Drudge Retort: Red Meat for Yellow Dogs
Sunday, July 13, 2008

John Ridley: Jesse Jackson, Ralph Nader, Geraldine Ferraro, Al Sharpton, Bob Johnson and South Carolina State Senator Robert Ford have all maligned Obama as being everything from a "lucky" black man to not being black enough ... what a long strange trip this campaign season has been watching so-called liberals fumble the hot potato that is Barack Obama.

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While I find Ridley irritatingly inconsistent with my own feelings, he absolutely hits this one out of the park with his assessment of many disgruntled liberals being put out to pasture by Barack Obama's rapid ascension and takeover of the Democratic Party. Many are just angry over being replaced by the next generation while others are perturbed by his sincere method of seeking common ground instead of the more preferred by others method involving scorched earth and searing flesh.

Obama has also questioned race-based affirmative action and understands -- again, as the majority of black Americans do -- that what's good for the country is good for all of us. To Jackson that's "talking down" to blacks. To Nader that's "talking white." But to the tens of millions of Americans who helped Obama win the primary (as opposed to Jackson and Nader who have yet to win an election) Obama is simply talking to America.

By taking common sense stances over controversial issues and by consistently recognizing both the merits and faults of opponent's ideas, a much more healthy dialog can begin not just in Washington DC, but around dinner tables, and bus stops, and car pools all across America. If Obama is able to create an atmosphere where we talk TO each other and listen instead of talking AT each other and refusing to hear, it could become his most enduring legacy.

We need to face facts. America is changing in ways that will not be stopped. Its far better that we learn how to communicate and bridge gulfs between our increasingly melded cultures than it is to turn our gaze toward a past that will not be revisited no matter how hard we fight and deny it. Our country's moving on, and I for one, can't wait to see where this next ride takes us.

From "This Week" on ABC in May...

In a wide-ranging interview, Mr. Obama, a graduate of Columbia University and Harvard Law School, said affirmative action programs should ultimately become a diminishing tool for us to achieve racial equality in this society.--

Asked if his two young daughters should benefit from those programs when they apply to college, he said they should be treated as folks who are pretty advantaged.--

I think that we should take into account white kids who have been disadvantaged and been brought up in poverty and shown themselves to have what it takes to succeed,-- Mr. Obama said. He added, There are a lot of African-American kids who are still struggling even those who are in the middle class may be first-generation as opposed to fifth- or sixth-generation college attendees, and that we all have an interest in bringing as many people together to help build this country.--

Is Obama against affirmative action? What does the author mean by Obama's "questioning"? What is Obama's straight answer - is he opposed to or does he support the continuation of affirmative action?

Or, like many pols, is Obama trying to occupy both sides of an issue?

Good questions Oohrah, let me see if I can answer them to your satisfaction.

First, and I'm not being evasive, its not a simple yes or no question. I think the fact that Obama has lived the life he has shows that seeking out diversity helps our society if competence isn't also sacrificed. I think the answer depends upon the situation. If there has been no historically verifiable history of discrimination attached to any particular endeavor, then there is no need for preferential treatment. Conversely, if minorities have been purposely excluded based on non-performance factors, then some remediation is called for to balance the inequity without sacrificing quality.

In my opinion, the problem with AA has always been that the individuals receiving preferential treatment didn't have to first prove exceptionality beyond mere competence, the first lucky stiff in line got the break regardless of whether he or she was up to the task. Now, I say this next point with deference to standardized measures because we know cultural bias creeps into the most sincere efforts to measure anything. My point is that the people choosing the candidates who will receive an assist from the past sins of others should still have to compete against other peers, and the strongest candidates will emerge. Mere race or gender should never be enough to qualify for anything! Then we don't have the stereotypical result of an underqualified person taking the place of someone obviously with more skill and more potential that happens to be among the majority.

To me, this is the vein of Ridley's latter comment of "what's good for America is good for all of us". Black Americans realize that more harm is done when unprepared individuals are chosen to fill defacto quotas while being ill-equipped for the job. Frankly if one wanted, and argument could be made that this is precisely what the majority wanted so they'd be able to kill the idea of AA once and for all by pointing to decreased productivity and lessor bottom lines. The only problem was that far too many chosen by race or gender were not only qualified, they became stars in their own rights and actually changed the corporate culture by paving the way for others just like themselves who came on board later: those ready and willing to excell in the tasks at hand and compete equally and successfully with their majority co-workers.

Let's be completely honest:

All AA guarantees is an opportunity.

It doesn't promise success, it doesn't promise excellence. It promises to give one individual a chance, nothing more. If that individual is not up to the task, so be it, they need to be replaced by someone that is.

But let's also not act like 'majority on majority' decisions always hit 100% of the time either. There is no certainty with each and every person chosen outside of AA. Maybe many of the problems are caused by the incompetence of those doing the choosing in the first place. But of course, that would be a too easy place to assign blame. We can't expect responsibility from those doing the choosing, can we? It often HAS to be someone or something else's fault.

"What does that mean? ("diminishing") Does that mean we should do away with AA by a set date?"

I don't know the answer to that for sure, Oohrah. My educated guess, based on his programs on education and economic development, is that elevating the level of schools and education, along with economic opportunity should ultimately eliminate the need for AA.

To my knowledge he has not discussed any timetable or date certain.

Oohrah...

I believe the overall answer just isn't a yes or a no in regards to doing away with any specific preferences. Its more of an "it depends", as I was trying to say in my last posts. Personally, I know of no one working or being placed amongst my friends and their work environments solely due to AA. One of my closer friends is a conservative black entrepreneur who is a strident proponent of self-help and active personal achievement as the true means to success, not any unearned possibilities offered out of pity. But what he fails to see are all of the historic and endemic "unspoken factors" that served to keep women and minorities out of the equations all together while embracing nepotism and legacy even when its products were far less able than many unable to even have the opportunity to compete in fairness.

Its just not a simple problem with a simple answer. The reality I see is one where we've already largely reached the point where only extremely selective use of AA should ever be needed because merit should always be the determinant factor as it ever should. But in the very same vein, its impossible to turn a blind eye to the voluminous amount of nepotism and legacy which conservatives seem not to mind. Maybe the answer is simply this: There always has been and there always will be bias when making choices regarding individual personnel. As long as NO ONE gets preferential treatment over anyone else and if a factual meritorious argument can be made, there is no need for remedy. But if the advantaged or preferred have certain endemic benefits unavailable to others, then turnabout is fair play.

I will guarantee you this: Legacy and nepotism will still be considered a right of proper bloodlines long after race or gender-based preferences are long dead and buried.

Obama's ascendancy within the Dem Party has caused a bit of a paradigm shift.

The old guard is struggling with the Young Turks and the old guard is not winning.

They are bitterly clinging to their old ways.

Interesting perspective, Tony.

Gotta luff the headline, btw.

Spud luffs a good PE reference.

Be Well.

"paradigm shift."

NEVER use that phrase again, or else: www.casadelmarkohchang.com

NEVER use that phrase again, or else

Yes, yes, Spud realises that the term "paradigm shift" should only be applied to science not any of the humanities.

That it has become a ridiculously over-used buzz-word in Mad Ave circles.

That sed, Spud finds it useful in using the phrase in order to describe the zeitgeist change (if you will) that has occured recently caused by the fact that a large number of people are now seeing new ways to look at politics and participate in it due to Obama's fresh perspective and unconventional solutions to age-old problems.

G08ama.

Be Well.

" Spud realises that the term "paradigm shift" should only be applied to science"

No

It's UTTER BULLSHIT.

Think I'll add sour cream and chives.

Funny thing: My mother was one of twelve; North Texas farmers.

She had one brother who stuck to the old farm. His wedding present to me the first time was a paper sack of potatoes.

He's the only one of them still alive and he's still riding fence.

It's UTTER BULLSHIT

Cos the scientific concencus that must be overturned in order fer a PS to occur largely doesn't exist due to the fluidity of concensus and the competing schools of thought that exist simultaneously?

Think I'll add sour cream and chives.

You Chive Turkey!

/Could nae resist.

Be Well.

Tantalus Range, Brandywine Falls

1984.


The French fries at Hut's were good a couple of days back.

We ate at the bar.

www.cwrl.utexas.edu

a paper sack of potatoes.

Spud likes the guy already.

still riding fence

Farmers are too stubborn to die and besides ...there's too much left to do.

Spud thought you were talking about McCain fer a sec there.

Then Spud thought about it again.

No, thought Spud, that would have been "sitting" not "riding" if you were talking about McCain.

Speaking of baked potatoes...

Bout that time...

** DB **

^_^

Be Well.

"Speaking of baked potatoes..."

I go to swim laps under the stars.
Think Immortal Beloved, the "Ode To Joy" scene.

Uncle Paul is the coolest living old North Texas farm boy ever.

Speaking of baked potatoes...

Bout that time...

Posted by dethspud at 2008-07-12 12:30 AM

Don't forget the butter and sour cream - yummmm

All AA guarantees is an opportunity.


It doesn't promise success, it doesn't promise excellence. It promises to give one individual a chance, nothing more. If that individual is not up to the task, so be it, they need to be replaced by someone that is.


It promises to give one individual a chance, nothing more....But there is more. In giving one individual a chance it takes away the same chance for a more deserving/qualified individual.

In giving one individual a chance it takes away the same chance for a more deserving/qualified individual.


Posted by JeffJ at 2008-07-12 02:15 AM | Reply | Flag:


So Justice Thomas is not qualified to be in the SCOTUS? He took the job of a more qualified person because of AA?

I'm not asking for the DR lefties(whomever they are today) response. I'm asking for yours.

AA needs to be fixed for sure. What it doesn't need is to be ended. Given the number of Americans NOT going to college, I have no problem giving financial help to minorities that can't get into these colleges otherwise. As long as they have good grades, I say go for it.

So Justice Thomas is not qualified to be in the SCOTUS? He took the job of a more qualified person because of AA?


A lot of AA recipients (not necessarily talking about Thomas) take their preferential opportunity and 'make it happen'.

Some don't.

Think about it this way, college drop-out rates are considerably higher for AA admission recipients than not. 1 reason for this is that a higher percentage of AA recipients are put into a position where once the opportunity is given, they aren't able to succeed, no matter how hard they try. Universities (as one example) have entrance requirements for a reason. In this case (higher drop-out rates) is AA serving its purpose? In the working world which has more value:

A. 2 years of college at U of M, but no degree

-or-

B. 4 years at EMU and a degree

Drop-out rates may be higher.

But what about all those kids that stay in college for awhile, and just fuck around cuz mom and dad are paying?

Met a lot of those, and I don't see them listed in the statistics until they actually drop.

I have no problem giving financial help to minorities that can't get into these colleges otherwise. As long as they have good grades, I say go for it.

Scholarships have always been a good idea.


That said, I am not, and never will be in favor of "free" (tax-payer funded) college education.

It's not that I don't feel that college is a worthwhile expenditure. It is. But when it's handed to everybody for free on a macro-scale, we'd see a lower percentage of students fully apply themselves than if it's seen as an 'investment' taken by individuals. Student loans are a good idea because ultimately the student pays for his education. The student 'invests' in himself and thus (a higher percentage of the time) fully applies himself and has the motivation to do so. From a purely monetary standpoint (other factors are at play here, but I am trying to keep this somewhat focused) it's not just about the extra income a college degree can bring in the workplace vs. a High School diploma - said increase needs to more than offset the financial burden of tuition.

Met a lot of those, and I don't see them listed in the statistics until they actually drop.


As long as the method of measuring is the same - not counting a drop until it becomes a drop - I am not sure of your point.


But what about all those kids that stay in college for awhile, and just fuck around cuz mom and dad are paying?

You are only addressing the money side of this. From your angle it's one in the same - whether a kid gets his tuition paid for by mom and dad or the government the net result will likely be the same.


I am not talking about payment, I am talking about admission standards.


If the students don't apply themselves, they lose the scholarship, jeff. I'm fine with that.

Now, as for those drop outs from AA...

Were they full or patial scholarship students?

But when it's handed to everybody for free

Like i said: bad grades = no school.

As long as the method of measuring is the same - not counting a drop until it becomes a drop - I am not sure of your point.

That there are kids not from AA that don't take their gift very seriously, and choose to party instead.

Losing one of them to an AA cadidate that CAN and WILL get the good grades is not a problem from my POV.

In fact, there's a certain student that went to Harvard and Yale with nothing but straight C's.

Would have been better if a minority had "taken" the space he wasted at those fine schools.

Alex,


I think we pretty much agree with the monetary side of this - I never really considered the AA debate to be about money.


My focus is on the admission side of this. Having different performance measures based upon skin-color in terms of offering admission.

Would have been better if a minority had "taken" the space he wasted at those fine schools.


What if said minority didn't have the chutzpah to graduate, much less do so with straight "C's"?

That there are kids not from AA that don't take their gift very seriously, and choose to party instead.

I saw it firsthand.


Losing one of them to an AA cadidate that CAN and WILL get the good grades is not a problem from my POV.

Except that statistically, this doesn't happen. We can find anecdotal evidence to support just about anything. However, when measuring a policy implemented at a macro-scale we have to measure its results at a macro-scale. When we do this as it pertains to college admissions AA doesn't bode particularly well for those whom it's purported to help.

Jeff- We probably agree on admisson standards as well.

The real problem with AA is simple. Students that need it likely came from terrible school systems with no budget. They are less likely to be able to meet admission standards because of this.

Fixing AA at that point is like closing the barn door after the animals got away. We need to be focusing on improving public schools in poorer areas.(books from this century) and to stop making kids learn only for test taking in other schools.

It's gotten so bad that they spend WEEKS studying for MEAP now, because they school board needs that govt money from passing these tests. So all they teach is how to pass the stupid test.

There needs to be another type of oversight. I understand the fed govt doesnt want schools producing bad students to continue getting funds, but it's a very ridiculous situation if you think about it.

"Oh, your students are failing? Well no books for them next year. That'll fix everything!"

Here are my ideas:

Students in your school district continue to get poor grades and fail tests?

After two years of this...fire the school board. Make studying for the MEAP tests(or whatever it's called in other areas) limited in duration. Like ONE week. This stuff should be a REVIEW of the material, not new stuff they need months to digest. Also, putting a cap on the amount of time invested will keep school boards from putting their students through hell so they don't get fired.

And finally: have some standards for local school board seats. Just about anyone can fill them, and it really shows.

Alex,


We need to be focusing on improving public schools in poorer areas.


Yes!!!

I've been saying this for years. AA treats the symptom, but not the disease.

The problem though is more than 'just' shitty public schools; although I do agree that this is a problem. Kids (per capita) from those areas suffer a much higher degree of, at best, indifferent parenting and at worst, shitty parenting. The general lack of a dad in the home (even in home's of dedicated single-moms) further exacerbates this. No matter how good the school, a lack of parenting and/or shitty parenting is a monumental hurdle that can't be fixed via good schools.

Alex,


I like your accountability angle, but think about it. If you have a bunch of beaurocrats whose necks are on the line as a result of grades do you really think said grades the students are given will be an accurate reflection of their performance and/or the schooling they've received? Also, it's not that difficult to hide test preperation in a class cirriculum.

I have a few friends who are in the public education system. Much of what I am throwing at you comes from many-a late-night discussion I've had with them regarding some of these very same issues (not the AA stuff, but the problems with our public schools).

AA needs to continue as long as employers will choose a white name over a black name on two resumes of equal strength.

And they do.

AA also becomes neccessary when black schools receive less funding and attention than others.

AA needs to continue as long as employers will choose a white name over a black name on two resumes of equal strength.


And they do.

You raise a good point. But maybe not. If those dark-skins had any gumption they'd give their kids white-sounding names!


AA also becomes neccessary when black schools receive less funding and attention than others.

I agree in principle. However, what about the following factors:

1. school districts that are adequately-funded via tax dollars but are poorly-run due to incompetence of their elected leaders

2. The fact that more affluent districts may not receive any more government funding than a poor district, but choose to tap the affluence and altruism of those within its community for competitive advantage - fund-raising, etc.


Jeff- I know they would TRY to fudge numbers to save their necks, but it needs to be done.
These school boards are filled with idiots.

Their necks already ARE on the line, in terms of govt money. But THAT doesn't work, because local politicans and school board people keep dipping into the funds. More specific govt grants are neccesary to stop that.

Same problem with SS. It worked fine...until all the pigs ate the trough nearly clean. We wouldn't have a solvency problem right now if the govt wasn't putting their hands into the SS funds.

Jeff- The fact that more affluent districts may not receive any more government funding than a poor district,

Oh, but they do. Trust me on that one. I switched school districts as a kid when we moved to a better area.

Went from books from the 70's to brand new books and computers. Only did well for myself before because we had a great library in the poorer town where I grew up.

Non affluent areas can raise money from philanthropists looking for a tax break and a good deed. But the problem is: Who wants to throw money at a sinkhole?

It's a downward spiral. Any school that started on that path, or fell into it, bleeds money. No one wants to take the risk of throwing their cash away for nothing. So, areas that became ghettos over racism, now stay ghettos over classism and fear of failure by outside money generators.

And being a fellow resident of Michigan, I need not tell you of the corrupt school officials and politicans sucking the money out of the school systems there.

They get away with it for a simple reason. Everyone expects detroit schools to be underfunded and shitty at this point. No one notices when another year of failure occurs because a few bastards stole from kids.

Alex,


I agree with you to the extent that politicians and many school boards have screwed the proverbial pooch. I also feel that greater accountability (including rolling a few heads) is needed - badly.

I'd like to see a full voucher system for every student.

Now, I realize that I've opened a completely new can of worms and the timing was horrible as I am about to go to bed.

I'll succinctly say it like this: The benefits gained via the power of true competition outweigh the drawbacks for such a system IMO.


Gotta run. I enjoyed the discussion.

take care, jeff. We'll discuss vouchers, and why I'm not a huge fan of them, another time.

Just wanted to add my feelings on education.

What changed is that both parents started working to pay for all the 'stuff' - i.e. TV's in every room, two new cars, all manner of 'consumer goods' that required two incomes to pay for.

No one home to help with homework. Education suffered.

1 + 1 still equals 2

Words are spelled the same way.

It can be argued that with the election of Barack Obama, the need for AA should be deemed over. Isn't the highest possible job in this nation the office of the POTUS? In further fact it could be argued that the near-miss of Hillary Clinton shows that this nation would clearly choose a woman to lead it as well. Although to me what is too often overlooked is all the built-in, near-legacy-like advantages she had over Obama at the start of the primary season. Not to diminish her accomplishments, she did have a head start and the backing of a former POTUS himself, a luxury not to be afforded to the next female who aspires to the office.

If Obama is fortunate to be both elected and to serve a full 8 years, Hillary would likely be too old by that time. But I do believe that another strong, popular woman will emerge to carry the mantle forward and quite, possibly be the 45th POTUS. We'll just have to wait and see.

And finally, Jeff and Alex..., what about the continued existence of legacy and nepotism which promotes mainly whites, often those who would not get said opportunities based on merit? Legacy has been around far longer than AA, and any serious movement to end AA must address the other non-meritorious measures which help some to the disadvantage of others including the aggrieved class always mentioned as the example against AA? Why should the advantaged gain another advantage not available to most in our society merely based on blood instead of their personal achievements balanced against everyone else's equally without bias? It would behoove anyone wanting to state a case for opposition to AA to acknowledge the same non-meritorious nature of both legacy and nepotism first since they are much older than AA.

"It can be argued that with the election of Barack Obama, the need for AA should be deemed over. Isn't the highest possible job in this nation the office of the POTUS?"

This logic is clearly flawed. It is exactly like saying--Since Ray Charles rose out of poverty, the need welfare should be deemed over.

Be afraid of any president. The job has turned into a dictatorship that attracts bad people.

This logic is clearly flawed. It is exactly like saying--Since Ray Charles rose out of poverty, the need welfare should be deemed over.

No, its not flawed. The only thing flawed is ignoring the message an Obama presidency sends to all persons of color, namely that NO ACHIEVEMENT is beyond their reach if they work hard enough to get there. If your supposition were correct, then why did Hillary keep harping on the existence of the glass ceiling as it pertained to women? Wasn't the whole point until the ceiling is breached, women can't assume they have true equal opportunity?

The exact same logic applies to persons of color. The Ray Charles analogy was beyond useless in this context. The point I was making is that an Obama presidency brings the conservative ethos to its fruition, making it hard to argue against his ascension from the standpoint of preferential treatment even though wingnuts still try to make the case. If you read my complete thoughts, you'd see I wasn't advocating the end of preferential treatment unless we begin with that received by the already privileged first, such as both legacy and nepotism. Seems there's no outcry from the privileged class over either two of those, so why focus on AA as the unlivable sin?

Well, my ex & I were having a conversation on this sort of nonsense.

Her father was Jewish, her mother Catholic ~ so according to Jewish Religion she's not Jewish.

Meanwhile a real good friend of ours shocked her awhile ago when he said he considered himself black even though he's doesn't really look it at all ~ his father was the first "black" fireman somewhere in some city in New York years ago.

Tiger Woods is 1/4 black & half Cambodian...

this race stuff is so ridiculous. "Showboat" like.

meanwhile Obama is joining in selling out our Country...to the control freaks that sponsor Aipac


The people I've talked to who do not want Obama are not afraid of his color - They hate what a socialistic liberal he is.

The way many are handling the fact of Obama's race is reminiscent of the scene in Blazing Saddles in which the "Gov" tells his second in command, "Can't you see that that man is a ni..." as he realizes he is talking to the black star of the movie.

Don't you know that that man is a nigger? Worried?

Scratch a fish belly white pussy liberal and you will find a racist.


Scratch a fish belly white pussy liberal and you will find a racist.

Posted by fwthom at 2008-07-13 06:35 PM |

Ah agree!

Jesse Helms.

I seem to be alone on this, but it appears to me that these comments are "engineered" and Obama always comes out on top after the controversy. I'm not buying any of it. Looks like Jesse is willing to take one for the team. A sacrafice fly ball deep into the outfield, and Obama is ready with his toe on third waiting to run to home plate.

Congrats to most of you for making this one of the more thoughtful, intelligent and civil threads (at least until Boob, Ray, FWThom and itsme came along) that I have read in a long time.

Speaking of baked potatoes...

Bout that time...

Dethspud

In your case wouldn't that be considered cannibalism?

RIGHTOCENTER:

I like a good discussion myself, but the problem are posters who just come here to be assholes. You know the usual suspects.... Nothing insightful ever to add in their cases. They turn threads into stupidity time and time again with their antics.

Me? I have loads of Republican friends, most of whom are just as fed up with the status quo of these times as I am. We're REALLY good friends. Brothers of mine. But, we can discuss and disagree without being disagreeable - a lost art in American politics.

Posters like you, GOATMAN, and OOHRAH come to mind as a handful from the right who carry on a good discussion without resorting to childish antics or hateful rhetoric.

I do feel Bush - because he's our inept president - is fair game. I'm just as livid at him as my GOP friends are for the miserable job and damage he's done to our Treasury, military, and standing in the world.

Ridley is an idiot. I don't mind thoughtful counterpoint but Ridly just isn't very bright or interesting to read.

obama on a.a. in may, 2007.

"Tiger Woods is 1/4 black & half Cambodian...

Posted by Bani"

Incorrect.

We really ought to elect an illegal for president. That way, we'd only have to pay him 3 bucks and hour and we could make him mow the Whitehouse lawn himself!

I think by Obama just getting the Democratic bid has shown people across the USA that race barriers are truely going away. We've come a long way since the 60's. I see it like unions, when first formed they did many great things for worker rights etc. Now, many unions create sluggish business and have hard times competing against non-union work. AA has been a needed tool, but surley, but slowly that AA will be a non issue. I would say even if you took away AA, many schools, jobs etc would still have an urge to diversify even if they were not forced to, it makes them look better.

America is NO a racist nation!

FACT!

But there ARE a number of racists in it and most of them a LIBERALS!

FACT!

posting "FACT!" after saying something doesn't actually make it a fact, FYI.

FACT!

Tony,

You seem to be an intelligent person with some compassion. I am a 60 year old black woman who has lived in the state of Tennessee for my entire life. I have seen many changes for the good and some for the not so good. I have also been following this campaign very closely. It is indeed historic. I am not so naive as to think the election of Senator Obama would usher in an era of good feelings in this country, but I hope it will give the next generation of young black people something about which to hope. Maybe they can think that if Obama can achieve this level perhaps they can might be able to achieve more in this society. I have heard so may young, smart black people use the excuse, " The white man won't let me." I think they are using this as an excuse because it is the easy way out. I don't know. I don't agree with a lot of what Obama says, but he is a politician after all. He is the future. GOD BLESS YOU.

Many Americans can not type a complete, cogent sentence.

FACT!

James_Dean is a subset of the set "many Americans."

FACT!


"Tiger Woods is 1/4 black & half Cambodian...


Posted by Bani"


Incorrect.

Posted by SanAntonioRogue

Cambodian, Thai...what the difference?:>)


"One could question if Tiger Woods is genetically a genuine Black, as he is at least one half Thai, plus his Father is a mixed-race Black."

If the libs are so obsessed with electing someone based solely on the color of his skin, why NOT Tiger? At least he's accomplished something, unlike Barry who has done nothing.

Since when does Playing Golf mean anything?

Humanear is apparently another victim of the sports-media complex.

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