is there a web page I can visit?"

"Is a propostion hard to test, but likely true."

So zed is saying I don't know that one man who professed his atheist wasn't an atheist, but that everyone in the military is a "believer", even though I gave him 3 athiest from my family whom all served. Your the fucking mind reader, no I take tht back. Just a right wing spigot, spouting off on another topic you know camel dung on. Thanks for playing Carnac......

LM

"Just a right-wing spigot...."

Moi? Don't get around much, do you? But don't bother trying. You seem perfectly happy with whatever it is you are.