President Bush told Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas during a private meeting today the U.S. will ensure the Palestinians will have a state on the ground before Bush leaves office

President Bush told Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas during a private meeting today the U.S. will ensure the Palestinians will have a state on the ground before Bush leaves office

An Israeli withdrawal and a Palestinian state all in the next eighteen months. My.

Bush is mentally ill. Any debate?

No

But this is from right wing World Nuts Daily

President Bush told Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas during a private meeting today the U.S. will ensure the Palestinians will have a state on the ground before Bush leaves office.,?i>

Bush is the height of arrogance.
This is right up there with his "Mission Accomplished" speech on the aircraft carrier 3 months after he invaded Iraq.

All the former U.S. Presidents who spent so much time trying to negotiate a peace deal in good faith and resolve the Palestinian state issue were not able to accomplish it but this incompetent jerk brags that he'll "ensure" Palestine becomes a state all within one year?

I'm all for anything that might bring peace to that regio -- including the idea of a Palestian state of that's what it takes -- but it won't be brought about by this guy currently in the White House. Bush ridiculed and belittled Clinton for trying so hard to make a ME peace deal and Bush treated his efforts with scorn.

What you see now is a guy who finally realizes his time left in office is running real short. Bush is desperately looking for a way not go down in the history books as the "Worst U.S. President Ever" but it's too late.
Too late now

sorry about the all bold -- my error

"regio" is "region"

"of that's" is "if that's"

"Democracy throught the Middle East", A Palestinian State", wholly shit maybe this fuckin Idiot is really a Man for the times!!!!!!

G-d help u.s. all.

I don't think that having a Palestinian "State" would stop the terror bombings, or induce Israel to stop the shelling, rocket attacks, incursions, etc.

A "state" is just words on paper. To action the state, and make it real, we need a change in policy. Are we going to invade Israel when they send tanks into this new Palestinian state, like we did for Kuwait in the first gulf war?

So Bush has a way of placating the Israeli right and his own base, both of whom hate the concept? Expect to see the saudi royals wearing crucifixes and ice skating in hades before that happens.
Then again maybe God just told him to make it happen.

G-d help u.s. all.

Posted by nanc at 2007-11-27 09:09

I think nanc summed it up best.

Whatever Bush predicts, expect the opposite.

Somewhere in the asshole of the WestBank, where camels don't even go, abbas will be granted a couple of square yards of dirt (probably between two Isralei military bases) and Bush will declare Mission Accomlished.
BLT and Bowa will call this the greatest diplomatic success in history.

There's a place called Palestine, Texas. Maybe we could have a 51st state built around that.

"Whatever Bush predicts, expect the opposite."

I've made a killing the last seven years betting just that. The Dow, as of today, is up 3.88% for the year. I'm up 15.73%. If the trend continues, it'll be 7 straight years of beating the market handily. Thanks, Boy George...you're the gift that keeps on giving.

Can't be 7 years, dan. 9-11 ate a chunk out of everyone's pocketbook.

Somewhere in the asshole of the WestBank, where camels don't even go, abbas will be granted a couple of square yards of dirt (probably between two Isralei military bases) and Bush will declare Mission Accomlished.
BLT and Bowa will call this the greatest diplomatic success in history.

Posted by northguy3 at 2007-11-27 09:46 PM | Reply


Be His luck Dubya will hand Him a potted plant with Palestine dirt in it and THAT will be His Palestinian land.

Larry Mohr

I've been trying for a while to wrap my head around the whole Israel/Palestine thing.

I'm only 30 so haven't been around for the majority of it. I've done the basic Wikipedia + a few hours of googling to try and get better aquainted. Even read "Exile" thinking that may give me a more humanistic insight.

I'm still baffled. The history of aggressions and responses just seems so convoluted, and marked with such emotional ties, that mending the hearts and minds of people that have been bred with this conflict just seems like a pipe dream.

Can someone tell me the reason a Palestinian state has so far been denied? Is it military strategem and the need for a "buffer zone". Is it the refusal to legitimize a longstanding enemy? Both? More?

I'm up 15.73%. If the trend continues, it'll be 7 straight years of beating the market handily. Thanks, Boy George...you're the gift that keeps on giving.

Posted by Danforth at 2007-11-27 09:47 PM |

So when Bush posted said mission accomplished, you must have loaded up on military contractor stock. I would be uneasy about staying in the market. Bush also says the economy is sound.

"Can't be 7 years, dan. 9-11 ate a chunk out of everyone's pocketbook."

Not mine...I was heavily into gold and bonds. The bonds went up 13-14% a year for those two years, and the gold skyrocketed. It more than made up for the stinkers.

Can someone tell me the reason a Palestinian state has so far been denied?

Because the Israeli strategy is to drive them out across the Jordan. It's embedded in Zionist ideology.

Look at history before 1948 to see how 800,000 Palestinians where terrorized off their land.

No peaceful solution is possible. This will go on until one side can no longer fight.

"So when Bush posted said mission accomplished, you must have loaded up on military contractor stock."

Not really...I was returning from Tuscany and read in the UK Fin Times (which I find often more brutally honest about the American markets than American publications) the Bush Administration was more than willing to let the dollar drop further. To me, that meant one thing: foreign investments, up 25% for the last three years and about 30% this year. One of my faves, Matthews China Fund, is up 64% this year.

Oh, and all this while Bush was yapping about a "stronger dollar".

Bet against what Bush says, make money. It's almost enough to wish for four more years!

Can someone tell me the reason a Palestinian state has so far been denied? More?

Posted by GustoGus at 2007-11-27 09:57 PM

Israel

Danforth

Glad to see someone not afraid of gold. The best is yet to come.
It might have been you and me who a while ago were talking about a nasty recession sometime before or after the 2008 election. All signs point to a nasty 2008.

President Bush told Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas during a private meeting today the U.S. will ensure the Palestinians will have a state on the ground before Bush leaves office, a senior Palestinian negotiator told WND

The palestinian state isn't the problem -- the UN had divided up that land into Israel and palestine way back in 1947 to establish a two-state solution. And the palestinians rejected the deal believeing that their Arab neighbors would help them just destroy Israel so they could take all the land. Of course, Israel won and the palestinians were shit out of luck.

So like spolied little brats they have been complaining for the past 60 years about Israel being the cause of all their problems.

So sure, Bush, the Israelis, and their Arab neighbors can work out a deal to give the palestinians a significant chunk of land to call their own -- but unless they recognize israel and put away the bombs to instead focus on building their own nation -- then all will be for naught -- like it has been for 60 years.

Ray,

I actually sold some gold this year (yea, I know...I wish I had it back). It was going up so much, it was unbalancing my portfolio. But I put the money into I-bonds, up 11.77% YTD. That sure lessens the hurt, but I've got some target prices I'll buy at if gold retreats. If not, I'll just have to drown my sorrows with Veuve Clicquot instead of Dom.

An Israeli withdrawal and a Palestinian state all in the next eighteen months. My.

Bush is mentally ill. Any debate?

~sed Zed.

None wotsoever.

This is more of his "We'll land a man on Mars" Bushit trying to distract from the failure of his presidency. Bush still thinks that he will have a legacy of worth not shame.

Silly chimp!

Palestine needs something resembling autonomy fer any peace plan to work. They need the wall to come down, they need the occupation to end. The settlements must stop.

A peace plan proposed by seven states in the region that did include real autonomy was previously rejected by Condi in favor of a plan by the "quartet" of western interests that the Palestinians had previously rejected.

That tells Spud all he needs to know BushCo's desire fer real peace in the area.

It doesn't exist.

Trying to make Condi, Karen Hughes and John Bolton into diplomats underscores this point.

Listen to their words carefully but then watch their actions even more carefully.

Gusto asks...

Can someone tell me the reason a Palestinian state has so far been denied?

There are only two states capable of initiating a real peace process in the region. Israel and the US. They hold all the cards that count. The idea that Palestine has been the one holding up progress has been asserted countless times by both Israel and the US. While there is certainly no love lost between the Palestinian people and the Israeli's it's disingenuous in the extreme to say that they are reason.

Doesn't stop some folk.

Spud's just saying.

Be Well.

gusto - your biggest problem is using wikipedia.

er....I'm pretty sure he told us we'd have a manned mission to mars....hello?????

I've been telling y'all he's crazeeeee.....do ya believe me now???????

He has no plans on delivering such a promise. Bush is the front-man for the right wing of the Likud party.

To Nanc:
I dunno. Ye olde Wiki has been pretty good to me in establishing timelines and giving me something concrete to start from. Perhaps there is alot to be wary of, but for someone coming in blind, I've found it to be an excellent starting resource.

To Zulu:

Thanks for the reference. Seems amazon has it in stock and even a used version for under 3 bucks!

There will be a Palestinian state.......unfortunately Israel will be occupying it.
Details, details.

I cannot wait to see this played out.

Waking up every day in Bush World is like Xmas morning, you never know what present they're going to give you that morning.

It's like a bad car wreck, you know you shouldn't look, but you just can't help it.

Why bother suggesting to anyone here to read anything about the subject when its obvious they already know everything there is to know. Yeah right.

The Arabs living in Palestine could have had a State in 1947 but rejected it, could have had it during Clinton's Presidency but rejected it and could have it now.

Despite the myths that have been created in recent years since the Left has taken up with the Islamists here's the simple facts ... lets examine first what Israel said way back in 1948 as the Arab armies were on their way to drive the Jews into the sea - which is exactly what they had threatened to do ....

From the "The Declaration Of The
Establishment Of The State Of Israel" May 14, 1948

"WE APPEAL -- in the very midst of the onslaught launched against us now for months -- to the Arab inhabitants of the State of Israel to preserve peace and participate in the upbuilding of the State on the basis of full and equal citizenship and due representation in all its provisional and permanent institutions."


And now lets look at what's written in the Hamas Charter .. for all to see including all here who insist they actually know something about this subject.

"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences, are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement. "

"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors. "

The rest is all bullshit, myths and sadly the hate and vitriol from the likes of Ray who trust me is a complete anti Semite and should never be taken seriously when it comes to this subject

Here's an example of Ray just so you know and there are plenty of others on this site who are coming from the same disgusting mindset

""GZ is a blood sucking parasite. Did I hurt his feelings by calling him a dirty name? Tsk. Tsk. Tsk.
POSTED BY RAY AT 2006-10-18 09:08 PM | REPLY
"I call you Jewboy and Zionazi because you lost all credibility. I aim to show readers why.
POSTED BY RAY AT 2006-10-17 10:03 PM | REPLY."

And FYI = to all those on this thread. Much of what's already on the table has already been agreed to. Everything from the dividing of Jerusalem, the swap of land for settlements and even the Golan has all been essentially agreed to already.

the problem is none of that and has never been. Its all about disarming the ski masked armed thugs because until these gangs are defanged, they can and will undo everything.

Abbas knows it after seeing some of his people thrown from Gazan rooftops.

And for those who will try and compare the Israeli right wing to the Islamic Jihad or Al Aksa ... When Israel needed to move out all those Jews living in Gaza even though they lived there for 30 years - they did so and Israel will do it again if they have to. There will not be an armed insurrection by Israelis. The Israeli police and army can control any of the Israeli radicals. Can the Palestinians do the same?

No one believes they can and so that's what prevents peace.

President Bush told Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas during a private meeting today the U.S. will ensure the Palestinians will have a state on the ground before Bush leaves office


recently heard in the oval office:

"Ok so I promised em democracy and a Palestinian state, that may have been crazy. But! I never told them how we're going to build that state. First, I need all the guys who are currently in Iraq and the rest of those dudes in Afghanistan. We're going to build a coalition of the willing and go in there and whip some democracy on 'em. Flowers and Chocolates!"

GZLIVES

I'd like to see peace as much as anyone in the ME. I'm Christian and want both Israel to exist and the Palestinians to get their own country and for them to live in peace. I have abhorred the attacks on Israel by a few.

However, I did notice that after months and months of peace Sharon boldly showed up on the Temple Mount for no good reason other than to incite the Arabs, , 200 were killed and the cycle of violence started all over again.

I also have noticed over the years that settlements have been built on land guaranteed to Palestinians against treaties Israel signed - over and over, families separated, houses bulldozed, all on Palestinian land given in treaties.

How were either of those examples warranted or justified? Security? Nope. Giving the Palestinians the finger? Seems so.

I'm in the middle. There's plenty of blame to go around. You want more Palestinian radicals? Just keep up the tactics that have turned so many innocent hearts hard. Occupation and intimidation are not going to bring peace, they're going to bring hatred towards Israel. Not the kind of behavior anyone should impose on another group of people. Been done and condemned by the U.S. in other countries.

That's my take as a 51 year old U.S. Citizen who's kept up pretty well over the years on events around the world

GZLIVES

FYI A good percentage of my friends celebrate Hanukkah, and I've been to the Bar and Bat Mitzvahs this year of the children of two close friends of my wife and I. I'm not an anti-Semite by any stretch of the imagination.

GZLives

When you make statements like this........ "in recent years since the Left has taken up with the Islamists"........you give up any credibility.

When you make statements like this........ "in recent years since the Left has taken up with the Islamists"........you give up any credibility.

GZ he's right. Didn't Jews march with Martin Luther King for civil rights? Didn't Jews go to the South to fight for civil rights?

So, why are you so right wing and why do you want to deny Palestinians (not the criminals) civil rights?

Curious, not snarky.

Words fail me. Blair begged Bush to get more involved in this process in 2004 and was completely ignored. Now that Bush's legacy is headed for the toilet he's making a halfhearted last minute attempt to do something that's eluded better minds than his for the last 40 years. I'll bet Condi put him up to it.

The worst part of this is that leaders and representatives of all of our allies and rivals in the region got to witness this Mumbling Mediocrity up close and personal. Our allies will go home and make plans to get along without us, and our rivals will go home emboldened to cause us more trouble.

Bush is a disaster.

"Bush and the U.S. administration gave us a commitment there will be a Palestinian state before he leaves office, and not just an outline of a state on paper but contiguous territory on the ground,"

He knows where it is. It's in the area around those Israeli Security fences and east, west, south and north somewhat.

Yeah so what.

He also promised no nation building, to "jawbone" opec into lowering the price of oil, catch osama bin forgotten and be a conservative.

Just another lie in a string of em.

If anyone saw the photo ops on MSNBC with Keith Olberman Bush could'nt even get the names of the parties straight and he's going to do what no one has been able to do since 1948 and bring peace to the middle east? I don't think so.

"Bush and the U.S. administration gave us a commitment there will be a Palestinian state before he leaves office, and not just an outline of a state on paper but contiguous territory on the ground,"

Perhaps the danger lies in "before he leaves office." No hurry here, just an extension of his administration to make his statement true.

In order for this plan to succeed a broken military force will have to prevail where diplomacy has consistently failed.

But, Israel has always been the primary obstacle to peace, since they want what they want and are prepared to use force to get it (on our nickle of course). Water, land, water, land, water, land. 50 years of assassination and/or imprisonment for those they displaced.

On the other hand, Bush may have more leverage with Israel than others. If he succeeds he could salvage his legacy.

"But, Israel has always been the primary obstacle to peace, since they want what they want and are prepared to use force to get it (on our nickle of course). Water, land, water, land, water, land. 50 years of assassination and/or imprisonment for those they displaced."


Tell me something, are you unable to read? Are you ignorant ? ..

What part of this do you NOT understand.

"Initiatives, and so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences, are in contradiction to the principles of the Islamic Resistance Movement. "

"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors. "

Lets see if you get this part.

Many of the Muslims think they are forbidden to have anything to do with Jews ANDS believe any land once governed by Muslims belongs to them.

I'm not saying all but organizations that roam the streets of Ramallah or Gaza absoliutely believe it and many fire rockets into Israeli cities everyday hoping to kill a Jew which then think guarantees them entrance into Paradise.

Now do you honestly believe any civilized country would ever make peace knowing this entire faction has still not been brought under some control? Duhhh Gaza is literally CONTROLLLED by the fanatics.

Now were you able to read this post. Go and explore yourself before you play parrot and mouth off the typical lies you lazy Lefties seem to enjoy so much

The Israelis were more then willing to make peace with the Palestinians in 1948, during Clinton's term and they are now ... so get it straight already.

Your name shouldn't be NUTCASE but STUPIDCASE

'"Bush and the U.S. administration gave us a commitment there will be a Palestinian state before he leaves office, and not just an outline of a state on paper but contiguous territory on the ground," said the Palestinian negotiator, who spoke on condition his name be withheld because he was revealing the contents of a private meeting.'

I have to doubt even Bush would be ignorant enough to guarantee a contiguous state - unless he means Gaza or the West Bank but not both. Becuase those two areas don't connect and Israel is never going to cede extra territory towards this end.

And why guarantee the Palestinians anything? The only thing they have to offer in negotiations is an end to terror attacks. They have yet to produce a leader who is both willing and able to put and end to Hamas and Islamic Jihad. Therefore, they don't have a credible leader who is willing to offer peace AND to do what it takes to deliver it.

I feel bad for the innocents caught in the middle but until the Palestinians as a whole make up their mind between compromise and perpetual war there is really no reason to expect anything positive to happen for them. And no US president can change that, which is why better men than Bush have already failed.

GZ: While Bush was holding his photo-op, 15,000 jews were protesting in Jerusalem against the idea of sharing said city with the sand jockeys.

I'd like to hear how Hamas pulled that off.

Neither side has any interest in a lasting peace that requires give and take. There isn't an arab in the world who believes America is anything other than Israel's bitch and Israel knows Bush is a lame duck with no time left to accomplish anything they don't want and they can easily tap dance around a bit until he's back in Crawford, doing what he does best.
Like everything else he's attempted, Bush is a day late and a dollar short.

Many of the Muslims think they are forbidden to have anything to do with Jews

I'm not as schooled in the whole middle eastern thing as some here, but I know the Muslims also venerate Jesus and David (you know-- Jewish dudes) as prophets of God, and say "alayhee al-salam" which means something like "god's blessings be upon him" everytime they say their name.

That's some pretty heavy respect for a bunch of people who supposedly think its forbidden to have anything to do with Jews, dontcha think?

Do the Jews venerate any such Muslims in such a way I wonder?

beekeeper - they say that after speaking the name "allah", not Yeshua. they do not believe Yeshua is the Son of God.

there is not one comparison you can make between mooohammadism and christianity or judaism that would make it right.

this nation will suffer dearly for this "peace" summit.

time to balkanize the u.s.

i'll take the republic.

GZ,

You're talking chicken and egg stuff.

Except there is a clear history. The Palestinians were there first. Israel was given their land, which displaced the Palestinians while giving many of them jobs. Many Palestinians refused to accept the Jewish encroachment and were labeled terrorists by the UK, USA & Israel.

Israel was not satisfied with what they were given and began a 50 year military campaign and police action to assassinate and/or imprison Arab resistance. Their favorite tool is the Caterpillar tractor used to demolish Palestinian homes and farms for resettlement with Jewish emigrants. After the Russian economy collapsed, Russians with any semblance of a Jewish heritage moved in mass to Israel. With this new cheap labor pool Israel locked down the Palestinians into concentration camps leaving them 70% unemployed, starved for food and health care. No Israeli has ever been tried, let alone punished, for shooting Palestinians in the back, women and children included.

I can't understand why there is local resistance to this divine destiny.

beekeeper - they say that after speaking the name "allah", not Yeshua. they do not believe Yeshua is the Son of God

And "Allah" is arabic for--- God.

I don't believe Jesus, Aissa, or Yeshua or whatever his name was is God's son either, though it makes a nice story to tell people so they'll feel like their special and going somewhere happy when they die.