I would comment, but I'm afraid I'd get bopped upside the head with a 10" cast iron skillet

You'd deserve it.

Men need an equivalent to Lifetime channel to tell them how to deal with abusive women.

If a man fights back against an abusive woman, the women's advocacy groups will be all over him. They'll call him every name in the book, and if there are kids, they'll use them as a weapon against the "abusive man".

Men will laugh at him cause he "got beat up by a girl".

Ahhh, the beautiful results of feminism.

I'll be honest. Slapping me for saying something stupid is one thing, but if a woman starts throwing punches, she better be my mother or my sister if she expects me to not defend myself.

"Men need an equivalent to Lifetime channel to tell them how to deal with abusive women."

That would be good, but Marc Rudov offers plenty of advice on his shows about this, especially on the show I linked up there.

You know Axim it's refreshing to know that at least some other person other than me takes this seriously here at the DR. All everyone else can do is laugh and ignore the problem

Bill you need to leave Hillary fast.

Hitting back isn't an option. And neither is putting up with it. Which is why every man needs to have a great divorce attorney in his Rolodex.

Some women deserve to be alone, forever. For the good of all mankind, fill out the forms, and return them to the family court nearest you. Oh--and if you have children--fight for custody, and save the next generation of men from the women your daughters will become from living with your soon-to-be ex.

I was abused by my ex wife. I was stabbed in the arm with a car key, I had my left hand broken, and was hit lots of times.

If I even threatened to fight her, she would call the police.

When the cops show up, all she'd have to say is I was attacking her, and they'd arrest me. I could be bleeding from wounds she gave me, but that wouldn't matter.

6 months after my daughter was born, my wife left us both. I've been raising my daughter on my own for the past twelve years.

Sissies....

Sissies....

you've obviously never dated a latina

throwing punches comes as naturally to them as breathing.

Roy,

Sorry to hear about the abuse; glad you got your daughter.

A number of years ago my wife threw a stoneware plate and smashed it on my face (there is a joke there somewhere), she spent a few days in jail. We were divorced soon afterward. The really hilarious part was, she was furious that I had called the police. She actually thought the jail time was MY fault and that I should have just let it go and forgive her.

you've obviously never dated a latina

And that makes it ok? If women truly want to be equal, there needs to be equality on both sides. But women want to have their cake and eat it too. We as a society need to acknowledge that women often times have their own agenda's and dont always have a man's well being at heart. Feminists have successfully changed the culture to reflect men as boobs while the wife has all the power, showing men as "I have to ask my wife first" type of crap. And we wonder why we have men crying on TV shows and women losing respect for the male gender. I have no doubt there will be women on this blog crying the "victim" card, but that is NOT the conversation here. I'm sure there will be many more threads in which you can make your point. Anytime a man stresses his rights, he is called a pig, jerk and many other names that would get him put in jail if he were talking to a woman.

Some women deserve to be alone, forever.

And they should be. Good point.

and save the next generation of men from the women your daughters will become from living with your soon-to-be ex.

Problem is, we have had too many feminists telling us how men should be, and it has become ingrained in the minds of men today. We need real men, not defined by women to teach the next generation. Then and only then will men refuse to be hit by a woman. Feminists have taken self respect from men, because they themselves dont respect men.

Beavis Christ.

Not all Latin women hit men.. I am latin and never hit a man, then again I have never had a man hit me, because I can guarantee you had he done so I would have knocked him on his ass!! My husband has never hit me but then again he is a real man in every sense of the word.

The fact of the matter is that men nor women should be physical with one another unless in a loving manner.

Respect is the key in all relationships and boundries. If you have these you should not encounter problems.

.45 Cal

We need real men, not defined by women to teach the next generation.

Posted by boaz

I agree. My sister in law raised two boys alone...
would have been alot better if their fathers played a more significant role in their lives but lacking that resource, she was left to figure it out on her own.

They are good kids, but their characteristically male behavior (not even the bad kinds of male behavior) often got pathologized. Creates a kind of self loathing that I still see the effects of.

If you want to see the large-scale results of women raising boys alone, just look at the black community.....

Hagbard

I raised my son alone, and he is no worse for the wares. He went to college, is engaged to be married to his college sweetheart and is now partnered with a family member in business and is doing well for himself.

I raised my son to be responsible, caring and understanding. I also taught him to stand up for himself but also when to stand down, not to be a pushover or wussy and that it doesn't make you a man to hit a woman. I taught him early on keep your hands to yourself because even play fighting can turn at the blink of an eye. I taught him that having sex and bedding down women doesn't make you a man. I also taught him that if you take the time to bed down that woman you better be ready for the responsibility that comes along with it if a accident should occur and that I guarantee you is something that his father could have never taught him
45Cal

I used to have a co-worker who lives in a very abusive relationship with his ex-wife. She's emotionally and physically abusive and generally treats him like dirt. For various reasons, which seem to defy all logic, they keep pumping out babies and they've been together for 8 or 9 years.

About 4 years ago, when the abuse got very, very bad, the police got involved. The redneck county deputy who responded, had absolutely no understanding of female-on-male abuse and wound up arresting him. While in jail, he ultimately decided to get a divorce. Unfortunately, while he got a dirt cheap POS divorce lawyer from the yellow pages, she got a top notch lawyer pro bono (via the women's shelter). It's not even worth saying who came out on top during the divorce.

After the divorce, he ended up moving back in with her. Things are just as f*cked up now as when they were married.

The really ironic part of all of this is that his female coworkers and friends are significantly more supportive than their male counterparts. I've witnessed many of his male "friends" put him through an excessive amount of ridicule and mockery. Something that would never happen if a female coworker or friend showed up somewhere with a black eye.

6 months after my daughter was born, my wife left us both. I've been raising my daughter on my own for the past twelve years.




Posted by Roy_Batty
* * * *

And . . . everybody wins.

Good for you.

Posted by 45Caliber at 2008-05-27 10:40 AM

I am not looking to take away from your accomplishments. You should be proud and I congratulate and thank you for what you've done.

That said, your success is the exception and not the rule and I might even go so far as to say you've minimized and belittled the importance of a same sex parent.

... with your post, that is.

And that makes it ok? If women truly want to be equal, there needs to be equality on both sides.

TH:That sounds like the argument of someone insecure in their masculinity.

But women want to have their cake and eat it too.

TH: women's position in society has historically been second class (less than 100 years ago they couldnt vote, they STILL make less then men for equivalent work, etc) so pardon them for having a fight on their hands.

We as a society need to acknowledge that women often times have their own agenda's and dont always have a man's well being at heart.

TH: nor should they, or do you need your mommy to fight your fight for you.

Feminists have successfully changed the culture to reflect men as boobs while the wife has all the power, showing men as "I have to ask my wife first" type of crap.

TH: bullshit-our culture is male centered, if you are worried cause a few Lifetime shows present men as boobs or abusers, than again I question your male security. and as for asking your wife's permission, marriages are partners and if you are a good husband you make decisions together.

And we wonder why we have men crying on TV shows and women losing respect for the male gender.

TH: a man crying shows his power a man whining shows his wussiness. you sound like you are whining.

SNIP

Anytime a man stresses his rights, he is called a pig, jerk and many other names that would get him put in jail if he were talking to a woman.

TH: rights? what rights are being taken away from you oh supressed one.



Problem is, we have had too many feminists telling us how men should be, and it has become ingrained in the minds of men today.

TH: if you are so weakminded that you cant think for yourself and are influenced by propoganda I really hope you dont procreate, the world is better off without the l ikes of you.

We need real men, not defined by women to teach the next generation.

TH: the best men are those with influences from both genders and the self respect and dignity and confidence to be themselves.

Then and only then will men refuse to be hit by a woman.

TH: when one is instilled with the self respect and until then we need a society that does not accept violence of any kind.

Feminists have taken self respect from men, because they themselves dont respect men.

TH: bullshit, you dont understand feminism. your insecurity shows through

TH,

Good Trolling.

Non Serviam.

HC

Men can't win in a fight with a woman, because of the way society is constructed and some women are willing to use a scorched earth policy, so why try? In a divorce everyone loses, especially the kids. My solution: just try to mollify the abusive wife and get a girlfriend or two on the side.

TH,

Your posts dont even warrant an answer. What I have posted is the truth, now, go ask your female minder if you can respond...

And that makes it ok? If women truly want to be equal, there needs to be equality on both sides.

TH:That sounds like the argument of someone insecure in their masculinity.

If I showed a woman what is truly equal, I would be put in jail, because the genders are NOT truly equal. My masculinity makes me superior, not the other way around, but our laws make women equal with men.

We as a society need to acknowledge that women often times have their own agenda's and dont always have a man's well being at heart.

TH: nor should they, or do you need your mommy to fight your fight for you.

Again, I said nothing about fighting, but laws make it so we cant take it there. Your attitude of "nor should they" is exactly what I am talking about. You are not doubt a brainwashed man, forever bowing to the will of a woman. Yes, they should always think of a man's point of view, but most women today are childish, emotionally driven, and shelfish. They only think about what benefits them, and there are men that are the same way, but women have society skewed toward them. Not every woman is a victim, alot are skeeming, coniving, evil bitches.

Feminists have successfully changed the culture to reflect men as boobs while the wife has all the power, showing men as "I have to ask my wife first" type of crap.

TH: bullshit-our culture is male centered, if you are worried cause a few Lifetime shows present men as boobs or abusers, than again I question your male security. and as for asking your wife's permission, marriages are partners and if you are a good husband you make decisions together.

Bullshit back to you. Women watch lifetime and compare it to their lives, and have unrealistic expectations of marriage. You have no right to question my male security, your point of view was given to you by a woman, so you cant relate to me or even have a frame of reference to speak.

Problem is, we have had too many feminists telling us how men should be, and it has become ingrained in the minds of men today.

TH: if you are so weakminded that you cant think for yourself and are influenced by propoganda I really hope you dont procreate, the world is better off without the l ikes of you.

Very weak, womanman, you can do better than that.

Then and only then will men refuse to be hit by a woman.

TH: when one is instilled with the self respect and until then we need a society that does not accept violence of any kind.

Which is my point, often times women are bitter and do not instill in boys the respect of men that is needed, she is only trying to make a man that she thinks is a man, but in reality, she is making a pushover for the next woman.

I don't understand why anyone, man or woman, would stay in an abusive relationship.

Men can't win in a fight with a woman, because of the way society is constructed

True, and very sad. And more men need to call bullshit, but the ultimate law of the pussy usually wins..

and some women are willing to use a scorched earth policy, so why try?

So why shouldnt a man be able to use a scorched earth policy as well? Because she is a woman? Bullshit. The very reason that a woman is willing to do something like that is the reason a man should be able to defend himself. A man is no less than a woman.

"Women watch lifetime and compare it to their lives, and have unrealistic expectations of marriage."

I think Flavor Flav said that best when he said:

"you're blind baby.
you're blind to the facts of who you are
because you're watchin' that garbage."

Cold lookin' for that hero,

HC

"Fuck them, they are not human beings.
Every white male should be a dead white male."
signed
The Left

Wusses.

Your posts dont even warrant an answer. What I have posted is the truth, now, go ask your female minder if you can respond...

TH: yet you will answer, how tedious you are.


If I showed a woman what is truly equal, I would be put in jail, because the genders are NOT truly equal. My masculinity makes me superior, not the other way around, but our laws make women equal with men.

TH: you keep speaking of going to jail for demonstrating your superiority. You must therefore, be refering to your small penis or violence of some sort. That does not make you superior. I bet many women could kick your ass physically, mentally, spiritually, financially, emotionally, etc. I would be MOST women could.



Again, I said nothing about fighting, but laws make it so we cant take it there. Your attitude of "nor should they" is exactly what I am talking about. You are not doubt a brainwashed man, forever bowing to the will of a woman.

TH: not at all, I just respect people and take them as they come. You have prejudged youself superior to a whole gender. that makes you a peawit

Yes, they should always think of a man's point of view, but most women today are childish, emotionally driven, and shelfish.

TH:as are you my boy.

They only think about what benefits them, and there are men that are the same way, but women have society skewed toward them. Not every woman is a victim, alot are skeeming, coniving, evil bitches.


TH: have you been hurt by a woman? did your mother reject you? did the pretty girl at school laugh at you? I bet you lost your job to some smart woman? you loser.



Bullshit back to you. Women watch lifetime and compare it to their lives, and have unrealistic expectations of marriage. You have no right to question my male security, your point of view was given to you by a woman, so you cant relate to me or even have a frame of reference to speak.


TH: and your expectation of marriage appears to be from Ozzy and Harriet and Leave it to Beaver. Sorry son but a woman doesnt need you to experience life. Again you are a LOSER!




Which is my point, often times women are bitter and do not instill in boys the respect of men that is needed, she is only trying to make a man that she thinks is a man, but in reality, she is making a pushover for the next woman.

TH: did mommy not breast feed you? the only bitter one around here is you? you sound like someone who cant get a woman to blow him? man up boy, stop blaming your pathetic life on bitches and bitter women, grow a pair and make your own success

Another troll post from TH.

80% attack the poster
20% address the post (that's a generous 20%)

I bet many women could kick your ass physically, mentally, spiritually, financially, emotionally, etc. I would be MOST women could.

bet many women could kick your ass physically, mentally, spiritually, financially, emotionally, etc. I would be MOST women could.

You sir, are a child.

Again you are a LOSER!

You, are a bitch. Alas, since we are behind keyboards, I cannot prove it, but I suspect, you are the kind of man no other man wants to be around as we can sense bitchness and pussiness...

Stop posting those articles Ozark,

It's too much truth for feminists to handle at one time...

I don't understand why anyone, man or woman, would stay in an abusive relationship.

Posted by Sniper at 2008-05-27 12:00 PM

I see Oz has generously opened up the pages of his Misogynists Playbook for us all.

You, are a bitch. Alas, since we are behind keyboards, I cannot prove it, but I suspect, you are the kind of man no other man wants to be around as we can sense bitchness and pussiness...


Posted by boaz



says the founding member of the He-Man Woman Haters Club

dude your a douchebag and you dont even know it.

you demonstrate such hostility to women that it can ONLY be from some traumatic experience with the opposite sex.

again what specifically could land you in jail if you showed a woman? you said it now back it up

Another troll post from TH.

80% attack the poster
20% address the post (that's a generous 20%)

Posted by Hagbard_Celine



hag, how does if feel to live a completely pointless existance? Inquiring minds want to know.

Misogynists Playbook

You're an asshole Corky. Only 12 minutes after my post you make this ludicrous accusation. So you didn't read one of those articles did you?

Do you think Erin Prizzy is a misogynist? What about Dr. Jennifer Rohling, Dr. Lynette Feder, Claudia Ann Dias? Are all of these women misogynists?

Of course this is the typical response to anyone who would light to the facts. Label them a misogynist - even if they are female.

Join No MAAM and reclaim Your lost Masculiity. Call 1-800-AL-BUNDY. Operators are standing by to take Your call. That is NO MAAM Men Against Amazonian Masterhood.

Larry Mohr

I trolled the troll and got exactly the response I expected. Not pointless at all.

If you spent less time attacking the poster, maybe you'd be able to participate in a real conversation.

your inability to understand what was posted is clear, we get it now go away pointless man

Join No MAAM and reclaim Your lost Masculiity (sic & sick) Lennie the MohrOn

Obviously you haven't made the call, have you?

Punk Ass Bitch.

Yet, nationally, men still are not taking responsibility for this terrible act. A recent national sample of college students showed that 84 percent of men who had committed acts fitting the legal definition of rape described their acts as "definitely not rape," according to The Daily Pennsylvanian.


from one of your articles

Yep, have a little wine with dinner and sex afterwards and it's rape because the woman had diminished capacity.


actually what the first article says is that a college's policy is that if a woman is so intoxicated she cant make an informed decision that makes it rape, FL state law is even less stringent.

you demonstrate such hostility to women that it can ONLY be from some traumatic experience with the opposite sex.

No, it comes from seeing men have their manhood taken by women who only care about themselves. In this PC world, women arent earning respect by being women. They are trying to get respect unfairly and getting mad when men call them on it.

again what specifically could land you in jail if you showed a woman?

Depends on how the woman presented herself to me. If she comes as an equal, she will be treated as any man would be treated.

again if your manhood is so threatened that your manhood aint so manly.

women arent demanding respect unfairly, they are throwing off the shackles put on them by society, by history, I understand you dont get it, but women have historically been made second class citizens. They did not receive the vote until 88 years ago, a drop in the bucket, they couldnt hold property, they could be beaten-legally, by their spouse, they could get divorced without their husbands permission. It wasnt until some 40 or so years ago that women could be allowed to compete equally in the workplace, even today they are paid less for the same work. They still have to deal with neanderthals that think that just because they have a penis they are entitled to more, that just becuase they can beat someone up, they are superior. I get it you dont understand.


and again
you avoid the question,what would land you in jail if you were demonstrating equality to a woman?

couldnt get divorced etc

Hey Mike Siesel You do realize You are another one of those reasons why they make Trojan Latex condoms. Just thoght I'd inform You of that fact.

Larry Mohr

from one of your articles...truthhurts

So would you say that both sides of the argument are treated fairly?

And what's surprising that 84% of criminals do not view their acts as a violation of the law.

Personally I've never been interested in having sex with a woman who is drunk because it's much better when they are fully engaged. Further, I've known women who were raped and understand the effect not only on their lives but also on their subsequent relationships with men.

My point is that DV is misreported, unreported, and there's a bias in the system against men who may in fact be subject to abuse. What about women who enter a shelter and find themselves being propositioned by the staff?

You are another one of those reasons why they make Trojan Latex condoms. Lennie the MohrOn, Perennial Poster Boy for the Pro-choice Movement

I ride bareback so they can discontinue production immediately.

What's up with TruthHurts? what got his panties all tied up? You think it's OK TH if women abuse men? You think they should just 'take it like a man'?

The fact is, that a woman can strike a man and expect to get away with it. In fact, she can strike a man and call the police and the guy gets charged. If you're OK with that then I think something is wrong with you.

You are about as useless as they come Mike Siesel. You are a waste of space here on earth and that is a fact Jack.

Larry Mohr

Men can't win in a fight with a woman, because of the way society is constructed.

Men have been taught since birth in our society to suppress their emotions, that it's not masculine and is a sign of weakness for men to express their emotions and feelings, to verbalize their problems and fears, to cry or outwardly show real concern.

Women don't feel the need to internalize and suppress their feelings and emotions like men do because society accepts it as normal behavior when a woman does it. Society says it's "okay" for women to cry, but it's "not okay" for men. It has to be hard for men to always have to keep their hurt inside, to not be able to cry when hurt, to always have to be the ones who are "strong and in control" 100% of the time.

no, I dont believe it is right for a woman to abuse a man. I just dont believe that men are being victimized by feminists and that men are superior to women like neadaboaz thinks.

I believe men can be abused and abuse I believe women can be abused and abuse. Neither is right or acceptable.

I dont believe in hitting anyone, I abhor violence of all sorts. It is not right that a woman abuses the system to fuck with a man.

I figure women get the short end of the stick in society though and more often than not the man is the abuser, the man is the one shirking his responsibilities vis a vis child support or alimony that lead to much of teh acrimony, etc.

Sissies....

Posted by CalifChris at 2008-05-27 02:30 PM

Well put.

Posted by truthhurts at 2008-05-27 02:34 PM

If you had said that from the very beginning, I wouldn't have so agressively trolled your redacted.

But you chose to throw the baby out with the bath water, and all I meant to say was... Hey! There's a baby in there.

well I would just refer you to the post I was responding to and the nonsense posted subsequently by said idiot

more often than not the man is the abuser

Statistics show that when only one party is violent, 70% of the perpetrators are women. When both parties are violent men initiate the act 57% of the time, and in that case women are at a disadvantage and suffer more serious injuries.

But that's not how it is portrayed is it?

Domestic violence against anyone is a terrible. It is a shame that some men are victimized both by their spouse and then further by society that doesn't take it seriously. The same is true of all violence against men (including rape) that is somehow considered to be less devastating because men are supposed to be so strong.

Statistics show that when only one party is violent, 70% of the
perpetrators are women...

Could be the woman had about all she felt she could take from him and just
gave the guy a smack he deserved.

actually if you thought it through you would understand the phenomena they are describing.

when the perpetrators are women we are talking say a face slap or other act of violence that does not cause injuries.

"As for physical injury due to intimate partner violence, it was more likely to occur when the violence was reciprocal than nonreciprocal. And while injury was more likely when violence was perpetrated by men.."

so when a man reacts to the physical expression from a woman the woman tends to get hurt.

women seem to hit more often but the men do the more damage.

Violence of any kind is unacceptable, but i would like to know what the studies definition of violence is.

my experience is that women do not hit, they will mind fuck you into tommorrow but I have experienced very few acts of serious violence perpetrated by women. One that stands out was in college. a fraternity brother of mine was dating a girl, they broke up (cant remember the circumstances) but I was in my room one day and i hear WHACK WHACK WHACK. she was slapping his face hard. He did not react.

interesting how culture views that. If he was a dick and say cheated on her, perhaps we think he deserved it, but if he reacted by smacking her, either if she cheated on him or in response to the hitting she was doing, it would have been abusive.

I will say all he got was a red cheek, but if he hit her he would have broken something, based on their body sizes.

but no she should not have been hitting him regardless of the reason.

I will say that some of my perspective from this comes from having an old fashioned paternalistic, chivalrous, protectionist attitude torward women

"well I would just refer you to the post I was responding to and the nonsense posted subsequently by said idiot"

Posted by truthhurts

He was only 50% insane in that first post then spiraled down afterwards... I think your posts may have contributed to that though.

"I will say all he got was a red cheek, but if he hit her he would have broken something, based on their body sizes."

Posted by truthhurts

I think anybody who is dealing with someone who is larger than them should take that potentiality into consideration when getting into a fight. Especially when dealing with someone less verbally capable. That goes for men and women. Just because nobody has a right to hit anyone else doesn't mean that you can say/do everything just short of that and not expect things to turn bad.

chivalrous

Question then TH...

Why were men chivalrous? And dont tell me it was just because they were women, because that ISNT it....

I will say all he got was a red cheek, but if he hit her he would have broken something, based on their body sizes.

Oh but that still makes it alright for her to hit him...

I would say she needs to watch what she says, reevaluate the men she is with, but that's just me.

Women know which buttons to push and they know how to get us mad. I have always taught my daughter that although no man should hit her, dont be stupid when you are 100 lbs and he is 285 lbs and you are egging on a fight with him. Common sense to me..

why are men chivalrous?

Guess that would be the choice of any man. I choose to act chivalrous because chivalry can stand for a number of virtues that I strive for including honor, respect, as well as the admiration and adoration of women.

chivalrous behaviour has evolved from the standards of how a medieval knight should act, heroic, brave, gallant etc. The basis was chevalier the french mounted knight. Chivalry evolved into the standards of gentlemen

Could be the woman had about all she felt she could take from him and just
gave the guy a smack he deserved.


Posted by CalifChris


This comment is both funny and sad at the same time. Women who are victims of domestic abuse oftentimes feel they deserve the abuse because the "must have done something wrong." One of the big issus is getting them to understand that there is no justification for the abuse. Apparently now men feel the same way and society condones rather than trying to fix the problem.

chivalrous behaviour has evolved from the standards of how a medieval knight should act, heroic, brave, gallant etc. The basis was chevalier the french mounted knight. Chivalry evolved into the standards of gentlemen

You are only partially correct. Chivalry evelved into the standards of gentlemen, but you still didnt answer why.

I would suppose that chivalry came about as a man's way of acknowledging the rough road women had to travel. Staying at home, child rearing, cooking, etc was rough stuff back in the day. It was understood it was woman's work, and pulling out a chair or opening a door was a man's way of knowing that.

Well, today women still want that treatment and still be able decimate a man in the boardroom. They want to compete equally, but still be afforded the gestures that acknowleged they were the weaker sex. Cake and eat it too...

I think anybody who is dealing with someone who is larger than them should take that potentiality into consideration when getting into a fight. Especially when dealing with someone less verbally capable.

Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2008-05-27 03:12 PM | Reply | Flag:

......AND TAKE NOTE THAT THE ABOVE SHOULD BE THE FINAL WORD for all DR posters when having a discussion with Larry. You have been aptly warned.

would suppose that chivalry came about as a man's way of acknowledging the rough road women had to travel. Staying at home, child rearing, cooking, etc was rough stuff back in the day. It was understood it was woman's work, and pulling out a chair or opening a door was a man's way of knowing that.

Well, today women still want that treatment and still be able decimate a man in the boardroom. They want to compete equally, but still be afforded the gestures that acknowleged they were the weaker sex. Cake and eat it too...

Posted by boaz



dude you need to get laid by a liberated woman

what did nicholas say in A Few Good Men "I say, 'cause this is true: if you haven't gotten a blowjob from a superior officer, well, you're just letting the best in life pass you by."

Well, today women still want that treatment and still be able decimate a man in the boardroom. They want to compete equally, but still be afforded the gestures that acknowleged they were the weaker sex.

I don't think many women would choose chivalry over equality. I don't see why they are conflated anyway. Do you think women are equal in our society? Most of the women I know have full-time jobs and are still responsible for most work involving the house and the kids. I guess that's liberation.

Do you think women are equal in our society?

Of course women are equal today. Can women do the job of a man, I think so. But when they dont get hired, they shouldnt assume it's sexist.

Most of the women I know have full-time jobs and are still responsible for most work involving the house and the kids.

Women like that are few and far between.

of the big issus is getting them [women] to understand that there is no justification for the abuse....

True, abuse of any person is wrong but you can't compare even just a slap from a woman as the same kind of physical abuse if it was a slap coming from a man. Women have only 1/3 the upper body strength of men. How many average women can really throw a punch that could do any real physical harm to a guy? Not many. Men don't realize the amount of strength they have.

Sure, women can easily be the ones initially at fault for starting the fight. Women know what buttons to push with a guy to irritate him -- that's how women "fight" -- but if it ever turned physically abusive the guy should just get up and walk out the door until things cool off.

Neither one should be physically abusive to the other -- but most of all men should never be physically abusive to the woman.

Truthhurts

why are men chivalrous?

Guess that would be the choice of any man. I choose to act chivalrous because chivalry can stand for a number of virtues that I strive for including honor, respect, as well as the admiration and adoration of women.

Women like men who treat them with respect. For most women their desire for wanting equality ends when it comes to having the guy showing a little chivalry and being a gentleman.

Even something as trivial as opening her car door for her, or helping her carry a heavy package, as a woman I can tell you most women love being treated like that and most any woman who tells you otherwise is lying. They appreciate it from the men they know and they appreciate it when a stranger does it for them simply because they are a woman. I always make sure I say "thanks" and acknowledge a guy being polite -- even if it's just holding open the door for me going into a 7-11 convenient mart. A little appreciation and respect shown by both sides doesn't take much effort and goes a long way.

True, abuse of any person is wrong but you can't compare even just a slap from a woman as the same kind of physical abuse if it was a slap coming from a man. Women have only 1/3 the upper body strength of men. How many average women can really throw a punch that could do any real physical harm to a guy? Not many. Men don't realize the amount of strength they have.

Sure, women can easily be the ones initially at fault for starting the fight. Women know what buttons to push with a guy to irritate him -- that's how women "fight" -- but if it ever turned physically abusive the guy should just get up and walk out the door until things cool off.

Neither one should be physically abusive to the other -- but most of all men should never be physically abusive to the woman.

Posted by CalifChris at 2008-05-27 05:21 PM

Women like men who treat them with respect. For most women their desire for wanting equality ends when it comes to having the guy showing a little chivalry and being a gentleman.

The old folks home doesn't count.

I used to bartend and not a chance, women are not interested at all in the nice, common sense, well mannered guy. Women like the guy who treats em like shit. See and watched it every single day.

Women are not interested in nice guys.

"I choose to act chivalrous because chivalry can stand for a number of virtues that I strive for including honor, respect, as well as the admiration and adoration of women."

Posted by truthhurts

I say you should leave the adoration for your deity, TH.
Best advice an ex-girlfriend ever gave me.

"Women are not interested in nice guys."

Posted by moneywar

My brother tried to convince me of that as he got laid by some of the finest women I've ever set eyes on and he treated most of them like dirt. He said that my "nice guy" game was a loser's gambit. In the short term, he was right, my sex life had many dry spells. Then I met the right one. And she can kick my ass if she wanted to and there wouldn't be very much I could do about it.

Women are not interested in nice guys.

Posted by moneywar at 2008-05-27 05:49 PM

Yes we are. We don't like some milquetoast, pushover kind of guy we can walk all over. Guys who are doormats are boring. Most women like a combination of a rugged, masculine type of guy who they feel could protect them if needed but also has some gentlemanly qualities in him too. I don't think that's too much to ask of a guy.

Gotta run. Later.

Look for the Adams apple next time.

Kidding.

"Women are not interested in nice guys.

Posted by moneywar at 2008-05-27 05:49 PM


"Yes we are.
...

Posted by CalifChris "


Not that it's important, but why in the hell have you been portraying yourself as male all this time?

Any man who lets a woman abuse him deserves what he gets. FUCKIBG PUSSY....

Look for the Adams apple next time.

Kidding.

Posted by itsme at 2008-05-27 06:08 PM

That redacted was just wrong, LOL.

Women are not interested in nice guys. Yes we are...CC

Okay, the bubble baths and nipple creams are being to make sense now. LOL


Out of the Navy I shared a house with a couple of guys who had served in the 101st. No sooner would they bed one gal and they were off schmoozing another. The one common thread was that these women had little, or low, self esteem. Another factor seemed to be an absent father, generally due to divorce.

Like a social worker I seem to be drawn to women who are neurotic, self absorbed, completely whacked out, frantic, hyperactive, obsessive compulsive, or totally fucking crazy.

I'm not sure sure if it's because opposites attract or I just feel comfortable in a familiar environment.

I should have been a monk.

Cali,

I always thought you were a guy. What happened, why the sudden change?

Oz,

Don't feel bad, I seem to attrack the ugly ones!

for some reason I always thought CC was a man, damn sexist of me.

"Like a social worker I seem to be drawn to women who are neurotic, self absorbed, completely whacked out, frantic, hyperactive, obsessive compulsive, or totally fucking crazy.
"

I've noticed.
She's one of the few bloggers here I actually tried to get in touch with.
Fortunately I didn't get anywhere near as "in touch" as you did.

for some reason I always thought CC was a man, damn sexist of me.

Posted by truthhurts

That's so funny coming from you... and on this thread. But to let you off the hook, I was sure she was a man too.

Hagbard Celine... Guilty.

Reading through these threads makes me very happy to be in a good relationship with a great spouse.

I had no idea so many DR members were in such screwed up relationships and so bitter about the institution of marriage. Though, I must admit that it is somewhat entertaining to read all the paranoid theories about feminists trying to emasculate them; like it's some conspiracy between the Lifetime channel and NOW.

Next thing you know, we're going to find out CC is a Latina, and she's going to start signing her posts with "Adios."

"Hitting back isn't an option. And neither is putting up with it. Which is why every man needs to have a great divorce attorney in his Rolodex.

Posted by rightisright at 2008-05-27 09:05 AM"

No, "every man" does not have to have that in his Rolodex. Those of us perceptive enough to know who we were getting married to do not need a great divorce attorney. (For the record, my wife hip checked me right out of the shower when we were still dating. I wasn't seriously injured, and she promised not to go all hockey on me ever again.)

Even something as trivial as opening her car door for her, or helping her carry a heavy package, as a woman I can tell you most women love being treated like that and most any woman who tells you otherwise is lying. They appreciate it from the men they know and they appreciate it when a stranger does it for them simply because they are a woman.

The things you just named are like gold to a woman. They are also things I dont just automatically give to a woman just because she is a woman. Do I get an automatic blowjob?

"Yes we are.
...

Posted by CalifChris "

WTF? Looks like someone is spoofing Chris...

Poor Boaz. So hard to "automatically" open a door for a woman. Needs a blow job first. (My guess is he won't be holding any doors open any time soon.)

"Of course women are equal today.

Posted by boaz at 2008-05-27 04:55 PM"

Well, yeah, except for that pesky little statistic of being paid 70% of the male wage for the same work.

Montecore,

I was saying that to be funny, but obviosly you get what I mean. I open doors for a lady, and I dont do it until a woman proves herself to be one.

So given the posts above, Boaz, the real question we have is....

would you open the door for CC?? :D

Well, yeah, except for that pesky little statistic of being paid 70% of the male wage for the same work.

Well, a woman needs to choose an occupation that pays something. A shrink counsoler wont make what an engineer makes. They usually choose jobs that dont pay much.

would you open the door for CC??

ROTFLOL...

I think someone spoofed his logon...

No, I'm talking about for the same job/position, Boaz. I think the real debate is whether the fact that women leave the workforce to raise families, etc. justifies the lower pay.

No, I'm talking about for the same job/position

Can I see a non-biased stat of 70% lower in the same job? That is sort of hard to believe...

Montecore,

None of those articles said women make 70% less than men. They had the overall statistics, which I already know, it's because women dont choose high paying jobs on average.

it is somewhat entertaining to read all the paranoid theories about feminists


You should walk a mile in my shoes (size 14).

I have a daughter who struggles to get paid what she's worth but it's not a man who is resisting an increase in her salary. Just recently she asked her female supervisor for a raise to cover her tuition, and admittedly she got a bonus that would cover that, but just the same she was also denied a raise because she was allowed to go on flex time because of her class schedule - that was the excuse. Yet she still worked 40+ hours every week and got her job done.

This woman is in the post menopausal stage like many of the early feminists. I've counseled my daughter and helped her understand that she should be making more than this woman and that's the stumbling block. So I send her links to wage scales, and recently she was named chair of a committee that addresses employee retention and welfare. My strategy is to help her evaluate the employees and eliminate the turn over, and by extension learn to make the case for herself to the owner of the firm.

What I see as a good sign as regards her maturity is that she has twice refused an offer of money in the fall and again in January.

For a father that is a milestone.

A real assessment of the feminist movement is that it is fractured between women like my daughter who strive to achieve independence and equality, and those older women who have languished in the special interest philosophy that was long ago captured by misanthropes and misandrists of all stripes. They have a tidy little cash flow through the various bureaucracies and legal system, bear little or no scrutiny, and dispense propaganda - and I label it as such because they only tell half the story.

You Gals need to Clean House.

Your friendly mis-OZ-inist

Boaz,
I don't know about the women you know, but I can tell you my girlfriends all have top paying positions and out of a group of my 7 closest friends 5 are higher paying then their husband's. I am the one of the two that is not. Reason being is I am retired, and I am not in want of a thing! I am also certain that Sarge wouldn't care if I was making more than he was. Reason being that as a man you have to be secure with yourself first and foremost.A woman can be the CEO in the boardroom and a wife and loving mother outside I have plenty of colleagues and friends who are both!

BTW, what does a woman have to do to prove to you she is a woman first prior to your opening a door for her?.. That my friend was a backwards ass statement!

.45Cal

"True, abuse of any person is wrong but you can't compare even just a slap from a woman as the same kind of physical abuse if it was a slap coming from a man. Women have only 1/3 the upper body strength of men. How many average women can really throw a punch that could do any real physical harm to a guy? Not many. Men don't realize the amount of strength they have. "

You don't get it CC and unfortunately I can't verbalize it even though I understand in my mind that abuse has nothing to with strength it has to do with lack of respect for the other person. Sure men have more strength, but the point is both men and women can either chose to solve their problems by talking or by violence. Yes, women might be "waaker" but it is the violent act itself that is the problem. It makes matters worse when the woman know the man won't hit her because society doesn't approve and the laws protect her, this leads to more abuse, not only physical, but mental. Think about it if one individual attacks another with impunity that individual will abuse that power and keep attacking safe in the knowleged they can't be punished. In other words, absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Cali,

I always thought you were a guy. What happened, why the sudden change?


Posted by moneywar


Like Nully said, not that it makes any difference, but for some time i've been a little confused about Cal not knowing for sure one way or the other what to think.

"I had no idea so many DR members were in such screwed up relationships and so bitter about the "

YEAH! That's why we cling to the DR and our PCs!

LOL!

"institution of marriage. Though, I must admit that it is somewhat entertaining to read all the paranoid theories about feminists trying to emasculate them; like it's some conspiracy between the Lifetime channel and NOW."

It's no "conspiracy" in the pejorative sense of the word. And as Marc Rudov points out, there is a connection between men being "whipped" at home and crazy laws being passed against them by other men. Legislators are as "whipped" as any other men resulting in feminists getting what they want.

It may sound funny to some, offensive to others, but I think Rudov is on to something.

Next thing you know, we're going to find out CC is a Latina, and she's going to start signing her posts with "Adios."

Posted by mOntecOre


FF! ROTFLMAO!

Nullifidian, OzarkAggie, Moneywar, Member2586, Montecore, Boaz,
and to all of you above who asked --

"CalifChris" stands for "CalifChristine" --
I'm a woman, straight, normal (as you can be and still blog on here) and DR was my first time ever blogging. When I first started a few years ago there were practically no women that I knew of. I didn't blog as often as I do now. I never announced I was female because no one asked and I didn't think it was necessary. I didn't try to act like a guy -- I was always myself.

In the very beginning the guys just referred to me as "a Cali dude with a surfboard" and I left it at that. I was not trying to pull one over on you guys. I just didn't really know how to come out and say I was a female and there was no need anyway. The way I am on here is the same personality I always have.

Honestly, I kept my gender a non-issue because I wanted to be accepted on DR for my opinions and thoughts and to have a good debate. I felt if you all knew I was a female you would be "polite" but you'd ignore me when it came to going back and forth with the retorts. Get real, do you really think Nulli would have called me a "fucking anal retentive idiot" (grin) like he did last week if he knew I was female? Probably not. Nor would a lot of the others have given me a verbal run for my money when going back and forth with the retorts. But I didn't care because it was all done in fun and in good old "retort" style and I gave back as good as I got. I want to keep it that way.

I had thought more these last couple of months about finally coming out and saying I was a woman -- without making a big deal about it -- because many more women blog on here now and I'm more comfortable. I decided to do just come out and say it on some thread and the opportunity was here without making some big deal out of it. I didn't know if anyone would even notice it but you did and I'm answering you. I've made my reputation -- for good or bad -- and hope you all just treat me as you always have.

I hope none of you think I was trying to be deceitful to just pull one over on you because I wasn't. It just all started out with you all assuming I was a guy and I just never said any different. OzarkAggie would tell me I "was a good man" for taking care of my Mom and I felt kinda bad for not being truthful. I just came out today and decided to make it known.

Can we now all go back to just pounding away at each other the same as before? The last thing I want or need is for you all to treat me "too nice" and "too polite" and not even battle with me any more. I won't break. And if any of you ever make me cry you'll never know about it 'cause I'd never give you f--king assholes the satisfaction. (grin)

The end.

The last thing I want or need is for you all to treat me "too nice"

No problem Closet Freak.

I just thought you were swishy...maybe...but now I'm thinking of that hero worship you toss b00b's way: "Truthseeker" What baloney. Only a woman could lie like that - I should have known.

I do remember that bit about mooning the train and in one picture there was pretty good looker in a bikini. I'll just think of you as her.

But my compliments regarding your mom and your care were sincere. It can be a burden that gives you joy and sadness in one felled swoop. You're a good gal Christine. My word on that.

No problema, Christine. I'll be glad to continue to bash you when I deem it appropriate. :)

"CalifChris" stands for "CalifChristine" --


WTF???!!!!!????????

"Get real, do you really think Nulli would have called me a "fucking anal retentive idiot" (grin) like he did last week if he knew I was female? Probably not."


Well, that's a not a gender-specific insult, er, description.

You think you might have mentioned that fact somewhere along the line in the last 4-5 years or so 'Christine'.


Jesus christ, I always knew Ozark Anal Queen was a bitch, but damn.....You're shitting us, right?

Im freakin shocked by these new developments

CC- So you want to play "get the mexican across the border" with me, honey?

Just kidding! I never knew(or cared) about your gender. In fact, I don't know the gender of most posters here. And the ones i do know...it didn't really change how I thought of them.

Except for Dawgpound. He's a color blind trans sexual with dyslexia and a lazy eye.

"You're shitting us, right? Posted by dawgpooh

She said she was a woman not a canine. Get your steamers at the animal shelter rexy.

You think you might have mentioned that fact somewhere along the line in the last 4-5 years or so 'Christine'.

So you're bummed your CC fantasy that included anal and a reach around just went up in smoke, right?

Not all of us like to take a shit and blog at the same time, rex. Leave people to their secrets.

As a public defender I have represented hundreds (thousands?) of accused perps of domestic violence. About 15% the time it is the woman who is accused. I find that generally women are able to inflict a lot less physical injury than men. (Though obviously there are big exceptions to the rule, - like the women who chopped her husband up with an axe and stuffed the body parts in Glad Bags.) Women tend to get somewhat lesser sentences than men overall, - on the other hand less of them tend to be recidivists, and as mentioned above, they tend to inflict less injury. When it comes to jury trial however, for better or worse women are a lot more likely to be acquitted for acts of violence than men. I'm still not sure why that is, stereotypes notwithstanding. The bottom line is, in 90% + of cases of DV, alcohol or drugs is involved.

Chris/Christina, I'm sorry for your loss, I know you loved your mother very much.

My condolences to you and your family

"My condolences to you and your family"

For what? Don't be stupid. Assuming her story is true, what's the problem? Her explanation is perfectly reasonable.

So now CC is coming out of the closet and is admitting to being a woman? I can't fucking deal with this. Ya know the Supreme Court of California recently ruled it was okay to be female. Next thing you know all these people I have known for years are coming out and admitting they are female. I mean there is nothing wrong with it or anything but do they have to be so public about it? If they are female behind close doors that is their business, but actually feeling some compulsive need to let the whole world know? It's just not right. It wasn't like this in the good old days.

Seriously though, your gender makes sense. You were never a big enough asshole to be a "real man".

And now that I think of it, your whole thing for Lou Dobbs now seems kind of creepy.

And now that I think of it, your whole thing for Lou Dobbs now seems kind of creepy.

Posted by moder8 at 2008-05-28 01:27 AM | Reply

I just puked in my mouth. Bastard.

Ahhhh.. the misplaced and false notions of chivalry.

Before I launch into the negative, I will point out that I hold open doors, I carry packages. For women I have never even met. Not because I believe women cannot do these things, but that I believe they should not have to. My wife understands why I sometimes stubbornly do things, for example when my back was thrown, I didn't let her mow the lawn. (we have to use a weedwhacker and it's often swampy and mucky).

Now.. the thing is, those are all that's leftover of what I used to be. I used to be Truthhurts. I used to ADORE and ADMIRE women. I used to put them on a pedestal and treat them like they were heavenly creatures, above us, It used to be absolutely impossible for me to understand how a woman could EVER be wrong about ANYTHING. I even used to question the masculinity of anyone who has dared to say otherwise. I used to say things like "Most women can defeat your average man in a fight, they're smarter then us, faster, have a better moral compass." And while I was able to get laid.. nothing lasted very long, and I thought that women were only interested in jerks.

Then... one day.. I grew up. I can't exactly delineate when this happened.. but it did. I realized that I was not loving any one individual woman, I was loving my bizzare IDEAL of women.. not woman themselves. (grammatical nightmare, yes.. but you get the idea) I realized that women are just people. There are evil ones, there are good ones.. and they are not automatically to be respected just because they have boobies. And then, I started attracting quality women. It's like they could somehow magically smell that I was no longer a sissy.

It's the mindsets of "liberated" men that cause harm just as much as the total misogynist pigs Neither have the ability to see women as real people, and they, together, create a society in which men are in a lose/lose situation if abused. The correct thing to do is.. just see woman as people. My wife, for example, takes care of the shopping, and the cleaning. I do the cooking, and computer/general repair. We do what we're best at, and the other defers when necessary.

Chivalry is a word I balk at, because males who use the word have no idea what it means. You can be a gentleman, but don't try to be a knight. They're fantasy creatures. And, incidentally, "chivalry" only applied to high-class ladies. Low class wenches were to be spat on, used freely for pleasure, or just plain killed if the knight felt like it. Chivalry was never, ever about women in general.

What's up with the new handle, TH?

*sighs* I meant I used to be just LIKE him, not "I am him but in a new screenname."

*shrugs* We all sometimes fail our Reading Comprehension skill roll.

Oops.

Calichris,

Nice.....It really doesnt matter,

When you did the tribute to fallen soldiers, you soldified your standing with me...

BTW I want to clarify my admire and adore comment, I dont put women up on pedastals, I respect women and treat them as equals, i dont believe that just because I have a penis I am superior. I see women who are treated differently by men just because they are women, intelligent, confident, successful professionals who are treated like support staff just because they have breasts. The condescension is constant and blatant.

Opening a door, or saying maam is not belittling a woman it is a subtle bit of admiration of the viva le differance variety, but it is coupled with a the fact that when we get in the board room and are competing over something we are going to go nose to nose, but when we are done I willhold the door on the way out.

CC

see the problem now is that when we read your posts we will be imagining you typing naked and you being a woman that looks like Megan Fox or Charlize Theron.

.You're shitting us, right?

Posted by dawgpound


elephants cant shit that much!

CC -- when people use gender neutral names it is somethimes difficult to tell whether a person is a man or a women. This is the Internet if people feel somehow betrayed then I would suggested they should soon get over it. I myself had a feeling you might be a women but could not be sure call, yes, here it comes,




MALE INTUITION,

LOL!

Anyways, you are still the Lou Dobbs worshipping, illegal alien hating (with good reason) , coffe drinking poster we all know and love. Nothing really changes for me because I try no to insult people too much, maybe making fun of their names and sometimes a few nasty comments but thas't it.

I hold doors open for women all of the time, however I only do so in order to check out their butts as they walk past me.

CC, don't be concerned about your gender changing the way people deal with you here.
Reference Danni.

FF Jeff!

""CalifChris" stands for "CalifChristine" --
I'm a woman, straight, normal (as you can be and still blog on here) and DR was my first time ever blogging. "

Thanks for letting us know...I had a feeling that this was the case due to a few things in your writing style but I didn't want to say anything because I figured if you wanted it known you'd say something.

"None of those articles said women make 70% less than men. They had the overall statistics, which I already know, it's because women dont choose high paying jobs on average."

Correct. The "statistic" that women make only 70% of what men make is not true for the same job with the same experience anymore and hasn't been true for many years. The fact is, as the government statistics hold out, that women on average earn less than men. The reason is that as a whole, more women work part time, in lower paying jobs or have gaps in their work experience due to family obligations that limit careers. None of this is indicative of oppression as the popular myth of the 70% statistic would have you believe.

On topic....

As many of you know, I've been involved in a very difficult family situation that ended up in lots of court appearances, false allegations against me made by my ex wife, supervised visitation, etc etc. I eventually prevailed, partly because it became very clear to the courts that my ex is emotionally disturbed (I only wish I could have recognized it before we seperated 9 years ago and that I'd gotten her help). I ended up with full custody of my two minor children as a result, after she decided to abandon them and head for the west coast and I'd been vindicated completely. Now I'm a single custodial dad with my hands full with two teens including an 18 year old with some serious psychiatric issues. I also haven't seen my now 20 year old daughter in 4 years as a result of this mess and I'm trying to get her to come back into the family.

I agreed for some of our story to be shared publicly under assumed names; if interested there is an article in this month's "Best Life" magazine on supervised visitation; my story is used as an example. Don't worry, the names have been changed :-)

Anyhow, I've been very sensitive to this issue and gotten to know other parents who've been through their own terrible situations as well. Female domestic violence is definitely an issue, probably as common or more common than male on female violence though underreported. I have a few male friends that have been through the grinder because of it, including one who actually managed to get a shelter to take him in because of a dangerously violent girlfriend. My own ex was considered very dangerous to me at one point; one of the psychologists involved in the case called me one day to tell me that she was worried that my ex might do something and told me to get a restraining order ASAP. My request was denied by the court although they give them out like candy to the women in Mass...the women in the part of the court where you file for ROs gave me major attitude about helping me too.

We have women who kill their husbands, like the minister recently, who get little or no punishment because they claim the guy was a jerk or violent with no prior history or record. On TV it's OK to show guys in the emergency room with grievous injuries for giving their wife the wrong present for valentines...but imagine if it was the other way around!

Violence is never OK, either way. And, yes, I'm sensitive to male on female DV...a few months ago a woman I worked side by side with for several years was murdered by her husband so it hits close to home for me too. He's in jail awaiting trial.

But the fact is that we are now applying a huge double standard for a lot of reasons and a certain percentage of women are really taking advantage of that.

And once again I appear to be the thread killer...I think rcade watches to see if I post on a topic and then, if he sees dcinma, he knows it's time to pull it....

Dawgpound

...I'm sorry for your loss, I know you loved your mother very much.

My condolences to you and your family

Thanks so much for your kind words. They're appreciated.

Nullifidian

My condolences to you and your family"

-- Posted by dawgpound at 2008-05-28 01:14 AM |

For what? Don't be stupid. Assuming her story is true, what's the problem? Her explanation is perfectly reasonable.

Posted by nullifidian at 2008-05-28 01:23 AM

I think you may have been getting the issue confused. My Mom passed away two months ago in March but I just now let that be known on DR about three days ago. (Wasn't emotionally up to discussing it before then.) Her loss was the reason for Dawgpound offering his condolences to me.

My condolences also Chris.
This is the first I have heard of your loss.

Cali,

Sorry to hear about your Mom, I know you were close and that's really tough. My heart felt best wishes goes out to you.

Condolences to you, Chris. You never get over it, but the pain eventually becomes a bit duller. Treasure the good times, take the best she had to give and pass it along as best you can.

Kerrin57, Moneywar and Doc --

Thanks for your kind thoughts. I welcomed hearing them.

My condolences too, Chris.

My condolences, CChris.

I know you sacrificed a lot to care for her personally in lieu of putting her into a home. I suspect she appreciated that more than she could possibly express vocally. I hope her final days were relatively peaceful.


PS - Until you revealed your gender I always thought you were a dude.

I always thought you were a dude...and that really turned me on Posted by JeffJ

The Tom Leykis TV Channel

I used to bartend and not a chance, women are not interested at all in the nice, common sense, well mannered guy. Women like the guy who treats em like shit. See and watched it every single day.

Women are not interested in nice guys.

Posted by moneywar

Just wanted to reiterate this point. I bartended for about 7 years. I watched assholes left and right pickup tail right out from under "nice guys"

It was kind of sad, but also educational, after about my 3rd year I had the asshole bartender game down pat.

I got laid so much back then.....then I went into computer networking..

WTF was I thinking...

CalifChristine

holy crap.

I lurk here alot and post here or there. The woman thing shouldn't really be a big deal, but after reading for a while you start to form general ideas of what people are like.

Honestly, I always kinda figured you for just a somewhat effeminate guy.

Cheers to you buddy!