All injured parties form a line here for your court date.

The locals are in a tizzy today about the fact that this thing was doomed from the start. We have nutjobs talking about how this explanation is really a cover up organized by the governer himself. What a bunch of rubes I have to put up with here. Any room in Wisconsin Wisgod?

Any room in Wisconsin Wisgod?

Posted by the_nether

Don't bother. After that happened, our retarded Govenor funded studies on all similar bridges in Wi.
The Republican Assemby tried to stall it to see what the findings were in Mn. but he pushed the panic button.

Typical.

Still, in a no-holds-barred retard-a-thon I think Minnesota takes Wisconsin in a sixth round knock out.

Yesterday I read that they wanted to raise gas taxes 40 cents a gallon to fix our roads and bridges and they sited this collapse as a reason but I also heard Minnisota spent 500 million in highway money to build a stadium for the Vikings.
/also heard pidgieon shiat was the reason for the collapse and the state workers were supposed to clean and maintain the bridges weren't doing their job.

Well the queens aren't getting it...yet.

But, yeah they like to spend our vehicle excise tax money and other road and bridge money on things like stadiums and money pit light rail projects. Than when the bridges fall down they tell us we're not taxed enough, and shame on us. What's worse, a majority of the people agree with them. What an honor to live and work in such a dump.

HUH? I though Bush did it.

Yesterday I read that they wanted to raise gas taxes 40 cents a gallon to fix our roads and bridges

Well the money has to come from somewhere. Misapropriation of funds is a separate issue, but funding road and bridge work from gasoline taxes is a use tax, and the propper way to do it. The people who drive pay for the roads they need.

If you don't want to pay for a new bridge, don't drive.
Or do you expect someone else to pay for it, and drive on it for free?

If you don't want to pay for a new bridge, don't drive.
Or do you expect someone else to pay for it, and drive on it for free?
--------

If you endorse the light rail in the twin cities area, this is your platform. Someone else should pay so I can ride.

Pat Robertson's Fault: He never predicted the extra weight and traffic the bridge would have faced 40 years after it was built.
Of course, if he had, nobody would have believed him anyways.

What a surprise.

After a government agency investigates the collapse, the find that government agencies were not liable, and that instead the private firm who designed the bridge is. Did anyone think that the NTSB would blame government bridge inspectors who had the job of looking at the bridge periodically to determine whether it was structurally sufficient?

Did anyone think that the NTSB would say, "we were liable," and "so were federal and state governments for ignoring reports that the bridge was structurally deficient."

I didn't. As is obvious, this is the fault of anyone but government.

The locals are in a tizzy today about the fact that this thing was doomed from the start.

Posted by the_nether

It was OK when it was designed but updates to the bridge put a much heavier load on it.

You guys can afford to build a stadium for your sports team but a bridge is out of the question. What ar your priorities?

If you endorse the light rail in the twin cities area, this is your platform. Someone else should pay so I can ride.

Well I look at mass transit from the overall system view. If gasoline taxes pay for mass transit, the driver is not without benefit. Every user of the train is a car that's not competing with you for freeway space or a parking spot.
You're paying more, but getting a faster commute.

But I agree in that situation that someone who doesn't drive and doesn't buy gasoline is getting the train for free, and that I don't agree with.

I'm happier with the Illinois model, where we're raising sales taxes to pay for mass transit. Everyone pays, everyone gets the bennefit of either using the EL or having less traffic.

And there is universal agreement that our Gov.'s plan to let seniors ride the El for free is vote pandering and a bad idea all around. Everyone pays taxes, and everyone pays a fare to ride.

Apparantly our priorities are Twins staduim and light rail. All else is folly in the eyes of the majority of suckers in this state. Although I think the Twins stadium is being funded by a sales tax in Hennepin county, so I guess we're just all about money sucking light rail.

Well I look at mass transit from the overall system view. If gasoline taxes pay for mass transit, the driver is not without benefit. Every user of the train is a car that's not competing with you for freeway space or a parking spot.
------------------

The problem here is that most light rail riders are former bus riders. So you get no net loss of cars on the road, and the busses are still making the routes. It's a "no one wins except rail riders" scenerio.

I thought this was all Bushes fault

So if I don't have kids to send to public schools I shouldn't have to pay 13,000 per rugrat to carve up desks and destroy books and what not?

You bet your ass Shirts, because "it benefits us all." TM

Although, this thread isn't about the broken education system in Minnesota on which I could rant for the next few days. It's about the bridge collapse which is a symptom of the broken spending model in Minnesota, on which I shall rant for a lifetime.

Was the design ever evaluated after 41 years to see if it would hold the immense increase in traffic -- particularly trucks -- coming across the bridge? If not, why not. This collapse is just a taste of things to come when the NAU gets in full gear and the NAFTA Superhighway starts to flood our roads and bridges with lumbering, old trucks by the tens of thousands.

Maybe we should have all the states spend their federal highway funding to look at antiquated infrastructure across our nation? Oh, sorry, I forgot. That money the last 5 years has been diverted for the war in Iraq. my bad.
Y'all aint' seen nothing yet.

Didn't Bush have a short stint as head of a construction firm in the early 70's? I heard it said that firm went belly-up shortly after he left.

Remember, "everything he touches..."

Any room in Wisconsin Wisgod?

Posted by the_nether

Got room for me too?
California is now in literal fiscal meltdown. We are now billions and billions of $$$$ in debt and the socialist politicians who run Sacramento want to make up for it by increasing the taxes of the citizens of my state. The socialist California politicians are constantly working on overthrowing Proposition 13 so they can tax homeowners right out onto the street by increasing their property taxes by 1000%. So far Prop. 13 is untouchable but just give them time -- they keep chipping away at it and right now those socialists politicians are desperate and hungry for more money.

So movin' sounds kinda good about now. Got a house to rent? Any room in Wisconsin?

I used to drive that bridge daily, 20 years ago. Even then it looked like a death trap; I usually puckered solidly all the way across...

Design my ass, that structure was rusty and crusty for the last two decades, at least. Proper maintenance and structural evaluation, especially when adding several hundred tons of extra concrete, structure and vehicles, would have prevented this collapse.

That bridge was built by people who gave a damn about their work, a shame it was not cared for in subsequent decades by those who shared that sentiment.

That bridge was built by people who gave a damn about their work, a shame it was not cared for in subsequent decades by those who shared that sentiment.

Posted by sfabisch at 2008-01-16 06:22 PM |

You spoke the TRUTH.
They are only blaming it on the designers because they "can't locate the original design calculations" and trace it back so it's easy to make the original designers the fall guy.

It is all due to highway/infrastructure maintenance funds either being diverted to other "pet projects" or slashed down to the bone in order to fund Bush's war in Iraq which has taken billions of dollars away from the states.

Men who did the engineering and design back in the 1960's were educated, skilled and trained in their respective professions. No cheap illegal laborers doing shoddy work and the cutting of corners in quality for the ultimate corporate profit like we see now.

Also, there were two major restructuring projects on that bridge after it was built. When were they done and who was responsible for doing them? That's probablly where the faulty design came in, not back with the original designers -- when Americans did quality work and were proud of their work product.

probablly = probably

The dr left exposed for the hypocrites they are. Many here raved about how this was GW's fault. It was not, the dr left can't/won't take back there shot from the hip KNOWING NOTHING crap. As usual.

It's quite comical how full of hate and agenda driven the dr left really is. Social fascists......Typical

No calchris you didn't even read the story Idiot

"Basically, those 16 gusset plates were too thin to provide the margin of safety expected in a properly designed bridge such as this," Rosenker said. "These gusset plates were roughly half the thickness that would be required -- half an inch thick rather than an inch thick."

"Investigators haven't located the original designer's calculations, he said, so "we cannot determine whether the error was a calculation error, a drafting error, or some other error in the design process."

That's one of the reasons it's not final. But seeing how this site LOOOVVVEESSSS 911 conspiracy theories, I trust YOU won't accept an engineers conclusions heh?

"Basically, those 16 gusset plates were too thin to provide the margin of safety expected in a properly designed bridge such as this," Rosenker said. "These gusset plates were roughly half the thickness that would be required -- half an inch thick rather than an inch thick."

Nothing but political bull shit.

You forget, this bridge was already known to have safety issues but was pushed off because of no money...it was all going to try an occupy Iraq. That be a BUSH problem.

Nothing but political bull shit.

Money analyzed the bridge himself and he knows better.

Ray analyzed the bridge himself, and said: "if only we would cut taxes! Bridges can rebuild themselves!"

Trolling today. Huh Reilly?

BTW troll, I was giving the engineering study the benefit of the doubt. It wasn't a maintenance issue.

"Trolling today. Huh Reilly?"

Ray says, "bridges can be built for free"!

Hey, if everybody would donate, we wouldn't need government to repair the bridges!

--Ray

Is building bridges really a necessary government function? If the bridges benefit private citizens and business, they will build the bridge.

Libertarians

DAVEsaltwaterbetweenhisearsTHE
WAVE

No calchris you didn't even read the story Idiot

Posted by DavetheWave at 2008-01-16 07:15 PM | R


Yes, I did read the story.

I spent years working with a law firm specializing in building and construction engineering law -- including faulty and shoddy building problems. You may be a little out of your league here if you want to jump all over me on faulty construction issues but feel free to continue, of course.

btw -- who was responsible for the use of the less than adequately thick gusset plates in the quote below --

"These gusset plates were roughly half the thickness that would be required -- half an inch thick rather than an inch thick."

Was that calculation in the original design? We will probably never know because apparently the original specs aren't available.

Was it the design team responsible for the following two major renovations on that bridge afterwards? Do you know? Maybe you can enlighten us.

As for your idol Bush? YES he is very much at fault for slashing to the bone the federal highway/maintenance funds for all the states so he could use that money for war profiteering and running his war in Iraq. IF you want proof of how he slashed those funds from the budget (compared to the money the states use to get from previous presidents) -- just let me know. I'll be happy to give you links to the budget slashes.

States cannot be expected to shoulder those high costs by themselves. The fool Bush is now even letting in thousands of trucks from south of the border in anticipation of his NAU agenda and we have aging roads, bridges and highways all over our nation. Is he giving a single thought as to future safety? NO.

This bridge collapse was most likely caused by non-maintenance, shoddy work, depletion of federal funds to the state by Bush, and corporate greed to cut corners.

I could tell you a story of a lawsuit we worked where some workers in a power plant had received horrendous steam burns because there was less than adequate thickness on some steel piping used to pipe steam thoughout the plant. A section of the pipe fishmouthed and burst open spraying 2000 degree steam all over them. Corporate greed -- they wanted to save money on meeting the steel thickness requirements.

Well, have stuff to do but feel free if you want to go another round.

Monte,

You're a troll!

Sincerely,
Ray

Reilly
You're such a well known buffoon on this site, all you are doing is making me sound more credible.

"You're such a well known buffoon on this site, all you are doing is making me sound more credible."

Great rebuttal, looney!

Is building bridges really a necessary government function? If the bridges benefit private citizens and business, they will build the bridge.
Libertarians


Is inspecting bridges really a necessary government function? Sure it is. That's why we undertook the responsibility ourselves, and failed miserably.
Minnesota Democrats

"Minnesota Democrats"

The chief executive of Minnesota is a Republican.

"As for your idol Bush? YES he is very much at fault for slashing to the bone the federal highway/maintenance funds"

As i said what a freakin idiot! The whole purpose of the releases by the NTB SAYS it...

"Some individuals have leapt to premature conclusions," Minnesota Gov. Tim Pawlenty said in a statement. "The NTSB clearly stated today the original design flaw was unrelated to subsequent inspections or maintenance of the bridge."

get it, IT WASN'T THE INSPECTIONS. But your hatred for bush clearly shows through, and has obviously blinded you......

The chief executive of Minnesota is a Republican.

Posted by Danforth
------------------

Not much of one...and everyone else is a Democrat.

Actually, the way the party is going he's a great republican, just not much of a conservative.

So, let me get this straight: If he's a Republican, but you don't like what he's doing, or he's not conservative enough, that means he's a Democrat?

Ahhh, another graduate of Jonah Goldberg Community College.

Let me whittle it down. Although most of our elected officials are Democrats, this state is crawling with liberals on both sides of the aisle. So it really no longer matters if they have an R or a D behind their name. Thay all want as much of my money as they can steal and they want to redistribute it to people who don't work for a living. Case in point, spending highway money on light rail so poor people can get downtown to shoot me while I'm coming out of the theatre, and people paying the gas taxes can ride their bridges down into the river.

Did that clear things up?